CA - American students catch heat for wearing red, white & blue on Cinco de Mayo

[Kimberlyd125]

Living in America doesn't mean you have to completely erase your heritage and background. That's what makes us so great, the diversity and varying heritages. We SHOULD be celebrating those, even those who aren't that heritage. We should be celebrating heritages respectfully though, which is where we fall short, sadly. Americans use other heritages as excuses to get obliterated, which is gross, IMHO.

Americans use other heritages as excuses to get obliterated?

That's a huge leap of stereotyping and using very broad strokes.

Did you mean some Americans?

Because I would never say Mexican-Americans use their own heritages as an excuse to climb flag poles and hang the American flag upside down under the Mexican flag. Some did. But I would never group people all together by the actions of some.

And I never get "obliterated" on Cinco de mayo, St Patricks day, Mardi Gras...
And I am an American.
JMO

ETA: and just because an American doesn't join in a celebration, does not mean they are trying to erase them. We all have rights here.

 

[sonjay]

Living in America doesn't mean you have to completely erase your heritage and background. That's what makes us so great, the diversity and varying heritages. We SHOULD be celebrating those, even those who aren't that heritage. We should be celebrating heritages respectfully though, which is where we fall short, sadly. Americans use other heritages as excuses to get obliterated, which is gross, IMHO.

Being an American living in America means you don't have to erase your American heritage and background. That's what protects us against racist bigots who would prevent us from showing our patriotism and love of country.

Other heritages use their heritage as an excuse to attempt to browbeat Americans into silence and submission. Those of us who love America and who love freedom will always stand up against that kind of oppressive, racist and immoral fascism.

 

[sonjay]

Those boys don't even go to that school anymore. As a matter of fact none of the current students even attended the school when that incident happened. So waving flags in the faces of current students who had nothing to do with it, is just racism at it worst.

The school continued to ban the American flag until just a few days ago. Merely because the original victims of oppression have moved on doesn't mean that true lovers of freedom should allow the school the continue oppressing the minority-white student body at that school. I'm so thankful there were free-speech-supporting freedom lovers who didn't let that oppressive behavior by the school continue indefinitely. It went on for much too long as it was. Justice delayed is justice denied.

At least the flag-waving protesters protested peacefully. Funny, I always thought peaceful protests were a Good Thing. The flag-waving protesters didn't riot, loot stores, set fires or start shooting people. That kind of behavior is engaged in only by those who are willing to use violence to silence people they don't agree with.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

I'm pretty sure it was a given that it was a broad generalization and I didn't literally mean every single American. JMO. I'll be sure to be excruciatingly specific from now so as to avoid twisting of my words.

I most certainly did not twist any words. I copied them. Exact.

My point is, making broad generalizations is one of the biggest problems with topics such as the one of this thread.

For example, it often leads to people who aren't at all racist being bunched in and stereotyped because of the actions of others just because they share the same skin color color or background.

JMO

I don't have a racist bone in my body. And I am a white American. My family has been here since the 1620's. I come from a long line of Veterans. I love my country and have strong faith. I fly a flag when appropriate and feel an overwhelming sense of pride when I see a man or woman in uniform. Sometimes to the point of tears. I love to study American history. I love baseball (and of course softball) and apple pie.
I realize some people who share my background are racist.
I would hate to be seen that way because of the actions of some.

I just wish we could all agree on at least that.

JMO

 

[Nova]

I totally disagree. It's not a technical legalism. What you are advocating is that one group of people can suppress the First Amendment rights of another group by whining that they're offended by the American flag, FFS!

Offensive and/or provocative speech is exactly the type of speech that needs protecting.

Free speech as long as no one's "offended" by it is not free speech.

That is not at all what I argued. What I said was something you have also said in previous posts: schools with underage students are special circumstances requiring freedom from disruption.

And, frankly, I think it's disingenuous of you to keep insisting the rest of us are arguing that anyone has a right to not be offended. I don't believe anybody here has said that. What we've said--and what at least some courts have ruled--is that students have a right to attend school without disruption. Wearing U.S. iconography on Cinco de Mayo is an obvious FU to Mexicans celebrating their heritage (particularly since the events commemorated had nothing to do with the U.S.) and is therefore unnecessarily disruptive.

 

[Tawny]

Being an American living in America means you don't have to erase your American heritage and background. That's what protects us against racist bigots who would prevent us from showing our patriotism and love of country.

Other heritages use their heritage as an excuse to attempt to browbeat Americans into silence and submission. Those of us who love America and who love freedom will always stand up against that kind of oppressive, racist and immoral fascism.

Who is erasing American heritage?

 

[Tawny]

I most certainly did not twist any words. I copied them. Exact.

My point is, making broad generalizations is one of the biggest problems with topics such as the one of this thread.

For example, it often leads to people who aren't at all racist being bunched in and stereotyped because of the actions of others just because they share the same skin color color or background.

JMO

I don't have a racist bone in my body. And I am a white American. My family has been here since the 1620's. I come from a long line of Veterans. I love my country and have strong faith. I fly a flag when appropriate and feel an overwhelming sense of pride when I see a man or woman in uniform. Sometimes to the point of tears. I love to study American history. I love baseball (and of course softball) and apple pie.
I realize some people who share my background are racist.
I would hate to be seen that way because of the actions of some.

