PDA

View Full Version : Events Post-911 Calls 7/15 to Arrest 7/16



BondJamesBond
12-19-2009, 01:08 AM
Updating based on add'l info from BeanE's post :blowkiss: and cell records...


7/16/08


00:45 AM Sgt. Hosey notified Yuri.

01:05 AM Casey completed or began her 4-page handwritten statement

04:11 AM Yuri arrived @ G&C's and began his first interview w/ Casey after he read Casey's statement. Yuri's narrative indicates that LE had already learned that the Sawgrass apt. in question had been vacant for 142 days. LE had gone w/ Casey to Sawgrass 7/15PM.

>4:11 AM Yuri and Casey left G&C's and drove to Glenwood address, then Sawgrass, then, Crossings @ Conway.

<6:48 AM Yuri dropped Casey back @ G&C's. George informed Yuri that he & Cindy believed Casey was withholding information and they're concerned something had happened to Caylee. Comments to Yuri about the smell in the Pontiac.

##:## AM Yuri briefed Sgt. Allen

##:## AM Yuri visited Sawgrass Apt. and inquired about ZFG, etc.

11:30-11:44 AM Yuri visited Universal Studios w/ Investigator Turtora re: Casey's employment information, etc. and called Casey to inquire about some of the details

12:30PM Sgt. Allen & Det. Wells picked up Casey from G&C's and transported her to Universal Studios

##:##PM Det. Beasley arrived @ G&C's to process the Pontiac and received additional items from Cindy. Need to locate this report again :rolleyes: :doh:

<7:20PM Pontiac sealed @ G&C's by Det. Beasley

~7:20PM Pontiac towed from G&C's per Google travel time allowance from CSI arrival time

7:46PM Pontiac documented arrived @ CSI Forensics Bay by CSI Bloise

##:##PM CSI Bloise opened the sealed door and immediately noted the odor of human decomposition.

#:##PM Det. McBryde picked up George and proceeded to the tow yard to retrieve the trash bag from the dumpster

9:57PM Det. McBryde photographed the trashbag in the dumpster and retrieved it, then returned to G&C's

10:13PM LE photographed G&C's sideyard

11:07PM Det. McBryde arrived @ the Forensics unit w/ the trash bag

##:## PM/AM Yuri arrived @ the Forensics unit and directed a search of the trash bag

7/17/08


Pontiac CSI work continued

3:31PM D/S Forgery's K9 cadaver inspected the trunk

From Casey's cell records it appears she returned home sometime just before 6:48AM whence she initiated a text-fest w/ Tony. Casey's cell usage that morning was virtually continuous w/ the longest single break being 26 mins until the time LE picked her up again to goto Universal. Of course, Casey could've been multi-tasking, but, it sure doesn't look like G or C had her undivided attention for Q&A OR she had much time to focus on getting something outta the car and :rolleyes: squirreled away :nuts: (pun fully intended). Still not impossible...but she was a very good AT&T customer that morning. ;)

Speculating the likely time for Casey & Lee's convo in the garage was sometime 2:45AM-4:11AM 7/16 after Casey finished her statement and before Yuri arrived.

1) Still would appreciate a link to Beasley's first report of processing the car if anyone has that handy. TIA1.

2) Does Brittany's statement provide any clues re: time of day? TIA2.

AZ: One thought...IIRC, it was Cindy's coworker @ Gentiva that zeroed in on the carseat still being in the car that spelled trouble. IIRC, she urged Cindy to contact police. Perhaps that put Cindy in a different frame of mind when she returned home and started back into the car. NOW it was a "major prob".

Keep in mind that LE's view in the first several hours was that the grandparents had just learned of the situation and reported it immediately, hence, giving benefit of the doubt to G&C regarding custody of the car didn't skyrocket to the top of the to-do list. From that perspective one might consider George's approaching Yuri 7/16 AM about the car as further indication that the grandparents wanted to get to the bottom of things and were unlikely to meddle w/ evidence.

OK, OK :other_beatingA_Dead: I wished they'd sealed it earlier too. :)

JBean
12-19-2009, 06:07 AM
Should point out too that Cindy knew who she was dealing with, Casey - Yuri at this time did not, although it didn't him long. I bet as soon as he heard/saw that first statement from Casey he had her pegged, hence the driving her around to get her to show them the various places and then lock her into to her lies.

I agreee it is troubling about the car but I don't think we will know for sure what Yuri thought or suspected until he tells us at trial, should it get to that point.
According to our timeline, YM started interviewing KC at 4:11am. In his statement he said that he had already reviewed KC's 4 page statement that was obtained prior to his arrival.. At that time he told her flat out that her story was suspiicious and that he found her version of events to be suspect. He even gave her the opportunity to change her statement. This is BEFORE he drives her all around checking out the story.So, yuri knew immediately that KC was not being truthful and that was probably based on common sense.
http://www.wesh.com/download/2008/0717/16910180.pdf

So we know for sure that :
he finds out about the decomp smell upon his arrival at the house,or about(3:45ish) per his 7/24 interview with GA.
Then by 4:11 am after reviewing the story, he already thinks KC is not telling the truth and is suspicious of her.
We aslo know per the bond hearing linked earlier that he did not need a search warrant to get the car.

My point is not to discredit LE for making a mistake. It happens and they have conducted an overall stellar investigation.
I think most agree that they would have preferred it was sealed up earlier but it is what it is and I don't consider this to be any kind of weak link in the case.

But the question is, did they miss any important evidence because of this or will it impact any of the evidence that they did get?
Not trying to paint this as some sort of deal breaker. Just trying to figure out if there are any ramifications to this missed opportunity.

BondJamesBond
12-19-2009, 02:53 PM
According to our timeline, YM started interviewing KC at 4:11am. In his statement he said that he had already reviewed KC's 4 page statement that was obtained prior to his arrival.. At that time he told her flat out that her story was suspiicious and that he found her version of events to be suspect. He even gave her the opportunity to change her statement. This is BEFORE he drives her all around checking out the story.So, yuri knew immediately that KC was not being truthful and that was probably based on common sense.
http://www.wesh.com/download/2008/0717/16910180.pdf

So we know for sure that :
he finds out about the decomp smell upon his arrival at the house,or about(3:45ish) per his 7/24 interview with GA.
Then by 4:11 am after reviewing the story, he already thinks KC is not telling the truth and is suspicious of her.
We aslo know per the bond hearing linked earlier that he did not need a search warrant to get the car.

My point is not to discredit LE for making a mistake. It happens and they have conducted an overall stellar investigation.
I think most agree that they would have preferred it was sealed up earlier but it is what it is and I don't consider this to be any kind of weak link in the case.

But the question is, did they miss any important evidence because of this or will it impact any of the evidence that they did get?
Not trying to paint this as some sort of deal breaker. Just trying to figure out if there are any ramifications to this missed opportunity.

Couple points...

FWIW...IMHO, as I read Yuri's narrative it suggests that he knew before he got to G&C's the first time that the Sawgrass apt. story was already suspect based on the 7/15PM work that told them the apt. had been empty. Then he read Casey's statement and told her up front that she could change her story.

I'm taking his narrative account as a better indication of the sequence of events where it may conflict w/ the later GA interview re: exactly when George commented 'bout the smell. His narrative indicates George approached him when he dropped Casey back @ the house (est. ~<6:48AM) vs. when he first arrived ~4:11AM, IMHO.

I'm guessing that when Casey & Yuri left Yuri may have been the last LEO out. Also assuming Yuri got direction from Sgt. Allen, or at least they discussed it, on the next priority after leaving Casey @ the house as Yuri mentioned it in his narrative.

Not trying to poke holes in Yuri's approach 'cause I sure don't know WTH I'm doin' :bang: Looks like they were focused on checking out the statement - what they were being told was the scene of the crime -@ Sawgrass - and then likely on to verify w/ Casey's employer that she worked on the date she provided in her statement. Even though Sawgrass couldn't provide a positive ID...they did get a curve ball w/ the ZFG visitor card. :waitasec: So...all things considered, by 12:30PM 7/16 they had it put together :thumb:

As for the "So what, big deal?" aspect of not sealing the Pontiac. It does give the defense the opportunity - ala OJ - to suggest evidence was planted by LE. As ridiculous as that sounds...:rolleyes: they can go w/ the, "LE already had their mind made up..." angle. Hey - it worked once. :doh:

IMHO the defense is missing the best opportunity of SODDI as far as I can tell. Dunno why we're not hearing it yet...perhaps they'll just sit on it 'till trial.

BeanE
12-19-2009, 05:49 PM
Updating based on add'l info from BeanE's post :blowkiss: and cell records...

Speculating the likely time for Casey & Lee's convo in the garage was sometime 2:45AM-4:11AM 7/16 after Casey finished her statement and before Yuri arrived.



Lee said KC went to the garage because LE wanted her, then him, separated from GA and CA when they (GA/CA) gave their written statements. Their written statements have approx 10:18pm on 7/15 on them.

I linked to the statements... somewhere lol. Pls holler if you want me to pull them up. It's no problem. :-) :blowkiss:

I need to do a few things. I'll find Beasley's statement when I get back if it hasn't popped up by then. I have that linked... somewhere too lol.

BondJamesBond
12-19-2009, 06:51 PM
Lee said KC went to the garage because LE wanted her, then him, separated from GA and CA when they (GA/CA) gave their written statements. Their written statements have approx 10:18pm on 7/15 on them.

I linked to the statements... somewhere lol. Pls holler if you want me to pull them up. It's no problem. :-) :blowkiss:

I need to do a few things. I'll find Beasley's statement when I get back if it hasn't popped up by then. I have that linked... somewhere too lol.

Thanks, BeanE. :) I was looking them over earlier. When you pointed me back to Casey's statement it was the first time I realized her statement was so much later than Lee's, G's and C's. In fact, going through that evolution has me wondering if I overlooked something...or perhaps I imagined it.

Of course, I'm not choosing my words too carefully...so...consider this in general terms...and be kind, 'cause I've forgotten much and tossed almost all my files.

I always thought LE showed up and they went about getting statements...which is pretty much true of Lee, G and C. However, we know LE went to Tony's to get Casey's cell ~10PM. Maybe I wasn't paying attention that Casey went with them? :waitasec: Yuri's narrative mentions LE having already made the 1st Sawgrass adventure <00:45AM 7/16. So...:slap: me...but I guess this means Casey went. Last ping @ Tony's was 10:07PM and the next ping was 1hr 48mins later @ G&C's 11:55PM. The dynamic of Casey going into Tony's apartment w/ LE to get the phone just doesn't ring true (pun, once again, shamelessly intended :rolleyes). Am I just dreamin'??? :hypno:

So...IF that's correct, allowing some +/- it means Lee left for Tony's about the time Casey was getting back w/ LE. :waitasec: I recall Lee's statement commenting about LE having Casey outside w/ the phone @ G&C's...maybe I'm just dreamin' all this up. :hypno:

OK...I'm wandering OT... :bang: Guess the convo w/ Lee in the garage could've just as easily been before running off to get the phone.

darnudes
12-19-2009, 07:31 PM
That is correct about the statements. In fact I was reading Cindy's depo last night and she was asked about her statement and if the time it was taken was 22:11 as this was written on it, she more or less verified that it was approx the correct time.

Doesn't mean Casey did her statement at the same time but I think they may have.

BeanE
12-19-2009, 07:35 PM
Thanks, BeanE. :) I was looking them over earlier. When you pointed me back to Casey's statement it was the first time I realized her statement was so much later than Lee's, G's and C's. In fact, going through that evolution has me wondering if I overlooked something...or perhaps I imagined it.

Of course, I'm not choosing my words too carefully...so...consider this in general terms...and be kind, 'cause I've forgotten much and tossed almost all my files.

I always thought LE showed up and they went about getting statements...which is pretty much true of Lee, G and C. However, we know LE went to Tony's to get Casey's cell ~10PM. Maybe I wasn't paying attention that Casey went with them? :waitasec: Yuri's narrative mentions LE having already made the 1st Sawgrass adventure <00:45AM 7/16. So...:slap: me...but I guess this means Casey went. Last ping @ Tony's was 10:07PM and the next ping was 1hr 48mins later @ G&C's 11:55PM. The dynamic of Casey going into Tony's apartment w/ LE to get the phone just doesn't ring true (pun, once again, shamelessly intended :rolleyes). Am I just dreamin'??? :hypno:

So...IF that's correct, allowing some +/- it means Lee left for Tony's about the time Casey was getting back w/ LE. :waitasec: I recall Lee's statement commenting about LE having Casey outside w/ the phone @ G&C's...maybe I'm just dreamin' all this up. :hypno:

OK...I'm wandering OT... :bang: Guess the convo w/ Lee in the garage could've just as easily been before running off to get the phone.

hmmmm I see what you're sayin', Bond. I've been wanting to go back through and track which deputy was doing what in terms of who's at the house & who's out on the road. Lemme do that tomorrow morning, and I'll pull everything I can find of where KC is along the way.

We have at least 6 deputies involved before Yuri even arrived, and I'm not completely sure every one of them ever actually was at the house. I think one or two might have gone to the locations and reported back via phone without ever going to the house.

Lemme see what I can dig up. (No pun intended)

cecybeans
12-19-2009, 08:16 PM
BJB - having LA and KC in the garage might help make sense of whatever LA did at AL's. I had always imagined it that way anyway. It was almost like he had instructions on what to get and what to do. The fact LA and KC went in the garage to talk, instead of outside or almost anywhere else, was very odd to me. LA makes such a huge thing about the Pontiac's smell; I can't imagine they would pick that place for a conversation unless they wanted to be avoided. Perhaps they went out there to talk sotto voce but in full sight knowing that if LE wanted them back inside, they probably would wave them in instead of walking right up to the door.

Perhaps, if this conversation happened first, there were instructions for LA regarding wiping the emails and the fake bsod or whatever. It makes more sense than what LA said they were discussing, IIRC - that conversation could have easily taken place when they were talking earlier in her room.

BeanE
12-19-2009, 08:24 PM
Confirmation of KC going w/LE to Sawgrass

Statement from deputy Adriana Acevedo. 2nd responding officer

Took KC in her patrol car to Sawgrass
"immediately" took KC back to her residence after seeing the apartment

Doesn't say what time she took KC to Sawgrass

PDF page 1
http://flawebhosting.net/docdump110608/dcf.pdf

Other notes:
Rendon Fletcher already on the scene
Ryan Eberlin arrived shortly after Acevedo

BeanE
12-19-2009, 08:58 PM
BJB - having LA and KC in the garage might help make sense of whatever LA did at AL's. I had always imagined it that way anyway. It was almost like he had instructions on what to get and what to do. The fact LA and KC went in the garage to talk, instead of outside or almost anywhere else, was very odd to me. LA makes such a huge thing about the Pontiac's smell; I can't imagine they would pick that place for a conversation unless they wanted to be avoided. Perhaps they went out there to talk sotto voce but in full sight knowing that if LE wanted them back inside, they probably would wave them in instead of walking right up to the door.

Perhaps, if this conversation happened first, there were instructions for LA regarding wiping the emails and the fake bsod or whatever. It makes more sense than what LA said they were discussing, IIRC - that conversation could have easily taken place when they were talking earlier in her room.

Just a note. Lee claims he didn't know where KC was, then found her in the garage. He estimated she had been there about 5 minutes before he found her.

She could have gone anywhere in the house while GA/CA gave their statements. I'm highly suspicious of why she chose to go to the smelly garage.

Lee said the smell was so bad he just couldn't stay in there. It really didn't sound like he sought it out, but found KC there, tried to talk, had to leave because the smell was making him sick.

O/T. How come decomp smell never seems to bother killers? Or is it sociopaths. I know sociopaths don't feel physical pain as much as other people. Maybe they don't notice smells as much? Or just aren't bothered by bad smells as much? But they seem aware the smell will bother others. So bizarre.

BeanE
12-19-2009, 09:02 PM
Yuri's Investigative report

http://www.wesh.com/download/2008/1126/18155354.pdf

PDF page 4

Rendon Fletcher went to Sawgrass July 15 no time given. No mention of KC.

Ryan Williams met with Tony July 15 no time given. No mention of KC.

Robert Salamat went to 232 North Glenwood and met with the residents. No date or time given. No mention of KC.

BondJamesBond
12-19-2009, 09:41 PM
All Hail BeanE! :bowdown:

Time for a new thread on the logistics of the responding LE's :)

I believe I recognize "Ryan"s sig on Casey & Lee's statements. I didn't check G or C's.

BeanE
12-19-2009, 11:23 PM
All Hail BeanE! :bowdown:

Time for a new thread on the logistics of the responding LE's :)

I believe I recognize "Ryan"s sig on Casey & Lee's statements. I didn't check G or C's.

Well I was thinking it might be helpful to have a thread to track down all activity in the house from Cindy's last 911 call until KC left and went to Universal then central ops with Yuri and was arrested. I want to know everybody in that house and what they did and when. I just don't know if it would be useful, or interesting to anyone else. Nor would I have a clue what to name it lol.

Sorry for putting superfluous info into this thread. I get interested in other stuff when researching stuff that's thread topic related and lose track of the topic in my obsession with detail.

mitzi
12-20-2009, 12:46 AM
Couple points...

FWIW...IMHO, as I read Yuri's narrative it suggests that he knew before he got to G&C's the first time that the Sawgrass apt. story was already suspect based on the 7/15PM work that told them the apt. had been empty. Then he read Casey's statement and told her up front that she could change her story.

I'm taking his narrative account as a better indication of the sequence of events where it may conflict w/ the later GA interview re: exactly when George commented 'bout the smell. His narrative indicates George approached him when he dropped Casey back @ the house (est. ~<6:48AM) vs. when he first arrived ~4:11AM, IMHO.

