View Full Version : UT -Susan Powell, 28, West Valley City, 6 Dec 2009 - #3
omegagal
12-20-2009, 02:33 AM
Open House schedule
Date Start Time End Time
12/20/2009 1:00 pm 4:00
copy and paste
Again, these are NOT Josh's Open Houses. Please pull up the listing you are looking at and read it...
Silver Bells
12-20-2009, 02:41 AM
"He said the only thing keeping him going right now was his two boys. He's latched on to them as his sole mental support because even some of his own family members have turned on him now."
Ugh--this turns my stomach. The LAST thing these bewildered little boys need right now is their dad sniveling and slobbering all over them. They are HIS support? Shouldn't it be the other way around?
I am so worried about these little boys. :( Hopefully somebody who is a mandatory reporter will see how off and unstable Josh is acting. If we are to believe this People article, he is barely able to take care of himself. Are there any officials looking out for these little boys? Where are the child welfare advocates?
ETA sorry this is my first post, I've been following this case since the beginning but couldn't hold back anymore about these sweet little guys who must be crying for their mommy all the time. :cry: I have little ones and I just can't imagine.
Blondie in Spokane
12-20-2009, 03:17 AM
Welcome to Websleuths, Silver Bells!!!!!
tfrohning
12-20-2009, 03:22 AM
Again, these are NOT Josh's Open Houses. Please pull up the listing you are looking at and read it...
Yes I understand!! I post that before I seem your post.
so carry on..it still interesting that the web site is up. JMO
Curious Me
12-20-2009, 05:27 AM
"He said the only thing keeping him going right now was his two boys. He's latched on to them as his sole mental support because even some of his own family members have turned on him now."
Ugh--this turns my stomach. The LAST thing these bewildered little boys need right now is their dad sniveling and slobbering all over them. They are HIS support? Shouldn't it be the other way around?
I am so worried about these little boys. :( Hopefully somebody who is a mandatory reporter will see how off and unstable Josh is acting. If we are to believe this People article, he is barely able to take care of himself. Are there any officials looking out for these little boys? Where are the child welfare advocates?
ETA sorry this is my first post, I've been following this case since the beginning but couldn't hold back anymore about these sweet little guys who must be crying for their mommy all the time. :cry: I have little ones and I just can't imagine.
WELCOME SILVER BELLS. Your post expresses the real concern...those two little boys may be in danger if they're allowed to be around Josh at this time. Josh may be very unbalanced. At the very least, Josh is in no condition to be around his sons. I hope this is not being allowed. He is a POI, the only one at this point.
JMO, I just want to convey how non-judgemental the family and friends have been. Please don't think I am knocking the family or friends for not pointing the finger at Josh immediately. They are all good people. I just think it must have something to do with their religious beliefs, but everyone hesitates to come out and say anything too judgemental. Geraldo was trying to drag it out of them, trying to point out how strange Josh's story is, and how weird he comes across as a grieving husband. I guess those close to Susan don't want to believe she may be gone at his hands. I hope there's a break in this case soon.
angeleleven
12-20-2009, 06:54 AM
WELCOME SILVER BELLS. Your post expresses the real concern...those two little boys may be in danger if they're allowed to be around Josh at this time. Josh may be very unbalanced. At the very least, Josh is in no condition to be around his sons. I hope this is not being allowed. He is a POI, the only one at this point.
JMO, I just want to convey how non-judgemental the family and friends have been. Please don't think I am knocking the family or friends for not pointing the finger at Josh immediately. They are all good people. I just think it must have something to do with their religious beliefs, but everyone hesitates to come out and say anything too judgemental. Geraldo was trying to drag it out of them, trying to point out how strange Josh's story is, and how weird he comes across as a grieving husband. I guess those close to Susan don't want to believe she may be gone at his hands. I hope there's a break in this case soon.
I noticed that too and agree. Geraldo tried so hard to drag it out of the parents and it seemed they just would not say anything against Josh. Geraldo did everything but spelled it out to them. The father, especially, appeared to me to want to say only kind things. He didn't want to believe anything different. Did anyone hear Geraldo say 'how was Susan' and the family quickly corrected him and said do you mean 'how is Susan'.....they didn't like the past tense question. IMO
angeleleven
12-20-2009, 06:59 AM
Correcting what I said above....Geraldo said "what was Susan like" and the family said do you mean "what is Susan like".........(trying to wake up from a long night)
smart blonde
12-20-2009, 07:23 AM
http://www.joshpowellrealtor.com/
After going to this website, click on the 'ABOUT' section on the top bar. Then click on the 'ABOUT JOSH', and you will find the following...
"Throughout his college years, Josh received some of the highest honors available, including Phi Theta Kappa, Magna Cum Laude, and repeated placement on the President's List".
It also states that some of his 'social' outlets were public speaking (lol!), campus politics, drama productions, and writing for the campus newspaper (he probably once ran a classified ad).
Elsewhere on his website, he claims to have "12 years in the real estate industry".
~ I just can't help but wonder if any of these claims are true. This guy is so full of himself.
There is one statement on the website I know for a fact to be a lie... it's where he claims 'Honesty' and 'Integrity'.
smart blonde
12-20-2009, 07:32 AM
I wonder if he realized that the very title of his website violates the National Association of Realtors' rules and guidelines.
For one thing, the word 'Realtor' must always be capitalized.
For another, it is prohibited to be used in the manner in which he is using it. He could have his website as joshpowellrealestate.com, or just joshpowell.com, but the National Association of Realtor's have very strict rules in regards to the use of the word 'Realtor', and he is flat out violating them.
Jerk.
Amity
12-20-2009, 07:59 AM
It also states that some of his 'social' outlets were public speaking (lol!), campus politics, drama productions, and writing for the campus newspaper (he probably once ran a classified ad).
Quote above Underlined by me and respectfully shortened for space.
Makes me think that's where he learned to snivel on cue?
HesterMofet
12-20-2009, 09:53 AM
I read fran's synopsis of the facts and have come to the conclusion: the husband did it. I don't see how anyone can speculate anything different. The hinky meter is off the scale on this one.
justplainmetal
12-20-2009, 09:56 AM
Forensic Astrology chart posted on Josh Powell.
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4586056&postcount=368
nervous_nellie
12-20-2009, 10:33 AM
in regards to susans family not publicly slamming jp on heraldo, i think that to do so in their minds would be sealing susans fate and they are not ready to accept that she is gone, it is not because they favor him in any way. moo :twocents:
adnoid
12-20-2009, 11:14 AM
I wonder if he realized that the very title of his website violates the National Association of Realtors' rules and guidelines...
Interestingly he has active licenses as both a salesman AND a broker:
JOSH POWELL SALT LAKE CITY JOSH POWELL Principal Broker 5655486-PB00 Active
JOSH POWELL SALT LAKE CITY JOSH POWELL Real Estate Company 7186104-CN00 Active
One of Utah's requirements to be a broker is that you have to certify that you have 3 years of actual experience selling real estate - in my experience the licensing folks rely on your statements to establish this. I wonder what he put down?
http://realestate.utah.gov/realestate/real_licensing.html#3
justplainmetal
12-20-2009, 11:28 AM
More on Forensic Astrology Forum.. Susan and Josh Powell by Tuba.
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4586222&postcount=370
passionflower
12-20-2009, 11:36 AM
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Forensic Astrology - CASE BRIEFINGS only
This astro chart xplains JP 'personality' and problems with his coldness to women
badhorsie
12-20-2009, 11:40 AM
What needs to happen for Susan Powell to have her own forum here?
passionflower
12-20-2009, 11:57 AM
I wonder though if all newer rentals have them. I think the insurance companies that cover them would insist on it.
To our surprise we rented a car in Seattle and it broke down, we had no idea that it had a hidden on star thing.
We called the rental and they knew exactly where we were to send help!
Hope JP rental had this and that when LE had the van, they put one in already.
Taminator
12-20-2009, 12:26 PM
To our surprise we rented a car in Seattle and it broke down, we had no idea that it had a hidden on star thing.
We called the rental and they knew exactly where we were to send help!
Hope JP rental had this and that when LE had the van, they put one in already.
Hopefully there was a GPS tracking system on the rental car.....and hopefully they put one on the van, too!! I remember when they did that to Scott Peterson. So many parallels in the two cases....
passionflower
12-20-2009, 12:41 PM
http://newsblaze.com/story/20091220075129kays.nb/topstory.html
came on google about the Navy blue CAP...........Interview
The Bottom Line: The motive would be a controlling husband kills his wife when he finally realizes that she will leave him, that she will divorce him. This is the hypothesis that I come up with when reviewing Tim Peterson's testimony
LogicalMinds
12-20-2009, 12:54 PM
http://newsblaze.com/story/20091220075129kays.nb/topstory.html
came on google about the Navy blue CAP...........
Oh wow.....this is a great article...or at least I think so <grin> cause this is exactly what I have said from day one....I also feel that (like so many of these other sad cases) Josh flipped when Susan told him it was "over"
I keep pointing out that Josh was due to start a new job the very next day....and I PERSONALLY think that either 1) Susan told him "fine, now you have a job we can split up and you can support yourself" OR 2) Josh balked at starting the job, didn't want to go back to work, and Susan said "I've had enough of supporting you"
I think he flipped out and killed her....and after that?? I don't know the details but he probably was caught off guard when the cops had broken in and seen the "wet spot", the fans...and we now know they do have a carpet cleaning machine.....very incriminating IMHO
I agree that the "blue cap" interview is very telling
let's hope they wind this up and get those boys away from this creep soon soon soon
passionflower
12-20-2009, 12:58 PM
FRAN ARE YOU ADDING TO LIST???
Can you add Tim Peterson interview, the blue cap odd ways, sister Jennifer 'ODD',
Susan's parents bought and paid monthly for her cell phone to contact them if things got worse, her diary (journal) stating many threats from Josh, JP leaving for 24 hours after he rented a car, LE had van for 3 days???
Thanks!!!!
tfrohning
12-20-2009, 01:02 PM
Thanks to everyone for helping me understand the Real Estate Laws in Utah.
I think the web site is very interesting. I really hope that rental car had a GPS.
I would think they do have the miles logged.
Patty G
12-20-2009, 01:52 PM
What needs to happen for Susan Powell to have her own forum here?
It takes a while before a forum is even considered. Right now there is only one "person of interest" and that is Josh.
passionflower
12-20-2009, 02:03 PM
What's the weather like in Utah area????
Temp?
I see where searches are impossible in 1 article
lemonmoussetart
12-20-2009, 02:09 PM
"He said the only thing keeping him going right now was his two boys. He's latched on to them as his sole mental support because even some of his own family members have turned on him now."
Ugh--this turns my stomach. The LAST thing these bewildered little boys need right now is their dad sniveling and slobbering all over them. They are HIS support? Shouldn't it be the other way around?
I am so worried about these little boys. :( Hopefully somebody who is a mandatory reporter will see how off and unstable Josh is acting. If we are to believe this People article, he is barely able to take care of himself. Are there any officials looking out for these little boys? Where are the child welfare advocates?
ETA sorry this is my first post, I've been following this case since the beginning but couldn't hold back anymore about these sweet little guys who must be crying for their mommy all the time. :cry: I have little ones and I just can't imagine.
Welcome Silver--am new too, Yes I have noticed on a couple news clip where Josh is holding his son in his arms. It appeared he was using the boy as a human shield against reporters. (digusting) No doubt the boy has to be wondering "why are these people asking all these questions about Mommy?"
Thanks everyone for all the great posts these last couple of days with little new news. Have noticed that LE has not asked for further questioning of Josh--I think they are POd since his no show. Now will keep everything close to the vest until the time comes. I have no doubt they will be making an arrest in this case.
Question for anyone who may know: Do cell phones ping even if they are turned off?
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 02:17 PM
Welcome Silver--am new too, Yes I have noticed on a couple news clip where Josh is holding his son in his arms. It appeared he was using the boy as a human shield against reporters. (digusting) No doubt the boy has to be wondering "why are these people asking all these questions about Mommy?"
Thanks everyone for all the great posts these last couple of days with little new news. Have noticed that LE has not asked for further questioning of Josh--I think they are POd since his no show. Now will keep everything close to the vest until the time comes. I have no doubt they will be making an arrest in this case.
Question for anyone who may know? Do cell phones ping even if they are turned off?
And we've seen on an interview that he said he hasn't told his boys anything. WTH?
passionflower
12-20-2009, 02:27 PM
And we've seen on an interview that he said he hasn't told his boys anything. WTH?
like Drew P. is she on a vacation forever?
Staying in the woods forever?
Mommies lost and no one can find her?
She left us for a gigalo!
What's his excuse?
Guess he can't say the truth....
well remember when we went camping, daddy dumped mommie and left.........
know can he? arrrgggghhhhh.........
lemonmoussetart
12-20-2009, 02:32 PM
After going to this website, click on the 'ABOUT' section on the top bar. Then click on the 'ABOUT JOSH', and you will find the following...
"Throughout his college years, Josh received some of the highest honors available, including Phi Theta Kappa, Magna Cum Laude, and repeated placement on the President's List".
It also states that some of his 'social' outlets were public speaking (lol!), campus politics, drama productions, and writing for the campus newspaper (he probably once ran a classified ad).
Elsewhere on his website, he claims to have "12 years in the real estate industry".
~ I just can't help but wonder if any of these claims are true. This guy is so full of himself.
There is one statement on the website I know for a fact to be a lie... it's where he claims 'Honesty' and 'Integrity'.
Notice all his educational accolades, but NEVER says WHERE he went to school.
Hmm Someone actually forgot to say where?
His age has been disputed from 34-38, but 12 years in real estate? So, he started at age 22? uh huh
SuziQ
12-20-2009, 02:34 PM
On local cbs news they are reporting a neighbor is saying he heard something suspicious Sunday night over at the Powells, at 11:45 p.m. he heard a car alarm going off inside their garage.
VB
Makes me wonder if Susan and Josh weren't fighting over the keys or Susan purposely hit the panic button on the key fob.
passionflower
12-20-2009, 02:46 PM
So maybe she was alive until 11:45..........
passionflower
12-20-2009, 02:50 PM
Wonder if other neighbors will come through with testimonies of that night..........
like in seeing lots of lights, the van horn, JP leaving.
I know if someone's panic button went off I would look out my window to see why.
My elderly mom goes to bed with her keys to hit it if she gets sick,
neighbors know to come!
LaLaw2000
12-20-2009, 02:55 PM
IIRC, it was stated somewhere that Josh was/is an IT person for a trucking company. I think it was stated that the job at the trucking company was where he was supposed to have been at work at on Monday morning when neither he nor Susan called in missing work.
If Josh was an IT person for a trucking company, he would know all about the tracking devices almost all commercial trucks have on them. He would know that at any given moment, the trucks can be tracked as to the progress. They would know exactly where the truck is, what highway, and whether or not the truck was even running. On a computer screen, you will see a map image and a red spot as to where the truck is. The jail/correctional facility used such a program to track all transportation vans. IMO, he would probably be very aware of the fact that most car rental agencies can do the same. I read an article in the New York Times about most car rental companies being able to know exactly where any of their cars are and even whether or not they had been driven out of state. The article gave an example of a guy having been fined for having driven out of state to a wedding when he had rented the car for local use. The article was written a couple of years ago. So, If Josh knows about tracking devices, he probably would have known that the rental car company may have had this same capability. So, a wild goose chase in the rental vehicle to throw LE off? Maybe.
I have a couple of questions for anyone who may know. Apparently a neighbor heard a car alarm going off in the Powell's garage at or around midnight that Sunday night. One question I have is: Even if the van alarm itself is is off as it would be if someone unlocked the vehicle with a key, would the GPS system have an independent alarm if someone were removing it from the vehicle? If the GPS system was not factory installed, it could have an independent alarm if someone were attempting to remove it. Another question: If the van were equiped with a LoJack, would an alarm go off if someone attempted to remove it? What else would make the van alarm go off when we know Josh had his keys? I can make my vehicle alarm go off using my remote key fob. It may be just as simple as the 4 year old playing with the key fob, but IDK.
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 02:58 PM
The Bottom Line: The motive would be a controlling husband kills his wife when he finally realizes that she will leave him, that she will divorce him. This is the hypothesis that I come up with when reviewing Tim Peterson's testimony.
ITA John Kays' article pegged it. Yesterday eve--prior to even reading this today--I allowed my mind to flash to what would have most likely pushed him over the edge and w/out hesitation arrived at the same, almost predictable, conclusion: she finally ended it. When people have achieved or acquired by posing or by false pretenses in the beginning to get what they want, eventually they will be seen for who they are... and I had the distinct feeling Susan finally saw him for who he really is. And instead of a fence (boundary) this time it was a wall she put up--which he knew he'd never get back thru, under, over or around. It was finished. And he snapped. That would expose him ultimately for the failure which he underneath already knew or feared himself to be... JMO
http://newsblaze.com/story/20091220075129kays.nb/topstory.html
:parrot:
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 03:02 PM
Good Lord, the more I watch that blue cap interview over and over, it is just insufferable... his snivelling, really really poor acting... :rolleyes:
:parrot:
omegagal
12-20-2009, 03:08 PM
I applaud Christiana Brady with ABC-4 for doing the best reporting on this case yet... thank you Christiana.....
wicket
12-20-2009, 03:17 PM
Gitana1's statement really struck a cord with me - but how many men (and unfortunately most are men) do kill their wives/girlfriends and are still walking around. So many of them lawyer-up and make the detectives prove the case. Why are women so replaceable? Would not walking away or a divorce be so much better? That said, I believe it has to do with ego and a controlling nature. Just look at Scott Peterson, O.J. I cannot remember her first name but the I believe is Young, and she was murdered while her hubby was away. He lawyered up very quickly and is now surrounded by his parents who are evidently well connected. There is a local mystery of Debbie DeMello where her husband said he and his wife were riding in a car, an argument arose, she got out and then that's the end. Nothing more was found and he now is walking around free.
She was never found, no clues. Her family is still searching. Why? This was a small city, small budget, she was not a well-connected woman - why did her disappearance garner little except for signs on telephone poles? She, same as Susan, had small children.
Is the score card in the favor of the woman? I have my doubts.
If the media and pressure from family hadn't been volcanic ,I believe Drew Peterson would still be taunting the camera folks, riding his motorcycle and thumbing his nose at neighbors.
Why does it take certain cases to grib the hearts and minds of everyday citizens? Every woman who disappears deserves her day in court; even in abstentia!
wicket
12-20-2009, 03:27 PM
BBM
There are lots of similarities to this case.
I'm about 3/4 of the way through the book "Limb From Limb" which is about the murder of Tara Lynn Grant. I highly recommend it.
I did not know there was a book written concerning this poor woman's death. I will certainly search it out - I guess I could put it on my Christmas Wish List but my family would then wonder about me - more than they do now. Thanks for the heads up.
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 03:34 PM
IIRC, it was stated somewhere that Josh was/is an IT person for a trucking company. I think it was stated that the job at the trucking company was where he was supposed to have been at work at on Monday morning when neither he nor Susan called in missing work.
If Josh was an IT person for a trucking company, he would know all about the tracking devices almost all commercial trucks have on them. He would know that at any given moment, the trucks can be tracked as to the progress. They would know exactly where the truck is, what highway, and whether or not the truck was even running. On a computer screen, you will see a map image and a red spot as to where the truck is. The jail/correctional facility used such a program to track all transportation vans. IMO, he would probably be very aware of the fact that most car rental agencies can do the same. I read an article in the New York Times about most car rental companies being able to know exactly where any of their cars are and even whether or not they had been driven out of state. The article gave an example of a guy having been fined for having driven out of state to a wedding when he had rented the car for local use. The article was written a couple of years ago. So, If Josh knows about tracking devices, he probably would have known that the rental car company may have had this same capability. So, a wild goose chase in the rental vehicle to throw LE off? Maybe.
I have a couple of questions for anyone who may know. Apparently a neighbor heard a car alarm going off in the Powell's garage at or around midnight that Sunday night. One question I have is: Even if the van alarm itself is is off as it would be if someone unlocked the vehicle with a key, would the GPS system have an independent alarm if someone were removing it from the vehicle? If the GPS system was not factory installed, it could have an independent alarm if someone were attempting to remove it. Another question: If the van were equiped with a LoJack, would an alarm go off if someone attempted to remove it? What else would make the van alarm go off when we know Josh had his keys? I can make my vehicle alarm go off using my remote key fob. It may be just as simple as the 4 year old playing with the key fob, but IDK.
