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View Full Version : Canada - Jessica Lloyd, 27, Belleville, Ontario 01/28/2010 thread #2



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hoppyfrog
02-13-2010, 11:13 PM
Please continue here.

RubyRed
02-13-2010, 11:32 PM
Before the service began, several members of the Canadian Forces entered the funeral home in uniform and wearing black armbands.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/ottawa/story/2010/02/13/ottawa-jessica-lloyd-funeral.html


That was a nice gesture.

Dee10
02-13-2010, 11:44 PM
Residents sure Williams led police to body


Lloyd's body, according to a joint statement by OPP and Belleville city police, was "located" by officers on Monday morning. The body was found on Cary Road, an unpaved crossroad linking Marlbank Road and East Hungerford Road south-east of Tweed.

Residents who live in the area said they believe Williams must have directed police investigators to Lloyd's body due to the fact the road is lightly used by motorists and its remote location.


Fleming said the road, which is approximately four kilometres in distance, features no houses and boasts mainly pastures, fields and woods.

http://www.intelligencer.ca/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=2448289

RubyRed
02-13-2010, 11:44 PM
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/ottawa/story/2010/02/13/ottawa-jessica-lloyd-funeral.html

click on video to right - Jessica Lloyd Funeral

pinkeyesucks
02-13-2010, 11:45 PM
Did anyone else hear the CBC radio discussion that talked about his catalogued trophy collection that was hidden in the Ottawa home in a heating duct? My husband was listening to it on Friday while at work, and I can't seem to find any reference to it.

pinkeyesucks
02-13-2010, 11:48 PM
Residents sure Williams led police to body





http://www.intelligencer.ca/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=2448289

Yeah I'm not so sure that is completely accurate, but we'll go with it.

:)

antiquegirl
02-13-2010, 11:56 PM
Yeah I'm not so sure that is completely accurate, but we'll go with it.

:)

I'm sure going with it. It's way too much of a coincidence that RW talked to OPP investigators on Sunday and poor Jessica's remains were found early Monday morning. (And not one mention of the golf course. ;))

JMO

flipflop
02-13-2010, 11:56 PM
Did anyone else hear the CBC radio discussion that talked about his catalogued trophy collection that was hidden in the Ottawa home in a heating duct? My husband was listening to it on Friday while at work, and I can't seem to find any reference to it.

hmmm, isn't that where Bernardo hid his video tapes years ago. WEIRD!

I just searched and found that Bernardo hid his tapes in pot lights in the ceiling.

Police didn't have the tapes because Bernardo hid them in a pot light in the bathroom ceiling of their home. Authorities didn't get their hands on these tapes until September 1994, by which time Homolka was in jail.
http://osgoode.yorku.ca/media2.nsf/83303ffe5af03ed585256ae6005379c9/47f95c9ce0cae54385257011007096ca!OpenDocument

RubyRed
02-13-2010, 11:58 PM
in defence of our defence
When the news broke Monday that now-former CFB Trenton Base Commander, Russ Williams had been arrested for the murder of Jessica Lloyd, Marie-France Comeau and the sexual assaults of two other local women, it was as if the world stood still.

There was the obvious horror that comes with knowing that such a vicious criminal was secretly under our noses the whole time. Anyone can appreciate the gravity of the realization that comes with knowing that if someone in such a prestigious, authoritative and high-profile position as Williams could commit such heinous crimes, then so, it seems, could anyone. Suddenly we all find ourselves suspicious, motives questioned, our abilities to trust anyone severely compromised.(more at link)

http://www.tumblr.com/tagged/Jessica+Lloyd

pinkeyesucks
02-14-2010, 12:08 AM
hmmm, isn't that where Bernardo hid his video tapes years ago. WEIRD!

bernardo hid his in the back of a closet behind a panel i believe. And then of course later in a lawyers office....

:)

antiquegirl
02-14-2010, 12:09 AM
Did anyone else hear the CBC radio discussion that talked about his catalogued trophy collection that was hidden in the Ottawa home in a heating duct? My husband was listening to it on Friday while at work, and I can't seem to find any reference to it.

I have not heard this, but thanks for sharing it. While I was Googling this, I found several articles that mentioned that the victims were bound with duct tape. I don't recall reading this before. Unwinding and binding with duct tape would take two hands. Again, I have to wonder how he kept these women subdued, while he was using both his hands. Would verbal threats be enough to keep them from trying to escape?

" ... two women who were bound with duct tape... "

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/opinion/columnists/top-colonels-story-could-heat-up-some-cold-cases-84292357.html

" ... bound the women with duct tape ... "

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Williams+Case+Being+accused+serial+rapist+neighbou r+Cosy+Cove+Lane/2560660/story.html

JMO

pinkeyesucks
02-14-2010, 12:15 AM
I have not heard this, but thanks for sharing it. While I was Googling this, I found several articles that mentioned that the victims were bound with duct tape. I don't recall reading this before. Unwinding and binding with duct tape would take two hands. Again, I have to wonder how he kept these women subdued, while he was using both his hands. Would verbal threats be enough to keep them from trying to escape?

" ... two women who were bound with duct tape... "

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/opinion/columnists/top-colonels-story-could-heat-up-some-cold-cases-84292357.html

" ... bound the women with duct tape ... "

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Williams+Case+Being+accused+serial+rapist+neighbou r+Cosy+Cove+Lane/2560660/story.html

JMO

If you sat on them to subdue them you could. And yes, I think that being whacked in the head and waking to find a large man in the room would be enough to confuse me for the time it would take to bind me up. I still think that he knocked the out first, especially if they attempted to fight. could have sat on them and used teeth and one hand for duct taping though.

Purely speculative though.

RubyRed
02-14-2010, 12:23 AM
bernardo hid his in the back of a closet behind a panel i believe. And then of course later in a lawyers office....

:)

behind a light fixure in a drop ceiling

http://www.allserialkillers.com/paul_bernardo.htm

Dee10
02-14-2010, 12:30 AM
Cops haven't searched Williams' Orleans home


Though two break and enters — in which the only items stolen were
women’s underpants — were committed in the Fallingbrook neighbourhood in
2008, police are stressing that Williams is not a suspect in those
incidents.

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2010/02/13/12871266-qmi.html

matou
02-14-2010, 12:35 AM
If Williams confessed to killing Jessica and helped lead LE to Jessica's body, why wouldn't he just confess to all other crimes he may have committed?

pinkeyesucks
02-14-2010, 12:40 AM
If Williams confessed to killing Jessica and helped lead LE to Jessica's body, why wouldn't he just confess to all other crimes he may have committed?

I think this is on many a mind. He is one smart man- if he confessed to the four crimes he committed it makes him look like he is being upfront and it does lower the suspicion radar a bit for linking him to other crimes though doesn't it. Perhaps he even changed his MO over the years to avoid being caught?

Just speculating though. I just don't believe that this "just started"....honest Mom, I've only done it this once....

Dee10
02-14-2010, 12:46 AM
If Williams confessed to killing Jessica and helped lead LE to Jessica's body, why wouldn't he just confess to all other crimes he may have committed?

Perhaps he is & they have to ck records so on to see if he is connected to crimes he confesses to?

Or maybe he is confessing to crimes that he is sunk with by evidence?

flipflop
02-14-2010, 12:57 AM
"They didn't tell the public they were looking for matching treads. They only asked the drivers if they saw anything unusual. Don't forget, at the time she was just missing, they didn't know she'd been murdered

But when a driver comes out of the blue and asks the police if they checked into tire tracks, did they have anything -- why the hell would you ask that?

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2010/02/13/12864936-sun.html

antiquegirl
02-14-2010, 01:28 AM
"They didn't tell the public they were looking for matching treads. They only asked the drivers if they saw anything unusual. Don't forget, at the time she was just missing, they didn't know she'd been murdered

But when a driver comes out of the blue and asks the police if they checked into tire tracks, did they have anything -- why the hell would you ask that?

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2010/02/13/12864936-sun.html

Interesting!

"a law enforcement source with knowledge of the matter, and speaking on condition of anonymity ... "

I'm pretty sure I know who this "anonymous" LE source is. These statements are almost identical to those said by (former OPP Sgt.) Cam Wooley on CP24 on Monday.

""showed the kind of unusual interest that others (motorists) didn't. Body language, facial expressions, questions asked -- police are trained in this kind of psychology. They look for tell-tale signs that could be the tip of the iceberg. It's a start."

JMO

antiquegirl
02-14-2010, 02:16 AM
Perhaps he is & they have to ck records so on to see if he is connected to crimes he confesses to?

Or maybe he is confessing to crimes that he is sunk with by evidence?

ITA with your first sentence. LE cannot charge him on confessions alone. They would need corroborating evidence before he could be charged with further crimes and this takes time. I'm not saying there will be other crimes uncovered, or that he has confessed to any, only that it's too soon to know one way or the other.

JMO

Patience
02-14-2010, 09:32 AM
Very Interesting

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Williams+Case+Neighbours+second+guess+Cozy+Cove+La ne/2560660/story.html

The victims were both women who lived alone. The attacks occurred in the dead of night. The intruder bound the women with duct tape, blindfolded them with pillow cases, tied them to chairs and photographed them.
"They asked all kinds of things. Did my father beat me, did my mother molest me," he says. "Personal stuff, like what kind of sex do you like.
Police told him it was one of the victims who identified him.

pinkeyesucks
02-14-2010, 10:07 AM
Found it....

"A source said police are probing 48 such cases and have recovered stolen lingerie - neatly stored, catalogued and concealed - in searches of the suspect's Ottawa home."

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/ontario-women-were-asphyxiated-source-says/article1465532/

This article also goes on the say:

"The "bizarre escalation" theory casts doubt on growing public speculation that the alleged pattern of sex crimes could incorporate decades-old "cold" cases of homicide or sexual assault."

Hence my theory of the change in MO to throw them off the track of other crimes that may or may not be linked in the coming months.

But the article was written by the man that will be publishing the coming book, so I dunno....trolling for sales?

antiquegirl
02-14-2010, 11:31 AM
Found it....

"A source said police are probing 48 such cases and have recovered stolen lingerie - neatly stored, catalogued and concealed - in searches of the suspect's Ottawa home."

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/ontario-women-were-asphyxiated-source-says/article1465532/

This article also goes on the say:

"The "bizarre escalation" theory casts doubt on growing public speculation that the alleged pattern of sex crimes could incorporate decades-old "cold" cases of homicide or sexual assault."

Hence my theory of the change in MO to throw them off the track of other crimes that may or may not be linked in the coming months.

But the article was written by the man that will be publishing the coming book, so I dunno....trolling for sales?

(BBM)

I would think that the man writing the book would be extra careful to make sure his reporting is accurate. If it later comes out that he got too many facts wrong, he will be discredited and fewer people will buy the book. As well, when newspaper journalists make mistakes, readers tend to blame (and sometimes sue) the publication rather than the individual reporter. This won't be the case with a book, where the onus will be on the writer. It would also stand to reason that TA is spending more time and effort doing research on this case than the average reporter. I trust the Globe & Mail more than all the Sun Publication outlets combined. Maybe this is just wishful thinking.

JMO

pinkeyesucks
02-14-2010, 11:55 AM
That is a good point. I think I just do not trust the media in general.

Hate the Sun. And I'm not keen on the National Post.

matou
02-14-2010, 12:43 PM
I think this is on many a mind. He is one smart man- if he confessed to the four crimes he committed it makes him look like he is being upfront and it does lower the suspicion radar a bit for linking him to other crimes though doesn't it. Perhaps he even changed his MO over the years to avoid being caught?

Just speculating though. I just don't believe that this "just started"....honest Mom, I've only done it this once....

I was comparing the similarities and differences between what we know about the crimes committed against Comeau and Jessica. In Comeau's case, she was killed and discovered in her home. In Jessica's case, she was not discovered in her home. We are not sure if she was killed there or somewhere else. If she was abducted, then this is a change in his MO, either an escalation of his crimes or a way to throw things off of an investigation involving a single perp.

About the strange behaviour while in custody i.e. acting like a POW. Does anyone know if he was even an actual POW, it all seems like an act to me. If he's capable of 'faking' this type of behaviour for his own reasons or to instill fear in LE or the jail guards, it seems to me that he will be a hard nut to crack r.e. his involvement in other crimes.

Just my opinion

flipflop
02-14-2010, 01:10 PM
It's anyone's guess how Russell Williams, then a six-year-old, reacted to his mother's first divorce. But years later, in 2001, he went ballistic when she divorced Jerry Sovka.

"Our mother's divorce from my stepfather caused a deep rift between him, my mother and myself," brother Harvey Williams said in a statement circulated to media this week. "We have had only minimal contact."

I wonder what would make a full grown man go "ballistic" over his mothers 2nd marriage ending? And then not talk with her for almost a decade.

pinkeyesucks
02-14-2010, 01:31 PM
I was surfing this morning and happened upon this Annual:

http://www.nddb-bndg.org/train/docs/Annual_2008-2009_e.pdf

Here are some interesting snippets:

In t e r e s t ing Fac t s
As of March 31, 2009, there were 158,493 DNA profiles from convicted offenders in the COI and 48,268
profiles from crime scene evidence in the CSI. Comparison of these DNA profiles has led to 11,503 matches
between offenders and crime scene samples (referred to as Offender Hits) and another 1,788 matches between
crime scene samples (referred to as Forensic Hits). The most prolific offender was associated to 47 crime scene
DNA profiles while the oldest case in the CSI dates back to 1964. The oldest case assisted by an Offender Hit
was linked to a 1981 murder from Alberta. The first Forensic Hit occurred on November 10, 2000 while the first
Offender Hit occurred on December 1, 2000.

I am new to all this so I found it quite enlightening:)

Summersolstice
02-14-2010, 01:44 PM
http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2010/02/13/12871266-qmi.html

RubyRed
02-14-2010, 01:56 PM
Nothing about the place stands out as suspicious in light of Williams’ arrest, he said, adding he’s not looking under any floorboards or popping his head into the attic because there's no reason to.
http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2010/02/13/12871266-qmi.html

I think I would be looking, or I would constantly be wondering. moo

pinkeyesucks
02-14-2010, 02:10 PM
Pretty much the same rules apply to military, in regards to DNA evidence with a few exceptions:

http://www2.parl.gc.ca/Sites/LOP/LegislativeSummaries/Bills_ls.asp?lang=E&ls=c18&source=library_prb&Parl=39&Ses=1#hclauses34
H. Clauses 34-46: Amendments to the National Defence Act

"Bill C-18 amends the National Defence Act so that the military justice system and its relationship with the National DNA Data Bank will mirror the civilian justice system. There are, however, some differences between the two systems, and the bill reflects this fact. Thus, clause 34 of the bill adds section 119.1 to the National Defence Act to make it clear that failure to comply with an order or summons is an offence. This mirrors the addition of section 487.0552 to the Criminal Code except that in the military justice system no reference is made to indictable or summary convictions, simply to imprisonment for less than two years or to “less punishment.” Similarly, clause 36 of the bill amends section 196.14 of the National Defence Act in a manner similar to clause 9, which amends section 487.051 of the Criminal Code to clarify the lack of discretion available to a court when imposing DNA orders for certain primary designated offences. In the military justice system, however, no young people will be tried, nor are discharges under section 730 of the Criminal Code an available punishment, so references to these two situations are removed."

Patience
02-14-2010, 03:30 PM
The police apparently say there is not a connection but I'm not convinced.

Another Bellville woman missing - Deborah Rashotte
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=95744&highlight=deborah+rashotte

antiquegirl
02-14-2010, 04:13 PM
It's anyone's guess how Russell Williams, then a six-year-old, reacted to his mother's first divorce. But years later, in 2001, he went ballistic when she divorced Jerry Sovka.

"Our mother's divorce from my stepfather caused a deep rift between him, my mother and myself," brother Harvey Williams said in a statement circulated to media this week. "We have had only minimal contact."

I wonder what would make a full grown man go "ballistic" over his mothers 2nd marriage ending? And then not talk with her for almost a decade.

I suspect the term "went ballistic" might be a bit of sensationalistic editorializing on the part of the reporter. Nowhere is the brother or anyone else quoted as using it.

Still, the rift must be real and RW likely blamed his mother for the divorce. The fact that he used his stepfather's surname suggests that either JS adopted the boys or that RW felt close to him, but I think the latter, since both men later reverted to their bio dad's name. RW was very young at the time of the first divorce and probably thought of JS as more of his own father than DW.

RW's mother has several times been described by old friends and neighbours as a very attractive woman back in those days. I'm just speculating that perhaps some infidelity might have played a part in one or both of these divorces. We may never find out.

When all the shrinks are done with him, I think there will be a very complex psychological profile of this man and "mother issues" will play a big part. We probably won't know until TA's book comes out ... if then.

JMO

antiquegirl
02-14-2010, 04:27 PM
The police apparently say there is not a connection but I'm not convinced.

Another Bellville woman missing - Deborah Rashotte
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=95744&highlight=deborah+rashotte

DR has a history of disappearing of her own free will for weeks at a time. Her family didn't report her missing until after almost a month. I am hoping that she will turn up safe very soon.

This is her own FB page:

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=579495994&ref=fs#!/profile.php?v=info&ref=fs&id=579495994

JMO

LadyL
02-14-2010, 05:59 PM
It's anyone's guess how Russell Williams, then a six-year-old, reacted to his mother's first divorce. But years later, in 2001, he went ballistic when she divorced Jerry Sovka.

"Our mother's divorce from my stepfather caused a deep rift between him, my mother and myself," brother Harvey Williams said in a statement circulated to media this week. "We have had only minimal contact."

I wonder what would make a full grown man go "ballistic" over his mothers 2nd marriage ending? And then not talk with her for almost a decade.

the term 'ballistic' seems to be the reporter's word

but I too wonder that a divorce would 'cause an adult to be upset with other family members

the only thing I was speculating on is the possibility of the mother having an affair, which could tie into his hatred of women but then why wouldn't he stay in contact with his stepfather?

idk - having a hard time understanding how a divorce would 'cause a decade-long rift between brothers and a mother & son ...

LadyL
02-14-2010, 06:00 PM
I was surfing this morning and happened upon this Annual:

http://www.nddb-bndg.org/train/docs/Annual_2008-2009_e.pdf

Here are some interesting snippets:

In t e r e s t ing Fac t s
As of March 31, 2009, there were 158,493 DNA profiles from convicted offenders in the COI and 48,268
profiles from crime scene evidence in the CSI. Comparison of these DNA profiles has led to 11,503 matches
between offenders and crime scene samples (referred to as Offender Hits) and another 1,788 matches between
crime scene samples (referred to as Forensic Hits). The most prolific offender was associated to 47 crime scene
DNA profiles while the oldest case in the CSI dates back to 1964. The oldest case assisted by an Offender Hit
was linked to a 1981 murder from Alberta. The first Forensic Hit occurred on November 10, 2000 while the first
Offender Hit occurred on December 1, 2000.

I am new to all this so I found it quite enlightening:)

very interesting ... ty for posting

antiquegirl
02-14-2010, 06:14 PM
the term 'ballistic' seems to be the reporter's word

but I too wonder that a divorce would 'cause an adult to be upset with other family members

the only thing I was speculating on is the possibility of the mother having an affair, which could tie into his hatred of women but then why wouldn't he stay in contact with his stepfather?

idk - having a hard time understanding how a divorce would 'cause a decade-long rift between brothers and a mother & son ...

Great minds think alike. ;)

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased Canada - Jessica Lloyd, 27, Belleville, Ontario 01/28/2010 thread #2

LadyL
02-14-2010, 06:18 PM
http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2010/02/13/12871266-qmi.html

If police decide to check out Williams’ old haunt, one thing is certain: They will need a warrant before the current owners let them in.
“I wouldn’t let them come in my house. I mean, come on,” said the man.
“It’s kind of a tough situation for us. We just got married and moved in the house.”

really??? I find that odd ... I mean, obviously no one wants to have to open their home to investigators ... no one wants to be invaded that way but I personally wouldn't hesitate if it would help the case & help solve crimes!

does anyone else find it strange that this person says he wouldn't let them in without a warrant?

LadyL
02-14-2010, 06:23 PM
Great minds think alike. ;)

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased Canada - Jessica Lloyd, 27, Belleville, Ontario 01/28/2010 thread #2 (http://websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4811045&postcount=32)

I should've read ahead first :blushing:

pinkeyesucks
02-14-2010, 06:27 PM
Perhaps the new owner was just annoyed that people are now speculating what might be found in HIS house...it must be weird to suddenly have the press parked on your lawn taking pictures. That strange feeling of being part of something that feels sinister without actually being part of it.

I dunno, it was just a thought, I don't know how I would feel about it. I'm trying to put myself in the same situation and I'm coming up a bit blank.

antiquegirl
02-14-2010, 06:28 PM
If police decide to check out Williams’ old haunt, one thing is certain: They will need a warrant before the current owners let them in.
“I wouldn’t let them come in my house. I mean, come on,” said the man.
“It’s kind of a tough situation for us. We just got married and moved in the house.”

really??? I find that odd ... I mean, obviously no one wants to have to open their home to investigators ... no one wants to be invaded that way but I personally wouldn't hesitate if it would help the case & help solve crimes!

does anyone else find it strange that this person says he wouldn't let them in without a warrant?