I'm guessing that when Casey & Yuri left Yuri may have been the last LEO out. Also assuming Yuri got direction from Sgt. Allen, or at least they discussed it, on the next priority after leaving Casey @ the house as Yuri mentioned it in his narrative.

Not trying to poke holes in Yuri's approach 'cause I sure don't know WTH I'm doin' :bang: Looks like they were focused on checking out the statement - what they were being told was the scene of the crime -@ Sawgrass - and then likely on to verify w/ Casey's employer that she worked on the date she provided in her statement. Even though Sawgrass couldn't provide a positive ID...they did get a curve ball w/ the ZFG visitor card. :waitasec: So...all things considered, by 12:30PM 7/16 they had it put together :thumb:

As for the "So what, big deal?" aspect of not sealing the Pontiac. It does give the defense the opportunity - ala OJ - to suggest evidence was planted by LE. As ridiculous as that sounds...:rolleyes: they can go w/ the, "LE already had their mind made up..." angle. Hey - it worked once. :doh:

IMHO the defense is missing the best opportunity of SODDI as far as I can tell. Dunno why we're not hearing it yet...perhaps they'll just sit on it 'till trial.

Bold mine.

I'm not as concerned as some here about the fact that the car sat at the Anthony's for a few extra hours, unsealed....After all, it sat at Amscot for 3 days, and obviously someone (GA/CA) cleaned the trunk out, at the Anthony's house, hours before it was sealed. All the other circumstantial evidence added to the evidence in the trunk is going to sink her. I am not worried.

BeanE
12-20-2009, 08:26 AM
Bold mine.

I'm not as concerned as some here about the fact that the car sat at the Anthony's for a few extra hours, unsealed....After all, it sat at Amscot for 3 days, and obviously someone (GA/CA) cleaned the trunk out, at the Anthony's house, hours before it was sealed. All the other circumstantial evidence added to the evidence in the trunk is going to sink her. I am not worried.

I'm not concerned so far as the trial goes. But then, my focus in this case is in finding out Caylee's story in all its detail, rather then legal/trial/defense/prosecution concerns. Justice doesn't always come in a courtroom. To me, justice is finding out and telling a victim's story regardless of legal technicalities.

With that in mind, I'm just disappointed that what seems to me to be more opportunity than was reasonable was given to KC, GA, CA, and LA to remove evidence. Any evidence removed, cleaned, changed, tainted is, to me, an impact to determining as much as possible of what happened to this precious baby.

ETA: MOO

BondJamesBond
12-20-2009, 10:45 AM
BJB - having LA and KC in the garage might help make sense of whatever LA did at AL's. I had always imagined it that way anyway. It was almost like he had instructions on what to get and what to do. The fact LA and KC went in the garage to talk, instead of outside or almost anywhere else, was very odd to me. LA makes such a huge thing about the Pontiac's smell; I can't imagine they would pick that place for a conversation unless they wanted to be avoided. Perhaps they went out there to talk sotto voce but in full sight knowing that if LE wanted them back inside, they probably would wave them in instead of walking right up to the door.

Perhaps, if this conversation happened first, there were instructions for LA regarding wiping the emails and the fake bsod or whatever. It makes more sense than what LA said they were discussing, IIRC - that conversation could have easily taken place when they were talking earlier in her room.

Interesting thoughts. Need to check the computer forensics and JWG's 7/15 timeline again. IIRC, there are timestamps on the computer use during the 7/15PM-7/16AM timeframe that should shed add'l light on who was doing what & when.

My apologies for OT. :blushing:

BeanE
12-20-2009, 12:42 PM
Bond, if you haven't found it yet, here's Charity Beasley's report, beginning on docstoc page 179, handwritten page 292

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/4320677/Casey-Anthony-first-set-of-documents-released

Also noting Ryan Eberlin's documentation begins on docstoc page 173, handwritten page 286.

- Dispatched 7/16(?) for stolen vehicle. Spoke to Lee first (Witness 1), Cindy second (Witness 2), George third (Witness 3), then spoke to Casey. Casey completed a sworn written statement.
- Rendon Fletcher went to Sawgrass.
- Ryan Williams went to Tony's.
- Robert Salamat went to 232 North Glenwood.

BeanE
12-20-2009, 01:52 PM
Noting that Jesse says deputies were using & answering KC's phone 7/15-7/16

http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFiles/Stories/Local/Casey%20Anthony%20discovery%20Pages%201-150.pdf

pdf page 43

BondJamesBond
12-21-2009, 03:32 AM
Yuri's Investigative report

http://www.wesh.com/download/2008/1126/18155354.pdf

PDF page 4

Rendon Fletcher went to Sawgrass July 15 no time given. No mention of KC.

Ryan Williams met with Tony July 15 no time given. No mention of KC.

Robert Salamat went to 232 North Glenwood and met with the residents. No date or time given. No mention of KC.


Bond, if you haven't found it yet, here's Charity Beasley's report, beginning on docstoc page 179, handwritten page 292

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/4320677/Casey-Anthony-first-set-of-documents-released

Also noting Ryan Eberlin's documentation begins on docstoc page 173, handwritten page 286.

- Dispatched 7/16(?) for stolen vehicle. Spoke to Lee first (Witness 1), Cindy second (Witness 2), George third (Witness 3), then spoke to Casey. Casey completed a sworn written statement.
- Rendon Fletcher went to Sawgrass.
- Ryan Williams went to Tony's.
- Robert Salamat went to 232 North Glenwood.


Noting that Jesse says deputies were using & answering KC's phone 7/15-7/16

http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFiles/Stories/Local/Casey%20Anthony%20discovery%20Pages%201-150.pdf

pdf page 43

BeanE: You realize you've provided me w/ a week's worth of work here. :)

I'm going to see if JBean agrees to break this thread back @ the last update of the timeline into a new thread focused on 7/15-post-911 to 7/16 arrest focused timeline development. I dunno what to call it either, but, before reviewing your links I wouldn't have thought there would be much more we could do with it. There's at least a little more that can be done...or at least documented in a thread to make it easy to find later IYKWIM.

Noted, for example, relative to the car sealing...if we reviewed George's cell, Cindy's cell & Hopespring home phone records again for 7/16 we should find Yuri's call referenced in Beasley's report (handwritten #293) where he gained approval to obtain the car, etc. That timestamp + travel time will tighten up Beasley's arrival time. Not expecting revelations, but, I'm in agreement w/ your earlier post that we are working to do here is get clarity on the events.

Also noted that Jesse was quick on the dial. LE w/ Casey's phone called Jeff H. @ 12:05AM 7/16 for only a few seconds. Jesse called Casey's cell and spoke w/ Sgt. Hosey @ 12:06AM :eek: for <1min.

Other rabbit holes I wanna chase down based on reviewing the mat'l again. I can't commit to anything better than a slow burn. But would like to do it if others will help.

JBean
12-21-2009, 10:58 AM
Bond asked me to move the timeline analysis into its own thread up here and I concur. hate to see this great work lost in other discussion.
Please alert on any other posts from the sealing of the pontiac thread that you guys want brought up here.
I took a quick search starting at the post Bond gave me, but there may be more.
Nice work.

BeanE
12-21-2009, 12:05 PM
First responding Officers/Deputies and Detective on the scene:

First responding officers/deputies:

Rendon Fletcher: First on scene
Adriana Acevedo: 2nd on scene
Ryan Eberlin: 3rd on scene
Ryan Williams
Robert Salamat
Reggie Hosey

Adriana Acevedo's report - Page 1
http://flawebhosting.net/docdump110608/dcf.pdf

Ryan Eberlin's report
begins docstoc page 173, handwritten page 286.
http://www.docstoc.com/docs/4320677/Casey-Anthony-first-set-of-documents-released

- Dispatched 7/16(?) for stolen vehicle. Spoke to Lee first (Witness 1), Cindy second (Witness 2), George third (Witness 3), then spoke to Casey. Casey completed a sworn written statement.
- Rendon Fletcher went to Sawgrass.
- Ryan Williams went to Tony's.
- Robert Salamat went to 232 North Glenwood.


First Detective on scene:
Yuri Melich
http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFiles/Stories/Local/Casey%20Anthony%20discovery%20Pages%201-150.pdf
pdf page 3
Date/time Yuri notified was 7/15 00:45 12:45am by Reggie Hosey

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=659JE9JrkfI
video of Bond hearing - cross by Baez
despite questioning by Baez, Yuri doesn't explain the 3 hours from notification to arrival on scene
Yuri Melich arrived on scene @ 3:30/3:45am on 7/16

BeanE
12-21-2009, 12:08 PM
http://www.docstoc.com/docs/4320677/Casey-Anthony-first-set-of-documents-released

Charity Beasley's report
Sealed & impounded Pontiac
beginning on docstoc page 179, handwritten page 292

Lee Anthony handwritten statement pdf page 35
7/15 22:16 10:16pm Taken by Ryan Eberlin

George Anthony handwritten statement pdf page 39
7/15 22:16 10:16pm Taken by Adriana Acevedo

Casey Anthony handwritten statement pdf page 31
7/16 01:05 1:05am Taken by Ryan Eberlin

George Anthony verbal okay to take Pontiac pdf page 41
7/16 9:30pm signed by Awilda Torres-McBryde

Jesse Grund handwritten statement pdf page 43
Jesse got a call from friend Jeff 7/16 00:05 12:05am saying Jeff got a call from a deputy from KC's phone number
Jesse called KC on her phone and got Reggie Hosey

Sawgrass Apts Amanda Macklin statement pdf page 60
Amanda Macklin arrived at Sawgrass for work 7/16 at 8:45am. Yuri talked to her then

Yuri interview with KC at house pdf page 71
Recorded interview 7/16 04:11 4:11am
Yuri read KC's written statement and had a verbal interview with her prior to this recorded interview

Casey Anthony arrest affidavit pdf page 2
Filled out 7/16 at 20:09 8:09pm by Yuri Melich
Date/time of Casey Anthony's arrest 7/16 16:33 4:33pm

BeanE
12-21-2009, 12:09 PM
Movements of LE & KC

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/4320677/Casey-Anthony-first-set-of-documents-released

begin pdf page 3

KC rode with Yuri and Deputy Sheriff to 'old folks home' Glenwood & Robinson, then Sawgrass, then Crossings at Conway town homes (Zanny's mother's home). Yuri then took KC home to Hopespring.

Yuri then talked with George who said KC was holding back info and that he and Cindy fear something had happened to Caylee.

Yuri then met with John Allen, then back to Sawgrass, then Universal

John Allen and Appie Wells went to Hopespring to get Kc, then to Universal with her

Yuri took KC to central operations, where KC was arrested, and then taken to the OC jail


Yuri's Investigative report PDF page 4
http://www.wesh.com/download/2008/1126/18155354.pdf

Rendon Fletcher went to Sawgrass July 15 no time given. No mention of KC.

Ryan Williams met with Tony July 15 no time given. No mention of KC.

Robert Salamat went to 232 North Glenwood and met with the residents. No date or time given. No mention of KC.

BeanE
12-21-2009, 12:11 PM
KC Alone in the Garage + KC and Lee in the Garage

Narrative of what happened based on putting the pieces together from Lee's depo:
Lee goes outside and calls Amy. Meanwhile, KC, after being separated by LE from CA for fighting, goes to the garage. She opens the garage door?? Lee joins KC in the garage and asks her about Jeff and Tony. KC tells Lee her laptop & cell are at Tony's. Lee calls Tony and tells him (not asks) that he's coming to get the laptop & cell.

The pieces:
Lee's July 30 State Deposition
http://www.wftv.com/pdf/21310241/detail.html

pdf 146/24 - Lee got Amy's phone # from Cindy. Called Amy & got Tony's #. Then went outside to call Tony while LE was "asking Casey whatever questions or doing whatever the heck they were doing in the house". Called Tony before filling out his written statement. Told him he wanted the laptop and cellphone.

pdf 149/1 During this hour or so from 9 till 10 or 10:15 LE was not with KC the entire time and this is when KC told Lee about the laptop and cellphone.

pdf 149/9 LE was never with Lee but some were with GA/CA. LE tried to separate KC and CA specifically, and also GA, because CA was yelling at KC. CA would yell things at KC and then they would fight. CA would talk loud so KC would hear it and then KC would have a quick response.

pdf 150/25 KC, GA, CA were free to move about the house.

pdf 150/8 Lee doesn't know why KC went to the garage because he was on the phone outside. Lee came in & asked where's KC? 'They' said she's outside. Lee went to the garage for a minute & talked to KC. Asked her about Jeff Hopkins. KC in garage for 5 minutes.

When Lee went to the garage, the garage door was open.

151/17 called Tony from outside on Hopespring about a house and a half down from home

152/7 in garage Lee asked KC about Tony. This is when she told him about her laptop & cell over at Tony's.


This includes some LE movement/activities:

Lee's OCSO interview July 29
http://www.wftv.com/download/2008/0923/17540065.pdf

pdg page 16 The only thing Lee wrote down when talking with KC before LE arrived was Tony's name and address.

17/11 first responding officer walked in and began questioning KC

18/19 around midnight went to Tony's

20/14 when Lee got home, Acevedo was in the living room with CA and GA

21/19 Lee got back to the house at 2:25am. was gone for two hours.

22/3 there was a large gathering of officers around a vehicle around the garage when Lee got home from Tony's

22/18 LE went to get the cell from Tony's at about 11pm. when they returned they started calling all the contacts on KC's cell.

23/21 Acevedo left the house and came back while GA, CA, LA went through KC's stuff on the floor

47/18 KC and Lee in the garage

Here Lee said he was in the garage with KC because LE had separated KC and Cindy. He deviates though and says this is while he was waiting to fill out his statement.

Couldn't be there for more than a minute or two because the smell was "atrocious".

Lee asked KC about the smell. Here she tells the two dead squirrel story. Lee doubted her story for several reasons.

JBean
12-21-2009, 12:16 PM
I have gotten 3 alerts on posts letting me know I did not do a very good job of moving posts over LOL.
I am really sorry, I tried to do it real quick before work so you all wouldn't have to wait all day.
The alerts are confusing so i am going to have to wait until I get home tonight to go through the information and figure out what posts go where.
I just grabbed the obvious posts after the reference point of post 189 that Bond gave me.

Sorry if I have confused the issue, i truly was only trying to make it available as soon as possible.
I guess haste truly does make waste.

I see part of the problem. Bond said 179 and I thought it was 189. will fix when I can

BeanE
12-21-2009, 12:21 PM
My Christmas List:

Statements, evidence reports, any kind of documents written by deputies/first responding officers:
Rendon Fletcher
Ryan Williams
Robert Salamat
Reggie Hosey

BondJamesBond
12-21-2009, 01:38 PM
My Christmas List:

Statements, evidence reports, any kind of documents written by deputies/first responding officers:
Rendon Fletcher
Ryan Williams
Robert Salamat
Reggie Hosey

Pg 2144 Acevedo's narrative report ends, "See original report for further details". :waitasec:

If this "original report" was released I'm willing to bet you'd know it. Will also ask 'nother friend or two also ;)

BeanE
12-21-2009, 04:08 PM
Interview with Brittany Schieber
http://www.wftv.com/download/2008/0925/17555345.pdf

Has activities at the house on 7/16

Nancy Grace interview with Brittany Schieber
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0809/25/ng.01.html

More activities at the house 7/16

BeanE
12-21-2009, 04:53 PM
Cindy called co-worker Debbie P evening of 7/15

no time noted but CA said LE was on the scene and talking with KC

(CA was screaming and feared Caylee was dead :-( )

http://www.wftv.com/news/18530380/detail.html
pdf page 7

BondJamesBond
12-21-2009, 05:43 PM
Cindy called co-worker Debbie P. evening of 7/15

no time noted but CA said LE was on the scene and talking with KC

(CA was screaming and feared Caylee was dead :-( )

http://www.wftv.com/news/18530380/detail.html
pdf page 7*abbreviated lastname*

Well, BeanE, I think you just solved a little mystery AZ and I have been noodlin' on :thumb:

I haven't looked through the home phone records in awhile, but, we were looking @ Cindy's cell phone and wondering if the following calls were to/from an attorney:


7/15/2008 10:28 PM (407)***-6434 ORLANDO 2 minutes
7/15/2008 10:33 PM (407)***-6434 INCOMING 3 minutes

Dimes to doughnuts these are the calls to & from Debbie. The hysterics would make sense owing to the call being soon after LE's arrival. Hafta check the timing of Cindy's statement, but, IIRC, it was done before these calls.

BondJamesBond
12-21-2009, 06:40 PM
Interview with Brittany Schieber
http://www.wftv.com/download/2008/0925/17555345.pdf

Has activities at the house on 7/16

Nancy Grace interview with Brittany Schieber
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0809/25/ng.01.html

More activities at the house 7/16

OK...re-reading...

1) Brittany saw G&C w/ the car in the driveway 7/15PM. That would've been before George left to go back to work.

2) Cindy visited Brittany @ her house MORNING of 7/16.

BeanE
12-21-2009, 08:03 PM
OK...re-reading...

1) Brittany saw G&C w/ the car in the driveway 7/15PM. That would've been before George left to go back to work.

2) Cindy visited Brittany @ her house MORNING of 7/16.

Also from those docs, Lee called Brittany twice on 7/16, although no times given. He complained to her both times that KC had given him fake phone numbers, e.g., gave him Brittany's phone number as being Juliette Lewis's number. So there was a period of time on 7/16 when Lee was busy going through calling people.

BondJamesBond
12-21-2009, 09:38 PM
Also from those docs, Lee called Brittany twice on 7/16, although no times given. He complained to her both times that KC had given him fake phone numbers, e.g., gave him Brittany's phone number as being Juliette Lewis's number. So there was a period of time on 7/16 when Lee was busy going through calling people.

Interesting...

First sign of Casey being dropped off @ G&C's 7/16AM is @ 6:48AM whence Casey takes up the text-fest w/ Tony.