Completely agree, this is very possible. Can't recall year, model, estimated value or if this would come factory standard on their van, but I do know many car alarms can be purchased which have tracking features or are combined w GPS tracking capabilities... which JP would've realized posed a slight problem for him. And while these can frequently be armed and disarmed by phone, dialing in, or texting eg--this too would have been traceable ie shown a call eg. Thus while he probably had the skill or wherewithall to disable manually, it's totally plausible that in doing so disconnecting it could have activated alarm.
Good thinking friend, I believe you're on to something. :thumb: :detective:
:parrot:
hellolisakitty
12-20-2009, 03:52 PM
What's the weather like in Utah area????
Temp?
I see where searches are impossible in 1 article
For the Salt Lake area we will be in the mid 30's today. We have awful inversion... and it looks like we might be getting snow on Tuesday and/or Wednesday, which is good for our air quality - but certainly not helpful in regards to searches for Susan, if they are even doing it or planning it.
Curious Me
12-20-2009, 04:23 PM
She needs to be found. I keep checking in, looking for news on this case, and praying. I expect to hear the results of the tests done on the wet spots on the carpet, or some revealing news soon.
This is JMO, if the spirit does live on, and if Josh did end her life, I think Susan is crying out to be found with great concern that her sons not be around the man that killed her. It is a comfort to know there are others, all of you, that aren't going to let Susan be forgotten.
AdoraBlue
12-20-2009, 04:26 PM
I don't get this male camaraderie thing. His friend is willing to be there for Josh because "even if he did it, he needs support" What? I would be horrified if I thought my friend did such a thing. I would be scared, disgusted, shocked and unsafe around him or her. I would probably have the wherewithall (SP?) to tell him or her to get an attorney but I would not want to be anywhere near such a person and I would certainly tell them to do the right thing for the sake of the missing person and his or her family. Where is the sympathy for Suan? Her little boys? Her poor, suffering parents? What the heck is this? Is it a male thing, something deep within some men that they can identify with the desire to kill or is it just this wacky friend? Male sleuthers, please enlighten and tell me what you would do in such a situation and please think about it, don't just say your first thought.
And, what the heck does Wayne's family think? If that was my husband, he would not be bringing home his dear friend to my house. But, perhaps Wayne isn't married. What happened to loyalty to the innocent? What happened to morality above friendship? What the heck?
BBM
I am female and can't give insight as to the "male" factor but I did see these articles last week and IMO this phenomenon could give some insight into the "geek" factor. Could it be some sort of explanation of Wayne's demeanor perhaps. And of course I am not lumping all "techies" together or saying that IT people are antisocial, etc., or implying that women don't work in this field. Just thought it was an interesting background tidbit. Heaven only knows I am not a "techie." My computer is basically like a car or a light switch, I just turn it on and it does its thing. :twocents:
Interested in your opinions about this.
http://www.sciencenews.org/view/generic/id/50804/title/Stereotypes_steer_women_away_from_computer_science
http://news.discovery.com/human/nerds-women-computer-science.html
passionflower
12-20-2009, 04:38 PM
latest google alert..........
http://www.examiner.com/x-22460-Seattle-Family-Examiner~y2009m12d20-Susan-Powell-update-Doubt-and-suspicion-mound-family-responds-to-shocking-statement
lemonmoussetart
12-20-2009, 04:55 PM
I believe we can safely say that Josh is (once again) unemployed.
lemonmoussetart
12-20-2009, 05:11 PM
Whoa!
Police think husband of missing mom has left Utah
http://www.wkowtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=11707650
Posted: Dec 20, 2009 5:04 PM EST
Updated: Dec 20, 2009 5:04 PM EST
SALT LAKE CITY (AP) - Police say they believe the Utah man considered a person of interest in the disappearance of his wife is now in Washington state.
West Valley City police Capt. Tom McLachlan said Sunday that neighbors of Josh Powell say he left Utah either Friday or Saturday, presumably to be with family in Washington.
His wife Susan has been missing since Dec. 7. Josh Powell told police he last saw her at 12:30 a.m. that day when he took his two young sons on a camping trip and left her at home.
Police have called Josh Powell a person of interest and said he was not forthcoming in interviews with detectives.
McLachlan said there are no restrictions on Josh Powell's movements.
Meanwhile, Susan Powell's family and friends are planning a candlelight vigil Sunday night in Puyallup, Wash.
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 05:14 PM
SALT LAKE CITY (AP) - Police say they believe the Utah man considered a person of interest in the disappearance of his wife is now in Washington state.
West Valley City police Capt. Tom McLachlan said Sunday that neighbors of Josh Powell say he left Utah either Friday or Saturday, presumably to be with family in Washington...
(cont'd at link)
http://www.abc4.com/content/news/top%20stories/story/Police-say-husband-of-missing-mom-has-left-Utah/RI1C45dNQEyMH_Rp0cVczA.cspx
:parrot:
Dr.Fessel
12-20-2009, 05:18 PM
I don't think he is going to get the support he is looking for there.
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 05:18 PM
I really hope the Utah LE orders Josh arrested as a material witness. It's so easy to slip into Canada here. I'm disgusted. This killer is somewhere near me, my children, my family. UHG!
Perhaps I need to start traveling with eggs and rotten tomatoes!
Gee Josh, your own family saying you'll probably be behind bars in a week, and you leave, hmmm. I guess you know that Susan isn't coming home, don't you?
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 05:23 PM
I don't think he is going to get the support he is looking for there.
I don't think so doc... article says Susan's family and friends are planning a candlelight vigils this eve in Puyallup WA and in West Valley UT.
I'm like Ginger, don't come here... :eek: but according to police captain, there are no restrictions on his movements. :(
:parrot:
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 05:25 PM
I don't think he is going to get the support he is looking for there.
What I do hope is that our local authorities will keep an eye on him.
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 05:30 PM
Peterson Dejavu all over again. Oh, he's just trying to get away from the media. I can't wait until his beard is reeking of Clairol.
emmcee
12-20-2009, 05:43 PM
Can he legally be stopped if he attempts to cross the border?
Openmyeyes
12-20-2009, 05:50 PM
Did the article say where the children are?
I'm trying to be calm, but its difficult....
mysticrose
12-20-2009, 05:56 PM
I am highly concerned he has left the state and undoubtly with his two children...I am concerned for their safety.
Josh could cross over into Canada probally without a problem and once there he could hide but he would be found and we have an extradition treatie with Canada. One thing though is US has to garauntee no Death Penalty in order for them to agree to sending him back here to be charged if indeed they do...
jmo...
Can he legally be stopped if he attempts to cross the border?
You mean the state border? (sorry, reading backwards a little here)
If you mean state border, no they can't stop him.
We've seen this before where the guy leaves the state. I can only imagine he's doing this because his mom and sis (and bil) are no longer supporting his bogus (imho) story. They even lamented publicly they thought he was going to be arrested.
He might think his dad will stick up for him. great! :mad:
He can run but he can't hide. Josh KNOWS LE has his number. It's only a matter of time.
Don't fret everyone! I know it's hard, I'm frustrated too! But LE knows what they're doing. These things don't happen in an hour episode like tv. It takes persistance and patience.
I have no doubt they'll get their man.
JMHO
fran
mysticrose
12-20-2009, 05:57 PM
Can he legally be stopped if he attempts to cross the border?
No he can't be stopped at this point, but Canada may not want him...lol
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 05:59 PM
You mean the state border? (sorry, reading backwards a little here)
If you mean state border, no they can't stop him.
We've seen this before where the guy leaves the state. I can only imagine he's doing this because his mom and sis (and bil) are no longer supporting his bogus (imho) story. They even lamented publicly they thought he was going to be arrested.
He might think his dad will stick up for him. great! :mad:
He can run but he can't hide. Josh KNOWS LE has his number. It's only a matter of time.
Don't fret everyone! I know it's hard, I'm frustrated too! But LE knows what they're doing. These things don't happen in an hour episode like tv. It takes persistance and patience.
I have no doubt they'll get their man.
JMHO
fran
Talking about Canadian border I thought... and as much as that concerns me the thought of his having their 2 little boys worries me more!
:parrot:
I am highly concerned he has left the state and undoubtly with his two children...I am concerned for their safety.
Josh could cross over into Canada probally without a problem and once there he could hide but he would be found and we have an extradition treatie with Canada. One thing though is US has to garauntee no Death Penalty in order for them to agree to sending him back here to be charged if indeed they do...
jmo...
FWIW, Susan's parents need to file an emergency order! ASAP!
They can have a judge draw up emergency, temporary custody papers and they could get custody of the kids by tomorrow afternoon. It was done on the Nancy Cooper case. The judge signed the paper and the husband didn't even get a chance to respond. LE picked the kids up and that was it until a formal hearing could be held.
Just, fwiw,
fran
PS.............not only is this a wonderful tool to insure the safety of the kids, it can often times create valuable insight for LE about the hubby. Ehhh, that depends IF he decides to fight the custody!....fran
PPS.....I forgot what the 'special type hearing' is called. Maybe gitani1 knows!
justplainmetal
12-20-2009, 06:04 PM
I doubt he has the financial means to go on the run. Unless he plans on him and the boys "camping" in the vehicle.
Talking about Canadian border... I thought ... & as much as that concerns me, the thought of his having the 2 little boys worries me more!!
:parrot:
I didn't think of him running for the Canadian border.
darn!
:banghead:
fran
hellolisakitty
12-20-2009, 06:04 PM
Vomit...
"The father of Joshua Powell said Sunday he believes his son is being "villified" as questions swirl around the disappearance of his daughter-in-law, Susan Powell, who has now been missing for 14 days.
"The whole thing has just turned into a vilification of Josh and it will turn into a vilification of me, my ex-wife and my other kids," said Steven Powell, who spoke to The Salt Lake Tribune briefly through the partially open front door of his home Sunday.
"I'm not making any statement because it doesn't matter how benign it is or how supportive it is. Somebody will twist it around."
It's unclear whether Joshua Powell was at his father's home Sunday."
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
LaLaw2000
12-20-2009, 06:05 PM
I really hope the Utah LE orders Josh arrested as a material witness. It's so easy to slip into Canada here. I'm disgusted. This killer is somewhere near me, my children, my family. UHG!
Perhaps I need to start traveling with eggs and rotten tomatoes!
Gee Josh, your own family saying you'll probably be behind bars in a week, and you leave, hmmm. I guess you know that Susan isn't coming home, don't you?
BBM
I do hope Josh will be watched by someone. I cannot believe local LE is letting Josh go out of state! I hope that he was followed and will be going to his family home. Reporters already know Josh's Dad will not speak to them, but I hope at least one will camp out there anyway.
I wonder if Josh's sister and BIL are with him? Josh will certainly have the boys with him. I do hope that he and the kids are not going up to Washington alone because I do not feel he is capable of driving safely if he is as stressed as his friend Wayne says. I just do not have a good fwlling about this trip and I do not trust Josh.
I do hope Josh's family will not help him disappear into Canada!!
MOO
ETA: I see from a post after this one that LE did not know when he left.
Texas Mist
12-20-2009, 06:07 PM
<snip>
West Valley City police Capt. Tom McLachlan said he did not know if Joshua Powell took his two sons. McLachlan said police learned of Joshua Powell's travels from his neighbors, who told police he left Friday or Saturday.
....
McLachlan did not know whether Joshua Powell was making a holiday visit or will be gone longer.
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
LaLaw2000
12-20-2009, 06:12 PM
That's just great, Texas Mist! (total sarcasm)
Josh Powell is LE's one and only POI, and they do not know how long he will be gone or if he took the boys or not? Something stinks!
MOO
emmcee
12-20-2009, 06:14 PM
<snip>
West Valley City police Capt. Tom McLachlan said he did not know if Joshua Powell took his two sons. McLachlan said police learned of Joshua Powell's travels from his neighbors, who told police he left Friday or Saturday.
....
McLachlan did not know whether Joshua Powell was making a holiday visit or will be gone longer.
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
I cannot BELIEVE that LE does not know when he left or if he has the kids. I hope they are following him and know every move he's making, and just "playing dumb".
And yes, regarding my earlier statement I meant the Canadian border - I can see him trying to make a run outside the country, and he would probably have the help of his parents to do so. JMHO of course.
Just fwiw, regarding entry into Canada from the U.S. From what I can gather, because it now requires a passport to cross the Canadian border for entry into the U.S., the Canadian's have changed their rules about letting U.S. citizens entering without a passport, as has been done in years past.
A U.S. citizen cannot enter Canada unless they have the proper documentation to re-enter the U.S. So, IMHO, unless the children have passports, he can't flee with them to Canada. Or him either, for that matter.
There are ways to apply for a quick passport online, but I believe it may not work for the kids. From what I've seen, under 16 needs to apply in person. If they don't have both parents present, there's more detail to go into. There's been too many international parental kidnapping issues.
HTH,
fran
LaLaw2000
12-20-2009, 06:21 PM
I cannot BELIEVE that LE does not know when he left or if he has the kids. I hope they are following him and know every move he's making, and just "playing dumb".
And yes, regarding my earlier statement I meant the Canadian border - I can see him trying to make a run outside the country, and he would probably have the help of his parents to do so. JMHO of course.
IMO, Josh's Dad seems angry enough about the public opinion of Josh that I could see him helping him get out of the country. If he is already this angry about what is thought of Josh, he would think he couldn't get a fair trial. There has already been talk predicting an arrest soon.
So, yes, I can see his Dad helping him get out of the country.
MOO
LaLaw2000
12-20-2009, 06:22 PM
Just fwiw, regarding entry into Canada from the U.S. From what I can gather, because it now requires a passport to cross the Canadian border for entry into the U.S., the Canadian's have changed their rules about letting U.S. citizens entering without a passport, as has been done in years past.
A U.S. citizen cannot enter Canada unless they have the proper documentation to re-enter the U.S. So, IMHO, unless the children have passports, he can't flee with them to Canada. Or him either, for that matter.
There are ways to apply for a quick passport online, but I believe it may not work for the kids. From what I've seen, under 16 needs to apply in person. If they don't have both parents present, there's more detail to go into. There's been too many international parental kidnapping issues.
HTH,
fran
But Josh could cross the border illegally, couldn't he? There are places where he could do so, IMO.
passionflower
12-20-2009, 06:22 PM
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
latest google alert on Josh father answers at his door today
lemonmoussetart
12-20-2009, 06:27 PM
Just fwiw, regarding entry into Canada from the U.S. From what I can gather, because it now requires a passport to cross the Canadian border for entry into the U.S., the Canadian's have changed their rules about letting U.S. citizens entering without a passport, as has been done in years past.
A U.S. citizen cannot enter Canada unless they have the proper documentation to re-enter the U.S. So, IMHO, unless the children have passports, he can't flee with them to Canada. Or him either, for that matter.
There are ways to apply for a quick passport online, but I believe it may not work for the kids. From what I've seen, under 16 needs to apply in person. If they don't have both parents present, there's more detail to go into. There's been too many international parental kidnapping issues.
HTH,
fran
While I do agree that you must have a passport to enter Canada, you do not need to apply in person if under the age of 16. (unless this has changed in the last year). Just applied for my daughter's passport with signature of only one parent (me), as Dad is not in the picture. No extra paperwork, nothing. The country we were visiting was Ireland which is further away than our neighbor, Canada.
passionflower
12-20-2009, 06:29 PM
I really hope the Utah LE orders Josh arrested as a material witness. It's so easy to slip into Canada here. I'm disgusted. This killer is somewhere near me, my children, my family. UHG!
Perhaps I need to start traveling with eggs and rotten tomatoes!
Gee Josh, your own family saying you'll probably be behind bars in a week, and you leave, hmmm. I guess you know that Susan isn't coming home, don't you?
Where are Susan's sons?!
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 06:30 PM
I didn't think of him running for the Canadian border.
darn!
:banghead:
fran
It's a hop, skip and a jump (app. 2 hours) from Seattle or Bellingham WA eg, or from Port Angeles eg just a ferry ride to Victoria CA... not a comforting thought at all. :mad: Is JP's family in the Pullayup area as well?
Emergency injunction for temporary custody for sure!
:parrot:
passionflower
12-20-2009, 06:30 PM
IMO, Josh's Dad seems angry enough about the public opinion of Josh that I could see him helping him get out of the country. If he is already this angry about what is thought of Josh, he would think he couldn't get a fair trial. There has already been talk predicting an arrest soon.
So, yes, I can see his Dad helping him get out of the country.
MOO
bet he gave him money!
passionflower
12-20-2009, 06:35 PM
Darn, he should of been arrested already!
Now this.........I'm so angry!
He should of been on 24/7 watch!
Now look at the tax dollars and maybe more lives to risk.
FRAN, please add to your list, he fled!!!!
winterrose
12-20-2009, 06:35 PM
You're kidding me,he left with the boys???LE wasn't watching a POI?They don't know if this guy killed his wife and now he's running around with children,he could be suicidal.What kind of family does he have anyway?Even if they feel he isn't quilty or they're protecting him,they should at least care enough about thier grandchildren.I can't believe they'd take a chance with thier lives,he might be quilty.What is wrong with people?
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 06:35 PM
Vomit...
"The father of Joshua Powell said Sunday he believes his son is being "villified" as questions swirl around the disappearance of his daughter-in-law, Susan Powell, who has now been missing for 14 days.
"The whole thing has just turned into a vilification of Josh and it will turn into a vilification of me, my ex-wife and my other kids," said Steven Powell, who spoke to The Salt Lake Tribune briefly through the partially open front door of his home Sunday.
"I'm not making any statement because it doesn't matter how benign it is or how supportive it is. Somebody will twist it around."
It's unclear whether Joshua Powell was at his father's home Sunday."
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
Is it just me or does anyone else detect a theme in this family... I mean hellooo, his DIL, the mother of his grandsons, is MISSING... and he's more concerned w not only how this is affecting his son's image but how it may reflect upon HIM!? I'm sorry but I just can not ever imagine this being foremost in my mind, geez... :rolleyes:
:parrot:
passionflower
12-20-2009, 06:37 PM
FRAN ARE YOU ADDING TO LIST???
Can you add Tim Peterson interview, the blue cap odd ways, sister Jennifer 'ODD',
Susan's parents bought and paid monthly for her cell phone to contact them if things got worse, her diary (journal) stating many threats from Josh, JP leaving for 24 hours after he rented a car, LE had van for 3 days???
Thanks!!!!
bump for FRAN!!!!
Suthrnqt
12-20-2009, 06:38 PM
<snip>
West Valley City police Capt. Tom McLachlan said he did not know if Joshua Powell took his two sons. McLachlan said police learned of Joshua Powell's travels from his neighbors, who told police he left Friday or Saturday.
....
McLachlan did not know whether Joshua Powell was making a holiday visit or will be gone longer.
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
It really upsets me that LE wasn't keeping closer tabs on Joshua Powell. At the very least, I'd expect the customary "Don't leave town without notifying us" speech and a GPS unit attached to his vehicle. Maybe I watch too many crime dramas. But I feel a little common sense goes a long way in these investigations.
IIRC, it was stated somewhere that Josh was/is an IT person for a trucking company. I think it was stated that the job at the trucking company was where he was supposed to have been at work at on Monday morning when neither he nor Susan called in missing work.
If Josh was an IT person for a trucking company, he would know all about the tracking devices almost all commercial trucks have on them. He would know that at any given moment, the trucks can be tracked as to the progress. They would know exactly where the truck is, what highway, and whether or not the truck was even running. On a computer screen, you will see a map image and a red spot as to where the truck is. The jail/correctional facility used such a program to track all transportation vans. IMO, he would probably be very aware of the fact that most car rental agencies can do the same. I read an article in the New York Times about most car rental companies being able to know exactly where any of their cars are and even whether or not they had been driven out of state. The article gave an example of a guy having been fined for having driven out of state to a wedding when he had rented the car for local use. The article was written a couple of years ago. So, If Josh knows about tracking devices, he probably would have known that the rental car company may have had this same capability. So, a wild goose chase in the rental vehicle to throw LE off? Maybe.
I have a couple of questions for anyone who may know. Apparently a neighbor heard a car alarm going off in the Powell's garage at or around midnight that Sunday night. One question I have is: Even if the van alarm itself is is off as it would be if someone unlocked the vehicle with a key, would the GPS system have an independent alarm if someone were removing it from the vehicle? If the GPS system was not factory installed, it could have an independent alarm if someone were attempting to remove it. Another question: If the van were equiped with a LoJack, would an alarm go off if someone attempted to remove it? What else would make the van alarm go off when we know Josh had his keys? I can make my vehicle alarm go off using my remote key fob. It may be just as simple as the 4 year old playing with the key fob, but IDK.