Yes. I thought the same thing. It's not as if LE would toss the place as if you were a suspect. And yes, I'd be curious enough to look around myself, albeit with great trepidation. I hope LE gets a warrant, but I doubt that someone as meticulous and orderly as RW would leave anything incriminating behind when they moved.

JMO

Patience
02-14-2010, 06:36 PM
Another victim of Russ Williams/Sovka?

Parents of slain Ontario woman relive pain with news of colonel's arrest

Read more: http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Parents+slain+Ontario+woman+relive+pain+with+news+ colonel+arrest/2558147/story.html#ixzz0fYJIrZhj (http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Parents+slain+Ontario+woman+relive+pain+with+news+ colonel+arrest/2558147/story.html#ixzz0fYJIrZhj)

Margaret McWilliam, of Deep River, Ont., was 21 years old in 1987 when she was raped and killed while out for a jog in a Scarborough, Ont., park about a half-kilometre from her new Toronto home.

RubyRed
02-14-2010, 06:51 PM
If police decide to check out Williams’ old haunt, one thing is certain: They will need a warrant before the current owners let them in.
“I wouldn’t let them come in my house. I mean, come on,” said the man.
“It’s kind of a tough situation for us. We just got married and moved in the house.”

really??? I find that odd ... I mean, obviously no one wants to have to open their home to investigators ... no one wants to be invaded that way but I personally wouldn't hesitate if it would help the case & help solve crimes!

does anyone else find it strange that this person says he wouldn't let them in without a warrant?

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2010/02/13/12871266-qmi.html

bbm
I find that odd and this:

he’s not looking under any floorboards or popping his head into the attic because there’s no reason to.

Seriously , if the police felt they needed to search, I for one would want them to . I know if I lived there , I would probably look . That is just me, though. moo

RubyRed
02-14-2010, 06:59 PM
Another victim of Russ Williams/Sovka?

Parents of slain Ontario woman relive pain with news of colonel's arrest

Read more: http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Parents+slain+Ontario+woman+relive+pain+with+news+ colonel+arrest/2558147/story.html#ixzz0fYJIrZhj (http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Parents+slain+Ontario+woman+relive+pain+with+news+ colonel+arrest/2558147/story.html#ixzz0fYJIrZhj)

Margaret McWilliam, of Deep River, Ont., was 21 years old in 1987 when she was raped and killed while ]out for a jog in a Scarborough, Ont., park about a half-kilometre from her new Toronto home.






The police have a lot of work ahead of them.

pinkeyesucks
02-14-2010, 07:52 PM
Just returned for what would have been a regular after supper jaunt to the local drug store. The atmosphere around here is very different than what it was a few weeks ago. Not a single person on the street once darkness falls. Streets that I used to walk down I bypassed feeling like there is not enough light. This has had an enormous impact on our little community.

LadyL
02-14-2010, 10:01 PM
Just returned for what would have been a regular after supper jaunt to the local drug store. The atmosphere around here is very different than what it was a few weeks ago. Not a single person on the street once darkness falls. Streets that I used to walk down I bypassed feeling like there is not enough light. This has had an enormous impact on our little community.

sad )-;

hope everyone can get back to their regular routine soon

yes, keep an eye out & protect yourself but people should be comfortable enough to enjoy their own community - otherwise the bad guys win

a good ol' take back the night rally might be helpful for morale? or some kind of community get-together to address the fear people need to bond in their anger & shock

RubyRed
02-14-2010, 10:16 PM
[QUOTE=pinkeyesucks;4811559]Just returned for what would have been a regular after supper jaunt to the local drug store. The atmosphere around here is very different than what it was a few weeks ago. Not a single person on the street once darkness falls. Streets that I used to walk down I bypassed feeling like there is not enough light. This has had an enormous impact on our little community.[/QUote:

:rings: hang in there, don't let the bad guy win.

Patience
02-14-2010, 11:42 PM
Ottawa police recover hidden keepsakes from home of military commander accused of murder

Read more: http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/a8re+Prairies/2564856/Police+recover+hidden+keepsakes+from+military+comm ander+home/2564958/story.html#ixzz0fZYW2V7X (http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/a8re+Prairies/2564856/Police+recover+hidden+keepsakes+from+military+comm ander+home/2564958/story.html#ixzz0fZYW2V7X)

OTTAWA — Police say they have recovered evidence — including hidden keepsakes — from the Ottawa home of a former Ontario military base commander charged with murdering two women.

Ontario Provincial Police investigating Col. Russell Williams also said Sunday they have matched a print from a homicide scene to the 46-year-old’s boot

Dee10
02-15-2010, 01:01 AM
Ottawa police recover hidden keepsakes from home of military commander accused of murder

Read more: http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/a8re+Prairies/2564856/Police+recover+hidden+keepsakes+from+military+comm ander+home/2564958/story.html#ixzz0fZYW2V7X (http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/a8re+Prairies/2564856/Police+recover+hidden+keepsakes+from+military+comm ander+home/2564958/story.html#ixzz0fZYW2V7X)

OTTAWA — Police say they have recovered evidence — including hidden keepsakes — from the Ottawa home of a former Ontario military base commander charged with murdering two women.

Ontario Provincial Police investigating Col. Russell Williams also said Sunday they have matched a print from a homicide scene to the 46-year-old’s boot




I gotta a question...from the boxes in the picture that were carried out...the only place I would think they could have been hidden is the attic? This was one picture, I wonder if there were more "BOXES"? AND this was at the Ottawa home, wonder what is "hidden" at the cottage??? Wonder why they didn't take them the other day, the date on the picture is Sunday?

Dee10
02-15-2010, 01:06 AM
Just had another thought, since he didn't move in until December, I am guessing these are or could be boxes from the old house. LE certainly has their work cut out for them! :furious:

antiquegirl
02-15-2010, 01:27 AM
I gotta a question...from the boxes in the picture that were carried out...the only place I would think they could have been hidden is the attic? This was one picture, I wonder if there were more "BOXES"? AND this was at the Ottawa home, wonder what is "hidden" at the cottage??? Wonder why they didn't take them the other day, the date on the picture is Sunday?

This is just a guess, but those boxes aren't necessarily the boxes they were stored in. LE could have taken those boxes into the house and put smaller bags, boxes, items, etc. into them before removing them from the house. It's possible that before they removed these items, they spent days cataloguing and photographing what they found - better to preserve the evidence in as close to original condition as they could. Hasn't it been reported that items were hidden in heating ducts? He might also have had DVDs, CDs, computer discs, etc. in plain sight on shelves, possibly mislabeled to fool his wife. LE would just put them all in these generic boxes.

I am surprised, too, that he would hide things in the Ottawa house instead of the cottage, where he had more time alone. Wondering if these items from Ottawa were from previous crimes that were moved from their old house and the cottage might contain evidence from the local crimes. Or maybe the cottage didn't have any good hiding places?

JMO

EDIT: Sorry, Dee, I see you wrote the same thing about evidence taken from the old house to the new one.

Hazel
02-15-2010, 04:01 AM
This is just a guess, but those boxes aren't necessarily the boxes they were stored in. LE could have taken those boxes into the house and put smaller bags, boxes, items, etc. into them before removing them from the house.
Those boxes look used to me (or shall I say reused). In the following link we can see a zoomed version of that same picture. IMO those are not boxes LE brought in, but boxes that were found in the house. I also recall seeing a picture of LE bringing in brand new flattened cardboard boxes

big picture of BOXES = http://www.windsorstar.com/news/williams-investigation/index.html

I have been wondering if that roadside canvass scared the pants off him, and he perhaps thought LE were getting a bit too close. Would it be possible he packed some items from the cottage and brought them to Ottawa (all speculation on my part, just throwing an idea out there, not that I really think that could be the case). I too thought he would keep his keepsakes in the cottage, if only for fear his wife will decide to reorganize the room/space/closet or whatever area he was keeping those "souvenirs".





Hasn't it been reported that items were hidden in heating ducts?
I read about that here in WS, but to be honest, I haven't seen that reported (as of yet), and it sounds very possible. If items were in those boxes we see in the picture, then how about a locked trunk or secret wall compartment? Just speculating.



He might also have had DVDs, CDs, computer discs, etc. in plain sight on shelves, possibly mislabeled to fool his wife. LE would just put them all in these generic boxes. Wouldn't that be way too risky?

rs&bbm (sorry antiquegirl for dissecting your post :angel: )

flipflop
02-15-2010, 09:47 AM
I gotta a question...from the boxes in the picture that were carried out...the only place I would think they could have been hidden is the attic? This was one picture, I wonder if there were more "BOXES"? AND this was at the Ottawa home, wonder what is "hidden" at the cottage??? Wonder why they didn't take them the other day, the date on the picture is Sunday?


The officers were carrying stacks of flat boxes, garbage bags and a large roll of brown paper that they used to cover all the windows.
http://www.trentonian.ca/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=2446011

If you check out pic 3 in this link, you will see LE carrying new flat boxes into RW's house
http://www.canada.com/news/Police+search+Williams+Ottawa+home/2550481/story.html

but the boxes in this photo do not appear to be the new boxes that they carried inside
http://www.windsorstar.com/news/williams-investigation/index.html
can anyone read what is written on the "used" box carried by the plain clothes detective? I zoomed in but couldn't make out the wording.

antiquegirl
02-15-2010, 10:09 AM
The officers were carrying stacks of flat boxes, garbage bags and a large roll of brown paper that they used to cover all the windows.
http://www.trentonian.ca/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=2446011

If you check out pic 5 in this link, you will see LE carrying new flat boxes into RW's house
http://www.canada.com/news/Police+search+Williams+Ottawa+home/2550481/story.html

but the boxes in this photo do not appear to be the new boxes that they carried inside
http://www.windsorstar.com/news/williams-investigation/index.html

I haven't seen that picture before. Can I be forgiven for noticing that the cop in the blue shirt is hot? ;)

JMO

flipflop
02-15-2010, 10:15 AM
I haven't seen that picture before. Can I be forgiven for noticing that the cop in the blue shirt is hot? ;)

JMO

Hell YAAAAAAAA you can be forgiven right along with me as I agree with you!

antiquegirl
02-15-2010, 10:33 AM
Those boxes look used to me (or shall I say reused). In the following link we can see a zoomed version of that same picture. IMO those are not boxes LE brought in, but boxes that were found in the house. I also recall seeing a picture of LE bringing in brand new flattened cardboard boxes[/B]

big picture of BOXES = http://www.windsorstar.com/news/williams-investigation/index.html

I have been wondering if that roadside canvass scared the pants off him, and he perhaps thought LE were getting a bit too close. Would it be possible he packed some items from the cottage and brought them to Ottawa (all speculation on my part, just throwing an idea out there, not that I really think that could be the case). I too thought he would keep his keepsakes in the cottage, if only for fear his wife will decide to reorganize the room/space/closet or whatever area he was keeping those "souvenirs".


I read about that here in WS, but to be honest, I haven't seen that reported (as of yet), and it sounds very possible. If items were in those boxes we see in the picture, then how about a locked trunk or secret wall compartment? Just speculating.


Wouldn't that be way too risky?

rs&bbm (sorry antiquegirl for dissecting your post :angel: )

Hazel, I don't mind at all having my post dissected. We're here to brainstorm and examine all options. I do it all the time.

I agree that that particular pic shows boxes that look used. LE probably removed a lot of stuff, including previously packed and those packed by them.

Yes, leaving out CDs and the like would be risky, but we've pretty much determined how cocky and arrogant RW is. Based on his military background and from all we've heard, I can well imagine him being controlling and authoritative in his marriage ("My stuff is private and not to be touched!"). He almost certainly had his own office with military files and such that his wife might not be interested in.

Anyway, this is all speculation and conjecture. I could be totally wrong on all counts.

JMO

flipflop
02-15-2010, 10:59 AM
Those boxes look used to me (or shall I say reused). In the following link we can see a zoomed version of that same picture. IMO those are not boxes LE brought in, but boxes that were found in the house. I also recall seeing a picture of LE bringing in brand new flattened cardboard boxes[/B]

big picture of BOXES = http://www.windsorstar.com/news/williams-investigation/index.html

I have been wondering if that roadside canvass scared the pants off him, and he perhaps thought LE were getting a bit too close. Would it be possible he packed some items from the cottage and brought them to Ottawa (all speculation on my part, just throwing an idea out there, not that I really think that could be the case). I too thought he would keep his keepsakes in the cottage, if only for fear his wife will decide to reorganize the room/space/closet or whatever area he was keeping those "souvenirs".


I read about that here in WS, but to be honest, I haven't seen that reported (as of yet), and it sounds very possible. If items were in those boxes we see in the picture, then how about a locked trunk or secret wall compartment? Just speculating.


Wouldn't that be way too risky?

rs&bbm (sorry antiquegirl for dissecting your post :angel: )

JMO: I bet he was they type of guy that had a "military" office in his home which was under lock and key with him always carrying the only key. Im sure he would have lead his wife to believe that this office held "top secret" military information. Which would not make her curious and would respect his privacy for his position. I cannot imagine what his wife is feeling at this point. Having your husbands name splashed across the front page of every national and local newspaper, I really feel for her being innocent and having your home riped apart and just knowing that all of this evidence, deceased womens panties, pic of them, etc was right within the safety of her own home. Just as the families and friends of the victims, how does she ever recover from something like this.

antiquegirl
02-15-2010, 11:15 AM
JMO: I bet he was they type of guy that had a "military" office in his home which was under lock and key with him always carrying the only key. Im sure he would have lead his wife to believe that this office held "top secret" military information. Which would not make her curious and would respect his privacy for his position. I cannot imagine what his wife is feeling at this point. Having your husbands name splashed across the front page of every national and local newspaper, I really feel for her being innocent and having your home riped apart and just knowing that all of this evidence, deceased womens panties, pic of them, etc was right within the safety of her own home. Just as the families and friends of the victims, how does she ever recover from something like this.

(BBM)

Last night I Googled his name and it came up with an astounding 2000+ hits! (Just for this case only and doesn't include anyone else with the same name.)

I would not bet against you and agree that your guess is a very likely scenario. And ITA about his poor wife, too. Can you imagine her concentrating on anything else except this case and how she could have missed any signs? She must be a total wreck and her life changed forever. :(

antiquegirl
02-15-2010, 11:55 AM
(Carried over from the previous thread)


Originally Posted by pjgrrrl

I also got to wondering how someone would successfully break into 48 different homes without an incidence occurring? Like, a dog barking? A boyfriend lurking inside? The woman sleeping? Alarm systems? It really seems way too risky to me, but I might be missing something. I don't know how to break into a house afterall or know how easy it is. I mean I am guessing some of these houses were close together- so how did not even one person notice? Sheesh.

I've been giving this some thought and wondered how this specific number was arrived at. It doesn't seem like one that the media would make up, nor one that RW would volunteer off the bat.

So, what if LE asked him, "When did these break-ins begin?" and he replied that he started just around the time he graduated from university (1986). "And how often do you think you perpetrated these type of activities?". Possible response: "On the average of twice-a-year." That would add up to approximately four dozen.

Of course, this is purely guesswork and any number combinations could work equally well. But if he spaced out the B & E's this far apart, it would give him plenty of time to stake out the homes, make sure they were empty, and minimize the risk of getting caught.

It would be almost impossible for LE to tie him to most of these crimes and I doubt they'll go to much bother considering the far more serious charges.

JMO

pinkeyesucks
02-15-2010, 11:58 AM
In regards to the boxes of "evidence" removed from the house. I doubt they would have brought the actual boxes that that everything was hidden in out of the house without placing everything into a different container (or box) first. Just as a means of preserving the integrity of the evidence and where it was found. eg- these 12 items were found here, these 4 were hidden here....But that is just an opinion.

Wow. The wife. Still so many things not being talked about publicly. I think I am debating her position as much as I am debating the cocky/careless what the heck just happened one....do you think he provided a full statement with complete cooperation to protect her in some way? Although, it's not as if she could testify against him, so that doesn't fit. Much more debate to follow in my head I am quiet sure....

Someone raised the question of RW ever being a POW. I doubt it. But I think that the Geneva Convention is well studied by anyone that enters the military, and quite sure that someone of high rank would be very well versed in what is required should they ever by interrogated. Perhaps it was because his lives suddenly meshed? Part II of the Geneva Convention states:

"CAPTURE

Art. 5. Every prisoner of war is required to declare, if he is interrogated on the subject, his true names and rank, or his regimental number.
If he infringes this rule, he exposes himself to a restriction of the privileges accorded to prisoners of his category."

http://www.icrc.org/IHL.NSF/FULL/305?OpenDocument

It was a very dry but interesting read.

Purely speculation on my part.

antiquegirl
02-15-2010, 12:23 PM
Wow. The wife. Still so many things not being talked about publicly. I think I am debating her position as much as I am debating the cocky/careless what the heck just happened one....do you think he provided a full statement with complete cooperation to protect her in some way? Although, it's not as if she could testify against him, so that doesn't fit. Much more debate to follow in my head I am quiet sure....

(Respectfully snipped and bolded by me)

Thanks for this, pinkeye.

I just did a little research on this and to the best of my knowledge, while spouses are not compelled to testify against their legal partners, they can voluntarily do so. Also, if the couple legally separates before the trial, the law no longer applies. All of this is moot if there will be no trial, of course, which is possible if he confessed as reported.

JMO

pinkeyesucks
02-15-2010, 12:28 PM
Originally Posted by pjgrrrl

"I also got to wondering how someone would successfully break into 48 different homes without an incidence occurring? Like, a dog barking? A boyfriend lurking inside? The woman sleeping? Alarm systems? It really seems way too risky to me, but I might be missing something. I don't know how to break into a house afterall or know how easy it is. I mean I am guessing some of these houses were close together- so how did not even one person notice? Sheesh."

I dunno pjgrrrl, but I'm kinda creeped out considering it wasn't more than 3 weeks ago that we were warned of a peeping tom in our neighbourhood! My guess would be that he scoped the joints out fairly well before attempting to get in.

RubyRed
02-15-2010, 12:32 PM
Quiet student. Respected military leader. Alleged serial killer. Can the experiences of the boy help us understand the man?

But the shock of these events, coupled with the extent of Williams' career and life, have police officials, media and the public grappling for answers as to how such a highly successful, well-educated and well-respected career officer could face such serious charges.


http://www.thestar.com/news/ontario/article/764948--life-and-times-of-col-russell-williams?bn=1

flipflop
02-15-2010, 12:37 PM
Originally Posted by pjgrrrl

"I also got to wondering how someone would successfully break into 48 different homes without an incidence occurring? Like, a dog barking? A boyfriend lurking inside? The woman sleeping? Alarm systems? It really seems way too risky to me, but I might be missing something. I don't know how to break into a house afterall or know how easy it is. I mean I am guessing some of these houses were close together- so how did not even one person notice? Sheesh."

I dunno pjgrrrl, but I'm kinda creeped out considering it wasn't more than 3 weeks ago that we were warned of a peeping tom in our neighbourhood! My guess would be that he scoped the joints out fairly well before attempting to get in.

I agree with you, IMO he scoped every joint out for things like alarms, dogs, or other people in the house, what times they arrived etc. I think he was very clever in this aspect, but got sloppy due to the snow. (leaving tracks from his SUV and boot prints in the snow) If it was not winter with snow on the ground, who knows how many more victims we would be reading about.

LimeCola
02-15-2010, 02:00 PM
Quiet student. Respected military leader. Alleged serial killer. Can the experiences of the boy help us understand the man?

But the shock of these events, coupled with the extent of Williams' career and life, have police officials, media and the public grappling for answers as to how such a highly successful, well-educated and well-respected career officer could face such serious charges.


http://www.thestar.com/news/ontario/article/764948--life-and-times-of-col-russell-williams?bn=1

"They went to the same university and took some of the same courses on economics, the same campus, they lived in the same Scarborough neighbourhood ... that's a coincidental thing from what we can gather," a police source told the Star. "We are getting a lot of information on all kinds of different things."

I don't know... this seems like more than coincidence to me. How many rapist/serial killers could there have been in their Scarborough neighbourhood?

RubyRed
02-15-2010, 02:04 PM
"They went to the same university and took some of the same courses on economics, the same campus, they lived in the same Scarborough neighbourhood ... that's a coincidental thing from what we can gather," a police source told the Star. "We are getting a lot of information on all kinds of different things."

I don't know... this seems like more than coincidence to me. How many rapist/serial killers could there have been in their Scarborough neighbourhood?

Between these two nut jobs I just want to vomit.:sick:

antiquegirl
02-15-2010, 02:23 PM
"They went to the same university and took some of the same courses on economics, the same campus, they lived in the same Scarborough neighbourhood ... that's a coincidental thing from what we can gather," a police source told the Star. "We are getting a lot of information on all kinds of different things."