THEN

It appears Casey begins trying to reach Brittany...reaching Brittany is Casey's highest priority after establishing a dialogue w/ Tony :eek: There is NO other cell contact between the two for the entire period 6/1-7/15.

First - a <1min call to Brittany @ 6:53AM...which I'm guessing went to vmail.
Then - a text message @ 9:42AM
Finally - Brittany responds @ 11:29AM and they have a text convo 'till 12:14PM just before Sgt. Allen picks Casey up to goto Universal

Here's the entire cell dialog between the two of them.


Date DOW Time Type From To Call Duration (min)
7/16/08 WED 6:53:49 AM OUTGOING CALL Casey Anthony Casey Anthony 1
7/16/08 WED 9:42:00 AM OUTGOING TEXT Casey Anthony Brittany Schieber
7/16/08 WED 11:27:55 AM INCOMING TEXT Brittany Schieber Casey Anthony
7/16/08 WED 11:28:25 AM OUTGOING TEXT Casey Anthony Brittany Schieber
7/16/08 WED 11:29:05 AM INCOMING TEXT Brittany Schieber Casey Anthony
7/16/08 WED 11:30:28 AM OUTGOING TEXT Casey Anthony Brittany Schieber
7/16/08 WED 11:30:39 AM OUTGOING TEXT Casey Anthony Brittany Schieber
7/16/08 WED 11:31:44 AM INCOMING TEXT Brittany Schieber Casey Anthony
7/16/08 WED 11:36:44 AM OUTGOING TEXT Casey Anthony Brittany Schieber
7/16/08 WED 11:38:11 AM INCOMING TEXT Brittany Schieber Casey Anthony
7/16/08 WED 11:38:42 AM OUTGOING TEXT Casey Anthony Brittany Schieber
7/16/08 WED 11:40:12 AM INCOMING TEXT Brittany Schieber Casey Anthony
7/16/08 WED 12:12:59 PM INCOMING TEXT Brittany Schieber Casey Anthony
7/16/08 WED 12:13:51 PM OUTGOING TEXT Casey Anthony Brittany Schieber
7/16/08 WED 12:14:40 PM INCOMING TEXT Brittany Schieber Casey Anthony

Brittany stated in the NG interview that Cindy's visit was in the "morning" of 7/16. Note that Brittany made no mention of a vmail to either LE in her interview, or to NG. Due to the texting back'n forth w/ Tony IMHO this is Casey's use of the phone...not Lee's during this timeframe. Would have to look @ the text messages w/ Tony that were released from that morning to confirm, IIRC, they provided the timestamps & content in the released docs.

Dunno what time Lee's calls to Brittany were that morning, but, perhaps Lee connecting the dots of "Juliette" = "Brittany" is what compelled Cindy's walk down the street that morning...which it seems may have been before 11:27AM 7/16. Would hafta check the G&C home phone records to see if Lee used it to call Brittany. If he used his own cell phone, well, we don't have those records.

FWIW...it seems Casey's next priority - behind reaching Brittany - was reaching Ryan. Immediately after finishing the 2hr call w/ Tony Casey placed a call to Ryan.

ETA: BeanE provided the text messages to Brittany below. :blowkiss:

BondJamesBond
12-21-2009, 09:58 PM
Will also post on the Pontiac sealing thread...but, unless Casey was multi-tasking :rolleyes: the Pontiac was pretty safe from her interests for a block of just over 2hrs on the morning of 7/16.

Casey was on the phone w/ Tony for a marathon call 7:27AM-9:29AM :rolleyes:

She was basically in continuous text mode the rest of the time.

Here are the times when she wasn't engaged in some activity w/ her phone for >5 mins


Date DOW Time Type From To Call Duration (min) Time to Next Event (min)

9:46:44 AM OUTGOING TEXT Casey Anthony Jamie Realander 5
9:55:06 AM INCOMING TEXT Jamie Realander Casey Anthony 7
10:04:30 AM INCOMING TEXT Jesse Grund Casey Anthony 11
10:21:04 AM OUTGOING TEXT Casey Anthony Jesse Grund 21
11:12:04 AM OUTGOING TEXT Casey Anthony Jenna Prentice 5
11:44:50 AM INCOMING CALL Yuri Melich Casey Anthony 0 9
11:53:24 AM INCOMING CALL Mark Hawkins Casey Anthony 4 10
12:06:33 PM INCOMING TEXT MySpace Alert 1697720 Casey Anthony 6
12:14:40 PM INCOMING TEXT Brittany Schieber Casey Anthony 26

...and of course by 12:30PM she was gonzo w/ Sgt. Allen.

So...IF Cindy walked down to talk to Brittany <11:27AM and Casey was tied up on the phone def'n 'till 9:29AM...it appears to me the biggest "risk" to the Pontiac might've been @ 10:21AM's 21 minute period of cell inactivity...perhaps that was Casey's opportunity to shower that morning. One hopes. And, of course, George's whereabouts @ the time would have to be accounted.

BondJamesBond
12-22-2009, 07:16 AM
Perhaps Cindy's cell activity 7/16 suggests a few things...


Date Time From To Duration (min)
7/16/2008 8:55 AM Cindy Ryan 5
7/16/2008 9:46 AM Debbie Cindy 8
7/16/2008 10:18 AM Cindy Yuri 3
7/16/2008 11:36 AM Cindy George 2
7/16/2008 12:48 PM Cindy Yuri 4
7/16/2008 1:42 PM Cindy (407)254-7222 2

:waitasec: Cindy's first cell call of the day was to Ryan. Was Cindy checking out a story Casey told her? Casey's 3rd priority was to call Ryan after reaching Tony and trying to reach Brittany that morning.

:) Cindy's second cell call of the day was from Debbie. Logical follow-up call from her supervisor to check on things.

:waitasec: Cindy's third cell call of the day was to Yuri. More than a few possibilities.

:waitasec: Cindy's fourth cell call of the day was to George. OK...this one is curious. Does this tell us George and/or Cindy were outta the house? (e.g. Cindy @ Brittany's?, George @ ?) Perhaps Cindy called George on her way back/after visiting Brittany to give him the scoop (that she didn't learn anything) from their conversation. Thinking Cindy's visit was before 11:27AM since that is the time Brittany finally replied to Casey via text...maybe something along the lines of..."WTF is going on?! Casey. Your Mom was just down here..." and they carried on for another 20 mins or so...which seems unlikely (not impossible) if Cindy was sitting there.

Need to look @ the home phone & George's cell phone records.

:waitasec: Cindy's fifth cell call of the day was to Yuri. Perhaps a, "What's gonna happen to Casey now that Sgt. Allen picked her up?" call...or...regarding the Pontiac.

Absence of calls to Lee. IIRC, Lee stayed around futzing w/ the computer to set-up the CayleeIsMissing website, etc. Need to check computer forensics, etc.

BeanE
12-22-2009, 10:43 AM
There is NO other cell contact between the two for the entire period 6/1-7/15.

snip

Although Brittany DID give her phone to LE...so AFAIK...the text messages between Brittany & Casey 7/16AM are another piece of evidence that has not been released

text messages july 16 pdf page 1
text messages july 7 pdf page 2
myspace messages june 9 to june 25 pdf page 3

http://cayleeanthony.files.wordpress.com/2008/09/brittany-schieber-7-24.pdf

BeanE
12-22-2009, 10:48 AM
When Lee went to the garage, the garage door was open.


Just read in Cindy's state depo that she had the garage door open and was going in and out through it while Lee was talking to KC in KC's room.

Closed the window with the doc and didn't save the url first. Sorry.

BondJamesBond
12-22-2009, 12:30 PM
My Christmas List:

Statements, evidence reports, any kind of documents written by deputies/first responding officers:
Rendon Fletcher
Ryan Williams
Robert Salamat
Reggie Hosey

BBM

Santa came early courtesy of Muzikman re: narrative from Fletcher...pg 2788

BeanE
12-22-2009, 02:22 PM
BBM

Santa came early courtesy of Muzikman re: narrative from Fletcher...pg 2788

Thank you, Bond and Muzikman.

:blowkiss:

BondJamesBond
12-22-2009, 04:28 PM
http://www.docstoc.com/docs/4320677/Casey-Anthony-first-set-of-documents-released

Charity Beasley's report
Sealed & impounded Pontiac
beginning on docstoc page 179, handwritten page 292

Lee Anthony handwritten statement pdf page 35
7/15 22:16 10:16pm Taken by Ryan Eberlin

George Anthony handwritten statement pdf page 39
7/15 22:16 10:16pm Taken by Adriana Acevedo

Casey Anthony handwritten statement pdf page 31
7/16 01:05 1:05am Taken by Ryan Eberlin

George Anthony verbal okay to take Pontiac pdf page 41
7/16 9:30pm signed by Awilda Torres-McBryde

Jesse Grund handwritten statement pdf page 43
Jesse got a call from friend Jeff 7/16 00:05 12:05am saying Jeff got a call from a deputy from KC's phone number
Jesse called KC on her phone and got Reggie Hosey

Sawgrass Apts Amanda Macklin statement pdf page 60
Amanda Macklin arrived at Sawgrass for work 7/16 at 8:45am. Yuri talked to her then

Yuri interview with KC at house pdf page 71
Recorded interview 7/16 04:11 4:11am
Yuri read KC's written statement and had a verbal interview with her prior to this recorded interview

Casey Anthony arrest affidavit pdf page 2
Filled out 7/16 at 20:09 8:09pm by Yuri Melich
Date/time of Casey Anthony's arrest 7/16 16:33 4:33pm

Adding...

Cindy Anthony handwritten statement pdf pages 34-35 (Lee pg 32)
7/15 22:11 10:11PM Taken by Adriana Acevedo

I'm going to suggest below that the LEO fills-in the time when the statement is finished, based on Lee's activity.

Just getting info down in quite a random manner, :rolleyes:. FWIW...food for thought...mistakes for correcting later :)

Google Maps drive time from G&C's to Sawgrass ranges 13-17 mins depending on the route chosen. So...when D/S Acevedo made a round trip w/ Casey that carved out a minimum of 30 mins that Casey was not @ G&C's after LE's arrival and before Casey's statement was given @ 01:05 7/16.

So...depending on when statements are time stamped...since we know D/S Acevedo drove Casey to Sawgrass we know it had to be >10:16PM since Acevedo took G's statement. That would all work for Casey getting back to G&C's before Lee left ~11:50PM. IOW...earliest Casey could've been back would be ~10:50PM. I know...Captain Obvious @ work here. :bang:

Per JWG's 7/15 timeline (Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Ping Map for July 15, 2008 - Discuss that day only) computer forensics support Lee being on the computer 10:15PM - 11:50PM.

Since Lee's statement is stamped 10:16PM...that suggests the LE is writing the time down upon completion.
That would also suggest Lee's time w/ Casey in the garage would've been almost immediately after LE arrived ~9:55PM so they could get Cindy's statement finished 10:11PM, IIRC, they were screaming @ each other.


Since Lee & George statements are stamped at the same time Eberlin signed Lee's statement and D/S Avecedo signed Cindy's...one scenario would be that...

Avecedo sent Casey away from Cindy and got Cindy started on her statement first...finishing @ 10:11PM, Avecedo signed.
Casey chose to be in the garage...as LE was focused on Cindy drama (understandable)
Eberlin was responsible for Lee...got him started or sent him away so Eberlin & Avecedo could focus on G&C.
Lee sought out Casey before or after he wrote his statement...while George started his statement
Lee came back into the house before George finished and Eberlin got Lee started or took his finished statement.
Lee and George finished their statements at about the same time. They gave them to Eberlin & Avecedo respectively to date & sign and Lee went onto the computer
Casey in the garage for at least a portion of this time after Lee went back in. Unclear what time LEO started getting her story.
Appears that getting Cindy calm & getting her statement took first priority...I can imagine she was hysterical as we heard on the 3rd 911 and Debbie attested on her 10:28PM call.

JBean
12-22-2009, 09:55 PM
Oh hey wasn't Acevedo one of the same officers involved in the discovery of the remains? or one of Kronk's reports or something?

BeanE
12-22-2009, 10:23 PM
Oh hey wasn't Acevedo one of the same officers involved in the discovery of the remains? or one of Kronk's reports or something?

Yes.

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/5232618/Casey-Anthony-Adriana-Acevedo-Interview


She also went to high school with Lee.

BeanE
12-22-2009, 10:42 PM
Nice work, Bond.

Lee says he got Amy's number from Cindy & called her to get Tony's number, then found KC in the garage, KC tells him about laptop/cell at Tony's, then he calls Tony to tell him he's coming for the laptop/cell. This doesn't make sense to me.

Why would he get Amy's number for the purpose of getting Tony's number if he hadn't yet had KC tell him about the laptop/cell?

There's something out of whack in his sequence of events - understandable - he was stressed. I believe him about the events that happened - just question his sequence.

I think he may have been filling out his statement when he lost track of where KC was. Then when done with his statement, found her in garage & talked to her, then got Amy's number from Cindy (she'd have been calmer & easier to get the number from by that time prolly), then called Tony.

ETA: I vote for LE time stamping witness statements when they're finished. Makes them all official like. But I don't have a clue really. :-)

Woe.be.gone
12-22-2009, 11:55 PM
Movements of LE & KC

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/4320677/Casey-Anthony-first-set-of-documents-released

begin pdf page 3

KC rode with Yuri and Deputy Sheriff to 'old folks home' Glenwood & Robinson, then Sawgrass, then Crossings at Conway town homes (Zanny's mother's home). Yuri then took KC home to Hopespring.

Yuri then talked with George who said KC was holding back info and that he and Cindy fear something had happened to Caylee.

Yuri then met with John Allen, then back to Sawgrass, then Universal

John Allen and Appie Wells went to Hopespring to get Kc, then to Universal with her

Yuri took KC to central operations, where KC was arrested, and then taken to the OC jail

BBM and snipped bm

Everytime I read about the sequence of the drive KC took Yuri on, I think about CA's day on June 15, 2008. She left Hopespring Dr. with Caylee and went to the Old Folk's Home to visit her father. Then CA went with Caylee to her mother's house. KC took Yuri by SG to symbolize the "nanny" as the one who was responsible for Caylee's care that day. We all know there wasn't a "nanny" but that CA cared for Caylee when KC wasn't caring for her the bulk of the time. Also CA claimed that she went to Universal looking for KC but KC wasn't there.
I can't get it out of my mind that CA tried to back away from the date of June 15 which was a day that placed her firmly in the care of Caylee to include picture evidence. Can someone please tell me why it is not possible that harm came to Caylee while under CA's care. I know that people say that KC would not take the blame for her mother but that's an opinion. KC stated that she fears CA the most out of all people. Why? What is that comment about? Also I know that GA says he saw KC and Caylee leave the morning of June 16 but we know that his story has changed and could be based on the week before as they originally all agreed upon the date of June 8 as having been the day they last saw Caylee.

I feel like I need to apologize for butting in here with an adverse angle regarding who may be ultimately responsible for Caylee's death but I can't let it go from my mind as a possibility of what may have happened and want/need proof that it didn't happen that way.

Other than the idea that nobody thinks that KC would cover for anybody else, why could it not have happened the way I describe above? Would LE have considered this possibility and outruled it? The weirder CA acted, the more I distrusted her. She walked out when they confirmed the death penalty because she has told KC that she could never be convicted because they know KC is innocent because CA is guilty. A possibility imo. Also this would explain why the family does not visit KC. Would you visit your daughter if you were causing her to sit in your place even for a month or two? Now it has been how long?

Maybe KC will tell an alternate story. I hope LE has concrete evidence or a testimony of some sort as to what really went down the day Caylee died or I'll always have my doubts about KC's parents largely because of their own behavior, their lies and their withholding of evidence that they have done.

Consider how easy it is for CA to lie and twist things and blame others without batting an eyelash. She never listens to the logic of others. It's her way or the highway. People accuse KC of showing no remorse but I can't say that I've ever witnessed any true grieving coming from CA either. If it were me, I know I would have broken down and shown some raw emotion many times over by now. I don't see any of that coming from any of them.

BondJamesBond
12-23-2009, 03:48 PM
Nice work, Bond.

Lee says he got Amy's number from Cindy & called her to get Tony's number, then found KC in the garage, KC tells him about laptop/cell at Tony's, then he calls Tony to tell him he's coming for the laptop/cell. This doesn't make sense to me.

Why would he get Amy's number for the purpose of getting Tony's number if he hadn't yet had KC tell him about the laptop/cell?

There's something out of whack in his sequence of events - understandable - he was stressed. I believe him about the events that happened - just question his sequence.

I think he may have been filling out his statement when he lost track of where KC was. Then when done with his statement, found her in garage & talked to her, then got Amy's number from Cindy (she'd have been calmer & easier to get the number from by that time prolly), then called Tony.

ETA: I vote for LE time stamping witness statements when they're finished. Makes them all official like. But I don't have a clue really. :-)

Interesting observations, BeanE.

I agree...makes more sense that Lee & Casey talked first, THEN Lee got the number. However, I'd suggest he had to get the number from Cindy - not because she was calmer, cause she was still upset 10:28PM talking to Debbie - but because Cindy had the # from earlier call to Amy and because, based on the first calls home form jail to get Tony's #, Casey didn't know the #'s that were programmed into her phone from memory (I don't either :bang:)

Also hafta think about the timing of LE picking up the cell @ Tony's. If Casey was sending Lee after it...she either thought Lee would beat them there (unlikely IMHO) or she didn't know LE was going after it...or she hadn't talked to LE about it yet. IIRC it was in Fletcher's report that Casey indicated Caylee had called her ~noon. Perhaps that conversation happened after Lee & Casey spoke...and Fletcher acted on the obvious to get the phone picked up...eh?

BeanE
12-23-2009, 04:43 PM
Interesting observations, BeanE.