Oh geese! I totally forgot about this IT stuff in the hands of a 'controlling' spouse. We saw this carp before in the Nancy Cooper case. He had special equipment to monitor her phone calls at work. :(
I wonder if it was Josh removing a gps tracking etc that caused the alarm to go off late that night? THIS is a very intersting scenario?
Oh, my goodness! I thought of something!
In the Nancy Cooper case, Brad denied having her phone calls monitored. He even gave an under-oath statement to this fact. At the time, I said I believed he was lying. Nancy's friends said Nancy believed he was listening to her calls and then sometimes they had unexplained hang-ups. She even got a second cell phone he didn't know about, IIRC? .......Anyway, his expertise was VoIP............(fwiw, he lied about other things under oath as well).....
As Cooper was specially certified in VoIP, he had ways to make things work that some people didn't necessarily know about, IMHO. He did at one time remove the phones he initially installed at his home. But I believe he had other devices set up and then tried to or did remove them. LE SW his POE and confiscated a couple of his computers at work. Still waiting until trial to see just how MUCH he was lying.
I don't believe Josh is as savvy on IT as Brad Cooper, but he may be more than the average person and he may have been tracking Susan 'other ways.' LE needs to go to his work and look at any computers he had access to!
JMHO
fran
gogrannypop
12-20-2009, 06:41 PM
It is very easy to cross the US/Canada border illegally. I live on the border and see it done every day, even though we have a very well guarded border crossing here. There are thousands of unsecured miles where one can cross.:twocents:
passionflower
12-20-2009, 06:41 PM
Is it just me or does anyone else detect a theme in this family... I mean hellooo, his DIL, the mother of his grandsons, is MISSING... and he's more concerned w not only how this is affecting his son's image but how it may reflect upon HIM!? I'm sorry but I just can not ever imagine this being foremost in my mind, geez... :rolleyes:
:parrot:
Evil can run in families...........
passionflower
12-20-2009, 06:43 PM
What is he driving the van?
any All points bulletin out for him?
Now how do LE think they will arrest him?
Solstice Canyon
12-20-2009, 06:43 PM
Where are Susan's sons?!
Passionflower, from the article you linked above in post #569, the article is now stating:
"Powell's attorney, Scott C. Williams, said Joshua brought the couple's two children, Charlie, 4, and Braden, 2, with him on the trip."
Unless you were asking specifically where the boys are right now!
passionflower
12-20-2009, 06:43 PM
Desparate men do desparate things...........wonder if anyone gave him a gun?
That just popped up in my head............
It really upsets me that LE wasn't keeping closer tabs on Joshua Powell. At the very least, I'd expect the customary "Don't leave town without notifying us" speech and a GPS unit attached to his vehicle. Maybe I watch too many crime dramas. But I feel a little common sense goes a long way in these investigations.
I'm not going to sell this LE agency short just yet.
Have faith!
;)
fran
Texas Mist
12-20-2009, 06:46 PM
Is it just me or does anyone else detect a theme in this family... I mean hellooo, his DIL, the mother of his grandsons, is MISSING... and he's more concerned w not only how this is affecting his son's image but how it may reflect upon HIM!? I'm sorry but I just can not ever imagine this being foremost in my mind, geez... :rolleyes:
:parrot:
Hmmmm - Joshy's daddy sounds like Cindy Anthony, don't ya think?
(and I wonder why he & his ex-wife are divorced --- because there could be a history of controlling men in the family...JMOOOC!!!)
LaLaw2000
12-20-2009, 06:47 PM
fran, I hope Josh's work computer has been looked at just as you do. He may have been able to delete some data, but we know it can be recovered.
Yes, shades of Brad Cooper and Scott Peterson as well.
Brad Cooper was a controlling POS just as Josh is. Now Josh has decided to leave the state without telling LE first. LE had to learn it from the neighbors.
Josh needs to be arrested before Christmas. Chris Coleman was arrested at his parents house - I hope Josh is also!
hellolisakitty
12-20-2009, 06:48 PM
Does anyone know if this could be political,like religiously political,you know what I mean?I can't believe he wasn't arrested already,either.
Ed Smart was in an interview with one of the fathers this week,so I guess representing the religious group they're in.Just saying.
Ed Smart has not faded away, that is for sure. He speaks out about missing persons and abductions a lot here in Salt Lake, so I was not shocked to see him with Susan's father. They do belong to the same church... but I am thinking even if Susan was not LDS Ed would still be supporting the family in some way. I have my opinions of Ed Smart - but when it comes to this sort of thing I do not think he cares about religion, economic status or any of that other stuff. Or, I guess I should say I would certainly hope not.
hellolisakitty
12-20-2009, 06:49 PM
Passionflower, from the article you linked above in post #568, the article is now stating:
"Powell's attorney, Scott C. Williams, said Joshua brought the couple's two children, Charlie, 4, and Braden, 2, with him on the trip."
Unless you were asking specifically where the boys are right now!
Oh no!!!! Now I feel ill.....
Texas Mist
12-20-2009, 06:49 PM
It really upsets me that LE wasn't keeping closer tabs on Joshua Powell. At the very least, I'd expect the customary "Don't leave town without notifying us" speech and a GPS unit attached to his vehicle. Maybe I watch too many crime dramas. But I feel a little common sense goes a long way in these investigations.
McLachlan says "I don't know" about a number of things, e.g., he didn't know if an ALS or Luminol had been used on "the wet spot"....I think he just says that instead of "we're not going to comment on that at this time".
But still - what diff would it make if he let the public know if Josh took them?
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 06:51 PM
Evil can run in families...........
yathink... I don't even need to get all psychologically deep like Vaknin, or spiritually deep about generational sin citing from the brilliant likes of Dr. Peck, I mean everybody's heard the apple doesn't fall far from the tree, or chip off the old block, right... :rolleyes:
:parrot:
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 06:51 PM
Just fwiw, regarding entry into Canada from the U.S. From what I can gather, because it now requires a passport to cross the Canadian border for entry into the U.S., the Canadian's have changed their rules about letting U.S. citizens entering without a passport, as has been done in years past.
A U.S. citizen cannot enter Canada unless they have the proper documentation to re-enter the U.S. So, IMHO, unless the children have passports, he can't flee with them to Canada. Or him either, for that matter.
There are ways to apply for a quick passport online, but I believe it may not work for the kids. From what I've seen, under 16 needs to apply in person. If they don't have both parents present, there's more detail to go into. There's been too many international parental kidnapping issues.
HTH,
fran
Hi Fran,
My concern about crossing the border is that there are MANY places it can be done with no checkpoint and no security. I've known people who have done this. That's what I'm worried about.
Patty G
12-20-2009, 06:52 PM
FWIW, Susan's parents need to file an emergency order! ASAP!
They can have a judge draw up emergency, temporary custody papers and they could get custody of the kids by tomorrow afternoon.
For all we know, maybe Josh's parents will do it on Monday.
Solstice Canyon
12-20-2009, 06:55 PM
Desparate men do desparate things...........wonder if anyone gave him a gun?
That just popped up in my head............
This concerns me as well. It was scary to know he was staying at his brother-in-law's home with the kids under the circumstances, but there were, at least presumably, other people around to supervise what was happening and to hopefully prevent any harm from coming to his children.
Now, he's presumably on his own with them. Even if they are being tracked or followed, what's to prevent him from doing something drastic? He wouldn't necessarily need a gun, unfortunately.
omegagal
12-20-2009, 06:57 PM
Is it just me or does anyone else detect a theme in this family... I mean hellooo, his DIL, the mother of his grandsons, is MISSING... and he's more concerned w not only how this is affecting his son's image but how it may reflect upon HIM!? I'm sorry but I just can not ever imagine this being foremost in my mind, geez... :rolleyes:
:parrot:
Evil runs in families according to M. Scott Peck, MD in the book People of the Lie. I believe Josh's dad has been an enabler for Josh and his behavior all his life.... I wonder what the circumstances were between Josh's mom and dad and their divorce..
Patty G
12-20-2009, 06:58 PM
It really upsets me that LE wasn't keeping closer tabs on Joshua Powell. At the very least, I'd expect the customary "Don't leave town without notifying us" speech and a GPS unit attached to his vehicle. Maybe I watch too many crime dramas. But I feel a little common sense goes a long way in these investigations.
Josh doesn't have to notify the police of anything.
What we don't know is if LE put a GPS system in the van. The way I look at it, if I could think of it, then they did it already.
Sometimes the police indicate they aren't aware when actually they already know.
Texas Mist
12-20-2009, 06:58 PM
ummm - if Josh is so overwhelmed that he can barely tie his shoelaces, WTH is he doing running off w/ the kids? did he just recover from being so overwhelmed?
And what about waiting for Susan to come home? I know he mumbled "I love her" in one of the tv news interviews but it's starting to look as tho he loved her like he'd love a favorite pair of socks.
I have a feeling that tv news & LE will keep him under the microscope in Puyallup -- and he's not going to feel less pressure.
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 06:58 PM
For all we know, maybe Josh's parents will do it on Monday.
I hope they do. It's true, there is NOTHING they can do legally until Monday, unless an arrest is made. I really hope they already have a lawyer in place.
Curious Me
12-20-2009, 06:58 PM
To me it seems so wrong to allow any Person of Interest in a crime have no restriction on their movements. Sorry if that infringes on anybody's rights, but to become a POI in a crime means you are being looked at closely. You should not be allowed to run away or go on trips with motorcycles or rental cars when your own wife is missing. Am I the only one that is shocked that this is allowed?
Not to mention, Josh may have run off with the two little boys. He is probably reaching a desperate state and I pray the boys are not with him.
There's a prayer vigil, but guess Josh is too busy running away. Says alot about him, doesn't it? He'd be there for Susan's family and offer anything he could to find her if he was truly innocent and wasn't always just thinking about himself. What's that sniveling all about, Josh?
Solstice Canyon
12-20-2009, 07:00 PM
Originally Posted by fran:
"FWIW, Susan's parents need to file an emergency order! ASAP!
They can have a judge draw up emergency, temporary custody papers and they could get custody of the kids by tomorrow afternoon."
For all we know, maybe Josh's parents will do it on Monday.
Let's hope they instinctively (or otherwise) know to do this, and that it's not too late.
Solstice Canyon
12-20-2009, 07:04 PM
...Not to mention, Josh may have run off with the two little boys. He is probably reaching a desperate state and I pray the boys are not with him...
(snipped for space) Unfortunately, his attorney has stated that the boys are with him, as per an article referenced above by Passionflower (post #569).
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 07:04 PM
Evil runs in families according to M. Scott Peck, MD in the book People of the Lie. I believe Josh's dad has been an enabler for Josh and his behavior all his life.... I wonder what the circumstances were between Josh's mom and dad and their divorce..
Yes I am well aware of this ogal... even before this thread... lol could have written the book if Peck and Vaknin didn't beat me to it....... ;) My point was that even those who may not be familiar w or believe in generational sin can relate to apples or chips off the block. You're preachin to the choir.
:)
:parrot:
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 07:06 PM
**Shivers***
Joshua Powell is less than twelve miles from me right now. That is, if he hasn't run. This makes my blood boil. Luckily for us they're in South Hill...I don't shop or run errands there often so I don't think it's likely I'll find myself face to face with the mumbling, murdering mouth-breather.
nervous_nellie
12-20-2009, 07:08 PM
Vomit...
"The father of Joshua Powell said Sunday he believes his son is being "villified" as questions swirl around the disappearance of his daughter-in-law, Susan Powell, who has now been missing for 14 days.
"The whole thing has just turned into a vilification of Josh and it will turn into a vilification of me, my ex-wife and my other kids," said Steven Powell, who spoke to The Salt Lake Tribune briefly through the partially open front door of his home Sunday.
"I'm not making any statement because it doesn't matter how benign it is or how supportive it is. Somebody will twist it around."
It's unclear whether Joshua Powell was at his father's home Sunday."
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
well, at least we know where josh gets his behavioral issues from...im sorry but i dont give a rats behind about jp's dad and ex-step mother! i mean GET REAL!
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 07:10 PM
ummm - if Josh is so overwhelmed that he can barely tie his shoelaces, WTH is he doing running off w/ the kids? did he just recover from being so overwhelmed?
And what about waiting for Susan to come home? I know he mumbled "I love her" in one of the tv news interviews but it's starting to look as tho he loved her like he'd love a favorite pair of socks.
I have a feeling that tv news & LE will keep him under the microscope in Puyallup -- and he's not going to feel less pressure.
Well if he wanted to go to a vigil (yea right :rolleyes:) he didn't have to come HERE to WA :snooty: when there was one right there in West Valley...
Do we know for certain he is in Puyallup... I've been asking, is this where his family is from as well?
:parrot:
Curious Me
12-20-2009, 07:11 PM
He has the two little boys with him. Oh no! Please say a prayer and light a candle, not only for Susan, but for her loving family and the safety of her two young sons.
While I do agree that you must have a passport to enter Canada, you do not need to apply in person if under the age of 16. (unless this has changed in the last year). Just applied for my daughter's passport with signature of only one parent (me), as Dad is not in the picture. No extra paperwork, nothing. The country we were visiting was Ireland which is further away than our neighbor, Canada.
Did you have to show a bc without 'father' indicated? or did you have to submit court order where you have sole custody? I was going by this website.
I could be wrong.
fran
http://www.travel.state.gov/passport/get/minors/minors_834.html
Special Requirements for Children Under Age 16
Minors under age 16 must apply in person
All children regardless of age, including newborns and infants, must have their own passport
There are special requirements for All Minors Ages 16 & 17
Read and understand Steps 1 - 7 before leaving this page.
STEP 1: Complete and Submit Form DS-11: Application For A U.S. Passport
Complete Form DS-11: Application for a U.S. Passport. To submit Form DS-11, the minor:
Must apply in person with both parents/guardian(s)
Must provide the additional documentation required by Form DS-11 (See Steps 2-7)
Must not sign the application until instructed to do so by the Acceptance Agent
Must provide your SSN in accordance with 26 U.S.C. 6039E
STEP 2: Submit Evidence of U.S. Citizenship
The minor's evidence of U.S. citizenship must be submitted with Form DS-11. All documentation submitted as citizenship evidence will be returned to you. These documents will be delivered with your newly issued U.S. passport or in a separate mailing.
Primary Evidence of U.S. Citizenship (One of the following):
Previously issued, undamaged U.S. Passport
Certified birth certificate issued by the city, county or state*
Consular Report of Birth Abroad or Certification of Birth
Naturalization Certificate
Certificate of Citizenship
*A certified birth certificate has a registrar's raised, embossed, impressed or multicolored seal, registrar's signature, and the date the certificate was filed with the registrar's office, which must be within 1 year of your birth. Some short (abstract) versions of birth certificates may not be acceptable for passport purposes.
NOTE: If you do not have primary evidence of U.S. citizenship or your U.S. birth certificate does not meet the requirements, please see Secondary Evidence of U.S. Citizenship.
STEP 3: Submit Evidence of Relationship
Parent(s)/Guardian(s) must submit evidence of their relationship to the minor applicant.
Evidence of Relationship (One of the following):
Minor's certified U.S. birth certificate with both parents' names
Minor's certified Foreign Birth Certificate with both parents' names*
Minor's Report of Birth Abroad with both parents' names
Adoption Decree with adopting parents' names*
Court Order establishing custody
Court Order establishing guardianship
*All foreign documents submitted with a passport application must be accompanied by an English translation (formal or informal).
NOTES:
Previous U.S. passports are not acceptable as evidence of relationship
Evidence of a legal name change must be submitted, if the name of a parent/guardian has changed since the original documents were issued (e.g. photocopy of a marriage certificate, etc.)
STEP 4: Present Identification of Parent(s)/Guardian(s)
When applying for a minor under age 16, both parent(s)/guardian(s) must present acceptable identification at the time of application.
Primary Identification (One of the following):
Previously issued, undamaged U.S. passport
Naturalization Certificate
Valid Driver's License
Current Government Employee ID (city, state or federal)
Current Military ID (military and dependents)
NOTE: If none of these items are available, please see Secondary Identification.
STEP 5: Submit a Photocopy of Each Parent/Guardian ID Document To Be Presented (STEP 4)
A photocopy of each identification document to be presented by a parent or guardian must be submitted with the minor's passport application. If you are applying for multiple minors at one time, you must include a photocopy of each parent/guardian ID document presented with each minor's individual passport application.
Photocopy must be on plain white, 8 1/2 x 11" standard paper stock, showing the front and the back of your ID
Photocopy must contain images on only one-side of each page submitted.
If copies cannot be made on the same side of one page, you may present two separate pages; one displaying the front of the ID and the second displaying the back of the ID.
The paper should be free of other images and/or markings.
The 8 1/2 x 11" paper size cannot be substituted with a larger or smaller size paper, even if the alternative folds down to the 8 1/2 x 11" size.
You may enlarge the image of your ID on the 8 1/2 x 11" page, but you may not decrease the size of the image.
Other situations that require a photocopy of identification, but are less common, include:
If you are presenting Secondary Identification, you must provide a photocopy each document being presented with your application
An assistant to a disable applicant who witnesses the signature or signs on the disabled customer's behalf must present a photocopy of his or her ID
A person acting as an Identifying Witness (Form DS-71) must present a photocopy of his or her ID
STEP 6: Provide Parental Consent
Both parents must provide consent authorizing passport issuance for a minor under age 16. See the scenarios below, and follow the instruction that best applies to your circumstance:
Both Parents MUST:
Appear in person with the minor
Sign Form DS-11 in front of an Acceptance Agent
One Parent MUST:
Appear in person with the minor
Sign Form DS-11 in front of an Acceptance Agent
Submit the second parents' notarized Statement of Consent (Form DS-3053)
One Parent
(with sole legal custody)
MUST:
Appear in person with the minor
Sign Form DS-11 in front of an Acceptance Agent
Submit primary evidence of sole authority to apply for the child with one of the following:
Minor's certified U.S. or foreign birth certificate listing only the applying parent
Consular Report of Birth Abroad (Form FS-240) or Certification of Birth Abroad (Form DS-1350) listing only the applying parent
Court order granting sole custody to the applying parent (unless child's travel is restricted by that order)
Adoption decree (if applying parents is sole adopting parent)
Court order specifically permitting applying parent's or guardian's travel with the child
Judicial declaration of incompetence of non-applying parent
Death certificate of non-applying parent
NOTE: If none of the above documentation is available, the applying parent must submit Form DS-3053 stating why the non-applying parent/guardian's consent cannot be obtained
A Third Party
(in Loco Parentis applying on behalf of a minor under the age of 16)
MUST:
Submit a notarized written statement or affidavit from both parents or guardians authorizing a third-party to apply for a passport
When the statement of affidavit is from only one parent/guardian, the third-party must present evidence of sole custody of the authorizing parent/guardian.
IMPORTANT NOTE: The written consent from the non-applying parent that accompanies an application for a new passport must be less than 3 months old. New written consent from the non-applying parent must be obtained and submitted with any future passport application for the minor under age 16
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 07:12 PM
Anyone think the lawyer told Josh to do this? Any third grader knows this guy's about to be arrested. Maybe the lawyer thought this would make it more difficult, tie things up as long as possible?
winterrose
12-20-2009, 07:13 PM
Well if he wanted to go to a vigil (yea right :rolleyes:) he didn't have to come HERE to WA :snooty: when there was one right there in West Valley...
Do we know for certain he is in Puyallup... I've been asking, is this where his family is from as well?
:parrot:
Steven Powell's home is located in a gated community called Country Hollow in South Hill, a community just outside of Puyallup, Wash. Joshua and Susan Powell both attended high school at nearby Rogers High school. Susan's parents, Chuck and Judy Cox, also live in Puyallup.
passionflower
12-20-2009, 07:13 PM
and what will his high profile lawyer say now?
I hope the news is on his trail! and LE catches him and arrests him,
he is guilty!
Dr.Fessel
12-20-2009, 07:15 PM
First off a big Congrats to The Salt Lake Tribune reporters Melinda Rodgers and Nate Carlisle for staying on this guy through 3 states..........their email is mrogers@sltrib.com .
No doubt in my mind the chip ran to the block in this case. I think the fact the dad lives in a gated community is good. They only have to watch one enterance when he tries to bolt to Canada. I think the cops knew exactly what he was doing.
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 07:15 PM
Well if he wanted to go to a vigil (yea right :rolleyes:) he didn't have to come HERE to WA :snooty: when there was one right there in West Valley...
Do we know for certain he is in Puyallup... I've been asking, is this where his family is from as well?
