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Salem
02-20-2010, 11:17 PM
Please continue here.

Thread 1


Thanks,

Salem

jeff_jones
02-20-2010, 11:29 PM
There is a Haitian church in Norcross run by Pastor Seneque Saintil.
I think he is also from New Orleans. I guess its a Baptist Church.
Its located at:
5225 Jimmy Carter Boulevard
Norcross, Ga. 30093.
I wouldn't be at all surprised if this isn't somehow connected to Jean Sainvil.

Unrelated. The pastors don't look alike.
The Mitspa Haitian Baptist Church is duly registered with the GA Sec of State.

No trace there however of Sainvil, Gospel Assembly, or Eglise Assemblee (the sign in the window).

Missizzy
02-20-2010, 11:52 PM
I found Isaac Adrien, the young man who served as Silsby's scout. Seems that he's the director of the Children of Promise. I thought he was simply a young man who helped Silsby connect with some desperate parents:

http://www.echildrenofpromise.org/NewsViews/WhatsHappening/tabid/85/articleType/ArticleView/articleId/53/Haitian-Childrens-Homes-Are-In-Rubble.aspx


"I would like to say that we all can be very proud of Isaac. He has done a great job in the midst of this traumatic event. He and his brother, Steve, begin translating today with the relief efforts being coordinated by Quisqueya Christian School. They felt God wanted them to sign up and volunteer.”

Note: Isaac was sponsored through Children of Promise for many years, was raised at the House of Blessings Orphanage, and is now the director of the Children of Promise program in Haiti. He is a living example of what sponsorship does in the lives of children."

http://www.echildrenofpromise.org/


I wonder if Judge Sainvil has interviewed Isaac.

Missizzy
02-21-2010, 12:00 AM
Even though Phil Murphy is mentioned on the Children of Promise website along with Isaac Adrien, Mr. Murphy has distanced himself from the Silsby group:

http://haitihouseofblessings.org/

Phil Murphy Wrongly Linked to Haiti Orphan Drama

"The Lake Wales Ledger recently published an article detailing the unfortunate error made by the New York Times in falsely linking Phil Murphy with the 10 Americans detained in Haiti for attempting to illegally transport 33 children out of the country. Phil has no connection to the 10 Americans who tried to take children."

http://www.theledger.com/article/20100205/NEWS/2055057/1134?Title=Man-Wrongly-Linked-to-Haiti-Orphan-Drama


I guess if it says it on the internet, we need to believe it.

i.b.nora
02-21-2010, 12:11 AM
Thinking about the timeline of who was where when. Silsby went to the orphanage where the Pickett kids were and tried to 'get' them. Do we have a date for that? Anyone know?

Answering my own question:

Sunday, Jan. 24: Silsby offers to help

Silsby makes the first of three phone calls to Richard and Malinda Pickett of Kentucky, offering to help get their three adopted children out of Haiti. The family tells her not to interfere.

Monday, Jan. 25: Silsby calls again

Silsby calls the Picketts for the last time offering her help to get the adopted children out of Haiti. The family refuses.

Tuesday, Jan. 26: Quest for orphans

• Orphanage worker Isaac Adrien meets Silsby in Port-au-Prince. He says Silsby tells him she is looking for homeless children.

• Silsby attempts to find the three children awaiting adoption by the Picketts, Richard Pickett says. The children were not given to her.


http://www.idahostatesman.com/newsupdates/story/1071122.html

Missizzy
02-21-2010, 12:24 AM
Has anyone found any mention as to the name of the orphanage where the Pickett kids were? In a huge city, fraught with turmoil, how did Silsby find those particular children?

Were they at one of Phil Murphy's House of Blessings homes or how about Isaac Adrien's Children of Promise?

Missizzy
02-21-2010, 12:31 AM
On Phil Murphy's own website for House of Blessings, he links himself to Isaac Adrien:

http://haitihouseofblessings.org/

"Phil Murphy, co-founder of House of Blessings and the Children of Promise Sponsorship Program in Callebasse, Haiti, reports on his recent visit to the community of Callebasse and with the sponsored children there."

I'm not seeing how Mr. Murphy can distance himself from Mr. Adrien. I guess it's possible that Mr. Adrien worked with Silsby and Mr. Murphy didn't know it but they do seem to have a close alliance. It is very clear that Mr. Murphy is listed as co-founder of the Children of Promise Sponsorship program which Mr. Adrien is in charge of.

Come on......

Missizzy
02-21-2010, 12:36 AM
http://www.allthingsandersoncooper.com/2010_02_01_archive.html

"Anderson spoke by phone with David Louis in Port-au-Prince. David works at an orphanage run by his father and was hired by Ms. Silsby as an interpreter. Richard Pickett in Nashville talked about his experiences with Silsby. Pickett was in Port-au-Prince to bring home 3 Haitian children he and his wife adopted (with the proper paperwork), when his wife was contacted three times by Silsby saying she was in Haiti and could get their kids out.

Pickett's wife told Silsby no - Richard was already on the ground and they didn't need her help, but Silsby went to the orphanage anyway. Pickett thinks Silsby was trying to use the kids for fundraising purposes."



So, possibly Silsby learned of the Pickett children through David Louis, who works at his father's orphanage in Port au Prince?

i.b.nora
02-21-2010, 12:37 AM
Murphy had nothing to do with anything, imo.

jeff_jones
02-21-2010, 12:41 AM
Tuesday, Jan. 26: Quest for orphans
Orphanage worker Isaac Adrien meets Silsby in Port-au-Prince. He says Silsby tells him she is looking for homeless children.

That proves what I said earlier: why would Silsby be at the DR side of the northern border crossing on Jan 27, as Sainvil claims? On Jan 27 she was already in PaP.

jeff_jones
02-21-2010, 12:42 AM
Murphy had nothing to do with anything, imo.
I agree.

i.b.nora
02-21-2010, 12:43 AM
"The Picketts said they were immediately suspicious of Silsby. The Kentucky couple didn't need her help — the government had already given them permission to go pick up the children. But Silsby persisted, they said.

She showed up at the Compassion for All orphanage in Haiti, asking to collect the Picketts' three adopted children and claiming to be Malinda Pickett's friend, according to Richard Pickett.

That orphanage and others turned her down."

http://www.usatoday.com/news/religion/2010-02-12-silsby11_ST_N.htm

jeff_jones
02-21-2010, 12:48 AM
I vaguely remember a report that said that one night Silsby cried because nobody wanted to give her any orphans. Did any of you see that too?

Missizzy
02-21-2010, 12:50 AM
A transcript of AC's interview with Pickett about the three kids and Silsby's attept to take the children from Compassion for All Orphanage run by Arthur Louis and his son, David:

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1002/04/acd.01.html

".....But the person that gave Laura our [ETA the Picketts] contact information told her explicitly that you cannot just take any child across the border. You have to have the correct permissions to do that from the government. And Laura wanted to make the calls anyway to see if there are ways that she could get children....."

and


"She came up with this idea a couple of years ago. And she actually hired her 24-year-old nanny to actually set up this orphanage. They started a foundation. And it was really in its infancy. They thought that -- you know, they put together this manifesto. They thought they would eventually get down to the Dominican Republic sometime down the road.

Then the earthquake happens and all of a sudden they wanted to get down there right away. So, she came here to the church. She met with the pastor. And they solicited donations. And word came out to the church members, does anybody want to go to Haiti and go set up this orphanage in the Dominican Republic?

And you had a few people raise their hands and say, I want to go. So, some of the people who actually went down with her only, you know, raised their hand 48 hours before they actually got on an airplane..."

i.b.nora
02-21-2010, 01:08 AM
Yes, Laura cried, boo hoo.

Missizzy
02-21-2010, 01:09 AM
http://www.usatoday.com/news/religion/2010-02-12-silsby11_ST_N.htm?csp=34&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Religion-TopStories+%28News+-+Religion+-+Top+Stories%29

"She asked for kids at each of the orphanages, and at the end of the day when no one would give her any, she cried," Richard Pickett said. "Why would you cry after you see these kids are being taken care of?"

A few days later, Silsby and nine other Americans were charged in Haiti with kidnapping for trying to take 33 children out of the country without proper documentation."

I'm starting to think that Laura is not only well-intentioned yet driven. I'm starting to think that she's a very sick woman. I'm becoming increasingly worried about her state of mind.

jeff_jones
02-21-2010, 01:38 AM
I just read the entire Puello interview. He's blaming all his past legal problems on misunderstandings. But the interviewer forgot quite a few.
E.g. he says he never represented himself as a lawyer,only a "consultant"
I see I can now upload attachments. Let's try one.
Look at the logos.

Missizzy
02-21-2010, 01:46 AM
I wanted to go back and look at that video I posted a week or so ago:

http://www.newsoftheworld.co.uk/video/?videoId=2160_721979&videoChannel=NOTW:News

I wanted to see if we might know that name. It took some looking but I found it. It's at this link:

http://www.newsoftheworld.co.uk/news/721573/Trading-on-miserywe-expose-child-trafficker-preying-on-Haitis-orphans-Babies-for-sale-in-Haiti.html

The charity boss's name is Yis Jean Guerson. He is responsible for providing medical aid to victims of the January 12 disaster with respected local aid group AST (Association de la Santé Pour Tous - "health for all").

But, unknown to dedicated colleagues, Guerson secretly heads a child trafficking ring and exploits his position of trust scouring camps for a stock of orphaned, lost and homeless youngsters.

Shockingly Guerson, 31, is also a TEACHER at a local school responsible for guiding and protecting children from the age of three."

I wonder if Silsby crossed his path? Oh what horrors would have ensued if they did team up. I wonder if Guerson has any alliance with Isaac Adrien, Phil Murphy, or Jean Sainvil. Watching this video makes me physically sick. The children seem to trust the man and they have no sense as to how his actions are going to impact their lives. They actually look very well cared for. Does he keep them in this condition to sell them?

Lies, lies, lies. We need to start looking for the motive behind the lies. Is it high priced international adoption, child sponsorship (a cash cow IMO), slavery, child sex trafficking....or all of it.

I think we're beating a dead horse. Everything Silsby said has been proven to be a lie or a distortion of the truth or "misunderstood". Almost everyone who worked with her has been less than forthcoming and has sown the seeds of distrust. What is the great secret we are missing?

i.b.nora
02-21-2010, 01:53 AM
Sorry, I draw the line, I don't do News of the World except in rare cases. And, I don't buy into all your conspiracy stuff. So, I am off to watch the Olympics.

Missizzy
02-21-2010, 02:49 AM
How could Phill Murphy not be somewhat connected with Silsby if he, himself, links his work to Isaac Adrien? It's sounds from these websites that they men work in tandem. And Adrien was the scout who arranged for the soccer field meeting? I don't get it!!

http://haitihouseofblessings.org/

http://www.echildrenofpromise.org/Ne...In-Rubble.aspx

http://www.echildrenofpromise.org/

Run a search on each of these pages for both men's names. They are connected. I feel that Adrien, at least, is complicit in arranging illegal and unethical custodial changes for children.

I don't necessarily think there's a conspiracy at all. I do think, though, that we're getting closer and closer to learning that Silsby MUST have had some contact with Puello prior to her arrest. I'm not going to "make you believe it", i.b.nora LOL. I'll let you come to your own conclusion.

Another snip from a comment on the DR Forum:

http://www.dr1.com/forums/haiti-earthquake/100199-who-can-stop-tragedy-32.html

"We thought it strange, did we not, that after the US Consul in Haiti presented suggestions to the detained Baptists as to whom they might employ as lawyers, they rejected these in favour of Torres Puello, whom Silsby subsequently said she had not had any contact with until after her arrest. Common sense says that when a national of your own country whose job it is to offer assistance within certain guidelines (viz. the US Consul) makes suggestions, and you are feeling frightened & vulnerable because you have been jailed in a foreign land, wouldn't you grasp at those suggestions rather than choose a 'lawyer' from a third country whom you had never heard of? Unless, of course there were compelling reasons (like you already knew the 'lawyer' from the third country). This could also explain why a man wanted in a number of locations by different authorities viz Puello, would put his fugitive status at risk of being discovered. H'mm. Maybe not looking quite such a 'rush in & help' scenario? At least, for some of the participants."


I honestly don't know where this is going but I'm not going to surprised in the least at where we end up.

Melly53
02-21-2010, 06:01 AM
Unrelated. The pastors don't look alike.
The Mitspa Haitian Baptist Church is duly registered with the GA Sec of State.

No trace there however of Sainvil, Gospel Assembly, or Eglise Assemblee (the sign in the window).

I am curious where you found that the Mitspa Haitian Baptist Church is duly registered with the Ga Sec of State. The only listing I could find for them with the Ga Sec of State states that they were registered on 12/28/2000 but on 7/09/2005 under went an Automated Adminstrative dissolution/revocation. I could not find a current registration for them.

Melly53
02-21-2010, 06:53 AM
http://miamiherald.typepad.com/burnettiquette/

After reading the excerpt below it seems to me that the lawyer Fleurant does not want the Judge to visit the so called orphanage and I don't think time has anything to do with it since I read that the Judge flew to the DR on Saturday. Also since when did Silsby's orphanage become associated with Hildago's church? What is his church's name and affiliation?

Such a trip could take days to plan and longer to be carried out, Fleurant said, adding that "We have proof - here! - documents from the Dominican government authorizing the acceptance of the children into this orphanage. And the pastor - Pastor Jose Orlando Hidalgo - of the church that administrates the orphanage has offered to come here and meet with the judge and tell him!"

Fleurant dismissed questions about the nature of his primary client Silsby's relationship with Jorge Puello, a Domincan resident and child sex-trafficking suspect, who portrayed himself to be an attorney representing Silsby's group.

"There is no connection," Fleurant bristled. "The truth is Laura Silsby did not even meet Jorge Puello until after she was arrested."

But rather than deny reports that Hidalgo's Domincan orphanage might just be an empty building housing no children and is located in a neighborhood well-known for child sex-trafficking, Fleurant simply suggested such a neighborhood should have an orphanage.

"If you can put an orphanage in such an area, that is not a bad thing. There is where they need it most, no," he asked, refusing to dispute the orphanage's location.

The last two paragraphs really bother me especially the part about it being located in an area that is well known for child sex-trafficking. I would think if Silsby/Hildago's intentions were above board that their goal would be to totally remove children from that area and environment because just being there would pose an additional unnecessary risk to the children being housed in the temporary "orphanage" which is really just a converted hotel. Just how secure could a place like that be to begin with? IMO

Missizzy
02-21-2010, 12:27 PM
Experts: Laura Silsby and nine other Americans may have caused more fallout than they realize

http://www.idahostatesman.com/newsupdates/story/1089150.html


'Like a stone dropped into a still pool, the actions of a group of American volunteers continue to ripple across Haiti and the United States.

Group members - eight of them home and two still in jail - insist they went to Haiti with a noble goal: to rescue desperate orphans threatened by the aftermath of the Jan. 12 earthquake.

But despite these intentions, experts say, their decisions and subsequent arrests created waves that have affected thousands.

Some sick and injured Haitian children are going without medical care they need because the controversy made it hard for doctors to get them to the proper treatment facilities.

Others will not see permanent homes anytime soon because wary officials have slowed adoptions. Media attention - and the financial support it can drive - has been diverted from continued humanitarian efforts and needs in the quake-afflicted country.

The fallout offers a cautionary tale and a lesson for people who simply want to help."


More at link.

Missizzy
02-21-2010, 01:45 PM
I have no luck with translating so I'm just going to post a snip of a post on the DR forum. Hopefully, someone will help us out. This is from the poster, Lambada, and posted early this morning:

http://www.dr1.com/forums/haiti-earthquake/100199-who-can-stop-tragedy-32.html

"If reports in Clave Digital & El Nuevo Diario are true, this might be the connection the Haitian judge was looking for between Torres Puello & Silsby before the arrest of the Americans: 'Torres Puello además realizaba trabajos de “realtor” en Sosua, Puerto Plata donde conoció a Laura Silbsy'
Autoridades de El Salvador y de RD cruzan información sobre Torres Orellana

'Torres Puello además realizaba trabajos de “realtor” en Sosua, Puerto Plata donde conoció a Laura Silbsy, una de las misioneras del grupo bautista'.
Autoridades policiales de El Salvador envían a RD huellas dactilares prófugo Interpol"


http://www.clavedigital.com/App_Pages/Noticias/Noticias.aspx?id_Articulo=27718

http://elnuevodiario.com.do/app/article.aspx?id=187452 (this site has a photo of Jorge's home in El Salvador)

jeff_jones
02-21-2010, 01:52 PM
I am curious where you found that the Mitspa Haitian Baptist Church is duly registered with the Ga Sec of State. The only listing I could find for them with the Ga Sec of State states that they were registered on 12/28/2000 but on 7/09/2005 under went an Automated Adminstrative dissolution/revocation. I could not find a current registration for them.

Melly - The main point of my post was to show that Seneque Saintil of Mitspa and Sainvil are not the same. Sleuthing is good, but I like to avoid hypothetical associations based merely on similarly sounding names.

My other point was that Sainvil seems to be operating a church (non-profit) under the radar.

i.b.nora
02-21-2010, 04:55 PM
Melly - The main point of my post was to show that Seneque Saintil of Mitspa and Sainvil are not the same. Sleuthing is good, but I like to avoid hypothetical associations based merely on similarly sounding names.

My other point was that Sainvil seems to be operating a church (non-profit) under the radar.
Probably my fault for bringing it up at all. However, in the days and weeks since we first heard Pastor Jean's name, I have seen his last name spelled at least four different ways in mainstream written news reports. One of the spellings was Saintil, so to me, it wasn't such a leap. May or may not be related.

Missizzy
02-21-2010, 05:40 PM
We need to keep an eye on this:

http://www.haitivox.com/



"Sunday, February 21, 2010

THREE BIG STORIES COMING

Hi all,

I have three BIG Haiti stories coming that I'll be reporting on in the next 72 hours. One is major breaking news, so I'm going to release that information by working with a major media partner to maximize distribution of the information.

They are related to Silsby, to Transitional Housing, and a third topic."

Missizzy
02-21-2010, 06:08 PM
A little background on the blogger Anne-Christine d'Adesky of haitivox:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anne-Christine_d'Adesky



I knew she was a writer and an activist. I had no idea that she was the same woman who advised Silsby to drop her plan of "rescuing" orphans. From the WSJ article of Feb. 2nd:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703422904575039761361995340.html


"New light was shed on the early activities of the missionaries by Anne-christine d'Adesky, a writer and human-rights activist from a prominent Haitian family who is a U.S. citizen. She emailed several U.N. authorities and said she met Laura Silsby, the leader of the American group, on Jan. 24 in a hotel in the Dominican Republic.

Ms. Silsby said her authorization to collect Haitian orphans and bring them to the Dominican Republic was from an unnamed Dominican official, according to Ms. d'Adesky's email. "I informed her that this would be regarded as illegal even with some 'Dominican' minister authorizing, since the children are Haitian," Ms. d'Adesky wrote, adding that she directed Ms. Silsby to U.N. agencies helping the Haitian government handle orphans and adoptions. In a telephone interview, Ms. d'Adesky said she recalled Ms. Silsby's response: "We have been sent by the Lord to rescue these children, and if it's in the Lord's plan we will be successful."

Ms. d'Adesky also told the U.N. officials that Ms. Silsby had planned to bring children back to the Dominican Republic on Jan. 25, four days before the group was arrested. She therefore urged the U.N. officials to "check on the orphanage" in the Dominican Republic because children might have been brought there before the group was arrested......."

more at link

Have we determined just who this Dominican "minister" is? Is it possible that Silsby is referring to a politician or are we certain she meant to imply that the person was a religious leader?

FWIW, note that Alejandro Puello is referred to in this article as Silsby's attorney.

Missizzy
02-21-2010, 06:17 PM
A thorough overview of just what went on at the Hotel Lino in the DR on January 24th by someone who was there, Ms. d'Adesky, herself:

http://www.haitivox.com/2010/02/more-suspicious-ties-in-haiti.html



"......As some of you know, I met the Laura Silsby Baptist missionary group that was arrested for possible child trafficking when I was in Santo Domingo, on the eve of my (and their) entry in Haiti. We met by chance in a hotel there, the Hotel Lino on Sunday, January 24th. After introducing myself and my work monitoring the post-quake orphan crisis (on this blog), we later met and chatted for a half hour in their hotel room. They told me they were a relatively new group to the orphan scene, and were motiviated by God to try to help Haitian children. They'd already had a plan to have an orphanage in the Dominican Republic, and with the quake, their plan went into fast-track....."

and


"But it's important for people following this story to know that a group was involved, with open knowledge of their church/parishes in the US, and it was a planned trip, and it engaged Dominicans with prior ties in the Dominican Republic."


She goes on to detail what Silsby told her and how she advised the group and follows up with her suspicions and concerns about the group and their "contacts" in the DR. Not sure if I've seen this entire piece posted before.

much more at link

truckbomb
02-21-2010, 08:43 PM
Truckbomb, even though only a Gringo lawyer, is fluent in spanish (mainly because he lives in the Baja of Florida where english is not the main language). Truck has translated for your convenience the ClaveDigital.com website relevant expressions.

In the spanish expression, Sosua, Puerto Plata donde conoció a Laura Silbsy the word conoció comes rom the infinitive conocer which, in the present tense, means to be familiar with . In the Preterite tense (action fully completed in the past) conoció means HE MET. In other words, Puello first MET Silsby in Sousa DR according to this article and NOT first while she was in a Haitian jail. Gotcha.

Lets go to some of the revealing text now in english.


In addition, Torres worked as a "realtor" in Sosua, Puerta Plata where he met Laura Silbsy, apparently the leader of the Baptist Group (who are defendants of the abduction of the children), and the only one that did not obtain the conditional release in Haiti.

In this opportunity in Haiti, the judge Bernard Saint Bernard Saint Vil, who is in charge of the Americans’ case, said that he will open an investigation of Puello to establish his true identity. He indicated that 'he was skeptical of him because he arrived with four bodyguards. “I have never seen that of a lawyer”, the judge said. He will ask the help of the Department of National Security U.S., on the case of Puello.

According to the authorities of the National Civilian Police of el Salvador, Jorge Aníbal Torres Puello or Jorge Torres Orellana, has American, Canadian, Salvadorian, and Dominican passports, which information has been verified by the police of el Salvador. In El Salvador, the identity document of Jorge Towers Orellana is marked with the number 4167475-3. The case of Torres Orellana or Towers Puello has captured the attention of all the radio, television media and newspapers in Miami, besides the main agencies of the international press.

So the judge is asking for the help of the U.S. federales. Bad news for Silsby given how the U.S. federals can trace cellphone messages.

Looks like our friend Puello has multiple passports so he can come and go at will. Where is Interpol? Maybe Puello is still in DR.

Truck, now back from Mexico, thinks that the Judge will find more than one reason to stay on in the DR given that he can get a comfortable bed and three squares away from a devestated Haiti. The Idaho churches had better send Silsby more mosquito repellant.

Missizzy
02-21-2010, 09:34 PM
Thanks so much Truckbomb. Four years of high school Latin only serves to tantalize me with possibly understanding bits and pieces. Isn't it interesting how it always comes down to the tiniest detail?

Soooo, Ms. Silsby and Señor Puello most probably spent some time dabbling in "real estate" in Sosua? That's a bit like saying you dabble in gardening in Southern Oregon. My theory has always been that Puello sprung out from under the rock and hustled into that Haitian jail to protect his interests. Who knows what these two had cooked up.

i.b.nora--With all due respect, it's not a conspiracy theory, it's just a theory.

truckbomb
02-21-2010, 09:51 PM
When Silsby “turned down” the U.S. Counselor Service’s recommended lawyers and selected Puello as the group’s “lawyer” all the while the Idaho church is saying that they had no contact with Silsby for the first days when she was arrested, this points to her prior dealings with Puello. When the judge with the help of the U.S. federales focuses in on the cell phone calls Silsby is a cooked goose.

Every day Silsby and her cohort are enjoying the hospitality of the "Haitian Hilton" while hitting the Kool Aid is a day of absolute enjoyment here in the Baja. Hoping the Judge and his prosecutor companion have booked in the DR at the long term rate.

Missizzy
02-21-2010, 10:28 PM
Does anyone remember the breakdown of the judicial process for this case? We read that an investigative judge would complete a report and present it to the defense attorney and the prosecuting attorney. This report would then be presented to the presiding judge. Is Judge Sainvil the investigative judge or the presiding judge?

Missizzy
02-22-2010, 12:36 AM
Over on the DR forum, they are talking about another group of 28 children being transported out of the country without their parents' permission--only the permission of a consortium of attorneys:

There is a link to this site and a comment about Silsby not meeting up with the "right" group:

http://www.listin.com.do/app/article.aspx?id=132351

http://www.dr1.com/forums/haiti-earthquake/100199-who-can-stop-tragedy-33.html

Missizzy
02-22-2010, 12:47 PM
Some more info concerning the Baptists who "got away"--the ones who stayed in the DR and did not get arrested. John Requa is the man who is mentioned in the church bulletins as planning a mission trip to the Ukraine last year.

http://www.magicvalley.com/news/local/54413870-1f76-11df-b76c-001cc4c002e0.html


"There was little the Americans could do. The Texans left on Jan. 31, Requa said, and the Twin Falls delegation followed suit the next day. Though they'd had past missionary experience - Crider even helped out at orphanages in Vietnam - none of them had been involved in the planning for this trip. Neither Crider nor Requa ever met Jorge Puello, the former legal adviser to the jailed 10 who is wanted in El Salvador on human smuggling accusations.

"We had no idea of how it was set up or anything. We just went to help," Requa said. The kidnapping charges were ridiculous, he added - if the group had planned to steal children, would they have driven a bus of them up to a border checkpoint?

Today, they're relieved that the Thompsons, McMullin and the others have been released. But they're still concerned for the two people who had to stay behind, and they worry about the effect the whole saga has had on Haitians and the children they sought to care for....."


more at link

Missizzy
02-22-2010, 11:03 PM
More info about the anonymous Baptists who stayed in the DR:

http://bastardette.blogspot.com/

"....Now we learn that Nancy Rodriguez, wife of Paul Rodriguez, Magic Valley Baptist Association director of missions, and four "missionaries" from an unnamed group in Texas were also at the "orphan" hotel. This makes (so far) 17 onsite New Life adoption traffickers recruited by Laura Silsby. According to the News-Times:

The plan had been to gather up orphaned children and take them across the border to an orphanage in the Dominican Republic. Eastside members Matt and Lora Crider and John Requa were joined in Haiti's neighboring country by Nancy Rodriguez - wife of Paul Rodriguez, director of missions for the Magic Valley Baptist Association...."

and


"So we now have another mystery. Who are the Texas missionaries and why have they disappeared from the Silsby story? We'd really love to hear more from Nancy Rodriguez, too.

Just how many people were in on this little junket down to Haiti?"

Missizzy
02-22-2010, 11:18 PM
Once burned twice shy. The Haitians are being very cautious about children leaving their country. Good!!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100222/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/cb_haiti_americans_detained

"Two Americans escorting six U.S.-bound Haitian orphans were briefly detained over the weekend in a misunderstanding, Haitian and U.S. officials said Tuesday.