I don't know... this seems like more than coincidence to me. How many rapist/serial killers could there have been in their Scarborough neighbourhood?


It does sound too coincidental, but coincidences do happen.

Many years ago, my oldest friend lived within 3 kilometers of Williams' cottage in Tweed. They later moved to Port Dalhousie and ended up living a block away from Paul Bernardo. Her son went to school with Kristen French. His friend lived right next door to PB and the two of them went through PB's garbage when French was missing. What are the odds that she lived so close to two serial offenders in two different locations?

I'd personally be surprised if LE found proof that PB and RW were "pals" in their university days. They sound like two completely different personality types. PB was a party animal, stealing license plates and smuggling cigarettes in his youth. RW sounds like an introverted nerd with no social life, according to interviews.

JMO

pinkeyesucks
02-15-2010, 02:36 PM
I can't tell if these pictures are all the same as the ones linked earlier in regards to the evidence removed from the house but in this shot you can see some of the writing on the sides of the box, and they look like the original box size that was shown being carried into the Ottawa home a few days ago.

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Police+remove+boxes+evidence+from+Williams+Westbor o+home/2565091/story.html

antiquegirl
02-15-2010, 02:55 PM
I can't tell if these pictures are all the same as the ones linked earlier in regards to the evidence removed from the house but in this shot you can see some of the writing on the sides of the box, and they look like the original box size that was shown being carried into the Ottawa home a few days ago.

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Police+remove+boxes+evidence+from+Williams+Westbor o+home/2565091/story.html

From the same article:

" ... have matched a snowy print from a homicide scene to a boot worn by the former base commander."

I've seen mention of this boot print several times without it being identified as coming from Jessica's case. Is it possible that it actually came from Marie-France Comeau's crime scene? Was there snow on the ground, or could this report be mistaken and it could have come from soft or muddy ground? To link RW to both crimes this way would be a coup for LE.

JMO

nonfictionrocks
02-15-2010, 03:16 PM
It does sound too coincidental, but coincidences do happen.

Many years ago, my oldest friend lived within 3 kilometers of Williams' cottage in Tweed. They later moved to Port Dalhousie and ended up living a block away from Paul Bernardo. Her son went to school with Kristen French. His friend lived right next door to PB and the two of them went through PB's garbage when French was missing. What are the odds that she lived so close to two serial offenders in two different locations?

I'd personally be surprised if LE found proof that PB and RW were "pals" in their university days. They sound like two completely different personality types. PB was a party animal, stealing license plates and smuggling cigarettes in his youth. RW sounds like an introverted nerd with no social life, according to interviews.

JMO

I know this is OT but did your friend's son suspect PB and if so, why?

antiquegirl
02-15-2010, 03:24 PM
I know this is OT but did your friend's son suspect PB and if so, why?

My friend didn't say, but I'm guessing that as teenage boys who were French's schoolmates, they probably went through many garbage cans, with PB's just being handily next door. She did say that they didn't find anything.

Patience
02-15-2010, 04:41 PM
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2010/02/08/f-williams-biography.html

jokie7348
02-15-2010, 05:19 PM
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2010/02/08/f-williams-biography.html

Thanks for the biography link. I believe I have read all of the biographical information on Williams, but I have not seen when he married, how many years he has been married, and if they have any children. I would be interested in seeing this info although I don't know how to look it up.

Just wondering if he married late in life and if there are no children.

pinkeyesucks
02-15-2010, 05:24 PM
From the same article:

" ... have matched a snowy print from a homicide scene to a boot worn by the former base commander."

I've seen mention of this boot print several times without it being identified as coming from Jessica's case. Is it possible that it actually came from Marie-France Comeau's crime scene? Was there snow on the ground, or could this report be mistaken and it could have come from soft or muddy ground? To link RW to both crimes this way would be a coup for LE.

JMO

No snow in Brighton that day, and if you look at the picture on at this link, with cruiser parked in front of the crime scene.....I do believe, I see wet, rainy, MUDDY front lawn.

But that is just my opinion:)

armywife
02-15-2010, 05:41 PM
Thanks for the biography link. I believe I have read all of the biographical information on Williams, but I have not seen when he married, how many years he has been married, and if they have any children. I would be interested in seeing this info although I don't know how to look it up.

Just wondering if he married late in life and if there are no children.

BBM

I haven't seen anything stating when they married, but is has been said in that they have no children.

This is one article stating such:
CTV Toronto Russ Williams' profile: A distinguished military man (http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20100209/williams_bio_100209/20100209/?hub=TorontoNewHome)

flipflop
02-15-2010, 05:43 PM
No snow in Brighton that day, and if you look at the picture on at this link, with cruiser parked in front of the crime scene.....I do believe, I see wet, rainy, MUDDY front lawn.

But that is just my opinion:)

matched a snowy print from a homicide scene to a boot worn by the former base commander.

I took it that it must have been a JL's house that they found the snowy boot print, as the other took place in Nov when we had no snow.

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Police+remove+boxes+evidence+from+Williams+Westbor o+home/2565091/story.html

flipflop
02-15-2010, 06:08 PM
the media can be very misleading....

Police detectives first visited the Edison Avenue home earlier this week, but not to search it for evidence.

Instead, they were there to retrieve some of Harriman’s personal belongings and purse. http://www.ottawacitizen.com/technology/Police+search+begins+Westboro+home+accused+killer/2551107/story.html

then another source prints the following making it sound like they FOUND someones purse

Purse found in search of Colonel Williams’ Ottawa home
Posted on February 10, 2010

Police have conducted a brief search of Colonel Russ Williams’ Ottawa home, and were seen leaving with a few items.

Two officers left the home with a red, leather woman’s purse and two shopping bags yesterday, then looked through the blue BMW in the driveway. The investigators refused to comment and provincial police won’t say what the officers were looking for during their short visit. Williams, the former commander of CFB Trenton, shares the house with his wife, Mary Elizabeth Harriman
http://www.mix97.com/news/?s=jessica+lloyd

antiquegirl
02-15-2010, 06:24 PM
BBM

I haven't seen anything stating when they married, but is has been said in that they have no children.

This is one article stating such:
CTV Toronto Russ Williams' profile: A distinguished military man (http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20100209/williams_bio_100209/20100209/?hub=TorontoNewHome)

From these articles, it seems that the couple met and married approximately 19 years ago.

"One of his first jobs in the military was instructing pilots in Portage la Prairie, Man. The small town was also where he married his wife, Mary Elizabeth Harriman."

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/colonel-russell-williams-is-a-man-no-one-really-knew/article1463964/

"But Williams was a natural flyer; so accomplished, in fact, that after earning his wings in 1990, his first job was instructing pilots in CT-134 Beech Musketeer aircraft at the Forces' flying school in Portage la Prairie, Man.

It was there that he met and married his wife, Mary Elizabeth Harriman, in 1991."

http://www.timescolonist.com/technology/Accused+killer+early+years+instability+privilege/2558189/story.html

It has also been reported that MEH is a few years older than her husband.

"Neighbours in Orléans said Harriman celebrated her 50th birthday a few months ago."

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/mikeholmes/would+suspect+Pope+before+would+suspect+Russ/2543042/story.html

HTH

pinkeyesucks
02-15-2010, 06:26 PM
The snow is pretty crunchy around here. I wonder if it's the same there. Same thing crosses my mind again...cocky (or) careless....the voices in my head are driving me nuts!

antiquegirl
02-15-2010, 06:33 PM
the media can be very misleading....

Police detectives first visited the Edison Avenue home earlier this week, but not to search it for evidence.

Instead, they were there to retrieve some of Harriman’s personal belongings and purse. http://www.ottawacitizen.com/technology/Police+search+begins+Westboro+home+accused+killer/2551107/story.html

then another source prints the following making it sound like they FOUND someones purse

Purse found in search of Colonel Williams’ Ottawa home
Posted on February 10, 2010

Police have conducted a brief search of Colonel Russ Williams’ Ottawa home, and were seen leaving with a few items.

Two officers left the home with a red, leather woman’s purse and two shopping bags yesterday, then looked through the blue BMW in the driveway. The investigators refused to comment and provincial police won’t say what the officers were looking for during their short visit. Williams, the former commander of CFB Trenton, shares the house with his wife, Mary Elizabeth Harriman
http://www.mix97.com/news/?s=jessica+lloyd

Ah, here we go again with the media. I'm guessing that "car" is a typo (the "r" is right beside the "t") and it should have been "cat". RW (macho dude) would not have been so embarrassed about having pictures of his car.

I also believe that it was MEH's purse that LE removed from the house. We know that Jessica left her purse behind when she vanished and there has been no word about Marie-France's being missing. It also doesn't fit with the type of trophies he's been reported to take with him.

Darn irresponsible journalism!

JMO

Hazel
02-15-2010, 06:36 PM
BBM

I haven't seen anything stating when they married, but is has been said in that they have no children.

This is one article stating such:
CTV Toronto Russ Williams' profile: A distinguished military man (http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20100209/williams_bio_100209/20100209/?hub=TorontoNewHome)


:Welcome-12-june: to WS armywife !

They have said the Williams bought the Orleans home 14+ years, so that would be around 1995. I haven't read anything stating when and where they got married

flipflop
02-15-2010, 06:37 PM
he was charged on Sunday night after a nine-hour police interrogation.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/colonel-russell-williams-is-a-man-no-one-really-knew/article1463964/

now thats a long chat....

Hazel
02-15-2010, 06:43 PM
"But Williams was a natural flyer; so accomplished, in fact, that after earning his wings in 1990, his first job was instructing pilots in CT-134 Beech Musketeer aircraft at the Forces' flying school in Portage la Prairie, Man.

It was there that he met and married his wife, Mary Elizabeth Harriman, in 1991."

http://www.timescolonist.com/technology/Accused+killer+early+years+instability+privilege/2558189/story.html

It has also been reported that MEH is a few years older than her husband.

"Neighbours in Orléans said Harriman celebrated her 50th birthday a few months ago."

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/mikeholmes/would+suspect+Pope+before+would+suspect+Russ/2543042/story.html

HTH

Thanks for the info antiquegirl! RW is turning 47 next month (March 7); which makes him a Pisces FWIW.


http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/763904--colonel-s-stepfather-can-t-figure-out-murder-charges

Hazel
02-15-2010, 06:55 PM
Trenton to parade for troops


Quinte West Mayor John Williams, who oversees an area that includes Trenton, issued a statement before the funeral of Jessica Lloyd calling for residents to show up for a “military appreciation rally” next Saturday.

Starting at 10 a.m. at Bain Park, on the corner of Hwy. 2 and RCAF Rd., marchers will end up at the busy highway’s entrance to CFB Trenton, Canada’s largest military transportion base.

“We encourage everyone to come out and show their support to the men and women of the military and their families,” Mayor Williams said in his notice, calling the parade “neighbours supporting neighbours.”
read more : http://www.torontosun.com/news/torontoandgta/2010/02/14/12879051.html

LadyL
02-15-2010, 07:20 PM
It does sound too coincidental, but coincidences do happen.

Many years ago, my oldest friend lived within 3 kilometers of Williams' cottage in Tweed. They later moved to Port Dalhousie and ended up living a block away from Paul Bernardo. Her son went to school with Kristen French. His friend lived right next door to PB and the two of them went through PB's garbage when French was missing. What are the odds that she lived so close to two serial offenders in two different locations?

I'd personally be surprised if LE found proof that PB and RW were "pals" in their university days. They sound like two completely different personality types. PB was a party animal, stealing license plates and smuggling cigarettes in his youth. RW sounds like an introverted nerd with no social life, according to interviews.

JMO

[bbm]

:eek:

oh, man I have sooooo many questions about that but wrong thread, wrong time

Hazel
02-15-2010, 07:32 PM
the media can be very misleading....



another typo and misleading info:


Court appearance set for Thursday Updated: Sat Feb. 13 2010 19:01:57

As investigators searched Williams' Ottawa home, two properties his wife owns and a lakeside couple that belongs to the couple, reports said Williams was placed under a suicide watch at the Quinte Detention Centre in Napanee, Ont., which is about 60 kilometres east of CFB Trenton.
http://ottawa.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20100213/OTT_missing_belleville_100213/20100213/?hub=OttawaHome


Then they correct the "couple that belongs to the couple", but still sounds as if there are 2 more properties that are being searched.

Updated: Sat Feb. 13 2010 12:59:20
Investigators spent Thursday and Friday combing Williams' Ottawa home, two properties his wife owns, and the lakeside cottage the couple have in Tweed, a small town near Trenton.
http://ottawa.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20100213/OTT_new_trenton_commander_100213/20100213/?hub=OttawaHome

antiquegirl
02-15-2010, 07:58 PM
Trenton to parade for troops



read more : http://www.torontosun.com/news/torontoandgta/2010/02/14/12879051.html

Well, I think this is a fine idea and a good plan, but does anyone want to bet that it wasn't the mayor's? ;)

JMO

SomeGirlOnTheNet
02-15-2010, 08:11 PM
I really wouldn't give a lot of credence to the media saying their source is a "police officer involved in the case".

I simply cannot see any officer willing to lose his career just to give a newspaper a scoop. They want to see a conviction as well. It's probably more like my friend whose brother's best friend is cousins with someone on the force.. and they claim to know intimate details. Bull.

I really would like to know what has tied Williams to the home invasions if they didn't see his face...they hadn't even searched his home at this point to find any pictures.

Poor Col Cochrane - what should have been the best promotion of his career, will always be overshadowed by why he has been given command. :sick: He's a really great guy - he'll do well.

SomeGirlOnTheNet
02-15-2010, 08:12 PM
I would like to comment, that on Friday morning, city council was in Tim Horton's on the base and every military person who came through was given a free coffee.

It was a nice gesture.

SomeGirlOnTheNet
02-15-2010, 08:19 PM
Oh, and what is "BBM"? :waitasec:

Scanner
02-15-2010, 08:26 PM
BBM=bolded by me

maxfactor
02-15-2010, 08:27 PM
Oh, and what is "BBM"? :waitasec:
BBM is bolded by me

LadyL
02-15-2010, 08:29 PM
he was charged on Sunday night after a nine-hour police interrogation.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/colonel-russell-williams-is-a-man-no-one-really-knew/article1463964/

now thats a long chat....

dear god, I'd be ready to confess after nine hours!

although I have a feeling he confessed early on and much of that time was spent gathering details and getting him to write out his confession

LadyL
02-15-2010, 08:30 PM
Trenton to parade for troops



read more : http://www.torontosun.com/news/torontoandgta/2010/02/14/12879051.html

glad to see that happening
I'd attend if I lived closer

LadyL
02-15-2010, 08:33 PM
I would like to comment, that on Friday morning, city council was in Tim Horton's on the base and every military person who came through was given a free coffee.

It was a nice gesture.

excellent idea
little things like can go a long way for morale in general

pinkeyesucks
02-15-2010, 08:52 PM
I would like to say that although the press seems to want everyone in the free world to think that the average Canadian hates the military for what one man did, we are not that stupid. I will not be cowed into thinking that way just because the sentiment is expressed by a reporter that thinks s/he has put the right word on the atmosphere. These crimes do not reflect our military, they are simply one of the those uncontrollable things that happen in life. It serves to remind me that often time private lives and public persona can be very different. It is not a reflection of how I feel.

I am shocked, and saddened. And as I work through these emotions and try to figure out what has happened in our sleepy little town that is what is to be expected.

I wish the press would butt out. I think the constant insinuation is making it worse.

I am proud of our armed forces. My hatred is directed solely at the crimes that were committed.

But that is just my opinion, and it's not worth much

RubyRed
02-15-2010, 09:08 PM
I would like to say that although the press seems to want everyone in the free world to think that the average Canadian hates the military for what one man did, we are not that stupid. I will not be cowed into thinking that way just because the sentiment is expressed by a reporter that thinks s/he has put the right word on the atmosphere. These crimes do not reflect our military, they are simply one of the those uncontrollable things that happen in life. It serves to remind me that often time private lives and public persona can be very different. It is not a reflection of how I feel.

I am shocked, and saddened. And as I work through these emotions and try to figure out what has happened in our sleepy little town that is what is to be expected.

I wish the press would butt out. I think the constant insinuation is making it worse.

I am proud of our armed forces. My hatred is directed solely at the crimes that were committed.

But that is just my opinion, and it's not worth much

It is just a way to sell papers,,,I agree with you, I am proud of them too,

antiquegirl
02-15-2010, 09:10 PM
I would like to say that although the press seems to want everyone in the free world to think that the average Canadian hates the military for what one man did, we are not that stupid. I will not be cowed into thinking that way just because the sentiment is expressed by a reporter that thinks s/he has put the right word on the atmosphere. These crimes do not reflect our military, they are simply one of the those uncontrollable things that happen in life. It serves to remind me that often time private lives and public persona can be very different. It is not a reflection of how I feel.

I am shocked, and saddened. And as I work through these emotions and try to figure out what has happened in our sleepy little town that is what is to be expected.

I wish the press would butt out. I think the constant insinuation is making it worse.

I am proud of our armed forces. My hatred is directed solely at the crimes that were committed.

But that is just my opinion, and it's not worth much

Very well put and it is worth a lot. Thank you for expressing what I feel, too.

:blowkiss:

flipflop
02-15-2010, 09:14 PM
I would like to say that although the press seems to want everyone in the free world to think that the average Canadian hates the military for what one man did, we are not that stupid. I will not be cowed into thinking that way just because the sentiment is expressed by a reporter that thinks s/he has put the right word on the atmosphere. These crimes do not reflect our military, they are simply one of the those uncontrollable things that happen in life. It serves to remind me that often time private lives and public persona can be very different. It is not a reflection of how I feel.

I am shocked, and saddened. And as I work through these emotions and try to figure out what has happened in our sleepy little town that is what is to be expected.

I wish the press would butt out. I think the constant insinuation is making it worse.

I am proud of our armed forces. My hatred is directed solely at the crimes that were committed.

But that is just my opinion, and it's not worth much

I AGREE...the media needs to leave the Military out of this, they have nothing to do with this. If you worked for UPS and your boss did what RW did, would the public/media put a target and hate UPS employees!!!!!

flipflop
02-15-2010, 09:28 PM
[QUOTE=SomeGirlOnTheNet;4815183]I really wouldn't give a lot of credence to the media saying their source is a "police officer involved in the case".

I simply cannot see any officer willing to lose his career just to give a newspaper a scoop.


Counld't agree with you more about the media "sources"...for example

more details of Williams' alleged confession to cops leaked out, including that he had allegedly admitted to several panty thefts from homes and that he kept the underwear catalogued in his home. http://www.thewhig.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=2449517

That source is as likely as "I overheard someone say at Tim Hortons" even though this info could be true, alot of people are speculating this. Police officers would not provide media with such info. Here is an example of what actually happened to an officer that did.News Release February 3 2010
OPP make arrest in breach of trust investigation
ORILLIA, ON, Feb. 3 /CNW/ - The Ontario Provincial Police (OPP),
Professional Standards Bureau, has arrested and charged an OPP officer
following an investigation into the disclosure of confidential information.
As a result of receiving information, the OPP Professional Standards
Bureau launched a criminal investigation into the actions of an OPP officer.
The investigation found that the officer released confidential information to
an unauthorized person. Constable Muharem KRDZALIC, age 28, a 2 year member of the OPP assigned to the 407 Detachment of Highway Safety Division has been charged with Breach of Trust, contrary to the Criminal Code.
The information released by the officer was not related to the operation
of Highway 407 or traffic enforcement on Highway 407.
Constable KRDZALIC has been suspended from duty and will appear in the
Ontario Court of Justice, Courtroom No.9, 491 Steeles Ave, Milton, Ontario on
March 17, 2010. http://www.opp.ca/ecms/index.php?id=405&nid=138

I really do not think that an officer would jeapordize their job to give the media their 2 min of fame with new info.

nonfictionrocks
02-15-2010, 10:13 PM
I really wouldn't give a lot of credence to the media saying their source is a "police officer involved in the case".

I simply cannot see any officer willing to lose his career just to give a newspaper a scoop.


Counld't agree with you more about the media "sources"...for example

more details of Williams' alleged confession to cops leaked out, including that he had allegedly admitted to several panty thefts from homes and that he kept the underwear catalogued in his home. http://www.thewhig.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=2449517

That source is as likely as "I overheard someone say at Tim Hortons" even though this info could be true, alot of people are speculating this. Police officers would not provide media with such info. Here is an example of what actually happened to an officer that did.News Release February 3 2010
OPP make arrest in breach of trust investigation
ORILLIA, ON, Feb. 3 /CNW/ - The Ontario Provincial Police (OPP),
Professional Standards Bureau, has arrested and charged an OPP officer
following an investigation into the disclosure of confidential information.
As a result of receiving information, the OPP Professional Standards
Bureau launched a criminal investigation into the actions of an OPP officer.
The investigation found that the officer released confidential information to
an unauthorized person. Constable Muharem KRDZALIC, age 28, a 2 year member of the OPP assigned to the 407 Detachment of Highway Safety Division has been charged with Breach of Trust, contrary to the Criminal Code.
The information released by the officer was not related to the operation
of Highway 407 or traffic enforcement on Highway 407.
Constable KRDZALIC has been suspended from duty and will appear in the
Ontario Court of Justice, Courtroom No.9, 491 Steeles Ave, Milton, Ontario on
March 17, 2010. http://www.opp.ca/ecms/index.php?id=405&nid=138

I really do not think that an officer would jeapordize their job to give the media their 2 min of fame with new info.