I agree...makes more sense that Lee & Casey talked first, THEN Lee got the number. However, I'd suggest he had to get the number from Cindy - not because she was calmer, cause she was still upset 10:28PM talking to Debbie - but because Cindy had the # from earlier call to Amy and because, based on the first calls home form jail to get Tony's #, Casey didn't know the #'s that were programmed into her phone from memory (I don't either :bang:)

Also hafta think about the timing of LE picking up the cell @ Tony's. If Casey was sending Lee after it...she either thought Lee would beat them there (unlikely IMHO) or she didn't know LE was going after it...or she hadn't talked to LE about it yet. IIRC it was in Fletcher's report that Casey indicated Caylee had called her ~noon. Perhaps that conversation happened after Lee & Casey spoke...and Fletcher acted on the obvious to get the phone picked up...eh?

Argh! I forgot about Cindy still being upset at 10:28. Was thinking she calmed down after being separated from KC but you're right - she was still on overload.

Fletcher was at Sawgrass w/KC & Acevedo then KC & Acevedo left. He hung out at Sawgrass for a few, then maybe swung by Tony's to pick up the cell and was back at Hopespring by midnight per Jesse's noted calls then? Cindy told Debbie at 10:28 that LE was on the scene talking with KC. So Fletcher heads to Sawgrass maybe 10:30 or so and back by midnight. Take out drive time on the far end. Take out Sawgrass drive time on the front end. He's at Tony's maybe around 11 to 11:30? Does that work?

ETA: Well, Lee says LE got the phone about 11:

LA: I was never, I never held anything back from them. Because I had actually originally offered to go get the cell phone. And they had went prior to, I want to say about eleven o'clock and returned with the cell phone and started calling all the contacts.

BondJamesBond
12-23-2009, 05:52 PM
Argh! I forgot about Cindy still being upset at 10:28. Was thinking she calmed down after being separated from KC but you're right - she was still on overload.

Fletcher was at Sawgrass w/KC & Acevedo then KC & Acevedo left. He hung out at Sawgrass for a few, then maybe swung by Tony's to pick up the cell and was back at Hopespring by midnight per Jesse's noted calls then? Cindy told Debbie at 10:28 that LE was on the scene talking with KC. So Fletcher heads to Sawgrass maybe 10:30 or so and back by midnight. Take out drive time on the far end. Take out Sawgrass drive time on the front end. He's at Tony's maybe around 11 to 11:30? Does that work?

ETA: Well, Lee says LE got the phone about 11:

LA: I was never, I never held anything back from them. Because I had actually originally offered to go get the cell phone. And they had went prior to, I want to say about eleven o'clock and returned with the cell phone and started calling all the contacts.

I'm looking @ Tony's cell records now. Some interesting things there to shed some light...and maybe throw another wrinkle into things ;)

Looks like LE had the phone <10:28PM @ Tony's, def'n after 10:07PM. And the phone was back @ G&C's <11:55PM.

Here's something intriguing. There were 3 calls from Lee's cell to Tony's cell 7/15.


9:54PM
10:25PM
10:32PM


Notice anything? ;)

More later.

BeanE
12-25-2009, 02:43 PM
LE says Lee went to Tony's at 2. George says Lee went to Tony's at 1 or 2.

George's OCSO Interview of Aug 4 2008

docstoc page 41

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/2419801/Casey-Anthony-George-Anthony-Transcript-4-Aug08

AZlawyer
12-25-2009, 05:48 PM
Perhaps Cindy's cell activity 7/16 suggests a few things...


Date Time From To Duration (min)
7/16/2008 8:55 AM Cindy Ryan 5
7/16/2008 9:46 AM Debbie Cindy 8
7/16/2008 10:18 AM Cindy Yuri 3
7/16/2008 11:36 AM Cindy George 2
7/16/2008 12:48 PM Cindy Yuri 4
7/16/2008 1:42 PM Cindy (407)254-7222 2

:waitasec: Cindy's first cell call of the day was to Ryan. Was Cindy checking out a story Casey told her? Casey's 3rd priority was to call Ryan after reaching Tony and trying to reach Brittany that morning.

:) Cindy's second cell call of the day was from Debbie. Logical follow-up call from her supervisor to check on things.

:waitasec: Cindy's third cell call of the day was to Yuri. More than a few possibilities.

:waitasec: Cindy's fourth cell call of the day was to George. OK...this one is curious. Does this tell us George and/or Cindy were outta the house? (e.g. Cindy @ Brittany's?, George @ ?) Perhaps Cindy called George on her way back/after visiting Brittany to give him the scoop (that she didn't learn anything) from their conversation. Thinking Cindy's visit was before 11:27AM since that is the time Brittany finally replied to Casey via text...maybe something along the lines of..."WTF is going on?! Casey. Your Mom was just down here..." and they carried on for another 20 mins or so...which seems unlikely (not impossible) if Cindy was sitting there.

Need to look @ the home phone & George's cell phone records.

:waitasec: Cindy's fifth cell call of the day was to Yuri. Perhaps a, "What's gonna happen to Casey now that Sgt. Allen picked her up?" call...or...regarding the Pontiac.

Absence of calls to Lee. IIRC, Lee stayed around futzing w/ the computer to set-up the CayleeIsMissing website, etc. Need to check computer forensics, etc.

I think George was very likely not at home when Cindy called his cell at 11:36 am on the 16th. George's cell records show he checked his messages at 11:38 am (presumably that was Cindy's call) and then immediately (still 11:38 am) called the Anthony home phone for 2 minutes. So I assume he was not at home at that time. And probably Cindy wasn't home either, or he would just have called her back on her cell. :waitasec: Which suggests he was calling Casey or Lee at the house in response to something Cindy said in her message.

George's Epass records show he was on the road just before noon on the 16th, taking the route that I believe we previously identified was his route to his brand-new job.

http://websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2907723&postcount=16

suepitzl
12-26-2009, 10:53 AM
[QUOTE=BondJamesBond;4597819]I'm looking @ Tony's cell records now. Some interesting things there to shed some light...and maybe throw another wrinkle into things ;)

Looks like LE had the phone <10:28PM @ Tony's, def'n after 10:07PM. And the phone was back @ G&C's <11:55PM.

Here's something intriguing. There were 3 calls from Lee's cell to Tony's cell 7/15.


9:54PM
10:25PM
10:32PM



It was probably KC using Lee's phone to call Tony

BeanE
12-26-2009, 01:56 PM
I'm looking @ Tony's cell records now. Some interesting things there to shed some light...and maybe throw another wrinkle into things ;)

Looks like LE had the phone <10:28PM @ Tony's, def'n after 10:07PM. And the phone was back @ G&C's <11:55PM.

Here's something intriguing. There were 3 calls from Lee's cell to Tony's cell 7/15.


9:54PM
10:25PM
10:32PM


Notice anything? ;)

More later.

So... after whispering with KC in the bedroom, being told by KC that ZFG had kidnapped Caylee, what does brother Lee do? Well, with his great concern about Caylee being kidnapped by the nanny... the *only* thing he writes down is Tony's name & address, and before/as the very first deputies arrive, he calls Tony to get the laptop.

How was that helping to get Caylee away from the evil kidnapper nanny?

Those whispers in the bedroom have always bothered me tremendously... actually more than the whispers in the garage...

Why, upon finding out that his niece had been kidnapped by the evil nanny, was the first phone number he asked Cindy for, that of Tony? Why didn't he ask CA for ZFG's phone number and address? She had it - what she thought was it - she gave it to the deputy when the deputy asked for it.

Amazing that the deputies didn't have to hold Lee back from storming over to the address that CA had for ZFG.

Whisper whisper... first priority: get the laptop & cell from Tony's... the evil ZFG kidnapper nanny? Not so important...

BeanE
12-26-2009, 02:07 PM
[QUOTE=BondJamesBond;4597819]I'm looking @ Tony's cell records now. Some interesting things there to shed some light...and maybe throw another wrinkle into things ;)

Looks like LE had the phone <10:28PM @ Tony's, def'n after 10:07PM. And the phone was back @ G&C's <11:55PM.

Here's something intriguing. There were 3 calls from Lee's cell to Tony's cell 7/15.


9:54PM
10:25PM
10:32PM



It was probably KC using Lee's phone to call Tony

This could be as well if KC grabbed Lee's phone when Lee went to the kitchen to get the pad of paper. But I don't think KC had Tony's # memorized per the first jail phone call. Which would mean that she or Lee called Amy to get Tony's phone # before this?

Do we have a call to Amy prior to the 9:54 call to Tony?

aafromaa
12-26-2009, 08:32 PM
[quote=suepitzl;4603647]

This could be as well if KC grabbed Lee's phone when Lee went to the kitchen to get the pad of paper. But I don't think KC had Tony's # memorized per the first jail phone call. Which would mean that she or Lee called Amy to get Tony's phone # before this?

Do we have a call to Amy prior to the 9:54 call to Tony?
I'm pretty sure the call was placed by LA not KC. IIRC, TL told LE that LA called him around 9 or 9:30 that night and told him that Caylee had been missing for a month. Looks like TL was off a little in his timeline but one minute he's chillin' at home with his girlfriend and playing video games with his buddy waiting for the game to start - then AH & CA are at the door - then KC leaves with them - then he finds out from AH that KC has cleaned out her checking account - then he finds out his girlfriend's daughter has been missing for a month and she never said a word. All of this within about 2 or 3 hours - no wonder he was off on the time when he told LE that LA called between 9 and 9:30 when the first call was actually 9:54.

While I am satisfied that this call was placed by LA to TL, I am not sure how he got the number. It is possible that one of the A's spoke to AH after she spoke to TL on KCs phone and likely that they had exchanged #s during that conversation but I'm guessing that TL's conversation with AH took place very near the same time as LA's call to TL - she had just learned about the money missing from her checking account. So was it just a coincidence that one of the A's spoke to AH shortly after TL called her and gave her his number? Did AH call one of the A's to say, here's TL's number if you need it? Remember, TL found out the story about ZFG taking Caylee from LA's 1st call not from his conversation with AH - she didn't know that part of the story yet so why would she call the A's to provide TL's phone number? And if she did, why didn't they tell her about the ZFG story then? IIRC, it was around 11pm when CA called AH & told her about the ZFG story. Of course, AH's timeline could have been off that evening as well but if she really didn't learn the ZFG story until an hour after LAs 1st call to TL then I don't think that's where LA got TLs number.

BeanE
12-26-2009, 08:42 PM
[quote=BeanE;4603888]
I'm pretty sure the call was placed by LA not KC. IIRC, TL told LE that LA called him around 9 or 9:30 that night and told him that Caylee had been missing for a month. Looks like TL was off a little in his timeline but one minute he's chillin' at home with his girlfriend and playing video games with his buddy waiting for the game to start - then AH & CA are at the door - then KC leaves with them - then he finds out from AH that KC has cleaned out her checking account - then he finds out his girlfriend's daughter has been missing for a month and she never said a word. All of this within about 2 or 3 hours - no wonder he was off on the time when he told LE that LA called between 9 and 9:30 when the first call was actually 9:54.

While I am satisfied that this call was placed by LA to TL, I am not sure how he got the number. It is possible that one of the A's spoke to AH after she spoke to TL on KCs phone and likely that they had exchanged #s during that conversation but I'm guessing that TL's conversation with AH took place very near the same time as LA's call to TL - she had just learned about the money missing from her checking account. So was it just a coincidence that one of the A's spoke to AH shortly after TL called her and gave her his number? Did AH call one of the A's to say, here's TL's number if you need it? Remember, TL found out the story about ZFG taking Caylee from LA's 1st call not from his conversation with AH - she didn't know that part of the story yet so why would she call the A's to provide TL's phone number? And if she did, why didn't they tell her about the ZFG story then? IIRC, it was around 11pm when CA called AH & told her about the ZFG story. Of course, AH's timeline could have been off that evening as well but if she really didn't learn the ZFG story until an hour after LAs 1st call to TL then I don't think that's where LA got TLs number.

I think it was Lee calling Tony as well.

Lee claims he got Tony's # from Amy after getting Amy's # from Cindy. Link in my previous posts in this thread, as well as Lee's account(s) of the sequence(s) of events.

BeanE
12-26-2009, 08:54 PM
Tony's OCSO interview

http://www.wftv.com/download/2008/0923/17540075.pdf

8 or a little after, he heard KC's phone ring & realized her cell was still at his place. He called Amy. Amy told him about her $$ missing. No mention of Caylee.

20 minutes to a half hour later (approx 8:30) Lee calls him. Tells him about Caylee.

Doesn't mention that Lee was (per Lee's account) coming for KC's laptop & cell.

BondJamesBond
12-27-2009, 03:27 AM
Was the 16th the day George had an early...Noontime... meeting that Cindy urged him to keep (her bond hearing testimony)?

Is my memory betraying me?

BondJamesBond
12-29-2009, 08:56 PM
FWIW...Yuri's call pattern w/ George, Cindy & Casey 7/16...and some speculation regarding the events/subject of the calls. IIRC, we have Yuri contacting George about coming to get the Pontiac via phone call.


7/16/2008 10:18 AM Cindy called Yuri 3 mins Speculate this may have had something to do with going down to talk w/ Brittany that morning.

7/16/2008 11:30 AM Yuri called Casey 1.3 mins to voicemail :rolleyes: Speculate this was to confirm Casey's employment info as Yuri visited w/ Universal and found no record of Casey currently employed there.

7/16/2008 11:30 AM Casey called (321)###-9765 5 mins Note**: Speculate this is one of the LEO/detectives #'s :detective: and Casey provided the "Tom Manley" supervisor BS, etc.

7/16/2008 11:44 AM Yuri called Casey 0.1 mins to voicemail :rolleyes: Speculate this was follow-up from the dead-end @ Universal for current employment records.

7/16/2008 11:54 AM Yuri called George 2 mins Speculate this is the call during which Yuri told George Casey would likely be arrested, and seems it may've been the call they may have discussed picking up the car.

7/16/2008 12:48 PM Cindy called Yuri 4 mins Speculate this was follow-up Q's from Cindy since Sgt. Allen had just picked Casey up to goto Universal. W/o Yuri's records we don't know if they spoke or it went to vmail.

7/16/2008 1:45 PM Cindy called Yuri 2 mins Speculate this was more Q's from Cindy. IIRC, Yuri commented during some interviews about Cindy calling him several times...perhaps this was one of those calls.

7/16/2008 2:05 PM Cindy called Yuri 5 mins Speculate this was yet another set of Q's from Cindy per above.

**This (321)###-9765 number was called only 2x by Casey's phone. The first was @ 12:02 AM as the 2nd number called (1st was to Amy) when Casey's phone was brought back to Hopespring by LE. This number was called several times by Tony's cell 7/15-7/16PM and I am using the first call to this number from Tony @ 7/15 10:28PM as the indication that LE had arrived @ Tony's apt. and picked up the phone <10:28PM.

I did this rather quickly...so, wouldn't be surprised to find some oversights/errors on my part. Without the home phone records 7/15-7/16 it is difficult to get a complete picture...

BondJamesBond
12-29-2009, 09:21 PM
So... after whispering with KC in the bedroom, being told by KC that ZFG had kidnapped Caylee, what does brother Lee do? Well, with his great concern about Caylee being kidnapped by the nanny... the *only* thing he writes down is Tony's name & address, and before/as the very first deputies arrive, he calls Tony to get the laptop.

How was that helping to get Caylee away from the evil kidnapper nanny?

Those whispers in the bedroom have always bothered me tremendously... actually more than the whispers in the garage...

Why, upon finding out that his niece had been kidnapped by the evil nanny, was the first phone number he asked Cindy for, that of Tony? Why didn't he ask CA for ZFG's phone number and address? She had it - what she thought was it - she gave it to the deputy when the deputy asked for it.

Amazing that the deputies didn't have to hold Lee back from storming over to the address that CA had for ZFG.

Whisper whisper... first priority: get the laptop & cell from Tony's... the evil ZFG kidnapper nanny? Not so important...



I'm pretty sure the call was placed by LA not KC. IIRC, TL told LE that LA called him around 9 or 9:30 that night and told him that Caylee had been missing for a month. Looks like TL was off a little in his timeline but one minute he's chillin' at home with his girlfriend and playing video games with his buddy waiting for the game to start - then AH & CA are at the door - then KC leaves with them - then he finds out from AH that KC has cleaned out her checking account - then he finds out his girlfriend's daughter has been missing for a month and she never said a word. All of this within about 2 or 3 hours - no wonder he was off on the time when he told LE that LA called between 9 and 9:30 when the first call was actually 9:54.

While I am satisfied that this call was placed by LA to TL, I am not sure how he got the number. It is possible that one of the A's spoke to AH after she spoke to TL on KCs phone and likely that they had exchanged #s during that conversation but I'm guessing that TL's conversation with AH took place very near the same time as LA's call to TL - she had just learned about the money missing from her checking account. So was it just a coincidence that one of the A's spoke to AH shortly after TL called her and gave her his number? Did AH call one of the A's to say, here's TL's number if you need it? Remember, TL found out the story about ZFG taking Caylee from LA's 1st call not from his conversation with AH - she didn't know that part of the story yet so why would she call the A's to provide TL's phone number? And if she did, why didn't they tell her about the ZFG story then? IIRC, it was around 11pm when CA called AH & told her about the ZFG story. Of course, AH's timeline could have been off that evening as well but if she really didn't learn the ZFG story until an hour after LAs 1st call to TL then I don't think that's where LA got TLs number.

Check my timing, but, even though we don't have Tony or Amy's cell records...from above timing of a 9:54PM call to Tony and IIRC 9:41PM 3rd call to 911 (duration??) - when we know George walked in while Cindy was still on the phone - it seems Lee had to be on the phone w/ Amy to get Tony's number between the 3rd 911 call and before LE arrived. :waitasec:

Given that timing, BeanE, IMHO, perhaps it underscores the point you've been making about Lee's priorities to get the cell & laptop vs. Caylee...and perhaps some direction from Casey to that end. :waitasec: IIRC, we only heard the "Caylee called today" story from LEO report - not Lee. So...jus' sayin' that would've been a 'legit' reason for Lee to press to get the phone IYKWIM. But, AFAIK, we have no reason to believe he had that angle.