:parrot:
It's unconfirmed he's with the parents, but likely--at least that's what the local media believes. They live in the South Hill area of Puyallup, very close to Susan's parents.
How Mr. Cox is refraining from marching over there is beyond me........
Solstice Canyon
12-20-2009, 07:16 PM
Being from Washington State as they were, is it possible that Josh might already have a passport for the boys, and would not need to apply for one?
If that's the case, hopefully LE has the Canadian border officials keeping an eye out for them...
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 07:17 PM
and what will his high profile lawyer say now?
I hope the news is on his trail! and LE catches him and arrests him,
he is guilty!
The lawyer is simply confirming he went and he had the right to do so. And I'm wondering if it wasn't his own suggestion.
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 07:18 PM
Being from Washington State as they were, is it possible that Josh might already have a passport for the boys, and would not need to apply for one?
If that's the case, hopefully LE has the Canadian border officials keeping an eye out for them...
Yep, I'm worried about this. If I'm remembering correctly, but I'll have to confirm, Canada doesn't like giving up perps who face the death penalty. I really hope this isn't a strategy that's being played out before our eyes.
hellolisakitty
12-20-2009, 07:18 PM
Well if he wanted to go to a vigil (yea right :rolleyes:) he didn't have to come HERE to WA :snooty: when there was one right there in West Valley...
Do we know for certain he is in Puyallup... I've been asking, is this where his family is from as well?
:parrot:
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
Steven Powell requested The Salt Lake Tribune to not publish his comments after he spoke to reporters. Powell said his house and the subdivision around it is private property and said he's worried media discovers where he lives, they will "camp out" near his house.
He told Tribune reporters to "please just go and please do not come back." Asked whether he wants a chance to speak on behalf of Joshua Powell and explain the reasons why he thinks his son has been unfairly vilified, Steven Powell said, "I don't need to explain anything. There is nothing to explain."
The Pierce County Sheriff Department -- the agency in charge of the areas where Steven Powell as well as Judy and Chuck Cox live -- is assisting West Valley City police with the case, spokesman Ed Troyer has said.
passionflower
12-20-2009, 07:19 PM
Josh left Fri or Sat from Utah to ?????
they say Washington, but we have no idea, do we?
This is Sunday.........3 days........and don't forget the
24 hours with the rental car! and 17 hours camping.......
all these trips and mileage in 14 days!!!!
Exhaustion and not having his right mind could cause a very
bad wreck and take many livs in this weather!
I just cannot believe any one in their right mind would help this
man take 2 kids on another goose chase journey!
Let's pray that no one else is killed by this idiot.
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 07:21 PM
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
Steven Powell requested The Salt Lake Tribune to not publish his comments after he spoke to reporters. Powell said his house and the subdivision around it is private property and said he's worried media discovers where he lives, they will "camp out" near his house.
He told Tribune reporters to "please just go and please do not come back." Asked whether he wants a chance to speak on behalf of Joshua Powell and explain the reasons why he thinks his son has been unfairly vilified, Steven Powell said, "I don't need to explain anything. There is nothing to explain."
The Pierce County Sheriff Department -- the agency in charge of the areas where Steven Powell as well as Judy and Chuck Cox live -- is assisting West Valley City police with the case, spokesman Ed Troyer has said.
Ha, as if you weren't listed Mr. Powell.
I know a lot my local Pierce Sheriffs...GO BOYS! Keep on that rat!
lemonmoussetart
12-20-2009, 07:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lemonmoussetart
While I do agree that you must have a passport to enter Canada, you do not need to apply in person if under the age of 16. (unless this has changed in the last year). Just applied for my daughter's passport with signature of only one parent (me), as Dad is not in the picture. No extra paperwork, nothing. The country we were visiting was Ireland which is further away than our neighbor, Canada.
Did you have to show a bc without 'father' indicated? or did you have to submit court order where you have sole custody? I was going by this website.
I could be wrong.
fran
No, just checked a box that I had sole custody--needed no court documentation verifying this. Father's name is on her birth certificate which was necessary for passport, of course.
passionflower
12-20-2009, 07:27 PM
IMO, Susan's dad KNEW Susan had problems with Josh, it was HE WHO got the cell phone and paid monthly to keep in touch with her,
Susan's friends, church and Josh's own sister knew about the problems.
IMO, they all left her down.
Oh if Susan had had the support and a plan!
Anyone out there with this domestic violence.......
please NEVERtell the SOB you are leaving, have a PLAN and escape!
It might of saved Susan, Stacy and so many others!
After going to this website, click on the 'ABOUT' section on the top bar. Then click on the 'ABOUT JOSH', and you will find the following...
"Throughout his college years, Josh received some of the highest honors available, including Phi Theta Kappa, Magna Cum Laude, and repeated placement on the President's List".
It also states that some of his 'social' outlets were public speaking (lol!), campus politics, drama productions, and writing for the campus newspaper (he probably once ran a classified ad).
Elsewhere on his website, he claims to have "12 years in the real estate industry".
~ I just can't help but wonder if any of these claims are true. This guy is so full of himself.
There is one statement on the website I know for a fact to be a lie... it's where he claims 'Honesty' and 'Integrity'.
I'm not trying to minimize Josh's accomplishments, IF it's true! However, did you all know that "Phi Theta Kappa" is for two year (ie jr college) students?
JMHO
fran
http://www.ptk.org/
Phi Theta Kappa
Patty G
12-20-2009, 07:33 PM
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
The Pierce County Sheriff Department -- the agency in charge of the areas where Steven Powell as well as Judy and Chuck Cox live -- is assisting West Valley City police with the case, spokesman Ed Troyer has said.
I find the above statement about the Pierce County Sheriff Department assisting the West Valley City Police Department very comforting.
I also like the fact that Josh's father lives in a gated community.
IMO, Josh's lawyer probably advised Josh to head to his father's place and take the children away from all the media that is surrounding Josh. If anything, hopefully the children will have some sort of Christmas even if it is without their mother.
passionflower
12-20-2009, 07:33 PM
I was just reading on another blog that someone feels That Susan's father knows more than he is really saying.
Hopefully he told ALL HE KNOWS to LE!!!
I'm wondering if physical abuse had started recently from JP to Susan????
LaLaw2000
12-20-2009, 07:35 PM
Steven Powell's home is located in a gated community called Country Hollow in South Hill, a community just outside of Puyallup, Wash. Joshua and Susan Powell both attended high school at nearby Rogers High school. Susan's parents, Chuck and Judy Cox, also live in Puyallup.
Well, apparently the reporter got into that gated community! Wonder what Steven Powell's neighbors think of having Josh in their midst?
hellolisakitty
12-20-2009, 07:36 PM
Watching KUTV Channel 2.... technically the cops DO NOT KNOW WHERE JOSH IS! They say the neighbors told LE that he said he was going to Washington... but as of right now he and the children are NOT accounted for.
But the BIL thinks he is still in Utah (per a phone interview earlier today).
"Friends and family are keeping their eyes peeled for him"
Wow....
passionflower
12-20-2009, 07:37 PM
Those poor little babies!
My heart breaks thinking of what they have gone through in 2 weeks.
No mommy, no house, no favorite anything.
Arguments, crying, emotions............
On trips in the cold, crazy father, tossed around from
family member to family member.......now to grandparents
(do they even know them that well?)
passionflower
12-20-2009, 07:41 PM
He is a man on the run now..........
where will he go?
who will take him in?
these are the big questions.........
internet girlfriend???
mysticrose
12-20-2009, 07:42 PM
Reading along here...I just read about the car alarm being heard...maybe Susan set it off trying to get help or bring attention to the home by hitting the panic button on the keys...or JP did not realize the van was locked and tried to open it while trying to load Susan.
Another thing why is he not in Utah helping look for his wife if "he didn't do anything to her " as he stated in one of his interviews ?...
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 07:43 PM
Some interesting articles if anyone hadn't seen... also, from the mothersarevanishing blog (cont'd at link)
Neighbor Stephanie Olson said as soon as she heard her neighbor was missing, she had a bad feeling.
"I know she would never leave her kids," Olson said. "If anything, she would have left with the children while Josh was at work. She'd take her kids. I believe that 100 percent. She was really good with her children."
Olson and other neighbors said about a year ago, Susan Powell began talking openly in church about obtaining a divorce. Olson said Susan Powell was very open about her home life and the issues in her marriage.
"She wasn't shy," Olson said. "She talked about divorcing and trying to save money to leave him."
http://mothersarevanishing.blogspot.com/2009/12/susan-powell-familiar-scenario.html
And from today's SLTribune (full article at link)
Chuck and Judy Cox worked to get to know their new son-in-law, who Chuck Cox said has an "interesting" sense of humor that people don't understand.
He grew frustrated with his son-in-law, who would arrive hours late to family dinners or other functions. Joshua Powell's behavior was an odd departure from the way Chuck and Judy Cox raised Susan, they said.
Some of Susan's friends were also put off by Joshua's seemingly anti-social and awkward behavior.
The Coxes silently wondered if Joshua had a possible mental illness, knowing he had a relative that suffered from bipolar disorder. But Joshua's family summed up the man's eccentric behavior as "Josh is just Josh," Chuck Cox said.
They also had "issues" with Joshua's father, Steven Powell, who could not be reached for comment for this story. A man who answered the door of a Puyallup home believed to belong to Steven Powell refused to speak to a Salt Lake Tribune reporter. The Coxes said Steven Powell isn't actively helping with the search for Susan...
Chuck Cox visited his daughter and grandchildren every three to six months, when his job as a safety inspector for the government brought him to Salt Lake City.
Aware that his daughter and her husband had "typical" problems, he believed on a recent visit that her relationship with Joshua had taken a turn for the better. The couple underwent marriage counseling, Chuck Cox said, which encouraged his daughter.
"We were constantly asking her, 'How are things?' And she was telling us that they were better," Chuck Cox said. "And now hearing things ... I think she wasn't telling us the whole story."
"I think she just didn't want us to worry," Judy Cox added. "She wanted to make things work."
Still, the family reached out to Susan out of concern that a day might come when she needed their assistance.
Chuck Cox said he bought his daughter a cell phone when she moved to Utah so she could use it for emergencies. Joshua Powell knew about the phone, he said, but he and Judy paid the bill each month to ensure his daughter had a way to call them.
"We wanted her to be able to call us whenever she wanted -- just on the off chance that if something ever got really weird -- we wanted to cover all of our bases so she could call us for help," he said...
Chuck Cox didn't hear about his daughter's disappearance from her husband until two days after she went missing.
Joshua Powell called Chuck Cox the Tuesday after Susan disappeared, a day after "the entire state was already looking for her," Chuck Cox said.
Since then, he has seen his son-in-law once when in Salt Lake City and spoke with him over the phone once. Joshua behaved strangely in both encounters and claimed he doesn't know what happened to Susan, Chuck Cox said.
He said he has spoken with Joshua's mother in West Valley City, who along with Joshua's sister, Jennifer Graves, is committed to finding out the truth about what happened to Susan. Jennifer's husband, Kirk, has said in previous media interviews that he thinks Joshua could be arrested in connection with Susan's disappearance.
Those comments are disturbing to the Coxes, who are concerned about the well-being of their two grandsons, although Chuck Cox has said Joshua has always been a good father.
"They know him better than we do -- for them to say that, it's like, 'Wow,'" Judy Cox said of Graves' comment.
Chuck Cox said he was careful not to point a finger at his son-in-law at first when news about his daughter broke, in part because of the Elizabeth Smart kidnapping case, where the wrong suspects were initially targeted. But he said he had his own suspicions about Joshua from the start, especially after seeing TV interviews in which a seemingly befuddled Joshua speaks of "making s'mores" and hiking on trails somewhere "down south" in the middle of a snowstorm with his two young children.
He said it's excruciating to hear his 4-year-old grandchild, Charlie, talking about "Mommy being lost."
"That's all he knows," Chuck Cox said. "He's too young to understand."
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14035282?source=rv
:parrot:
omegagal
12-20-2009, 07:45 PM
The last time they had a candle light vigil, they took that house apart. Maybe Joshy boy's afraid of what they're planning for this vigil tonight.....
I'd love to see him arrested soon so LE and the media can have a decent Christmas....
bump for FRAN!!!!
I actually came in here today to update the list. But when I was in the middle of working on it, going to see for anything I missed, I saw Josh left town. You know how that goes?
I'll try and put up an updated list soon and everyone can tell me anything I missed.
fran
omegagal
12-20-2009, 07:48 PM
I was just reading on another blog that someone feels That Susan's father knows more than he is really saying.
Hopefully he told ALL HE KNOWS to LE!!!
I'm wondering if physical abuse had started recently from JP to Susan????
I bet the only domestic violence has been emotional, psychological, verbal and financial... and that's a lot worst than physical. Ask anyone that's been abused all of these ways. Physical you can at least get the courts involved and this dumb s&*$ knew that........
It is very easy to cross the US/Canada border illegally. I live on the border and see it done every day, even though we have a very well guarded border crossing here. There are thousands of unsecured miles where one can cross.:twocents:
LOL, well I live a few miles from the southern border and I KNOW there's ways to cross here!
fran
hellolisakitty
12-20-2009, 07:55 PM
I bet the only domestic violence has been emotional, psychological, verbal and financial... and that's a lot worst than physical. Ask anyone that's been abused all of these ways. Physical you can at least get the courts involved and this dumb s&*$ knew that........
Been there and agree with you 100%.
I bet the only domestic violence has been emotional, psychological, verbal and financial... and that's a lot worst than physical. Ask anyone that's been abused all of these ways. Physical you can at least get the courts involved and this dumb s&*$ knew that........
They say that verbal abuse is only a second away from physical abuse!
fran
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 07:58 PM
Watching KUTV Channel 2.... technically the cops DO NOT KNOW WHERE JOSH IS! They say the neighbors told LE that he said he was going to Washington... but as of right now he and the children are NOT accounted for.
But the BIL thinks he is still in Utah (per a phone interview earlier today).
"Friends and family are keeping their eyes peeled for him"
Wow....
I think this is a case of being willfully obtuse to throw off the press.
Here is a link (http://www.komonews.com/news/local/79765062.html) to where the attorney is confirming Washington:
Josh Powell's attorney, Scott Williams, said in a text message to The Associated Press that his client went to his father's house in Washington for the holidays with his sons.
So now we have confirmation the dirt bag is indeed in South Hill. Or at least, that's where he's supposed to be.
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 07:59 PM
Well, apparently the reporter got into that gated community! Wonder what Steven Powell's neighbors think of having Josh in their midst?
Heck, I'd let all the press in I could if I knew there was a chance that creep was inside my gates! Pretty sure some of the neighbors might just feel the same.
LaLaw2000
12-20-2009, 08:00 PM
I bet the only domestic violence has been emotional, psychological, verbal and financial... and that's a lot worst than physical. Ask anyone that's been abused all of these ways. Physical you can at least get the courts involved and this dumb s&*$ knew that........
Well, we just do not know if there was ever any physical violence or not, but I would say murder would be pretty physical and certainly the most abusive that can be.
Josh has it in him to do murder, so physical abuse is within the realm of possibility when he got angry. Usually verbal abuse is closely followed by physical abuse........................just sayin.
MOO
Patty G
12-20-2009, 08:01 PM
Don't forget about the "World-Wide Candlelight and Prayer Vigil."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAzz2l140O4
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 08:01 PM
**Shivers***
Joshua Powell is less than twelve miles from me right now. That is, if he hasn't run. This makes my blood boil. Luckily for us they're in South Hill...I don't shop or run errands there often so I don't think it's likely I'll find myself face to face with the mumbling, murdering mouth-breather.
Oh great :eek: at least there's a good couple hours between him and us :/ Susan used to live in my area, per last article, and doesn't sound like any shrinking violet either (nor is kiki, shocker right) but it's undoubtedly that strength over which JP feared he'd lost all control :rolleyes: w/e :loser: :mad:
:parrot:
LaLaw2000
12-20-2009, 08:04 PM
Don't forget about the "World-Wide Candlelight and Prayer Vigil."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAzz2l140O4
Thank you for the reminder, Patty G.!
I will certainly do this.
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 08:04 PM
Oh great :eek: at least there's a good couple hours between him and us :/ Susan used to live in my area, per last article, and doesn't sound like any shrinking violet either (nor is kiki, shocker right) but it's undoubtedly that strength over which JP feared he'd lost all control :rolleyes: w/e :loser: :mad:
:parrot:
I'm half tempted to make a sign and stand outside those gates.
"TELL US WHERE SUSAN IS!"
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 08:06 PM
Well, we just do not know if there was ever any physical violence or not, but I would say murder would be pretty physical and certainly the most abusive that can be.
Josh has it in him to do murder, so physical abuse is within the realm of possibility when he got angry. Usually verbal abuse is closely followed by physical abuse........................just sayin.
MOO
They say that verbal abuse is only a second away from physical abuse!
Probably decided he "had to" kill her cuz he knew if he laid a hand on her and gave her half a chance, sheda whooped his sorry @$$ :furious:
:parrot:
passionflower
12-20-2009, 08:08 PM
I actually came in here today to update the list. But when I was in the middle of working on it, going to see for anything I missed, I saw Josh left town. You know how that goes?
I'll try and put up an updated list soon and everyone can tell me anything I missed.
fran
You're great Fran for doing this for us!!!
hellolisakitty
12-20-2009, 08:09 PM
I think this is a case of being willfully obtuse to throw off the press.
Here is a link (http://www.komonews.com/news/local/79765062.html) to where the attorney is confirming Washington:
So now we have confirmation the dirt bag is indeed in South Hill. Or at least, that's where he's supposed to be.
The only think that makes me wonder... the attorney made the comment a couple hours before the 5pm news... and on the news LE said they had no confirmation of where they were and the BIL doubted he ever left Utah. So, who knows...
gitana1
12-20-2009, 08:14 PM
I am highly concerned he has left the state and undoubtly with his two children...I am concerned for their safety.
Josh could cross over into Canada probally without a problem and once there he could hide but he would be found and we have an extradition treatie with Canada. One thing though is US has to garauntee no Death Penalty in order for them to agree to sending him back here to be charged if indeed they do...
jmo...
I don't think foreign countries care about the DP with regard to extradition when it concerns an American national. They'd just rather have such people the heck out of their country.
lemonmoussetart
12-20-2009, 08:15 PM
"Happy" holidays?
Josh Powell's attorney, Scott Williams, said in a text message to The Associated Press that his client went to his father's house in Washington state for the holidays with his sons.
http://www.oregonlive.com/newsflash/index.ssf?/base/national-86/126135290210370.xml&storylist=orwashington
passionflower
12-20-2009, 08:16 PM
They say that verbal abuse is only a second away from physical abuse!
fran
I'm even thinking of him throwing things at her,
threats of wrecking car with her & kids in it,
punching doors, walls, pushing her, drugging her,
holding her roughly leaving little bruises no one saw in special areas.
The abuse goes from emotional, finacial, verbal and so forth.
Then the last was the violent murder, but I bet he was up the ladder on abuse!
omegagal
12-20-2009, 08:17 PM
Some men can contain the abuse to "legal" forms for years. It seems like this is how Josh and Susan existed for quite a while.... sometimes it never gets "physical" though the mental torture is in fact much worst. Where ever Susan is, I pray she is no longer in any mental or physical pain... God be with her and her family...
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 08:18 PM
Thank you for the reminder, Patty G.!
I will certainly do this.
Video says 8:30-9pm. The West Valley vigil in Utah is MT (Mountain Time), we're Pacific Time in WA eg where they're holding another vigil... Not sure that really matters prayers work all the time, I just thought I'd mention.
:parrot:
passionflower
12-20-2009, 08:19 PM
"Happy" holidays?
Josh Powell's attorney, Scott Williams, said in a text message to The Associated Press that his client went to his father's house in Washington state for the holidays with his sons.
http://www.oregonlive.com/newsflash/index.ssf?/base/national-86/126135290210370.xml&storylist=orwashington
Since his parents are divorced and this is dad and step mom, wonder how close they are to him emtionally?
Wonder what step mom thinks of a murderer in her home?
Did sister kick him out of her home?
Was there no where else to go?
When and if he is arrested, then they would be harboring a fugitive if they don't let him leave, right? or help him?
They must have money to help him travel???
Quote:
Originally Posted by fran
Things are mounting up.............anyone else?
fran
1. Husband not the one who reported victim missing.
2. Husband had 'odd' alibi, ie going camping in sub-zero temperartures, late at night, leaving sick wife home alone in bed, and taking two toddlers, pre five yo's into the freezing winter night.