A State Department official confirmed that the Americans were prevented from leaving Haiti because officials at Port-au-Prince's airport were suspicious about the documents authorizing them to take the children out of the country.

A police officer and an official at Haiti's Ministry of Communications said four Americans — a woman and three men — along with seven Haitian children were taken Saturday to the police station near the airport.

After some hours, a U.S. Embassy official arrived with paperwork that allowed them to be freed, said the two officials, who spoke on condition of anonymity because they are not authorized to speak to reporters.

The State Department official, who also spoke on condition of anonymity, said there were two Americans and six children, who were being taken to families in Minnesota...."

more at link

i.b.nora
02-22-2010, 11:49 PM
In the meantime, we have another Jim Allen interview.

Jim Allen Speaks To NewsChannel 10 (http://www.newschannel10.com/Global/story.asp?S=12026713)

snips

"For almost a week he had no idea why he was sleeping on a concrete floor with other Haitian jail inmates."
+
"Allen says, "they didn't tell us anything. They just said take your shoelaces off, take your belts off and give us your phones. You're in jail. That's all we knew for several days. We didn't know what the charges were."
+
Allen says they had virtually no communication with the outside world, and the language barrier made it even worse."

"He says a lot of good things happened in the midst of this whole ordeal, like getting to tell people at the border and other jail inmates about God."

Now, I don't really want to disparage this guy, simply because, so far I think he is the only one that is telling the absolute truth as he experienced it. (Even one of Allen's own lawyers (Kelly Shackelford) flat out lied in a statement made to The Christian Post before Jim went on the Oprah Winfrey Show.)


"Shackelford told The Christian Post that one piece of misinformation circulating concerns the situation surrounding the group’s arrest. The attorney said the team had brought the bus with the children to the border where Dominican authorities said they had all the paperwork they needed. But the team decided to go back to Haiti’s capital Port-au-Prince to check if there was any other paperwork they needed and was at that point arrested.

Media reports have said the American team was arrested at the border as they were trying to take the children out of the country.

“They were arrested not at the border; they were arrested in the middle of Haiti asking for the paperwork they needed,” Shackelford said. “I don’t know what an American could do trying to help and asking what they needed and then get arrested. I don’t know if there is any way to avoid that. I think there was just chaos. It is a very unfortunate situation that these Americans got thrown into jail for three weeks.”" = LIE!!! That is not what Jim Allen has said in any of his interviews.

Almost every other person willingly or unwillingly caught up in this whole caper has mostly lied, imo. The quantity of lies are stunning. I think the parents of the orphans (I just love saying that) were telling the truth. And, I think Jim Allen has been telling the truth.

i.b.nora
02-23-2010, 12:00 AM
"http://bastardette.blogspot.com/

"....Now we learn that Nancy Rodriguez, wife of Paul Rodriguez, Magic Valley Baptist Association director of missions, and four "missionaries" from an unnamed group in Texas were also at the "orphan" hotel. This makes (so far) 17 onsite New Life adoption traffickers recruited by Laura Silsby."

In her blog posting, bastardette references a photo, however I think she has identified the people incorrectly.
I believe Paul Rodriguez is in the front row, kneeling first on the left holding hands with his wife Nancy Rodriguez.

http://www.armsaroundthemagicvalley.com/clientimages/24516/disasterreliefphotos/communityactionevent07078.jpg

jeff_jones
02-23-2010, 02:24 AM
Pastor Sainvil

AP's Feb 20 video briefly showed the flyer Jean Sainvil (aka Pastor Sainvil) handed out to the parents in Citron (a neighborhood at Delmas 33 in Port-au-Prince).
A screen shot from AP's Feb 20 video is attached.

Contacts: pastorsainvil@yahoo.com
and supposedly a phone number: 3818-4068 Pastor Sainvil

- only in Australia did I find a xxxx-xxxx format (coincidence, 3818-4068 is a childcare center in Queensland, but that would be outlandish)
- Haitian numbers have the same 7 digits as we do here, and usually start with a 2.

Maybe the kid's father wrote it down wrong?
If you discard the 4th digit, that is not 100% clear, you get 381-4068 which happens to match New Life Baptist Church in Davenport IA, but their site doesn't mention any missions. Again, unlikely.
I tried various combinations with various area codes. No leads.

Since it was precisely his presence that convinced the parents to trust Silsby one would think he made sure the parents had his correct number. After all, he had only just met Silsby himself.

As I wrote earlier, Sainvil claims to have met Silsby on Jan 27 at the northern border crossing in Ouanaminthe, which is almost a day's drive from Port-au-Prince. But Silsby was already in PaP on Jan 26 meeting with Isaac Adrien. Something's wrong with the date or the place.

His church "Eglise Assemblée Evangélique" aka Gospel Assembly Church (but he claims to have 25 missions) is a +/- 500 sqft room in the back of a strip mall at 6099 Buford Hwy, Suite J, in Norcross GA, behind a hairdresser, a travel agent, etc... It doesn't seem to be registered anywhere, and has an unlisted phone # (678-933-8082).
He feels the kids didn't need any paperwork at all. Verbal agreements were just fine.
At first he called himself an "unpaid consultant", then said he happened to run into Silsby at the border and helped her find 'orphans'. But then jumped on a military evacuation plane to Miami and later his phone went dead.

Two of the early Sainvil interviews: (there are more, but the YouTube ones automatically embed and take up space)

http://www.cbsatlanta.com/video/22414250/index.html
http://video.ap.org/?f=1160152&pid=YcoXxlQoF_OsslTzszukobvvpM1a1TEw

Though the pastor has such influence and so many alleged missions I cannot find anything about his past. He probably has a double first name, and Sainvil is very common. Unlike Left Side of the Moon (http://leftistmoon.wordpress.com/2010/02/08/pastor-jean-sainvil-keyser-soze/), (thanks for the links), I am not sure this is the same person from Gardner MA.

---

Missizzy
02-23-2010, 03:02 AM
Do you not think he is the same Jean Sainvil at Appling Way in Atlanta? A woman lives at that address too. A MSainvil. Not the same people?

And I'm confused about the "scout", who went and set up the hasty soccer field meeting. Here, I thought he was just a helpful kid who knew the families. I had no idea that he is Isaac Adrien, director of an orphanage. Hmmmm.

I noted that the Haitian guards did ask the Baptists to turn over their phones. There's gonna be some mighty interesting info on those phones, IMO.

Missizzy
02-23-2010, 03:18 AM
How can this not be of concern? Isaac Adrien is listed as the director of the sponsorship programs for Children of Promise:

http://www.echildrenofpromise.org/NewsViews/WhatsHappening/tabid/85/articleType/ArticleView/articleId/47/Haiti-Earthquake-Situation-11310.aspx

Isaac is also the young man who assisted the Silsby group in finding parents willing to give up their children.

The Children of Promise are also under scrutiny tonight for another adoption debacle:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100223/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/cb_haiti_americans_detained_4;_ylt=AsJfufRjAGTHlOC XD4Rsf4G9IxIF;_ylu=X3oDMTE2ZnI5cWlsBHBvcwMzBHNlYwN 5bi1yLWItbGVmdARzbGsDZXYtb3JwaGFuYWdl

"Six U.S.-bound orphans seized by Haitian police despite having their papers in order remained in a government-run nursery more than two days later, the orphanage director said Monday night.

"The youngest has developed diarrhea and is very dehydrated," said Jan Bonnema of Prinsburg, Minnesota, founder and director with her husband, Bud, of the Children of The Promise orphanage, where the children originated."

and

"A large group of Haitians attacked them," Bonnema added. "They were swearing at them and saying, 'These are Haitian babies. You cannot take them. You are child trafficking.'"

U.S. and Haitian officials had earlier confirmed the detention but without providing details. The children, ages 1 to 5, and women were all detained by police, and the women were released several hours later from a nearby police station after U.S. diplomats intervened. But the children remained in a government nursery in a tent camp on Monday night, Bonnema said."


You know I've worked with international and domestic adoptions for 26 years now. After our two highly successful Korean adoptions and our failed Haitian adoption, we decided to turn our attention to the children in the US who were waiting the longest...black boys. We've adopted five boys of color and two of their sisters along the way. Black boys in the US still wait far longer for adoption and languish in foster care.

To be very blunt, I'm not understanding this. A Haitian adoption costs between $10,000 adn $20,000 and has a holding time of almost two years. A domestic adoption is free and the child receives an adoption assistance payment, full medical, dental, and therapy until the age of 21. Why are people in a frenzy about Haitian children who should be staying in their own country? Has anyone turned to look at the 400,000 children with a plan of adoption in this country? Just wondering.

i.b.nora
02-23-2010, 03:55 AM
A Timeline. Additions, changes, corrections are welcome.

Laura Silsby and Charisa Coulter visit Haiti in late December, early January and take food and clothes and toys to the children at Pastor Daniel's church in Quiminthe, Haiti


FRIDAY JANUARY 8, 2010
Laura Lavonne Silsby and Jose Altagracia Ovando Hidalgo register the Refugio de Niños Nueva Vida Dominicana with the Dominican Republic government
(New Dominican Life Children's Refuge)

Sometime between January 8 and January 12, Laura Silsby and her cohort, sidekick, joined at the hip nanny and assistant Charisa Coulter leave the DR and return to their home/s in Idaho.


TUESDAY JANUARY 12, 2010
An Earthquake strikes Haiti at about 5:00 PM EST time.


FRIDAY JANUARY 22, 2010
— This is the day that all The Baptists are to meet in Miami. According to Jim Allen of Amarillo, Texas he went a day early and arrived in Miami on January 21st.
— It is possible that the Baptists flew to Puerto Plata, got their bus and then drove to Santo Domingo on Sunday.


SATURDAY JANUARY 23, 2010
— Did the Baptists visit the Hotel/Orphanage today?


SUNDAY JANUARY 24, 2010
The Baptists arrive in the Dominican Republic and check into the Hotel Lina, Santo Domingo, Dominican Republic. (Barcelo Lina, Santo Domingo - located in the center of Santo Domingo about 25 miles from Las Americas International Airport)
— By chance, they meet Anne-Christine d'Adesky, a writer and human rights activist who after listening to Silby's 'plans' to collect Haitian orphans, informs her that it would be regarded as illegal.
— Ms. Silsby's response: "We have been sent by the Lord to rescue these children, and if it's in the Lord's plan we will be successful."
— Silsby calls Malinda Pickett of Kentucky, she and her husband Richard are in the process of adopting some orphans in Haiti. Laura offers to help 'get' the kids. Malinda informs Laura that Richard is in Haiti now and please do not do anything to our children.
— Silsby informs d'Adesky that the group hoped to cross the border later this Sunday night, or the next day, and be back in the DR by Monday evening. d'Adesky informed Silsby that they needed documents and they had to inform Haitian authorities and UN people at the Protection Cluster who were in charge post quake.
— Silsby agreed to meet up with d'Adesky in the morning. However, by morning, the Baptists were gone.
— The director of "His Home for Children" in Haiti said a bus had turned up at his orphanage (near Delmas 60) late Sunday night, unannounced, with a missionary group that asked him to turn over remaining children in his care. He declined, telling d'Adesky 'it smelled fishy'


MONDAY JANUARY 25, 2010
— According to Anne-Christine d'Adesky (in an email to the UN), Silsby had planned to bring children back to the Dominican Republic on Jan. 25 (today)
— Silsby calls Malinda Pickett twice today, offering to get their adopted children out of Haiti for them. The family declines her assistance.


TUESDAY JANUARY 26, 2010
— Orphanage worker Isaac Adrien , 20, meets Silsby at the Quisqueya Christian School in Port-au-Prince. Isaac was raised at the House of Blessings Orphanage (founded by Phillip Murphy) in Callebasse. Isaac is coordinator for the Children of Promise program in Haiti. He and his brother, Steve, begin translating yesterday with the relief efforts being coordinated by Quisqueya Christian School. He says Silsby tells him she is looking for homeless children.
Acting on behalf of the Baptists, Adrien went the same day to Callebasse and convened nearly the entire village of Callebasse, about 500 people, on a dirt soccer field and presented the Americans offer. He told his neighbors the missionaries would educate their children in the neighboring Dominican Republic, the villagers said, adding that they were also assured they would be free to visit their children there. The Baptists also offered swimming pools and tennis courts.
— Silsby showed up at the Compassion for All orphanage in Haiti, asking to collect the Picketts' three adopted children and claiming to be Malinda Pickett's friend, according to Richard Pickett.
— David Louis, son of the owner Arthur Louis, of the Compassion for All orphanage
was there that day. He said Silsby asked if she could help them by taking a few of the children. He told her that he cannot make that decision. (intvu with AC360)
— When David wouldn't give Silsby any children and the Pickett children were not there -- they were with their new father Richard Pickett -- Silsby hired David Louis to go from orphanage to orphanage and be her translator and guide. And no one would turn children over to her. And, in the end, she was frustrated and crying that none of the responsible adults would give her any children.
— Three interpreters who worked for the Baptists told CNN the group met twice with a man, a mystery man, thought to be a Haitian policeman, who offered to help.
The first encounter took place on January 26. He told team leader Laura Silsby that they couldn't gather up Haitian children as they were doing, but then offered his help, according to an interpreter's account.
"They met a police guy and he told them that he could help and he was helping them with some paper," said Steve Adrien, one of three interpreters employed by the group. "We did not meet him in a police station, but in the street in a car."


WEDNESDAY JANUARY 27, 2010
— Pastor Jean Sainvil claims he first met up with Silsby and The Baptists on this day at Quanamithe on the northern Haiti-Dominican border and agreed to help her collect children for a 150-bed orphanage the Americans were establishing near the beach resort of Cabarete in the Dominican Republic.


THURSDAY JANUARY 28, 2010
— 20 children in the village of Callebasse were surrendered to the Baptists today. Parents there told The Associated Press they surrendered their children on Jan. 28, two days after a local orphanage worker acting on behalf of the Baptists convened nearly the entire village of about 500 people on a dirt soccer field to present the Americans' offer. As they loaded children onto a bus in Callebas on Jan. 28, the Americans took down contact information for all the families and assured them a relative would be able to visit them in the Dominican Republic.
— The Baptists again met with the mystery man in Port-au-Prince on Thursday, near the Dominican embassy. "He was helping Laura (Silsby) to get in touch with the ambassador in the Dominican embassy," according to Isaac Adrien, Steve's brother and another one of the interpreters. He said the group came away from the meeting with a document from the embassy that they took with them to the border on Friday.
— Silsby, accompanied by Sainvil collects 13 children from Citron.
— Sainvil, a former orphan who says his nondenominational Haiti Sharing Jesus Ministry has 25 churches in the countryside, said the two agreed to meet again in Port-au-Prince on Feb. 13 to get more children.
— John Requa of Twin Falls, Idaho, member of Eastside Baptist Church arrives in the Dominican Republic with plans to help the Baptists. He busied themselves working with another mysterious group from Texas to get the hotel that would serve as a temporary building ready for the children. Also, Requa and the Criders to come were joined by Nancy Rodriguez - wife of Paul Rodriguez the director of missions for the Magic Valley Baptist Association.


FRIDAY JANUARY 29, 2010
— Matt and Lora Crider arrive in the Dominican Republic. (probably Puerto Plata)
— 2:00 PM The Dominican consul in Port au Prince told the American Baptists that "you do not have the paperwork. It is illegal, what you are doing. Do not travel."
— 6:00 PM The Baptists with 33 purloined children are stopped at the southern Haitian / DR border crossing of Malpasse and detained. According to Jim Allen they spend Friday night at the border in a secured area.
— The group in Haiti called the group in the DR to say they had to get another document and wouldn't be across with the children that night.
— Pastor Jean Sainvil said when border authorities were questioning the missionaries, “One of the police officers called me and I was talking to him, and that’s when my phone went dead.”


SATURDAY JANUARY 30, 2010
— The Baptists are escorted back into Port au Prince and Silsby is questioned. Later in the day the Baptists are arrested and jailed.
— The children are turned over to an orphanage in Port au Prince run by the Austrian-based SOS Children's Villages charity.
— The Criders during a trip to Santo Domingo, got a call from Paul Thompson that the Baptists in Haiti had been arrested. Matt and Lora immediately went to the U.S. Embassy for help.
— Sainvil, meanwhile, became sick with vomiting and diarrhea and decided to fly back to the U.S. on a military transport plane, he said. ??? when ???


SUNDAY JANUARY 31, 2010
— Baptists in jail. No shoestrings, no phones, no belts. Got to keep their Bibles.
— The mysterious Texans working at the rented hotel/orphanage, left to go back to U.S.


MONDAY FEBRUARY 1, 2020
— Baptists are scheduled to attend a hearing with the judge.
— Anne-Christine d'Adesky sends an email to the United Nations and recounts meeting the leader of the missionaries before they entered Haiti and warning that the group's plan to collect 100 Haitian orphans was illegal because they lacked proper authorization.
— Ms. d'Adesky also told the U.N. officials that Ms. Silsby had planned to bring children back to the Dominican Republic on Jan. 25, four days before the group was arrested. She therefore urged the U.N. officials to "check on the orphanage" in the Dominican Republic because children might have been brought there before the group was arrested.
— Jorge Puello might have met in person with the Baptists today.
— John Requa and Matt and Lora Crider, all of Twin Falls, Idaho and Nancy Rodriguez left the DR and flew back to the U.S.


TUESDAY FEBRUARY 2, 2010
— Jorge Puello contacts Jose Hidalgo and requested documents detailing Silsby's plans to open the orphanage in the Dominican Republic so he could prove her innocence. Hidalgo said he turned over copies of the documents after Puello showed him a video in which he interviewed Coulter, one of the missionaries.

Melly53
02-23-2010, 04:04 AM
How can this not be of concern? Isaac Adrien is listed as the director of the sponsorship programs for Children of Promise:

http://www.echildrenofpromise.org/NewsViews/WhatsHappening/tabid/85/articleType/ArticleView/articleId/47/Haiti-Earthquake-Situation-11310.aspx

Isaac is also the young man who assisted the Silsby group in finding parents willing to give up their children.

The Children of Promise are also under scrutiny tonight for another adoption debacle:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100223/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/cb_haiti_americans_detained_4;_ylt=AsJfufRjAGTHlOC XD4Rsf4G9IxIF;_ylu=X3oDMTE2ZnI5cWlsBHBvcwMzBHNlYwN 5bi1yLWItbGVmdARzbGsDZXYtb3JwaGFuYWdl

"Six U.S.-bound orphans seized by Haitian police despite having their papers in order remained in a government-run nursery more than two days later, the orphanage director said Monday night.

"The youngest has developed diarrhea and is very dehydrated," said Jan Bonnema of Prinsburg, Minnesota, founder and director with her husband, Bud, of the Children of The Promise orphanage, where the children originated."

and

"A large group of Haitians attacked them," Bonnema added. "They were swearing at them and saying, 'These are Haitian babies. You cannot take them. You are child trafficking.'"

U.S. and Haitian officials had earlier confirmed the detention but without providing details. The children, ages 1 to 5, and women were all detained by police, and the women were released several hours later from a nearby police station after U.S. diplomats intervened. But the children remained in a government nursery in a tent camp on Monday night, Bonnema said."


You know I've worked with international and domestic adoptions for 26 years now. After our two highly successful Korean adoptions and our failed Haitian adoption, we decided to turn our attention to the children in the US who were waiting the longest...black boys. We've adopted five boys of color and two of their sisters along the way. Black boys in the US still wait far longer for adoption and languish in foster care.

To be very blunt, I'm not understanding this. A Haitian adoption costs between $10,000 adn $20,000 and has a holding time of almost two years. A domestic adoption is free and the child receives an adoption assistance payment, full medical, dental, and therapy until the age of 21. Why are people in a frenzy about Haitian children who should be staying in their own country? Has anyone turned to look at the 400,000 children with a plan of adoption in this country? Just wondering.

Missizzy, IIRC Issac was working at one of the orphanages, House of Blessings, that Silsby visited when she went around asking for children. He refused to give her any of their children. He did however agree to act as an interpreter for her group and took her to some other orphanages where the response was the same (No). He later took her to the village of Cabrese(sp?) where he is from I believe. I remember that he was testifying for the Haitian government in the trial proceedings.

I remember this information was stated in one of the videos when the media interviewed the interpreters early on in the case. Anderson Cooper maybe or CNN I think but I can't remember which one right off the top of my head. I would look for the video but am too tired right now. Maybe tomorrow, because I really need to head to bed..

jeff_jones
02-23-2010, 02:08 PM
MissIzzy wrote:

To be very blunt, I'm not understanding this. A Haitian adoption costs between $10,000 adn $20,000 and has a holding time of almost two years. A domestic adoption is free and the child receives an adoption assistance payment, full medical, dental, and therapy until the age of 21. Why are people in a frenzy about Haitian children who should be staying in their own country? Has anyone turned to look at the 400,000 children with a plan of adoption in this country? Just wondering.

Thanks for bringing that up.

pinkpuddytat
02-23-2010, 03:41 PM
Has anyone found any mention as to the name of the orphanage where the Pickett kids were? In a huge city, fraught with turmoil, how did Silsby find those particular children?

I recall reading in a news article that the Picketts had been maintaining a website about their adoption process. Apparently Silsby got all or most of her information about them from this website.

i.b.nora
02-23-2010, 04:05 PM
Two Americans to be released in Haiti kidnapping case: Lawyer
Feb 23, 2010 9:53 PM | By Sapa-AFP
Two Americans charged with kidnapping children following Haiti's devastating earthquake will be released by Thursday at the latest, one of their lawyers, Aviol Fleurant, told AFP.

http://www.timeslive.co.za/world/article323412.ece

i.b.nora
02-23-2010, 04:10 PM
UPDATE 1-US missionaries still held in Haiti to be freed (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN2311769920100223)
No evidence of wrongdoing, judge says

By Joseph Guyler Delva

PORT-AU-PRINCE, Feb 23 (Reuters) - Two U.S. missionaries still held in Haiti on child kidnapping charges are expected to be freed this week, the judge hearing their case said on Tuesday.

"I think they could be released this week," the judge, Bernard Sainvil, told Reuters."

"The case will be over this week because we have no criminal grounds to pursue it," added Sainvil, who spoke after questioning the two Americans, Laura Silsby and Charisa Coulter, in a Port-au-Prince courtroom.

pinkpuddytat
02-23-2010, 04:12 PM
"She asked for kids at each of the orphanages, and at the end of the day when no one would give her any, she cried," Richard Pickett said. "Why would you cry after you see these kids are being taken care of?"

I recall seeing that, and it fits with my assessment that she was literally desperate to maintain the appearance that this orphanage project was on track, because she needed to keep the donations flow coming to support herself and keep her very troubled financial house of cards from tumbling down in a way that was likely to land her in a US prison, or at the very least leave her facing a long list of criminal fraud charges in the US, spelling the permament end of any pretense to be a successful businesswoman, and likely having profoundly negative effects on her custody battle/visitation rights, and alimony/child support payments.

BUT, I'd like to know what Mr. Pickett's source was for this information. Was the orphanage where she tried to get his children her last stop of the day, and the orphanage staff reported this (but how would they have known it was "the end of the day" and that she'd been unsuccessful in several attempts to obtain children)? I don't have any reason to doubt Mr. Pickett's report, but I'd really like to know the source. If someone was aware of an emotionally unstable American woman having spent the whole day trying to obtain children she had no particular claim to, and then breaking down in tears when the end of the day arrived and she still hadn't gotten any, the person should have been trying to contact the Haitian and/or American authorities to report her activities.

pinkpuddytat
02-23-2010, 04:15 PM
Two Americans charged with kidnapping children following Haiti's devastating earthquake will be released by Thursday at the latest, one of their lawyers, Aviol Fleurant, told AFP.


Consider the source . . .

pinkpuddytat
02-23-2010, 04:22 PM
Two U.S. missionaries still held in Haiti on child kidnapping charges are expected to be freed this week, the judge hearing their case said on Tuesday. "I think they could be released this week," the judge, Bernard Sainvil, told Reuters." "The case will be over this week because we have no criminal grounds to pursue it," added Sainvil, who spoke after questioning the two Americans, Laura Silsby and Charisa Coulter, in a Port-au-Prince courtroom.


Consider the actual words of a more reliable source. And that this source may yet defer to the prosecutor, who may have a different opinion.

If indeed they are released, I hope Silsby is taken into custody by some US authority. It has occurred to me that if the Haitian government's attitude is that they just wanted to send a message to people thinking of pulling stunts like this, but not actually go through with a prosecution (given the other, rather more pressing priorities they currently face), they may be cooperating with the US government to delay the release until the various US state and federal authorities that have legitimate grounds to take Silsby into custody, finish their inter-authority squabbling and determine who gets her first. I don't think she'd be held in a US prison at this point, but there's plenty of grounds to arrest her for various fraudulent financial activities, and then let her out on bail (assuming she could make bail, but she still seems to have some churchy suckers back in Idaho who believe she's pure as just-fallen snow).

pinkpuddytat
02-23-2010, 04:36 PM
MissIzzy wrote: To be very blunt, I'm not understanding this. A Haitian adoption costs between $10,000 adn $20,000 and has a holding time of almost two years. A domestic adoption is free and the child receives an adoption assistance payment, full medical, dental, and therapy until the age of 21. Why are people in a frenzy about Haitian children who should be staying in their own country? Has anyone turned to look at the 400,000 children with a plan of adoption in this country? Just wondering.


Thanks for bringing that up.

The sad reality is that virtually all US children available for adoption at a cost below $25,000+ are severely damaged -- physically and/or psychologically. The inherent problems with that are already more than many prospective adoptive parents want to take on, but there's the added complication that government agencies will maintain a lot of control over these children's lives after they're adopting, requiring certain types of therapy or medication that the parents may not agree with, requiring that the children attend public school when the parents feel that homeschooling without the stress of big crowds, bullies, inflexible schedule, etc, would be much better, at least in the early years. Certainly some Haitian children are severely damaged too (as MissIzzy has shared re her personal experience), but there are a lot of healthy, normal, very young Haitian children whose very poor parents are quite willing to give them up, and the severely damaged ones at least won't be tied to the "system" run by US child welfare agencies.

In addition, these poor Haitian parents won't launch lawsuits months or years after the adoption, claiming some technical reason why the adoption shouldn't have been finalized and they should get the children back. There have been too many horror stories about families who adopted and bonded with infants, only to be forced to return them as preschoolers who've never known any other home or parents, to chronic drug addicts/child neglecters/single moms with a never-ending series of live-in lowlife boyfriends/etc. If you adopt internationally, you know you'll be *keeping* the child, which is the number one priority for most prospective adoptive parents.

Missizzy
02-23-2010, 04:40 PM
Whoa--i.b.nora, that's a massive amount of work. Thank you so much. I'd been trying to hold it all in my head. Playing off your timeline, here's some questions:

Just where did Silsby come up with the Haitian child/DR orphanage idea? Had she done any research into just how ludicrous this plan was, especially prior to the earthquake? By that statement, I'm referring to the fact that the Dominicans have certainly loosened things up to help the Haitians. Prior to the earthquake, Haitian kids--especially orphans--were just not welcomed with open arms in the DR. Why did she not hook up with an established orphanage in Haiti and funnel funds and workers there?