Take note of this post DH just in case you have ideas about releasing a book on this case too.

Hazel
02-15-2010, 11:08 PM
From the same article:
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Police+remove+boxes+evidence+from+Williams+Westbor o+home/2565091/story.html
" ... have matched a snowy print from a homicide scene to a boot worn by the former base commander."

I've seen mention of this boot print several times without it being identified as coming from Jessica's case. Is it possible that it actually came from Marie-France Comeau's crime scene? Was there snow on the ground, or could this report be mistaken and it could have come from soft or muddy ground? To link RW to both crimes this way would be a coup for LE.

JMO

When I read about LE matching the boots, I immediately thought of Mr Jones' statement, with regards to the sexual attacks in September, though the "snowy" and "homicide scene" remarks seem to point to Jessica's case. IDK, maybe LE has more than one set of boot prints.

He said police seized computers, compact discs, DVDs, a camera, his hunting knife and work-boots and other items from his house. Jones said he's still waiting for the return of some possessions.

The article seems to have been update or I might have missed reading this:

Bonnie Jones said they'd noticed Saturday that there were curious eyes on the opposite shore.

"There were undercover cars across the lake with binoculars so we knew someone was under surveillance," she said.

I find it interesting that LE had RW under surveillance on Saturday.

http://www.intelligencer.ca/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=2440516

maxfactor
02-15-2010, 11:39 PM
I wonder if the media once again made the mistake and it should have read on Sunday?!?! Saturday just does not make sense, if RW was under surveilance on Saturday, why not check out his tires then, instead they set up an allday roadside stop on the hwy to check tires out on Sunday???? Does not add up in my books.

I think the roadside stop was on the previous Thursday, that's when LE first became suspicious of him.

flipflop
02-15-2010, 11:58 PM
I think the roadside stop was on the previous Thursday, that's when LE first became suspicious of him.

My mistake, you are correct on that Maxfactor

On Feb. 4, police stopped cars travelling in both directions along Hwy. 37 north of Belleville, near Lloyd’s home where she vanished without any identification, her wallet or her car in January.

Therefore I does make sense that they were watching him after that!!!

LogicalMinds
02-16-2010, 12:12 AM
Such a shocker....now to hear that he has been "breaking and entering" for years??

Some random thoughts and pure speculation >>

>>> he may have done each of his b and e's..and his other horrible crimes..with "military precision"...? Over the years he probably took "advanced" courses...he probably read militry magazines...it would be "normal" if he ordered say "night vision goggles" or whatever wouldn't it??

>>> his marriage.....doesn't seem to be real "partners"....seems to me to be distant, maybe his choice....his wife had a fullfilling career....they had a cat for years, then when it died got an other...no kids, no dogs....she is a bit older than him

>>> I can well imagine that he kept his life compartmented...."my office...top secret military stuff...stay out"...

>>> the fact that the wife would stay at the new house overseeing construction etc by herself several times a week gave him more time to get into his horrible deeds JMO

>>> I am NOT "blaming" the wife....I am sure she is devasted...I just think that he was a cold, withdrawn man, a high achiever, not social but able to succeed at flying, military life

These are just some impressions I have

flipflop
02-16-2010, 12:34 AM
Such a shocker....now to hear that he has been "breaking and entering" for years??

Some random thoughts and pure speculation >>

>>> he may have done each of his b and e's..and his other horrible crimes..with "military precision"...? Over the years he probably took "advanced" courses...he probably read militry magazines...it would be "normal" if he ordered say "night vision goggles" or whatever wouldn't it??

>>> his marriage.....doesn't seem to be real "partners"....seems to me to be distant, maybe his choice....his wife had a fullfilling career....they had a cat for years, then when it died got an other...no kids, no dogs....she is a bit older than him

>>> I can well imagine that he kept his life compartmented...."my office...top secret military stuff...stay out"...

>>> the fact that the wife would stay at the new house overseeing construction etc by herself several times a week gave him more time to get into his horrible deeds JMO

>>> I am NOT "blaming" the wife....I am sure she is devasted...I just think that he was a cold, withdrawn man, a high achiever, not social but able to succeed at flying, military life

These are just some impressions I have

With RW holding such a high and well decorated position in the military I am sure he was of the best of commiting B & E's. I just wonder for how many years that this game of his has been going on, before he started going forward and commiting more serious crimes. At least single women living along will feel a bit safer with this nut job behind bars, but will also make them more cautious at the same time.

Hazel
02-16-2010, 12:34 AM
My mistake, you are correct on that Maxfactor

On Feb. 4, police stopped cars traveling in both directions along Hwy. 37 north of Belleville, near Lloyd’s home where she vanished without any identification, her wallet or her car in January.

Therefore I does make sense that they were watching him after that!!!
Exactly! that's why I thought Mrs. Jones comment about the binoculars on Saturday was interesting, and makes me wonder if:

*Disclaimer* The following are all entirely MY theories, and nothing to do with the case/investigation. I have no relationship whatsoever with anybody either related (family, friends, acquaintances) to the case, anybody investigating nor reporting the case. Everything is just a product of my imagination.

Theory 1:
RW was also aware he was being watched, and got nervous, packed his boxes with 'treasures' and brought them to Ottawa. If that was the case, maybe he thought he was going to have his cottage searched, and never in a million years imagined he was going to receive a "visit" in Ottawa.

Theory 2:
RW did notice LE and the binoculars, but thought it was Mr.Jones (whom he allegedly was trying to frame for his crimes), the one who was been watched. IF (big IF) he had 'planted' evidence that could incriminate Mr. Jones, then he was feeling confident everything was going according to his plans.

Theory 2:
RW didn't notice he was being watched, and as many criminals do, he returned to the scene of the crime, before returning to Ottawa, and unknowingly led LE to Jessica's body. (Not sure when he returned to Ottawa, could have been that same Saturday or the next day Sunday, when he was arrested).

Then again, it is more likely that I am totally off and none of these theories have anything to do with reality. Just throwing out a few of the many ideas that come to mind.

antiquegirl
02-16-2010, 12:35 AM
When I read about LE matching the boots, I immediately thought of Mr Jones' statement, with regards to the sexual attacks in September, though the "snowy" and "homicide scene" remarks seem to point to Jessica's case. IDK, maybe LE has more than one set of boot prints.

I know that this is nitpicking, but I’m still wondering why it was never stated which homicide scene the print came from. That Ottawa Citizen article is the only one where the word “snowy” was used. Here are three others where the adjective was not used.

Ontario Provincial Police investigating Col. Russell Williams also said Sunday they have matched a print from a homicide scene to the 46-year-old’s boot.

http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Ottawa+police+recover+keepsakes+from+home+Russell+ Williams+accused+murder/2564970/story.html

Ontario Provincial Police investigating Colonel Russell Williams also said yesterday they have matched a print from a homicide scene to the 46-year-old's boot.

http://www.nationalpost.com/todays-paper/story.html?id=2565677#ixzz0ffYXZuwF

they were able to match a boot found in Williams' home to a footprint that was left at a hoicide scene.

http://ottawa.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20100215/OTT_Williams_Search_100215/20100215/?hub=OttawaHom

I’m also wondering if by “homicide scene”, are they necessarily referring to Jessica’s home area? If she was killed elsewhere, the homicide scene could be somewhere else entirely, including the location where her body was found.

(snip)


I find it interesting that LE had RW under surveillance on Saturday.

http://www.intelligencer.ca/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=2440516

If LE had him under surveillance on Saturday, it would be safe to assume that he was still in Tweed then. I wonder when exactly he drove to Ottawa (later on Saturday, or Sunday morning?) and if LE followed him there. It would make sense that they did.

JMO

Hazel
02-16-2010, 12:49 AM
Such a shocker....now to hear that he has been "breaking and entering" for years??

Some random thoughts and pure speculation >>

>>> he may have done each of his b and e's..and his other horrible crimes..with "military precision"...? Over the years he probably took "advanced" courses...he probably read militry magazines...it would be "normal" if he ordered say "night vision goggles" or whatever wouldn't it??

>>> his marriage.....doesn't seem to be real "partners"....seems to me to be distant, maybe his choice....his wife had a fullfilling career....they had a cat for years, then when it died got an other...no kids, no dogs....she is a bit older than him

>>> I can well imagine that he kept his life compartmented...."my office...top secret military stuff...stay out"...

>>> the fact that the wife would stay at the new house overseeing construction etc by herself several times a week gave him more time to get into his horrible deeds JMO

>>> I am NOT "blaming" the wife....I am sure she is devasted...I just think that he was a cold, withdrawn man, a high achiever, not social but able to succeed at flying, military life

These are just some impressions I have

ITA with all your points LogicalMinds. Good thinking about the night-vision goggles! that could very well be the case.

flipflop
02-16-2010, 12:52 AM
Quote:
Bonnie Jones said they'd noticed Saturday that there were curious eyes on the opposite shore.

"There were undercover cars across the lake with binoculars so we knew someone was under surveillance," she said

If LE were suspicious after the roadside stop on Thursday, RW with his intelligent military mind probably felt they were onto him. JMO I bet he packed up any treasures in Tweed and moved them to Ottawa very shortly after this stop. I also feel he was under watch since after this stop on Thursday and not noticed by neighbours until Saturday.

antiquegirl
02-16-2010, 12:56 AM
Exactly! that's why I thought Mrs. Jones comment about the binoculars on Saturday was interesting, and makes me wonder if:

*Disclaimer* The following are all entirely MY theories, and nothing to do with the case/investigation. I have no relationship whatsoever with anybody either related (family, friends, acquaintances) to the case, anybody investigating nor reporting the case. Everything is just product of my imagination.

Theory 1:
RW was also aware he was been watched, and got nervous, packed his boxes with 'treasures' and brought them to Ottawa. If that was the case, maybe he thought he was going to have his cottage searched, and never in a million years imagined he was going to receive a "visit" in Ottawa.

Theory 2:
RW did notice LE and the binoculars, but thought it was Mr.Jones (whom he allegedly was trying to frame for his crimes), the one who was been watched. IF (big IF) he had 'planted' evidence that could incriminate Mr. Jones, then he was feeling confident everything was going according to his plans.

Theory 2:
RW didn't notice he was been watched, and as many criminals do, he returned to the scene of the crime, before returning to Ottawa, and unknowingly lead LE to Jessica's body. (Not sure when he returned to Ottawa, could have been that same Saturday or the next day Sunday, when he was arrested).

Then again, it is more likely that I am totally off and none of these theories have anything to do with reality. Just throwing out a few of the many ideas that come to mind.

Interesting theories, Hazel. The flaw in the last one, though, is that all reports state that Jessica's body was not found until Monday. There was no way RW could have unknowingly led LE to it before he went to Ottawa, as we know he was questioned and arrested there on Sunday.

Lloyd's body was found earlier Monday in Tweed

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/100208/national/missing_belleville_woman

The body of Jessica Lloyd, 27, right, was found by police on Feb. 8.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2010/02/08/f-williams-biography.html

antiquegirl
02-16-2010, 01:06 AM
Quote:
Bonnie Jones said they'd noticed Saturday that there were curious eyes on the opposite shore.

"There were undercover cars across the lake with binoculars so we knew someone was under surveillance," she said

If LE were suspicious after the roadside stop on Thursday, RW with his intelligent military mind probably felt they were onto him. JMO I bet he packed up any treasures in Tweed and moved them to Ottawa very shortly after this stop. I also feel he was under watch since after this stop on Thursday and not noticed by neighbours until Saturday.

I'm not trying to be argumentative, but I honestly don't believe RW suspected he was under surveillance. If he had, he'd have been smart enough to know that if LE were to search his Tweed home, they would also search his Ottawa home. If he had the slightest doubt, why not get rid of the trophies altogether (toss them in the lake or whatever), instead of moving them to his other house? This is not a stupid man, but he is an arrogant one. I believe he had evidence hidden in Ottawa all along and possibly in the cottage, as well. If he did take some with him on Saturday/Sunday, it was only because the Ottawa house had a better hiding place, not because he thought it would never be searched.

That's JMO.

Hazel
02-16-2010, 01:44 AM
Interesting theories, Hazel. The flaw in the last one, though, is that all reports state that Jessica's body was not found until Monday. There was no way RW could have unknowingly led LE to it before he went to Ottawa, as we know he was questioned and arrested there on Sunday.

Lloyd's body was found earlier Monday in Tweed

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/100208/national/missing_belleville_woman

The body of Jessica Lloyd, 27, right, was found by police on Feb. 8.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2010/02/08/f-williams-biography.html

Yikes! I just noticed all my grammar mistakes :blushing: (English is not my first language, as you all probably already noticed :blushing: )

I have a question: "If all reports say Jessica was found Monday morning, is that a fact? I mean is that 100% accurate? Was that said by LE or just the reporters?

UPDATE : In this Press Conference, found the answer to my question:

CTV News Channel: OPP Det. Insp. Chris Nicholas (http://watch.ctv.ca/news/#clip264670)

LadyL
02-16-2010, 01:54 AM
Quote:
Bonnie Jones said they'd noticed Saturday that there were curious eyes on the opposite shore.

"There were undercover cars across the lake with binoculars so we knew someone was under surveillance," she said

If LE were suspicious after the roadside stop on Thursday, RW with his intelligent military mind probably felt they were onto him. JMO I bet he packed up any treasures in Tweed and moved them to Ottawa very shortly after this stop. I also feel he was under watch since after this stop on Thursday and not noticed by neighbours until Saturday.

wow, first time I've read that!

antiquegirl
02-16-2010, 02:14 AM
Yikes! I just noticed all my grammar mistakes :blushing: (English is not my first language, as you all probably already noticed :blushing: )

I have a question: "If all reports say Jessica was found Monday morning, is that a fact? I mean is that 100% accurate? Was that said by LE or just the reporters?

There is no way to know if anything is 100% accurate. We can only go by what the media reports and hope for the best. The reporters have to get their information from somewhere, and presumably with something as important as this, they'd get it from LE, or at least verify it with them. We have to remember that "Monday morning" could be any time after midnight, February 8th.

JMO

pinkeyesucks
02-16-2010, 10:03 AM
It does not surprise me that they had him under surveillance on the Saturday before the arrest. By the Thursday they were announcing on the radio that they believed all 4 crimes could possibly be related.

http://www.mix97.com/news/?s=jessica+lloyd

This was definitely a case where they needed to dot all the i's, and cross all the t's just in case he decided to fight it. Given the right resources a legal dream team may have been able to find a hole or two to exploit. Look at OJ...

pinkeyesucks
02-16-2010, 11:42 AM
This has been floating around my head since the whole mess blew up. Profound words.

"The media, and many of us who are spectators, are presently engaged in a kind of frantic biography. It is a futile and self-destructing exercise. Biography is a form of fiction. The facts that one finds in a biography may be empirically verifiable, but the narrative itself is a lie."

Read more: http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/fullcomment/archive/2010/02/15/john-baglow-looking-for-the-mark-of-cain-in-col-williams.aspx#ixzz0fiKQjeVa

Hazel
02-16-2010, 04:12 PM
The secret life of Colonel Russell Williams


The truth—if police are correct—is that Williams was a man with two distinct faces, a meticulous, cold-blooded planner who could transform from officer to monster and back again in a matter of hours. Consider the timeline. On Sept. 16, 2009, he returned home from a trip to the remote Canadian Forces base in Alert, Nunavut. The next day, he allegedly broke into a woman’s house near his Tweed, Ont., home, tied her to a chair, sexually assaulted her, and photographed her naked body. Williams spent the rest of that week attending a military parade, playing in a golf tournament, and grinning for a photo op with minor hockey players.

The next sexual assault on his charge sheet—Sept. 30—was much like the first. It, too, occurred in the same neighbourhood where Williams lived. The unnamed victim woke up to find a man in her home, and then cowered in horror as he stripped off her clothes, fastened her wrists to a chair, and pulled out his camera. Back at CFB Trenton two days later, a smiling Williams presented a $700 cheque to the Heart and Stroke Foundation, the same charity where his wife, Mary Elizabeth Harriman, is the associate director.

2-page long article >> read more : http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/02/16/the-secret-life-of-colonel-russell-williams/

IMO, there's something weird with his eyes. Looks like his sanpaku is more prominent in his right eye. JMO

pjgrrrl
02-16-2010, 04:27 PM
When I venture home, I tend to drive by a little "drive in" partition that has some outhouses and a lake, where people who canoe unload and go on Tooey Lake. I have many a night stopped here to stretch, etc. until last year (Will have to see if I can scoop up the little tombstone article) when a woman got sexually assaulted by someone who was hiding either in the bushes beside or in the unit itself. I thought this was so entirely bizarre because the people in the surrounding areas are overly friendly and I can't see some random tourist waiting to assault someone (JMO). However, my point being- this is a common route to go back to Ottawa, you can either continue on highway 7, or you can swing highway 7 onto 41 and then take the 417. But it's definitely worth a look for the police that dealt with that case. Could be tied to RW.

SomeGirlOnTheNet
02-16-2010, 07:17 PM
What really stands out to me, is that he DIDN'T have a lot of spare time.

His Beemer was parked in front of Wing Headquarters before I got there at 7:00 am and was there when I left at 4:00 pm. If I had to go in in the evening to catch up on some work, he was there in his office working.

He travelled. A LOT. He was an extremely busy man, as are all of the prior WComd's. It is a very busy, high tempo base, and especially with the taskings of the Olympics, Haiti, repatriations, Afghanistan, etc.

WComd's really don't have much down time - they're always putting out fires, authorizing, on their Blackberry's. I just don't get it. You don't get to that position by being a slacker - and you can't maintain that position being one.

It's a real head scratcher for me - of course, obviously he found time, but it really has me puzzled.

pjgrrrl
02-16-2010, 07:33 PM
What really stands out to me, is that he DIDN'T have a lot of spare time.

His Beemer was parked in front of Wing Headquarters before I got there at 7:00 am and was there when I left at 4:00 pm. If I had to go in in the evening to catch up on some work, he was there in his office working.

He travelled. A LOT. He was an extremely busy man, as are all of the prior WComd's. It is a very busy, high tempo base, and especially with the taskings of the Olympics, Haiti, repatriations, Afghanistan, etc.

WComd's really don't have much down time - they're always putting out fires, authorizing, on their Blackberry's. I just don't get it. You don't get to that position by being a slacker - and you can't maintain that position being one.

It's a real head scratcher for me - of course, obviously he found time, but it really has me puzzled.

I feel the same way, from all my friends who worked alongside, they said he would be in at 6 a.m. until 6 p.m. on many days. But I guess that leaves 4 hours, providing he slept 8? I am assuming he had access to a massive database too. So say he met someone he thought who was of interest, and drove by their house- bam, jump on the database gather a name, etc.

So bizarre.

Hazel
02-16-2010, 07:35 PM
This article contains many QUOTES from Tweed residents. Here are a few:

Charges against military man shock residents of quiet country town

The dark star is associated with evil-doing.

-- ancient Egyptian mythology


"In the roadblock on (Hwy.) 37, I'd love to know what made them so definite he was their man. Within 24 hours of arresting him, the police, just like that, discovered her (Jessica Lloyd's) body. She'd been missing for a week. I'm thinking somebody helped them. Where they found her out there off Carry Rd.? Like looking for a needle in a haystack with all the concession roads and dense woods around here."

"As soon as I saw his picture, I remembered him. I served him. He came in for breakfast about twice a month, always alone. He was never in his uniform, and he wasn't one to make conversation.

"Another waitress remembered serving him at night four or five times, and she said he was alone, too."

"I recognized him. He came in about once a month for a haircut. Fourteen dollars. I can't remember anything odd, or him saying anything. I had no idea who he was."
Thursday -- four days after police arrest and charge Col. Russell Williams -- and on private Cosy Cove Lane, OPP cruisers are parked inside criss-crossings of yellow security tape in front of cottage No. 62 that backs on to frozen Lake Stocco, sparkling now beneath the feel-good sun. A decorative emblem is nailed to the front door of the cottage.
A dark star.

respectfully snipped and BBM

read more : http://www.thewhig.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=2448590

http://www.ottawasun.com/news/ottawa/2010/02/08/will1.jpg
The home of Russ Williams on Cosy Cove Lane in Tweed surrounded by police tape following the arrest of the CFB Trenton Commanding Officer. (PETE FISHER, QMI Agency)

http://www.ottawasun.com/news/ottawa/2010/02/08/will3.jpg

http://www.ottawasun.com/news/ottawa/2010/02/08/will5.jpg

http://www.ottawasun.com/news/ottawa/2010/02/08/will8.jpg

source for images : http://www.ottawasun.com/news/ottawa/2010/02/08/12796526.html#/news/ottawa/2010/02/08/pf-12792486.html

pjgrrrl
02-16-2010, 07:36 PM
The secret life of Colonel Russell Williams



2-page long article >> read more : http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/02/16/the-secret-life-of-colonel-russell-williams/

IMO, there's something weird with his eyes. Looks like his sanpaku is more prominent in his right eye. JMO

I don't get this sanpaku thing- I have it, but am far from crazy! From what I read here, it's the three whites visible one should be aware of. Sometimes I feel people read way too much into coincidences. :P JMO

http://www.24-7pressrelease.com/attachments/071899/sanpaku.jpg

Hazel
02-16-2010, 07:56 PM
2 large trucks brought to Col. Williams's home
Last Updated: Tuesday, February 16, 2010 | 3:23 PM ET



Two large cube trucks were parked outside the Ottawa home of Col. Russell Williams Tuesday as provincial police continued to search the inside of the house as part of their investigation into the murders Williams is charged with committing.