FWIW...

Easiest thing would've been to grab Cindy's phone and view recently dialed #'s to get Amy's # :twocents:

BeanE
12-29-2009, 10:50 PM
Check my timing, but, even though we don't have Tony or Amy's cell records...from above timing of a 9:54PM call to Tony and IIRC 9:41PM 3rd call to 911 (duration??) - when we know George walked in while Cindy was still on the phone - it seems Lee had to be on the phone w/ Amy to get Tony's number between the 3rd 911 call and before LE arrived. :waitasec:

Given that timing, BeanE, IMHO, perhaps it underscores the point you've been making about Lee's priorities to get the cell & laptop vs. Caylee...and perhaps some direction from Casey to that end. :waitasec: IIRC, we only heard the "Caylee called today" story from LEO report - not Lee. So...jus' sayin' that would've been a 'legit' reason for Lee to press to get the phone IYKWIM. But, AFAIK, we have no reason to believe he had that angle.

FWIW...

Easiest thing would've been to grab Cindy's phone and view recently dialed #'s to get Amy's # :twocents:

He was a young guy faced with an awful situation. Maybe didn't know wth to do and was grasping at any straw in somewhat of a panic and a compulsion to do *something*. But... I dunno. Seems like a strange priority. And then there's the BSOD.

If he did know about that supposed call from Caylee, the story likely included that it was from a private number. I think he knows phones enough to know that hitting redial on that phone wouldn't have given him the kidnapper. Besides - Cindy had what she thought were ZG's phone # and address right there. And that still doesn't account for why he was after the laptop too.

Just stuff to chew on.

Nice work on those phone calls, Bond. :blowkiss:

Searchfortruth
12-30-2009, 11:22 AM
He was a young guy faced with an awful situation. Maybe didn't know wth to do and was grasping at any straw in somewhat of a panic and a compulsion to do *something*. But... I dunno. Seems like a strange priority. And then there's the BSOD.

If he did know about that supposed call from Caylee, the story likely included that it was from a private number. I think he knows phones enough to know that hitting redial on that phone wouldn't have given him the kidnapper. Besides - Cindy had what she thought were ZG's phone # and address right there. And that still doesn't account for why he was after the laptop too.

Just stuff to chew on.

Nice work on those phone calls, Bond. :blowkiss:As for how Lee got TL's number, didn't Lee state in his LE interview that the first thing he did after hearing the 31 days comment from Casey was write down Tony's address ? Maybe he got the phone number from Casey when he was writing down the address ? Why Lee went straight to Tony's information, I don't know. Maybe Casey had already told him that Zenaida's number had been disconnected and there was no way of reaching her by phone ? Guessing here.

I also wonder if Lee felt the need to pick up the laptop because Casey (while giving them the "story") answered many of his questions with "oh, that information is on the laptop"...like Zenaida's e-mail or whatever lie she was trying to explain away. Maybe Lee gets to the laptop and looks for this vital information, finds it's not there, and we have the BSOD (again guessing on my part).

I think they all figured out pretty early on that Casey's story was not adding up. Then the worry shifted dramatically from the missing child to their soon to be arrested daughter.

AZlawyer
12-30-2009, 07:38 PM
FWIW...Yuri's call pattern w/ George, Cindy & Casey 7/16...and some speculation regarding the events/subject of the calls. IIRC, we have Yuri contacting George about coming to get the Pontiac via phone call.


7/16/2008 10:18 AM Cindy called Yuri 3 mins Speculate this may have had something to do with going down to talk w/ Brittany that morning.

7/16/2008 11:30 AM Yuri called Casey 1.3 mins to voicemail :rolleyes: Speculate this was to confirm Casey's employment info as Yuri visited w/ Universal and found no record of Casey currently employed there.

7/16/2008 11:30 AM Casey called (321)###-9765 5 mins Note**: Speculate this is one of the LEO/detectives #'s :detective: and Casey provided the "Tom Manley" supervisor BS, etc.

7/16/2008 11:44 AM Yuri called Casey 0.1 mins to voicemail :rolleyes: Speculate this was follow-up from the dead-end @ Universal for current employment records.

7/16/2008 11:54 AM Yuri called George 2 mins Speculate this is the call during which Yuri told George Casey would likely be arrested, and seems it may've been the call they may have discussed picking up the car.

7/16/2008 12:48 PM Cindy called Yuri 4 mins Speculate this was follow-up Q's from Cindy since Sgt. Allen had just picked Casey up to goto Universal. W/o Yuri's records we don't know if they spoke or it went to vmail.

7/16/2008 1:45 PM Cindy called Yuri 2 mins Speculate this was more Q's from Cindy. IIRC, Yuri commented during some interviews about Cindy calling him several times...perhaps this was one of those calls.

7/16/2008 2:05 PM Cindy called Yuri 5 mins Speculate this was yet another set of Q's from Cindy per above.

**This (321)###-9765 number was called only 2x by Casey's phone. The first was @ 12:02 AM as the 2nd number called (1st was to Amy) when Casey's phone was brought back to Hopespring by LE. This number was called several times by Tony's cell 7/15-7/16PM and I am using the first call to this number from Tony @ 7/15 10:28PM as the indication that LE had arrived @ Tony's apt. and picked up the phone <10:28PM.

I did this rather quickly...so, wouldn't be surprised to find some oversights/errors on my part. Without the home phone records 7/15-7/16 it is difficult to get a complete picture...

Bond, FYI, the 321-***-9765 number shows up in Casey's BILLING records (as opposed to the cell tower records) as Yuri's regular cell number instead. Maybe just an issue of how the calls were routed some of the time? But in any event, this number appears to connect to Yuri's cell.

BondJamesBond
12-30-2009, 08:43 PM
Bond, FYI, the 321-***-9765 number shows up in Casey's BILLING records (as opposed to the cell tower records) as Yuri's regular cell number instead. Maybe just an issue of how the calls were routed some of the time? But in any event, this number appears to connect to Yuri's cell.

Thanks, AZ.

I'm wondering :waitasec: Perhaps OCSO assigns a cell to the lead of a case in addition to their own personal #.

For example, I'm assuming Sgt. Hosey had the lead on the case before Yuri got involved. And we know Tony called the (321)###-9765 number 3 times before midnight...before Yuri was contacted by Sgt. Hosey.

Calls from Tony's cell to this #:

7/15/2008 10:28:20 PM
7/15/2008 10:33:25 PM
7/15/2008 11:09:20 PM

...and then there's the 12:02 AM call from Casey's phone to this number when it returned to Hopespring.

Yuri was reportedly contacted by Sgt. Hosey @ 00:45 AM 7/16, IIRC.

Just speculating...but if a phone is assigned to the case, then, it would be passed to whomever has the lead to simplify communications as things develop and more information starts coming in from a variety of sources. So...for example...Sgt. Hosey would've passed this one to Yuri in the process of his getting to Hopespring ~04:00 AM 7/16.

BondJamesBond
12-30-2009, 11:33 PM
I think George was very likely not at home when Cindy called his cell at 11:36 am on the 16th. George's cell records show he checked his messages at 11:38 am (presumably that was Cindy's call) and then immediately (still 11:38 am) called the Anthony home phone for 2 minutes. So I assume he was not at home at that time. And probably Cindy wasn't home either, or he would just have called her back on her cell. :waitasec: Which suggests he was calling Casey or Lee at the house in response to something Cindy said in her message.

George's Epass records show he was on the road just before noon on the 16th, taking the route that I believe we previously identified was his route to his brand-new job.

http://websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2907723&postcount=16

Thanks, again, AZ. So...need only to get a Google Maps driving time from Hopespring to the Beline toll and back up from 11:52 AM to get a reasonable estimate for when George left that morning...assuming there were no detours, etc. Looks like it'd be pretty close to 11:36 AM as I believe you suggest. :)

Searchfortruth
12-31-2009, 12:20 AM
Thanks, again, AZ. So...need only to get a Google Maps driving time from Hopespring to the Beline toll and back up from 11:52 AM to get a reasonable estimate for when George left that morning...assuming there were no detours, etc. Looks like it'd be pretty close to 11:38 AM as I believe you suggest. :) I vaguely remember George saying he went to his new place of employment that day to explain there were issues at home. I don't know if he did that to get time off or what. Wish I had a link for this, maybe someone else remembers it too ? I feel sure it was in a LE interview.

BondJamesBond
12-31-2009, 04:19 AM
I vaguely remember George saying he went to his new place of employment that day to explain there were issues at home. I don't know if he did that to get time off or what. Wish I had a link for this, maybe someone else remembers it too ? I feel sure it was in a LE interview.

Thanks, Search. I have a fragment of a memory of Cindy saying that George had an early (e.g. Noontime before starting a 3PM shift) meeting @ his new job and after all of the chaos of the night, she urged him to go...to get away from things. I was thinking Cindy made this statement @ the bond hearing...but I don't particularly trust my memory, and I'm too lazy to go listen to her bond hearing testimony ;)

darnudes
12-31-2009, 09:59 PM
Thanks, Search. I have a fragment of a memory of Cindy saying that George had an early (e.g. Noontime before starting a 3PM shift) meeting @ his new job and after all of the chaos of the night, she urged him to go...to get away from things. I was thinking Cindy made this statement @ the bond hearing...but I don't particularly trust my memory, and I'm too lazy to go listen to her bond hearing testimony ;)

lol, fair enough. I went and listened for you :)

George at the bond hearing stating he left for work as he had an important meeting, Cindy urged him to go and Yuri/one of the detectives called him just before noon to advise they were going to talk to Casey again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xJfZxuKs3Q&feature=related

BondJamesBond
01-02-2010, 03:10 AM
Bringing the following over from the Computer Forensics thread. Thanks, JWG. :)


As I was researching the missing persons website visits on KC's laptop computer, I began to piece together what happened to KC's laptop during the final 24 hours before it was turned over to LE.

Lee arrives at Tony's around midnight, leaving around 2:00AM and arriving back at his parents around 2:25AM (evidence pages 1442 - 1445). While there he sees KC's laptop plugged in and set up on the kitchen counter top. He starts it up but gets the "blue screen of death" indicating the computer was improperly shutdown and data has been lost (page 1478). Lee also states later that, as he is investigating the situation with Caylee after bringing KC's computer back to life, he notices that in KC's Yahoo email account all emails prior to June 15 were deleted (page 1479).

I personally noticed that the internet history before June 27 was deleted, as was July 2 - 9.

Now let's look at the activity...

No activity on July 15 until 8:47 PM, when about 40 seconds worth of AIM activity occurs. My belief is this is when the computer is powered on by Tony, and AIM automatically launches. Nothing happens for 1 1/2 hours.

KC's phone - which is in the possession of Tony, receives texts from Andy F. and Will W., around 9:25. At around 10:05 Tony calls Amy and learns about KC cleaning out her bank account. Tony is probably not emotionally stable at this point.

At 10:15 PM activity resumes. For the next five minutes it looks like there are repeated attempts to log into KC's ATT wireless account, culminating in a visit to the "lost password" page to presumably have a new password sent to her email account. A successful login to Yahoo may have occurred at this time.

Activity resumes again at 10:30 with an attempt to either register with or log into an existing "Lava Life" account. This lasts for about a minute (methinks Tony is looking at the internet history). Attempts are then made to log into Facebook (unsuccessfully).

10:43 PM - a successful attempt to log into myspace is made, although the account is not clear (if I knew the numeric ID for KC I could probably tell). For the next 10 minutes comments and inbox messages are viewed.

10:57 PM - a successful attempt to log into Facebook is made, although the account is not clear. Numerous photos are viewed for the next 3 minutes. Activity stops.

11:15 PM - a return to Facebook with what appears to be a single upload.

11:19 PM - a second attempt to login to the ATT wireless account.

11:23 PM to 11:35 PM - a rapid-fire mixture of myspace and photobucket views. On Photobucket it is images. On myspace it is images and messages.

11:35 PM to 11:50 PM - many, many views of Facebook photos after what appears to be a successful login.

Computer handed over to Lee.

1:40 AM - computer appears to reboot.

2:32 AM - successful login to Yahoo mail. Activity stops at 2:34 (possibly after seeing no email exists).

At 5:09 AM the computer is powered up, but no real activity until 5:18 when the MSN website is brought up. One of the very first things done here is to go to the white pages search off this site and enter "aida" as a first name and "fernandez-gonzalez" as the last name. Lee searches referral sites ussearch.com and reunion.com for ZFG. Activity is very sparse from about 5:25 AM to 1:40 PM.

From 1:40 PM to 2:00 PM or so there are multiple searches on multiple site for combinations of "cheryl davis" "east coast universal" and "battle of the bands" - all of which were figments of KC's imagination. One wonders how he continues believing sis to this day. :waitasec:

After a brief pause of 20 minutes or so, work began on the cayleeismissing, myspace page...Lee's part to understand just what KC was up to.

So...per above...Lee's activity on the CayleeIsMissing site didn't start until later in the day 7/16...a little different than my thinking earlier.

:waitasec: Interesting that the first activity upon returning the laptop to G&C's was to logon to Yahoo mail. While Casey could've given the pwd to Lee, it seems that didn't happen until the laptop was physically in the same location as Casey.

:waitasec: Also, in add'n to the content of the activity per JWG's post above, based on the timing of 5:09-5:25AM...this activity had to be Lee vs. Casey...since Casey and Yuri left after the 04:11AM interview for the ride-around that ended ~<6:48AM.

Pure speculation on my part... but, the last call from Casey's cell before the texting w/ Tony commenced was a call to an unidentified number (407)###-4102 @ 4:57AM. After this call there was a period of 1 hr & 51 mins of inactivity. Perhaps this 4:57AM call coincided with the time Casey & Yuri left the house after their interview was completed (4:57-4:11AM, IIRC, = 46mins...not outta the question). Going w/ this speculation would mean Lee powered up the laptop just a few minutes after LE (i.e. Yuri) left. This might also suggest that Yuri was the last LE presence @ the house 7/16AM.

Finally, JWG indicated the laptop activity was "sparse" after 5:25AM until after Casey was taken to Universal by Allen & Wells. So...it seems reasonable to conclude that Lee was @ G&C's at least until 5:25AM. Why is this relevant? Well...only in an attempt to establish the details of who was w/ Casey @ the house <George left <11:36AM and while Cindy was down the street @ Brittany's. Brittany indicated in the NG interview that Cindy visited her during the morning. And per BeanE's explanation above, Lee had calls w/ Brittany indicating Casey had given him her # as "Julliet"s. Since Casey's first text to Brittany was @ 9:42AM, that suggests to me she had given Lee this story <9:42AM. There was so little time that Casey wasn't on her phone talking to Tony or texting after 6:48AM that it seems possible Casey gave Lee the "Julliet" info before Yuri arrived. It might also seem that the 9:42AM text was prompted by Casey being confronted by Cindy/Lee re: Lee's discovery. Going further out on that limb :poke: that would suggest Cindy's motivation to walk down the street came <9:42AM-10:18AM (call to Yuri perhaps advising Julliet=Brittany)...and that Cindy left Brittany's <11:27AM-11:36AM when Brittany texted Casey back and Cindy called George's cell to advise him of her convo respectively.

While Casey MAY have simply taken a shower @ 10:21AM...the 21 minute period of cell inactivity that followed now bothers me a great deal...as that would have coincided w/ the time that it appears Cindy may have walked down the street, and represented Casey's first opportunity to move around the house/garage more freely. :banghead: IF George left <11:36AM...perhaps he could've been napping per BeanE's suggestion, or even in the shower at this time giving Casey free reign to move something outta the Pontiac to the backyard. I'd like to get more details from JWG on the "sparse" computer activity >5AM...and on both computers. Methinks the lack of computer activity is an indication that Lee had gone home for a few hours before returning to work on the CayleeIsMissing site that afternoon.

OK...not allot new here...much simply restating what BeanE, AZ, JWG, etc. have already suggested...adding a little add'l speculation as food for thought. :waitasec:

JWG
01-02-2010, 12:28 PM
Bringing the following over from the Computer Forensics thread. Thanks, JWG. :)

So...per above...Lee's activity on the CayleeIsMissing site didn't start until later in the day 7/16...a little different than my thinking earlier.

:waitasec: Interesting that the first activity upon returning the laptop to G&C's was to logon to Yahoo mail. While Casey could've given the pwd to Lee, it seems that didn't happen until the laptop was physically in the same location as Casey.

** SNIP **



Well, let me try to straighten the record out some because when I first posted the material Bond referred to, I screwed it up royally. :slap:

The laptop.

This was left at Tony's after Cindy pulled KC out of the apartment earlier that evening. KC generally used Internet Explorer on this computer, although on July 13 she downloaded and began using Safari as well. It appears that Safari was set as her default browser from that point on.

KC clearly tried covering her tracks because the web page history for Internet Explorer is missing, indicating she deleted the history. However, the cookies remain, as does the recent document history which records which files she has created, opened, and saved. Also, her Safari surfing history was preserved, so either she had not figured out how to delete that or just had not gotten around to it.

So from the above it appears that the last recorded activity on the laptop occurred at 5:42 PM on the 15th. Now, this does not mean that KC did not use the computer after that time - she probably did. The last activity recorded is her login to AIM, so she probably began chatting at that point. She may also have done additional surfing on Internet Explorer and simply erased the history. But it does not appear to me that Tony or Lee or anyone else used the laptop.

The desktop.

The information released regarding the desktop is for the user casey. This user account is the one George and Cindy used. KC used the password-protected owner account, and we have not seen information for that account.