What exactly went on and who were the players in the pre-earthquake visits? Whose money was used for all these junkets? How could the pastors of the two Idaho churches and the Directors of Missions NOT been more involved/informed? They've given us the impression that they're all a bit bemused by what has taken place. A pastor is the shepherd of his/her flock--why aren't they in charge of the whole shebang?

In that vein, what was Silsby's position in these churches? I've read over the church newsletters a number of times (before some were removed) and I've seen no "An Evening with Laura--to Haiti with Love" Sunday night services. I don't see where Silsby "orgainically" moved into a position of power with these churches. It seems as if she fell from the sky. Oh my Lord, you don't think she's heaven-sent, do you?

There was, though, frequent mention of the Requa mission work to the Ukraine. Did the Requas give that up and channel their donated items and work to Haiti instead. Why did a group of working men and women drop everything and go with such a flimsy plan? When I think of the planning and development which could have been completed at the Idaho end, with maybe one person on the ground in Haiti, it really seems ridiculous that so many agreed to this.

If they were truly looking for someone to strictly hold a child on their lap, they could have paid a Haitian mom or dad to do that. And remember they had 40 and then 33 children with only 10 adults. I just can't figure out what these nine people thought they were going to do for two weeks. Did they have another group back in Idaho set up to relieve them? That's where planning would have come in.

Another issue is that there are many many Baptist and fundamentalist affiliated orphanages in Haiti which were damaged. The ones which were not damaged have been inundated with children, often true orphans. Why not volunteer to help where some infrastructure already existed?

The level of arrogance and lack of cultural sensitivity just appalls me when I think about it. When we traveled to Haiti to adopt in 1989, we were made aware of the fact that, outside the hotel we stayed, we were NOT to be seen in public with our new daughter. The Haitian people had very negative reactions to international adoption and felt that Americans and Europeans were child-stealing. The cultural reaction in Korea in the mid-80s was totally different. Everywhere we went, people stopped us to thank us for adopting a Korean child. The issue is that cultures are different and have different reactions to adoption. Silsby failed to do any homework.

I also wanted to point out that I'm seeing more and more comments on numerous blogs concerning the selling of body parts. The subject is sickening and not one I can link to the Baptists. But I do keep seeing scattered reports of groups of young children disappearing. Where are they going? In fact there's some very thought provoking and well written comments on the Anderson Cooper page. I'll link to it:

http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2010/02/05/video-missionaries-case-lies/

This is the video concerning the "brochures" which were given to parents. The comments that follow are right on, IMO.

Missizzy
02-23-2010, 05:29 PM
I'm sorry my post is so out of sequence. Thank you, guys, for breaking the news of the possible release of the final 2 Baptists. We'll see.

Pink--I'd like to address your post. I'm sorry but I don't agree with you on a number of levels. Many children in the US are indeed, prenatally exposed to drugs or alcohol. Many, who have been in the system for years have behavioral and abandonment issues. That is a huge issue. However, children in third world countries often arrive with rickets, parasites, vitamin deficiencies, failure to thrive, post-nutritional deficiencies, institutionally induced attachment issues, and lack of medical histories.

Children born in the states most commonly have a "paper trail" back to the day of their birth or first prenatal appointment and due to very strict disclosure laws, rarely is an adopting parent unaware of previous abuse, neglect, or parental medical history issues.

An domestic adoptive parent is subjected to a home study as is the case with every international adoption. The same goes for post-placement supervision and interstate compact rules. These are federally and mandated and only a very black-market situation would be able to circumvent them. Once a child is legally adopted, usually 6-12 months after placement, no agency maintains any control of the child. If a family receives an adoption assistance stipend, no amount of reporting or accounting can be requested. Agencies may not have any impact on family choices concerning moving, education, discipline, therapy, etc.--not once the adoption is final. This sounds terrible and unethical but essentially, a parent can adopt from a Christian agency and tell the case manager that the child will attend a private Christian school and will maintain a twice yearly meeting with a birth parent. That family can pick up and move to another state or country and make any choices they wish concerning education and religion. No birth-family visitation/open adoption can be legally mandated. It is considered informal and a courtesy only. A legally adopted child is no different than a child born to a family. A parent is only required to follow state laws concerning appropriate education, protection, support, and discipline.

Many of the the very real issues you raise involve children who are in a foster/adoption placement. That is, when a foster family asks to adopt a child they've bonded with. If a family chooses domestic adoption, they can choose to only consider children who have no legal risk--the parental rights have been terminated. We've completed eight domestic adoptions like this. I cannot speak highly enough of our experiences, for the most part. We've had appropriate subsidies, excellent medical, dental, pharmaceutical, and mental health care, access to special education services, and respite help for the asking. If we want to be involved with an agency based support group, we could. We've had very good communication with the public state agencies that placed our children with us. The adoptions held no cost for our family. In fact, there are one time subsidies to help pay for travel and finalizations costs. Everything in US adoptions is intended to remove barriers to permanency and to create an incentive to adoption. If someone is truly interesting in adopting a healthy child of color, let me assure you that there are tens of thousands ready and waiting here in the states.

Adopting internationally, you are truly on your own. You have no way of ever knowing your child's true history. You receive no services, stipends, etc. In fact, you must sign a binding agreement to not apply for government funds (food stamps, SSI) for the child for a certain number of years after placement. Until recently, children with pre-existing medical conditions were not required to be covered under the family insurance plan. This process worked like a charm for our family with our Korean adoptions as the Korean process was finely honed by the 1980's. Our experience with Haiti was a total debacle and morass from the get go.

I encourage anyone with questions concerning adoption to check out the advocacy group I've worked with for the last 16 years, the North American Council on Adoptable Children:

www.nacac.org

There are lots of fact sheets and great links. As an end note, I've given birth three times to gloriously healthy and bright children. We did everything the "right way". As those children grew up they developed serious mental and neurological illnesses--related to an unknown gene which also caused my severe disability. We've also sadly lost a biological grandchild soon after her birth to this same disorder.

Our Korean adoptees and four of our domestically adopted children are fabulously healthy and productive adults. Four struggle mightily with mental and chronic illness. Parenting is a gamble, no matter which door you go through.

truckbomb
02-23-2010, 05:37 PM
If the judge is reported to find "No criminal activity" on the part of Silsby and her lackey why are these two female Beavis and Buttheads still sleeping on the concrete floor and "could be released "no later than the end of the week."

Maybe Pink is right. The prosecutor may get a say or the U.S. authorities are negotiating which law enforcement arm, state or federal, gets first whack at them. Frankly, I will believe the release when I see them getting on the plane without U.S. marshall cuffs.

i.b.nora
02-23-2010, 06:46 PM
At about the same time as the Reuters report was coming out, this McClatchy report also came out.

Senator: U.S. says Haiti will release last two missionaries (http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2010/02/23/87750/senator-us-says-haiti-will-release.html)

By Bethann Stewart | Idaho Statesman

The State Department has told Idaho's U.S. Sen. James Risch that two missionaries still being held in Haiti on child kidnapping charges will be released later this week.

Risch's spokesman, Brad Hoaglun, said that the State Department said Laura Silsby and Charisa Coulter would be released later this week. It was not immediately clear how the State Department knew of their release.

Missizzy
02-23-2010, 08:21 PM
Pink--I know I can get tiresomely stuck but I have another point about adoption ethics. For those who aren't interested, please skip this post and move on.

One sea change in adoption and foster care which I failed to mention in my treatise above is the arrival on the scene of the Fundamentalists and Evangelics. I'm going to try to step lightly but call it as I've seen this drama play out in the last 25 years.

In the 70's and 80's, transcultural, both domestic and primarily Korean, adoption was typically connected with the urban centers and liberal politics. Black children were starting to enter the US system at the same time Holt Adoptions and Eastern Child Welfare were setting up shop in Korea. American parents (yes, typically white middle class couples) were seeing the costs of adopting a perfect white newborn skyrocket with Roe vs. Wade taking its toll on unplanned pregnancies. It suddenly became "cool" and "evolved" to adopt outside of one's own race or heritage.

Families often said that the race or color of the child "didn't matter to them". Oh, how naive we all were back in those days. Of course, the race and color mattered to the child. It was not a pleasant thing to be seen as the Marvin's little Korean girl or the Johnson's nice adopted black son. We had a lot of work to do on cultural sensitivity.

For a while black/white adoptions were slowed by some strong advocacy by the Association of Black Social Workers in the early 90s. They tried (and still do, I imagine) to exhort black families to adopt to a great level of success. However, with the use of illicit drugs and the crumbling family structure in the inner city, children of color literally overwhelmed the system. I worked hard on the MultiEthnic Placement Act in 1994 which finally removed the barriers to whites adopting black children. Now a family's race could only be considered as a factor in adoption--not THE factor. Families were finally given cultural training on racial issues and we saw the advent of the Culture Camps.

In the mid-90s, Evangelical and Fundamentalist churches started preaching about adoption. Along with the Quiver Full movement, we saw the beginning of the huge multi-racial adoptive family. I personally know of families with up to 40 children which fit this description. They often, but of course, not always, are very conservative in their politics and see their actions as a personal statement against abortion. I know some great families with some very successful and happy kids.

However, these families have had their problems. Adoption is not about altruism. It's all fine and dandy to adopt that sweet little black baby boy but that boy grows up. That boy is not always tickled to be the only child of color in an all white high school. He straddles two worlds. Is he black or is he white?

Often times, in the rush to adopt as many children as possible, something called child-crowding occurs. Just because a house can hold 12 children doesn't mean it's the best practice. Children need space and attention. They are individuals and can often get shunted out of the way in huge families (trust me on this one as the mother of 14).

When the conservative Christians hit up against DHS, sparks went off. The Christians approached parenting a la James Dobson. DHS took a far more liberal view. DHS forbid any sort or corporal punishment in their foster and adoption training classes (and remember that many children arrive in a family as a foster child prior to being adopted). DHS also did not usually approve of home-schooling as they sought greater oversight of the child while the child was still in foster care. That flew in the face of many of the Christian foster and adoptive parents. This caused many to remove themselves from foster care and from the waiting lists at DHS for adoption. We saw a mass exodus towards Christian agencies who had contacts in Haiti, Liberia, and Ethiopia.

This is where the fine article that Texas Mist posted comes in. It describes the practice of international child and baby trafficking and "laundering". It is essentially the purchasing of children from their families and fast-tracking them for adoption. Birth parents don't always understand that they are literally signing away their kids until it is too late. Unscrupulous workers have been known to openly lie to families and promise visits or contact. Sometimes the children will be maintained for long periods of time in the orphanages which brings the orphanage and its directors more funds. Families can get photos and letters from their children and can visit but the darned paperwork just keeps getting "lost". The Christian agencies on the US end will often accept family dynamics which not be allowed in the public sector. This was all well-documented in the paper which TM posted.

While transcultural families were once found in the 70s-80s within the ultra liberal community, they are now more often found in the Bible Belt. With US agencies bursting at the seams with children of color waiting for adoption, African and Haitian children are arriving in record numbers. I really feel as if there's a strong link to the Quiver Full movement. This is, as always, my opinion only. I truly don't wish to step on anybody's toes nor minimize the love that a family has for their children.

If you look at international and transcultural adoption over the course of the last 25-30 years, it has changed drastically.

i.b.nora
02-23-2010, 11:16 PM
Jorge has a new website:

http://www.jorge-es-inocente.com/

i.b.nora
02-23-2010, 11:19 PM
Domain Name.......... jorge-es-inocente.com
Creation Date........ 2010-02-22
Registration Date.... 2010-02-22
Expiry Date.......... 2011-02-22
Organisation Name.... Jorge Torres
Organisation Address. Calle Cuyaya Numero 28
Organisation Address.
Organisation Address. Santo Domingo
Organisation Address. 00000
Organisation Address. DN
Organisation Address. DOMINICAN REPUBLIC

Texas Mist
02-23-2010, 11:19 PM
Man Connected With Americans in Haiti Makes His Case While Still on the Run
By MARC LACEY and IAN URBINA
Published: February 23, 2010

MEXICO CITY — Jorge Torres — a k a Jorge Puello, a k a the self-described “lawyer” who advised the 10 Americans arrested in Haiti last month — certainly has unusual habits for a man on the run. A fugitive of the modern age, he fires off e-mail messages on the lam, defends himself on Web sites against the charges looming over him and grants media interviews even as law enforcement agencies pursue him.

In a rambling telephone interview on Tuesday from what he said was Panama, but could have been anywhere, Mr. Torres said he was not guilty of anything, pointed reporters and police officers alike to his new Web site [ http://www.jorge-es-inocente.com/ ] and vowed to turn himself in soon to prove he had done nothing wrong.

“All I’m waiting for is for my lawyer to tell me, ‘Surrender,’ ” he said.

The man on the phone clearly had the same voice as the one who once presented himself as the lawyer for the 10 Americans jailed on child abduction charges. But he abruptly disappeared after it emerged that he was not a lawyer at all, and that the authorities in El Salvador were seeking his arrest on charges of sexual trafficking.

Jorge Aníbal Torres Puello appears to be his real name, and Mr. Torres e-mailed copies of identity documents to support that. He acknowledged using numerous aliases over the years, sometimes to leave his criminal past behind him and sometimes for other shadowy reasons.

But even his wife, Ana J. Galvarina Ramírez Orellana, was sometimes confused about his identity.
........................
Mr. Torres could not fully explain why he became involved in the Americans’ case when he knew arrest warrants were out for him. But even with the obvious risk of exposure, he seemed to delight in the media attention. “I’m in demand,” he said of the many journalists trailing him at the time, not the law enforcement officials now in pursuit.

much more here -- good read

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/24/world/americas/24puello.html

Puello is a dangerous man, IMO.

Texas Mist
02-23-2010, 11:49 PM
Haiti adoption fights mirror desperation

By JONATHAN M. KATZ
The Associated Press


PORT-AU-PRINCE, Haiti — Foreigners detained, Haitians enraged, children caught in the middle: The scenario that played out this week echoed the case of 10 Americans caught trying to spirit youngsters out of this earthquake-ravaged nation.

This time it turned out differently. Six U.S.-bound orphans seized by Haitian police Saturday as they were about board a flight for Miami were handed over to the U.S. Embassy on Tuesday. They are scheduled to leave Wednesday afternoon for new homes and families in the United States.

The two cases highlight the perils of trying to remove youngsters from this desperate country.

At the very moment Haiti's impoverished children are in greatest need — and well-meaning foreigners most willing to help — fears of child trafficking are making it harder than ever for them to leave the Western Hemisphere's poorest land.

Fears were exacerbated by the case of 10 U.S. Baptist missionaries who were stopped late last month trying to take a busload of 33 children to the Dominican Republic without proper documentation.

more here -- Haiti is struggling :(

http://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world/haiti-adoption-fights-mirror-323984.html

i.b.nora
02-24-2010, 12:02 AM
On this page:
http://www.jorge-es-inocente.com/hipocrecia_del_sistema_judicial_de_eeuu
He seems to compare his bank fraud case to that of Martha Stewart, regarding sentencing, I think.

truckbomb
02-24-2010, 12:21 AM
Truckbomb's translation of the last part of Puerllo's self-serving Web Page
-------------------------------------------------------------------

The actions of Mr. Torres are the creation and manipulation by the the United States of America government and proves the discrimination towards Hispanics in that racist and cruel nation.

The nation of El Salvador has contributed to these actions of the United States government by manufacturing a case with political motives against Mr. Torres.

We hope that with all this information you as reader you can understand the miserable life that he has suffered during his 32 years of life and finally

YOU BE THE JUDGE.
Thanks.

Committee for the defense of Jorge Aníbal Puello Towers.

--------------------------------------------
Racist and Cruel nation?
Is this guy Looney Tunes or what?

i.b.nora
02-24-2010, 12:26 AM
In some ways, I don't think he is any loonier than T h e B A P T I S T S.

Missizzy
02-24-2010, 03:32 AM
I'd like to see a run down of the members of Puello's Committee......Chenvert, Hidalgo, hmmmm.

i.b.nora
02-24-2010, 12:52 PM
Puello Says Other Dominicans Helped Silsby (http://www.haitivoxbulletin.com/2010/02/special-report-puello-says-other.html)

This is the awaited Haitivox article, one of them anyhow. Glad I didn't hold my breathe. If we didn't already know so much about Puello and his history of lying and if he hadn't have launched his brand new website just yesterday then I might consider this article more important than I think it is.

From Haitivox's own words: "Mr. Puello alleges that another group of Dominicans were helping Silsby secure documents and passage across the border prior to her fateful trip to Haiti. This article does not disclose their names, because these allegations require further investigation. But it will be shared with law enforcement authorities."

One of the things I find so fascinating about Jorge Puello is his reliance on "documents" to prove his statements / allegations / etc. But, what is even more fascinating is how people seem to automatically believe that since it is a "document" that it must be real.

About halfway through the article she finally gets to the info about the lady lawyer and some high placed Dominican official who Puello says helped Silsby. And, she talks some about Sean Lankford and his interactions with Puello. All of course is based on Puello's word alone and some "documents" which he claims is an email exchange between he and Lankford.

Missizzy
02-24-2010, 01:47 PM
I wonder if the high ranking military official could be the "minister" Silsby referred to. Note, she did not use the word "pastor" or "missionary" as she did with some others. She said "minister". That word is used for official positions in the DR.

ITA, i.b.nora, about the comments about documents. Not only Puello seems to put an awful lot of stock in documents, but so did Silsby. I would think that Judge Sainvil could follow the paper trail of these so-called documents and clearly determine what is going on.

Is it truly possible that Silsby was horribly unlucky in just meeting the wrong people? That she truly was trying to set up an orphanage/island hide-out and fell into the laps of the bad guys? Or did the bad guys take advantage of her naivete and help her as much as possible thinking she'd be the perfect "front" for a supply of children. Was the primo duper, duped?

I wish Ms. d'Adesky would give us a little more. Why doesn't she name the trafficker? She's playing the drama card a bit much for me.

It's a "tune in tomorrow" tone. Not at all like her usual writing.

Missizzy
02-24-2010, 01:54 PM
http://bastardette.blogspot.com/

More on Puello. We've seen most of this before but I like to keep an eye on this blog.

And an interesting snip from a comment from someone posting as "pedrochemical" on the DR Forum:

http://www.dr1.com/forums/haiti-earthquake/100199-who-can-stop-tragedy-35.html

"I think that this episode is bringing to light a business in which people are facilitating adoptions, perhaps quite legally up until these fools got caught, and making a stink load of cash.

There are respectable people on the North coast involved in this trade. They prefer to set themselves up as pious, holy people but they have a bottom line like the rest of the world. The bottom line it seems is VERY FAT INDEED.

Remember, we are talking about (legally) buying and selling children.
People should know about the money trail....."

more at link

Missizzy
02-24-2010, 02:51 PM
In "reading" Jorge's new blog, I've been able to pick out that he's got quite a CV there. Used car salesman, grocery store worker, satellite dish repairman. I wonder if he left out the part of cattle wrangling in Wyoming?

And just an innocent question. If the mother of his children is in prison and his Mom is in the DR, who's watching his kids? Who's supporting them? Child support enforcement of El Salvador is probably on the list of those hunting him.

Missizzy
02-24-2010, 03:11 PM
It would be interesting to look at the guest list of the El Lino Hotel during the time Silsby was staying there. Also, the reservation list for the dining room.

Missizzy
02-24-2010, 03:29 PM
Can't anyone get it "right"?

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/24/world/americas/24orphans.html?th&emc=th

Questions Surface After Haitian Airlift

".........But for 12 of the children, last month’s airlift transported them from one uncertain predicament to another. As it turns out, those children — between 11 months and 10 years old — were not in the process of being adopted, might not all even be orphans and are living in a juvenile care center here while the authorities determine whether they have relatives in Haiti who are able to take care of them.

The details of the children’s departure — and what that could mean for relations between the United States and the Haitian government, which later detained 10 Americans for trying to take children out of the country without authorization — remain unclear....."


more at link

i.b.nora
02-24-2010, 03:30 PM
It would be interesting to look at the guest list of the El Lino Hotel during the time Silsby was staying there. Also, the reservation list for the dining room.
It seems like The Baptists might have only stayed at the Hotel Lina that one night and I venture to say, barely that.
Quote from Haitivox first article: "The director of "His Home for Children" in Haiti said a bus had turned up at his orphanage (near Delmas 60) late Sunday night, unannounced, with a missionary group that asked him to turn over remaining children in his care. He declined, telling d'Adesky 'it smelled fishy'".

Missizzy
02-24-2010, 07:53 PM
http://bastardette.blogspot.com/

New info posted this afternoon on "Laura Silsby's Texas Missionaries Revealed".

Missizzy
02-24-2010, 08:00 PM
Per TM's advice, I read the Puello article. It is, indeed, a good read. You know you've got problems when a woman doesn't even know the true identity of her husband:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/24/world/americas/24puello.html


"But even his wife, Ana J. Galvarina Ramírez Orellana, was sometimes confused about his identity.

When they first started dating, she said, she thought his name was Georges Albert Simard Puello. Then, after American authorities unsuccessfully sought to extradite him on suspicions that he was trying to smuggle migrants from Canada to the United States, he informed her that he was actually Jorge Aníbal Torres Puello.

Speaking from a jail cell in El Salvador last week, Ms. Ramírez said her mysterious husband, who had repeated brushes with the law, changed his identity with ease and left her behind in the advanced stages of pregnancy when the police sought the two of them last year in connection with the Salvadoran sex trafficking ring. Ms. Ramírez was jailed on the trafficking charges.

She now suggests that she may soon be divorcing him."


That might not be as easy as it sounds. First, Ana needs to figure out who she's really married to. I note that while Puello roams free and laps up the attention, he leaves women behind in jail. What a guy.

Missizzy
02-24-2010, 08:11 PM
I'm sorry, i.b.nora, as I know you are certain that Puello didn't know Silsby before her arrest. I respect your position, I really do. But...

"Instead, it appears that on Jan. 31 Mr. Torres called the Idaho church that five of the 10 missionaries attended and, using the name Jorge Puello, offered his legal services pro bono."

Yeah, right!!!!! Just a simple cold call from a CONcerned man.

truckbomb
02-24-2010, 09:29 PM
Yesterday Truck sent an email to our Mr. Torres. Here was my email (natually in spanish)
---------------------------------------------

Sr. Torres, ¿Encontró usted a Sra. Silsby antes de las autoridades Haitianas la detuvo?

Su amigo

Juan
----------------------------------------------
Trans: Mr. Torres, Did you meet Ms. Silsby before the authorities detained her?

Your Friend
John

----------------------------------------------
Torres replyed this evening with:

Nunca conoci yo a esa señora antes de el arresto de ella.

----------------------------------------------

Trans: I never met this lady before her arrest.

-----------------------------------------------

Folks, I cannot vouch for the truth of the matter asserted but it is interesting that one of this board is in direct contact with him.

Missizzy
02-24-2010, 11:07 PM
Thanks Truckbomb for posting your correspondence with Señor Puello. I would say his word is at least as good as, say....US real estate......that's the ticket.

I'm almost certain that he is trolling for the highest bidder for his story. No doubt that he is here relishing every bit of attention we afford him.

FWIW, I've raised 9 sons and my three oldest are 29, 33, and 35. I have studied Puello's photos carefully and I don't think this man is 32. I think he's a good bit older. It's hard to imagine that he's squeezed so much living into three decades.

i.b.nora
02-24-2010, 11:33 PM
I'm sorry, i.b.nora, as I know you are certain that Puello didn't know Silsby before her arrest. I respect your position, I really do. But...

"Instead, it appears that on Jan. 31 Mr. Torres called the Idaho church that five of the 10 missionaries attended and, using the name Jorge Puello, offered his legal services pro bono."

Yeah, right!!!!! Just a simple cold call from a CONcerned man.
I do think it was a cold call. Jorge is an opportunist, always looking for a new target, seems to me.

jeff_jones
02-25-2010, 01:36 AM
I do think it was a cold call. Jorge is an opportunist, always looking for a new target, seems to me.

I've come to the same conclusion. He craves the limelight. And - unintentionally (or not?) - this case has given him the notoriety to face the Salvador charges as a "celebrity" instead of just any other Joe Blow.

He's very shrewd and very dumb at the same time.
His specialty is "fixing paperwork" (getting Salvadoran nationality, offering naturalizations online, trying to recruit escorts online).
Not child trafficking.
His realtor activities (if any) were limited to trying to peddle Santo Domingo projects (e.g. building Shalom I & II) and rentals. No obvious North Coast connections.

The HaitiVox report today didn't bring new elements. That Silsby had a (real) lawyer in the DR called Sencìon has been known for a while. The report links her to a lady called ... Asuncion ... (from a 2006 State Dept country report) but that's hypothetical.

Silsby strikes me as someone who was desperately looking for a turnaround in her life. Her son's wedding in the DR last summer gave her the opportunity to visit the place. She loved it. With the same pizzazz and energy of her previous ventures she motivated and mislead others.
When they got arrested, Puello saw the opportunity to make some extra $$ and become a hero at the same time. Any normal organization would have told him "Thanks, but no thanks", but as this was a DIY setup with no experience whatsoever, they said "Why not?" And the rest is history.

__

pinkpuddytat
02-25-2010, 02:52 AM
Mr. Torres could not fully explain why he became involved in the Americans’ case when he knew arrest warrants were out for him. But even with the obvious risk of exposure, he seemed to delight in the media attention. “I’m in demand,” he said of the many journalists trailing him at the time, not the law enforcement officials now in pursuit.[/B][/FONT][/SIZE

You could fill up a whole psych hospital with the cast of characters involved in this case . . .

pinkpuddytat
02-25-2010, 02:58 AM
I would think that Judge Sainvil could follow the paper trail of these so-called documents and clearly determine what is going on.

If they existed, I'm sure he could. But it's pretty hard to follow a paper trail that consists exclusively of hot air emanating from the mouths of two psychologically unstable people, both of whom seem to be career criminals, and one of whom can't be located.

pinkpuddytat
02-25-2010, 03:05 AM
I do think it was a cold call. Jorge is an opportunist, always looking for a new target, seems to me.

I think it was a cold call too, but I think it was quite a while before the band of bungling Baptists got arrested. Silsby had been making noise in the DR about her orphanage plans for a long while, and it's hard to imagine that Jorge hadn't gotten interested in the "opportunity" she presented early in her noise-making. An American with a good flow of money, an obvious lack of concern for ethics, and a good cover story about affiliation with an SBC church would have been quite a tempting target for Jorge.

truckbomb
02-25-2010, 05:22 AM
I initiated the email to Puello and he answered. In doing some "Sleuthing" I came across his email address and tried it.

i.b.nora
02-25-2010, 01:35 PM
Probably the single most interesting and best recent video I have seen is one by the New Tang Dynasty Television (NTDTV) taken in Haiti on this past Tuesday as Laura Silsby and Charisa Coulter arrive for the hearing. The last 30 seconds are fascinating to me. You can see CNN's Gary Tuchman attempting to talk with Charisa, who seems bored to death and is more interested in chewing her gum, Laura is looking after Charisa by getting her away from Tuchman and protecting her from the reporters and camera people.