I just wish we could all agree on at least that.

JMO

You're going to have to direct your comments about being called racist elsewhere, because I made no such claims.

 

[Nova]

Nova, I lost the ablility to thank these posts. Just wanted to let you know that I did!:clap::clap::clap:

Thanks, Linas. I too lost the "thanks" function, so just assume I would have thanked you if I could have.

The same goes for lots of other posters, including those who disagree with me.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

Who is erasing American heritage?

Who is erasing anyone's heritage?
Can heritages be erased?

JMO

 

[Tawny]

These are the very reasons uniforms in school are necessary.

 

[sonjay]

The fact that your family fought and died for that flag, doesn't make it right for you to antagonize hispanic students at a predominately Mexican school by waving your flag in their faces on Cinco de Mayo.

There is a time and place for everything. If you want to show your patriotism, then go wave your flag at a celebration on the Forth of July, not at a predominately Mexican school on Cinco de Mayo.

Nobody was waving their flag in anyone's face. They were wearing t-shirts with the flag on it.

There's not a time and place for everything. There is no time and no place for prohibiting students from wearing any national flag or any national colors of their choice, any time they want to. That is anti-freedom, oppressive, and discriminatory.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

You're going to have to direct your comments about being called racist elsewhere, because I made no such claims.

Never said you did.
You did say you we're making broad generalizations. I made the point that making broad generalizations is a huge issue when it comes to topics such as this.

I may have expanded on my original thought. I apologize if my post in any way seemed to accuse you in particular of anything. It was not my intention.

ETA:
Looking over my post, I don't think I did.
I made my point, then gave an example. I never implied you made racist claims.

JMO

 

[Tawny]

Never said you did.
You did say you we're making broad generalizations. I made the point that making broad generalizations is a huge issue when it comes to topics such as this.

I may have expanded on my original thought. I apologize if my post in any way seemed to accuse you in particular of anything. It was not my intention.

ETA:
Looking over my post, I don't think I did.
I made my point, then gave an example. I never implied you made racist claims.

JMO

Well, I didn't think I gave the impression that I was speaking about every single American when discussing how we as Americans are generally known for using 'holidays' like St Patrick's Day and Cinco de Mayo as an excuse to drink copious amounts of alcohol, so I guess we're even

 

[sonjay]

Who is erasing American heritage?

Morgan Hill School was, until they finally stopped.

Now: Who was erasing Mexican heritage — as you claimed?

The answer is, no one. No student at Morgan Hill School was prevented from wearing or displaying the Mexican flag or from celebrating Cinco de Mayo or from expressing their pride in their heritage.

Only the American students were prevented from showing pride in their heritage. That's oppressive and discriminatory, and highly offensive.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

Generalizations again. I'm so glad I'm not defined by someone else's generalizations.

 

[Mystymiss]

With all this talk! I'm going out to my favorite Mexican restaurant tomorrow
wearing my red white and blue shirt (with that American flag sewed on the pocket) to celebrate mothers day (day early) with my boys. Wonder if
I will be turned away!.

 

[Nova]

Apparently, the very symbol of the United States of America is now racist and offensive. And the sensitive children at the Morgan Hill School need to be protected from the mere sight of the flag, lest they suffer irreversible emotional trauma.

You started out in this thread making the most knowledgeable and well-reasoned posts. Now you've succumbed to sarcasm just because everyone didn't immediately accept your conclusions.

What a shame...

 

[Nova]

I just can't wrap my mind around it.
Should I take my flag down? You know I am a white woman. I don't want my neighbors, who I love dearly BTW, to think I'm racist.

SMH

That flag stands for freedom for all races. It does not discriminate. All races have fought for and died for what that flag represents.
We should ALL be proud of the flag. It's not just 13 stripes and 50 stars painted on some fabric to look pretty.
It's a symbol of freedom and democracy.


JMO

Of course you should fly the flag if you want to do so. Whether you should wear it to middle school is another matter.

 

[Nova]

WTH?? Un-freaking-real



I think everyone of those students should be made to wear US flag shirts on a US holiday like, oh I dunno, let's pick Memorial Day. If they fail to do so, they should be kicked out of school because they might start a gang war.

Sounds stupid to me but hey, fair game.

You've hit on the problem! Days that celebrate the U.S. are already HOLIDAYS! Kids don't go to school on those days. They can wear whatever they want

 

[Nova]

Wouldn't this typically be an argument in favor of making extra-special efforts to protect the free speech of the oppressed minority at that school?

I'm shocked at how willing so many people are to throw our precious first amendment rights under the bus, just because they don't like the message.

Every single post on this thread supporting the oppression of free speech is a perfect example of why free speech must be protected, and must be exercised regularly.

sonjay, if you will think back (or reread the thread) you will be reminded that many of us think the vice-principal erred in demanding the kids remove their flag-wear. What we have been discussing--quite reasonably until today--was the difference between "free speech" in society at large and free speech in a special environment for children, such as a school.

I applaud your vigorous support of the First Amendment, but it rather misses the point here.