3. Change of story details, here and there or becoming evasive.
4. Avoiding media contact. The few times media managed to get a statement. He cut them off when they asked detailed questions about camping location. His excuse was "I have to get my boys." IMHO, he's using the boys as a shield.
5. Avoiding media questions, ie "Is that where you went camping?" to which he replies, "I have to pick up my boys."
6. Avoids wife-victim's family.
7. Stops talking to LE
8. Concerned with 'his house.'
9. Speaks of victim in 'past-tense.'
10. Speaks of 'buying new clothes and comforter.'
11. Unexplained 'wet spot' in carpeting and 'fans being used to dry.'
12. Gradual release of 'friends and family' speaking of marital problems.
13. Alleged from 'friends' of husband having control issues, which included control of wife ie victim.
14. Alleged from 'friends' of 'verbal abuse' by husband of victim.
15. Alleged statement by one of the children (ok, possibly rumor) "Daddy said mommy stayed in the woods for awhile."
16. Spoke to neighbor about 'hope his bird isn't dead' but didn't talk about his missing wife.
17. Testing generator late at night on camping trip
18. Sledding in the dark? Locals, is there a place in that area to go sledding in the dark? He told friend he was taking boys sledding, that was at 5:00p.m. and he was seen returning home at 8:30p.m.)
19. Near frost bitten hands.
20. Just the sheer distance of the alleged camp site (3 or 4 hours drive)
21. NOT one sign of husband camping where he said he was.
22. Just plain talking about 'himself,' rather than his missing wife!!!!!!!!
23. No sign of forced entry of home.
24. Friends and neighbors said it was unusual for Josh to suddenly go camping late at night with the children in the freezing weather.
25. Periodic money problems including a past bankruptcy.
26. Joshy tells his FIL the last time he saw Susan was at 12:30, but didn't bother to tell him what a great time was had by all at the wee-hours-of-the-nite-camping-in-subzero-temps-and-snowstorm-in-the-desert outing.
(from Texas Mist)
27. Left sick wife alone, never to check on her and she had NO CAR to go to doctor! (from member passionflower)
28. Wife had gone to bed sick with an ear-ache which meant she most likely had a cold. Yet, husband made her walk home from church in freezing weather, (they only had one car)
29. Susan's friend had spoken to her on Sunday and friend said Susan wasn't sick.
30. Husband said wife sick but she went to bed at 12:30 a.m.
31. Husband said he forgot it was Sunday but he also said he saw last saw Susan at 12:30 a.m. when she went to bed and he was leaving for camping with the kids. She would have reminded him it was Monday and not Sat,nite/Sunday a.m.
32. Susan told co-workers she was physically fearful of her husband.
33. Co-workers say Susan took precautions in case 'anything' happened to her.
34. Josh's BIL stated when asked if he believes Josh had anything to do with Susan's disappearance, "I pray Josh isn't responisble."
35. Susan't friends knowledge of Powell marriage............SEVERAL advised Susan to leave her husband.
36. Susan's family paid for her to have a cell phone in case she was in trouble.
37. Josh refused a lie detector test. (I know this can't be used in court, but in the court of public opinion, it points to him hiding something.
38. Disappeared for 24 hours with rental car, AFTER Susan went missing.
39. Local reporter said that at alleged camping location, you need to travel approximately 20 miles on unpaved road. It was storming. {suspicious}
40. When talking about spur of the moment camping trip with boys, Josh said they '.....liked to have smores in the morning.' :waitasec:
*Blue are added as the case developes and Websleuthers mention them
REASONS NOT TO LOOK TOWARDS HUSBAND
1. Josh said he didn't harm Susan.
2. Susan's dad said to stop looking at husband, he didn't harm his daughter.
omegagal
12-20-2009, 08:21 PM
Thank you for the reminder, Patty G.!
I will certainly do this.
On the FB Friends and Family Group, they've posted a site where you can light a candle for her tonight... It's a third way down on the main page on the FB site.
GingerRed
12-20-2009, 08:23 PM
I don't think foreign countries care about the DP with regard to extradition when it concerns an American national. They'd just rather have such people the heck out of their country.
After checking wikipedia and several articles, I'm finding that Canada most often refuses to extradite unless the death penalty is off the table. There have been exceptions, but mostly those were for people who murdered law enforcement.
From Wikipedia's Capital Punishment in Canada page:
The Supreme Court of Canada, in the case United States v. Burns, (2001), has determined that Canada should not extradite condemned persons, unless they have assurances that the foreign state will not apply the death penalty, essentially overruling Kindler v. Canada (Minister of Justice), (1991). This is similar to the extradition policies of other nations such as Germany, France, Italy, the United Kingdom, Israel, Mexico, and Australia, which also refuse to extradite prisoners who may be condemned to death.
So if Joshy just happens to take a nice stroll into Canada when the arrest warrant is issued, the death penalty could be taken completely off the table simply to make certain Canada returns Powell to Utah.
Patty G
12-20-2009, 08:24 PM
Video says 8:30-9pm. The West Valley vigil in Utah is MT (Mountain Time), we're Pacific Time in WA eg where they're holding another vigil... Not sure that really matters prayers work all the time, I just thought I'd mention.
:parrot:
Since the vigil states "World-Wide" it's got to be 8:30 PM somewhere in the world. Soon it will be 8:30 PM for me. :) That is when I will light my candle and say my prayer for Susan and her family.
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 08:25 PM
Those poor little babies!
My heart breaks thinking of what they have gone through in 2 weeks.
No mommy, no house, no favorite anything.
Arguments, crying, emotions............
On trips in the cold, crazy father, tossed around from
family member to family member.......now to grandparents
(do they even know them that well?)
omg!!! those poor boys....
I feel the Polar-BiPolar Defense coming on... haven't we all heard, it was the hypothermia inducing hallucinations and psychosis... :rolleyes:
:parrot:
passionflower
12-20-2009, 08:26 PM
Fran,
Add?? he has left Utah on Fri or Sat, Sun where abouts at moment unknown???
Press thinks Father's house?
passionflower
12-20-2009, 08:32 PM
It's 8:30 here, lite a candle and thinking of all abused women and children!
R.I.P. Susan, we all know you are in a better place.
Bless your sons and keep them safe.........
Hope you get justice soon.
adnoid
12-20-2009, 08:33 PM
...And what about waiting for Susan to come home?..
Good point. Except he knows she's not, and he just told the rest of us that he knows she's not by bolting.
adnoid
12-20-2009, 08:34 PM
...So now we have confirmation the dirt bag is indeed in South Hill. Or at least, that's where he's supposed to be.
All we know is his attorney said that. His criminal defense attorney. In my mind, that means of all the places in the world he could be South Hill is NOT it.
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 08:45 PM
Originally Posted by fran
Things are mounting up.............anyone else?
fran
1. Husband not the one who reported victim missing.
2. Husband had 'odd' alibi, ie going camping in sub-zero temperartures, late at night, leaving sick wife home alone in bed, and taking two toddlers, pre five yo's into the freezing winter night.
3. Change of story details, here and there or becoming evasive.
4. Avoiding media contact. The few times media managed to get a statement. He cut them off when they asked detailed questions about camping location. His excuse was "I have to get my boys." IMHO, he's using the boys as a shield.
5. Avoiding media questions, ie "Is that where you went camping?" to which he replies, "I have to pick up my boys."
6. Avoids wife-victim's family.
7. Stops talking to LE
8. Concerned with 'his house.'
9. Speaks of victim in 'past-tense.'
10. Speaks of 'buying new clothes and comforter.'
11. Unexplained 'wet spot' in carpeting and 'fans being used to dry.'
12. Gradual release of 'friends and family' speaking of marital problems.
13. Alleged from 'friends' of husband having control issues, which included control of wife ie victim.
14. Alleged from 'friends' of 'verbal abuse' by husband of victim.
15. Alleged statement by one of the children (ok, possibly rumor) "Daddy said mommy stayed in the woods for awhile."
16. Spoke to neighbor about 'hope his bird isn't dead' but didn't talk about his missing wife.
17. Testing generator late at night on camping trip
18. Sledding in the dark? (Locals, is there a place in that area to go sledding in the dark? He told friend he was taking boys sledding, that was at 5:00p.m. and he was seen returning home at 8:30p.m.)
19. Near frost bitten hands.
20. Just the sheer distance of the alleged camp site (3 or 4 hours drive)
21. NOT one sign of husband camping where he said he was.
22. Just plain talking about 'himself,' rather than his missing wife!!!!!!!!
23. No sign of forced entry of home.
24. Friends and neighbors said it was unusual for Josh to suddenly go camping late at night with the children in the freezing weather.
25. Periodic money problems including a past bankruptcy.
26. Joshy tells his FIL the last time he saw Susan was at 12:30, but didn't bother to tell him what a great time was had by all at the wee-hours-of-the-nite-camping-in-subzero-temps-and-snowstorm-in-the-desert outing.
(from Texas Mist)
27. Left sick wife alone, never to check on her and she had NO CAR to go to doctor! (from member passionflower)
28. Wife had gone to bed sick with an ear-ache which meant she most likely had a cold. Yet, husband made her walk home from church in freezing weather, (they only had one car)
29. Susan's friend had spoken to her on Sunday and friend said Susan wasn't sick.
30. Husband said wife sick but she went to bed at 12:30 a.m.
31. Husband said he forgot it was Sunday but he also said he saw last saw Susan at 12:30 a.m. when she went to bed and he was leaving for camping with the kids. She would have reminded him it was Monday and not Sat,nite/Sunday a.m.
32. Susan told co-workers she was physically fearful of her husband.
33. Co-workers say Susan took precautions in case 'anything' happened to her.
34. Josh's BIL stated when asked if he believes Josh had anything to do with Susan's disappearance, "I pray Josh isn't responisble."
35. Susan't friends knowledge of Powell marriage............SEVERAL advised Susan to leave her husband.
36. Susan's family paid for her to have a cell phone in case she was in trouble.
37. Josh refused a lie detector test. (I know this can't be used in court, but in the court of public opinion, it points to him hiding something.
38. Disappeared for 24 hours with rental car, AFTER Susan went missing.
39. Local reporter said that at alleged camping location, you need to travel approximately 20 miles on unpaved road. It was storming. {suspicious}
40. When talking about spur of the moment camping trip with boys, Josh said they '.....liked to have smores in the morning.' :waitasec:
41. Wife's cellphone, purse and belongings LEFT BEHIND...
42. Josh says "got his days mixed up, thought it was Sunday" :rolleyes: (yet neither attends church nor allows for boys to go...)
*Blue are added as the case developes and Websleuthers mention them
REASONS NOT TO LOOK TOWARDS HUSBAND
1. Josh said he didn't harm Susan.
2. Susan's dad said to stop looking at husband, he didn't harm his daughter.
passionflower
12-20-2009, 08:50 PM
Did anyone put a timeline on this last 2 weeks?
Maybe we could put one together. TIA
I'm looking over my notes. But need help........
anyone have the timeline better than I have?
Sunday, December 6, 2009
Susan went to church, walked home with friends.
JP made pancakes and eggs for supper, rarely cooked.
Friend was over to help Susan with crocheting project.
Friend left at 5 pm.
JP took sons sledding in dark at 5:30pm.
Neighbor sw JP come home at 8:30pm
Neighbor heard JP's van's security going off in garage at 11:45pm.
Monday, Dec 7, 2009
JP left for a camping trip at 12:30 am Monday morning with sons.
JP and Susan do not show up for work.
Sons are not at babysitters.
Relatives are called.
Concerned relatives call LE, who break a window for wellness search.
Friend calls JP cell phone at 3pm
Another friend contacts JP by cell phone at 4pm.
JP arrives home at 5pm.
Tuesday, December 8th
JP calls Susan's dad and tells him Susan is missing.
LE takes van.
JP rents a car and leaves for 24 hours.
Wednesday, December 9th
JP comes back home?
Did he take sons for 24 hours?
Where was he?
Police spent two hours removing items from the Powell home.
Police say Josh Powell is not a suspect at this time
Thursday, December 10
Police searched the Simpson Spring Recreation Area and found no sign of Josh Powell's campsite.
Josh Powell speaks briefly with reporters
Friday, December 11
Police stil have no arrests and said Josh Powell is a person of interest
Saturday, December 12:
Susan Powell's father, Charles Cox, traveled to Utah to help search for his daughter.
Josh Powell's family held a press conference and Josh Powell stands silenty with them.
Community members pass out fliers with pictures of Susan Powell.
Sunday, December 13, 2009
1 week Susan is gone.
Monday, December 14:
Josh Powell retains attorney.
Friday/Sat, December 18/19
Josh on the run to Washington?
Sunday, December 20,2009
2 weeks Susan is gone.
World wide prayer vigil at 8:30pm.
JP and sons where abouts unknown
nursebeeme
12-20-2009, 08:53 PM
Adnoid... ITA.. he is not at his Father's house...
passionflower
12-20-2009, 08:57 PM
Originally Posted by fran
Things are mounting up.............anyone else?
fran
1. Husband not the one who reported victim missing.
2. Husband had 'odd' alibi, ie going camping in sub-zero temperartures, late at night, leaving sick wife home alone in bed, and taking two toddlers, pre five yo's into the freezing winter night.
3. Change of story details, here and there or becoming evasive.
4. Avoiding media contact. The few times media managed to get a statement. He cut them off when they asked detailed questions about camping location. His excuse was "I have to get my boys." IMHO, he's using the boys as a shield.
5. Avoiding media questions, ie "Is that where you went camping?" to which he replies, "I have to pick up my boys."
6. Avoids wife-victim's family.
7. Stops talking to LE
8. Concerned with 'his house.'
9. Speaks of victim in 'past-tense.'
10. Speaks of 'buying new clothes and comforter.'
11. Unexplained 'wet spot' in carpeting and 'fans being used to dry.'
12. Gradual release of 'friends and family' speaking of marital problems.
13. Alleged from 'friends' of husband having control issues, which included control of wife ie victim.
14. Alleged from 'friends' of 'verbal abuse' by husband of victim.
15. Alleged statement by one of the children (ok, possibly rumor) "Daddy said mommy stayed in the woods for awhile."
16. Spoke to neighbor about 'hope his bird isn't dead' but didn't talk about his missing wife.
17. Testing generator late at night on camping trip
18. Sledding in the dark? (Locals, is there a place in that area to go sledding in the dark? He told friend he was taking boys sledding, that was at 5:00p.m. and he was seen returning home at 8:30p.m.)
19. Near frost bitten hands.
20. Just the sheer distance of the alleged camp site (3 or 4 hours drive)
21. NOT one sign of husband camping where he said he was.
22. Just plain talking about 'himself,' rather than his missing wife!!!!!!!!
23. No sign of forced entry of home.
24. Friends and neighbors said it was unusual for Josh to suddenly go camping late at night with the children in the freezing weather.
25. Periodic money problems including a past bankruptcy.
26. Joshy tells his FIL the last time he saw Susan was at 12:30, but didn't bother to tell him what a great time was had by all at the wee-hours-of-the-nite-camping-in-subzero-temps-and-snowstorm-in-the-desert outing.
(from Texas Mist)
27. Left sick wife alone, never to check on her and she had NO CAR to go to doctor! (from member passionflower)
28. Wife had gone to bed sick with an ear-ache which meant she most likely had a cold. Yet, husband made her walk home from church in freezing weather, (they only had one car)
29. Susan's friend had spoken to her on Sunday and friend said Susan wasn't sick.
30. Husband said wife sick but she went to bed at 12:30 a.m.
31. Husband said he forgot it was Sunday but he also said he saw last saw Susan at 12:30 a.m. when she went to bed and he was leaving for camping with the kids. She would have reminded him it was Monday and not Sat,nite/Sunday a.m.
32. Susan told co-workers she was physically fearful of her husband.
33. Co-workers say Susan took precautions in case 'anything' happened to her.
34. Josh's BIL stated when asked if he believes Josh had anything to do with Susan's disappearance, "I pray Josh isn't responisble."
35. Susan't friends knowledge of Powell marriage............SEVERAL advised Susan to leave her husband.
36. Susan's family paid for her to have a cell phone in case she was in trouble.
37. Josh refused a lie detector test. (I know this can't be used in court, but in the court of public opinion, it points to him hiding something.
38. Disappeared for 24 hours with rental car, AFTER Susan went missing.
39. Local reporter said that at alleged camping location, you need to travel approximately 20 miles on unpaved road. It was storming. {suspicious}
40. When talking about spur of the moment camping trip with boys, Josh said they '.....liked to have smores in the morning.' :waitasec:
41. Wife's cellphone, purse and belongings LEFT BEHIND...
42. Josh says "got his days mixed up, thought it was Sunday" :rolleyes: (yet neither attends church nor allows for boys to go...)
43. Josh skips town on Dec 18/19 (Fri/Sat) attorney says to spend holidays in Washington with father and step mom.
44. Sunday 2 weeks after Susan disappeared, Josh whereabouts unknown.
Has sons with him....
*Blue are added as the case developes and Websleuthers mention them
REASONS NOT TO LOOK TOWARDS HUSBAND
1. Josh said he didn't harm Susan.
2. Susan's dad said to stop looking at husband, he didn't harm his daughter.
helping Fran, please delete if not right
revampz
12-20-2009, 08:58 PM
have just read for the 1st time the posts about this case.......I know they say innocent until proven guilty......but wow........to use an old term.....I'd bet my left leg this lady is not alive and her husband killed her between 8.30 and 11.45 pm...
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 09:01 PM
REASONS NOT TO LOOK TOWARDS HUSBAND
1. Josh said he didn't harm Susan.
2. Susan's dad said to stop looking at husband, he didn't harm his daughter.
Actually according to the most recent article (in Salt Lake Tribune), SP's dad has since had a change of heart and no longer has confidence in his SIL's innocence. So I think we can strike #2--tho presumably it could be replaced w "JP's dad says he didn't harm his daughter-in-law"
:parrot:
Texas Mist
12-20-2009, 09:01 PM
<snip>
West Valley City » Joshua Powell isn't the only Utah husband who won't help police solve a crime.
In 1994, someone shot and killed Kimberly Evans at the mouth of Butterfield Canyon in Herriman. Her husband, Mark B. Evans, submitted to an interview with police shortly after the murder. Detectives grilled him hard. So hard he hasn't spoken to investigators since.
"I would like to talk to him to clear him from being a suspect in his wife's murder," said Salt Lake County Sheriff's Det. Todd Park, who is still investigating the case. "I feel like there are other viable suspects more so than him."
Since Susan Powell went missing Dec. 7, the scrutiny has been on her husband and why he won't answer questions for detectives. While there exists a possibility Joshua Powell is covering up a crime, Kimberly Evans' unsolved murder may be evidence that sometimes even innocent people are afraid of police.
.....
Some attorneys believe "if the police already suspect you, speaking to police might give them more ammunition," said Medwed, who teaches a course on wrongful convictions.
Black last week said Joshua Powell's refusal to answer more questions is not normal. Not only do most crime victims speak with police, Black said, many guilty people talk to police as a way of gauging what police know.
Joshua Powell's behavior is "bizarre to everybody,"
more here
http://www.sltrib.com/News/ci_14038413
passionflower
12-20-2009, 09:05 PM
Actually according to the most recent article (in Salt Lake Tribune), SP's dad has since had a change of heart and no longer has confidence in his SIL's innocence. So I think we can strike #2--tho presumably it could be replaced w "JP's dad says he didn't harm his daughter-in-law"
:parrot:
very good observation!
passionflower
12-20-2009, 09:11 PM
With no job, no money how long can JP go from home to home with in the family?
Can an attorney give you money to stay lost for awhile???
Wonder if he will get rid of the van and buy another vehicle?
Scott P ran and had another car an camping equipment on his way to Mexico......
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 09:11 PM
Originally Posted by fran
Things are mounting up.............anyone else?
fran
1. Husband not the one who reported victim missing.
2. Husband had 'odd' alibi, ie going camping in sub-zero temperartures, late at night, leaving sick wife home alone in bed, and taking two toddlers, pre five yo's into the freezing winter night.
3. Change of story details, here and there or becoming evasive.
4. Avoiding media contact. The few times media managed to get a statement. He cut them off when they asked detailed questions about camping location. His excuse was "I have to get my boys." IMHO, he's using the boys as a shield.