VIDEO at this web address:

http://english.ntdtv.com/ntdtv_en/ns_na/2010-02-24/259834135140.html


Two Detained Americans Appear in Haitian Court
2010-02-24 12:56

"The two detained American missionaries appeared in court in Haiti's capital of Port-au-Prince yesterday. The judge was seeking information about their weekend testimony about how they wanted to set up an orphanage in neighbouring Dominican Republic."

Missizzy
02-25-2010, 03:18 PM
i.b.nora--I'm almost willing to concede (almost, mind you) that Puello never spoke directly to Silsby before her arrest. I still think that he was in contact with many of the "mystery people" she worked with in the DR. I don't think he arrived with his henchmen totally "cold". He asked around and learned the story and then inserted himself. I'm sure he knows many of these same people through other business ventures and saw big bucks to be made. Who knows, he probably owes lots of favors. He got all those passports somehow. Somebody, still un-named, is paying big time to keep their bunnies covered, IMO.

i.b.nora
02-25-2010, 03:55 PM
I am not sure who you mean by "his henchmen". I think he operates solo. If anyone aids him, it is probably family.
He talks about the passports in the comment section of that latest Haitivox article. And, his explanation sounds believable to me. Nowhere have I heard it said that the 13 passports were all issued to him. As he explains it, the passports are parceled out primarily to his kids.

Texas Mist
02-25-2010, 08:00 PM
Haiti judge: No release of US Baptists this week
A Haitian judge says American missionaries Laura Silsby and Charisa Coulter will remain in jail over the weekend as he awaits more testimony.
Posted: 4:39 PM Feb 25, 2010

PORT-AU-PRINCE, Haiti (AP) -- A Haitian judge says American missionaries Laura Silsby and Charisa Coulter will remain in jail over the weekend as he awaits more testimony.

Judge Bernard Saint-Vil says he has asked two real estate agents and a pastor from the Dominican Republic to testify in Port-au-Prince about property the missionaries rented to set up an orphanage.

That is expected Monday. If they do not show, Saint-Vil says he still expects to rule next week.

He also said Thursday he wants to question a pastor and another man from a border town.

http://www.volunteertv.com/national/headlines/85399547.html

i.b.nora
02-25-2010, 09:28 PM
So, it seems that Judge Bernard Saint-Vil is interested in talking with Rob Chenert and Jose Hidalgo, the real estate guys. Possibly Bishop Julio Cesar Cornielle, the Catholic guy. I still think there might be some other names on that registration for the Refuge in the DR. I hope he checks that out.

Then we have Pastor Daniel Paul at The House of the Lambs of God Orphanage at Quanaminthe in Haiti. Not sure who the 'other man' from a border town might be, anyone know?

I think its good that Saint-Vil is really taking his time with the investigation. Never can tell what he might just turn up. Just can't be too careful.

pinkpuddytat
02-25-2010, 09:30 PM
[QUOTE=Texas Mist;4855194][FONT="Microsoft Sans Serif"][COLOR="DarkGreen"]Haiti judge: No release of US Baptists this week
A Haitian judge says American missionaries Laura Silsby and Charisa Coulter will remain in jail over the weekend as he awaits more testimony.
[SIZE="2"]QUOTE]

Good news! I'm glad to hear they're spending more time in the Haitian jail. It's likely the best chance either of them will ever have to be forced to face up to reality and motivated to change their ways. The US justice system is unlikely to have that effect on them.

Missizzy
02-25-2010, 09:30 PM
i.b.nora--First, you are right on about that video. What in heck is going on with Coulter? Her behavior seems like that of a bored and very rude 14 year old presenting herself at Juvenile Court. I thought at first that she might be ill but that's not it at all. She's acting very inappropriately for a woman in such a dire situation. I would not want to seem rude, disrespectful or disinterested to the guards escorting me in a foreign country. Silsby, at least knows how to work the camera. She "handles" Coulter as if she was a child.

And when I used the word "henchmen" (as in lackey, "expendable adherents of the main villain") I was referring to the bodyguards who escorted Puello to court to see Silsby the first time. That was the word that sprung to my mind when I watched the very first video of Puello. They looked like self-important bouncers. Sorry if my comment was confusing.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/12/world/americas/12haiti.html

"I was skeptical of him because he arrived with four bodyguards, and I have never seen that from a lawyer,” the judge said in an interview. “I plan to get to the bottom of this right away.”

also at this link:

"Mr. Puello said he did not even have a passport."

Who knows how many passports the man has. I'm starting to wonder if the man even knows his own real name.

Missizzy
02-25-2010, 09:37 PM
Yes, and travel can be slow when one is attempting to be very very thorough.......

jeff_jones
02-25-2010, 10:00 PM
Judge Bernard Saint-Vil says he has asked two real estate agents and a pastor from the Dominican Republic to testify in Port-au-Prince about property the missionaries rented to set up an orphanage.

That is expected Monday. If they do not show, Saint-Vil says he still expects to rule next week.

He also said Thursday he wants to question a pastor and another man from a border town.

The full AP report specifies the border town as Ouanaminthe. That means he wants to meet the pastor Silsby went to visit in December. And maybe someone related to the pastor from Norcross?

I'm very curious if Ovando Hidalgo, Chenvert and someone from the diocese are going to come all the way to Port-au-Prince. I thought he had met them over the weekend. Maybe this is just a procedural matter, i.e. giving their testimony in a court room, in Haiti.

Missizzy
02-25-2010, 10:04 PM
I still wonder if John Duarte figured into any of this. He's the Canadian priest who was arrested for sex abuse of boys. He was arrested in Puerto Plata in October 2009. I wonder if his leaving opened up some real estate the Catholics owned? Was he, in any way connected with Bishop Cornielle?

http://thehaitianblogger.blogspot.com/2009/10/priest-faces-charges-in-canada-for_22.html

And while we're on the subject of Father Duarte, why was he extradited to Canada? He abused Haitian boys in Haiti and fled to the DR. He was arrested in Puerto Plata but extradited to Canada? Why? Just wondering.

Missizzy
02-25-2010, 10:12 PM
Some interesting links:

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/02/24/the-missionary-impulse/

The Missionary Impulse

"From out of the ordered suburbs of Idaho to the grim chaos of Haiti came 40-year-old Laura Silsby — fleeing creditors who had foreclosed on her home and ex-employees stiffed of their wages.

To the Caribbean she went with nine other self-appointed missionaries and an audacious plan: they would “gather 100 orphans from the streets,” of the poorest country in the Western Hemisphere, according to an outline on the Web site of Silsby’s group, New Life Children’s Refuge.

The children would be whisked across the border into the Dominican Republic. Food, shelter, legal permits: the basics would be worked out by divine blueprint. For now, they needed funds — tax deductible!

What’s more, there would soon be “opportunities for adoption,” the group mentioned, “for loving Christian parents who would otherwise not be able to afford to adopt......”

and

“Kidnapping for Jesus” is what many, including outraged Idahoans, have called it in reader response to newspaper stories about the missionaries. Silsby says it’s all a misunderstanding, and her intentions were good......"

more at link



Another thought provoking piece:

http://www.americasquarterly.org/node/1331

ILLEGAL TRAFFICKING IN HAITI AND BEYOND

"......The public scrutiny over both scandals focused on the individuals and organizations involved in the trafficking of children. But this most recent case involving American missionaries in Haiti sheds light on a very troubling and dark side of the adoption story: a globalized and growing demand of children who, for better or for worse, can often end up being trafficked into "better" lives...."

more at link

Missizzy
02-25-2010, 11:42 PM
http://media.www.pointparkglobe.com/media/storage/paper1255/news/2010/02/25/Opinions/Missionaries.Actions.Reveal.Egotism-3879296.shtml

Children have potential to pull Haiti out of rubble



"..........My issue with the actions of these American missionaries does not stem from the fact that they did not have all their paperwork in line, because they did it illegally on a whim, or even because they took 22 of the 33 children from their living parents, who willingly handed them over, because they could no longer afford to support them after the earthquake. Actually, these various issues are merely a shot in the dark when it comes down to why their actions were so underestimated and wrong.

My issue comes from the knowledge I gained on a mission trip to Haiti a year and a half ago. I am all too aware of the self-righteous thoughts that accompany mission trips to poverty stricken developing countries, because in retrospect I have carried the "save" the souls before the world moniker. The stereotype of white churchgoers flying to distant places with notions of rescuing poor, oppressed, uneducated people who just need them, is too instilled in our minds.

This stereotype is a crock of lies......."


more at link--worth reading

Missizzy
02-26-2010, 06:12 PM
A new addition to this blog, dated Friday, Feb. 26th:

http://www.haitivox.com/

More on Puello and Pastor Sainvil of Georgia.

Missizzy
02-26-2010, 06:52 PM
Probably nothing at all but I noticed that the constable's spokesperson for Windsor, Ontario who has released info about the arrest of John Duarte--the Catholic priest who was caught molesting Haitian boys, is named S. Coulter. Ontario's a long way from Idaho. We've never seen a connection, have we?

In almost every article which comes up on Duarte, S. Coulter's name comes up. Here's just one:

http://www.windsorstar.com/life/Former+Windsor+priest+John+Duarte+arraigned+child+ molestation+charges/2151232/story.html

".......Bradie [Duarte's attorney] added, however, that he was unaware of another case where someone “was brought back to face trial in Canada for offences outside this country,” although he said he knew the Criminal Code had recently been amended to allow for prosecution for certain offences.

S. Coulter, media relations officer for the Essex detachment of the OPP, said the 44-year-old founder and former director of Hearts Together for Haiti was handed over to Canadian police by Dominican authorities Monday and left from Punta aboard an Air Canada flight. Upon arrival in Montreal, Duarte was arrested by Montreal police on a Canada-wide warrant.

Coulter said Duarte appeared briefly before a justice of the Quebec Court who authorized his continued detention and released him into the custody of the OPP.

She added the prisoner and his police escort arrived in Toronto Monday evening and later continued on to Windsor, arriving late at night. He was transported to the WIndsor Jail and held overnight."


This article also addresses the question I posted earlier about why Duarte would be extradited to Canada for his offenses and not Haiti.

truckbomb
02-27-2010, 09:13 AM
The real question remaining, if and when Silsby is released, is whether the United States can claim jurisdiction over criminal acts perpetrated by Silsby in Haiti. We have already Kidnapping, Attempted Kidnapping, Conspiracy to Kidnap, Wire Fraud, Obstruction of Justice (lies to Haitian authorities) and others yet to be named. (Got any more, Pink?)

Extraterritorial jurisdiction has always been tricky to get ones’ arms around. Usually it requires one of those “Offense Against All crimes”, your genocide, war crimes etc.

It seems to me, however, that a firm basis for US federal jurisdiction can be made on the basis of Silsby‘s acts committed in her travels back and forth to Haiti organizing the conspiracy as well as the use of an instrumentality of interstate commerce to carry out her acts. I suggest Mail Fraud, the use of cell phone calls back and forth and passport usage. I can’t wait for the federal marshals to pick her up at the Miami Airport and escort her to a nicer jail cell there to await her enablers to bail her out.

Want to weigh in here, Pink?

i.b.nora
02-27-2010, 07:43 PM
I hope none of the Idaho, Texas, or Kansas Baptists are planning any trips to Chile in the next few days.

Missizzy
02-27-2010, 07:45 PM
Already said and duly noted over here at our house!! We do think alike.

jeff_jones
02-27-2010, 10:45 PM
I hope none of the Idaho, Texas, or Kansas Baptists are planning any trips to Chile in the next few days.

I don't think they will venture into unknown territory anytime soon!
Did you notice that Jim Allen mentioned early on in one of the many interviews that he'd never left the country? Yet was at Miami airport with only 48hrs notice? That expedited passport surely wasn't cheap.
The lawyer, Hiram Sasser, gives me the creeps. If I'd been in jail for 3 weeks in Haiti, I'd stay home, enjoy my family and rest, instead of being paraded by such a clown.

i.b.nora
02-27-2010, 11:48 PM
I don't think they will venture into unknown territory anytime soon!
Did you notice that Jim Allen mentioned early on in one of the many interviews that he'd never left the country? Yet was at Miami airport with only 48hrs notice? That expedited passport surely wasn't cheap.
The lawyer, Hiram Sasser, gives me the creeps. If I'd been in jail for 3 weeks in Haiti, I'd stay home, enjoy my family and rest, instead of being paraded by such a clown.
You know, I did take notice of the fact that he said he had never left the country before, and wondered myself about the passport deal. I also wondered about shots that one might need when traveling to the DR and to Haiti. Sometimes, depending on the type of shot, you have to get one and then get a followup a week later.
And, I couldn't agree with you more about Hiram Sasser. Its too bad that Jim is just too dumb to realize how he has allowed himself to be used by everyone.

Missizzy
03-01-2010, 03:00 AM
I've wondered for quite some time about the schedule of recommended vaccines to enter Haiti--especially right before the rainy season. This is the CDC link we were given by Burners Without Borders (my husband got all his so he's ready to go when his time comes up):

http://wwwnc.cdc.gov/travel/content/news-announcements/relief-workers-haiti.aspx

You are correct, i.b.nora, in that several of the vaccines are recommended to have done separately. It's just not healthy to go in and get the whole deal in one day. When our family went to Bioxi for Katrina clean-up in September, it took three days to get all the shots. We also took Tamiflu and antibiotics just in case.


On another issue, I found an audio report from a woman who recently interviewed Laura and Charisa. She describes the jail they are held in. Click on the box (WBBM/Audio Now) at the upper left hand side. And make note about what she says about Charisa. This is getting stranger by the day. Is Charisa known to have cognitive issues or a mental illness? I know she's diabetic but that wouldn't cause the behaviors that she is exhibiting. If she has mental and/or physical challenges, it seems really slimy of Laura to drag her through all this. Did anyone read any info about her before it all disappeared? Interests, education, etc? Anybody have any theories?

http://www.wbbm780.com/topic/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=4428950

Yes, a link might be helpful. LOL

i.b.nora
03-01-2010, 12:57 PM
http://www.wbbm780.com/topic/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=4428950

pinkpuddytat
03-01-2010, 05:59 PM
The real question remaining, if and when Silsby is released, is whether the United States can claim jurisdiction over criminal acts perpetrated by Silsby in Haiti. . . . Want to weigh in here, Pink?

Why bother? She's committed enough criminal and civil offenses in the US to lock her up for a good while and heavily garnish any income she may have in the future. Her "business" appears to have been a financial fraud from the very beginning, or at least soon after, with plenty of interstate fraud, given that most of investors and creditors were outside Idaho. And then there's little matter of collecting donations (again from multiple states) with the false claim that her "charity" qualified for tax deductions. And even a remotely competent lawyer to dig up plenty of evidence that she induced her naive band of volunteers to accompany her overseas under false pretenses, thus causing them significant financial and reputational harm -- huge civil judgements there, and possible some criminal ones as well, since she put these people in serious physical danger through her lies to them. They just need to get one criminal financial fraud conviction on her, and she'll never be able to get any sort of personal or business credit again in her life, other than from kneecap-smashing loan sharks (and with her judgement skills, she'll probably waste no time getting involved with such "lenders"). For icing on the cake, her husband has presumably won the custody battle over their children hands down and permanently, and her children are perfectly clear on what sort of lying loser their mother is.

truckbomb
03-01-2010, 10:19 PM
I knew I could count on Pink for his usual penetrating insight. All points well taken, civil and criminal.

Missizzy
03-01-2010, 10:33 PM
Pink, if you would be so kind....can you explain why John Duarte was extradited to Canada for crimes against Haitian kids, instead of to Haiti. He was held in a DR jail (in Puerto Plata...hmmm) until he was transported back to Canada late last year, before the earthquake.

Does it follow that Silsby could be charged for her crimes against Haitian children and families (misrepresenting where the children were going and the possibility of ongoing contact) in the US?

pinkpuddytat
03-02-2010, 01:01 AM
I knew I could count on Pink for his usual penetrating insight.

FYI, "Pink" is a she.

pinkpuddytat
03-02-2010, 01:29 AM
Pink, if you would be so kind....can you explain why John Duarte was extradited to Canada for crimes against Haitian kids, instead of to Haiti. He was held in a DR jail (in Puerto Plata...hmmm) until he was transported back to Canada late last year, before the earthquake.

Does it follow that Silsby could be charged for her crimes against Haitian children and families (misrepresenting where the children were going and the possibility of ongoing contact) in the US?

Sorry, I'm not familiar with the Duarte case at all, so couldn't speculate. There are very few situations where crimes committed in a foreign country can be prosecuted. We do have some fairly recent "sexual tourism" laws that allow for prosecution in the US of US citizens who travel to foreign countries for the purpose of sexual activities with children, but Silsby & Co. certainly don't qualify under that. I think if she's to be criminally charged, it will be for things she did in the US, but prosecutors could get pretty creative about that if they wanted to. She's presumably lied to Idaho courts repeatedly, in connection with all her unpaid wage judgements, and that alone could get her locked up for quite a while. On a related note, she's also almost certainly diverted funds that came into her business, in violation of the court orders to apply all excess funds to the wage judgements. This could theoretically earn her quite a bit more lock-up time.

The issue becomes whether it's worth mountains of taxpayer money to undertake a complex prosecution of this washed-up scammer or to provide her with shelter and 3 square meals a day for years in prison. It doesn't appear she has any assets to speak of, so restitution for crimes just isn't going to happen, much less are her creditors and unpaid former employees ever going to see more than token payments toward what they're owed. It's not worth spending any more than necessary to make sure she does some serious prison time and is left with a record that will preclude her from getting into a position to commit any significant financial fraud in the future. They might be able to yank her passport for a few years, based on her having used it to travel to a foreign country for the purpose of committing crimes.

In reality, she's likely to end up doing fairly little prison time, and then hook up with some new boyfriend who's a small time scammer/hustler and be his gofer and maid in exchange for a roof over her head and enough money to eat and a shared set of wheels. She'll go back to using her maiden name to try to avoid being identified as who she really is. Her options for legitimate employment will be pretty limited, especially in this economy. I suppose she might be able to get a job waiting tables at a truck stop, but somehow I don't think she'd behave herself well enough to last more than a few days. If she ever manages to get and keep a legitimate job, her wages will be heavily garnished for the rest of her life to pay off the wage claim judgements, and probably some civil judgements from the hapless volunteers (though most of them sound like they'd have trouble scrounging up money for a lawyer to bring suit, and with Silsby looking unlikely to ever have any significant assets, the contingent-fee lawyers won't be interested).

truckbomb
03-02-2010, 02:57 AM
Truck stands corrected, O Pink.

Actually, I favor the federal crimes like Wire and Mail fraud.

Now that Truck has communicated via email directly with Puello I am getting all sorts of self exculpatory text, some in english, some from his mom. Where in the world is Puello? My bet - DR.

It is now Wednesday, Silsby and lapdog are still guests of the Haitian government with rations and lodging provided for free, All's right with the World. So much for her lawyer claiming that she would be out by early this week at the latest.

Missizzy
03-02-2010, 03:42 AM
Personally, I don't think the truck stop gig would work for long as she'd pull the hand over the heart trick every time she screwed up somebody's breakfast order. Nobody's gonna forget that vision.

pinkpuddytat
03-02-2010, 03:46 PM
Now that Truck has communicated via email directly with Puello I am getting all sorts of self exculpatory text, some in english, some from his mom. Where in the world is Puello? My bet - DR.

It is now Wednesday, Silsby and lapdog are still guests of the Haitian government with rations and lodging provided for free, All's right with the World. So much for her lawyer claiming that she would be out by early this week at the latest.

I'm having trouble believing that Puello is actually doing all this website posting and e-mailing without Interpol having traced his location by now. I think either they already know where he is and are waiting for some reason, or he's got one or more other people who are actually doing the posting for him (perhaps with him dictating by phone, or perhaps just saying whatever they think will protect him and confuse investigators).

The Haitian government knows how to feed and house prisoners a lot more cheaply than any US federal or state government. They could teach us a lot about this if we'd let them . . .

Missizzy
03-02-2010, 04:05 PM
Pink--If you are interested, here's the case of Father John Duarte. He's the Canadian who abused Haitian teens for years and then fled to the DR. He was extradited to Canada for trial last fall. My first guess was that Canada wanted him for fraud as he'd raised enormous amounts of money for his charity and garnered numerous awards. But this article is very clear in that he's being tried in Canada for crimes against children in Haiti. Why couldn't the US do this with Silsby?

http://www.windsorstar.com/life/Former+Windsor+priest+John+Duarte+arraigned+child+ molestation+charges/2151232/story.html

"....Duarte is charged under the Criminal Code with nine counts of sexual exploitation of boys between 12 and 17. The offences were alleged to have taken place in the Haitian capital of Port-au-Prince and the tiny fishing village of Labadie, on the island’s northern coast, between 1995 and 2006. A news release issued by the Dominican Immigration Office and National Drug Control Directorate said Duarte was arrested Oct. 20 by Dominican police at the request of a Canadian Embassy pertaining to a warrant issued in Canada in August.

The Dominican release said Duarte was arrested on information from Canadian investigators that he had been seeking sexual encounters with adolescent Haitian males in exchange for favours, such as buying them clothing or paying for better lodging for the victims’ families, many of whom lived in the sprawling slums of the Haitian capital or in the impoverished villages where Duarte set up his mission......"


This article describes his arrest in Puerto Plata:

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/windsor/story/2009/10/22/windsor-priest-arrested-091022.html

"....Father Joao José Correira Duarte, also known as John, 43, was arrested Tuesday at a hotel in Puerto Plata, Hoy Digital, a Spanish-language news website based in Santo Domingo, D.R........"


FWIW, this is the first time I've notice this name being used. I've always seen "John Duarte".

i.b.nora
03-02-2010, 10:26 PM
Two women from Idaho won't be released from Haitian jail today, officials say (http://www.idahostatesman.com/2010/03/02/1101587/two-women-from-idaho-wont-be-released.html)

BY KATY MOELLER - Idahostatesman
Published: 03/02/10

"Treasure Valley residents Laura Silsby and Charisa Coulter will spend another night in a Haitian jail, as a judge reviews records related to their involvement in trying to bus 33 children from Haiti to the Dominican Republic in late January."

""The depositions were taken this afternoon. The embassy was hoping for a release. The judge is reviewing the documents, but he will not make a decision today," said Brad Hoaglun, a spokesman in U.S. Sen. Jim Risch's office.

"We're hopeful for tomorrow," Hoaglun said.

Saint-Vil told the Associated Press he is consulting with prosecutors on the charges against Laura Silsby and Charisa Coulter.

Saint-Vil had said earlier he would probably order their release after Tuesday's hearing. He declined to explain the delay."

truckbomb
03-02-2010, 11:04 PM
"We're hopeful for tomorrow," Hoaglun said.

Saint-Vil told the Associated Press he is consulting with prosecutors on the charges against Laura Silsby and Charisa Coulter.

"Consulting with prosecutors on the charges."

My Translation: The game is for the judge to be the Good Guy stringing Silsby's lawyer along and the Bad Guy prosecutor steps in and 'advises' the judge there really are criminal acts by Silsby that should be taken to trial. The Good Guy judge will go along with this cover and Silsby is in for the whole thing.

Missizzy
03-03-2010, 12:55 PM
Nope, not today....sorry ladies.

http://www.kboi2.com/news/86025392.html

Haiti judge not ready to release two Idaho missionaries

"Two Americans still jailed on kidnapping charges in Haiti will have to wait for their freedom. The judge says he is not ready to release his decision after holding a final hearing.

Judge Bernard Saint-Vil tells The Associated Press he is consulting with prosecutors on the charges against Laura Silsby and Charisa Coulter.

Saint-Vil had said earlier he would probably order their release after Tuesday's hearing. He declined to explain the delay...."

truckbomb
03-03-2010, 07:05 PM
Laura Silsby tells The Associated Press from behind bars she doesn't think they will be there "much longer."

She told The Associated Press from her jail cell that she and nanny Charisa Coulter expect to be released soon, but would both readily come back despite their troubles here.

"Oh yes, both of us would come back to Haiti because there is so much need here, especially for the children," Silsby told an AP reporter at the airport-side police station where they are being held.


The judge told AP on Tuesday he is awaiting a recommendation from prosecutors. He says he could order their release even if authorities decide to continue investigating.

Get used to your quarters ladies, the judge is still playing stringalong.

Your ploy promising that you guys would come back is not going to work. I haven't seen such foolishness since Beavis and Butthead were around.

Missizzy
03-03-2010, 07:28 PM
After throwing that little threat down, I would think that Judge Sain-vil would be tempted to keep the women in jail as it's far better than having them boomerang back to try this again.

I've heard that legal consultations can be quite time consuming in Haiti.

Annie Mouse
03-03-2010, 09:51 PM
"Oh yes, both of us would come back to Haiti because there is so much need here, especially for the children," Silsby told an AP reporter at the airport-side police station where they are being held.

"We would definitely come back to help them once this misunderstanding or whatever you want to call it is sorted out."

"

...and this is why they need to be prosecuted. Their kind are unteachable. They're predators. Lock 'em up.

Missizzy
03-03-2010, 10:02 PM
As a beloved and revered judge once said to me, about one of my very special needs children, "Sometimes, all society can do is sanction them."

So true.

pinkpuddytat
03-04-2010, 01:36 AM
But this article is very clear in that he's being tried in Canada for crimes against children in Haiti. Why couldn't the US do this with Silsby?

We can only charge Silsby under US law with violating a US law. Canada is apparently using a Canadian law similar to the one the US has, making it a crime to travel abroad for the purpose of engaging in sexual activity with children. However, there's not a hint of evidence that Silsby had intention of doing that, nor that she had any specific intention of helping anyone else to do that. We don't have a US law making it a crime for US citizens to go abroad to try to kidnap children for phony orphanages. Even the law we have is an aberration -- there are very few laws (in the US or elsewhere) that make it a crime in one's country of origin to go commit a crime in some other country.

Such a law was enacted in the US (and apparently Canada as well) for the "child sex tourism" problem because it's so huge, and many of the "hosting" countries are ill-equipped to prosecute such cases. Places like Thailand and the Philippines just don't have the resources to prosecute the thousands of "child sex tourists" who come to their countries every year -- they're busy trying to deal with the economic issues that result in an endless stream of parents either selling their children to brothels, or encouraging their children to do this sort of "work" (from what I understand, the former scenario dominates in Thailand, and the latter dominates in the Philippines). The result was a steady round-trip flow of vile child rapists running off on trips to commit their crimes and coming back to run around the US with spotless criminal records and no registered sex offender status, even though it was perfectly clear what they were doing on their frequent trips abroad, and relatively easy to prove in court.