The two unmarked trucks joined OPP cruisers that remained at the front and back of the home on Edison Avenue in Ottawa's Westboro neighbourhood. Police officers were seen carrying equipment from the trucks into the house.

Read more: http://www.cbc.ca/politics/story/2010/02/16/ottawa-russell-williams-edison-home.html#ixzz0fkGYBfjE

This is giving me a very uneasy feeling *shrugs* :nerves: RW and his wife only moved into this house last December. :shocked2:

Read more: http://www.cbc.ca/politics/story/2010/02/16/ottawa-russell-williams-edison-home.html#ixzz0fkIiJx9b

matou
02-16-2010, 08:00 PM
Does anyone know how to get a forensic astronomy thread started for this case? I think I would need Jessica Lloyd's birth date and Russ Williams' info, in which case I would request this info, if anyone knows it. Sorry if this is posted in the wrong place.

sillybilly
02-16-2010, 08:08 PM
...It's a real head scratcher for me - of course, obviously he found time, but it really has me puzzled...
<snip>

Old saying in business ... "if you want something done, give it to the busiest person you know". Methinks this guy is Mr. Uber-Efficiency.

JMO

Hazel
02-16-2010, 08:10 PM
To be honest pjgrrrl, I have never heard of Sanpaku before someone mentioned it in a 'comments' section, regarding RW. I've been looking for this condition in my family and friends since then, lol.
I have no idea if this is something that has been researched and has been scientifically proved. It might only be a sign of a health or vision problem, or might be some inherited trait. If it hadn't been for that comment I read (which was also posted here), I would have never known such a thing existed.

pinkeyesucks
02-16-2010, 08:11 PM
Here is one for you, that I don't believe I have seen written about in any of the papers, and to be honest I hadn't thought of it before being told.

RW was front and centre at the funeral for Marie. He sat in the front, with the family.

I feel like I want to throw up. Seriously.

pjgrrrl
02-16-2010, 08:12 PM
Does anyone know how to get a forensic astronomy thread started for this case? I think I would need Jessica Lloyd's birth date and Russ Williams' info, in which case I would request this info, if anyone knows it. Sorry if this is posted in the wrong place.

Jess, May 18, 1982.

I would think that Comeau's would be needed too, no? Would that help if anyone had that?

pjgrrrl
02-16-2010, 08:13 PM
Here is one for you, that I don't believe I have seen written about in any of the papers, and to be honest I hadn't thought of it before being told.

RW was front and centre at the funeral for Marie. He sat in the front, with the family.

I feel like I want to throw up. Seriously.

I asked from the start if he was (once we knew he murdered her). I kind of had a feeling.

matou
02-16-2010, 08:16 PM
Jess, May 18, 1982.

I would think that Comeau's would be needed too, no? Would that help if anyone had that?

Thank you PJ. Yes, if anyone knows Marie Comeau's date of birth, that would be helpful. I found RW's info on wikipedia.

antiquegirl
02-16-2010, 08:28 PM
The secret life of Colonel Russell Williams

2-page long article >> read more : http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/02/16/the-secret-life-of-colonel-russell-williams/

IMO, there's something weird with his eyes. Looks like his sanpaku is more prominent in his right eye. JMO

Hazel, thank you so much for this link. It is the most detailed, comprehensive synopsis of events as yet published and will be invaluable for future reference.

SomeGirlOnTheNet
02-16-2010, 08:43 PM
Here is one for you, that I don't believe I have seen written about in any of the papers, and to be honest I hadn't thought of it before being told.

RW was front and centre at the funeral for Marie. He sat in the front, with the family.



Yes, he did. And he spoke at it apparently (I didn't go).

Hazel
02-16-2010, 08:49 PM
Hazel, thank you so much for this link. It is the most detailed, comprehensive synopsis of events as yet published and will be invaluable for future reference.

ITA, very comphehensive synopsis and very well written. I do however have an issue with the statement regarding the 'prank' phone call that Mrs. Jones received (that has also been pointed out by a poster by the name of "posterflag" in the comments section.

His wife, Bonnie, the treasurer of a neighbouring municipality, received a phone call one day shortly after police visited their house. “What’s it like to live with a murderer?” asked the female caller, according to Jones.

Mr. Jones was being investigated for the attacks. Was that phone call received much later? Why would the caller mention "murderer"? I read about this phone call in another article, but it didn't jumped at me then.

sorry, forgot to include the link : page 2, paragraph 7 (http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/02/16/the-secret-life-of-colonel-russell-williams/2/)

SomeGirlOnTheNet
02-16-2010, 08:58 PM
Sounds to me like the Jones' are milking this just a wee bit too much.

antiquegirl
02-16-2010, 09:06 PM
ITA, very comphehensive synopsis and very well written. I do however have an issue with the statement regarding the 'prank' phone call that Mrs. Jones received (that has also been pointed out by a poster by the name of "posterflag" in the comments section.


Mr. Jones was being investigated for the attacks. Was that phone call received much later? Why would the caller mention "murderer"? I read about this phone call in another article, but it didn't jumped at me then.

sorry, forgot to include the link : page 2, paragraph 7 (http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/02/16/the-secret-life-of-colonel-russell-williams/2/)

All you have to do is go on any of these Facebook groups for these missing or murdered women and read the comments. The world is full of nutjobs and morons who have never had an intelligent or logical thought in their lives. Anyone who would make a phone call like this probably doesn't even think to make the distinction between a sexual assault and murder. The call could have been made after Marie's murder, but what difference does it make? As far as I'm concerned, it's not relevant to anything. People get incredibly emotional and don't think before they act.

JMO

flipflop
02-16-2010, 09:27 PM
Sounds to me like the Jones' are milking this just a wee bit too much.

I personally would not blame this on the Jones', they probably mentioned this once to a media source and it exploded from there. JMO though.

Whats everyones thoughts on the trucks outside of RW's house????? Very curious!

pinkeyesucks
02-16-2010, 09:40 PM
Yes, he did. And he spoke at it apparently (I didn't go).

I left the part out about him speaking at it, I think I was hoping that it wasn't true. I heard another tall tale today that perhaps you could clarify for me. He is not a helicopter pilot as well, correct? Because the hot gossip on the street is that he actually flew one of the SR copters. That just didn't fit into my logical mind as being correct. Ordered it perhaps, but not actually ON IT right?

antiquegirl
02-16-2010, 09:45 PM
I personally would not blame this on the Jones', they probably mentioned this once to a media source and it exploded from there. JMO though.

Whats everyones thoughts on the trucks outside of RW's house????? Very curious!

I can't imagine what these trucks are for. One truck maybe, but two? We've already seen LE removing boxes of potential evidence. Are they trying to look behind the walls or under concrete floors without tearing the house apart? If so, it would have to be something really, really vital, KWIM? But why would he hide something like that in his own house with so many other possible, less risky dump spots? And I can't believe he'd take a live hostage to a house he shared with his wife. So, what could it be?

(And I don't believe his wife will ever move back into that house, or the cottage either.)

JMO

maxfactor
02-16-2010, 10:17 PM
I wonder if LE has searched his office, or are they legally even able to?

flipflop
02-16-2010, 10:20 PM
I can't imagine what these trucks are for. One truck maybe, but two? We've already seen LE removing boxes of potential evidence. Are they trying to look behind the walls or under concrete floors without tearing the house apart? If so, it would have to be something really, really vital, KWIM? But why would he hide something like that in his own house with so many other possible, less risky dump spots? And I can't believe he'd take a live hostage to a house he shared with his wife. So, what could it be?

(And I don't believe his wife will ever move back into that house, or the cottage either.)

JMO

I cannot imagine what ONE of these OPP trucks would be for, let along TWO. The forensic vans had already been in the driveway, as we have seen in media pics. I have no ideas as to what these heavy duty trucks are???? The media states that they carried equipment from these trucks into RW's house. The house has been stated in the media to be under construction in one source and being built in another. This does make me think that something of great interest has been found or they are looking for something that has been hidden in this house, I can't get Bernardo and cement out of my mind....
The trucks are the same trucks as seen in the background of the OPP website
http://www.opp.ca/ecms/index.php?id=52

Hazel
02-16-2010, 10:34 PM
Murder case's handling lauded by Col. Williams
Murder suspect praised corporal's work in man's slaying on Trenton base


A Quinte West man, Marcus Wilson, 37, is charged with that murder.

It is not known if authorities investigating Williams will re-visit the case.

A source provided the Star with a photo of Williams presenting a commendation to a M. Cpl. Thickson for "outstanding professionalism" at the murder scene on July 26, 2009, in ensuring the security of the area and the emergency workers who were attempting to revive the victim while the suspect was at large.

James Read, 36, died at Trenton Memorial Hospital on the same day he was found stabbed at a home on the base.

Three days later, Wilson was arrested.

OPP Sgt. Kristine Rae said she has not heard that the Read case is being re-visited by authorities after revelations about Williams' alleged crime spree emerged last week. "I can't say at this point," Rae said.

http://www.thestar.com/news/ontario/article/765596--murder-case-s-handling-lauded-by-col-williams

SomeGirlOnTheNet
02-16-2010, 10:38 PM
I left the part out about him speaking at it, I think I was hoping that it wasn't true. I heard another tall tale today that perhaps you could clarify for me. He is not a helicopter pilot as well, correct? Because the hot gossip on the street is that he actually flew one of the SR copters. That just didn't fit into my logical mind as being correct. Ordered it perhaps, but not actually ON IT right?

As far as I'm aware, he was an Airbus pilot and a Challenger pilot. Pilots can't just hop on any ol' plane and fly it - they must take training and become qualified. I don't believe he ever was a C130 pilot either. Helicopter piloting is waaay different than fixed wing.

I would say with 99.999% accuracy that he was not the pilot or a passenger on that Search and Rescue helicopter.

SomeGirlOnTheNet
02-16-2010, 10:41 PM
Murder case's handling lauded by Col. Williams
Murder suspect praised corporal's work in man's slaying on Trenton base



http://www.thestar.com/news/ontario/article/765596--murder-case-s-handling-lauded-by-col-williams

I know about this murder.

It was the son of one of the ladies who works at the Yukon Galley - there were eyewitnesses to this murder (his girlfriend). It was very cut and dry.

This is all becoming crazy.

antiquegirl
02-16-2010, 10:53 PM
There have been several mentions of a lake near RW's cottage, but I can't see it on any maps. Mr. Jones also talked about RW having a boat. Could one of the locals please tell me where this lake is and what it's called? Is it Stoco Lake? I wonder why there has been no mention of LE searching this body of water that RW had such easy access to. Is it too cold now to look there? This sounds like a handy dump spot.

JMO

flipflop
02-16-2010, 11:03 PM
There have been several mentions of a lake near RW's cottage, but I can't see it on any maps. Mr. Jones also talked about RW having a boat. Could one of the locals please tell me where this lake is and what it's called? Is it Stoco Lake? I wonder why there has been no mention of LE searching this body of water that RW had such easy access to. Is it too cold now to look there? This sounds like a handy dump spot.

JMO

I read in a link somewhere that fishing huts were on the lake, therefore the lake is frozen over.

pinkeyesucks
02-16-2010, 11:24 PM
There have been several mentions of a lake near RW's cottage, but I can't see it on any maps. Mr. Jones also talked about RW having a boat. Could one of the locals please tell me where this lake is and what it's called? Is it Stoco Lake? I wonder why there has been no mention of LE searching this body of water that RW had such easy access to. Is it too cold now to look there? This sounds like a handy dump spot.

JMO

It is Lake Stoco. The cottage is right on the shore. Eastern side.

http://maps.google.ca/maps?hl=en&source=hp&q=lake%20stoco%20tweed&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wl

At the time of the sexual assaults one of the theories thrown around that perhaps the perp came across the lake by boat- since there were no unusual vehicles to go on.

Hazel
02-16-2010, 11:33 PM
MAP showing Cosy Cove Lane and Lake Stoco. http://maps.google.ca/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=62+Cosy+Cove+Lane,+Tweed&sll=49.891235,-97.15369&sspn=28.795555,56.425781&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=62+Cosy+Cove+Ln,+Tweed,+Hastings+County,+Ont ario&t=h&z=16

pinkeyesucks
02-16-2010, 11:43 PM
I can't imagine what these trucks are for. One truck maybe, but two? We've already seen LE removing boxes of potential evidence. Are they trying to look behind the walls or under concrete floors without tearing the house apart? If so, it would have to be something really, really vital, KWIM? But why would he hide something like that in his own house with so many other possible, less risky dump spots? And I can't believe he'd take a live hostage to a house he shared with his wife. So, what could it be?

(And I don't believe his wife will ever move back into that house, or the cottage either.)

JMO
Well, in my opinion....there is more in his statement, and possibly in his dna, than what we know about. Investigators go in and remove hard evidence, forensics search, now two big mofo vans....more to this than meets the eye.

flipflop
02-17-2010, 12:01 AM
Well, in my opinion....there is more in his statement, and possibly in his dna, than what we know about. Investigators go in and remove hard evidence, forensics search, now two big mofo vans....more to this than meets the eye.

I am curious to know what the OPP carry in these big honkin' trucks that their regular forensic vans don't carry.

antiquegirl
02-17-2010, 12:05 AM
I am curious to know what the OPP carry in these big honkin' trucks that their regular forensic vans don't carry.

I suppose it's too much to ask that the media find out the function of these type of trucks, but we can always hope. They look different than any I've seen before.

flipflop
02-17-2010, 12:07 AM
I suppose it's too much to ask that the media find out the function of these type of trucks, but we can always hope. They look different than any I've seen before.

They belong to the OPP, you can see them in the background of this pic on the opp website, I searched the site but cannot find this type of trucks function or purpose. I wonder if they are just a new type of forensic truck?

http://www.opp.ca/ecms/index.php?id=52

satchel
02-17-2010, 12:20 AM
Just returned for what would have been a regular after supper jaunt to the local drug store. The atmosphere around here is very different than what it was a few weeks ago. Not a single person on the street once darkness falls. Streets that I used to walk down I bypassed feeling like there is not enough light. This has had an enormous impact on our little community.
"A Changed community"... A changed sense of security. I have never thought about who was passing my house when I was putting out the garbage or getting in my car, but lately I feel eerie and suspicious even in broad daylight. Who is driving by and what are they looking at? Should I smile and say Thank-you to that person at Tim Horton's who held the door open for me? This monster attacked randomly, with no apparent connection. People in their most vulnerable state. In their own homes and asleep. How did he choose them. Did he just happen to hold a door open for them or drive by their house one day and decide they were his next victim? This whole thing is distressing and disturbing to alot of people, I think.

antiquegirl
02-17-2010, 12:42 AM
They belong to the OPP, you can see them in the background of this pic on the opp website, I searched the site but cannot find this type of trucks function or purpose. I wonder if they are just a new type of forensic truck?

http://www.opp.ca/ecms/index.php?id=52

Good work, Flip! Still wondering what they're looking for after removing all those boxes of stuff last week. They did say it was going to take a while, but the curiosity is killing me. :waitasec:

Hazel
02-17-2010, 12:56 AM
There is no way to know if anything is 100% accurate. We can only go by what the media reports and hope for the best. The reporters have to get their information from somewhere, and presumably with something as important as this, they'd get it from LE, or at least verify it with them. We have to remember that "Monday morning" could be any time after midnight, February 8th.

JMO

Found the answer to my question:

I have a question: "If all reports say Jessica was found Monday morning, is that a fact? I mean is that 100% accurate? Was that said by LE or just the reporters?
OPP Det. Insp. Chris Nicholas (http://watch.ctv.ca/news/#clip264670)

Hazel
02-17-2010, 02:27 AM
I cannot imagine what ONE of these OPP trucks would be for, let along TWO. The forensic vans had already been in the driveway, as we have seen in media pics. I have no ideas as to what these heavy duty trucks are???? The media states that they carried equipment from these trucks into RW's house. The house has been stated in the media to be under construction in one source and being built in another. This does make me think that something of great interest has been found or they are looking for something that has been hidden in this house, I can't get Bernardo and cement out of my mind....
The trucks are the same trucks as seen in the background of the OPP website
http://www.opp.ca/ecms/index.php?id=52


Flip, that house is brand new. The Williams just moved in last weeks of December 2009. As I posted before, when the Google Street Car took images of Ottawa streets last spring/summer 2009, that semi-detached house was not there.

In its place was an old house with a "FOR SALE" sign. A developer must have bought it, and demolished that house, and in its place constructed what we see today.

Here is the link (you have to wait a bit until the image loads)
Old house in Edison Rd (http://maps.google.ca/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=471+Edison+Ave,+ottawa&sll=45.388785,-75.75288&sspn=0.001925,0.003444&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=471+Edison+Ave,+Ottawa,+Ottawa+Division,+Ont ario&t=h&layer=c&cbll=45.38914,-75.753092&panoid=55VcLb2cgIryiL6klr2jGg&cbp=12,40.31,,0,-5.65&ll=45.388821,-75.7529&spn=0.006751,0.013776&z=16)

For comparison purposes, see the pine tree on the left hand side, and small pine tree on right hand side.

Another angle : front view (http://maps.google.ca/maps?f=q&source=embed&hl=en&geocode=&q=471+Edison+Ave,+ottawa&sll=45.388785,-75.75288&sspn=0.001925,0.003444&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=471+Edison+Ave,+Ottawa,+Ottawa+Division,+Ont ario&t=h&layer=c&cbll=45.38923,-75.753146&panoid=h7jhqz1KhhSYH8Moq2I0JA&cbp=13,79.41,,0,5.98&ll=45.389228,-75.753136&spn=0.00764,0.013776&z=16)

New house (http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/2540702.bin?size=620x400)

Cannot think of how/when/what can be so well hidden that requires equipment to find it. Personally I didn't even think there was going to be much found in the Westboro house. It's very puzzling.

pinkeyesucks
02-17-2010, 07:44 AM
"A Changed community"... A changed sense of security. I have never thought about who was passing my house when I was putting out the garbage or getting in my car, but lately I feel eerie and suspicious even in broad daylight. Who is driving by and what are they looking at? Should I smile and say Thank-you to that person at Tim Horton's who held the door open for me? This monster attacked randomly, with no apparent connection. People in their most vulnerable state. In their own homes and asleep. How did he choose them. Did he just happen to hold a door open for them or drive by their house one day and decide they were his next victim? This whole thing is distressing and disturbing to alot of people, I think.

I couldn't agree more. For me, I know feel the need to analyze everything that happened. It is strange, because I don't WANT to know exactly what happened, but I feel the need to look at every aspect. It has turned into a bizarre drive to know if there was any way I could have spotted it, or stopped it before any of it occurred. This is something that obviously was not forseen, and logically I know that, but the drive is still there, almost like I may find some peace if I figure out the puzzle. How does a community heal from this? Belleville and the surrounding area has never been hugely outgoing and neighbourly, and now it is even less so.

pinkeyesucks
02-17-2010, 08:32 AM
Flipflop-

I can't find an exact description of the trucks in the pictures, but they look similar to what is called "Rapid Deployment Vehicles". Relatively open in the rear with bench seating along the sides, they would be what is used when dealing with things like riots, or other situations where they need to send in a team of trained officers. That is not to say that they can't be used for other purposes, like carrying equipment to a crime scene.

I will keep looking though.

pinkeyesucks
02-17-2010, 09:06 AM
Will RW's house on the base ever be searched? There are three current homes technically, Tweed, Ottawa and the quarters located at CFB Trenton.

nobodyzgirl
02-17-2010, 10:08 AM
Will RW's house on the base ever be searched? There are three current homes technically, Tweed, Ottawa and the quarters located at CFB Trenton.