5. Avoiding media questions, ie "Is that where you went camping?" to which he replies, "I have to pick up my boys."
6. Avoids wife-victim's family.
7. Stops talking to LE
8. Concerned with 'his house.'
9. Speaks of victim in 'past-tense.'
10. Speaks of 'buying new clothes and comforter.'
11. Unexplained 'wet spot' in carpeting and 'fans being used to dry.'
12. Gradual release of 'friends and family' speaking of marital problems.
13. Alleged from 'friends' of husband having control issues, which included control of wife ie victim.
14. Alleged from 'friends' of 'verbal abuse' by husband of victim.
15. Alleged statement by one of the children (ok, possibly rumor) "Daddy said mommy stayed in the woods for awhile."
16. Spoke to neighbor about 'hope his bird isn't dead' but didn't talk about his missing wife.
17. Testing generator late at night on camping trip
18. Sledding in the dark? (Locals, is there a place in that area to go sledding in the dark? He told friend he was taking boys sledding, that was at 5:00p.m. and he was seen returning home at 8:30p.m.)
19. Near frost bitten hands.
20. Just the sheer distance of the alleged camp site (3 or 4 hours drive)
21. NOT one sign of husband camping where he said he was.
22. Just plain talking about 'himself,' rather than his missing wife!!!!!!!!
23. No sign of forced entry of home.
24. Friends and neighbors said it was unusual for Josh to suddenly go camping late at night with the children in the freezing weather.
25. Periodic money problems including a past bankruptcy.
26. Joshy tells his FIL the last time he saw Susan was at 12:30, but didn't bother to tell him what a great time was had by all at the wee-hours-of-the-nite-camping-in-subzero-temps-and-snowstorm-in-the-desert outing.
(from Texas Mist)
27. Left sick wife alone, never to check on her and she had NO CAR to go to doctor! (from member passionflower)
28. Wife had gone to bed sick with an ear-ache which meant she most likely had a cold. Yet, husband made her walk home from church in freezing weather, (they only had one car)
29. Susan's friend had spoken to her on Sunday and friend said Susan wasn't sick.
30. Husband said wife sick but she went to bed at 12:30 a.m.
31. Husband said he forgot it was Sunday but he also said he saw last saw Susan at 12:30 a.m. when she went to bed and he was leaving for camping with the kids. She would have reminded him it was Monday and not Sat nite/Sunday a.m. "Got his days mixed up, thought it was Sunday" yet he neither attends church nor allows for boys to go.
32. Susan told co-workers she was physically fearful of her husband.
33. Co-workers say Susan took precautions in case 'anything' happened to her.
34. Josh's BIL stated when asked if he believes Josh had anything to do with Susan's disappearance, "I pray Josh isn't responisble."
35. Susan't friends knowledge of Powell marriage............SEVERAL advised Susan to leave her husband.
36. Susan's family paid for her to have a cell phone in case she was in trouble.
37. Josh refused a lie detector test. (I know this can't be used in court, but in the court of public opinion, it points to him hiding something.
38. Disappeared for 24 hours with rental car, AFTER Susan went missing.
39. Local reporter said that at alleged camping location, you need to travel approximately 20 miles on unpaved road. It was storming. {suspicious}
40. When talking about spur of the moment camping trip with boys, Josh said they '.....liked to have smores in the morning.'
41. Wife's cellphone, purse and belongings LEFT BEHIND...
42. Josh skips town on Dec 18/19 (Fri/Sat) attorney says to spend holidays in Washington with father and step mom.
43. Sunday 2 weeks after Susan disappeared, Josh whereabouts unknown.
Has sons with him....
*Blue are added as the case developes and Websleuthers mention them
REASONS NOT TO LOOK TOWARDS HUSBAND
1. Josh said he didn't harm Susan.
2. Josh's dad said to stop "villifying" JP, he didn't harm his wife.
:parrot:
Actually according to the most recent article (in Salt Lake Tribune), SP's dad has since had a change of heart and no longer has confidence in his SIL's innocence. So I think we can strike #2--tho presumably it could be replaced w "JP's dad says he didn't harm his daughter-in-law"
:parrot:
I actually intended to make a notation on the Dad's statement that he'd since changed is mind, but I forgot! :)
fran
IMHO, the point of the list shows just HOW MANY THINGS in this case point towards the husband. THAT is why we cannot discount him as a suspect.
It is the husbands duty, IF he's innocent, to cooperate with LE and PROVE he's not guilty so they can look somewhere else. He's made it so LE hasn't been able to get off first base with this mystery, suspicion of the NUMBER 1 USUAL SUSPECT, the victim's husband.
Just sayin'
fran
lonetraveler
12-20-2009, 09:16 PM
Three and one half hours sledding? WTH? With near zero degrees with two toddlers? I think that he took Susan along and did away with her then. He returned at 8:30pm according to a neighbor. I think that is when the cleanup began. Three to four hours later he packs up the boys and went "camping".
lonetraveler
12-20-2009, 09:18 PM
Did anyone see Josh and the boys during the sledding event?
passionflower
12-20-2009, 09:28 PM
Three and one half hours sledding? WTH? With near zero degrees with two toddlers? I think that he took Susan along and did away with her then. He returned at 8:30pm according to a neighbor. I think that is when the cleanup began. Three to four hours later he packs up the boys and went "camping".
Exactly what I have thought all along. ITA
He had a sled to dump her with.......
1/2 hour is to much in that weather outside with2 little ones.
He wanted to be seen coming, going and there.
IIRC he mentioned they stopped an ate also........alibi at MC D's???
another odd thing.
then at 8:30 put tired kids to bed and di his 'clean up', packed for get away and left. Van alarm went of while loading for trip just before he left!
He wasn't thinking or was removing a GPS system?
Three and one half hours sledding? WTH? With near zero degrees with two toddlers? I think that he took Susan along and did away with her then. He returned at 8:30pm according to a neighbor. I think that is when the cleanup began. Three to four hours later he packs up the boys and went "camping".
I actually contemplated this last evening and forgot about it.
I'm wondering if he actually did leave that night, earlier and return? I know he told the neighbor that he was going to take the boys, but that could have been his way to get rid of her because he MAY have drugged Susan with her dinner, which was why she suddenly got tired and layed down.
What if what the neighbor saw was Josh just moving the car into the garage? So he could load it up?
Of course we'd need to know if it was normal for them to park their car in the garage and if earlier that evening it had been in the garage.
JMHO
fran
lemonmoussetart
12-20-2009, 09:31 PM
NOW the questions are (if he is in WA):
1) will Josh let the boys see their other/Susan's grandparent's and family at their houses?
this would be a remote chance IMO
if so will he be there with them then entire visit?
2) would he have someone else take them to see Susan's family, or would he do it?
this would mean he has to face them/converse directly
3) am speculating that the closest Susan's family will get to boys (if at all), is to visit
them at his/Josh's family under very close and watchful eyes
4) Josh is liking this very much as now LE has to travel all the way there to question,
unless a video conference can be set up. lawyer is unlikely to OK this.
5) will Josh be attending her vigil in WA tonight? he has had plenty of time to arrive as he
is soo excellent at long overnight trips/drives
Did anyone see Josh and the boys during the sledding event?
nobody has come forward.
fran
SusanB
12-20-2009, 09:37 PM
Lonetraveler, I would hope he did not take Susan on the sledding trek - he had the boys with him, and I do not think or I would hope that he did not kill her in their presence.
It does seem an awfully long time to sled with two very small children, though. So, I don't know what to make of it. I think at least the older child would have something to say about what daddy did to mommy if it were true.
I am blown away that he just took off with the children,and apparently LE does not know where exactly he is? I find that hard to believe.
I just pray that he does not flee to Canada, or harm these innocent children in any way.
Thanks, Fran for the list - it's the first time I have heard that JP refused a poly. To me, that in itself is a red flag.
I'm gonna mull over these new developments for a few minutes, am trying to figure out what part his running off to Wash/his family/near to Canada/away from Utah-scene of the crime all means.:waitasec:
passionflower
12-20-2009, 09:38 PM
[quote=passionflower;4587389]Did anyone put a timeline on this last 2 weeks?
Maybe we could put one together. TIA
I'm looking over my notes. But need help........
anyone have the timeline better than I have?
Sunday, December 6, 2009
Susan went to church, walked home with friends.
JP made pancakes and eggs for supper, rarely cooked.
Friend was over to help Susan with crocheting project.
Friend left at 5 pm.
JP took sons sledding in dark at 5:30pm.
Neighbor saw JP come home at 8:30pm
Neighbor heard JP's van's security going off in garage at 11:45pm.
Monday, Dec 7, 2009
JP left for a camping trip at 12:30 am Monday morning with sons.
JP and Susan do not show up for work.
Sons are not at babysitters.
Relatives are called.
Concerned relatives call LE, who break a window for wellness search.
Friend calls JP cell phone at 3pm
Another friend contacts JP by cell phone at 4pm.
JP arrives home at 5pm.
Tuesday, December 8th
JP calls Susan's dad and tells him Susan is missing.
LE takes van.
JP rents a car and leaves for 24 hours.
Wednesday, December 9th
JP comes back home?
Did he take sons for 24 hours?
Where was he?
Police spent two hours removing items from the Powell home.
Police say Josh Powell is not a suspect at this time
Thursday, December 10
Police searched the Simpson Spring Recreation Area and found no sign of Josh Powell's campsite.
Josh Powell speaks briefly with reporters
Friday, December 11
Police stil have no arrests and said Josh Powell is a person of interest
Saturday, December 12:
Susan Powell's father, Charles Cox, traveled to Utah to help search for his daughter.
Josh Powell's family held a press conference and Josh Powell stands silenty with them.
Community members pass out fliers with pictures of Susan Powell.
Sunday, December 13, 2009
1 week Susan is gone.
Monday, December 14:
Josh Powell retains attorney.
JP does not show up to talk with LE.
Skips 3rd interview with LE
Wednesday, December 16,2009
LE takes DNA of Josh Powell.
Search home during a prayer vigil.
LE finds JOURNAL of Susan's at work
Friday/Sat, December 18/19
Josh on the run to Washington?
Saturday, December 19, 2009
ABC subpeoned for video tapes.
All news agencies asked not to destroy video tapes.
Sunday, December 20,2009
2 weeks Susan is gone.
World wide prayer vigil at 8:30pm.
JP and sons where abouts unknown
Steve Powell father of Josh defends son in interview
passionflower
12-20-2009, 09:44 PM
NOW the questions are (if he is in WA):
1) will Josh let the boys see their other/Susan's grandparent's and family at their houses?
this would be a remote chance IMO
if so will he be there with them then entire visit?
2) would he have someone else take them to see Susan's family, or would he do it?
this would mean he has to face them/converse directly
3) am speculating that the closest Susan's family will get to boys (if at all), is to visit
them at his/Josh's family under very close and watchful eyes
4) Josh is liking this very much as now LE has to travel all the way there to question,
unless a video conference can be set up. lawyer is unlikely to OK this.
5) will Josh be attending her vigil in WA tonight? he has had plenty of time to arrive as he
is soo excellent at long overnight trips/drives
My bet is NO to all the above.........JP only thinks of HIS NEEDS.
Maybe he will leave the sons with HIS father (who is like him?, and get HIS sons later) and split for his freedom.
dreamweaver
12-20-2009, 09:50 PM
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
updated 7:26pm mst
emmcee
12-20-2009, 09:53 PM
Do we know what Josh thinks happened to his wife?
Does he think she ran away on her own? If so, wouldn't he suggest places she would be likely to run to? Friends who might hide her? Places to search?
Does he think she was abducted? If so, wouldn't he suggest people she had problems with at work or people who had bothered her in the past?
Have her co-workers, church friends, neighbors, sisters, etc. offered any possible alternative explanations for her disappearance?
Have there been ANY searches for her at all?
SusanB
12-20-2009, 10:13 PM
Do we know what Josh thinks happened to his wife?
Does he think she ran away on her own? If so, wouldn't he suggest places she would be likely to run to? Friends who might hide her? Places to search?
Does he think she was abducted? If so, wouldn't he suggest people she had problems with at work or people who had bothered her in the past?
Have her co-workers, church friends, neighbors, sisters, etc. offered any possible alternative explanations for her disappearance?
Have there been ANY searches for her at all?
Emm, awesome questions, and my explanation to you would be, HE ALREADY KNOWS WHERE SHE IS, so he does not need to provide and clues about what happened, and everyone around her knows he did something to her, so no one is offering and alternative possibilities for her disappearance.
There were supposed searches by dogs at first - were they cadaver dogs? Don't know. The weather was bad for a couple days, so no search was done at that time. But the weather has since cleared, and seems like LE feels the potential area in question is too large for search parties. I think the4y are just waiting for Joshy to 'fess up and tell them where the body is., Unfortunately, valuable evidence is withering away as we speak, and decomp is progressing (tho the cold weather helps retard it to some extent)
I was reading the latest article posted above, and I wonder what sorts of "issues" the Cox family has had with Steven Powell? Any ideas out there?
IMOO LE is playing it cool as a cucumber, stating "Josh can go anywhere he wants." I have a feeling they are on him like white on rice, but don't want JPBoy to know. LE stated they have the cooperation of the Wash LE, so that means he is being watched.:innocent:
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
updated 7:26pm mst
Interesting comment by Mr. Cox.
:(
fran
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
On Friday, the Coxes told The Salt Lake Tribune that Steven Powell isn't actively
helping in the search for their daughter. The Coxes said they've had "issues" with Steven Powell in the past and aren't comfortable being around him
PS.............sorry SusanB. I see you already mentioned this....fran
omegagal
12-20-2009, 10:19 PM
I think I get it.... I think that a forensic psych. person is helping and they told LE that you have to let Joshy boy "have control". This is reminding me of how they were able to arrest OJ Simpson. They let him control the situation and arrested him with "honor".... I think they know EXACTLY what they are doing. They aren't going to let Joshy boy get away, they're just letting him hang himself.... We are going to be studying how they did this and why...
The Cox family knows she's gone, now they need Joshy to tell them where. The only way to do that is to let Joshy boy control things so he thinks he's powerful...
Bet you they make a plea in exchange for a body...
Do we know what Josh thinks happened to his wife?
Does he think she ran away on her own? If so, wouldn't he suggest places she would be likely to run to? Friends who might hide her? Places to search?
Does he think she was abducted? If so, wouldn't he suggest people she had problems with at work or people who had bothered her in the past?
Have her co-workers, church friends, neighbors, sisters, etc. offered any possible alternative explanations for her disappearance?
Have there been ANY searches for her at all?
The only thing he's said publicly is he's still trying to figure it out, {sniff, sniff}.
Oh, but then he said LE is taking care of it.
As far as her co-workers, church friends, and neighbors etc,...well, I've seen friend's blog posts said they suspect the husband, some told her to leave him, she told others she was going to leave by spring if things didn't work out, others she was trying to find a way to save money so she could leave him......................
Nope, no one has an explanation for her disappearance.
:(
JMHO
fran
nervous_nellie
12-20-2009, 10:20 PM
NOW the questions are (if he is in WA):
1) will Josh let the boys see their other/Susan's grandparent's and family at their houses?
this would be a remote chance IMO
if so will he be there with them then entire visit?
2) would he have someone else take them to see Susan's family, or would he do it?
this would mean he has to face them/converse directly
3) am speculating that the closest Susan's family will get to boys (if at all), is to visit
them at his/Josh's family under very close and watchful eyes
4) Josh is liking this very much as now LE has to travel all the way there to question,
unless a video conference can be set up. lawyer is unlikely to OK this.
5) will Josh be attending her vigil in WA tonight? he has had plenty of time to arrive as he
is soo excellent at long overnight trips/drives
im thinking he will not want the kids around anyone to avoid them being asked questions(at least the 4yr.old) for fear of having a "balloon boy" episode ... it sort of sounds like to me that joshys' daddy wants to protect them from the bad police and reporters. the comments from his dad really make my skin crawl - MAJOR FAIL
SusanB
12-20-2009, 10:23 PM
Interesting comment by Mr. Cox.
:(
fran
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
On Friday, the Coxes told The Salt Lake Tribune that Steven Powell isn't actively
helping in the search for their daughter. The Coxes said they've had "issues" with Steven Powell in the past and aren't comfortable being around him
PS.............sorry SusanB. I see you already mentioned this....fran
No prob, Fran. I'm thinking that Steven Powell is probably as unpleasant and self-serving as JP. You know, like father like son. Only speculation here, but SP may have backed up JP in many regards, thus angering the Cox side of the family. Wonder if there are any specific incidents that the "issues" refers to.:waitasec:
Amster
12-20-2009, 10:24 PM
I wonder if he took the gifts that Susan bought the boys? Probably not...:furious:
I wonder if he took the gifts that Susan bought the boys? Probably not...:furious:
The thought of these little boys celebrating Christmas without their mother makes me ill. I hope like hell he does not give them the gifts that she bought them and say they are from him. Not that they will know the difference, but the thought of it still makes me ill.
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 10:31 PM
I have asked myself this same (rhetorical) question over and over mc... we've heard NADA from JP re his reaction to his wife's sudden and mysterious VANISHING upon their unsuspecting return. The fact is he's had nothing to say except "I wouldn't know where to begin to look." How lame is that.
:parrot:
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 10:33 PM
Interesting comment by Mr. Cox.
:(
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
On Friday, the Coxes told The Salt Lake Tribune that Steven Powell isn't actively
helping in the search for their daughter. The Coxes said they've had "issues" with Steven Powell in the past and aren't comfortable being around himPS.............sorry SusanB. I see you already mentioned this....fran
One of JP's relatives is referred to in article as BP, perhaps this could possibly be where that remark comes from...
:parrot:
mysticrose
12-20-2009, 10:35 PM
I don't think foreign countries care about the DP with regard to extradition when it concerns an American national. They'd just rather have such people the heck out of their country.
Hi gitana....Canada does care actually because they do not believe in the DP,
there has been a few cases where americans have fled to Canada and in order to extradite them back the DP had to be taken off the table.... :)
Texas Mist
12-20-2009, 10:36 PM
Joshy couldn't take the heat in Utah's kitchen so he got out...well now.
Here's a guy who was at home on Saturdays but Susan had a sitter coming over to watch the boys....was that because Joshy really wasn't into watching them for 8 hours or so & doing all that's required for caring for 2yo & 4yo?
If he's like other whacked out dads, he really never is completely responsible for *everything* - breakfast, lunch, dinner, bathing, playing, putting them down for naps -- it's all too demanding & requires he give of himself.
He's really in a quandary now -- doesn't want other people spending too much time w/ his kids, but yet, he probably isn't really into being there 24x7 & giving selflessly of his own time...especially being all 'overwhelmed' and 'stressed out'....poor little babies are missing their momma - are they asking their dad "when will mommy be home?"....do they cry @ night missing her?
Not to mention that now he's just down the road from Susan's parents and from what I've read, the local news media has been actively reporting on this case -- and local LE was already involved in the investigation from the get-go.
Susan has lots of friends in Puyallup who care about her -- does he think people are just gonna stop staring & glaring at him??
Oh - and back living w/ daddy who sounds like a real piece of work himself.
No stress there. :huge eye roll:
(if indeed he *is* back in WA)
IMO, the pressure is still building, and flames are getting hotter under the boiling pot he's found himself in.
kiki the parrot
12-20-2009, 10:38 PM
No prob, Fran. I'm thinking that Steven Powell is probably as unpleasant and self-serving as JP. You know, like father like son. Only speculation here, but SP may have backed up JP in many regards, thus angering the Cox side of the family. Wonder if there are any specific incidents that the "issues" refers to.:waitasec:
Well his dad SP won't help search either... :rolleyes: then again, he also probably knows what they would find...... :mad:
:parrot:
Fairy1
12-20-2009, 10:40 PM
The thought of these little boys celebrating Christmas without their mother makes me ill. I hope like hell he does not give them the gifts that she bought them and say they are from him. Not that they will know the difference, but the thought of it still makes me ill.
He will. IMO.
SusanB
12-20-2009, 10:40 PM
im thinking he will not want the kids around anyone to avoid them being asked questions(at least the 4yr.old) for fear of having a "balloon boy" episode ... it sort of sounds like to me that joshys' daddy wants to protect them from the bad police and reporters. the comments from his dad really make my skin crawl - MAJOR FAIL
Very good point Nellie, the four year old (I heard he will be 5 in couple weeks) definitely can speak for himself very well unless he has some kind of problem. I still think that child and the diary will be keys to the case. Little children have a hard time holding in secrets - although I am sure Daddy-O counseled him about what to say to whom, but in time the little one will talk.