Missizzy
03-04-2010, 05:25 AM
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2010/03/03/1103264/attorney-for-laura-silsby-personal.html

Attorney for Laura Silsby, Personal Shopper in civil suit files motion to withdraw as counsel

"Gerald T. Husch, the attorney who was representing Personal Shopper Inc. and Laura Silsby in a civil suit filed by a former employee of the company who said she's owed thousands in unpaid wages, filed a motion this week to withdraw as counsel in the case...."

and

"Personal Shopper, a Boise-based online business, and its president were sued by Robin Oliver, the former marketing director for Personal Shopper, claimed in suit filed in October that the company owes her $22,916 in unpaid wages...."


more at link

Missizzy
03-04-2010, 05:42 AM
This was added on 2/28/10 to:

http://www.haitivoxbulletin.com/

The trafficker with a heart

"Born in Yonkers, US, the 32-year old Puello has been living in the Dominican Republic and dabbled in different businesses, including real estate. His most recent real estate activity, was, he claims, related to the construction of the modern, high-rise Santo Domingo Madison Towers in the exclusive Skyscraper City zone of El Naco, in Santo Domingo.(8) His Puello Real Estate Group advertises itself as a Developer-Builder company, represented by Jorge or Alejandro Puello, his cousin. That company also engaged in low-income apartment buildings and rentals. An internet site confirms that his firm was representing this building.

As it turns out, his cousin Alejandro is the lawyer in the family. But when reporters came to call upon him recently, he claimed no knowledge of why his on-the-lam cousin Jorge would pretend to be a lawyer and why he’d meddle in the affairs of a missionary group dabbling in orphan work. Further media conversations with Puello’s mother and stepfather confirmed Jorge’s a wanted man -- a wayward son in his mother’s eyes. She remains certain – at least to reporters – that Jorge cannot be guilty of those things he stands accused of – including sexual trafficking. But there’s no question her son has spent time in jail, and is accused of having helped people illegally cross borders and possessing false documents -- and that his wife is in jail.

Puello is also a practicing and passionate Orthodox Jew – a self-proclaimed convert to Judaism who goes by the name Yoram Migdal. He bills himself as the President of the Sephardic community in the Dominican Republic. In interviews, leading members of the Jewish community there now disclaim much knowledge or any active association with Puello, though he has davened (prayed) with them. An investigation by Haiti Vox found that Puello had registered a similarly named Sephardic company in Miami that law enforcement officials believe might have been a cover for his Internet escort business.

and

"During our conversation, Silsby told me [d'Adesky] what she later told others (or some variation thereof): that she had secured ‘permission’ from a Dominican ‘minister’ to bring the children into the Dominican Republic. When I politely informed her that Haitian authority and documents were still surely required, since these were Haitian children, she smiled while dismissing my concern. “I’ve been assured we can bring the children in,” she told me. In fact, the documents were being drawn up as we spoke. Her colleague was on the computer communicating with the individuals preparing the paperwork for her.

What confused me then, and has clearly continued to bother Haitian Judge Saint-Vil, is that Silsby appeared to be randomly trying to gather up any child in her path while on her Haiti mission, though adoption papers require a child’s name to be on the document. How could the papers be drawn up if she didn’t know what children she would be finding? I assumed at the time that she had the names of some children, and was planning to, well, wing it with any others.

When I pressed her at the time about the nature of the paperwork, or the name or identity of the ‘minister,’ she demurred. I was not certain if she was referring to a government minister, or a religious one (or both?)."

and

"What gave her confidence, I saw, was the ‘letter of authorization’ she had from her Dominican ‘minister.’ She also implied that she had ‘connections’ to help her with the border crossing.

Another thing Silsby kept stressing was that the New Life group ‘was different’ from all the other adoption agencies working in Haiti. They didn’t plan to take the children out of the Dominican Republic, she told me. That’s why the Dominicans had agreed to help her, she explained. She said she had contacts helping her in Haiti, and planned to target ‘native’ Haitian-run orphanages where, she felt (or had been told), those in charge could no longer care for the children because their facilities had been damaged."


There's much much more at link. Some info we've seen, but a lot has been added.

Missizzy
03-04-2010, 06:01 AM
More from the above link. This woman has done A LOT of research into this case. I wonder if Judge Sain-vil has subpoenaed her?

"Yoram Migdal [ETA Jorege Puello] directly answered my questions, and when I doubted his answers, he provided further hard copy evidence to back them up. These include a PDF of a bank statement and copies of email mail exchanges between him and Sean Lankford, one of the relatives of the Idaho clan who is his main contact with the group.

These emails confirm without question that they are coming from Jorge Puello – the information in them is very specific. The email exchanges between Puello and Lankford are also very current, revealing a very active communication between them. This is in contrast with claims made recently by lawyers for the Idaho relatives: that they have had little to do with Puello.

The most significant information is Puello’s allegation that other Dominicans helped Silsby -- corrupt individuals, he claims, who he feels likely duped and betrayed her. If his finger-pointing pans out, then Laura Silsby was seeking help from high-level Dominicans in politics and the government. And – if he’s right - one of them is a woman who was fired in 2007 after her subordinate was found guilty of trafficking persons across the border. These are serious allegations that merit investigation. If they are true, it suggests that Silsby was getting help from people who might have been seeking to help her break the law. Nothing in Puello’s statements implicates Silsby herself directly in trafficking."

and

"In response to questions, Puello states that he was put in contact by Silsby with a woman lawyer. The name he provided matches that of a high ranking lawyer and provincial district attorney who is active in Dominican politics. He claims that he contacted this woman when he noticed her name on some legal documents connected to Silsby. When he talked to this lawyer, the women told Puello that Silsby was supposed to go to the border where “the papers were going to be there, ready.” But when the lawyer contact learned that Silsby had been detained, she “got nervous and hung up,” claims Puello. His statements about a ‘General’ helping Silsby also matched Silby’s original statements to me, the night of our meeting, about a Dominican ‘minister’ who was helping her, and had given her his personal assurance her group would have no trouble getting into the Dominican Republic."



What follows is a verbatim exchange between Puello and d'Adesky. It is quite interesting and seems to implicate a number of high ranking people. This is so obviously NOT a single woman's knee-jerk rescue response to run off to Haiti and save the babies. I don't envy Judge Sain-vil in digging to bottom of this muck.

i.b.nora
03-05-2010, 02:52 PM
I saw that d'Adesky article when she first published it, and I have to say I am not that taken with her "investigations". She is in serious need of an editor for her writing. Her first article that she wrote about meeting Silsby in the hotel was interesting but her subsequent writings on the topic have not been um, not that good, imo.

Anyhow, its Friday and today in Haiti, we have:

Idaho missionary meets privately with Haiti judge (http://www.ktvb.com/news/Idaho-missionaries-likely-to-stay-in-Haiti-jail-through-weekend-86621982.html)
by Associated Press & NBC
Posted on March 5, 2010 at 10:31 AM
Updated today at 11:32 AM

The highlights:

"For the two Idaho missionaries still in Haiti it looks like it might be another weekend behind bars."

"Silsby and Coulter were back in court Friday. Silsby has been behind closed doors with the judge for about two hours, while Coulter was kept in a waiting room.

The judge previously said he would release the two but this week made his recommendation to the proseuctor, who says he has some issues with it.

The judge and the prosecutor have to clear up those issues before a final ruling can be made.

NBC reported last night about alleged illegal travel documents being investigated by the prosecutor. Those documents or lack of them is the hold up now."

truckbomb
03-05-2010, 06:55 PM
The judge previously said he would release the two but this week made his recommendation to the proseuctor, who says he has some issues with it. The judge and the prosecutor have to clear up those issues before a final ruling can be made.

NBC is reporting the two women returned to jail Friday and their reporter in Haiti believes that Coulter will be released on Monday.

What did I say? The prosecutor has issues? Of course he does. So do I. The lapdog Coulter may get released . I am OK wth that. She is just a tool anyhow. But Sislby is in for the long haul.

Illegal travel docs is the issue for the two but Silsby stays but not Coulter? I would love to know about that.

truckbomb
03-05-2010, 08:30 PM
Latest news

A Haitian judge on Friday signed an order to free one of two U.S. missionaries imprisoned on child kidnapping charges, but a paperwork problem delayed her release.
............
The order will allow U.S. citizen Charisa Coulter to leave the Caribbean nation but the leader of the group of missionaries, Laura Silsby, was to remain in jail, said judge Bernard Sainvil.

Coulter was returned to custody on Friday because court administrators could not find an official stamp necessary to validate the judge's signed order, Sainvil said.

"I already signed the release order. All that is left now is to seal it but they cannot find the official stamp," he said.

There was no chance that Coulter would be released before Monday, chief prosecutor Joseph Manes Louis told Reuters.

"I returned the order to the judge because there is an administrative problem. Once the problem is solved I will proceed according to the law," he said.The prosecutor now has Silsby on hold. Why?


Silsby was being held for further investigation.]

"coult not find the official stamp" How funny. Poor Coulter. Two more days because they cannot find the stamp. Rich.

But Silsby is another matter.

Things do not look good for our girl. Coulter gets out maybe Monday but Butthead stays in?

All's right with the world.

Missizzy
03-05-2010, 09:39 PM
If you are willing to wade through the meandering and overly long posting on haitivox concerning the Baptist Debacle, you will read about the mystery of the illegal travel docs which seemingly originated in the DR.

All...but for a stamp. Hmmmm

i.b.nora
03-06-2010, 12:20 AM
I am thinking that Coulter won't get out until Tuesday since they will need Monday to look for that official stamp. It probably won't turn up until late in the day on Monday, thus requiring one more day in jail.
Also, probably our State Department will be involved in at least helping her to leave the country safely, so to speak. They will need some time to make those arrangements. If it is like the other eight criminals, they will only take her to Florida. Maybe her mommy and daddy can meet her there.

Missizzy
03-06-2010, 01:21 AM
i.b.nora--I'm afraid you're forgetting the young lady has diabetes. My guess is that she's gonna demand some sort of medical transport out due to her medical fragility. You're really forgetting how delicate she looked when she entered court last week. Downright frail. You know she might get hypoglycemic.

My suggestion would be to give her a bottle of Gatorade, a few pkgs. of peanut butter crackers and stick her on the next cargo plane out. I am very offended by her rude and disrespectful attitude to her hosts. She had a fan and quilts to lie on. If anyone wants to see what a typical Haitian prison looks like from the inside, go to Youtube and search for:

"In focus Haiti: House call in Hell"

The Baptists have had preferential treatment, I'd say.

Texas Mist
03-06-2010, 01:27 AM
http://www.smileyhut.com/laughing/rofl.gif

A stamp!! That's good - yeah - I like it! :applause:

i.b.nora
03-08-2010, 04:48 PM
I guess someone found the official stamp.

Monday March 8, 2010

Haiti releases one of last two U.S. missionaries (http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2010-03-08-Haiti_N.htm)

"PORT-AU-PRINCE, Haiti (AP) — Haitian authorities have released one of the last two U.S. Baptist missionaries jailed for trying to take orphans out of the country after the earthquake.

Charisa Coulter left her cell Monday accompanied staff of the U.S. Embassy."

i.b.nora
03-08-2010, 04:59 PM
From The Raw Story:
One of two arrested US missionaries released in Haiti: (http://rawstory.com/news/afp/One_of_two_arrested_US_missionaries_03082010.html)

"Haitian authorities on Monday released one of two US missionaries they had been holding on child abduction charges, while keeping the leader of the group in custody.

Charisa Coulter, 24, was handed over to US embassy personnel who drove her away from the police station where she had been detained. She made no comment to waiting media.

Her companion and employer, Laura Silsby, 40, remained in detention."

From CNN:
American missionary held in Haiti released (http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/americas/03/08/haiti.americans.detained/?hpt=Sbin)

"Port-au-Prince, Haiti (CNN) -- Charisa Coulter, one of two Americans detained for more than a month in Haiti on suspicion of kidnapping 33 children following January 12's devastating earthquake, was released Monday.

She walked out of judicial police headquarters and headed to the nearby airport Monday afternoon.

Attorneys Chillier Roi and Ricardo Chachoute, who are representing Coulter and the American who still is being detained, Laura Silsby, earlier told CNN that the judge had OK'd Coulter's release."

Missizzy
03-08-2010, 05:00 PM
It's hard to talk while you're popping your gum. Snarky but true.

truckbomb
03-08-2010, 05:19 PM
Silsby went to court on Monday but was due to return to jail as an investigating judge looks into a new charge that she was trying to organize travel from Haiti for others without proper papers, a lesser crime under Haitian law.

From Haiti for others????
What am I missing? What others? The so-called orphans? If so this would be the rationale for a lesser offense for Silsby's acts than kidnapping. Why was this not reported then as Silsby didn't get the local paperwork set up to transport the children out of Haiti?

This is like saying the bank robber didn't bother to get withdrawal receipts.

pinkpuddytat
03-08-2010, 06:00 PM
Coulter was returned to custody on Friday because court administrators could not find an official stamp necessary to validate the judge's signed order, Sainvil said.

"I already signed the release order. All that is left now is to seal it but they cannot find the official stamp," he said.

There was no chance that Coulter would be released before Monday, chief prosecutor Joseph Manes Louis told Reuters.


LOL!

Translation: It's Friday. The guy who has the stamp went home early because he's got better things to do. And none of us have any intention of bothering him over his extended weekend on account of this idiot American girl. We don't give a crap where she spends her weekend.

pinkpuddytat
03-08-2010, 06:07 PM
She had a fan and quilts to lie on. If anyone wants to see what a typical Haitian prison looks like from the inside, go to Youtube and search for:

"In focus Haiti: House call in Hell"

The Baptists have had preferential treatment, I'd say.

Never mind Haitian prisons. These two idiots have been enjoying *far* better accommodations and meals than the average *free* Haitian in earthquake-affected parts of the country, many of whom had their homes turned to rubble (in some cases with dead relatives' bodies trapped inside) and have had to rely on unpredictable and insufficient food handouts by aid organizations.

Now dimwit Charisa gets to go home and look for a job, because Silsby's obviously in no position to support her anymore. Given the realistic view of her employment prospects, I expect her mommy and daddy better get used to supporting their little darling again. Payback for not raising her right . . .

pinkpuddytat
03-08-2010, 07:09 PM
From Haiti for others????
What am I missing? What others? The so-called orphans? If so this would be the rationale for a lesser offense for Silsby's acts than kidnapping. Why was this not reported then as Silsby didn't get the local paperwork set up to transport the children out of Haiti?

I assume the "others" refers to the orphans. Sounds to me like they're loathe to just let her go without pressing any charges at all, since she's obviously a criminal, so they're trying to contrive a lesser charge.

truckbomb
03-08-2010, 09:36 PM
Pink, even if the plea deal is a softball slap on the wrist will Silsby sell out her claim that she is doing "God's Work?" How can she admit to a criminal act in furtherance of "God's Plan?"

My prediction on the plea deal -------->

1. admit to the charge of attemping to transport children our of the country without authority.

2. Sentenced to time served.

3. Agree never to set foot in the country again (most important for the judge and everyone else).

Will she take it?

truckbomb
03-08-2010, 09:57 PM
This just in - From the Huffingtonpost

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/03/08/haiti-frees-ninth-accused_n_490594.html

After a court hearing Monday for Silsby, Judge Bernard Saint-Vil said he heard evidence from a police officer who said he stopped Silsby from loading a bus with children near the Dominican Republic consulate in Port-au-Prince on Jan. 26. That was three days before her group was arrested while trying to cross into the Dominican Republic with 33 children.

"I found inconsistencies in some of Laura's statements," Saint-Vil told reporters, saying he planned to visit the Dominican consulate to resolve them.

Going off to the DR counsulate to resolve the inconsistencies? Looks like the judge is not buying into Silsby's lies.

I would love to know which lies he is looking into.

Just hang in there Laura, you are not going anywhere soon.

i.b.nora
03-08-2010, 11:23 PM
Sara Sidner, a reporter for CNN had the opportunity to ask Silsby a few questions today after today's hearing with the judge. I have to say, Silsby has a really peculiar way of speaking. This is the first time I have had the chance to hear her speak in full sentences and answer more than just one question.

So, with that said, Charisa Coulter has landed!!! She has made it to Miami.

"The 25-year-old Baptist missionary who had been held on kidnapping charges in Haiti has been released and flew into Miami Monday.

Charisa Coulter's father Mel told the Associated Press that his daughter had gone to her hotel and did not say when she would return to Idaho."

tiny article: http://cbs4.com/local/missionary.baptist.haiti.2.1546609.html

Missizzy
03-09-2010, 04:11 PM
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2010/03/09/1110286/coulter-has-mixed-emotions.html#storylink=omni_popular

Coulter has 'mixed emotions' about her release from a Haiti jail


"....She sounds good," Mel Coulter said. "I know that she is very tired, but at the same time she is very happy to be back. She has very mixed emotions; it's like she's left part of herself still in Haiti with Laura (Silsby) behind....."

and

"....We're very concerned about (Laura's) kids and about Laura's condition in the jail," Coulter said. "This is the first time she is going to be by herself in the jail cell. It's got to be an extremely lonely feeling......"



What kids are they talking about? Aren't Laura's children with their father? Are they speaking of the Haitian children as "Laura's kids"? If so, I'm ticked. Those are NOT Laura's kids!!

truckbomb
03-09-2010, 07:22 PM
The (Idaho) Statesman asked Mayra Joli, a Coral Gables, Fla., expert in the Haitian legal system who is licensed to practice law in the United States and the Dominican Republic, to help interpret the events.
....

Q: What is the likelihood that Laura Silsby will be released?

A: It would be unconstitutional for one to stay behind on the same charges after all the others have been released. There would have to be new charges against her.

And, of course, so there will be. Lying to the investigating judge is an obstruction of justice even in Haiti. Fraud, in the attempt to take children out of the country without authority, is a criminal act.

When the judge gets back from the DR Counsulate let's see if he lowers the boom on Laura Butthead.

Annie Mouse
03-10-2010, 08:19 AM
When the judge gets back from the DR Consulate let's see if he lowers the boom on Laura B

I have to agree with you. If I were the prosecutor, I'd be trying to figure out how to keep Laura Silsby from making good on her threat to return to Haiti.

Silsby lied so often, about so much. There have to be plenty of charges to pin on her.

Silsby is openly unrepentant. If she gets away with what she's done, she'll be back to do worse. She'll claim lack of prosecution as proof of total vindication, and the crackpots back in Idaho will agree with her. Silsby has to be prosecuted, so that there can be grounds to deny her entry to Haiti.

pinkpuddytat
03-10-2010, 02:53 PM
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2010/03/09/1110286/coulter-has-mixed-emotions.html#storylink=omni_popular

Coulter has 'mixed emotions' about her release from a Haiti jail


"....She sounds good," Mel Coulter said. "I know that she is very tired, but at the same time she is very happy to be back. She has very mixed emotions; it's like she's left part of herself still in Haiti with Laura (Silsby) behind....."

and

"....We're very concerned about (Laura's) kids and about Laura's condition in the jail," Coulter said. "This is the first time she is going to be by herself in the jail cell. It's got to be an extremely lonely feeling......"

What kids are they talking about? Aren't Laura's children with their father? Are they speaking of the Haitian children as "Laura's kids"? If so, I'm ticked. Those are NOT Laura's kids!!

Since the reference to "(Laura's) kids" apparently had the parenthesized Laura inserted by the article writer, I wouldn't read too much into that statement. If "(Laura's)" replaced "her", then it was probably a reference to her own children -- remember Charisa was their nanny, at least when the kids were with Laura, and I'm sure they're upset and confused about all the revelations in the national and global media about their mother's "mission" to Haiti and all her business and financial troubles back home, as well as about the fact that their mother is still being held in a Haitian jail. If "(Laura's)" replaced "the", then it was probably a reference to the children taken off the bus, some of whom still hadn't been returned to their parents, last I heard.

But Mel is obviously loony, talking about Laura as if she's a wonderful friend to his daughter, when it's plain to see that she's a scam artist who dragged his daughter into a huge mess.

pinkpuddytat
03-10-2010, 03:04 PM
And, of course, so there will be. Lying to the investigating judge is an obstruction of justice even in Haiti.

I wouldn't be surprised if that's what they end up formally focusing on. But she sure has provided them with a generous array of options. And thankfully, the US officials have made it very clear that Haiti can do pretty much whatever it likes with Silsby, at whatever pace it likes.

Anybody heard anything from Jorge recently, or has he gone to ground? If I was in charge of investigating this, determining whether Silsby and Jorge were in contact prior to the arrests would be a high priority. I still strongly suspect that they were.

i.b.nora
03-10-2010, 09:48 PM
Eviction hearing scheduled for Laura Silsby's company, Personal Shopper Inc. (http://www.idahostatesman.com/2010/03/10/1112778/eviction-hearing-scheduled-for.html)

By KATY MOELLER - idahostatesman.com
Published: 03/10/10

"The Sundance Company, manager of the offices leased by Boise-based Personal Shopper Inc., has filed a civil suit against the company, and an eviction hearing has been set for Thursday next week."

and

"Court documents show that Personal Shopper Chief Operating Officer Nicole E. Gehring said that Jack is owed $1,535.40 for hours worked and $1,326.51 for vacation -- if he resigns. In the Feb. 22 document, she said he had not resigned and had not returned a company laptop computer.

Jack, who was a customer care manager, told the Idaho Statesman Wednesday that he had neither quit nor been fired from the company. A mediation hearing has been set for April 29; if the mediation fails, a trial will be held the same day.

Jack said he recently got a letter informing him of the cancellation of his health care benefits. He said another employee of the company told him that all employees had lost their health benefits, though that could not be confirmed Wednesday. Gehring did not return a call for comment."

There is more but the above is most important and new ...

Missizzy
03-11-2010, 02:13 AM
http://www.haitivox.com/

Wednesday, March 10, 2010

Silsby update: And then there was one... or even more

pinkpuddytat
03-11-2010, 10:09 PM
Jack said he recently got a letter informing him of the cancellation of his health care benefits. He said another employee of the company told him that all employees had lost their health benefits, though that could not be confirmed Wednesday. Gehring did not return a call for comment."

She obviously wasn't paying the health insurance premiums AND failed to give employees any advance warning about it. I'm sure there are some federal criminal charges lurking in that mess. And of course, she's lost her health insurance too, so now you and I get to pay her medical bills, since she's officially "poor" now.

I *really* wish Haiti would just keep this woman!

Annie Mouse
03-12-2010, 11:45 AM
She obviously wasn't paying the health insurance premiums AND failed to give employees any advance warning about it. I'm sure there are some federal criminal charges lurking in that mess. And of course, she's lost her health insurance too, so now you and I get to pay her medical bills, since she's officially "poor" now.

I *really* wish Haiti would just keep this woman!

I feel for the employees, really and truly. On the other hand, at the first inkling you have that a person is probably a sociopath, your first obligation to yourself and those you love is to get as much distance between yourself and the sociopath as possible.

I hope every one of them had been searching for a new job, even with the hard economic times. Anything is better than being employed by a sociopath.

A normal person cannot anticipate exactly how an association with a sociopath will harm them. A "normal" cannot get into the head of a sociopath in any meaningful way. The only safety lies in distance.

Missizzy
03-12-2010, 12:48 PM
Annie Mouse--ITA and wish that the churches which sponsored this "debacle" would be given this same message. One thing that always bothered me is that two seemingly bright and decent pastors allowed themselves and their flocks to be pulled into this scheme.

I've been very impressed over the years at how pastors and ministers of all faiths frequently have an innate ability to "peg" people. I think they must be doing a better job in the theology colleges in covering human psychology. Being that we spotted Laura as a sociopath and possibly bipolar with borderline personality disorder, why couldn't they?

She's the proverbial flim flam girl.

Missizzy
03-12-2010, 12:50 PM
i.b.nora--You mentioned a couple of days ago that you got to hear Silsby being interviewed. I've looked for that video but not been able to find it. You mentioned that Laura had a "peculiar way of speaking". Can you expound on that. I'm really intrigued.

i.b.nora
03-12-2010, 02:01 PM
Izzy — I saw the interview on TV, I don't know if it made it to the internet.
It was Sara Sidner reporting for CNN. It was on the same day they had released Charisa and it was when Laura was leaving the place where she had attended a hearing that day.

Anyhow, best way for me to describe it was she sort of talked like Paula Abdul.
With clipped precise words.

Annie Mouse
03-12-2010, 03:33 PM
Annie Mouse--ITA and wish that the churches which sponsored this "debacle" would be given this same message. One thing that always bothered me is that two seemingly bright and decent pastors allowed themselves and their flocks to be pulled into this scheme.

I've been very impressed over the years at how pastors and ministers of all faiths frequently have an innate ability to "peg" people. I think they must be doing a better job in the theology colleges in covering human psychology. Being that we spotted Laura as a sociopath and possibly bipolar with borderline personality disorder, why couldn't they?

She's the proverbial flim flam girl.

I've seen it go both ways. Cluster B personality disorders can thrive in church. I've seen pastor's entirely fooled, and I've even seen a pastor who creeped me out with his own pathological narcissism.

If you've ever been stung by a cluster B, and boy have I, then it should feel better to realize that even the best among us can be fooled. People with cluster B personality disorders are usually pretty slick.

jeff_jones
03-12-2010, 05:31 PM
Haiti judge: New charge for US missionary leader (http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5iZVTviF3l7E29ePDsK9oLXmtXvnwD9EDAJI00)
PORT-AU-PRINCE, Haiti — The last of 10 American missionaries detained in Haiti on suspicion of kidnapping is facing a new charge.
Judge Bernard Saint-Vil says Laura Silsby has been charged for a newly discovered, alleged attempt to bus child earthquake survivors to the Dominican Republic on Jan. 26.
She already could face trial on kidnapping and criminal-association charges from her group's attempt to take 33 children across the border without permission three days later.
Saint-Vil has added the new charge of "organization of irregular trips," from a 1980 law restricting travel out of Haiti that was signed by then-dictator Jean-Claude Duvalier.
The judge said Friday he has until early May to decide whether to release Silsby or order a trial.

Annie Mouse
03-12-2010, 05:48 PM
Judge Bernard Saint-Vil is my hero. Impressive. He's found a way to be merciful toward Silsby's dupes, and still hold Silsby responsible for her behavior. Not sh****.

Missizzy
03-12-2010, 09:28 PM
I wonder if she gets to stay where she is, in the Hilton of Haitian jails, or if they'll move her?

Bastardette is reporting that Team Silsby has her own FB page. I wonder if this is a new one. I never perused the other ones that went up. Make sure you read the little "administrative note" over on the left side. Wouldn't want any un-Christian comments or anything.

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?v=wall&ref=search&gid=314881424267

I guess this one's OK to post as it's Christian enough:

"Let's pray like this: Each time we rest, let's pray that God gives Laura the Peace which passes all understanding. Each time we eat, let's pray that God multiplies the morsels in her belly as He did the loaves and fishes. As we dress, let's pray God clothes her as he did the lilies of the field. Let's pray protection over her."
Posted 3/11 by El Leoutsakos


I'd really (and I mean this respectfully) like to hear what Silsby's supporters truly think of her now. Do they think she simply dreamed too big a dream, that she's misguided, that evil forces have worked against her? Do they have doubts? Are they truly still on board? Are they standing ready to help with the next Silsby dream? I wonder.