The first use of the desktop found on the 15th is at 8:47 PM, and appears to be a login to an AIM account. After that, nothing seems to happen again until 10:14 PM when Yahoo, ATT Wireless, Lavalife, Facebook, etc. sites are visited. This activity continues until 11:50 PM, when Lee leaves for Tony's.

The activity for the 16th looks as follows:

1:40 AM - very brief visit to Yahoo.
2:32 AM to 2:34 AM - Activity on Yahoo.
5:05 AM to 5:25 AM - Various sites visited, searching for ZFG.
8:01 AM to 10:50 AM - Activity centered around AIM. The purpose seems to be chat only. There are gaps in the activity, but that could be due to chatting. Notable gaps are:
8:33 - 8:51
8:54 - 9:21
9:38 - 10:09
10:14 - 10:25
10:25 - 10:35
10:35 - 10:49
The sole blip at 10:25 may be due to someone with the screen name bgamer2000 responding to an earlier chat request. It does not really mean that someone was actively using the computer at that time. The 10:35 activity may be nothing meaningful either.

After 10:49, there is no further activity until 1:38 PM when Lee and Cindy start work on the Caylee is Missing myspace.

HTH

BeanE
01-02-2010, 01:38 PM
But but but... Cindy said KC was on the desktop fervently and feverishly building the Caylee myspace in the AM. Surely she wasn't mistruthafying?

BondJamesBond
01-02-2010, 04:43 PM
But but but... Cindy said KC was on the desktop fervently and feverishly building the Caylee myspace in the AM. Surely she wasn't mistruthafying?

BBM

Actually, BeanE, I believe the correct spelling is mithatrufafyin' as would be properly pronounced by one of the most under-rated supersleuths out there...and, of course, the most wunnerful thing 'bout it...is that he's, "the only one". ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AlGOORD3h1o

BondJamesBond
01-02-2010, 05:06 PM
Well, let me try to straighten the record out some because when I first posted the material Bond referred to, I screwed it up royally. :slap:

The laptop.

This was left at Tony's after Cindy pulled KC out of the apartment earlier that evening. KC generally used Internet Explorer on this computer, although on July 13 she downloaded and began using Safari as well. It appears that Safari was set as her default browser from that point on.

KC clearly tried covering her tracks because the web page history for Internet Explorer is missing, indicating she deleted the history. However, the cookies remain, as does the recent document history which records which files she has created, opened, and saved. Also, her Safari surfing history was preserved, so either she had not figured out how to delete that or just had not gotten around to it.

So from the above it appears that the last recorded activity on the laptop occurred at 5:42 PM on the 15th. Now, this does not mean that KC did not use the computer after that time - she probably did. The last activity recorded is her login to AIM, so she probably began chatting at that point. She may also have done additional surfing on Internet Explorer and simply erased the history. But it does not appear to me that Tony or Lee or anyone else used the laptop.

The desktop.

The information released regarding the desktop is for the user casey. This user account is the one George and Cindy used. KC used the password-protected owner account, and we have not seen information for that account.

The first use of the desktop found on the 15th is at 8:47 PM, and appears to be a login to an AIM account. After that, nothing seems to happen again until 10:14 PM when Yahoo, ATT Wireless, Lavalife, Facebook, etc. sites are visited. This activity continues until 11:50 PM, when Lee leaves for Tony's.

The activity for the 16th looks as follows:

1:40 AM - very brief visit to Yahoo.
2:32 AM to 2:34 AM - Activity on Yahoo.
5:05 AM to 5:25 AM - Various sites visited, searching for ZFG.
8:01 AM to 10:50 AM - Activity centered around AIM. The purpose seems to be chat only. There are gaps in the activity, but that could be due to chatting. Notable gaps are:

8:33 - 8:51
8:54 - 9:21
9:38 - 10:09
10:14 - 10:25
10:25 - 10:35
10:35 - 10:49
The sole blip at 10:25 may be due to someone with the screen name bgamer2000 responding to an earlier chat request. It does not really mean that someone was actively using the computer at that time. The 10:35 activity may be nothing meaningful either.

After 10:49, there is no further activity until 1:38 PM when Lee and Cindy start work on the Caylee is Missing myspace.

HTH

Thanks for clarifying/updating, JWG.

Unless you see something in the AIM usernames involved that would indicate otherwise, I'm inclined to think this activity >8:01 was Casey. She was on a 122min call w/ Tony 7:27-9:29AM. At 8:03AM she let a series of calls from Jamie roll to vmail. Perhaps Casey fired up AIM mid-call to begin multi-tasking while on the phone w/ Tony and began a chat w/ Jamie 'bout Caylee missing that triggered Jamie's call attempts.

Sadly, IMHO, the 10:14AM-10:49AM period you outlined doesn't make me feel better 'bout Casey bein' otherwise occupied. IMHO, it meshes reasonably well w/ the 9:42-10:18AM I outlined above as the potential confrontation w/ Cindy re: Brittany/Juliette....and Cindy subsequently leaving the house to go visit. By 10:41AM Casey was back @ the cell phone texting again.

Could the initial 1:40AM & 2:32AM Yahoo activity have possibly been email deletions? Casey had just finished her handwritten statement and Lee wasn't back from Tony's just yet :waitasec:

BeanE...I'm curious if the late 7/15PM desktop work Lee (w/ some help from Casey to get into the AT&T account) was passed off to Cindy as working to get Caylee back IYKWIM. I 'spect things all kinda ran together @ some point.

Is there any other info to suggest Lee was @ G&C's 7/16 between 5AM & 1PM??? :waitasec:

JWG
01-02-2010, 06:38 PM
FWIW, here is the morning activity in a nutshell. All AIM-related:

8:01 AIM started up with screen name george4937
8:17 Change to screen name caseyomarie
8:17 Contact made with screen name shirleymp79
8:19 Visit www.mywebface.com (http://www.mywebface.com)
8:33 Contact made with screen name l7tone
8:33 Contact made with screen name thatenglishguy84
8:33 Visit www.mywebface.com (http://www.mywebface.com)
8:54 Visit www.mywebface.com (http://www.mywebface.com)
8:57 Contact made with screen name pierce5585
8:57 Contact made with screen name slazz13
8:57 Contact made with screen name sweetprincess735
8:57 Contact made with screen name mistermayagi
9:21 Visit www.mywebface.com (http://www.mywebface.com)
9:33 Contact made with screen name houston143
9:35 Contact made with screen name pierce5585
9:38 Contact made with screen name pierce5585
10:09 Contact made with screen name bgamer2000
10:14 Visit www.mywebface.com (http://www.mywebface.com)
10:25 Contact made with screen name bgamer2000
10:35 Visit www.mywebface.com (http://www.mywebface.com)
10:49 Contact made with screen name adc4hire
10:49 Contact made with screen name whatshotorlando
10:49 Contact made with screen name sixsideddice3307
10:49 Contact made with screen name witeplayboi
10:49 Logout (?) screen name caseyomarie

When I note "contact made", all I know is that it was some sort of event that created a record in the internet history. It could be KC initiating a chat, someone initiating a chat with KC, or possibly nothing more than an alert to KC that someone came online. It is impossible for me to tell.

The visits to mywebface.com seem to be associated with chat avatars. Given that the site visits do not exactly coincide with screen name contacts, it kind of appears that KC ... while supposedly searching for her lost daughter ... was creating avatars for some of her chat buddies? :waitasec:

BeanE
01-02-2010, 08:17 PM
The visits to mywebface.com seem to be associated with chat avatars. Given that the site visits do not exactly coincide with screen name contacts, it kind of appears that KC ... while supposedly searching for her lost daughter ... was creating avatars for some of her chat buddies? :waitasec:

That's our KC - always thinking of others. They can use it in mitigation.

BeanE
01-02-2010, 08:35 PM
BeanE...I'm curious if the late 7/15PM desktop work Lee (w/ some help from Casey to get into the AT&T account) was passed off to Cindy as working to get Caylee back IYKWIM. I 'spect things all kinda ran together @ some point.

Is there any other info to suggest Lee was @ G&C's 7/16 between 5AM & 1PM??? :waitasec:

If memory serves me correctly she talked about this at the bond hearing and in the Greta interview. In one she said she and KC put together the myspace while waiting for LE to arrive on 7/15. In the other she said she got KC out of her room, that KC was on the phone and/or wanted to take a shower, and she took her to the puter to put the myspace together. This would have been the morning of the 16th.

She was trying to make it sound like KC did all of it cuz she was such a great mom. It was obvious that Cindy was exaggerating.

I think it's a good probability that KC wasn't being truthful about what she was doing on the puter, and there was passing off of what she was really doing.

For Lee being at G&C's AM of 7/16, I can't think of anything right off. I think I assumed he was at G&C's when he was making those phone calls and finding out KC had given him fake numbers e.g. w/Brittany = Juliet. I just can't think of anything offhand that indicated he was at G&C vs his own place.

BondJamesBond
01-03-2010, 12:51 AM
10:49 Contact made with screen name witeplayboi


snipped & bbm

Alright, then. That's one I recognize.

BondJamesBond
01-03-2010, 01:20 AM
If memory serves me correctly she talked about this at the bond hearing and in the Greta interview. In one she said she and KC put together the myspace while waiting for LE to arrive on 7/15. In the other she said she got KC out of her room, that KC was on the phone and/or wanted to take a shower, and she took her to the puter to put the myspace together. This would have been the morning of the 16th.

She was trying to make it sound like KC did all of it cuz she was such a great mom. It was obvious that Cindy was exaggerating.

I think it's a good probability that KC wasn't being truthful about what she was doing on the puter, and there was passing off of what she was really doing.

For Lee being at G&C's AM of 7/16, I can't think of anything right off. I think I assumed he was at G&C's when he was making those phone calls and finding out KC had given him fake numbers e.g. w/Brittany = Juliet. I just can't think of anything offhand that indicated he was at G&C vs his own place.

On one hand...we don't have any calls from Lee to either Cindy or George's cell phone 7/16AM to let them know 'bout his discovery. On the other hand we don't have the home phone record. On our third hand we don't have any calls from/to Lee on Casey's cell phone 7/16AM either. :waitasec: Seems like Lee's natural reaction would've been to go directly to Casey and say, "WTF??!!?". I guess the absence of any computer activity after 5:25AM and before Casey's AIM activity is inconclusive...Lee could've either sacked out @ G&C's or gone home. If he stayed @ G&C's I kinda expect we would've seen more computer activity from him if/when Casey wasn't on.

Perhaps trivial, but, IMHO, Casey didn't have phone #'s memorized...hence, she likely couldn't have given Lee Juliette's (i.e. Brittany's) # until after the phone came back to G&C's. And, IF LE had exclusive control of the phone until they left...Casey wouldn't have been able to give Lee the # until >6:48AM 7/16. Absent calls 'tween Lee & Casey on Casey's phone records would support Lee sacking out @ G&C's and being there to clue Cindy in. OK...I'm going in circles. :bang: The only other opportunity would've been when Lee (w/ Casey's help I assume) logged onto AT&T 7/15PM @ G&C's...if Casey pulled Brittany's # outta those records...unlikely, IMHO...oh well.

So what? I guess as far as Casey having the opportunity to remove something incriminating from the Pontiac, it seems the dynamic @ the house 7/16AM was still one of distrust...not collusion. IOW...IF Casey moved something to the playhouse, etc. it would've been G&C's advance search of the backyard before the 7/17 K9 search that clued them into it on their own...not because Casey had tipped them off. After 12:30PM 7/16 Casey had only a single 30 second phone call to the Hopespring home phone in which to mention anything to them...and that call @ 1:06PM would unlikely have been a private one IYKWIM. Lee remains the wildcard. IF he was @ the house that morning he & Casey had a chance to talk privately...but, based on their subsequent conversations it seems Lee was pretty clueless.

BondJamesBond
01-04-2010, 12:07 AM
I edited the following post quote to reflect the same information it originally contained...only now the activity is attributed to the desktop @ G&C's house as JWG later indicated it should have been. References in the original post to Tony using it as the laptop have been removed accordingly. References to cell phone have been removed and timestamps are moved to the beginning of the paragraph for flow. All due respect to JWG's work on this. :thumb:

Doing this to focus on the activity in order to pose a few questions, observations & speculation...


*edited as described here: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4633468&postcount=77

7/15/08


8:47 PM about 40 seconds worth of AIM activity occurs. My belief is this is when the computer is powered on AIM automatically launches. Nothing happens for 1 1/2 hours.

10:15 PM activity resumes. For the next five minutes it looks like there are repeated attempts to log into KC's ATT wireless account, culminating in a visit to the "lost password" page to presumably have a new password sent to her email account. A successful login to Yahoo may have occurred at this time.

10:30 PM activity resumes again with an attempt to either register with or log into an existing "Lava Life" account. This lasts for about a minute. Attempts are then made to log into Facebook (unsuccessfully).

10:43 PM - a successful attempt to log into myspace is made, although the account is not clear (if I knew the numeric ID for KC I could probably tell). For the next 10 minutes comments and inbox messages are viewed.

10:57 PM - a successful attempt to log into Facebook is made, although the account is not clear. Numerous photos are viewed for the next 3 minutes. Activity stops.

11:15 PM - a return to Facebook with what appears to be a single upload.

11:19 PM - a second attempt to login to the ATT wireless account.

11:23 PM to 11:35 PM - a rapid-fire mixture of myspace and photobucket views. On Photobucket it is images. On myspace it is images and messages.

11:35 PM to 11:50 PM - many, many views of Facebook photos after what appears to be a successful login.

7/16/08


1:40 AM - computer appears to reboot.

2:32 AM - successful login to Yahoo mail. Activity stops at 2:34 (possibly after seeing no email exists).

5:09 AM the computer is powered up, but no real activity until 5:18 when the MSN website is brought up. One of the very first things done here is to go to the white pages search off this site and enter "aida" as a first name and "fernandez-gonzalez" as the last name. Lee searches referral sites ussearch.com and reunion.com for ZFG. Activity is very sparse from about 5:25 AM to 1:40 PM.

*8:01 AM AIM activity detailed in earlier post*

1:40 PM to 2:00 PM or so there are multiple searches on multiple site for combinations of "cheryl davis" "east coast universal" and "battle of the bands" - all of which were figments of KC's imagination. One wonders how he continues believing sis to this day. :waitasec:

After a brief pause of 20 minutes or so, work began on the cayleeismissing, myspace page...Lee's part to understand just what KC was up to.

Now...after reviewing the D/S Acevedo info BeanE provided along w/ JWG's computer forensic timeline...lemme propose the following observations/speculation.


1) Activity <10:43PM can be attributed to Lee :propeller:, while Casey had been taken by Acevedo to Sawgrass :takeoff:.

2) Activity 10:43PM to 11:50PM can be attributed largely to Casey. This timing of this period beginning fits almost perfectly w/ the travel time analysis provided earlier in this thread Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Events Post 911 Calls Up to 7-16 Arrest.

The success of the logins betrays Casey's presence :online: vs. the pre-10:43PM attempts. Perhaps w/ Lee :propeller: in & out of the room, or possibly even keeping an eye out for Casey to rifle through accounts. Recall that LE was in the process of bringing the phone back to G&C's. Consider that the first call from the cell phone that pinged @ G&C's was precisely @ 11:55PM. So, based on that timing...it appears to me that when LE returned w/ the phone THAT demanded Casey's immediate attention, put an immediate halt to the desktop activity, and triggered Lee :propeller: to leave for Tony's. This set the scene Lee described w/ Casey & LE and the phone (as he left).

3) 11:55 PM to 12:33 AM LE kept Casey occupied w/ her phone calling people.

4) 12:33 AM to 01:05 AM Casey provided her handwritten statement. :deal: While Casey was writing Sgt. Hosey contacted Yuri.

5) 1:40 AM after Casey probably did Q&A regarding her handwritten statement...and before Lee returned to G&C's...Casey snuck in and attempted more computer activity...perhaps interrupted/discovered...explaining the lack of activity.

6) 2:32 AM activity at approximately the time Lee returned to G&C's and might've been engaged in the dumping out of the bag exercise w/ Cindy, Acevedo, et.al...where was Casey? On the computer! :computer: Perhaps this 2 minutes was all it took to delete the emails that were later witnessed by Lee to be gone. I could certainly accomplish that in <2 minutes.

7) 5:09 AM activity has already been attributed to Lee's research :propeller: while Casey was on her ride around courtesy of Yuri.

Lemme suggest that event #2 above is when Casey deleted the MySpace entries April-July...and the images Jesse later described as being gone...perhaps some PB images too...gonzo. :eek: I've always been curious 'bout the deletion activity. :waitasec: It would've been uncharacteristically Casey to have deleted these items 'proactively'. No...:snooty:..Casey would've done it only when compelled to...IMHO. It would've also drawn attention to her other MS 'friends' to delete "current" activity...but deleting it from weeks/pages back in the history would've gone unnoticed. Perhaps some of the early discussion about Lee potentially facing charges...and "knowing" what he'd done per LE refers to his knowledge that Casey was destroying records/files. Of course...@ the time...Casey wasn't a suspect...she was the distraught mother assisting LE's investigation. Not suggesting that Lee :propeller: was altogether aware of what was happening. :rolleyes: I can also envision how THIS MS activity could've been misconstrued (I couldn't resist) later by Cindy's account to have been Casey & Lee collaborating on the CayleeIsMissing page set-up. :)

Perhaps just restating what has already been observed/suggested? Alright, then...have @ it. :)

BondJamesBond
01-04-2010, 08:26 AM
FWIW, here is the morning activity in a nutshell. All AIM-related:

8:01 AIM started up with screen name george4937
8:17 Change to screen name caseyomarie
8:17 Contact made with screen name shirleymp79
8:19 Visit www.mywebface.com (http://www.mywebface.com)
8:33 Contact made with screen name l7tone
8:33 Contact made with screen name thatenglishguy84
8:33 Visit www.mywebface.com (http://www.mywebface.com)
8:54 Visit www.mywebface.com (http://www.mywebface.com)
8:57 Contact made with screen name pierce5585
8:57 Contact made with screen name slazz13
8:57 Contact made with screen name sweetprincess735
8:57 Contact made with screen name mistermayagi
9:21 Visit www.mywebface.com (http://www.mywebface.com)
9:33 Contact made with screen name houston143
9:35 Contact made with screen name pierce5585
9:38 Contact made with screen name pierce5585
10:09 Contact made with screen name bgamer2000
10:14 Visit www.mywebface.com (http://www.mywebface.com)
10:25 Contact made with screen name bgamer2000
10:35 Visit www.mywebface.com (http://www.mywebface.com)
10:49 Contact made with screen name adc4hire
10:49 Contact made with screen name whatshotorlando
10:49 Contact made with screen name sixsideddice3307
10:49 Contact made with screen name witeplayboi
10:49 Logout (?) screen name caseyomarie

When I note "contact made", all I know is that it was some sort of event that created a record in the internet history. It could be KC initiating a chat, someone initiating a chat with KC, or possibly nothing more than an alert to KC that someone came online. It is impossible for me to tell.