I suspect that the house on base will get searched, the military could be doing the actual searching for that and passing anything they find over to LE, though that's just MOO.

wishingtorihome
02-17-2010, 10:16 AM
Found the answer to my question:

OPP Det. Insp. Chris Nicholas (http://watch.ctv.ca/news/#clip264670)

One article I found, indicated the family of Jessica Lloyd was alerted to the discovery of her body on Sunday night - (February 7).
(see below)

-----------------------------------------------------

http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:WuhB8oxky0wJ:www.metronews.ca/toronto/canada/article/445961--reeve-says-tweed-devastated-by-jessica-lloyd-s-death-man-arrested+jessica+lloyd+family+told+on+sunday&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca

February 08, 2010 12:18 p.m

A family friend, who did not want to be identified, told The Canadian Press earlier that Lloyd's family was told about the discovery of the woman's body on Sunday night.

antiquegirl
02-17-2010, 11:42 AM
One article I found, indicated the family of Jessica Lloyd was alerted to the discovery of her body on Sunday night - (February 7).
(see below)

-----------------------------------------------------

http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:WuhB8oxky0wJ:www.metronews.ca/toronto/canada/article/445961--reeve-says-tweed-devastated-by-jessica-lloyd-s-death-man-arrested+jessica+lloyd+family+told+on+sunday&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca

February 08, 2010 12:18 p.m

A family friend, who did not want to be identified, told The Canadian Press earlier that Lloyd's family was told about the discovery of the woman's body on Sunday night.

The date in this article wasn't mentioned by the source. As I wrote before, most people will mistakenly refer to the hours before sunrise as "night". If you were to receive a phone call at 10 minutes after midnight, wouldn't you say you got it on Sunday night? I would. LE, on the other hand, will have carefully noted the date in their report and refer to any time after midnight as "Monday morning". Det. Insp. Nicholas mentions both Monday and February 8th, so I'm assuming that Jessica's remains were found sometime between midnight and daybreak on that day, as that is what would be in their official reports.

JMO

pinkeyesucks
02-17-2010, 12:02 PM
I think that the family was told what the police knew at the time. The interview with RW went into the night. If I had to put money on it, it ended around 10 pm- you could call it a hunch, or you could call it nosey neighbour. I am sure that directions to the body would have been detailed somewhat in his statement. Now, knowing that it is black as your boot out in the boonies that time of night I can pretty much bet that while they knew approximately where it was they would not have tromped all over a crime scene in the middle of the night. That road is heavily wooded in sections, and the school bus drives it everyday, but not much else happens out there. :) But that is just my opinion, and my opinion tends not to be worth much.

antiquegirl
02-17-2010, 12:02 PM
"A Changed community"... A changed sense of security. I have never thought about who was passing my house when I was putting out the garbage or getting in my car, but lately I feel eerie and suspicious even in broad daylight. Who is driving by and what are they looking at? Should I smile and say Thank-you to that person at Tim Horton's who held the door open for me? This monster attacked randomly, with no apparent connection. People in their most vulnerable state. In their own homes and asleep. How did he choose them. Did he just happen to hold a door open for them or drive by their house one day and decide they were his next victim? This whole thing is distressing and disturbing to alot of people, I think.

(BBM)

I'm convinced that there had to be at least some stalking going on before the victims were chosen. How else would he know that they would be alone? Marie had a boyfriend and one of the sexual assault victims was reported as being married, yet both were alone when he struck. Even if he followed Jessica home that night, he wouldn't know if a friend or relative of hers wouldn't be dropping by. That's why I think that not only did he have prior knowledge of her living alone, but that he waited until she was already in bed. I don't believe that he would have taken the chance of inadvertently running into someone else in the houses he entered.

Not much has been reported about Jessica's social life prior to her brutal murder. Did she have one or more long-term relationship? Did she often have friends over to her house? Did she keep predictable hours? Were there places she frequented on a regular basis? If RW was not watching her house, how would he know for sure that she hadn't brought a man or a friend home with her that night? I could be wrong, but I suspect there may have been prior communication between Jessica and RW at some point - if only a casual conversation where he could determine that she lived alone. Were we ever told where she was that evening?

JMO

satchel
02-17-2010, 12:04 PM
It was my understanding that the family had been notified on Sunday night and that the body had been discovered on Monday morning. I'm sorry but I don't have the media links to back this information up. If this information is correct....it was my speculation that RW had confessed and that through his confession, he had informed LE to the location of the body. MOO

nobodyzgirl
02-17-2010, 12:34 PM
The date in this article wasn't mentioned by the source. As I wrote before, most people will mistakenly refer to the hours before sunrise as "night". If you were to receive a phone call at 10 minutes after midnight, wouldn't you say you got it on Sunday night? I would. LE, on the other hand, will have carefully noted the date in their report and refer to any time after midnight as "Monday morning". Det. Insp. Nicholas mentions both Monday and February 8th, so I'm assuming that Jessica's remains were found sometime between midnight and daybreak on that day, as that is what would be in their official reports.

JMO

This is just MOO, though I think the confusion in the date is based on LE locating the remains on the 7th of February (likely like you said AG, hours before sunrise), contacted the family and mentioned they had found female remains and need someone to identify the body, which by the time a family member got ready and headed to the morgue, it would now be the 8th of February, which is why they use that date, once the remains are identified as being J. Lloyd.

pjgrrrl
02-17-2010, 01:59 PM
Yes, the family knew Sunday.

antiquegirl
02-17-2010, 02:18 PM
Yes, the family knew Sunday.

Knew what? That there had been an arrest or that Jessica's body had been found? And what time (approximately) on Sunday? Why would the OPP detective lie about a few hours? TIA

Hazel
02-17-2010, 02:28 PM
I think that the family was told what the police knew at the time. The interview with RW went into the night. If I had to put money on it, it ended around 10 pm- you could call it a hunch, or you could call it nosey neighbour. I am sure that directions to the body would have been detailed somewhat in his statement. Now, knowing that it is black as your boot out in the boonies that time of night I can pretty much bet that while they knew approximately where it was they would not have tromped all over a crime scene in the middle of the night. That road is heavily wooded in sections, and the school bus drives it everyday, but not much else happens out there. :) But that is just my opinion, and my opinion tends not to be worth much.

Thanks pinkeyesucks; the reason I was asking this is because I checked Jessica's FB group in the early hours of Monday morning (can't remember exactly, maybe it was around 3 am), and the FB was gone. I was shocked at first, thinking that something must be going on, then I thought perhaps the administrators had been shutting down the FB page every night, so they could go rest.

Hazel
02-17-2010, 02:35 PM
Police ramp up search at Williams' country home

Updated: Wed Feb. 17 2010 12:55:25 PM

** breaking news **


Police activity appears to be heating up at the Tweed, Ont. home of Col. Russell Williams, who is facing two first-degree murder charges.

Two large, white police trucks arrived late Wednesday morning at the lakefront property about 30 kilometres northeast of Belleville.

Another six cruisers and 20 OPP officers are also at the scene, up from about three cruisers earlier in the day.

On Tuesday, similar police activity could be seen at Williams' home in Ottawa's Westboro neighbourhood.

RS & BBM


http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20100217/williams_search_100217/20100217/?hub=TorontoNewHome

Valleyboy
02-17-2010, 02:55 PM
Hi folks.
New poster here from Barrie Ont.

I have been following this case and others and impressed by
some of the info you people aquire.

I came across the following story that was posted on mix97 last week
and don't think anyone has posted it here yet.

It contains a picture but I don't know how to post a pic so I will
just post the link for the whole article.

The original artice was in The Contact back on Dec. 4th on page 5.

************************************************** ***

http://www.mix97.com/news/2010/02/eerie-twist-in-cfb-trenton-murder/


Eerie Twist in CFB Trenton Murder
Posted on Thursday, February 11th, 2010

In an eerily ironic coincidence Colonel Russ Williams was being arrested the very day that OPP were investigating the murder of Corporal Marie France Comeau in Brighton. An article in “The Contact” shows a smiling Colonel Williams being arrested in a “jail and bail” fundraiser on November 25th. Comeau was found dead in her Raglan Street home by her boyfreind during the noon hour that day. Colonel William has been charged with her murder.

Hazel
02-17-2010, 03:09 PM
Found nice size pictures of RW Tweed cottage, which clearly show THE BLACK STAR, so added those pictures to my post #121.

There are a few more pictures of the cottage at the link under the pictures. There are supposed to be 25 pictures in all, but first pictures don't show up, just click the arrow (next).

Here is the link to post #121: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4819173&postcount=121

Special request:
I'm still trying to find aerial images/pictures of the Tweed cottage, showing frozen Lake Stoco. Not sure if there are pictures or only video. If any of you come across any pictures, please post link(s) or pictures. Thanks! :)

nobodyzgirl
02-17-2010, 03:12 PM
Hi folks.
New poster here from Barrie Ont.

I have been following this case and others and impressed by
some of the info you people aquire.

I came across the following story that was posted on mix97 last week
and don't think anyone has posted it here yet.

It contains a picture but I don't know how to post a pic so I will
just post the link for the whole article.

The original artice was in The Contact back on Dec. 4th on page 5.

************************************************** ***

http://www.mix97.com/news/2010/02/eerie-twist-in-cfb-trenton-murder/


Eerie Twist in CFB Trenton Murder
Posted on Thursday, February 11th, 2010

In an eerily ironic coincidence Colonel Russ Williams was being arrested the very day that OPP were investigating the murder of Corporal Marie France Comeau in Brighton. An article in “The Contact” shows a smiling Colonel Williams being arrested in a “jail and bail” fundraiser on November 25th. Comeau was found dead in her Raglan Street home by her boyfreind during the noon hour that day. Colonel William has been charged with her murder.


Thanks for link and welcome Valleyboy

Hazel
02-17-2010, 03:17 PM
Hi folks.
New poster here from Barrie Ont.

I have been following this case and others and impressed by
some of the info you people aquire.

I came across the following story that was posted on mix97 last week
and don't think anyone has posted it here yet.

It contains a picture but I don't know how to post a pic so I will
just post the link for the whole article.

The original artice was in The Contact back on Dec. 4th on page 5.

************************************************** ***

http://www.mix97.com/news/2010/02/eerie-twist-in-cfb-trenton-murder/


Eerie Twist in CFB Trenton Murder
Posted on Thursday, February 11th, 2010

In an eerily ironic coincidence Colonel Russ Williams was being arrested the very day that OPP were investigating the murder of Corporal Marie France Comeau in Brighton. An article in “The Contact” shows a smiling Colonel Williams being arrested in a “jail and bail” fundraiser on November 25th. Comeau was found dead in her Raglan Street home by her boyfreind during the noon hour that day. Colonel William has been charged with her murder.


:Welcome-12-june: to WS Valleyboy!

to post an image, right click ON the image, select PROPERTIES. Copy the image "address' or "location"
Then click on the Icon that says INSERT IMAGE ... it looks like this: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/images/editor/insertimage.gif

Paste the URL address of the Image you want to show there.
For some reason I can only do this when using QUOTE. I don't get the option to add Image nor Link if using "QUICK REPLY"
Hope this helps :)

antiquegirl
02-17-2010, 03:36 PM
Found nice size pictures of RW Tweed cottage, which clearly show THE BLACK STAR, so added those pictures to my post #121.

There are a few more pictures of the cottage at the link under the pictures. There are supposed to be 25 pictures in all, but first pictures don't show up, just click the arrow (next).

Here is the link to post #121: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4819173&postcount=121

Special request:
I'm still trying to find aerial images/pictures of the Tweed cottage, showing frozen Lake Stoco. Not sure if there are pictures or only video. If any of you come across any pictures, please post link(s) or pictures. Thanks! :)

Thanks for the great pictures. However, I don't think that star is black. It looks more gold to me (zoom in and compare it to the black barbecue) and is possibly related to the military. Could SomeGirlOnTheNet please confirm or deny that this five-point star could be representative of a medal or badge assiciated with RW? TIA

pjgrrrl
02-17-2010, 03:58 PM
Thanks for the great pictures. However, I don't think that star is black. It looks more gold to me (zoom in and compare it to the black barbecue) and is possibly related to the military. Could SomeGirlOnTheNet please confirm or deny that this five-point star could be representative of a medal or badge assiciated with WR? TIA


It looks to me to be a wrought iron type star, one you would see at a country craft store. It might be sprayed with a gold fleck, or topcoat, but is weathered. JMO. I have a similar one!

Valleyboy
02-17-2010, 04:05 PM
Here is the picture (hopefully) I was trying to post in 170

Thanks Hazel

http://www.mix97.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/jail-n-bail-williams-

Hazel
02-17-2010, 05:22 PM
Williams hires high-profile defence lawyer
Timothy Appleby
Globe and Mail Update
Published on Wednesday, Feb. 17, 2010 2:14PM EST
Last updated on Wednesday, Feb. 17, 2010 2:28PM EST


Colonel Russell Williams, the former Trenton military base commander now facing charges of murder and sexual assault, has retained high-profile Ottawa defence lawyer Michael Edelson.

Currently being held without bail at the Quinte detention centre near Napanee, Ont., Col. Williams has a court appearance scheduled for Thursday morning in Belleville.

He is to appear by video link at what is expected to be a brief hearing that will set another court date.

read more : http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/williams-hires-high-profile-defence-lawyer/article1471452/

:waitasec: don't know what to think

flipflop
02-17-2010, 05:31 PM
Found nice size pictures of RW Tweed cottage, which clearly show THE BLACK STAR, so added those pictures to my post #121.

There are a few more pictures of the cottage at the link under the pictures. There are supposed to be 25 pictures in all, but first pictures don't show up, just click the arrow (next).

Here is the link to post #121: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4819173&postcount=121

Special request:
I'm still trying to find aerial images/pictures of the Tweed cottage, showing frozen Lake Stoco. Not sure if there are pictures or only video. If any of you come across any pictures, please post link(s) or pictures. Thanks! :)


Thanks for the pics, however, these Stars are a very popular item with home decor. Go into any home decor store and you will find them. I have seen several of these stars on houses, porches, sheds etc which come in a variety of colours. JMO I don't think it has any meaning further than a piece of art to decorate the exterior of the cottage.

Hazel
02-17-2010, 06:04 PM
Thanks for the pics, however, these Stars are a very popular item with home decor. Go into any home decor store and you will find them. I have seen several of these stars on houses, porches, sheds etc which come in a variety of colours. JMO I don't think it has any meaning further than a piece of art to decorate the exterior of the cottage.
Thank you flipflop :) It's just that there is another small "dark" star (difficult to see the exact color) at the front door as well. Could be a burgundy Christmas decoration? I didn't think much about it when I first saw the picture, but when I read the article, then it made me think that there could be a meaning to it. If it is common to see these stars in houses in Tweed, then it's just that, decoration :)

pinkeyesucks
02-17-2010, 06:31 PM
Thanks pinkeyesucks; the reason I was asking this is because I checked Jessica's FB group in the early hours of Monday morning (can't remember exactly, maybe it was around 3 am), and the FB was gone. I was shocked at first, thinking that something must be going on, then I thought perhaps the administrators had been shutting down the FB page every night, so they could go rest.

Yes, the Facebook group stopped allowing ANY posts, including discussion posts around 9 pm that night, which was very different than an average night up to that point- discussions remained open all night every night, but the wall shut down for the admins to get some time away. It had a very different feel than the typical shutdown. It was also around this time that there was in impromtu meeting at the corner of my street- with 4 cruisers and the undercover officer that lives across the street. I had no idea he was an officer until that night.

But that is just my opinion.

Hazel
02-17-2010, 07:01 PM
Valleyboy, you almost got it. You are missing the last part of the code, it has to include up to extension .jpg

put this code:
ttp://www.mix97.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/jail-n-bail-williams.jpg

(add h at the beginning of the code) I had to remove it, otherwise, will appear as a link here.

in between

maxfactor
02-17-2010, 07:04 PM
Williams hires high-profile defence lawyer
Timothy Appleby
Globe and Mail Update
Published on Wednesday, Feb. 17, 2010 2:14PM EST
Last updated on Wednesday, Feb. 17, 2010 2:28PM EST



read more : http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/williams-hires-high-profile-defence-lawyer/article1471452/

:waitasec: don't know what to think

I don't know what to think either but I wonder if it has anything to do with the fact that the search of his homes is being ramped up?

puppyraiser
02-17-2010, 08:53 PM
Sounds like both homes are being thoroughly searched......including tearing up floorboards and ripping apart walls and ceilings.

http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20100217/williams_search_100217/20100217?hub=Toronto

maxfactor
02-17-2010, 08:56 PM
Here's another article about his hiring a lawyer. It's the heading that gets me,

Williams retains top lawyer to fight murder, sex assault chargesBBM
http://www.thespec.com/News/BreakingNews/article/723631

flipflop
02-17-2010, 09:15 PM
Sounds like both homes are being thoroughly searched......including tearing up floorboards and ripping apart walls and ceilings.

http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20100217/williams_search_100217/20100217?hub=Toronto

Investigators equipped with saws, drills and other power tools were believed to be cutting out the flooring, wood-panelled walls and ceiling of the two-bedroom house as they search for evidence in the case against Williams.

On Tuesday, similar police activity could be seen at Williams' home in Ottawa's Westboro neighbourhood.


Did he confess to hiding items in the walls and floors, or what gave LE the hunch to search in these places?

matou
02-17-2010, 09:19 PM
Found this article that states that Jessica was strangled :( Hadn't read this before. http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Murdered+woman+remembered+police+continue+searchin g+colonel+home/2561141/story.html

puppyraiser
02-17-2010, 09:20 PM
Did he confess to hiding items in the walls and floors, or what gave LE the hunch to search in these places?

I wonder if, after the Bernardo fiasco, LE are doing much more thorough searches of the suspect's home(s).

RubyRed
02-17-2010, 09:25 PM
Cops haven't searched Williams' Orleans home
Nothing about the place stands out as suspicious in light of Williams’ arrest, he said, adding he’s not looking under any floorboards or popping his head into the attic because there’s no reason to.

“It’s just a house,” he said.

“We had a house inspection, you know, and we had a look at that a long time ago.”

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2010/02/13/12871266-qmi.html

I wonder if they will take saws and drills to this house. moo

RubyRed
02-17-2010, 09:27 PM
I wonder if, after the Bernardo fiasco, LE are doing much more thorough searches of the suspect's home(s).

You are probably right.

flipflop
02-17-2010, 09:34 PM
Snipped from the link attached:

On Friday, the police took the unusual step of blocking access to files about home break-ins in which women's underwear was stolen. It's a common practice to seal files during major crime investigations.

Insp. Al Tario would not comment on the sealed files. Instead, he e-mailed a written statement to say the Ottawa police ``cannot speculate or discuss evidentiary or investigative matters'' related to the Williams case


...I just wonder how many break ins that he committed and how many pairs of panties they will find in his houses. Can you imagine all the time and money that this is costing us tax payers for LE to be ripping apart his 2 houses for underwear!!!

http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Murdered+woman+remembered+police+continue+searchin g+colonel+home/2561141/story.html

puppyraiser
02-17-2010, 09:36 PM
Cops haven't searched Williams' Orleans home
Nothing about the place stands out as suspicious in light of Williams’ arrest, he said, adding he’s not looking under any floorboards or popping his head into the attic because there’s no reason to.

“It’s just a house,” he said.

“We had a house inspection, you know, and we had a look at that a long time ago.”
http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2010/02/13/12871266-qmi.html

I wonder if they will take saws and drills to this house. moo

Makes one wonder although I suspect Williams removed any possible evidence from that home since it sounds as if he fancied keeping trophies (if we are to believe what we've read in newspaper articles).

pinkeyesucks
02-17-2010, 09:38 PM
I dunno what to think about the lawyer....I am keeping my fingers crossed that every i is dotted, and every t is crossed.

RubyRed
02-17-2010, 09:40 PM
Makes one wonder although I suspect Williams removed any possible evidence from that home since it sounds as if he fancied keeping trophies (if we are to believe what we've read in newspaper articles).

yes, no doubt he did . I would feel creeped out living in that home, though. moo

Hazel
02-17-2010, 09:48 PM
This is not a new Video clip, but thought I will post it here for future reference. There are many other videos regarding this case on that link as well.

( wait for advertisement to end )

GLOBAL TV VIDEO "Murder Investigation" (http://www.globaltoronto.com/video/index.html?releasePID=vzxi9pf3YnZ89VXylQLxbBbhsIDR Pspy)

antiquegirl
02-17-2010, 09:53 PM
Snipped from the link attached:

On Friday, the police took the unusual step of blocking access to files about home break-ins in which women's underwear was stolen. It's a common practice to seal files during major crime investigations.

Insp. Al Tario would not comment on the sealed files. Instead, he e-mailed a written statement to say the Ottawa police ``cannot speculate or discuss evidentiary or investigative matters'' related to the Williams case


...I just wonder how many break ins that he committed and how many pairs of panties they will find in his houses. Can you imagine all the time and money that this is costing us tax payers for LE to be ripping apart his 2 houses for underwear!!!

http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Murdered+woman+remembered+police+continue+searchin g+colonel+home/2561141/story.html

I don't think they're looking just for underwear. Compared to the two murders and sexual assaults, this would be small potatoes and I doubt they'll even charge him for it - IF they make the other charges stick. I believe LE is after bigger game - the photos and videos they mention and anything that would tie him to the current charges. Hopefully they won't find anything worse, if you know what I mean. :(

As for the wording about the lawyer - that's what defence lawyers do; they fight for their clients. Nothing new there.