Missizzy
03-13-2010, 03:37 AM
Snipped from the DR forum, pg. 43

http://www.dr1.com/forums/haiti-earthquake/100199-who-can-stop-tragedy-44.html


"As a result of this thread Animal Cruelty at the New Life School, Sosua I have received a PM from John Hanley, School Administrator of the New Life School Sosua, to say that his school has no connection with the organization that was involved in the Haiti Incident. He couldn't figure out where to post in this thread to have it make any sense, but gave me permission to share the information, so here it is."

Thank you for that information which I am sure we are all very pleased to hear.

Posted by Lambada 3/12

And another very "meaty" blog from Bayblovechild.org concerning Silsby with the new charges and lots of links:

http://www.babylovechild.org/2010/03/12/haiti-new-charge-brought-against-laura-silsby-organization-of-irregular-trips/

I have a strong suspicion that Ms. Silsby is going to be left sitting and waiting for quite a while.

Missizzy
03-14-2010, 05:00 AM
A link to an article concerning Puello's wife (and a photo):

http://www.elsalvador.com/mwedh/nota/nota_completa.asp?idCat=6358&idArt=4588586

Esposa de Puello a juicio por uno de tres delitos

I think this says something about three crimes and the internet and prostitution. Can someone help, please.

Puello did mention a baby girl and she is carrying an infant in a pink blanket. Maybe he actually told the truth about something.


There's been a lot of talk on the DR Forum about multiple trips to the DR by Silsby. Is anyone thinking that there could be the possibility that she actually was successful in getting some kids through the border? Who would be caring for them, though, as all the Baptists turned tail and ran home? I wonder if that could be what Mel Coulter was referring to when he said she worries about "her" kids?

This would be just one more case of Silsby leaving others to clean up her messes. One would hope that the UN, Unicef, or even the US was looking into this.

Annie Mouse
03-14-2010, 09:48 AM
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2010/03/14/1116898/home-from-haiti-coulter-wants.html


I'd really (and I mean this respectfully) like to hear what Silsby's supporters truly think of her now. Do they think she simply dreamed too big a dream, that she's misguided, that evil forces have worked against her? Do they have doubts? Are they truly still on board? Are they standing ready to help with the next Silsby dream? I wonder.


I'd say yes. I've seen churches do this before. The more mistaken they are about someone or something, the more they cling to the error. They become more and more isolated in their fanaticism, believing that anyone who contradicts their delusion is "unchristian", or even demonic. Paradoxically, the more factual information that's presented to these people, the more they'll cling to their fantasy. There's no reasoning with fanatics.

There's probably not a lot that can be done to talk sense into Silsby's dupes. The best that can be hoped for is that the judge can prevent Silsby from returning to Haiti.

truckbomb
03-14-2010, 11:03 AM
MissIzzy asks about the following article in Spanish.

http://www.elsalvador.com/mwedh/nota...&idArt=4588586


Without translating the entire article, Truckbomb gives the following free translation of the relevant facts about Puello and his wife’s troubles in court.
------------------------------------------------------------------------

The article states that Puello’s wife had a preliminary hearing in which she was bound over for trial on only one of three criminal charges, “aggravated trafficking against five children in Nicaragua”, the other two charges being dropped for the moment, in effect, a provisional probation.

For our boy Puello, the judge issued new arrest warrants against Puello stating that once the Interpol reports on his location he will issue extradition procedures. (I assume he means Puello actually captured).

Later in the article, one of the victims of the other trafficking crimes, provisionally set aside by the judge, stated that Torre Puello was just as guilty as his wife in that matter.

The wife's lawyer says that she believed her husband worked at a modeling agency. This was the hook that Puello would have used to convince the two Nicaraguan victims to enter the country through "blind spots", in May 2009.

truckbomb
03-14-2010, 11:32 AM
From the IdahoStatesman of March 14, 2010

http://www.idahostatesman.com/2010/03/14/1116898/home-from-haiti-coulter-wants.html#Comments_Container

Coulter says at her Idaho arrival:

We are 10 Christians who obeyed God's calling and we went to help the nation of Haiti and its children," Coulter said Saturday night of the group's intent following the Jan. 12 Haiti quake. "It didn’t go the way we planned. ... It’s hard to understand.

When one is a dedicated fanatic, on the order of James Jones’ “Rainbow Family” and the Kool Aid episode, one is not surprised at a comment like this. These self delusional religious nuts (as well as those permitted to comment in the Bring Silsby Home Facebook page) do not comprehend even now that they undertook a criminal enterprise and got caught in the act (in flagrante delicto, not to put a fine point on it.).

I can see it now, John Dillinger and his gang are brought in by the cops fresh from being caught red handed in the bank. Old John says to his brethren flock, “It didn’t go the way we planned. ... It’s hard to understand.”

Missizzy
03-14-2010, 08:16 PM
truck--I think the problem is that you and I have not seen the light, therefore, it is hard for us to understand. The folks on the FB page, praying up a storm, are on board and "walking in the light".

You and I and many others here on WSs, the Bastardette, and the DR forum are just hanging out in dark corners, thinking the worst of "good Christian" people.

truckbomb
03-15-2010, 12:22 AM
MissIzzy, you have that right. Ol’ Truck not only “Does Not See The Light”, he does not even want to see the light, especially the light seen by Silsby and her gang and those guys on FB who all are on some very strong Hubbly Bubbly.

Let me play this out for you. Silsby and her lot have delusions of grandeur. They think they are agents of God in the same mold as the Disciples. They are especially called by the Deity to carry on his good works here on earth. Image the following scenario -vintage Silsby..


-----------------------------------------------------------------
A Prayer overheard in a Haitian jail cell a few nights ago:

Silsby: O God, O great and merciful God, here I am in this miserable jail cell, all of my colleagues have been released to their homes and I remain falsely charged with crimes when all I wanted to do was to carry out good works on your behalf here on earth to rescue the children from despair and misery from the earthquake ravaged country. Why do I remain here? Why have you forsaken me?

Deep Thunderous Voice eminating from the overhead of Silsby's jail cell:

GOD: What the hell are you talking about wench? Foresaken? Are you out of your mind? What about my three messages which you ignored? Let’s play them back.

Did I not have Anne-christine d’Adesky of the Haitian Voice tell you personally that “your plan would likely be deemed illegal, possibly viewed as trafficking, and that you all risked arrest and possible jail time in Haiti?”

Did I not also have the Haitian policeman, who ordered the first batch of 33 children off your bus, to tell you that you were committing a criminal act and you needed proper documentation to remove them from the country?

And did I not have the Dominican Counsel tell you all of this as well?

When you were born, I see from your file that when the brains were passed out you were nowhere in sight. Sit tight there, I will get back to you when I have dealt with the ravages of some other earthquakes. Doing my good works, indeed. Sheeesh.

Silsby: Jailor, get my lawyer. God says He will have me freed in the morning.

Missizzy
03-15-2010, 02:42 AM
Truck--I think you and I know the same Guy!!

jeff_jones
03-16-2010, 06:54 PM
Hat tip to Lambada on DR1
http://www.dr1.com/forums/841110-post443.html

In an interview with Dominican station NoticiasSin, judge Saint-Vil stated that Silsby claims that it was a Dominican general by the name of "Florentino" who had given her permission to bring 100 kids across the border.
http://www.noticiassin.com/www/index.php?go=Display&act=display_article&aid=14071&tid=4

The judge mentions it, but it doesn't really make a difference to him who gave authority to let them into the DR. They were not supposed to leave Haiti in the first place.

Saint-Vil only said "Florentino" but the press report in the side bar prints "Florentino y Florentino" which would be Manuel de Jesús Florentino Florentino, ex director of "Border Development", who incidentally appears on a list of Dominican generals who are wanted for a drug case in the Southern District of Manhattan, but today was re-appointed as military adviser to the President.
http://www.7dias.com.do/app/article.aspx?id=70511

truckbomb
03-16-2010, 10:41 PM
Truck has read all these media reports and has come to the conclusion that Silsby has gotten heself mixed up with some very serious criminals on an international level. Silsby says that the “General” who promised her the legal authority with documents to cross the border with orphans into the DR was named, “Florentino.” Well, this is the famous and notorious General Manuel de Jesús Florentino Florentino, just appointed as a military advisor to the DR President after being set aside as a Minister for some time on various suspicions of trafficking in the DR. The General has some really serious problems now.

Florentino just had his U.S. visa revoked along with a number of his other general buddies, retired and holed up in the DR, by the Federales in Manhattan Federal District Court. These gentle folks are now being considered for extradition to the U.S. in connection with the big drug trafficking case of Paulino Castillo which has international ties to a major drug trafficking case in Spain.

I conclude that Silsby, on one of her excursions to the DR was taken to El Capo de Capos, Florentino, who required $12,000 to facilitate Silsby’s program to take the children across the border. The village idiot, Silsby, does not realize that any DR documents will be worthless under Haitian law so is being duped by some really bad characters.

Finally, Silsby shows up with the children but cannot produce the bribe money. Oops! No bribe money, no papers, no border crossing. So the Haitan border guards will not get their cut, ending quickly her program. The bribers, and all associated with greasing the skids, scattered like cockroaches when the light is turned on and Silsby and her flock were then arrested.

truckbomb
03-17-2010, 11:25 AM
The Haitian judge tells 7Dias.com in his exclusive interview that he will ask the DR border administration to contact General Florentino y Florentino in order to interrogate him since the judge cannot do that in Haiti.

Good Luck on that, judge.

Florentino seems to be in no mood to appear involved with Silsby’s problems telling the DR press that any accusations that he was involved in drugs or trafficking are from the agenda of those opposed to the DR military and are using this to undermine him.

7Dias.com states that Silsby’s sentence (for the “irregular trips” charge) could be from three months to six years.

I will continue to monitor 7Dias.com which seems to be on top of this matter and its connection to Silsby and the international cases involving the U.S., Haiti, Spain and Puerto Rico.

Leave it to the village idiot to get herself involved, not only with Puello but also a whole raft of drug and minor trafficking characters. Better to be in a Haitian jail if she knows anything about these bad guys and may be thought to sing like a canary.

Settle in, girl. It will be a long, long ride. OTOH, Maybe the Manhattan federales will try to spring you just to learn what General Florentino was up to with you.

As the great American Philospher, Berra, once said.

It ain’t over ‘till its over.

truckbomb
03-17-2010, 01:46 PM
To read the gist of SIN's interview with Bernard St VII where St.VII fingers General Florentino together with other DR government officials accusing the General to have authorized Silsby to import 100 Haitian children into the DR: (All below is in Spanish.)

http://www.noticiassin.com/www/index.php?go=Display&act=display_article&aid=14071&tid=4

To listen and watch the interview and see Bernard Saint VII in the flesh.

http://www.noticiassin.com/www/index.php?go=Multimedia&act=multimedia_videos&mid=14258

Missizzy
03-17-2010, 08:27 PM
"Clueless in Boise"...a good blog post on:

http://bastardette.blogspot.com/

Why do these people have to screw up "Amazing Grace" for me?


On to Haitivox, in Ms. d'Adesky's defense, she's been saying for quite some time that there was something up with a minister or general in the DR. I really think she was/is on to something. I don't think she initially determined who the general was but I think this must have been the person Silsby referred to as the "minister" that night at the hotel.

Rereading her blog reminded me that we haven't heard a word about Chenvert lately.

Melly53
03-18-2010, 04:48 PM
http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/americas/03/17/haiti.baptists.children/index.html

Nearly all of the 33 Haitian children whom American missionaries allegedly tried to take out of the earthquake-ravaged nation were reunited Wednesday with their families, weeks after they were separated. The children, who range in age from 4 months to 12 years old, have been living in SOS Children's Village, an Austrian-run orphanage in northern Port-au-Prince, since late January, when the 10 Americans they were with were arrested at the Haitian-Dominican Republic border.
On Wednesday, 32 of the children were taken home by at least one parent. Authorities are still working to verify the paperwork from the parents of the remaining child, a 9-year-old girl, SOS Children's Village said. It was not immediately clear when she could be reunited with her family.
Haitian (http://topics.cnn.com/topics/Haiti) authorities acknowledged that it had taken them some time to return the children.

Missizzy
03-18-2010, 04:53 PM
That is absolutely great news. Isn't it interesting how cautious the Haitian government was in clearing the paperwork for each child? It doesn't sound like it was something that could be accomplished in a cobbled together meeting in the back seat of a car or on a soccer field.

Of course, I realize that the world is watching. It's also highly possible that these families were able to see their children and just not remove them from SOS. That might have actually been the best possible scenario for the kids as their parents knew they were safe, dry and fed. I'm sure the families had quite a bit of work on their hands just to prepare a place to stay with their kids.

pinkpuddytat
03-18-2010, 10:23 PM
Leave it to the village idiot to get herself involved, not only with Puello but also a whole raft of drug and minor trafficking characters. Better to be in a Haitian jail if she knows anything about these bad guys and may be thought to sing like a canary.

Methinks Silsby basically had a high-wattage neon sign on her back as she traipsed around Haiti and the DR. The sign read "USEFUL IDIOT" and the criminals flocked to her like flies to jam. The criminals were no doubt doubly thrilled after they landed on her and discovered that not only was she a useful idiot, but that she also lacked any crumb of ethics, thus relieving the criminals of the usual need to fabricate complicated stories to make the useful idiot truly believe everything was on the up and up.

Maybe, just maybe, she's actually showing some small evidence of functioning brain cells by playing dumb and saying virtually nothing of substance. If she has gotten a clue as to the sort of people she was mixed up with (whether she had a clue all along, or just started getting a clue after her arrest), she may be very wise to put on a dumb-and-ignorant act and stick with it. It may be her best hope of staying alive after her release from the Haitian jail, whenever that may occur.

pinkpuddytat
03-18-2010, 10:31 PM
http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/americas/03/17/haiti.baptists.children/index.html

Nearly all of the 33 Haitian children whom American missionaries allegedly tried to take out of the earthquake-ravaged nation were reunited Wednesday with their families . . . 32 of the children were taken home by at least one parent. Authorities are still working to verify the paperwork from the parents of the remaining child, a 9-year-old girl, SOS Children's Village said.

So bottom line is that NOT A SINGLE ONE of those 33 children actually lacked a living parent that could be located and wanted to care for their child(ren) as best they could. Just imagine what those families could have done with the amount of money Silsby's churchy suckers donated to her "save the orphans" scam (not to mention all the additional money the families of the arrested suckers have spent on legal and travel costs to rescue their hapless relatives). The whole spectacle is truly nauseating.

Missizzy
03-18-2010, 11:18 PM
The "Useful Idiot" post was one of the best I've read in a long time. Hit the nail on the head. Thank you, Pink.

The waste of funds is what kills me too. Tens of thousands were just thrown away and could have sustained so many families. Why, that's......un-Christian!!

truckbomb
03-19-2010, 12:05 AM
Pink, I agree that playing dumb is not only Silsby’s best card but the easiest and most natural for her to play. But I also thing that El Generalissmo will not be in a forgiving mood for the ONE person who fingered him in this escapade especially when the Manhattan Federales want to extradite El Generalissmo and his merry men on drug trafficking charges in the U.S. especially now that he just got appointed as military advisor to the DR President. A dead Silsby is not a singing Silsby and it not just church hymns we are talking about.

Better that the embassy folk pick her up and spirit her back to the U.S one day if she is ever released. Even then she will encounter much curiosity shown by the U.S. federales.

Pink, did you view the judge’s interview? He definitely wants to interview El Generalissmo. Need we ask why?

Annie Mouse
03-19-2010, 10:38 AM
So bottom line is that NOT A SINGLE ONE of those 33 children actually lacked a living parent that could be located and wanted to care for their child(ren) as best they could. Just imagine what those families could have done with the amount of money Silsby's churchy suckers donated to her "save the orphans" scam (not to mention all the additional money the families of the arrested suckers have spent on legal and travel costs to rescue their hapless relatives). The whole spectacle is truly nauseating.

If the Southern Baptists don't come out against this debacle soon, they really should give up on yelping "family values" every time they don't get their way on a social issue. Their "family values" make my skin crawl, and I'm as conservative and Christian as they come. This incident is quite literally an abomination. These "Christians" are practically reveling in vicious sin, calling evil good and good evil.

If the Truth can't sway Silsby's fan club, then what can?

Melly53
03-19-2010, 05:03 PM
Jorge Puello ARRESTED!!

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35950101/ns/world_news-haiti_earthquake/

Dominican police have arrested a fugitive who acted as the lawyer for U.S. missionaries accused of kidnapping 33 Haitian children.

Jorge Puello initially served as the group's legal adviser and spokesman, but authorities later said he was wanted for trafficking women and children in the U.S. and El Salvador


The National Drug Control Agency says the 32-year-old Puello was arrested in the parking lot of a fast food restaurant late Thursday in the Dominican capital, Santo Domingo.

pinkpuddytat
03-19-2010, 05:55 PM
Jorge Puello ARRESTED!!

. . . the 32-year-old Puello was arrested in the parking lot of a fast food restaurant late Thursday in the Dominican capital, Santo Domingo.

So which country gets first crack at him? I've lost count of how many he was wanted in.

I think Jorge isn't playing with a full deck, any more than Silsby is. He knew he was wanted on serious criminal charges, yet played around on the internet (probably traceably, given the Interpol warrant out for him), and hung around his last known location popping out to fast food restaurants.

Are we sure he and Silsby aren't actually *related*? :-) Their thought processes seem to have a good deal in common.

truckbomb
03-19-2010, 06:11 PM
My email buddy is now in custody. I suspected something was up when I didn't get my email response today. So much for that source. I guess he will not be able to give me any more insight soon. Well, I appreciate all he has teed up for me.

I will be reporting on his insight soon. While he was on the lam I kept this to myself. Much of his material I was able to confirm from other sources. Whatever he did in Salvador at least he appeared to be forthcoming on the Haitian scene.

Watch this post.

jeff_jones
03-19-2010, 06:20 PM
I've been wondering for weeks why it took them so long.

It was obvious he was still in the DR, because he had been quite busy with his "I am Innocent" (http://jorge-es-inocente.com/) website, collecting brand new documents to prove he was not in El Salvador when the activities he was indicted for happened.
The funny thing is that the immigration certificate he shows off is based on his Torres-Orellana passport, that he obtained with fraudulent documentation, as he admitted in interviews. So here's a Dominican citizen asking Dominican authorities to confirm that he flew in & out on certain dates under a fake Salvadoran passport... Whatever.
Last week he started another heading on his site accusing his cousin Alejandro (the real lawyer) of having screwed him. He must have changed his mind, because the next day it was gone.

By the way, over the past weeks we learnt that Puello's spelling - both English and Spanish - is far from perfect. Yet “PuelloConsulting.com” looked error proof. A quick Google of one line of text showed that he copy/pasted the entire text from the website of a real law firm in Costa Rica!

jeff_jones
03-19-2010, 06:28 PM
NYT has some more details in their report:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/20/world/americas/20puello.html

Melly53
03-19-2010, 06:42 PM
My email buddy is now in custody. I suspected something was up when I didn't get my email response today. So much for that source. I guess he will not be able to give me any more insight soon. Well, I appreciate all he has teed up for me.

I will be reporting on his insight soon. While he was on the lam I kept this to myself. Much of his material I was able to confirm from other sources. Whatever he did in Salvador at least he appeared to be forthcoming on the Haitian scene.

Watch this post.

The one thing I most want to know about him is 'did he admit that he met Silsby before she was arrested' because I never bought that he volunteered his services to people he knew nothing about and had never met??? Please tell us if you know!!!

jeff_jones
03-19-2010, 06:44 PM
And here's Listin Diario, with a bit of "exageración":
http://listin.com.do/app/article.aspx?id=135452

"Dominican police received his fingerprints several months ago from El Salvador"
Really?

i.b.nora
03-19-2010, 07:16 PM
FROM THE MSNBC ARTICLE:

"Puello has denied all of the allegations. His mother, Soledad Puello, secretary of internal affairs for the National Party of Veterans and Civilians, told The Associated Press on Friday that she will represent him in court.

"In the Dominican Republic ... the entire community will come out to defend him," she said. Soledad Puello had told the AP on Thursday that she and others were negotiating with Salvadoran prosecutors for her son to turn himself in."

You all saw that, right?

jeff_jones
03-19-2010, 07:19 PM
Here's a mugshot and article from Hoy, this morning:
http://www.hoy.com.do/el-pais/2010/3/19/318301/Apresan-presunto-abogado-profugo-violador-de-la-justicia-en-diferentes

Again, police sources claim they had received his fingerprints several months ago, and that they were immediately confirmed.
That's a stretch: when he was "outed" on Feb 12, Salvadoran authorities said they would send the fingerprints to Sto Domingo to be checked...
People's memories are getting a bit elastic.

Amazing that Fox News's blog in Washington had the "exclusive" story even earlier this morning:
http://liveshots.blogs.foxnews.com/2010/03/19/lawyer-for-americans-in-haiti-arrested/

truckbomb
03-19-2010, 08:13 PM
Not submitted for the truth of the matter asserted by Puello although he has some creds on his involvement in the Silsby matter:

Puello says he did not meet Silsby prior to her arrest but became acquainted with the facts of her "authority to transport" later after representaion was secured.

Apparently he became aware of Silsby's arrest and saw this as an opportunity to "assist on a pro bono basis." The stupid Idaho church likely thought the the offered pro bono representation was a "free lunch" as opposed to the U.S embassy's recommended list of three local attorneys who would have to be paid.

I don't know what the embassy could do more for U.S citizens caught red handed in a serious criminal act.

Of course $20,000 later elicited from the gullible Baptist Mother Church in Idaho, pro bono seems a bit far fetched.

My take: I don't think Puello knew initially about Silsby's connections with the Generallismo. By then it was too late. I also surmise the Generalissmo was looking for him too up to his arrest for purposes other than mere arrest (translation: Puello knew too much about the Generalissmo's involvement) but the locals gendarmarie got to him first. Puello is still not safe (nor is Silsby in Haiti) even in their respective jails.

Stay tuned, I have another name in this stew that will shock the sensitivities and is confirmed.

Silsby, dear idiot, as Laural would say to Hardy, "Another fine mess you've gotten us into."

jeff_jones
03-19-2010, 08:28 PM
And here the formal statement from the U.S. Marshals Service:
http://www.usmarshals.gov/news/chron/2010/031910a.htm

They actually confirm that it wasn't till Feb 12 that authorities in Salvador, Canada, or the US for that matter, suddenly discovered where Torres-Puello was hanging out. Were they really very concerned about him earlier?

As I've said before, Puello is no leader of an international child trafficking ring, as some believe. Just a con man with experience in fixing paperwork and identities. But way to conspicuous for his own good.

One element still intrigues me:

In his Feb 5 interview with Listin Diario (http://www.listindiario.com/APP/article.aspx?id=130514), Puello said he represented the office “DR Legal Team” in the USA. And indeed, besides “Puello Consulting” (started on Dec 9, 2009) he did have another website, called “LegalTeam.us”.
Google didn't cache it before he took it down on Feb 12, the day he was outed as Torres-Puello.

He registered Legalteam.us on Jan 22, two days before Silsby's arrival in the DR. On Jan 21 he had put up his car for sale (http://www.mundoanuncio.com/anuncio/toyota_raum_japones_super_economico_1183038847.htm l) (recently imported), because he was going to buy another one.
Perhaps all pure coincidence, but why did he want/need another legal website right then? He already had a quite “impressive” one with all the fancy logos (ABA, IAJLJ and CARD).

I'm afraid we may never find out what "Legal Team" was all about.

I'm also still curious about "Pastor" Sainvil, whose story never made sense.
All I found on the net since then, is that his full name is Jean Wesly Sainvil, that some time ago he was looking for a trucking job (http://www.truckdrivingcdljobs.com/in/Georgia/Lawenceville/JEAN%20WESLY%20SAINVIL.php), that early 2009 he got evicted from his home in Lawrenceville and that he used to live in S Florida.
Nothing out of the ordinary, but still no connections to any prior church or orphanage activities. While you can find plenty of other Haitian pastors (some named Sainvil as well) who are active in Georgia. One can but conclude that his 500 sqft church in Norcross is a very recent enterprise.
Let's see what the judge finds out about him:
AP Feb 24 (http://test.ajc.com/news/nation-world/6-haitian-orphans-who-504652.html)
“Bernard Saint-Vil, the judge ..... and has asked judicial police to investigate whether Pastor Jean Sainvil — who helped them recruit some of the children — indeed has orphanages in Haiti, as he has claimed”.
Sainvil's role came again up last Friday during the judge's interview at the DR Embassy in Haiti.

Truckbomb: eagerly awaiting you story!

pinkpuddytat
03-19-2010, 10:07 PM
The stupid Idaho church likely thought the the offered pro bono representation was a "free lunch" as opposed to the U.S embassy's recommended list of three local attorneys who would have to be paid.

Not submitted in defense of the IQs of the airheaded Idaho (and other states) churchians . . .

. . . but my clear recollection is that relatives and/or the spokesman for the Central Valley Baptist Church reported that they had either been unable to contact or unable to secure the services of any of those three attorneys recommended by the US Embassy. Probably true, and not surprising, IMO. Even in the best of the times, a competent and legitimate attorney wouldn't be eager to represent a gaggle of idiots like these (especially after a quick googling of Silsby revealed she had a longstanding habit of not paying her bills). And in the immediate aftermath of a nation-ravaging earthquake, I expect all three had MUCH more pressing things to attend to, whether legal work for people who needed legal help through no fault of their own, or personal matters like digging through rubble looking for their relatives or finding temporary shelter after their homes had collapsed. And of course, it may be that their phones and computers had fallen victim to the quake, and they just weren't reachable or in any position to undertake legal representation of anyone.

At any rate, when Jorge popped up eager to represent the cognitively-challenged ten, they got just the sort of legal representation they richly deserved. Karmic justice to the rescue :-)

truckbomb
03-19-2010, 10:25 PM
Pink, Your recollection is correct. That is what I remember. However, it should not have been hard to contact at least one of them through the State Department. I think they didn’t even try to call the legitimate lawyers when they were contacted by “free lunch.” What beats “free?”

Then they all doubled down when it came time to advance requested against “expenses” in advance. Later, when this need was made known, the Church and the families were All In. Doing God’s Work, you see, is expensive. But, I digress.

I am running down the lead on the name that Puello gave me before he was caught. Hint. It is a woman, a lawyer tied to the Generallismo and, ready for this? Bribery.

It must not have been hard to catch him. Directly using the internet whilst on the lam is not what a bin Laden would do.

Melly53
03-19-2010, 11:41 PM
Not submitted for the truth of the matter asserted by Puello although he has some creds on his involvement in the Silsby matter:

Puello says he did not meet Silsby prior to her arrest but became acquainted with the facts of her "authority to transport" later after representaion was secured.

Apparently he became aware of Silsby's arrest and saw this as an opportunity to "assist on a pro bono basis." The stupid Idaho church likely thought the the offered pro bono representation was a "free lunch" as opposed to the U.S embassy's recommended list of three local attorneys who would have to be paid.