The visits to mywebface.com seem to be associated with chat avatars. Given that the site visits do not exactly coincide with screen name contacts, it kind of appears that KC ... while supposedly searching for her lost daughter ... was creating avatars for some of her chat buddies? :waitasec:

Anyone know Lee's AIM screen name?

Woe.be.gone
01-04-2010, 08:19 PM
The fact that history between April and July was deleted from the desktop on July 16 obviously shows that someone is trying to hide something that has to do with what was going on prior to Caylee being reported missing. The deleted info must have contained clues as to part of the story anyway.

I ask, why would KC not have deleted any info like that prior to July 16? One would think she would have cleaned up the desktop long before that day. Also, why delete anything after June 16? KC had not lived at Hopespring since that day, right? Does anybody have any ideas as to why she would not have cleaned up the computer earlier versus on the day she was about to be arrested? She must be dumb. It does fit in with other commentary regarding KC never thinking ahead and just doing what she felt was necessary in the moment though. Weird.

Woe.be.gone
01-04-2010, 08:26 PM
I'll answer one of my own questions. The history must have something to do with KC's communications with CA. That would be my guess anyway - at least the communications during June/July. Or it could have something to do with avenues CA was involved in during those months - ie, seeking counseling, communication with SP, etc. Can they tell if CA's stuff/work is still on the computer for those months?

BondJamesBond
01-05-2010, 12:50 AM
The fact that history between April and July was deleted from the desktop on July 16 obviously shows that someone is trying to hide something that has to do with what was going on prior to Caylee being reported missing. The deleted info must have contained clues as to part of the story anyway.

I ask, why would KC not have deleted any info like that prior to July 16? One would think she would have cleaned up the desktop long before that day. Also, why delete anything after June 16? KC had not lived at Hopespring since that day, right? Does anybody have any ideas as to why she would not have cleaned up the computer earlier versus on the day she was about to be arrested? She must be dumb. It does fit in with other commentary regarding KC never thinking ahead and just doing what she felt was necessary in the moment though. Weird.


I'll answer one of my own questions. The history must have something to do with KC's communications with CA. That would be my guess anyway - at least the communications during June/July. Or it could have something to do with avenues CA was involved in during those months - ie, seeking counseling, communication with SP, etc. Can they tell if CA's stuff/work is still on the computer for those months?

Lemme clarify, Woe.

Suggestion is that Casey used the desktop to clean up content that was saved on other servers via the inet (e.g. MySpace & PhotoBucket). In that respect, it didn't matter what computer she used. Under the circumstances I'm suggesting...it was her only option.

Actually, since Casey left the Diary of Days blog - which IMHO revealed her intimate feelings about her own situation, what happened, and Cindy - IMHO she wasn't specifically trying to target communication 'tween the two of them. Rather...in this situation Casey was doing what she could do, as quickly as she could do it, to erase the tell-tale signs on her MySpace, Facebook, email and Photobucket websites of living la Bella Vita while her daughter was supposedly kidnapped. I haven't attempted on MySpace, but, I expect deleting wall posts is something more easily done in blocks than picking & choosing in the circumstances Casey faced w/ LE buzzing around. I have done on Facebook...and it is very quick & easy. Further adding support to the effort being done hastily, IMHO, is the failure to delete the Fusian pics from the Friday evening festivities the week of Caylee's demise. :(

Also as to the MS posts deleted...not everything up until 7/15...IMHO it was her attempt to be clever and hope that it wouldn't be obvious that some of the history had been deleted.

And for delay-@-all-costs, 10-mins-@-a-time Casey...I imagine the circumstances were perfect for her m.o. of cleaning up these items.

HTH.

Woe.be.gone
01-05-2010, 02:08 AM
I see. Thanks for the explanation BJB. I know very little about those things. I was thinking in terms of email on that computer and photos and searches, etc. I know there is a whole exploration of desktop computer searches, who may have made them, etc. too. I wonder why though, if you murdered your child you would not try to hide those things prior to being "caught". I'm just asking questions as they occur to me - I'm not against the idea that KC did the deed - just there are so many unanswered questions and complicated circumstances surrounding not only her defense but the family and friends too. Certain aspects of the case seem so strange to me and I'm hoping there will be explanations for them once the trial gets underway.

I couldn't sleep last night and I lay there and think about that hibiscus plant that was moved, why it was moved, etc. Too much yard work in the hot Florida sun during what must have been a very stressful time for the A's for me to readily believe it was scheduled for that timeframe.

Anyway the post communication can't reveal the truth if it's unavailable to us like not having the home phone records. Do you know why that is? Also, do you think KC was trying to protect certain people by deleting her MS and related stuff? What would any of it have to do with Caylee I wonder? It's unlikely she wrote on there that she had killed her child. :waitasec: You bring up a great point though that she forgot all about her party pictures that were taken just days after she may have killed her daughter. You'd think she'd attack those pics first. Nothing makes sense to me about any of her or her family's behavior.

JWG
01-05-2010, 07:07 PM
** SNIP **

Now...after reviewing the D/S Acevedo info BeanE provided along w/ JWG's computer forensic timeline...lemme propose the following observations/speculation.
1) Activity <10:43PM can be attributed to Lee :propeller:, while Casey had been taken by Acevedo to Sawgrass :takeoff:.

2) Activity 10:43PM to 11:50PM can be attributed largely to Casey. This timing of this period beginning fits almost perfectly w/ the travel time analysis provided earlier in this thread Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Events Post 911 Calls Up to 7-16 Arrest (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4593964&postcount=40).

The success of the logins betrays Casey's presence :online: vs. the pre-10:43PM attempts. Perhaps w/ Lee :propeller: in & out of the room, or possibly even keeping an eye out for Casey to rifle through accounts. Recall that LE was in the process of bringing the phone back to G&C's. Consider that the first call from the cell phone that pinged @ G&C's was precisely @ 11:55PM. So, based on that timing...it appears to me that when LE returned w/ the phone THAT demanded Casey's immediate attention, put an immediate halt to the desktop activity, and triggered Lee :propeller: to leave for Tony's. This set the scene Lee described w/ Casey & LE and the phone (as he left).

3) 11:55 PM to 12:33 AM LE kept Casey occupied w/ her phone calling people.

4) 12:33 AM to 01:05 AM Casey provided her handwritten statement. :deal: While Casey was writing Sgt. Hosey contacted Yuri.

5) 1:40 AM after Casey probably did Q&A regarding her handwritten statement...and before Lee returned to G&C's...Casey snuck in and attempted more computer activity...perhaps interrupted/discovered...explaining the lack of activity.

6) 2:32 AM activity at approximately the time Lee returned to G&C's and might've been engaged in the dumping out of the bag exercise w/ Cindy, Acevedo, et.al...where was Casey? On the computer! :computer: Perhaps this 2 minutes was all it took to delete the emails that were later witnessed by Lee to be gone. I could certainly accomplish that in <2 minutes.

7) 5:09 AM activity has already been attributed to Lee's research :propeller: while Casey was on her ride around courtesy of Yuri. Lemme suggest that event #2 above is when Casey deleted the MySpace entries April-July...and the images Jesse later described as being gone...perhaps some PB images too...gonzo. :eek: I've always been curious 'bout the deletion activity. :waitasec: It would've been uncharacteristically Casey to have deleted these items 'proactively'. No...:snooty:..Casey would've done it only when compelled to...IMHO. It would've also drawn attention to her other MS 'friends' to delete "current" activity...but deleting it from weeks/pages back in the history would've gone unnoticed. Perhaps some of the early discussion about Lee potentially facing charges...and "knowing" what he'd done per LE refers to his knowledge that Casey was destroying records/files. Of course...@ the time...Casey wasn't a suspect...she was the distraught mother assisting LE's investigation. Not suggesting that Lee :propeller: was altogether aware of what was happening. :rolleyes: I can also envision how THIS MS activity could've been misconstrued (I couldn't resist) later by Cindy's account to have been Casey & Lee collaborating on the CayleeIsMissing page set-up. :)

Perhaps just restating what has already been observed/suggested? Alright, then...have @ it. :)

I have to admit, I never considered the activity being 1) due to KC and 2) this was when she deleted the postings and pictures. :doh:

But when you add all the pieces together, it makes perfect sense, and in fact the desktop's internet history now makes perfect sense. Way to think outside the box, Bond. :present:

Given her rush to do this work - essentially right in front of the OCSO (where were they, anyway? :waitasec:) - I am more convinced than ever that it was KC who did something quick to the laptop that caused the BSOD before being yanked out of Tony's by Cindy. Perhaps a quick attempt to format the C drive.

JWG
01-05-2010, 07:08 PM
Anyone know Lee's AIM screen name?

I have not noticed it in any discovery. None of them that show up the morning of the 16th look like they would belong to him.

BeanE
01-05-2010, 07:27 PM
I am more convinced than ever that it was KC who did something quick to the laptop that caused the BSOD before being yanked out of Tony's by Cindy. Perhaps a quick attempt to format the C drive.

I've always thought it was KC.

JWG
01-05-2010, 09:38 PM
I've always thought it was KC.

Thanks BeanE. I've always felt the same, but enough others have posted viable explanations as to the culprit being Lee - or even Tony - that I have some degree of doubt. Now, that doubt is gone.

It was KC.

sadyjade
01-05-2010, 11:14 PM
I have not noticed it in any discovery. None of them that show up the morning of the 16th look like they would belong to him.

If you would be so kind, JWG .. as to point me in the direction of these screenames, I may be able to help out. Back in July of 2008, I was watching, chatting, peeping into lots of the MS pages for any and all players in this case. A number of them still had messages from Casey, some from Lee also. If I am remembering correctly, some of the boys played poker online (and other games) and I want to say it had something to with Darth Vader ... I will see what I can find in my own history and get back to you fine feathered friends *grin*

BondJamesBond
01-06-2010, 12:14 AM
If you would be so kind, JWG .. as to point me in the direction of these screenames, I may be able to help out. Back in July of 2008, I was watching, chatting, peeping into lots of the MS pages for any and all players in this case. A number of them still had messages from Casey, some from Lee also. If I am remembering correctly, some of the boys played poker online (and other games) and I want to say it had something to with Darth Vader ... I will see what I can find in my own history and get back to you fine feathered friends *grin*

That'd be great, SadyJ. See quoted section in post#78 above. Screenames there.

Its a long shot...but figured WTH...nothin' to lose, but sleep. ;)

BondJamesBond
01-06-2010, 01:27 AM
Given her rush to do this work - essentially right in front of the OCSO (where were they, anyway? :waitasec:) *snipped & BBM*

I re-listened to the last 911 call earlier today and gained a better appreciation than I had before of how quickly this all went down for the first-responders. BeanE provided much of the detailed info earlier in this thread to do a better job than I am about to :bang: but in the interest of capturing the thought FWIW.

I expect this is old news for many/most, and perhaps I'm putting 1 & 1 together to make 3...but consider...

The initial responding LEO's (Eberlin & Acevedo) were dispatched in response to the 911 call RE: stolen car
Acevedo went to Colonial HS w/ Lee...which tells us she is relatively young
Perhaps OCSO LEO's are dispatched based on their unit & the type of case (i.e. stolen vehicle)
Perhaps OCSO LEO's are assigned to units based on training & experience (i.e. homicide more seasoned vs. larceny, etc.)
IIRC, the final 911 call began ~9:40PM
Per call audio & his statement, George arrived @ 9:41:24 while Cindy broke down in the garage on the phone w/ the 911 operator
Per call audio @ 9:44:12 OCSO first responders arrived per Casey's comment to the 911 operator


So...OCSO first responders were prolly making the turn on Suburban (:shakehead:) when Lee got the ZFG revelation from Casey and Cindy placed the final call.

Based on the above info & a little speculation...

I find it highly unlikely that the 911 operator - in the ~4 mins & 12 seconds she was on the phone w/ Cindy getting the NEW kidnapping story - had the opportunity to inform the first-responder LEO's (Eberlin & Acevedo) who were dispatched for the purpose of investigating a stolen vehicle (that was prolly also considered something of a family dispute) of anything regarding the kidnapping, "dead body in the damn car" comment, etc..

This left Eberlin & Acevedo to deal w/ the developing situation until they and the dispatcher could close w/ the chain of command re: the changing conditions on the ground. All things considered, they did move quickly, IMHO.

Since Cindy called in the complaint they were obligated to get her calm and get information from her. We know from Cindy's call w/ Debbie ~10:28PM she was still very distraught. They got statements from Lee, Cindy & George and Acevedo whisked Casey away to Sawgrass leaving the house @ ~10:16PM to follow-up on the story they were being given. Due process. While another LEO, Reydon?, met w/ Sawgrass maintenance, etc. Acevedo returned Casey to Hopespring ~10:43PM

Virtually simultaneous to the Sawgrass trip another LEO, Williams, arrived @ Tony's apartment before 10:28PM and searched for signs of Caylee. He retrieved the cell phone and arrived back @ Hopespring sometime before 11:55PM based on the first cell ping there, and based on the ceasing computer activity, it seems likely to have been ~11:50PM. With a ~23minute travel time it appears Williams left Tony's apartment <11:30PM. Its a little unclear exactly when he left Tony's apartment, but, IMHO the timing of the first cell phone call from G&C's and the computer activity stopping is impossible to ignore. Since AT THIS POINT IN TIME Casey was still 'assisting' OCSO in the investigation, perhaps she was able to convince them that she could find ZFG's phone number by checking her online AT&T account via the desktop.


So...all things considered...Casey being allowed time on the computer 10:43-11:50PM....call it an hour...while LE...


(a) awaited the arrival of the cell phone w/ Williams, and
(b) awaited feedback from the initial Sawgrass management ZFG search w/ Fletcher, and
(c) awaited feedback from Salamat sent to check out the 232 Glenwood addy (Ricardo's) provided by Cindy from the Pontiac
(d) updated OCSO command, Sgt. Hosey, and
(e) prolly talked w/ Cindy, George & Lee intermittently, broke up shouting matches, etc.

...doesn't seem unreasonable to me. :twocents:

IIRC, it took Fletcher some time to get a hold of the Sawgrass maintenance guy to research the apt. info since the office was closed. My guess is THAT delay is what bought Casey the time for her computer delete-a-palooza :online:. :waitasec:

I'm sure I've made errors...please point'em out and I'll edit as needed. TIA!

ETA1: Fixed some of the LEO's names. :)
ETA2: Fixed some more of the LEO's names & added the 232 Glenwood check :)

JWG
01-06-2010, 11:34 AM
So...all things considered...Casey being allowed time on the computer 10:43-11:50PM....call it an hour...while LE...

(a) awaited the arrival of the cell phone w/ Williams, and
(b) awaited feedback from the initial Sawgrass management ZFG search w/ Reydon, and
(c) updated OCSO command, Hosey, and
(d) prolly talked w/ Cindy, George & Lee intermittently...doesn't seem unreasonable to me. :twocents:

** SNIP ** ... leaving just enough so that it is clear what I am referring to.


Bond, when you spell it out like that, it makes perfect sense.

We have had the luxury of looking back at the events with hindsight. In doing so, a lot of the evidence and the interpretation of same seems "obvious". Likewise with the behavior of the individual family members.

But looking at it from the perspective of the LEOs as events unfold, it does take time to ferret out information and begin to draw conclusions. So I appreciate you putting two and two together for me. :thumb:

BeanE
01-06-2010, 03:55 PM
Most excellent, Bond. :-) :blowkiss:

A few notes:

Code name Reydon = Rendon Fletcher


Since Cindy called in the complaint they were obligated to get her calm and get information from her. We know from Cindy's call w/ Debbie ~10:28PM she was still very distraught.

Don't forget that on the deputies' arrival, Cindy and KC were fighting to the point of screaming at each other, and had to be separated by LE. LE had that to deal with as well.


(a) awaited the arrival of the cell phone w/ Williams, and
(b) awaited feedback from the initial Sawgrass management ZFG search w/ Reydon

and awaited feedback from the deputy who went to what was supposedly ZFG's apartment at Amy/Ricardo's? Cindy got what she thought was ZFG's address/phone from her address book, and gave it to a deputy. Deputy went to the address to check it out, and talked to Amy/Ricardo there - it was their address that KC had given CA. My memory is failing me on what time the deputy went there.

And... now I'm remembering again about Cindy saying that KC was creating the MySpace *while waiting for the police*. I bet this is the timeframe she's referring to, and it further supports what yer sayin'.

Great work as always, my friend. :-)

sadyjade
01-07-2010, 12:31 AM
Bond, sadly ... I've had no luck finding much in the way of possible screen names identifications *sigh* I wont give up just yet though. I will continue to look back at what I still have somewhere in this box (pc).