JMO

antiquegirl
02-17-2010, 10:04 PM
Found this article that states that Jessica was strangled :( Hadn't read this before. http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Murdered+woman+remembered+police+continue+searchin g+colonel+home/2561141/story.html

Although, to the best of my knowledge, LE has never commented on the cause of death for either murder victim, "sources" have been mentioned before as stating:

"A second alleged victim of Canadian Forces Air Force Colonel Russell Williams was also asphyxiated, sources familiar with the investigation say."

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/ontario-women-were-asphyxiated-source-says/article1465532/

"Eastern Ontario women were both asphyxiated."

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/Eastern+Ontario+women+were+both+asphyxiated/2556788/story.html

" ... friends and family of Jessica Lloyd gathered in Belleville to remember the 27-year-old woman who was found strangled on Monday."

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/entertainment/Town+pays+tribute+homicide+victim/2560636/story.html

:(

pinkeyesucks
02-17-2010, 10:14 PM
[QUOTE=flipflop;4823396]Snipped from the link attached:

On Friday, the police took the unusual step of blocking access to files about home break-ins in which women's underwear was stolen. It's a common practice to seal files during major crime investigations.

Insp. Al Tario would not comment on the sealed files. Instead, he e-mailed a written statement to say the Ottawa police ``cannot speculate or discuss evidentiary or investigative matters'' related to the Williams case


...I just wonder how many break ins that he committed and how many pairs of panties they will find in his houses. Can you imagine all the time and money that this is costing us tax payers for LE to be ripping apart his 2 houses for underwear!!!

I think I am actually more upset with how much I am paying to feed the monster. I don't mind paying good money if it means they find what they need to make sure he never walks free again. But that's just my opinion.

pjgrrrl
02-17-2010, 10:32 PM
She was asphyxiated.

My opinion is that Comeau's death perhaps was an accident, maybe asphyxiation gone too far, and then he got a taste for it (murder).

I could be totally wrong in thinking that, but it's just where my mind is at.

Goodnight all, may you rest well.

maxfactor
02-17-2010, 11:43 PM
She was asphyxiated.

My opinion is that Comeau's death perhaps was an accident, maybe asphyxiation gone too far, and then he got a taste for it (murder).

I could be totally wrong in thinking that, but it's just where my mind is at.

Goodnight all, may you rest well.

That could very well be how it went. I also wondered if perhaps she recognized him and that's why he killed her.

antiquegirl
02-18-2010, 12:07 AM
She was asphyxiated.

My opinion is that Comeau's death perhaps was an accident, maybe asphyxiation gone too far, and then he got a taste for it (murder).

I could be totally wrong in thinking that, but it's just where my mind is at.

Goodnight all, may you rest well.

Yes, this was rumoured last week.

... investigators believe Comeau’s death was unintentional and that “she was meant to live.”

http://www.citytv.com/toronto/citynews/news/national/article/69997--report-suggests-col-russ-williams-and-paul-bernardo-were-friends

"But detectives believe the death of Canadian Forces Corporal Marie-France Comeau, 38, was not intentionally inflicted. "The theory is that she was meant to live."

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/ontario-women-were-asphyxiated-source-says/article1465532/

antiquegirl
02-18-2010, 12:11 AM
That could very well be how it went. I also wondered if perhaps she recognized him and that's why he killed her.

That's certainly a possibility. Another one to consider is that her mouth was covered in duct tape and her head with something else and she could have accidentally suffocated - even after he left her. It would still be murder.

JMO

RubyRed
02-18-2010, 01:04 AM
Comeau's car was gone Wednesday morning, but his wife noticed the woman arrive back over the lunch hour.
http://www.northumberlandtoday.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=2194366



Considering it was during the daytime , I think it was intentional. This one was different though , as the others happened during the middle of the night.

sillybilly
02-18-2010, 01:25 AM
Comeau's car was gone Wednesday morning, but his wife noticed the woman arrive back over the lunch hour.
http://www.northumberlandtoday.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=2194366



Considering it was during the daytime , I think it was intentional. This one was different though , as the others happened during the middle of the night.

If I'm reading this right, the attack on Cpl Comeau was somewhat of a blitz.

The article says her car was seen arriving back over the lunch hour, then:


"A short time later Alexander walked out of his home to greet a service man when Comeau's boyfriend, who is also in the military, came running the road, yelling, "She's dead inside the house."

then:


Ontario Provincial Police say the woman's body was discovered at 12:58 p.m. after emergency services were dispatched to 252 Raglan Street in Brighton.

bbm

To most people, "over the lunch hour" would commence approx 12:00 noon, and Cpl Comeau was found less than an hour later.

Paladine
02-18-2010, 03:35 AM
Williams hires high-profile defence lawyer
Timothy Appleby
Globe and Mail Update
Published on Wednesday, Feb. 17, 2010 2:14PM EST
Last updated on Wednesday, Feb. 17, 2010 2:28PM EST



read more : http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/williams-hires-high-profile-defence-lawyer/article1471452/

:waitasec: don't know what to think

I know that lawyer. He represented my Hubby on an impaired charge. Hubby was
.11, .08 is impaired, here. He got a fine, 3 month suspension, and an interlock device for a year...it could have been much worse...

Edelson is a very good lawyer, very expensive, but very good. And very connected and respected. This could be interesting.

sillybilly
02-18-2010, 06:20 AM
I think Mr. Edelsen is going to have his work cut out for him in defending this client. JMO, but from what I can see, he might be able to minimize a bit on sentencing, but I sure don't think RW is going to walk.

from:

http://www.northumberlandnews.com/news/article/148481


Cpl. Comeau became a flight attendant with 8 Wing Trenton's 437 Squadron after over a decade in the Canadian Forces. She was chosen to work as the Prime Minister and Governor General's flight attendant after six months on the job in 2009

bbm

Seems Cpl Comeau was chosen to be in pretty close proximity to RW from the time he became commander.

flipflop
02-18-2010, 08:08 AM
I think Mr. Edelsen is going to have his work cut out for him in defending this client. JMO, but from what I can see, he might be able to minimize a bit on sentencing, but I sure don't think RW is going to walk.

from:

http://www.northumberlandnews.com/news/article/148481



bbm

Seems Cpl Comeau was chosen to be in pretty close proximity to RW from the time he became commander.


Cpl. Comeau became a flight attendant with 8 Wing Trenton's 437 Squadron after over a decade in the Canadian Forces. She was chosen to work as the Prime Minister and Governor General's flight attendant after six months on the job in 2009

does anyone know who would do the choosing to pick attendants to do this particular job? Would it have been RW?

matou
02-18-2010, 10:55 AM
To most people, "over the lunch hour" would commence approx 12:00 noon, and Cpl Comeau was found less than an hour later. by Sillybilly

This has got me thinking that he intended to kill her. He must have been in her home when she entered at noon (let's say 12:00). He may have just wanted her lingerie or more. He did what he did and she was killed. Let's assume she was asphyxiated as the reports have stated. He must have grabbed her right away and covered her mouth or hit her to knock her out. She is dead before the boyfriend gets there just before 1 p.m. the same day, so she is freshly dead when he finds her.

How did he get out of this house? Did he leave through the front door? It was in the middle of the day. I'm guessing she had neighbours who were in closer proximity to her than Jessica since it was reported that a neighbour thought Comeau said "What are YOU doing here?"

If Williams parked his car somewhere else, then he would have been walking in the area between noon and 1 p.m. A guy of his stature may have been recognized by someone driving by. This is the same day that he is in the photo being "arrested". I wonder if this photo was taken before of after 12 noon? This guy changed his pattern crime to crime, it seems.

fats
02-18-2010, 11:06 AM
Speculation can be misleading!!

I agree with pikeyesucks---speculation is just that! Are the trucks outside his house in Ottawa and Tweed a big show? Does it mean that OPP have actually found evidence? Or could it also mean that they haven't and are just digging deeper because they have not found anything!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by pinkeyesucks
Yeah I'm not so sure that is completely accurate, but we'll go with it.


I'm sure going with it. It's way too much of a coincidence that RW talked to OPP investigators on Sunday and poor Jessica's remains were found early Monday morning. (And not one mention of the golf course. )

JMO
__________________
An opinion should be the result of thought, not a substitute for it.

Jef Mallett

fats
02-18-2010, 11:11 AM
I know that lawyer. He represented my Hubby on an impaired charge. Hubby was
.11, .08 is impaired, here. He got a fine, 3 month suspension, and an interlock device for a year...it could have been much worse...

Edelson is a very good lawyer, very expensive, but very good. And very connected and respected. This could be interesting.

I hope your husband learned from this. Amazing what a good lawyer can do--and glad no one was hurt as a consequence of hubby's drunk-driving! As Martha says, "not a good thing!"

antiquegirl
02-18-2010, 11:25 AM
Speculation can be misleading!!

I agree with pikeyesucks---speculation is just that! Are the trucks outside his house in Ottawa and Tweed a big show? Does it mean that OPP have actually found evidence? Or could it also mean that they haven't and are just digging deeper because they have not found anything!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by pinkeyesucks
Yeah I'm not so sure that is completely accurate, but we'll go with it.


I'm sure going with it. It's way too much of a coincidence that RW talked to OPP investigators on Sunday and poor Jessica's remains were found early Monday morning. (And not one mention of the golf course. )

JMO
__________________
An opinion should be the result of thought, not a substitute for it.

Jef Mallett

(BBM)

I agree. Which is why I have "JMO" (just my opinion) at the bottom of my post, which you have copied into yours.

A big part of our work here at WS is speculation and the hope that we can find some logical answers from it. Otherwise, all we would have is the same information as given by the media, which would not advance the cause. It's important (and part of the TOS) that we each make clear in our posts what is speculation and what are facts that have been given by authorized sources. Even some media info cannot be relied upon to be 100% accurate, as we have all learned.

JMO

RubyRed
02-18-2010, 11:35 AM
Col. Williams to make court appearance in Belleville

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/opinion/Williams+make+court+appearance+Belleville/2578450/story.html

nursebeeme
02-18-2010, 12:09 PM
Cpl. Comeau became a flight attendant with 8 Wing Trenton's 437 Squadron after over a decade in the Canadian Forces. She was chosen to work as the Prime Minister and Governor General's flight attendant after six months on the job in 2009

does anyone know who would do the choosing to pick attendants to do this particular job? Would it have been RW? let me take a stab at this, as my hubby is a LTC in the US Army (we have been in going on 20 years);

the way you get jobs in the military is thru your branch manager. That being said, she could have requested the job herself if she was qualified and there was an opening OR there could have been a 'by name request' which would mean that she knew/had worked with someone, knew of the job opening, and was specifically requested by the commander. If he had known her before and was in that specific chain of command at the time I could see a by name request being a possibility. MOO


ETA: jobs at this level could also require an application/interview process that is competitive in nature.

nobodyzgirl
02-18-2010, 12:24 PM
Speculation can be misleading!!

I agree with pikeyesucks---speculation is just that! Are the trucks outside his house in Ottawa and Tweed a big show? Does it mean that OPP have actually found evidence? Or could it also mean that they haven't and are just digging deeper because they have not found anything!!

snipped and bbm

This is JMO only - I think LE has more important things to do than make a big show by showing up with trucks. According to media reports (and yes, I know they are not always accurate), the trucks are there for bringing equipement. I would assume that this includes, the power tools, etc. that they are using to cut up the floors, walls, etc. I'm sure they learned there lesson from Bernardo case, and this time they will leave no stone unturned to ensure they have collected everything they need.

I also think because of his post in the Canadian Armed Forces, they will be making sure every single thing is done by the book (especially now because he has retained counsel) to ensure that he doesn't walk on a technicality.

Again, this is just strictly MOO

nobodyzgirl
02-18-2010, 12:34 PM
http://www.cbc.ca/politics/story/2010/02/18/colonel-russell-williams-court-belleville.html

Williams, 46, appeared on an-old style 36-inch TV screen before a packed courtroom at the Ontario Court of Justice in Belleville, Ont., at 10:30 a.m.

Dressed in an orange prison jumpsuit, he walked up to the camera at the Quinte Detention Centre in Napanee, Ont. A pale blue cement wall and a heavy metal door were visible in the background.

A legal representative for Williams requested that his next court appearance be March 25 by video. Justice of the peace Deanne Chappelle agreed. Williams said "thank you," then turned and walked away.

Williams has been charged with first-degree murder in the deaths of Jessica Lloyd, 27, and Cpl. Marie-France Comeau, 38, as well as counts of breaking and entering, forcible confinement and the sexual assault of two other women in Tweed, a small community north of Belleville. Williams was the commander of nearby CFB Trenton.

His brief court appearance Thursday drew about 60 people, leaving standing room only in the courtroom. Two Ontario Provincial Police officers and two Canadian military police officers were present, in addition the the two Belleville police officers typically on duty. The spectators included about a dozen reporters and courtroom sketch artists.

Now this is interesting, according to this article, his lawyer wasn't present, though he sent an articling student. I get that this appearance was strictly standard and nothing would be gleamed from it, though I find it amusing that he sent a student and not an associate:

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/court-appearance-for-ex-cfb-trenton-commander-charged-in-slayings/article1472693/?service=mobile

I also found this interesting in this article as well (BBM):

Among the spectators and media in the packed courtroom was Air Force Lieut. Tony O'Keeffe, who commands the 1,000-strong cadet military cadet college in Kingston. Outside court Lieut. O'Keeffe said he would be monitoring the criminal proceedings as “the eyes and ears" of the military.

He also said he would be travelling to Quinte later in the day to meet Col. Williams, whom he has known personally for nine years. Lieut. O'Keeffe said he was shocked to the core by the charges.

antiquegirl
02-18-2010, 12:43 PM
http://www.cbc.ca/politics/story/2010/02/18/colonel-russell-williams-court-belleville.html

(Respectfully snipped)

Thanks for this NBG. I wonder why the CBC opted to put this in their "Politics" section. The previous article about his upcoming court date was in the "Canada" category. Was this placement an editorial error? I fail to see how this falls under political news.

JMO

antiquegirl
02-18-2010, 12:50 PM
It's JMO that Williams would not have worn his uniform while committing any of his alleged offences. Still, I have to wonder how often his uniforms would have been dry cleaned. I'm guessing that LE has removed every article of his clothing from all residences to look for any remaining evidence from the crimes. I also wonder if they found any duct tape in the same colour(s) as used in the assaults.

JMO

pinkeyesucks
02-18-2010, 01:04 PM
So let's say that the media got it right in this case and that "Comeau’s death was unintentional and that she was meant to live.”

5 minutes of surfing on the internet and I come up with this....


John Wayne Gacy is claims the death of his first victim was "unintentional".

PB and KH's "first kill was unintentional, but the circumstances under which death occurred were perhaps more outrageous than any premeditated serial killing." http://www.hillside-strangler.com/hillside_strangler-team_killers_002.htm



Check out the opening to this research paper....I really wish I could get a copy of the whole thing. http://bases.bireme.br/cgi-bin/wxislind.exe/iah/online/?IsisScript=iah/iah.xis&src=google&base=ADOLEC&lang=p&nextAction=lnk&exprSearch=17980531&indexSearch=ID

Which brings me to my next point. Asphyxia can be preformed in many ways. There is strangulation, and here is a link to a book excerpt that explains that it ranks very high on the list of serial murders.

http://books.google.ca/books?id=SZTPdM97kq0C&pg=PA91&lpg=PA91&dq=serial+murders+death+by+asphyxiation&source=bl&ots=7z3wTnvbLO&sig=2vDRBXk9fNbFzIcZNaJQoma30iU&hl=en&ei=Pl59S-C_BdCWtgfB9I3DBQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=7&ved=0CB4Q6AEwBg#v=onepage&q=serial%20murders%20death%20by%20asphyxiation&f=false

Here are some other examples of how asphyxia can occur... http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Asphyxia

The term burking is often ascribed to a killing method that involves simultaneous smothering and compression of the torso. The term "burking" comes from the method William Burke and William Hare used to kill their victims during the West Port murders. The Burke and Hare murders were serial murders perpetrated in Edinburgh, Scotland, from November, 1827 through October 31, 1828. The killings were attributed to Irish immigrants William Burke and William Hare, who sold the corpses of their 17 victims to provide material for dissection....They killed the usually-intoxicated victims by sitting on their chests and suffocating them by putting a hand over their nose and mouth, while using the other hand to push the victim's jaw up. The corpses had no visible injuries, and were supplied to medical schools for money.
Compressive asphyxia (also called chest compression) is the mechanical limitation of the expansion of the lungs by compressing the torso, hence interfering with breathing. Compressive asphyxia occurs when the chest or abdomen is compressed posteriorly. The cause of death of detainees who have been restrained and left prone, for example in police vehicles, and are not able to move into safer positions has been referred to as 'positional asphyxia'.

In regard to the big mofo trucks and saws and drills at both homes.....

It occurred to me last night that legally they can't run his dna for any crime that he is not charged with UNLESS THEY HAVE EVIDENCE LINKING him to the crime. They have a search warrant to look, so wouldn't now be the time to get as much as they can?

I really don't know where I am going with this...Need some time to formulate without babies crying in the background:) Nap time I think!

This is all purely speculative on my part, and somewhat mind boggling....

Paladine
02-18-2010, 01:16 PM
I hope your husband learned from this. Amazing what a good lawyer can do--and glad no one was hurt as a consequence of hubby's drunk-driving! As Martha says, "not a good thing!"

Oh, I couldn't agree more. Dangerous, stupid and selfish. He heard all about it. And it scared him big time, he needs to drive to work. This was 2006, he has never gotten tipsy since.

Paladine
02-18-2010, 01:21 PM
It's JMO that Williams would not have worn his uniform while committing any of his alleged offences. Still, I have to wonder how often his uniforms would have been dry cleaned. I'm guessing that LE has removed every article of his clothing from all residences to look for any remaining evidence from the crimes. I also wonder if they found any duct tape in the same colour(s) as used in the assaults.

JMO

I'm thinking he may have worn his uniform with Jessica. Reportedly, they found boot prints at the scene that matched his. Snow boots or work boots, I wonder. If they are military boots, I would think he'd only wear those in uniform, no? Just a thought...


Police detectives investigating accused sex killer and rapist Col. Russell Williams have recovered evidence -- including hidden keepsakes -- from his Westboro home and have matched a snowy print from a homicide scene to a boot worn by the former base commander
http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Police+match+homicide+scene+footprint+boot+worn+Wi lliams/2566489/story.html

antiquegirl
02-18-2010, 01:46 PM
I'm thinking he may have worn his uniform with Jessica. Reportedly, they found boot prints at the scene that matched his. Snow boots or work boots, I wonder. If they are military boots, I would think he'd only wear those in uniform, no? Just a thought...

http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Police+match+homicide+scene+footprint+boot+worn+Wi lliams/2566489/story.html

It's feasible that he did wear his uniform. The reason I suspect he didn't is because of the risk of damaging it during a struggle and the possibility of contamination by evidence. Those uniforms must be very expensive to replace. Much easier and cheaper to dispose of civilian clothes if necessary.

Also, I still believe that Jessica was caught unaware after she was asleep. If RW broke into her house in the middle of the night (as he allegedly did with the assault victims), he would have been unlikely to be in uniform. It would be so helpful to know if her bed was made or not the following morning (presuming that making it up was her regular habit).

JMO

nobodyzgirl
02-18-2010, 03:11 PM
It's feasible that he did wear his uniform. The reason I suspect he didn't is because of the risk of damaging it during a struggle and the possibility of contamination by evidence. Those uniforms must be very expensive to replace. Much easier and cheaper to dispose of civilian clothes if necessary.

Also, I still believe that Jessica was caught unaware after she was asleep. If RW broke into her house in the middle of the night (as he allegedly did with the assault victims), he would have been unlikely to be in uniform. It would be so helpful to know if her bed was made or not the following morning (presuming that making it up was her regular habit).

JMO

I don't think he was in uniform either. I think he'd be too easily recognized in a uniform as opposed to civilian clothes, where he could blend in, especially if he was breaking into someone's house at night. I don't live in the the area, so I'm not sure how common it is for members of the military to walk around in uniform when they aren't on the base, if it's the norm or not.

RubyRed
02-18-2010, 03:49 PM
A Canadian military commander charged with two counts of first-degree murder will be officially relieved of his duties Thursday.


http://www.citytv.com/toronto/citynews/news/national/article/70333--court-appearance-for-col-russell-williams-charged-in-deaths-of-two-women

nobodyzgirl
02-18-2010, 03:54 PM
A Canadian military commander charged with two counts of first-degree murder will be officially relieved of his duties Thursday.


http://www.citytv.com/toronto/citynews/news/national/article/70333--court-appearance-for-col-russell-williams-charged-in-deaths-of-two-women

That makes sense why he was going to visit him after his court appearance - to relieve him of his duties..

nobodyzgirl
02-18-2010, 03:57 PM
This is completely unrelated to the case, though I came across this letter from the captains of the Team Canada Hockey teams (for the Olympics) and I thought I'd post it here as I found it very touching and inspiring.

http://www.army.forces.gc.ca/land-terre/news-nouvelles/story-reportage-eng.asp?id=4125

Go Team Canada...I hope all three teams bring home the Gold Medal in honour of our Troops!

fats
02-18-2010, 05:59 PM
:waitasec::waitasec::waitasec:
snipped and bbm

This is JMO only - I think LE has more important things to do than make a big show by showing up with trucks. According to media reports (and yes, I know they are not always accurate), the trucks are there for bringing equipement. I would assume that this includes, the power tools, etc. that they are using to cut up the floors, walls, etc. I'm sure they learned there lesson from Bernardo case, and this time they will leave no stone unturned to ensure they have collected everything they need.