I don't know what the embassy could do more for U.S citizens caught red handed in a serious criminal act.

Of course $20,000 later elicited from the gullible Baptist Mother Church in Idaho, pro bono seems a bit far fetched.

My take: I don't think Puello knew initially about Silsby's connections with the Generallismo. By then it was too late. I also surmise the Generalissmo was looking for him too up to his arrest for purposes other than mere arrest (translation: Puello knew too much about the Generalissmo's involvement) but the locals gendarmarie got to him first. Puello is still not safe (nor is Silsby in Haiti) even in their respective jails.

Stay tuned, I have another name in this stew that will shock the sensitivities and is confirmed.

Silsby, dear idiot, as Laural would say to Hardy, "Another fine mess you've gotten us into."

Thanks and another question if you don't mind! Did Silsby have any idea of what she was getting into or was it only the other churchies that were kept in the dark?

Lambada
03-20-2010, 12:23 AM
FROM THE MSNBC ARTICLE:

"Puello has denied all of the allegations. His mother, Soledad Puello, secretary of internal affairs for the National Party of Veterans and Civilians, told The Associated Press on Friday that she will represent him in court.

You all saw that, right?

And Sra. Ana Rita Soledad Puello López IS Partido Nacional de Veteranos y Civiles Sub-Secretary for Internal Affairs according to the PNVC website (number 36 here):
PNVC Directorio Ejecutivo (http://www.pnvc.org.do/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=22&Itemid=54)
which position might make her on nodding aquaintance terms with various Generals................??

Good evening everyone, I ought to introduce myself - Lambada from DR1. I.....er ahem noticed I was referred to in dispatches earlier in the thread ;) so thought I should join. I did try a while back but kept being put in a moderation queue and couldn't post. Now it appears, I've been let out :angel:. Unlike the subjects about which we are writing.......

i.b.nora
03-20-2010, 12:29 AM
Welcome, Lambada! I think you are the only one who saw what I posted.

jeff_jones
03-20-2010, 12:44 AM
Welcome, Lambada!

I.B. - I saw it, but don't know what to make of it.
Apparently she was negotiating with El Salvador, but it now seems the US was ahead of the game and will ask the extradition.
But I think that process will take a while.

jeff_jones
03-20-2010, 12:53 AM
Hint. It is a woman, a lawyer tied to the Generallismo and, ready for this? Bribery.

María Asunción Santos de Lara?
That's the name I found based on d'Adesky's story.

Whether it's her or someone else, how on earth did Silsby meet and communicate with those people, if it was not via Puello?

jeff_jones
03-20-2010, 01:12 AM
Lambada - since you're in the DR:
can you give an idea of the driving time
- SDO to Cabarete
- Cabarete to the northern border crossing (Ouanaminthe)
- SDO to the southern border crossing (Malpasse)
I am amazed by the amount of driving Silsby must have done that week.

Lambada
03-20-2010, 01:45 AM
I tend to go on the Metro bus to Santo Domingo & not drive because I have strong survival instincts...........Cabarete-SD approx 3.5-4 hours, Cabarete- Ouanaminthe about an hour longer and the roads are not as good. SD-Barahona approx 3.5 hours. BUT since the earthquake when convoys have been going there have been lots of holdups - some people have taken 7 hours to get to the border and then a few more to get to Port au Prince.

On Puello, US Marshals Service Press Release here:
Joint International Manhunt Leads to Arrest of Fugitive Wanted in Three Countries (http://www.usmarshals.gov/news/chron/2010/031910a.htm)

truckbomb
03-20-2010, 01:51 AM
Jeff Jones

I think you are referring to the d’Adesky March 10 story where it refers to an unnamed woman lawyer d’Adesky contacted and who was allegedly associated with an equally unnamed "General" as reported to her by Puello.

Your sleuthing following this article is very good because Maria Asuncion Santos de Lara is the woman lawyer in question that Puello confirmed to me. Apparently she was fired in 2007 because a subordinate in her office, where she was the District Attorney, was accused of trafficking. She remains in politics in the DR and still has influence particularly now that the General is back in the President's administration.

Unfortunately, Puello's arrest has cut off further information on her relationship with l’affaire Silsby and General Florentino. When Puello says to d’Adesky then that those folks won't be happy if the truth be known about them, he was greatly understating the exposure. You know - Luca Brasi sleeps with the fishes.

Anyhow I am no longer able to get info on the $12,000 deal that was supposedly to be paid to permit the border crossing. Couldn’t they have waited to pick him up a few days from now? Bummer.

Missizzy
03-20-2010, 02:12 AM
Two questions, how does Puello's mother have time to run a "preschool" in Sosua if she's the secretary of internal affairs for the National Party of Veterans and Civilians and planning on representing her son in court? Or is this something done on the kitchen table?

And secondly, I'm wondering if Canada won't claim Puello first as they did Duarte. They have laws to cover citizens who commit crimes against children, including trafficking. They bring them back to the provinces and try them there. I believe I read that Puello held Canadian citizenship...yes, no?

Lambada
03-20-2010, 02:49 AM
I saw that Puello's mother had a home nursery but that wasn't in Sosua, it was where she lived which I think was SD.

And quote from AFP 'According to documents of the US and Dominican authorities... this person is an important part of a network of alien smugglers (targeting) women and children from Central America and the Caribbean," added Lebron.' (emboldening mine)

Dominican Republic arrests man sought in child trafficking (http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100319/wl_afp/dominicanhaitiusjusticechildcrime_20100319183037)

truckbomb
03-20-2010, 12:35 PM
Melly53 asks:

Did Silsby have any idea of what she was getting into or was it only the other churchies that were kept in the dark?

Absent my favorite source now being incomunicado, I can only guess what Silsby and her flock of churchies had in mind. As to Silsby's mind I have a vision that inside it must look like the painting I saw in the Prado museum last November, El jardín de las delicias. And that is on a good day. See it here

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://laarquitecturadetushuesos.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/el_jardin_de_las_delicias_terrenales_500.jpg&imgrefurl=http://laarquitecturadetushuesos.wordpress.com/2008/05/31/el-jardin-de-las-delicias/el_jardin_de_las_delicias_terrenales_500/&h=500&w=445&sz=240&tbnid=CBvDNTcY190q6M:&tbnh=238&tbnw=212&prev=/images%3Fq%3D%2522jardin%2Bde%2Blas%2Bdelicias%252 2&hl=en&usg=__INkSse__y_myFPj6YYCNnjKclQ8=&ei=n_akS5iwM5Oltge4oLT6CQ&sa=X&oi=image_result&resnum=3&ct=image&ved=0CAkQ9QEwAg

Lambada
03-20-2010, 03:05 PM
As to the question of who gets Puello first, I see El Salvador are staking a claim. According to their Head of Person-Trafficking Unit, Violeta Olivares, the law sets out that he has to be extradited to the country where he has committed the most serious crimes and where the penalty is greatest. She says this would be El Salvador where he could face a sentence of 20 years imprisonment.

Capturan a Torres Puello en República Dominicana (http://www.elsalvador.com/mwedh/nota/nota_completa.asp?idCat=8613&idArt=4623722)

I don't know if she is referring to international law or the law of El Salvador?

jeff_jones
03-20-2010, 07:12 PM
Cabarete-SD approx 3.5-4 hours, Cabarete- Ouanaminthe about an hour longer and the roads are not as good. SD-Barahona approx 3.5 hours. BUT since the earthquake when convoys have been going there have been lots of holdups - some people have taken 7 hours to get to the border and then a few more to get to Port au Prince.

Thanks, Lambada. That corresponds to what I figured.
And confirms once again that "Pastor" Sainvil's story - that he ran into Silsby at the border in Ouanaminthe on Jan 27 - is unbelievable.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/02/20/world/main6227611.shtml

Now, it is possible that the AP reporter mixed up border towns, and that Sainvil gave a wrong date in his (phone) interview.
I hope the judge is looking into their respective exact itineraries, from arrival in the DR. The chartered bus driver would be a lot of help.

Truck:
How do you think Silsby first got in touch with the "lady lawyer", if not via Puello?

And I have one last question:

What happened to Edwin Coq?
It is still not clear to me who hired him. I don't recall Puello ever saying he did.
In a Feb 8 French press report (http://www.rfi.fr/contenu/20100208-lavocat-missionnaires-americains-jette-leponge) Coq (who doesn't speak English) said that, being Baptist himself, he took on the case upon recommendation by his pastor. When he heard that some family members of the detainees accused him of bribery, he quit in disgust. And never got a cent.

In hindsight, it smells like a “coup” by Puello to take control of the case: blame Coq and the Haitian judiciary and come in as the savior. For a day or two, the alleged bribe was the headline around the world.

truckbomb
03-20-2010, 08:19 PM
Jeff, I don’t think Silsby was ever in direct contact with either the Woman Lawyer or the Generissmo. In general, international traffickers are much too smart especially on such a low level transaction as Silsby’s. Nor did she ever know the name of the Generalissmo until later. These high level folk must always have deniability, a cut out or two if you please.

What I think happened is that Silsby finally realized from her prior warnings that she was not going to just drive through an international border with a busload of children but that she had to have some kind of documentation. Enter the “Mysterious Man” in the car she had an initial nighttime meeting with. Her handlers/translators at the time probably organized this meeting on her insistence.

This is the mysterious Haitian who likely had important contacts through intermediaries into high level DR folk. This type of arrangement is common in third world countries. There is always a single controlled conduit for moving people, money and/or drugs across borders. These are very smart and totally corrupt people who have superior deniability and are usually high up in the government or business world of the country. They are protected by higher ups with interests of their own.

This guy likely assured Silsby that proper documents would be available once she showed up with the children at the border. Of course, there must be a facilitating payment to those who enable the crossing Let’s assume $12,000. (Can you spell BRIBE?).

In her best conniving Nixonian reply, Silsby confirms, “$12,000? I can get that. No Problema.” Of course she has no ability or intention of gathering that sum relying on her ecclesiastical authority and mission to get her past that minor requirement so she can cross the border with proper documents and carry out her objective. Nobody ever said she was smart.

So Silsby got caught having no bribe money and was arrested when she betrayed the illicit conduit. Not smart. These are unforgiving folk with very long memories.

When Puello originally showed up at her jail he discovers rudimentary paperwork from her which, upon careful examination, expresses hopeful and benevolent thoughts on assisting with innocent (but not incriminating) support for welcoming Silsby and children into the DR for noble purposes. Village idiot Silsby assumes that these are authoritative for a crossing.

Puello, I think, discovers accidently the name of the woman lawyer on the paperwork, contacts her, and tells Silsby of her background and that of the Generallismo. Otherwise Silsby would never have known about either. Of course, Silsby does not know that revealing the Generalissmo’s name to the judge in hopes of getting out of jail places her in the crosshairs of those unforgiving folk. More not smart.

Has she kept her mouth shut about this contact she would have been much better off.

Puello, is probably peddling his story right now to the authorities in hopes of a deal.

jeff_jones
03-21-2010, 12:10 AM
Truck:

Thanks for your extensive scenario, but I've had my doubts about the "lady lawyer + general" connection from the start.

First, because it came from Puello, who's a compulsive liar, and desperate to distract his audience. "Look, there are big crooks involved!"
About his Salvador case he said it was politically motivated. In the US, he was "duped" as well.

Second, the amount Puello stated was 150,000 pesos, or US$ 3,900. Not the US$12,000 d'Adesky made it to be. Not that I have any experience, but don't you find that a small amount for these people to risk their reputation for?

Third, I believe Silsby's bus never even made it to the DR side. She was stopped on the Haitian side. Just like she was stopped by police with her first "load" (pardon the expression) of 40 kids. Hence the issue if there was any document or not and/or need for a bribe to get into the DR never came into play.

There are other holes in the story.

On the other hand, Silsby had mentioned earlier that her attorney for the orphanage in the DR was "Sencion". US$ 3,900 to incorporate, register and request the necessary permits to operate the orphanage seems a reasonable amount. Which she asked about when Puello called her. Perhaps because Silsby had not yet paid her? That would make sense, wouldn't it?

Then how did Silsby come up with the name Florentino? I don't know yet...

Lambada
03-21-2010, 01:44 AM
Then how did Silsby come up with the name Florentino? I don't know yet...

Maybe because Florentino y Florentino was Head of La Dirección General de Desarrollo Fronterizo (DGDF) (before his present promotion)? And Silsby had been at that border before on a previous visit, hadn't she?

His statement of denial of authorising her to bring out the children says 'Florentino y Florentino no es jefe de Migración, ni del Cesfront, es decir, no tiene a su cargo guardias fronterizos, ni regula la frontera; ya que las siete provincias donde tiene oficinas la Dirección General de Frontera con las cuales él desarrolla su labor' viz he makes it clear he is not in charge of Migracion nor Cesfront (border security), but border development.
Source:
Florentino achaca a "pugnas militares" inclusión de su nombre en lista (http://www.7dias.com.do/app/article.aspx?id=71138)

How 'developmental' would an orphanage be..........?? It's ok, it's rhetorical.:crazy:

DGDF has a website but..........it isn't all that helpful
Quienes Somos: La Dirección General de Desarrollo Fronterizo (DGDF) (http://www.dgdf.gov.do/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=16&Itemid=2)

The 'who are we' page is incredibly modest - no names!

truckbomb
03-21-2010, 02:07 AM
Jeff says: Third, I believe Silsby's bus never even made it to the DR side. She was stopped on the Haitian side. Just like she was stopped by police with her first "load" (pardon the expression) of 40 kids. Hence the issue if there was any document or not and/or need for a bribe to get into the DR never came into play.

Jeff, perhaps I didn’t make myself clear. I agree that Silsby didn’t make it to the DR side. Under my theory, Silsby got to the border on the Haitian side and then had to produce the bribe money to an intermediate. When she could not produce the money, the involved guards sensed trouble (i.e. they would not get their cut) and she was turned away. As I said in an earlier post, the cockroaches over on the DR side then scattered at this point. Silsby left to return to the DR Consulate in PAP to try to “clear up the problem” only to find the DR Consulate not willing to assist. Silsby returned to the border again empty handed and then was arrested.

As to the involvement of the Lady Lawyer + General, probability suggests that two higher ups in the DR who enjoy a suspicion of involvement in various kinds of trafficking (one wanted by the U.S. federales in Manhattan) both identified by Puello, are a strong red flag. Jeff, there is no way, repeat no way, anyone is going to cross that border with the heat turned up (on orphan crossing) to blazing hot without paying a bribe to someone.

As to the mere failure to pay the woman lawyer for small incorporation fees, that could well be the case but the facilitating crossing fee was the main default.

Jeff, this mess could wind up in the DR President’s office as a major scandal prior to the DR elections coming up. DR Prez is already taking heat for his apparent involvement with the Manhattan drug case. You are a fine sleuth. All of this is out there albeit in Spanish.

Bottom line. Silsby is not going anywhere until this mess is straightened out by the judge.

Lambada
03-21-2010, 03:01 PM
Jeff, this mess could wind up in the DR President’s office as a major scandal prior to the DR elections coming up. DR Prez is already taking heat for his apparent involvement with the Manhattan drug case.

truckbomb, I think the President is pretty close with the General & has been for many years. Each time the General gets removed from office, the President reinstates him. In 2005 when the General was Head of the DNI he was replaced because of alleged ties to Quirino Castillo, then in 2008
scroll down to 'Florentino reinstated to government' (http://74.125.113.132/search?q=cache:XO4-shhRpJsJ:dr1.com/news/2008/dnews090308.shtml+Major+General+Manuel+Florentino+ Florentino&cd=5&hl=en&ct=clnk) (in English).

The General's wife is the interior decorator who refurbished the new Supreme Court (there was a bit of scandal about that, too)
R. Dominicana: El cártel "Milenium Morado" asaltó obras públicas (lahaine.org/blog.php?disp=pdf&blog=1&p=17911)
Bear in mind that was written by Narciso Isa Conde (who isn't exactly 'neutral') in 2006.

Picture of the couple here:
Tienda Margarita Gómez, de Navidad (http://www3.diariolibre.com/noticias_det.php?id=171798)

Fast forward to 2010 & the US asks for a number of extradictions, the General allegedly being one of them
9 of the retired generals to be extradited to USA (http://www.dominicancentral.com/newsarticle/9_of_the_retired_generals_to_be_extradited_to_usa/)

Lawyer reveals names of officers, civilians allegedly sought by the U.S. (http://dominicantoday.com/dr/local/2009/9/17/33274/Lawyer-reveals-names-of-officers-civilians-allegedly-sought-by-the-US) (published Sept. 2009)

The General denies he is on the list. Meanwhile everyone in DR is supposedly looking for the escaped Puerto Rican trafficker, Figueroa Agosto, and rumours abound that the General's wife did some decorating work for him. And that possibly the President's daughter was involved in this work
Nicole Fernández, hija del Presidente y Margarita Gómez, "la decoradora", mencionadas por periódico digital en litis con fiscal (http://desdelarepublicadominicana.blogspot.com/2010/02/nicole-fernandez-hija-del-presidente-y.html)

And once again in 2010 the General gets reinstated as military adviser to the executive branch viz. the President. And THEN...........the Torre Atiemar scandal breaks
Ritzy building to be seized, others in Dominican prosecutor’s crosshairs (http://dominicantoday.com/dr/local/2010/3/11/35071/Ritzy-building-to-be-seized-others-in-Dominican-prosecutors-crosshairs)

El Presidente Fernández Reina en el centro de la " Torre Atiemar" y del Narco-Estado Dominicano (http://lacucarachaquemea.blogspot.com/2010/03/el-presidente-fernandez-reina-en-el.html)

So, given all this happening, I'm not sure that even if the General could be linked with Silsby, it would make much difference to the President. I totally agree, however, that Silsby was not wise to accuse someone so close to the President.

truckbomb
03-21-2010, 03:30 PM
Lambada reports: So, given all this happening, I'm not sure that even if the General could be linked with Silsby, it would make much difference to the President. I totally agree, however, that Silsby was not wise to accuse someone so close to the President.

I also don’t think a link to Silsby will make a difference to the General’s exposure. What will make a difference is his protective Prez, during an election year, having to deal with an extradition of the General and the others to the U.S. Federal Court in Manhattan. If Prez is out, so will be the General.

Meanwhile, Silsby rots in jail while prosecutors in four countries sniff around the DR administration’s possible involvement in the drug cases while the Haitian judge hopes to find out how all of that mess is going to affect his Silsby case.

Thanks for the most accurate research on the General. Do you have anything as detailed about Lady Lawyer?

Lambada
03-21-2010, 06:40 PM
What will make a difference is his protective Prez, during an election year, having to deal with an extradition of the General and the others to the U.S. Federal Court in Manhattan. If Prez is out, so will be the General.

But the Prez won't be out. It isn't a Presidential election this year, not until 2012. What we have in May 2010 are municipal & congresional elections only. We have this circus every 2 years; wall-to-wall elections, as soon as the counting of one is over, the propaganda for the next one starts: the motor caravans, the throwing of salami from helicopters, the turning up on the high street of 2 competeing caravans for 2 different parties...........:eek: (all elaborated in my next book......)

Fortunately, under the new Constitution starting in 2016 both sets of elections will be in the same year. But not on the same day. Oh no, nothing as simple as that. :banghead:


Thanks for the most accurate research on the General. Do you have anything as detailed about Lady Lawyer?

No I haven't had time to look into her yet. She was the Fiscal of San Cristobal, yes? Tell me, truckbomb, is she known by her single name, Maria Asuncion Santos, or her married name Maria Asuncion Santos de Lara?

truckbomb
03-21-2010, 07:58 PM
Thank you, Lambada, for your correction. You and Jeff have been very helpful in providing essential background.

I don't know if she is better known by her married name or otherwise. She shouldn't be too hard to find there in the DR.

If the Manhattan prosecuters get their way to secure the General's extradition, things will really heat up in your local. Sometimes governments are brought down by serious scandals without an election. Lets remember Nixon.

jeff_jones
03-21-2010, 08:08 PM
Truck - here's a note I made about the SINNoticias story:

“The interview took place while judge Saint-Vil was questioning César Cuevas Pérez, Minister-Counselor at the DR Embassy in Haiti. Who said Silsby came to visit him three times asking for an authorization to bring kids to the DR. He turned her away at each occasion. The third time she came accompanied by a Baptist pastor who said he was in a position to give him a document guaranteeing that the kids could leave Haitian territory.
Cuevas Pérez added that she also visited the DR Consulate several times, where she met Carlos Castillo, the Dominican Consul-General. The judge plans to question Mr Castillo as well.”

Castillo was the first to alert the media that he warned Silsby not to try to cross the border.

On a side note, Carlos Antonio Castillo Almonte is an interesting man. He owns one of the largest avocado growing and export companies in the DR - but has also been C.G. in Port-au-Prince for the past 10 years. Unlike diplomats at the Embassy who keep rotating. He's now running for senator from Ocoa for the PLD (the president's party). Sometimes he is referred to as Carlos Castillo Pimentel, after his father, who started the avocado business in San José de Ocoa and was a prominent general.

If we believe the Florentino connection (which would match her telling d'Adesky that she was covered by a “minister” in the DR), why did she bother to visit the Embassy and the Consulate and attract so much attention? She should have just gone straight to the border.
Then again, perhaps she picked the wrong crossing. Maybe the “papers” (or the right contact for the bribe) were in Belladère, or in Ouanaminthe (aka Juana Mendez)?

Truck - your label for Silsby as “village idiot” is totally accurate.
And I'm giving up trying to understand! I just hope the judge keeps digging.

jeff_jones
03-21-2010, 08:33 PM
No I haven't had time to look into her yet. She was the Fiscal of San Cristobal, yes? Tell me, truckbomb, is she known by her single name, Maria Asuncion Santos, or her married name Maria Asuncion Santos de Lara?

Lambada - I haven't found anything about her, but the one mention in a 2007 State Dept paper (http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/hrrpt/2006/78889.htm). Which lead me to think originally, when Puello became so eager to "spill the beans" to anyone who would listen, that he simply made it up (like hundreds of other stories), so others would run with it.

Remember, one day he was a direct descendant of Luis de Torres, another day his Jewish heritage came from a Swiss grand-aunt. The DEA duped him, but his new building in Santo Domingo would be built "by the prestigious US development company, Empire State Development"!
You have to give it to the guy, his imagination is endless.

But maybe you'll find out more about the lady, being on the spot.

believe09
03-21-2010, 09:32 PM
I thought we had a seperate thread on Silsby and her group...hmm my bad!

The person providing her with legal advice has just been arrested for...wait for it....human trafficking. He and his wife have also been accused of running a brothel out of their home...

http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/03/19/haiti.baptists.adviser/index.html

Forgive me if this story has already been linked....

truckbomb
03-21-2010, 10:13 PM
When the judge said he wanted to interview the General, Silsby’s fate and this thread became linked with the external international drug investigation by prosecutors in four countries. It was Silsby’s bad luck to have wandered into the hornet’s nest by her zeal in the mission to collect children under the cover of the post earthquake chaos in Haiti.

This comes about whether she hired the woman lawyer to lease the DR temporary quarters and/or her church accepted the representation of Puello.

I think that Puello informed Silsby while she was first jailed his discovery that the woman lawyer’s name was on papers Silsby held and then told her about his theory about the involvement of the General (Who else having contact with the jailed Silsby would have told her?).

Now the judge in Haiti has to deal in teh environment of all of this external mess before he can be comfortable in releasing her. His best choice is to let Silsby go to trial. Now we are likely talking months more here

Lambada
03-22-2010, 01:42 AM
Lambada - I haven't found anything about her, but the one mention in a 2007 State Dept paper (http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/hrrpt/2006/78889.htm). Which lead me to think originally, when Puello became so eager to "spill the beans" to anyone who would listen, that he simply made it up (like hundreds of other stories), so others would run with it.

But maybe you'll find out more about the lady, being on the spot.

Oh I remember that case well - caused a huge stir at the airport in SD. But it wasn't a trafficking case so much as extortion by a member of the Fiscalia staff, a secretary called Farconelis de los Angeles Rivera Santana, who promised people documents to be able to leave the DR & work in Spain. You can read about it in English from DR1 News 29th May 2006. Scroll down to
Huge travel bunko at Las Americas (http://dr1.com/news/2006/dnews052906.shtml#7)

María Asunción Santos de Lara, the Fiscal of San Cristobal, always maintained that this was nothing to do with the Fiscal's office but a private entrepreneurial endeavour by Farconelis de los Angeles Rivera Santana, who had worked at that office for 20 years.
Grupo estafado con falso viaje trata de linchar mujeres (http://noticiasyciencias.blogspot.com/2006/05/grupo-estafado-con-falso-viaje-trata.html)
It was memorable because those who had been defrauded (some 250-260 people) tried to linch Farconelis de los Ángeles Rivera Santana and Gina Pellestier de León when they came to Court.

Explican estafa del viaje (http://www.hoy.com.do/el-pais/2006/5/28/129360/print)

And in case you think history doesn't repeat itself, in April 2009 another San Cristobal Fiscal by name William Lara, was suspended for granting bail to a known dealer Rolando Florian Feliz
Destituyen procurador adjunto de San Cristóbal que favoreció a Florián Feliz (http://www.listindiario.com/app/article.aspx?id=98912)

Florian was later assassinated Florian buried as a "hero" (http://www3.diariolibre.com/noticias_det.php?id=200144)

María Asunción Santos de Lara was originally appointed by Presidential Decree (President Fernandez) back in 1999. Scroll down to Decree 499-99, Pp 117-8
GACETA OFICIAL (http://www.camaradediputados.gov.do/masterlex/MLX/Originales/1B/503/722/739/10029g.doc)

And in case you think I'm being anally retentive over giving sources ;) it's because I live where I do and I do know the law about defamacion injuria.

pinkpuddytat
03-22-2010, 02:12 AM
However, it should not have been hard to contact at least one of them through the State Department. I think they didn’t even try to call the legitimate lawyers when they were contacted by “free lunch.” What beats “free?”

What I recall reading was that they had tried to contact all three, and were unsuccessful in either reaching the person or securing their services in each case. Remember this was in the immediate aftermath of the quake. The State Department was busy, communications were a shambles, and this band of idiots was hardly a priority for either the State Department or any legitimate Haitian lawyer. Getting injured people out from under rubble was a priority. Figuring out how to get cargo planes in and out and get their cargo of food and medical supplies and rescue teams unloaded and distributed was a priority (there was a colossal air traffic back-up because the only operational runway was covered with planes that had landed and been unable to unload their cargo -- other planes loaded with relief supplies were being turned back after arriving in Haitian airspace, because there was simply no place for them to land).

If I'd been a legitimate Haitian lawyer, and my phone had miraculously still been operational, I wouldn't have returned any calls regarding these idiots. Do you realize how hard it was to find electricity to charge a cell phone in Port-au-Prince around that time? And I don't think anybody at the State Department gave a crap whether these idiots found a legitimate lawyer soon or ever -- they gave their goofy families and pastors three names and phone numbers, crossed that nuisance task off the to-do list, and moved on to more important things.


It must not have been hard to catch him. Directly using the internet whilst on the lam is not what a bin Laden would do.