Now dumbbass Joshy is thinking he can run away, and all his troubles will dissipate while his wife's body decomposes in some ravine in the wilderness. In a way, that does make sense to a murderer - the longer it takes to find the body, the less incriminating evidence there will be. Remember Casey Anthony? Little Caylee's body was just skeletal, therefore, no definitive cause of death could be determined. Cannot check Chloroform levels, strangulation markings, etc. The longer it takes to find Susan, the less likely COD can be determined - cannot check for poison, drugs, method, etc,
Joshy boy's just biding his time.:furious:
passionflower
12-20-2009, 10:44 PM
I am very worried about Susan's sons.........
crying and fussing with a crazy father that can't handle it for
8 hours on a sat let alone 24/7........
temper and lack of sleep etc.......
We all know about the terrible 2's and 4 year olds that chat and chat!!!
He's a bomb ready to explode.
LE should arrest him for child endangerment !!!!
SusanB
12-20-2009, 10:49 PM
I have asked myself this same (rhetorical) question over and over mc... we've heard NADA from JP re his reaction to his wife's sudden and mysterious VANISHING upon their unsuspecting return. The fact is he's had nothing to say except "I wouldn't know where to begin to look." How lame is that.
:parrot:
I am very worried about Susan's sons.........
crying and fussing with a crazy father that can't handle it for
8 hours on a sat let alone 24/7........
temper and lack of sleep etc.......
We all know about the terrible 2's and 4 year olds that chat and chat!!!
He's a bomb ready to explode.
LE should arrest him for child endangerment !!!!
Yea, and I doubt he will go to the Cox's for help. Must be staying with the Powells. I'm sure he is losing his damn mind, tho. Does not seem he really did much of the child care - other than last minute camping trips in subfreezing temps, making s'mores, and driving endlessly for miles.:crazy:
lemonmoussetart
12-20-2009, 10:54 PM
He may give the gifts to them, but only to win them over as he may [I]need[I] them, especially the 4 yr old.
However, with 0 income now--can also see him returning them for the $ before he left.
He knows other family members will come forward with gifts. Would the kids remember who gave what?
nervous_nellie
12-20-2009, 10:57 PM
susans family have never said anything off color about josh or his family, so for them to say that they do not feel comfortable around sp is very telling and something BIG must have happened at some point - i wonder if this "something" happened before or after susan went missing? or it is a summation of their entire relationship with jp's dad. it would be hard to have a bad experience with the father and not have seen any problems with his son, kwim? sorta getting the idea that jp is the spitting image of sp...
omegagal
12-20-2009, 10:59 PM
I think they have enough evidence on Joshy. What they don't want is for him to kill himself or those kids before results of DNA testing comes back. So they have to let him have control. I remember when they went to arrest OJ, he was supposed to come in on his own and didn't show. First he went to Nicoles grave. Then someone recognized him on the highway and called the police. So OJ put a gun to his head for all to see. LE sent in a detective with lots of forensic psych experience to OJs home to talk him into going with them. Meanwhile the media and onlookers were everywhere around that house. It would take 50 minutes of talking but they did it. Because they knew how to deal with a narcissist. Here is an interesting excerpt from CNN transcripts on OJ and his narcissism. I think Joshy is a narcissist as well. I think his dad let him get away with a lot of bad behavior enforcing it over the years. I also think Joshy thought since he presided over the home as the man, that he interpreted that to mean he "ruled" over the house. I bet his mom and sister could give us a perspective on that... but probably won't...
DIMOND: Brian Russell is a psychologist. Brian, let me just ask you here real quickly, what kind of personality are we dealing with her with O.J. Simpson? This guy, he just cannot seem to keep his name out of the headlines. What`s the matter with him?
BRIAN RUSSELL, FORENSIC PSYCHOLOGIST: You know, Diane, to me, O.J. Simpson is the classic malignant narcissist. You know, when somebody`s talent is identified as early in life as O.J.`s was, oftentimes what happens is people stop trying to develop anything else in that person but the talent. And at the same time, they excuse them from responsibility. They don`t hold them accountable. They let them get away with things. And so what you end up with is somebody who`s a small-minded individual who thinks they`re a really big deal. And you add on top of that lots of free time and plenty of money, and it`s almost a recipe for trouble.
I am very worried about Susan's sons.........
crying and fussing with a crazy father that can't handle it for
8 hours on a sat let alone 24/7........
temper and lack of sleep etc.......
We all know about the terrible 2's and 4 year olds that chat and chat!!!
He's a bomb ready to explode.
LE should arrest him for child endangerment !!!!
I only pray that the Cox family take seriously the fragile state this guy is in. They honestly couldn't get those two boys away from him fast enough, IMHO. The weepy persona he's in, I don't think it's all made-up, I truly believe he feels trapped. Thus the RUNNING!
We've seen too much of this sort of thing this year. I truly believe those children's lives are in danger. I only hope other members, of Josh's family, realize the seriousness of this situation and stop hiding behind the locked gates and think of someone else for a change. These two little innocent boys!
JMHO
fran
Tricia
12-20-2009, 11:16 PM
Forgive me, Forgive me Forgive me if this has already been discussed. I am running in and out and I have been meaning to post this.
I think he poisoned her at dinner, the wet spot on the rug was vomit.
Here is why;
He doesn't seem like someone who would kill someone with their bare hands. IMO.
Susan felt ill after dinner and went to lay down. Poison in the dinner perhaps?
Susan may have gotten up, threw up on the rug, and that was the wet spot.
If it was blood I think we would have heard about it by now and he would have been arrested.
Now, I have not read this thread yet so I am probably posting things that have already been discussed and therefore I will look like an idiot. Happens all the time. :)
OK, I'll read the thread late tonight.
Keep up the good work.
Tricia
omegagal
12-20-2009, 11:17 PM
A great article in Psychology Today, Evil and the Death of Innocence.
Seems we have the hardest time recognizing evil in people... It also talks about parenting...Steven are you listening???? Because we are....
It talks about the student flying into a rage for not getting the grades he wants. I have read my narcissistic X's journal where in undergraduate school, he went to go see a professor and wrote "how did he expect me to get into Harvard Law School with the grades he gave me". Wish I had seen that journal before I married him. Maybe I should have sent a copy of it to the newest bride....lol
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/evil-deeds/200811/evil-and-the-death-innocence
SusanB
12-20-2009, 11:23 PM
I think they have enough evidence on Joshy. What they don't want is for him to kill himself or those kids before results of DNA testing comes back. So they have to let him have control. I remember when they went to arrest OJ, he was supposed to come in on his own and didn't show. First he went to Nicoles grave. Then someone recognized him on the highway and called the police. So OJ put a gun to his head for all to see. LE sent in a detective with lots of forensic psych experience to OJs home to talk him into going with them. Meanwhile the media and onlookers were everywhere around that house. It would take 50 minutes of talking but they did it. Because they knew how to deal with a narcissist. Here is an interesting excerpt from CNN transcripts on OJ and his narcissism. I think Joshy is a narcissist as well. I think his dad let him get away with a lot of bad behavior enforcing it over the years. I also think Joshy thought since he presided over the home as the man, that he interpreted that to mean he "ruled" over the house. I bet his mom and sister could give us a perspective on that... but probably won't...
DIMOND: Brian Russell is a psychologist. Brian, let me just ask you here real quickly, what kind of personality are we dealing with her with O.J. Simpson? This guy, he just cannot seem to keep his name out of the headlines. What`s the matter with him?
BRIAN RUSSELL, FORENSIC PSYCHOLOGIST: You know, Diane, to me, O.J. Simpson is the classic malignant narcissist. You know, when somebody`s talent is identified as early in life as O.J.`s was, oftentimes what happens is people stop trying to develop anything else in that person but the talent. And at the same time, they excuse them from responsibility. They don`t hold them accountable. They let them get away with things. And so what you end up with is somebody who`s a small-minded individual who thinks they`re a really big deal. And you add on top of that lots of free time and plenty of money, and it`s almost a recipe for trouble.
Great research, Omega. My question is what talent does loser Josh have? All he seems to be good at is ordering his family around, creating off the wall fabrications, and acting his butt off! He THINKS he is "about something" but sad to say, he's totally not.
That evaluation also applies to Tiger Woods to a "T".
The folks who are running this investigation know what's up - he has to feel like "He's the man" and in control, so they are going along with that idea, waiting for him to screw up or give up. the problem is the poor little ones are with him, and all we can do is pray for their safety until the crime is solved one way or another.:(
omegagal
12-20-2009, 11:25 PM
Great research, Omega. My question is what talent does loser Josh have? All he seems to be good at is ordering his family around, creating off the wall fabrications, and acting his butt off! He THINKS he is "about something" but sad to say, he's totally not.
That evaluation also applies to Tiger Woods to a "T".
The folks who are running this investigation know what's up - he has to feel like "He's the man" and in control, so they are going along with that idea, waiting for him to screw up or give up. the problem is the poor little ones are with him, and all we can do is pray for their safety until the crime is solved one way or another.:(
Susan I was trying to be subtle there but here's what I wrote in the previous post, not wanting to get into any "religious discussions":
I think Joshy is a narcissist as well. I think his dad let him get away with a lot of bad behavior enforcing it over the years. I also think Joshy thought since he presided over the home as the man, that he interpreted that to mean he "ruled" over the house. I bet his mom and sister could give us a perspective on that... but probably won't...
If you want to email me directly I will be glad to explain the culture more fully "off board".
LaLaw2000
12-20-2009, 11:37 PM
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897[/URL]
updated 7:26pm mst[/QUOTE]
This article mentions Michael C. Powell. That is Josh's brother that was a delegate from the 2nd District. (Obama Delegate). If you go to obamadelegates.org, you can find a short biography he wrote for himself. When you get to the site, go to Delegates by State, scroll to Washington, click, then look at 2nd District Delegates. You can click on Michael C. Powell, and see a pic and read his biography. Interesting. I suppose I can put this on here because it was mentioned in the newspaper article.
Is anyone familiar with City of Rocks in Washington State? I saw a pic that I thought might be of Josh and Michaels' Mom entitled Grandma - City of Rocks.
Intresting place if it is indeed in Washington State. Could Josh have driven there and back during the 17 hours he was gone?
ETA: Link does not work on my post, but does on Dreamweavers (thanks, Dreamweaver) on the previous page.
JMO
SusanB
12-20-2009, 11:51 PM
I think I am slowly getting to know the culture, but I need lots more info. I agree that LE already has the scoop on JP, and they are doing right to let him feel he is in control. It is a matter of time until either he screws up, cracks up, gives up, or they have a solid circumstantial case worthy of presenting to the judge as probable cause for his arrest.
Tricia, it's all good, and as my old high school teacher once said, "No question is a dumb question - whats dumb is not asking the question."
I have some questions if anyone can help:
1. Did they use cadaver dogs to search any of the property surrounding this case?
2. Does anyone have any info about where JP went during those 24 hours in the rental car? Do we have mileage/GPS info, etc.
3. What "issues" does the Cox family have with Steven Powell?
4. Where is Joshua Powell RIGHT NOW? Does he have the children?
I have many more, but I'm getting frustrated with lack of information from LE - as well they are supposed to withhold info until the case is tight.:eek:
Solstice Canyon
12-20-2009, 11:58 PM
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
Story says it was updated 9:04pm Mountain Time. Now confirming that Josh & boys are staying with SP.
"Joshua Powell, 34, and his two children, Charlie, 4, and Braden, 2, are staying with Powell's father, said John Hellewell, a friend of the Powells. He said Joshua told him Saturday he was fired from his job. He worked as a computer programmer for a trucking and warehousing company.
Powell likely won't be able to make payments on the couple's West Valley City home and will lose it, Hellewell said. He said he spoke with Powell about 8 p.m. Sunday.
"He just told me he needed to get away from the press and publicity and keep his kids away from it," Hellewell said."
P.S. SusanB, hoping this helps for #4.
omegagal
12-21-2009, 12:11 AM
Here's the direct link for Josh's brother's bio as an Obama delegate for the 8th Congressional District:
http://www.obamadelegates.org/page/Michael+C+Powell+for+Barack+Obama
Interesting, seems arrogance is rewarded in this family. I would be so embarresed to have this bio...
LaLaw2000
12-21-2009, 12:12 AM
The kids had eaten an early dinner and might have even been tired from the day. What if Josh did take the kids sledding not long after dinner, the kids did their sledding thing and then they did the smores? Josh could have told the kids they would do s'mores over the campfire. So they could have done the s'mores at the same time as the sledding. The kids could verify that they had s'mores over a campfire.
That would give Susan time to die from the drugs and or poison he had put in her food or drink at dinner. Susan could have been trying to get to the front door while they were gone, collapsed and vomited on the carpet near the front door, and also voided there. She could have been there on the floor and may have even had her purse and cell phone by her. Josh could have found her there. LE needs to swab Susan's purse and cell phone, IMO.
I know I have never gone to bed or even to lie down on the bed with my purse, cell phone, and keys. These items were found on her bed according to various articles. I think Josh placed them on the bed himself. The kids probably went to bed after getting home at 8:30 PM. Josh would then have time to clean up the spot on the living room carpet, roll Susan up in the quilt, then place her in the van before waking the sleeping boys to put them in the van. They would, at that hour of the night, be totally unaware that their mother was wrapped in a quilt right behind them in the van.
I also think that Josh (I hate writing this) dumped Susan's body in Washington State, or wherever City of Rocks is, during that 17 hours he was gone.
**I honestly do not think there would be a blood spot on the rug. Just vomit and where Susan had voided. Forensics done on the square of carpeting if LE took it, would show traces of DNA as well as proteins and any chemicals from Susan's body, IMO.
Just speculating here - hope it's okay.
omegagal
12-21-2009, 12:13 AM
Hellewell is also Kiirsi's last name.... interestingly enough.
Texas Mist
12-21-2009, 12:15 AM
Great research, Omega. My question is what talent does loser Josh have? All he seems to be good at is ordering his family around, creating off the wall fabrications, and acting his butt off! He THINKS he is "about something" but sad to say, he's totally not.
That evaluation also applies to Tiger Woods to a "T".
The folks who are running this investigation know what's up - he has to feel like "He's the man" and in control, so they are going along with that idea, waiting for him to screw up or give up. the problem is the poor little ones are with him, and all we can do is pray for their safety until the crime is solved one way or another.:(
BBM -
He thinks he is or he is really, really trying to be a bigshot -- like his brother & his dad who apparently have very successful careers...his brother in politics, and his dad must have some measure of 'success' judging by the gated community he lives in...I checked sale prices for some houses there on one street & they ranged from $250K - $400K+....one $250K home I checked out was 4000+ square feet.
Sooo - what does Josh (with his 2 yrs of community college) do when he starts his real estate business? Something really smart & savvy like spend $80-90K on magnets in a Yellow Book? Ohhhh - that's a real genius of an entrepreneur now isn't it....throwing those big bucks around in front of his other real estate co-workers.
Now - there is a kicker to this if it's true -- and considering Joshy had that HUGE bill to Yellow Book in collections on his bankrupcty -- it could very well be he never intended to pay for it....I saw a post @ either deseretnews or KSL (sorry can't remember) from someone who claimed to have worked w/ him @ homenet who posted that Joshy had said that he wouldn't get the bill for the magnets until "after the campaign" (which I took to mean after all Yellow Books for his market were delivered) -- and if he didn't make enough to pay for it, then he just wouldn't. :eek:
And looks like he didn't.
And no wonder Susan was calling her dad to have him talk to Josh about bad financial decisions.
This guy is definitely a recipe for disaster (if the magnet story is true)...sadly, it appears its far worse than financial disasters. :(
GingerRed
12-21-2009, 12:19 AM
It would appear Josh showed up at the vigil in Puyallup tonight.
Susan's husband, Josh, has been named a person of interest in the case. He attended Sunday's vigil.
Link to the story. (http://blog.thenewstribune.com/crime/2009/12/20/supporters-gather-in-south-hill-for-missing-mom/)
While part of me is just sick with his appearance...it means he might very well be at his Dad's in South Hill as reported. It also means that LE can keep an eye on him. All things considered, that's a very good thing--distasteful as I'm sure many of us find it.
Melanie
12-21-2009, 12:20 AM
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
Story says it was updated 9:04pm Mountain Time. Now confirming that Josh & boys are staying with SP.
"Joshua Powell, 34, and his two children, Charlie, 4, and Braden, 2, are staying with Powell's father, said John Hellewell, a friend of the Powells. He said Joshua told him Saturday he was fired from his job. He worked as a computer programmer for a trucking and warehousing company.
Powell likely won't be able to make payments on the couple's West Valley City home and will lose it, Hellewell said. He said he spoke with Powell about 8 p.m. Sunday.
"He just told me he needed to get away from the press and publicity and keep his kids away from it," Hellewell said."
P.S. SusanB, hoping this helps for #4.
Fired from his job? Egads! At least he should be able get unemployment, or disability (stress). I don't see how he would lose the home if he receives social security income from Susan, or her life insurance.
To add - of course he won't get anything from Susan if he kil'd her. Does he already know this and is throwing in the towel already and admitting it?
Mel
Texas Mist
12-21-2009, 12:22 AM
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
Story says it was updated 9:04pm Mountain Time. Now confirming that Josh & boys are staying with SP.
"Joshua Powell, 34, and his two children, Charlie, 4, and Braden, 2, are staying with Powell's father, said John Hellewell, a friend of the Powells. He said Joshua told him Saturday he was fired from his job. He worked as a computer programmer for a trucking and warehousing company.
Powell likely won't be able to make payments on the couple's West Valley City home and will lose it, Hellewell said. He said he spoke with Powell about 8 p.m. Sunday.
"He just told me he needed to get away from the press and publicity and keep his kids away from it," Hellewell said."
P.S. SusanB, hoping this helps for #4.
Guess that explains why there were "friends or family" removing bedding and the bird from the house Friday & today. (reporter talks about the bird cage in the video & you can see it being removed)
http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=148&sid=9097273
LaLaw2000
12-21-2009, 12:27 AM
It would appear Josh showed up at the vigil in Puyallup tonight.
Link to the story. (http://blog.thenewstribune.com/crime/2009/12/20/supporters-gather-in-south-hill-for-missing-mom/)
While part of me is just sick with his appearance...it means he might very well be at his Dad's in South Hill as reported. It also means that LE can keep an eye on him. All things considered, that's a very good thing--distasteful as I'm sure many of us find it.
:eek: It is a wonder someone didn't attack him!
Kiirsi Hellewell has made no bones about the fact that she still considers Josh a friend. Josh was probably encouraged to attend. All a part of a major makeover on the part of his lawyer, IMO.
GingerRed
12-21-2009, 12:30 AM
It would appear Josh showed up at the vigil in Puyallup tonight.
Link to the story. (http://blog.thenewstribune.com/crime/2009/12/20/supporters-gather-in-south-hill-for-missing-mom/)
While part of me is just sick with his appearance...it means he might very well be at his Dad's in South Hill as reported. It also means that LE can keep an eye on him. All things considered, that's a very good thing--distasteful as I'm sure many of us find it.
:eek: It is a wonder someone didn't attack him!
Kiirsi Hellewell has made no bones about the fact that she still considers Josh a friend. Josh was probably encouraged to attend. All a part of a major makeover on the part of his lawyer, IMO.
Yeah, no kidding!
I have no doubt it's all for show. I'm just thoroughly grateful to know he went out in public, he hasn't fled yet, and he could be followed. The thought of LE losing him is NOT ok!
omegagal
12-21-2009, 12:31 AM
Fired from his job? Egads! At least he should be able get unemployment, or disability (stress). I don't see how he would lose the home if he receives social security income from Susan, or her life insurance.
To add - of course he won't get anything from Susan if he kil'd her. Does he already know this and is throwing in the towel already and admitting it?
Mel
When he is self employed he would not be entitled to unemployment or disability from SSA unless maybe he had a private disability policy. I doubt it as they are more expensive than whole life policies.
As a new employee at this warehouse, unlikely he would be entitled to any of these benefits as well.
Openmyeyes
12-21-2009, 12:31 AM
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14037897
updated 7:26pm mst
Don't know if everyone has read this yet, but YOWZA!
Here are a few things to add to our time line from the article:
Joshua Powell, 34, and his two children, Charlie, 4, and Braden, 2, are staying with Powell's father, said John Hellewell, a friend of the Powells. He said Joshua told him Saturday he was fired from his job. He worked as a computer programmer for a trucking and warehousing company.
Powell likely won't be able to make payments on the couple's West Valley City home and will lose it, Hellewell said. He said he spoke with Powell about 8 p.m. Sunday.
"He just told me he needed to get away from the press and publicity and keep his kids away from it," Hellewell said.
He was fired and will not be able to make his house payment.....
This is hinky, no matter how you look at it. Most companies would let you take time off, do what you need to do, etc. They don't just out and out fire you. Look at Cindy Anthony, as an example, she got to take a medical leave
(I bet they were very cooperative about it too, snicker, snicker). No company would fire you UNLESS they have a much better reason. I think he is lying about the firing.