I also think because of his post in the Canadian Armed Forces, they will be making sure every single thing is done by the book (especially now because he has retained counsel) to ensure that he doesn't walk on a technicality.

Again, this is just strictly MOO

I should clarify that it is a "big show" when those trucks are parked outside. I hope that means the OPP are actually finding and not just searching fruitlessly. They do have to be very thorough in such a high profile case. I wonder if they have found any substantial evidence.

Summersolstice
02-18-2010, 06:15 PM
http://www.cbc.ca/politics/story/2010/02/18/colonel-russell-williams-court-belleville.html

Williams, 46, appeared on an-old style 36-inch TV screen before a packed courtroom at the Ontario Court of Justice in Belleville, Ont., at 10:30 a.m.

Dressed in an orange prison jumpsuit, he walked up to the camera at the Quinte Detention Centre in Napanee, Ont. A pale blue cement wall and a heavy metal door were visible in the background.

A legal representative for Williams requested that his next court appearance be March 25 by video. Justice of the peace Deanne Chappelle agreed. Williams said "thank you," then turned and walked away.

Williams has been charged with first-degree murder in the deaths of Jessica Lloyd, 27, and Cpl. Marie-France Comeau, 38, as well as counts of breaking and entering, forcible confinement and the sexual assault of two other women in Tweed, a small community north of Belleville. Williams was the commander of nearby CFB Trenton.

His brief court appearance Thursday drew about 60 people, leaving standing room only in the courtroom. Two Ontario Provincial Police officers and two Canadian military police officers were present, in addition the the two Belleville police officers typically on duty. The spectators included about a dozen reporters and courtroom sketch artists.

Now this is interesting, according to this article, his lawyer wasn't present, though he sent an articling student. I get that this appearance was strictly standard and nothing would be gleamed from it, though I find it amusing that he sent a student and not an associate:

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/court-appearance-for-ex-cfb-trenton-commander-charged-in-slayings/article1472693/?service=mobile

I also found this interesting in this article as well (BBM):

Among the spectators and media in the packed courtroom was Air Force Lieut. Tony O'Keeffe, who commands the 1,000-strong cadet military cadet college in Kingston. Outside court Lieut. O'Keeffe said he would be monitoring the criminal proceedings as “the eyes and ears" of the military.

He also said he would be travelling to Quinte later in the day to meet Col. Williams, whom he has known personally for nine years. Lieut. O'Keeffe said he was shocked to the core by the charges.
Isn't that nice? They all know each other personally. Makes me wonder what Joe Grozelle's dad thinks.

This article describes O'Keeffe the military PR man as a "friend" of RW. A friend in PR is an interesting choice:

http://www.torontosun.com/news/canada/2010/02/18/12929481.html

Hazel
02-18-2010, 06:17 PM
Williams case back in court in March

Havent't seen this mentioned in the other articles:

Victoria Creighton, representing Williams’ Ottawa-based lawyer, Michael Edelson, told the court she was requesting the matter be adjourned until March 25 as disclosure had yet to be received. Crown Attorney Lee Burgess agreed to the request and Chapelle instructed Williams he would be appearing — by video once again — at the requested date.

Williams was described as “an intellect” by O’Keeffe who also spoke highly of his wife, Mary-Elizabeth Harriman.

“I have spoken with her, briefly. She’s an admirable and remarkable lady. She’s handling things very well, considering, and I would hate to be in her position,” he said.


source : http://www.ottawasun.com/news/ottawa/2010/02/18/12930861.html

Summersolstice
02-18-2010, 06:30 PM
Another victim of Russ Williams/Sovka?

Parents of slain Ontario woman relive pain with news of colonel's arrest

Read more: http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Parents+slain+Ontario+woman+relive+pain+with+news+ colonel+arrest/2558147/story.html#ixzz0fYJIrZhj (http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Parents+slain+Ontario+woman+relive+pain+with+news+ colonel+arrest/2558147/story.html#ixzz0fYJIrZhj)

Margaret McWilliam, of Deep River, Ont., was 21 years old in 1987 when she was raped and killed while out for a jog in a Scarborough, Ont., park about a half-kilometre from her new Toronto home.






That Deep River connection again!

Hazel
02-18-2010, 06:45 PM
Col. Williams appears in court with heavy sigh, looking a shadow of former self

more snippets of info I haven't seen in other articles:

dressed in an orange jumpsuit and appearing unshaven. He sauntered toward the camera and stood stooped in front of it, with none of the crispness Canadians are used to seeing from military officers.

He let out a heavy sigh before stating his full name - David Russell Williams - on the record.

Lt. Col. Tony O'Keeffe has known Williams for nine years and said the man on the courtroom screen didn't look like the "compassionate" Williams he knows.


CFB Trenton will hold a ceremony Friday to mark Col. Dave Cochrane officially taking command. Williams will for now continue to be paid as he has not been convicted of any offence, O'Keeffe said.

respectfully snipped and BBM

http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianpress/media/ALeqM5h1kWzpIGYTvE7DyaJidggyy6dBVQ?size=l
Col. Tony O'Keeffe, attending officer and friend to Col.
Russell Williams, speaks to reporters outside the Provincial
Court in Belleville. THE CANADIAN PRESS/Cole Burston


Meanwhile, provincial police continued to search Williams' home in nearby Tweed, Ont. An officer could be seen bringing a large brown paper bag out of the home and using a small camcorder to film inside and outside a shed on the property. By early afternoon two officers left in a forensic identification van, leaving only a couple of officers outside the home guarding the property cordoned off with yellow crime scene tape.

read more : http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianpress/article/ALeqM5gzg_0-bWu5q11fvQRruALmgKbrrw

Summersolstice
02-18-2010, 06:55 PM
Here is one for you, that I don't believe I have seen written about in any of the papers, and to be honest I hadn't thought of it before being told.

RW was front and centre at the funeral for Marie. He sat in the front, with the family.

I feel like I want to throw up. Seriously.

Makes me wonder who would have authorized the search zone for the military helicopters that returned from the search for Jessica without seeing anything.

Makes me wonder if Jessica's body was moved at some point. Where was that hunting cabin that the neighbor said RW asked about?

Hazel
02-18-2010, 07:03 PM
Accused colonel makes brief court appearance
Updated: Thu Feb. 18 2010 16:53:23

CTV VIDEOS

- outside Tweed cottage search
- court appearance/about Lawyer

http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20100218/colonel_thursday_100218/20100218/?hub=TorontoNewHome

some more CTV VIDEOS

http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20100211/williams_thursday_100211?hub=TorontoNewHome

Picture of RW mother = mark 1:39 in "CTV Toronto Austin Delaney on the Investigation" video


older CTV VIDEOS:
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20100209/williams_neighbour_100209/20100209

Summersolstice
02-18-2010, 07:08 PM
http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/767250--ex-chaplain-in-sex-case-paid-off-teen-officials

How many more?

Summersolstice
02-18-2010, 07:15 PM
This unrelated case turned up an enormous volume of material that was retained by the perp:

http://www.lfpress.com/news/london/2010/02/17/12918056.html

maxfactor
02-18-2010, 07:40 PM
Makes me wonder who would have authorized the search zone for the military helicopters that returned from the search for Jessica without seeing anything.

Makes me wonder if Jessica's body was moved at some point. Where was that hunting cabin that the neighbor said RW asked about?

I was wondering if that hunting cabin had been searched!

Hazel
02-18-2010, 08:07 PM
Originally Posted by Summersolstice View Post
Makes me wonder who would have authorized the search zone for the military helicopters that returned from the search for Jessica without seeing anything.

Makes me wonder if Jessica's body was moved at some point. Where was that hunting cabin that the neighbor said RW asked about?


I was wondering if that hunting cabin had been searched!

I don't recall reading about a hunting cabin, maybe it was in another article. IMO, Mr. Jones told RW of Cary Rd. area. This is the article I read:

But here he was, this 46-year-old high-achiever, the commander of Canada's largest air force base, suddenly intrigued by Jones's three-hour hunting trip.

Jones humoured him, and told him he was hunting birds. The colonel wanted to know where, exactly where.

Jones, a lifelong Tweed, Ont., resident, told him of the road 10 kilometres away, a place where he and a friend have a hunting camp.

The colonel indicated he had not heard of the road.

Near the golf course, Jones told him and the colonel's eyes flashed with recognition.

"Ya, ya, I know the road," he said. "Good luck with the hunt!"

But the day after his neighbour's arrest, Jones had a startling experience. That day, police set off in a grim convoy to retrieve the corpse of 27-year-old Jessica Lloyd, a Belleville, Ont., woman who had been missing for nearly two weeks.

The police convoy was headed in the direction of Jones's hunting camp.

The colour drained from his face. Williams tried to frame me, Jones recalls thinking. "That son of a *****."
respectfully snipped from article : http://www.canada.com/news/Williams%20neighbour%20struggled%20with%20stigma%2 0false%20attack%20accusations/2558062/story.html

Hazel
02-18-2010, 08:24 PM
WILLIAMS COURT:A packed courtroom in Belleville today


RAE:

"THEY HAVE BEEN IN THE DIFFERENT LOCATIONS FOR QUITE SOME TIME AND THEY WILL STAY THERE UNTIL THEY DON'T NEED TO STAY THERE ANY LONGER."




CKWS TV ( includes VIDEO )

http://www.ckwstv.com/index.cfm?page=news&id=1965

Summersolstice
02-18-2010, 08:28 PM
In an earlier media report, a neighbor of RW in the Orleans district of Ottawa said that the area had experienced numerous break-ins while RW was living there.

It occurred to me that there are any number empty, unoccupied cottages, or hunting camps and recreational properties listed for sale by Tweed-area realtors might have been broken into recently. I would hope that anyone who has experienced a B&E would contact LE, even if all that went missing was some clothing.

Remember the "House Hermit" from Orangeville?

Hazel
02-18-2010, 08:57 PM
In an earlier media report, a neighbor of RW in the Orleans district of Ottawa said that the area had experienced numerous break-ins while RW was living there.

It occurred to me that there are any number empty, unoccupied cottages, or hunting camps and recreational properties listed for sale by Tweed-area realtors might have been broken into recently. I would hope that anyone who has experienced a B&E would contact LE, even if all that went missing was some clothing.

Remember the "House Hermit" from Orangeville?
I believe they mentioned there were a few B&E with underwear stolen in Fallingbrook, in Orleans ( Ottawa area ).

The night/early morning Jessica was taken was a cold night (-16 C), and I have been wondering WHY did he take her from her home? Was she still alive and taken to another house? I can't imagine him taking her to his own house. Maybe as you say, an empty cottage? A house that the owner only goes to or rents during the summer months?
Then again, maybe Jessica was already dead, and RW took her ONLY to make it look different from his allegedly other crimes.
IMHO, It is becoming more apparent that he changed his MO; this is just speculation on my part, JMO. If that was the case, it worked, since nobody "saw" any connection between the 2 sexual attacks and Marie's murder.

antiquegirl
02-18-2010, 09:13 PM
WILLIAMS COURT:A packed courtroom in Belleville today

CKWS TV ( includes VIDEO )

http://www.ckwstv.com/index.cfm?page=news&id=1965

Thank you for providing all these great links and new info, Hazel. You're doing an awesome job here and saving the rest of us a lot of research time! :bow:

:Banane35:

maxfactor
02-18-2010, 09:26 PM
I don't recall reading about a hunting cabin, maybe it was in another article. IMO, Mr. Jones told RW of Cary Rd. area. This is the article I read:


respectfully snipped from article : http://www.canada.com/news/Williams%20neighbour%20struggled%20with%20stigma%2 0false%20attack%20accusations/2558062/story.html

Hazel, here is the article that mentions the hunting camp.:
http://www.canada.com/news/Williams%20neighbour%20struggled%20with%20stigma%2 0false%20attack%20accusations/2558062/story.html

antiquegirl
02-18-2010, 09:40 PM
Hazel, here is the article that mentions the hunting camp.:
http://www.canada.com/news/Williams%20neighbour%20struggled%20with%20stigma%2 0false%20attack%20accusations/2558062/story.html

Max, Hazel links the same article and quotes from it. The hunting camp was frequented by Mr. Jones, not RW, as mentioned in her post.

HTH

wishingtorihome
02-18-2010, 09:45 PM
I have many questions. Perhaps another Websleuther has answers or ideas.
(sorry if any or all of this has been addressed already – I may have missed it).

1.) When Colonel Williams encountered the police roadblock on highway 37, members of the OPP were stopping motorists in both directions. (this according to the Macleans article,
– see paragraph 5 on this page:)

http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/02/16/the-secret-life-of-colonel-russell-williams/4/

Which way was Williams heading - and where was he most likely going?
(also, where was he when he was arrested?)

2.) He must have been very shaken up after getting stopped, (possibly concerned about what the police knew about him). But then, he wasn’t arrested until three days later, which would have given him plenty of time to move or discard things. Could he have done this, or would police have put him under surveillance between the time of the road stop and his arrest?

3.) If police had actually put him under surveillance after the road interview, then perhaps they actually witnessed him discarding things from one of his homes and then confronted him with this information and made the arrest, (which later led to him revealing where the body of Jessica Lloyd could be found). Is any of this possible?

flipflop
02-18-2010, 10:35 PM
I have many questions. Perhaps another Websleuther has answers or ideas.
(sorry if any or all of this has been addressed already – I may have missed it).

1.) When Colonel Williams encountered the police roadblock on highway 37, members of the OPP were stopping motorists in both directions. (this according to the Macleans article,
– see paragraph 5 on this page:)

http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/02/16/the-secret-life-of-colonel-russell-williams/4/

Which way was Williams heading - and where was he most likely going?
(also, where was he when he was arrested?)

2.) He must have been very shaken up after getting stopped, (possibly concerned about what the police knew about him). But then, he wasn’t arrested until three days later, which would have given him plenty of time to move or discard things. Could he have done this, or would police have put him under surveillance between the time of the road stop and his arrest?

3.) If police had actually put him under surveillance after the road interview, then perhaps they actually witnessed him discarding things from one of his homes and then confronted him with this information and made the arrest, (which later led to him revealing where the body of Jessica Lloyd could be found). Is any of this possible?

#1 good question, I have not read anything about which direction he was heading.
#2 A neighbour at the cottage stated in the media that she noticed unmarked cars watching from across the lake, she noticed this on saturday, so who knows, LE may have had him under surveillance since the thursday road side stop.
#3 anything is possible....I agree.

Summersolstice
02-18-2010, 10:39 PM
http://www2.macleans.ca/category/need-to-know/?current=108880#post108880:

"High-profile Ottawa defence lawyer Michael Edelson has been retained by Col. Russell Williams, the former commander of CFB Trenton charged with the murders of two women. Edelson is currently representing Raymond Lahey, a former Bishop of the Antigonish Diocese in Nova Scotia charged with possessing and importing child pornography. The well-known lawyer also successfully represented Ottawa Mayor Larry O’Brien in a trial last August, where he was found not guilty of political influence-peddling. Over the course of his 29-year career, Edelson has personally represented over 55 clients charged with murder. Col. Williams is scheduled to make a brief appearance in a Belleville court this morning via video link from the Quinte Detention Centre, where he has been held since his arrest last week."

BBM. For those who don't know about that case, this will get you started:

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/nova-scotia/story/2009/10/01/ns-lahey-charged-sydney.html

flipflop
02-18-2010, 11:37 PM
I just thought of something...
Snipped from a media article:
His wife, Bonnie, the treasurer of a neighbouring municipality, received a phone call one day shortly after police visited their house. “What’s it like to live with a murderer?” asked the female caller, according to Jones.

If Jones was hauled in and questioned for the rapes in the neighbourhood, why would someone call as use the word MURDERER if no one was murdered at this time? This took place before any murders, didn't it?

Am I missing something or did the media screw this up, or did the Jones's?

antiquegirl
02-18-2010, 11:46 PM
I have many questions. Perhaps another Websleuther has answers or ideas.
(sorry if any or all of this has been addressed already – I may have missed it).

1.) When Colonel Williams encountered the police roadblock on highway 37, members of the OPP were stopping motorists in both directions. (this according to the Macleans article,
– see paragraph 5 on this page:)

http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/02/16/the-secret-life-of-colonel-russell-williams/4/

Which way was Williams heading - and where was he most likely going?
(also, where was he when he was arrested?)

2.) He must have been very shaken up after getting stopped, (possibly concerned about what the police knew about him). But then, he wasn’t arrested until three days later, which would have given him plenty of time to move or discard things. Could he have done this, or would police have put him under surveillance between the time of the road stop and his arrest?

3.) If police had actually put him under surveillance after the road interview, then perhaps they actually witnessed him discarding things from one of his homes and then confronted him with this information and made the arrest, (which later led to him revealing where the body of Jessica Lloyd could be found). Is any of this possible?

1.) “Williams came to the attention of the police as a result of information gathered during a road side canvass on Highway 37 on the night of February 4, 2010. (snip)” said a statement issued at a joint press conference.

http://www.vancouverite.com/2010/02/08/canadian-air-wing-col-russel-williams-charged-in-two-slayings-of-women/

This reference to "night" can be found in many media outlets. Also,

"Col. Russell was driving toward Tweed when he was stopped by police at a rolling road block."

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/the-tire-track-that-broke-the-case-wide-open/article1462401/

I am assuming from these accounts that RW was on his way home to Cosy Cove Lane when he was stopped.

Williams then turned himself in to Ottawa police and gave a detailed statement to a detective from the behavioural sciences squad.

http://www.calgaryherald.com/story_print.html?id=2564958&sponsor=

Not sure how reliable this information is, but it sounds as if he voluntarily went in to a police station. But this source says:

"So the colonel was asked to come in for questioning."

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/the-tire-track-that-broke-the-case-wide-open/article1462401/

2.) "Something about him wasn't right, he was more evasive than he needed to be," a source familiar with the investigation said.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/the-tire-track-that-broke-the-case-wide-open/article1462401/

3.) I agree with you and flipflop that this is possible.

JMO

antiquegirl
02-18-2010, 11:50 PM
I just thought of something...
Snipped from a media article:
His wife, Bonnie, the treasurer of a neighbouring municipality, received a phone call one day shortly after police visited their house. “What’s it like to live with a murderer?” asked the female caller, according to Jones.

If Jones was hauled in and questioned for the rapes in the neighbourhood, why would someone call as use the word MURDERER if no one was murdered at this time? This took place before any murders, didn't it?

Am I missing something or did the media screw this up, or did the Jones's?

(Underlined by me)

ITA. I thought of the same thing. Methinks Mrs. Jones made this up, but that's JMO.

Hazel
02-18-2010, 11:56 PM
Hazel, here is the article that mentions the hunting camp.:
http://www.canada.com/news/Williams%20neighbour%20struggled%20with%20stigma%2 0false%20attack%20accusations/2558062/story.html
Yes maxfactor, read that. I was trying to make a distinction between "hunting cabin" and "hunting camp". Mr. Jones mentions hunting camp, so I imagined (and I could be TOTALLY wrong), that he was bringing maybe a tent (something portable), and that there is no structure (cabin) there to be searched, like you suggested.

:waitasec: Thinking about it, maybe you are right, maybe there IS some kind of wooden structure(s).

maxfactor
02-19-2010, 12:07 AM
Yes maxfactor, read that. I was trying to make a distinction between "hunting cabin" and "hunting camp". Mr. Jones mentions hunting camp, so I imagined (and I could be TOTALLY wrong), that he was bringing maybe a tent (something portable), and that there is no structure (cabin) there to be searched, like you suggested.

:waitasec: Thinking about it, maybe you are right, maybe there IS some kind of wooden structure(s).

ah, I see. I guess I'm used to people around here saying they have a hunting camp, or just camp and there is usually a cabin on the lot.

nonfictionrocks
02-19-2010, 12:21 AM
Yes maxfactor, read that. I was trying to make a distinction between "hunting cabin" and "hunting camp". Mr. Jones mentions hunting camp, so I imagined (and I could be TOTALLY wrong), that he was bringing maybe a tent (something portable), and that there is no structure (cabin) there to be searched, like you suggested.

:waitasec: Thinking about it, maybe you are right, maybe there IS some kind of wooden structure(s).

My husband comes from a a long line of hunters and when they refer to a hunting camp this usually means a cottage or cabin-like structures. Hunting season is in the fall and although some hunters may sleep in tents most either hunt during the day and return to the comforts of their home at night or they stay overnight in more permanent structures - JMO