BondJamesBond
01-07-2010, 01:09 AM
*snipped to allow my musings*

:laugh:
Code name Reydon = Rendon Fletcher
You spoil me, BeanE. :)


Don't forget that on the deputies' arrival, Cindy and KC were fighting to the point of screaming at each other, and had to be separated by LE. LE had that to deal with as well.

and awaited feedback from the deputy who went to what was supposedly ZFG's apartment at Amy/Ricardo's? Cindy got what she thought was ZFG's address/phone from her address book, and gave it to a deputy. Deputy went to the address to check it out, and talked to Amy/Ricardo there - it was their address that KC had given CA. My memory is failing me on what time the deputy went there.


Clearer now more than ever to me that I've Columbo'd :sleuth: my way through to this to get to where you were back in post#11 :bang: Thanks for your patience. We could prolly dig through the timing of Amy's Facebook message 'bout all the drama...and oh-yeah, its-my-bday, dinner-@-Friday's :rolleyes: tagged onto the end... and ferret out when D/S Salamat wrapped up @ their place. Leavin' that for another time/sleuther ;)


And... now I'm remembering again about Cindy saying that KC was creating the MySpace *while waiting for the police*. I bet this is the timeframe she's referring to, and it further supports what yer sayin'.


That you can recall these details...:bowdown: and that they seem to 'make sense' with how we've laid this out now makes it much more real for me. I dunno 'bout anyone else, but, that's a real pay-off for me personally. Thank you for that. :thumb:


Great work as always, my friend. :-)


Well...Considering

(a) JWG did all the computer forensics heavy lifting back in March '09, :highfive: w/ a little nudge from ElizaAvalon, IIRC, to get those details for us, and
(b) you spent all the shoe leather back in December '09 (esp. Posts#11-~24) :blushing: to overcome the drudgery of the research, BeanE....and
(c) AZ, aafromaa, Cecybeans, Searchfortruth, etc. pitched in to keep things moving along.
I'd say its a really nice WS team effort :grouphug:

:) I think my contribution can be summed up pretty well by...Super Bowl Ads: FedEx - FedEx - An Idea - SPIKE

Thanks for tolerating my curiosity. Call me when hand gesturing is the critical skill defficiency on the team, and I'm soooo there.

'Nuff of my babbling. Will leave discussing the impact of the delete-a-palooza 7/15PM to the 'myspace' thread in the main forum...and leave this one for more sleuthin' on the frivolities of 7/15PM-7/16PM arrest ;)

RR0004
01-07-2010, 02:41 AM
I edited the following post quote to reflect the same information it originally contained...only now the activity is attributed to the desktop @ G&C's house as JWG later indicated it should have been. References in the original post to Tony using it as the laptop have been removed accordingly. References to cell phone have been removed and timestamps are moved to the beginning of the paragraph for flow. All due respect to JWG's work on this. :thumb:

Doing this to focus on the activity in order to pose a few questions, observations & speculation...



Now...after reviewing the D/S Acevedo info BeanE provided along w/ JWG's computer forensic timeline...lemme propose the following observations/speculation.


1) Activity <10:43PM can be attributed to Lee :propeller:, while Casey had been taken by Acevedo to Sawgrass :takeoff:.

2) Activity 10:43PM to 11:50PM can be attributed largely to Casey. This timing of this period beginning fits almost perfectly w/ the travel time analysis provided earlier in this thread Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Events Post 911 Calls Up to 7-16 Arrest (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4593964&postcount=40).

The success of the logins betrays Casey's presence :online: vs. the pre-10:43PM attempts. Perhaps w/ Lee :propeller: in & out of the room, or possibly even keeping an eye out for Casey to rifle through accounts. Recall that LE was in the process of bringing the phone back to G&C's. Consider that the first call from the cell phone that pinged @ G&C's was precisely @ 11:55PM. So, based on that timing...it appears to me that when LE returned w/ the phone THAT demanded Casey's immediate attention, put an immediate halt to the desktop activity, and triggered Lee :propeller: to leave for Tony's. This set the scene Lee described w/ Casey & LE and the phone (as he left).

3) 11:55 PM to 12:33 AM LE kept Casey occupied w/ her phone calling people.

4) 12:33 AM to 01:05 AM Casey provided her handwritten statement. :deal: While Casey was writing Sgt. Hosey contacted Yuri.

5) 1:40 AM after Casey probably did Q&A regarding her handwritten statement...and before Lee returned to G&C's...Casey snuck in and attempted more computer activity...perhaps interrupted/discovered...explaining the lack of activity.

6) 2:32 AM activity at approximately the time Lee returned to G&C's and might've been engaged in the dumping out of the bag exercise w/ Cindy, Acevedo, et.al...where was Casey? On the computer! :computer: Perhaps this 2 minutes was all it took to delete the emails that were later witnessed by Lee to be gone. I could certainly accomplish that in <2 minutes.

7) 5:09 AM activity has already been attributed to Lee's research :propeller: while Casey was on her ride around courtesy of Yuri.

Lemme suggest that event #2 above is when Casey deleted the MySpace entries April-July...and the images Jesse later described as being gone...perhaps some PB images too...gonzo. :eek: I've always been curious 'bout the deletion activity. :waitasec: It would've been uncharacteristically Casey to have deleted these items 'proactively'. No...:snooty:..Casey would've done it only when compelled to...IMHO. It would've also drawn attention to her other MS 'friends' to delete "current" activity...but deleting it from weeks/pages back in the history would've gone unnoticed. Perhaps some of the early discussion about Lee potentially facing charges...and "knowing" what he'd done per LE refers to his knowledge that Casey was destroying records/files. Of course...@ the time...Casey wasn't a suspect...she was the distraught mother assisting LE's investigation. Not suggesting that Lee :propeller: was altogether aware of what was happening. :rolleyes: I can also envision how THIS MS activity could've been misconstrued (I couldn't resist) later by Cindy's account to have been Casey & Lee collaborating on the CayleeIsMissing page set-up. :)

Perhaps just restating what has already been observed/suggested? Alright, then...have @ it. :)
Ok...haven't had time to finish all the reading...but what could have been so compelling at that point...so disastrous if it were to be found? Casey's daughter is missing...police are present in the house...statements are being given...why would Casey even think about getting rid of stuff? Maybe they were pics...but who the heck would care about how bad they may look when their daughter has been kidnapped? This is just so mind boggling.

RR0004
01-07-2010, 02:46 AM
Most excellent, Bond. :-) :blowkiss:

A few notes:

Code name Reydon = Rendon Fletcher



Don't forget that on the deputies' arrival, Cindy and KC were fighting to the point of screaming at each other, and had to be separated by LE. LE had that to deal with as well.



and awaited feedback from the deputy who went to what was supposedly ZFG's apartment at Amy/Ricardo's? Cindy got what she thought was ZFG's address/phone from her address book, and gave it to a deputy. Deputy went to the address to check it out, and talked to Amy/Ricardo there - it was their address that KC had given CA. My memory is failing me on what time the deputy went there.

And... now I'm remembering again about Cindy saying that KC was creating the MySpace *while waiting for the police*. I bet this is the timeframe she's referring to, and it further supports what yer sayin'.

Great work as always, my friend. :-)
So she wasn't creating the MySpace the next day (the 16th)? She said she didn't know how and needed Casey to help her.

Sorry if I seem to be coming into this in the middle...I'm trying hard to catch up.

Gypsy Road
01-07-2010, 03:39 AM
Bond, sadly ... I've had no luck finding much in the way of possible screen names identifications *sigh* I wont give up just yet though. I will continue to look back at what I still have somewhere in this box (pc).

I may not be any help what so ever here, but I seem to recall him using Vader something as well. I want to say it was Vader along with a number? I also seem to recall his screen name being the same one he uses on his ebay account. I hope I'm not totally dreaming this...my memory is so vague.

cecybeans
01-07-2010, 03:41 AM
I'm not sure if this fits the timeline, but what I am picturing here is that KC originally tried to use the desktop to log into and eliminate what she considered damaging evidence in her MySpace account. Perhaps she asked LA to log in while she was busy being interviewed and he was initially unsuccessful, then she was able to log on. At some point, it may have been difficult for either of them to continue to use the computer unobserved. At that point, it would make sense they would go to the garage for their little talk, and maybe that is when KC asked LA to retrieve the laptop, but to attempt to further erase evidence before bringing it home, hence the length of time at AL's and the alleged bsod episode (unless someone has completely eliminated this as a possibility).

What this says to me is that very early on, maybe even before LE arrived, KC advised her brother that her accounts needed "cleaning" and they collaborated on how to do it without attracting undue attention. Perhaps this is more the gist of LA's little "aha moment" story of KC realizing that LE was going to insist on more information about Caylee, and since KC could only stall with fabrications, she figured that a search of her records would be next on their list. That took place supposedly while she was in her room. I'd think the garage confab was more about needing privacy to plan how to get rid of incriminating evidence using the laptop.

darnudes
01-07-2010, 06:17 AM
8:01 AIM started up with screen name george4937 (GA)
8:17 Change to screen name caseyomarie (CA)
8:17 Contact made with screen name shirleymp79 (SP, Cindys mom)
8:19 Visit www.mywebface.com
8:33 Contact made with screen name l7tone (AL)
8:33 Contact made with screen name thatenglishguy84
8:33 Visit www.mywebface.com
8:54 Visit www.mywebface.com
8:57 Contact made with screen name pierce5585
8:57 Contact made with screen name slazz13 (plays poker- found them online)
8:57 Contact made with screen name sweetprincess735 (could be a porn site)
8:57 Contact made with screen name mistermayagi
9:21 Visit www.mywebface.com
9:33 Contact made with screen name houston143
9:35 Contact made with screen name pierce5585
9:38 Contact made with screen name pierce5585
10:09 Contact made with screen name bgamer2000
10:14 Visit www.mywebface.com
10:25 Contact made with screen name bgamer2000
10:35 Visit www.mywebface.com
10:49 Contact made with screen name adc4hire
10:49 Contact made with screen name whatshotorlando
10:49 Contact made with screen name sixsideddice3307 (CE - Ohio)
10:49 Contact made with screen name witeplayboi (AR)
10:49 Logout (?) screen name caseyomarie

nyvictoria
01-10-2010, 04:59 PM
If you would be so kind, JWG .. as to point me in the direction of these screenames, I may be able to help out. Back in July of 2008, I was watching, chatting, peeping into lots of the MS pages for any and all players in this case. A number of them still had messages from Casey, some from Lee also. If I am remembering correctly, some of the boys played poker online (and other games) and I want to say it had something to with Darth Vader ... I will see what I can find in my own history and get back to you fine feathered friends *grin*

I recall something Darth Vader-ish, as well. Lee is a Star Wars fan so it makes perfect sense. I'm going to look back through some old hand-written notes (if I can find 'em) to see if I wrote it down. Will post if I find anything.

btw...Kudos to everyone working on reconstructing those first days. Great sleuthing!!


ETA: I found a sticky note in some old paperwork with "Mustang - VADER 1"

Not sure if it's his screenname or his plate/tag#

The World According
02-21-2010, 10:28 AM
I edited the following post quote to reflect the same information it originally contained...only now the activity is attributed to the desktop @ G&C's house as JWG later indicated it should have been. References in the original post to Tony using it as the laptop have been removed accordingly. References to cell phone have been removed and timestamps are moved to the beginning of the paragraph for flow. All due respect to JWG's work on this. :thumb:

Doing this to focus on the activity in order to pose a few questions, observations & speculation...



Now...after reviewing the D/S Acevedo info BeanE provided along w/ JWG's computer forensic timeline...lemme propose the following observations/speculation.


1) Activity <10:43PM can be attributed to Lee :propeller:, while Casey had been taken by Acevedo to Sawgrass :takeoff:.

2) Activity 10:43PM to 11:50PM can be attributed largely to Casey. This timing of this period beginning fits almost perfectly w/ the travel time analysis provided earlier in this thread Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Events Post 911 Calls Up to 7-16 Arrest (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4593964&postcount=40).

The success of the logins betrays Casey's presence :online: vs. the pre-10:43PM attempts. Perhaps w/ Lee :propeller: in & out of the room, or possibly even keeping an eye out for Casey to rifle through accounts. Recall that LE was in the process of bringing the phone back to G&C's. Consider that the first call from the cell phone that pinged @ G&C's was precisely @ 11:55PM. So, based on that timing...it appears to me that when LE returned w/ the phone THAT demanded Casey's immediate attention, put an immediate halt to the desktop activity, and triggered Lee :propeller: to leave for Tony's. This set the scene Lee described w/ Casey & LE and the phone (as he left).

3) 11:55 PM to 12:33 AM LE kept Casey occupied w/ her phone calling people.

4) 12:33 AM to 01:05 AM Casey provided her handwritten statement. :deal: While Casey was writing Sgt. Hosey contacted Yuri.

5) 1:40 AM after Casey probably did Q&A regarding her handwritten statement...and before Lee returned to G&C's...Casey snuck in and attempted more computer activity...perhaps interrupted/discovered...explaining the lack of activity.

6) 2:32 AM activity at approximately the time Lee returned to G&C's and might've been engaged in the dumping out of the bag exercise w/ Cindy, Acevedo, et.al...where was Casey? On the computer! :computer: Perhaps this 2 minutes was all it took to delete the emails that were later witnessed by Lee to be gone. I could certainly accomplish that in <2 minutes.

7) 5:09 AM activity has already been attributed to Lee's research :propeller: while Casey was on her ride around courtesy of Yuri.

Lemme suggest that event #2 above is when Casey deleted the MySpace entries April-July...and the images Jesse later described as being gone...perhaps some PB images too...gonzo. :eek: I've always been curious 'bout the deletion activity. :waitasec: It would've been uncharacteristically Casey to have deleted these items 'proactively'. No...:snooty:..Casey would've done it only when compelled to...IMHO. It would've also drawn attention to her other MS 'friends' to delete "current" activity...but deleting it from weeks/pages back in the history would've gone unnoticed. Perhaps some of the early discussion about Lee potentially facing charges...and "knowing" what he'd done per LE refers to his knowledge that Casey was destroying records/files. Of course...@ the time...Casey wasn't a suspect...she was the distraught mother assisting LE's investigation. Not suggesting that Lee :propeller: was altogether aware of what was happening. :rolleyes: I can also envision how THIS MS activity could've been misconstrued (I couldn't resist) later by Cindy's account to have been Casey & Lee collaborating on the CayleeIsMissing page set-up. :)

Perhaps just restating what has already been observed/suggested? Alright, then...have @ it. :)

Bond, you and JWG are amazing! We all appreciate you so.

JBean
02-21-2010, 01:56 PM
So what? I guess as far as Casey having the opportunity to remove something incriminating from the Pontiac, it seems the dynamic @ the house 7/16AM was still one of distrust...not collusion. IOW...IF Casey moved something to the playhouse, etc. it would've been G&C's advance search of the backyard before the 7/17 K9 search that clued them into it on their own...not because Casey had tipped them off. After 12:30PM 7/16 Casey had only a single 30 second phone call to the Hopespring home phone in which to mention anything to them...and that call @ 1:06PM would unlikely have been a private one IYKWIM. Lee remains the wildcard. IF he was @ the house that morning he & Casey had a chance to talk privately...but, based on their subsequent conversations it seems Lee was pretty clueless.
I think this is so true Bond and right on the money.

BondJamesBond
04-24-2010, 09:33 AM
Bump as promised (last night just before ISP crash :rolleyes:)

LambChop
04-24-2010, 09:45 AM
most excellent, bond. :-) :blowkiss:

A few notes:

Code name reydon = rendon fletcher



don't forget that on the deputies' arrival, cindy and kc were fighting to the point of screaming at each other, and had to be separated by le. Le had that to deal with as well.



And awaited feedback from the deputy who went to what was supposedly zfg's apartment at amy/ricardo's? Cindy got what she thought was zfg's address/phone from her address book, and gave it to a deputy. Deputy went to the address to check it out, and talked to amy/ricardo there - it was their address that kc had given ca. My memory is failing me on what time the deputy went there.

And... Now i'm remembering again about cindy saying that kc was creating the myspace *while waiting for the police*. I bet this is the timeframe she's referring to, and it further supports what yer sayin'.

Great work as always, my friend. :-)


*snipped to allow my musings*

:laugh:
you spoil me, beane. :)




clearer now more than ever to me that i've columbo'd :sleuth: My way through to this to get to where you were back in post#11 :bang: Thanks for your patience. We could prolly dig through the timing of amy's facebook message 'bout all the drama...and oh-yeah, its-my-bday, dinner-@-friday's :rolleyes: Tagged onto the end... And ferret out when d/s salamat wrapped up @ their place. Leavin' that for another time/sleuther ;)




that you can recall these details...:bowdown: And that they seem to 'make sense' with how we've laid this out now makes it much more real for me. I dunno 'bout anyone else, but, that's a real pay-off for me personally. Thank you for that. :thumb:




well...considering

(a) jwg did all the computer forensics heavy lifting back in march '09, :highfive: W/ a little nudge from elizaavalon, iirc, to get those details for us, and
(b) you spent all the shoe leather back in december '09 (esp. Posts#11-~24) :blushing: To overcome the drudgery of the research, beane....and
(c) az, aafromaa, cecybeans, searchfortruth, etc. Pitched in to keep things moving along.
i'd say its a really nice ws team effort :grouphug:

:) i think my contribution can be summed up pretty well by...super bowl ads: Fedex - fedex - an idea - spike (http://www.spike.com/video/idea-fedex/2419760)

thanks for tolerating my curiosity. Call me when hand gesturing is the critical skill defficiency on the team, and i'm soooo there.

'nuff of my babbling. Will leave discussing the impact of the delete-a-palooza 7/15pm to the 'myspace' thread in the main forum...and leave this one for more sleuthin' on the frivolities of 7/15pm-7/16pm arrest ;)

priceless