I'm thinking he's dropping the kids off to bolt. Ice Road truckers bolo.
omegagal
12-21-2009, 12:35 AM
Don't know if everyone has read this yet, but YOWZA!
Here are a few things to add to our time line from the article:
Joshua Powell, 34, and his two children, Charlie, 4, and Braden, 2, are staying with Powell's father, said John Hellewell, a friend of the Powells. He said Joshua told him Saturday he was fired from his job. He worked as a computer programmer for a trucking and warehousing company.
Powell likely won't be able to make payments on the couple's West Valley City home and will lose it, Hellewell said. He said he spoke with Powell about 8 p.m. Sunday.
"He just told me he needed to get away from the press and publicity and keep his kids away from it," Hellewell said.
He was fired and will not be able to make his house payment.....
This is hinky, no matter how you look at it. Most companies would let you take time off, do what you need to do, etc. They don't just out and out fire you. Look at Cindy Anthony, as an example, she got to take a medical leave
(I bet they were very cooperative about it too, snicker, snicker). No company would fire you UNLESS they have a much better reason. I think he is lying about the firing.
I'm thinking he's dropping the kids off to bolt. Ice Road truckers bolo.
Is this Kiirsi's husband, father?? Anyone know?
John Hellewell, a friend of the Powells
LaLaw2000
12-21-2009, 12:36 AM
Well, getting away from the press/media (as stated in the article) would not include going to a high profile vigil, IMO. I am glad to know he hasn't fled, but he did stick his face in the media at the first opportunity. This guy is such a fake.
MOO
Texas Mist
12-21-2009, 12:37 AM
Don't know if everyone has read this yet, but YOWZA!
Here are a few things to add to our time line from the article:
Joshua Powell, 34, and his two children, Charlie, 4, and Braden, 2, are staying with Powell's father, said John Hellewell, a friend of the Powells. He said Joshua told him Saturday he was fired from his job. He worked as a computer programmer for a trucking and warehousing company.
Powell likely won't be able to make payments on the couple's West Valley City home and will lose it, Hellewell said. He said he spoke with Powell about 8 p.m. Sunday.
"He just told me he needed to get away from the press and publicity and keep his kids away from it," Hellewell said.
He was fired and will not be able to make his house payment.....
This is hinky, no matter how you look at it. Most companies would let you take time off, do what you need to do, etc. They don't just out and out fire you. Look at Cindy Anthony, as an example, she got to take a medical leave
(I bet they were very cooperative about it too, snicker, snicker). No company would fire you UNLESS they have a much better reason. I think he is lying about the firing.
I'm thinking he's dropping the kids off to bolt. Ice Road truckers bolo.
His 'friend' Wayne said Joshy was fired because of 'bad publicity'....I think that's what Josh told Wayne, but fact probably is that he never called into work....obviously not on Monday & probably not after that.
I'm guessing he was fired for abandoning his position....but who knows, maybe while he was out the employer did some checking around on his work performance & found other reasons to fire him.
Poor Josh - unappreciated. :boohoo:
SusanB
12-21-2009, 12:43 AM
Don't know if everyone has read this yet, but YOWZA!
Here are a few things to add to our time line from the article:
Joshua Powell, 34, and his two children, Charlie, 4, and Braden, 2, are staying with Powell's father, said John Hellewell, a friend of the Powells. He said Joshua told him Saturday he was fired from his job. He worked as a computer programmer for a trucking and warehousing company.
Powell likely won't be able to make payments on the couple's West Valley City home and will lose it, Hellewell said. He said he spoke with Powell about 8 p.m. Sunday.
"He just told me he needed to get away from the press and publicity and keep his kids away from it," Hellewell said.
He was fired and will not be able to make his house payment.....
This is hinky, no matter how you look at it. Most companies would let you take time off, do what you need to do, etc. They don't just out and out fire you. Look at Cindy Anthony, as an example, she got to take a medical leave
(I bet they were very cooperative about it too, snicker, snicker). No company would fire you UNLESS they have a much better reason. I think he is lying about the firing.
I'm thinking he's dropping the kids off to bolt. Ice Road truckers bolo.
Yea, that's a thought, maybe to flee to Canada. I doubt he has the funds or the desire to drag the little children along, so he's have to leave them with his father.
Somehow, I don't feel he ever really worked at that job, or only briefly, like you said, if he was a good, regular employee, and his wife goes missing, you would think they'd give him a break or a leave. Yea, hinky it is.:waitasec:
Melanie
12-21-2009, 12:57 AM
Don't know if everyone has read this yet, but YOWZA!
Here are a few things to add to our time line from the article:
Joshua Powell, 34, and his two children, Charlie, 4, and Braden, 2, are staying with Powell's father, said John Hellewell, a friend of the Powells. He said Joshua told him Saturday he was fired from his job. He worked as a computer programmer for a trucking and warehousing company.
Powell likely won't be able to make payments on the couple's West Valley City home and will lose it, Hellewell said. He said he spoke with Powell about 8 p.m. Sunday.
"He just told me he needed to get away from the press and publicity and keep his kids away from it," Hellewell said.
He was fired and will not be able to make his house payment.....
This is hinky, no matter how you look at it. Most companies would let you take time off, do what you need to do, etc. They don't just out and out fire you. Look at Cindy Anthony, as an example, she got to take a medical leave
(I bet they were very cooperative about it too, snicker, snicker). No company would fire you UNLESS they have a much better reason. I think he is lying about the firing.
I'm thinking he's dropping the kids off to bolt. Ice Road truckers bolo.
I'm sure LE is reading the link as well and heading over to the office to confirm the firing. My bet is he didn't show up, didn't call, and is lying, lying, lying.
Most (if not all) companies are at will employers, and will work with you if you work with them. Josh doesn't seem the type to go to his employer and try to work it out. As we can see - he's a runner.
MOO
Mel
Openmyeyes
12-21-2009, 12:57 AM
And he probably spent any funds he did have on all of his recent road trips and renting a car.
Curious Me
12-21-2009, 01:02 AM
All said tongue in cheek...Maybe he was fired for not knowing which day is Monday. Here's a man that can not be counted on. He did not show up at work because . . . I don't think Josh will have time or money to file a wrongful termination suit. Anytime now, Josh, it's all going to come down on you.
Solstice Canyon
12-21-2009, 01:03 AM
...Sooo - what does Josh (with his 2 yrs of community college) do when he starts his real estate business? Something really smart & savvy like spend $80-90K on magnets in a Yellow Book? Ohhhh - that's a real genius of an entrepreneur now isn't it....throwing those big bucks around in front of his other real estate co-workers.
Now - there is a kicker to this if it's true -- and considering Joshy had that HUGE bill to Yellow Book in collections on his bankrupcty -- it could very well be he never intended to pay for it....I saw a post @ either deseretnews or KSL (sorry can't remember) from someone who claimed to have worked w/ him @ homenet who posted that Joshy had said that he wouldn't get the bill for the magnets until "after the campaign" (which I took to mean after all Yellow Books for his market were delivered) -- and if he didn't make enough to pay for it, then he just wouldn't....
(snipped for space & red BBM)
Didn't someone mention that his brother gave him credit for doing some type of tech work for him during his campaign? I'm wondering if that's what he was referring to -- maybe he was waiting on the $ from that to come in.
Texas Mist
12-21-2009, 01:15 AM
(snipped for space & red BBM)
Didn't someone mention that his brother gave him credit for doing some type of tech work for him during his campaign? I'm wondering if that's what he was referring to -- maybe he was waiting on the $ from that to come in.
Josh would have needed to do more tech work than his brother's website (http://michaelcpowell.org/Pages/Bio.aspx) -- it shows it's designed & hosted by Polished Marketing -- Josh's company.
IMO, that ain't no $80K website. LOL
And I think the reference to 'campaign' means marketing campaign -- ala mass mailouts, telemarketing calls, TV ads, etc.
And while I'm thinking of it, maybe LE should get Joshy's brother the "interrogator" over to talk w/ him ASAP....perhaps this Intelligence Ops professional could wrap this case up like Hacking's brothers did.
Curious Me
12-21-2009, 01:17 AM
I imagine Josh wants to insure his sons are with his family from now on, and will want to keep them away from Susan's family. I think he senses something more will be coming down real soon. Poor kids being dragged on these trips. He's had plenty of time to plant false memories in the children and they must miss their Mommy so much.
Openmyeyes
12-21-2009, 01:26 AM
This guy just baffles me. My first impression of him was that he was hollow and in shock. The shock was from having to face what he had done and that he was almost caught red handed.
Watching the first couple video interviews he states that "He doesn't know what happened to her." Then he adds that "He doesn't even know where to begin to look for her." This tells me he didn't really have a plan, only a desire that he acted upon.
There is much more to this story than we know. We've been down this road before, and I'm afraid that selfishness is the key, just like with Scott Peterson. I'm wondering if a girlfriend will appear, or some addiction will surface. TM, your tidbit about him being fired due to "Bad Publicity" is a fantasy comment on his part; it is way too soon for that to be the case.
Heck, even Scott Petersons employer let him stay on for months.
Chances are that Josh didn't realize how hot the frying pan was going to really be, and that his plan or lack of one once the deed was done, would require more work than he anticipated.
I bet he also didn't realize he was going to be in competition with Casey Anthony for biggest villain of the decade. Who wants to start a poll???
Texas Mist
12-21-2009, 01:44 AM
This guy just baffles me. My first impression of him was that he was hollow and in shock. The shock was from having to face what he had done and that he was almost caught red handed.
Watching the first couple video interviews he states that "He doesn't know what happened to her." Then he adds that "He doesn't even know where to begin to look for her." This tells me he didn't really have a plan, only a desire that he acted upon.
There is much more to this story than we know. We've been down this road before, and I'm afraid that selfishness is the key, just like with Scott Peterson. I'm wondering if a girlfriend will appear, or some addiction will surface. TM, your tidbit about him being fired due to "Bad Publicity" is a fantasy comment on his part; it is way too soon for that to be the case.
Heck, even Scott Petersons employer let him stay on for months.
Chances are that Josh didn't realize how hot the frying pan was going to really be, and that his plan or lack of one once the deed was done, would require more work than he anticipated.
I bet he also didn't realize he was going to be in competition with Casey Anthony for biggest villain of the decade. Who wants to start a poll???
ITA -- obviously - as *we* already knew - going to WA was *not* going to get him out of the media or away from stares...DUH.
Joshua Powell, 34, who police have named as a person of interest in the case after Susan Powell, 28, was reported missing Dec. 7, did not speak to a hoard of cameras and media gathered at the event, held at the LDS Church ward chapel attended by Susan's parents, Chuck and Judy Cox.
He stood in a downpour surrounded by a tight group of supporters who shielded him from the media with umbrellas. Joshua's 4-year-old son, Charlie, accompanied him at the vigil and held a candle as many of Susan's friends and families stared at Joshua in surprise.
http://www.sltrib.com/News/ci_14039869
I noticed he's covering his eyes in the photo....sorry folks but I'm so jaded -- too reminiscent of Casey Anthony's most recent fake crying in court.
Curious Me
12-21-2009, 02:23 AM
I'm with you on the fake crying we are seeing alot of lately. Tears that contain no fluid are the latest fad it seems. Although, Josh doesn't have the eye poke down like Casey does. Josh snivels now, but he may be crying actual tears for himself soon.
Openmyeyes
12-21-2009, 02:24 AM
Respectfully snipped!
http://www.sltrib.com/News/ci_14039869
I noticed he's covering his eyes in the photo....sorry folks but I'm so jaded -- too reminiscent of Casey Anthony's most recent fake crying in court.[/QUOTE]
TM, it reminds me of Scott Peterson and how he pulled his baseball cap down over his eyes when reporters approached him on Christmas day.
We are all jaded. The reality of our 'hobby' makes us that way. We've heard way too many lies, we've seen people actually making their own form of justice and we sit here begging that the innocents get the justice we are actually allowed to have.
I've wondered for so many years why these people do these things. What pushes them over that invisible line to think they could actually kill another person. The serial murders I can almost understand or explain by realizing its more of a sickness. Its the wife murderers and the child murderers that I can't figure out. How do they move down that path. Freedom was one of Scott Petersons triggers. Josh's may be similiar. What if part of his plan was to do away with the kids too, but he got there and couldn't do it.
He had dreams of grandeur and spent money like he had it. I wonder if they had life insurance policies on the kids. Susan probably has one at work.
The selfishness theme will pop up. Just like with Scott, and how about Susan Smith. She wanted her freedom too.
I'm starting to ramble, I better get to bed. Hopefully, my dreams won't be crowded with Scott Peterson, Susan Smith, Casey Anthony, Josh Powell, Mark Hacking, and OJ Simpson. That would be an interesting round table, though. Casey Anthony would horn up to Scott Peterson and he would be looking around for the strawberries and champaign. Susan Smith would go right for OJ as he has money. Mark Hacking would be talking to Josh and telling him not to let his brother in law into see him and explaining how brothers really aren't nice guys at all. They ruined his party, and made him wear clothes. He probably still wants to move and asks Josh for suggestions on what routes to take. Josh will be sitting there with this blank look on his face wondering how he got there. Then he'll tell Mark he has no money, they fired him from his job, and that he just doesn't know where to start. Casey may ask for the boombox from her cell and may put on some music to get the party started, then she'll bring in all her snacks with a big old smile on her face....and so the party goes. They all get along famously. Josh has much to learn but he warms up after time. No tears or sniffles in here, just a bunch of murderers socializing with their peers.
Night night.
SuziQ
12-21-2009, 02:32 AM
This guy just baffles me. My first impression of him was that he was hollow and in shock. The shock was from having to face what he had done and that he was almost caught red handed.
Watching the first couple video interviews he states that "He doesn't know what happened to her." Then he adds that "He doesn't even know where to begin to look for her." This tells me he didn't really have a plan, only a desire that he acted upon.
There is much more to this story than we know. We've been down this road before, and I'm afraid that selfishness is the key, just like with Scott Peterson. I'm wondering if a girlfriend will appear, or some addiction will surface. TM, your tidbit about him being fired due to "Bad Publicity" is a fantasy comment on his part; it is way too soon for that to be the case.
Heck, even Scott Petersons employer let him stay on for months.
Chances are that Josh didn't realize how hot the frying pan was going to really be, and that his plan or lack of one once the deed was done, would require more work than he anticipated.
I bet he also didn't realize he was going to be in competition with Casey Anthony for biggest villain of the decade. Who wants to start a poll???
IMO, it's a common mistake these guys make. It never occurs to them that people will care and miss the person they tossed away like a broken toaster. They seem totally unprepared and caught off guard by the ensuing firestorm. It must really befuddle them. In fact I think befuddled describes Josh in many of those interviews. lol.
gitana1
12-21-2009, 03:09 AM
FWIW, Susan's parents need to file an emergency order! ASAP!
They can have a judge draw up emergency, temporary custody papers and they could get custody of the kids by tomorrow afternoon. It was done on the Nancy Cooper case. The judge signed the paper and the husband didn't even get a chance to respond. LE picked the kids up and that was it until a formal hearing could be held.
Just, fwiw,
fran
PS.............not only is this a wonderful tool to insure the safety of the kids, it can often times create valuable insight for LE about the hubby. Ehhh, that depends IF he decides to fight the custody!....fran
PPS.....I forgot what the 'special type hearing' is called. Maybe gitani1 knows!
An "ex parte" hearing.
gitana1
12-21-2009, 03:13 AM
It really upsets me that LE wasn't keeping closer tabs on Joshua Powell. At the very least, I'd expect the customary "Don't leave town without notifying us" speech and a GPS unit attached to his vehicle. Maybe I watch too many crime dramas. But I feel a little common sense goes a long way in these investigations.
Sorry, I ahve not read ahead so maybe this has been addressed but, how do we know LE isn't tracking him? Just because they say they don't know where he is does not mean that's true!
gitana1
12-21-2009, 03:15 AM
Josh doesn't have to notify the police of anything.
What we don't know is if LE put a GPS system in the van. The way I look at it, if I could think of it, then they did it already.
Sometimes the police indicate they aren't aware when actually they already know.
See, I should have read ahead!
Texas Mist
12-21-2009, 03:17 AM
...and was trying to break up the marriage....and Josh is a jerk asking the kids to choose between church and cake :shocked2: Poor Susan - how could she not be miserable living with this buttmunch & putting up w/ her FIL!! ETA - no wonder the Cox's had "issues" w/ daddy Powell !! I think we're going to hear about more sick twisted behavior that Josh exhibited....grrr....I'm so :furious: at him!!
<snip>
"One of the biggest problems Susan had was that (Josh) talked to his dad for hours, more than he talked to her," said Tim Peterson, a friend and member of the Powells' ward who has been vocal in the past about Josh Powell and once called police on him.
.....
Joe Trujillo, who talked to Josh Powell often when he would come visit two doors down the street, said Josh told him only a month ago that some family problems stemmed from how busy and active Susan was with her ward, which Josh Powell started attending again a few months ago because of marriage counseling.
"(Josh) mentioned the church was putting a burden on their marriage," Trujillo said.
Other ward members described a similar scenario.
Peterson said he went with the Elders Quorum presidency last September to offer Susan a blessing when she was feeling sick, and said that Josh Powell talked to them for 45 minutes while his wife sat there sick.
"Not in any part of the time did he show any concern for his wife," Peterson said.
"(Susan) told me that a couple times he would say to the kids, 'You can go to church or have this cake,' " Peterson said. "She had to do everything."
Hellewell said he knew Josh struggled with pressure from his family, especially his dad, Stephen Powell, about church.
"His dad is very against the church," Hellewell said. "His dad is always sending him anti-Mormon literature and I've heard stories from Josh and Susan that (Josh's) dad was always trying to break up their marriage."
more here in multipage article -- read page 2 for sure!!
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705352897/Husband-of-missing-West-Valley-woman-has-left-Utah.html?pg=1
christee
12-21-2009, 03:46 AM
I posted a couple of links in the scanner thread if anyone wants to listen. One is a link to Salt Lake County, Utah. The 2nd one is the Olympia, Washington area.
Hope this helps!
Dr.Fessel
12-21-2009, 03:51 AM
Has this been posted?
AP – Josh Powell, the husband of Susan Powell, stands with supporters after a candle light vigil for his wife …
41 mins ago
PUYALLUP, Wash. – A Utah man considered a person of interest in the disappearance of his wife was among more than 60 people who attended a vigil for her Sunday night in her parents' hometown in Washington state.
Sunday's vigil for Susan Powell, the mother of two young boys, was held outside a church in Puyallup, Wash., south of Seattle. Besides Josh Powell, the rainy event was attended by Susan's grandparents, parents and siblings.
Josh Powell, 34, of the Salt Lake City suburb West Valley City, did not speak to a hoard of cameras and media gathered at the event.....................
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091221/ap_on_re_us/us_missing_mom_utah
Dr.Fessel
12-21-2009, 03:55 AM
Going to that vigil was the biggest joke between Josh and his dad i bet. Josh is really trying to out do Drew in the humor. He has the same sense of humor I bet that Drew does.
Dr.Fessel
12-21-2009, 03:58 AM
He is laughing at everyone.
Dr.Fessel
12-21-2009, 04:07 AM
He went and cried in the church that next sunday just to let them know it was their fault he had to kill her.
Dr.Fessel
12-21-2009, 04:10 AM
James Hofheins, who administers the Facebook group, said a prayer at the vigil, and asked God to comfort Susan Powell's parents, her children and "all of her friends and family."
Joshua Powell was not mentioned .
"I'm still friends with Josh," said Kiirsi Hellewell, who has described Susan as her best friend.
"I know we're all praying for Josh," she said. "At least, some of us."
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14039869
.........................
BBM that is strange.
Dr.Fessel
12-21-2009, 04:12 AM
He went to the neighbors Peterson that day just to let him know, here I am and she is not.
Dr.Fessel
12-21-2009, 04:30 AM
If you want to know what Josh is going to do next think of the most outrageous thing he could do with a twisted sense of humor thrown in.
PorcineGranny
12-21-2009, 05:07 AM
My heart breaks for Susan and her children. May God bless them all.
As for Josh, something is terribly wrong. When I saw him on TV the word befuddled used to describe him fit perfectly. What would my obvious reaction be if my husband was missing? I would be begging everyone to help find him, and I would be willing to talk to anyone that I thought could help. I would not leave my home in case he came back.
Josh reminds me of Ron Cummings in that his reactions are not what could be rightfully expected. jmo
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