I suspect authorities have known exactly where he was for quite a while, and were giving him rope, so to speak, by allowing him to continue his imprudent internet activities.

pinkpuddytat
03-22-2010, 02:25 AM
In her best conniving Nixonian reply, Silsby confirms, “$12,000? I can get that. No Problema.” Of course she has no ability or intention of gathering that sum relying on her ecclesiastical authority and mission to get her past that minor requirement so she can cross the border with proper documents and carry out her objective. Nobody ever said she was smart. So Silsby got caught having no bribe money and was arrested when she betrayed the illicit conduit. Not smart. These are unforgiving folk with very long memories.

It's pretty clear that Silsby has spent the last decade in the US stringing people along with promises that "the money is coming", to the tune of millions of dollars. She's even managed to get away with this after court judgements ordering her to pay. I guess it was a shocker to her that in the third world, a demand for payment has to be met Right Now, Or Else . . . She didn't pay, and so for the past several weeks, she's been experiencing "Else" (and as you've pointed out, this may well be the mild version of "Else" with the serious stuff yet to come). Third world justice is what she's got coming IMO, and I hope she gets it.

truckbomb
03-22-2010, 10:39 AM
Jeff says: Thanks for your extensive scenario, but I've had my doubts about the "lady lawyer + general" connection from the start.

First, because it came from Puello, who's a compulsive liar, and desperate to distract his audience. "Look, there are big crooks involved!"

Jeff, Pullo must have told Silsby the name of the General before he was arrested because Silsby could not have learned the name from Puello or anyone else after he went to earth. Silsby revealed the name to the Haitian judge who then increased his curiosity about the General’s possible involvement.

Puello’s credibility may well deserve question based on his Curriculum Vitae as a compulsive liar. I could understand a question of his credibility on this point post arrest as a means of deflecting blame by distracting his audience and making it up on the fly to Haiti Vox. However, I don’t see an ulterior motive to tell Silsby the name before he went into hiding.

Right now, I suspect that the Manhattan prosecutors already have their investigators sitting down with Puello in his new DR quarters and listening carefully to his canary singing before he gets a free ride to Salvador.

truckbomb
03-22-2010, 11:19 AM
Lambada, thank you for the thorough research and citations. I read the articles in the original Spanish and have come to some disturbing conclusions. I refer to the incident where a number of people were bilked of their money by the person in the Lady Lawyer’s office to get ordinary air travel to Spain. It seems they were to be escorted to Spain by someone connected with the Mafia. If the Lady Lawyer was so innocent why did she get sacked? Mere supervisory incompetence? More likely a failure of sufficient direct evidence.

Then I read the similar case of bureaucratic corruption on the part of Feliz, who held a position very much like the Lady Lawyer. His downfall occurred because he wrongfully bailed out a drug dealer, most likely for cash.

The later assassination of Feliz connected with a drug dealer suggests people who get involved with illicit trade who know too much end up very dead. As for the Lady Lawyer, the Mafia as a travel coordinator organized by a subordinate right out of her office is a very disturbing connection where Puello identified the Lady Lawyer as involved with Silsby’s travel plans with the children.

Sleep well, Laura and pray your escort to your departure plane someday is the U.S. Consulate in Haiti.

jeff_jones
03-22-2010, 11:59 AM
Video clip:

http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/26184891/vp/35981371

Lambada
03-22-2010, 12:21 PM
truckbomb, it would be normal practice to fire the Fiscal after the secretary was prosecuted. Plus in 2006 there was a change of Attorney General from the previous one, Francisco Domínguez Brito, to the current one, Radhamés Jiménez Peña . Maybe the new AG wanted to clear the decks and start again?

With regard to Florian Feliz, he was a known dealer with a rap sheet as long as your arm. I never heard of him holding a Fiscal's position!! He did achieve urban legend status, though.

I think what everyone is skirting round is whether or not there was already in existence a well organised trade in the trafficking of either adults or children, into which happened the Silsby team, blowing the public profile wide open. I don't know the answer to this. If there was you can be fairly certain that damage control will have taken over as parties protect their rears.

NBC interviewed Silsby this morning, video & article here:
US Missionary Hopeful After 2 Months in Haiti Jail (http://www.aolnews.com/world/article/laura-silsby-us-missionary-in-haiti-hopeful-after-2-months-in-jail/19408935)

oops, just seen jeff's post. Slow computer today (we had a little earthquake last night).

truckbomb
03-22-2010, 02:10 PM
Lambada, thank you for the important correction re Feliz.

After viewing the video I see that Silsby confirms Puello’s statement that he contacted the Idaho church after they were arrested. I will accept that as interesting and maybe true but not yet verified independently.

And you are right that the traffickers have faded into the woodwork IMO like cockroaches not to be seen again. Maybe Puello will rat them out in hopes of a deal. But he better have some real evidence of higher up involvement.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is a thread populated by very well informed and incisive people. I especially name Jeff, Pink, and Lambada who has access to very good source material. Great work and very helpful Folks.

Silsby still thinks the Diety will cause her release. Maybe so, but from her statement she appears to have learned nothing. Given the same circumstances she would harvest the children again.

i.b.nora
03-22-2010, 02:13 PM
Interview with Steve McMullin, the Baptist.

Freed Idahoan missionary had no knowledge of jail cell note (http://www.ktvb.com/news/Freed-Idahoan-missionary-shares-more-about-Haiti-imprisonment-88748197.html)

by Scott Evans
Idaho's NewsChannel 7
Posted on March 20, 2010 at 10:28 PM
Updated today at 6:52 AM

snip

"From the beginning it's been clear that this mission trip to Haiti was led and organized by Laura Silsby.

What hasn't been clear is exactly how much others in the group knew.

For Steve McMullin, he said he was kept out of a lot of the dealings.

"I was told by other people that they had no parents, that those parents were dead," said Steve McMullin.

Steve McMullin is talking about the 33 Haitian children he's accused of kidnapping and trafficking.

The group got the children on January 27, three days before they were arrested.

"That night, we spent the night on the street, we got the kids and then we spent the night on the street in the bus, because we had no place to go," McMullin said.

The next day they tried to get them out of the country.

"We spent a lot of time going from agency to agency to agency to agency, looking for the documents, getting documents,” he said. “I never did see any documents.”

The lack of those documents led to their arrest.

"I figured it would be just a big misunderstanding and that we would be out in a couple days," he said."

Talking about the 'note' slipped to the NBC producer: "“I have no idea what the note is,” McMullin said. “I never saw the note. I saw it on TV after I got home, but that's the only knowledge that I have of it.”

McMullin said that he had talked to others about the note. He said they didn’t know about it and that he had no explanation about where or who the note might have come from."


Above is part of the written article, but there is a video interview in three parts. For me, the sound in the videos is barely audible, so if anyone else can hear anything important, please let us know.

pinkpuddytat
03-22-2010, 05:05 PM
Talking about the 'note' slipped to the NBC producer:[/B] [I]"“I have no idea what the note is,” McMullin said. “I never saw the note. I saw it on TV after I got home, but that's the only knowledge that I have of it.” McMullin said that he had talked to others about the note. He said they didn’t know about it and that he had no explanation about where or who the note might have come from."

The note *listed* all the arrestees except Silsby and Coulter, but was signed only by Carla Thompson. My recollection is that at the time the note was passed, the men had been sent to a different prison, so only the women would have been physically present when the note was written, and they wouldn't have had any way of conferring with the men. It's actual content was minimal, and basically just conveyed the message that "we've been lied to" (and that's how "we" got into this mess), and the main point seemed to be to spell out that "we" consisted of everyone in the group except Silsby and Coulter.

It doesn't sound like McMullin has talked to Carla Thompson or Corinna Lankford about the note. Apart from Silsby, Coulter, and 17 year old Nicole Lankford, they were the only women present in the jail cell when the note was passed. It's possible that Carla and Corinna have been advised by counsel not to discuss the note (or anything else), but its content was so innocuous that I'm hard-pressed to believe they wouldn't at least acknowledge to McMullin that they (or at least one of them) were responsible for it.

Melly53
03-23-2010, 12:57 AM
I am a bit confused by this man's interview. He says that they only took children given to them by Orphanage Leaders. So who was the leader(s) and from what orphanage(s)? Also said regarding their supposed agency to agency quest for documents that he thought at least some of the documents had been prepared ahead of time, but he never saw any of the documents himself.

pinkpuddytat
03-23-2010, 01:38 AM
I am a bit confused by this man's interview. He says that they only took children given to them by Orphanage Leaders. So who was the leader(s) and from what orphanage(s)? Also said regarding their supposed agency to agency quest for documents that he thought at least some of the documents had been prepared ahead of time, but he never saw any of the documents himself.

As the note he knows nothing about said, they were lied to. Silsby had at least one local man rounding up children, and with her volunteers ready to believe anything and everything she told them, it certainly wasn't difficult for her to point to a guy who'd just dropped off a bunch of children and tell her clueless crew that he's an "orphanage leader".

truckbomb
03-23-2010, 01:51 PM
When one watches all three video interviews one comes away with a few thoughts.

First, the interview was not a journalistic triumph with all the softball questions being asked.

I would have asked, “Mr. McMullin, you were in the jail cell for at least several days with Silsby. You must have had an uneasy feeling after you realized after some time that the situation was more than a misunderstanding and that the documents were your salvation. Didn’t you ask Silsby at all whether she had them or where they were?

As for McMullin, he seems well into the Kool Aid. Even now he sees no fault in Silsby’s handling of the situation. McMullin has been in jail for three weeks under very adverse conditions and has no clue that anywhere in the world, even in Idaho, what they did in collecting the children could well sustain a charge of kidnapping.

I guess you have to be a cultist religious nut to tune out reality and common sense.

Take me to the Kool Aid Mr. Jones.

i.b.nora
03-23-2010, 08:05 PM
Two Idaho missionaries react to NBC's interview with Laura Silsby (http://www.ktvb.com/news/Two-Idaho-missionaries-react-to-NBCs-interview-with-Laura-Silsby-88969387.html)

by Scott Evans
Idaho's NewsChannel 7
Posted on March 23, 2010 at 5:43 PM

"NewsChannel 7 talked with Corinna Lankford and Carla Thompson about Dr. Nancy Snyderman's interview with Laura Silsby.

Both say the interview was out of line and based not on the facts.

The women are referring to a part in the story where the NBC reporter asked Silsby for her reaction to the nine who no longer in jail are distancing them from her.

"Have those, here in Idaho, stepped back from Laura Silsby?” asked NewsChannel 7.

“No, absolutely not. We all still stand right beside Laura and support her in everything that she did and everything that's happening now. We're all right with you Laura," said Lankford.

"In a sense she implied that we were not standing behind her, and in fact we are standing behind her 100 percent," said Thompson."

more...

Thompson says they did a prayer service for her and Lankford goes on to say they have sent her several letters letting her know she has their support. They said they are frustrated at inaccuracies of reporting but that they are waiting for Silsby to get out and get home safely before they will comment or expound or tell their story.

pinkpuddytat
03-23-2010, 10:51 PM
“No, absolutely not. We all still stand right beside Laura and support her in everything that she did and everything that's happening now. We're all right with you Laura," said Lankford.

"In a sense she implied that we were not standing behind her, and in fact we are standing behind her 100 percent," said Thompson."

more...

Thompson says they did a prayer service for her and Lankford goes on to say they have sent her several letters letting her know she has their support. They said they are frustrated at inaccuracies of reporting but that they are waiting for Silsby to get out and get home safely before they will comment or expound or tell their story.

Either these two are deep into the Kool-Aid too, or they're waiting until she's out to mention that she has their "support" in the same way they'd "support" anyone struggling with mental illness, addiction, etc.

These two WERE the only adults present besides Silsby and Coulter when one of them passed the note to an NBC News producer saying "We've been lied to", and listing the name of 8 of the arrested missionaries, while omitting Silsby's and Coulter's names. I don't believe for a second that 17 year old Nicole pulled that stunt by herself, without their knowledge and support, and signed Carla Thompson's name to it. Nor do I believe that an NBC News producer would have fabricated such a story and note (and if Lankford and Thompson want to claim he did, they should have made a public accusation to that effect a long time ago).

After hearing these two and McMullin give irrational interviews, I'm getting the sense that they may have been threatened, and/or warned that Silsby's life is in danger from the criminals she was mixed up with, and that speaking candidly about anything having to do with her Haiti/DR escapade could harm her chance of getting out of Haiti and back to the relative safety of the US. Even if they think she's a criminal and/or mentally ill, as devout Christians, they wouldn't want to do anything to hasten her death.

Lambada
03-24-2010, 02:51 AM
Sorry for my absence - no internet for the last 27 hours (one of the joys of living in Paradise!).

I have just watched all 3 McMullin interviews and a couple of things struck me. He probably meant well BUT............my reaction is 'oh dear, oh dear, oh dear'. Not the sort of personality you want traipsing around a foreign country at a time of disaster (or possibly at any time!). Complete lack of streetsmarts, no curiosity, little self-responsibility. Lots of 'I don't know' responses, some where he clearly did know but looked off camera for guidance (was a lawyer present?) as to how to respond. When asked if the Haitian judge required his presence back in Haiti, would he go - did he actually say 'I don't know'? If I was the judge, I would find that disrespectful to the Haitian judiciary. McMullin seemed to be saying it would be up to the State Dept. Well, I'm sure they would advise BUT in the interests of being tactful, wouldn't you say 'Yes if the judge requires me back, I'm not going to become a fugitive from Haitian justice' (even if you didn't mean it).

And when they finally came out of Court knowing they were about to be released, someone explained the terms of the release 'in broken English' & McMullin didn't listen??? OK he has a hearing problem, but wouldn't you ask one of the other 8? Unbelievable. They might have been told they were being released without financial bond but on the understanding that they should return if required (I think I read that somewhere back when they were released) and NOW he says he 'doesn't know' whether he would go back or not?

Yes truckbomb I agree the journalist didn't zero in on some of the crucial questions but he did do quite a good job of letting the interviewee show us the type of person he was.............I mean for example the classic bit where McMullin said he hadn't realised when they got to the jail that they were there as inmates, so he started telling the Haitian inmates about the Lord because he thought he was there to minister. No wonder the Haitian prisoners initially said they didn't speak any English. Did you notice the discrepancies? First saying it was hard to make themselves understood because no-one had English & then later saying a lot of people had English so they had to be careful what they said.

I can imagine what the visiting US Consul said to his colleagues after visiting this person in jail ;).

Btw on Puello, El Salvador are asking for extradition, either under the 1933 convention signed by both countries or under the convention for international organised crime:
Dan a juez solicitud para extraditar a Torres Puello (http://www.elsalvador.com/mwedh/nota/nota_completa.asp?idCat=6358&idArt=4632189)

Video here:

Fiscalía solicitó la extradición de Jorge Torres Puello (http://www.esmitv.com/vernoticia.aspx?id=7142)

jeff_jones
03-25-2010, 08:53 AM
More trouble in Idaho

http://www.idahostatesman.com/2010/03/25/1129686/silsbys-troubles-mount-at-home.html

-

truckbomb
03-25-2010, 11:01 AM
From the Idaho Statesman

Also Wednesday, Gerald Husch, an attorney who has been representing Silsby and Personal Shopper in a suit filed by former employee Robin Oliver, was granted his motion to be removed as attorney for Silsby and her company. An affidavit filed in connection with Husch's motion said he's owed $19,000, according to Oliver's attorney, John Kluksdal.

Kluksdal said Silsby and Personal Shopper have 20 days after receiving notice of Husch's withdrawal to notify the court of their plans; if they do not, Kluksdal can file for a default judgment.

Good luck collecting your $19,000 legal fee from jailbird Silsby, Counselor Husch. Did your representation agreement call for a retainer? No? Because it is a Wage and Hour claim that triggers attorneys fees? And she hit numbers like $19,000 before you woke up that there nay be no assets left in the failed company? What woke you up, the news that your client was in a Haitian jail with a bunch of Looney Tunes like her that make the Beverly Hillbillies look like Rhodes Scholars?

Get in line with the others she bilked, Counselor. Not all is lost. Those other scammed creditors and you can use the default judgments as toilet paper.

truckbomb
03-25-2010, 11:07 AM
Should have added above that attorneys fees awarded to Counselor if Silsby successfully defends Wage & Hour suit. He should have had a big retainer and, if he had one, hit her up for replenishment when she maxed it out.

Lambada
03-26-2010, 04:33 PM
A bit more here about the investigation leading to the arrest of Jorge Puello - Interpol Washington, ICE & USMS International Investigations Branch plus law enforcement in DR, Haiti, Canada & El Salvador.

Adviser In Haitian Kidnapping Case Iced (http://www.caribbeanworldnews.com/middle_top_news_detail.php?mid=3295)

pinkpuddytat
03-26-2010, 04:51 PM
From the Idaho Statesman article:
And Silsby's ex-husband, Terry Silsby, has filed for sole custody of their 5-year-old daughter and 15-year-old son. In early March, he also asked the courts to demand an immediate return of his children's passports, require that Silsby obtain "medical clearance" before any contact with their children, and give him sole legal ability to make all educational decisions for the children.
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2010/03/25/1129686/silsbys-troubles-mount-at-home.html

Interesting. Sounds like this was a formal petition to the court to require a psychiatric evaluation. Apparently it never happened (the requests were made *last* March, so possibly it did), but its probably a moot point now. Any psychiatrist looking at what this woman has been up to for the past few months would peg her as either a pathological liar, utterly out of touch with reality, or both. None of those reports to the court would support any unsupervised contact with the children, much less part-time custody. But the judge has the same access we do to all the media reports, and better access to formal records of US/Idaho court proceedings re her business fraud and Haitian court proceedings re her criminal escapade and imprisonment there, and isn't likely to see the need for a psych evaluation to back up a sole custody order for the father.

I really feel sorry for the kids, especially the 15 year old. The 5 year old is probably to young to really notice anything's wrong, but the 15 year old is at an age where he (and his friends) are certainly aware of *everything* that's been in the media, and the teen years are usually tough going even without this sort of mess as a backdrop.

Lambada
03-27-2010, 02:10 PM
Jorge Puello has now been moved from the DNCD custody cells to the 'extraditables' part of Najayo jail (viz. still in the DR).
Envían a Najayo dos hombres solicitados en extradición (http://www.listindiario.com.do/app/article.aspx?id=136433)

And I see from an El Salvador newspaper that the Minister of Justice there is saying that Puello was helped by ex-government functionaries from Migracion Dept. and Foreigners Ministry
Autoridades reportan 19 víctimas de trata de personas (http://www.diariocolatino.com/es/20100326/nacionales/78292/)
which sort of mirrors some of the accusations being made about a government functionary in the DR.

Lambada
03-29-2010, 01:42 AM
This from one of the DR newspapers tonight - looks like the US is also staking a claim on Jorge Torres Puello:
EE.UU. detalla historial acusado tráfico de personas (http://diariolibre.com.do/noticias_det.php?id=239819)

pinkpuddytat
03-29-2010, 03:07 AM
This from one of the DR newspapers tonight - looks like the US is also staking a claim on Jorge Torres Puello:

He's a very popular fellow :-)

Belinda
04-02-2010, 04:48 AM
Hi All - I have been following this case closely on here and several other sites. What I'm wondering is if anyone has any additional information on the Pickett's? I wonder if they have filed a legal complaint of any kind? I also wonder if, at some point, Silsby will be charged for trying to snatch the Pickett kids. As she was unsuccessful, I don't know if they will bother.

Lambada
04-03-2010, 02:55 AM
I recall a poster asking about John Duarte earlier in the thread.
Ontario priest gets 18 months for preying on Haitian youths (http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Ontario+priest+gets+months+preying+Haitian+youths/2757938/story.html)

Missizzy
04-03-2010, 03:24 AM
Lambada--It was me and I am appalled. This man, this priest, preyed on these young boys for years and single-handedly tainted a well-meaning charity (and squandered huge amounts of donated funds) for his own wicked desires. I was very disappointed.

I find it interesting that Duarte hid out in Puerto Plata until he was arrested and extradited. I find it hard to believe that he never ran into all our other players. From what I've read, he was a very brash and flashy guy. Thanks.

Belinda
04-03-2010, 04:50 AM
Duarte got 18 months? 18 months for sexually abusing children? Really? This is a joke. So, I wonder how quickly he can resume his activities after prison. Why are these men continually let go with a slap on the wrist so they can continue to hurt children? I am so disgusted I could spit. This is insane. :banghead:

Missizzy
04-03-2010, 11:45 AM
This article describes Duarte's dynamic personality and shows how he was able to garner the support he did. And it was a massive amount of support. He "could do no wrong" until he was exposed. He did some amazing acts of charity and seemed to work tirelessly. However, not one whit of this charity excuses his sexual abuse.


http://www.windsorstar.com/news/Windsor+priest+John+Duarte+arrested+alleged+child+ abuse+Haiti/2129327/story.html

"Duarte had been living in the impoverished village since October 2003, where he had been directing the affairs of the charitable group, which had built and was operating two schools, a health clinic and running a child and family sponsorship program.

The HTFH [Hearts Together for Haiti]leaders received information that parents were concerned Duarte was seducing adolescents in the community...."

and

"Duarte, his close-cropped hair dyed a brassy blonde at one time and sporting tattoos and a nipple ring, worked tirelessly for the poor in Haiti, according to charity workers."




http://www.windsorstar.com/entertainment/movie-guide/Former+Windsor+priest+John+Duarte+sentenced+months +prison/2753172/story.html


"With time served since his arrest, Duarte is expected to be free in eight months.

When he delivered the sentence, Justice Bruce Thomas admonished Duarte's supporters in the courtroom for treating the case as if it were a "persecution" rarther than a prosecution....."


I find it very sad that the voices of the young boys and teens were not heard. So Duarte "saved the boys the heartache and pain of testifying". Right. He didn't want the parishioners to hear the details translated in open court. How do the boys get justice or closure? I wish an attorney would assist them in suing the charity so that they might receive therapy for their abuse. I've read that he had favorites and withheld food and shelter from those boys who refused his advances. He is truly evil. My guess is that Duarte will be trolling for boys in Canada the day he is released, which according the article will be around Christmas!!

Lambada
04-03-2010, 01:49 PM
I find it interesting that Duarte hid out in Puerto Plata until he was arrested and extradited. I find it hard to believe that he never ran into all our other players. From what I've read, he was a very brash and flashy guy. Thanks.

He was apparently working as a dive instructor at one of the tourist hotels in Sosua when he was arrested. I started a thread on DR1 last October so you can trace the DR part from that
Canadian Missionary Arrested At Casa Marina (http://www.dr1.com/forums/north-coast/97014-canadian-missionary-arrested-casa-marina.html)

DR1 is upgrading today & will be on and off, the webmaster has posted, so if you can't access the thread, maybe try later.

Melly53
04-03-2010, 02:06 PM
This article describes Duarte's dynamic personality and shows how he was able to garner the support he did. And it was a massive amount of support. He "could do no wrong" until he was exposed. He did some amazing acts of charity and seemed to work tirelessly. However, not one whit of this charity excuses his sexual abuse.


http://www.windsorstar.com/news/Windsor+priest+John+Duarte+arrested+alleged+child+ abuse+Haiti/2129327/story.html

"Duarte had been living in the impoverished village since October 2003, where he had been directing the affairs of the charitable group, which had built and was operating two schools, a health clinic and running a child and family sponsorship program.

The HTFH [Hearts Together for Haiti]leaders received information that parents were concerned Duarte was seducing adolescents in the community...."

and

"Duarte, his close-cropped hair dyed a brassy blonde at one time and sporting tattoos and a nipple ring, worked tirelessly for the poor in Haiti, according to charity workers."




http://www.windsorstar.com/entertainment/movie-guide/Former+Windsor+priest+John+Duarte+sentenced+months +prison/2753172/story.html


"With time served since his arrest, Duarte is expected to be free in eight months.

When he delivered the sentence, Justice Bruce Thomas admonished Duarte's supporters in the courtroom for treating the case as if it were a "persecution" rarther than a prosecution....."


I find it very sad that the voices of the young boys and teens were not heard. So Duarte "saved the boys the heartache and pain of testifying". Right. He didn't want the parishioners to hear the details translated in open court. How do the boys get justice or closure? I wish an attorney would assist them in suing the charity so that they might receive therapy for their abuse. I've read that he had favorites and withheld food and shelter from those boys who refused his advances. He is truly evil. My guess is that Duarte will be trolling for boys in Canada the day he is released, which according the article will be around Christmas!!

12 charges and all he got was 18 months!?!?! UNBELIEVABLE!

Lambada
04-05-2010, 12:54 AM
Watch the video here:
Former Ont. priest sentenced to 18 months in prison (http://www.montrealgazette.com/entertainment/movie-guide/Former+priest+pleads+guilty+counts+sexual+interfer ence/2753310/story.html)

Click on video at top of page.

Missizzy
04-05-2010, 02:58 AM
Thank you, Lambada, I had missed the video. I have been to Haiti two times and I will never forget it. There is something unforgettable about the people, the land, the busy-ness. Maybe it is the pride of so many of the Haitians in the midst of what for most of us, would be utter desperation.

It seems to be a country always at the tipping point just one twist around the bend from disaster. It is rife with imperfections of its own but it seems despicable for foreigners--Duarte, Silsby, the UN workers who rape--to bring their own evil agendas into the midst of those who struggle so valiantly each day.

Lambada
04-06-2010, 11:26 PM
'It had been unclear whether Jorge Puello would be extradited to the U.S., where he is wanted on smuggling charges, or El Salvador, where authorities allege he led a prostitution ring.

Gisela Cueto, an assistant general prosecutor for the Dominican Republic, told The Associated Press on Monday that Puello will face extradition to the U.S. at an April 28 hearing even though the El Salvador charges are more serious. She said the Central American nation did not complete a formal extradition request.'
'Lawyer' for US missionaries faces US extradition (http://www.jconline.com/article/20100405/NEWS09/100405022)

No formal request??? See earlier posts on this subject.

truckbomb
04-09-2010, 12:20 AM
While I am not in country and do not have the contacts and valuable resources of Lambada, I do have some sources whao have confirmed the following:


When Jorge was hired by the church in Idaho he went to Silsby and the others in the Haitian jail.

There Silsby gave him some documents from the Dominican Republic, perhaps the lease of the Catholic church hotel.

On the papers Jorge saw the name of the woman lawyer, Santos, and contacted her. At that point Jorge suspected that Santos was organizing paper documents authorizing passage of Silsby and her group into the DR with a number of "orphans."

The Santos plan was for Silsby to bring or cause the church to make a substantial payment upon crossing the border ($12,000). When Silsby arrived with the children she did not have the promised money, the plan failed. Silsby went to real DR authorities in Port au Prince and was told by the Counsel that taking the children from Haiti was illegal. Silsby was arrested upon her return to the border.

Then Jorge discovered that there was an illegal trafficking ring where the General and Santos were in charge.

I cannot vouch for the veracity of this assertion but it seems credible to me given the facts that we know. Let's see how this all pans out.

The good news: Silsby remains in jail, the Haitian judge seems to be in no hurry, and the Mississippi flows unvexed to the sea.