Laura Babcock Murder Trial 11.23.17 - Day 21

[tmar]

Thank you mimimic. I'm doing okay, very sweet of you to ask. :tyou:

Kamille.
I am sending you my kind thoughts during this sorrowful time.

 

[james9]

Ok theorists......who do you think the defense is going to call as witnesses?

ETA - for the life of me the only defense witness in the TB trial I can recall is MS.....

I think CN will be called, just so that DM can see her and talk to her. I don't think MS will testify this time around. I think he already has a chance on getting off M1, so why risk a cross examination by DM?

 

[james9]

Maybe DM can come up with reports of stray/dead deer in the area or the contacts for the 2 jobs in Barrie.
DM may call CN just for the fun of it.
Don't see Dungay doing anything, he's not got anything to refute. He can leave it to himself (whom he can trust!) to interpret the evidence in his closing address.

There were no reports of dead deer, and there were no contacts in Barrie for incinerator jobs. Those were made up, so there will be no reason to call anyone to the stand. (IMO)

 

[Inspector_North]

Millard didn’t get ‘contact’ visits. I wanna know how the letters got from Millard to his mother.

And vice versa.

 

[NoodlesMcgee]

Millard didn’t get ‘contact’ visits. I wanna know how the letters got from Millard to his mother.

Knowing DM - he probably convinced his mom to do something unsettling.

 

[RezButt]

I think CN will be called, just so that DM can see her and talk to her. I don't think MS will testify this time around. I think he already has a chance on getting off M1, so why risk a cross examination by DM?

I think the likelihood of that happening is on par with Wayne Millard being called as a witness, respectfully of course.

 

[matou]

Was there a part of the letter where he reminds CN of a trip they took together on the water?

 

[JuneBug67]

I think that similar to the TB trail, DM leaves such a wide swath of evidence that MS’s footprint starts to look small in comparison. I think that if you just remove DM like he didn’t exist in this case and then examine the evidence against MS then an M1 for him becomes obvious

JMO of course

I think that first part is definitely true, and as you say one has to consider that it is very likely an illusion. But I'm still grappling with your second part. What either of them did after is not proof of the facts of her murder. Either man could have been willing to help the other cover a murder or accidental death he wasn't responsible for. The planning with the incinerator before could be evidence of premeditation, but only if it can be proven it was intended for Laura and MS knew that and aided in the plan by researching and testing the incinerator. Some feel that the love triangle theory provides this proof. The facts of the 24 hours between July 3 and July 4 are the most confounding as it relates to MS. Except for the highly-suspicious-but-perhaps-explainable 'don't be out front' and 'spliff' exchanges it looks all the world like a guy who has no idea a death is occurring under his nose. We have to assume Marlena was there. DM is the arbiter of the disposition of Laura's possessions, plugs the iPad in on his own, seems to handle all the early phone disposal and body transporting on his own. Smich eventually rolls out of bed at 3 pm and tries to get out of chores at Maple Gate because of the rain. It's just so low key and ordinary for the presumed circumstances, that it's just not clear.

I think part of the struggle for me is the question of just what DM is capable of? He's just so off. He drives a 100,000 dollars into a swamp. He spends a zillion dollars racing a car for 6 miles in Mexico. As Shane testified, he's just a guy that breaks stuff. No anticipation of the results of his actions and no apparent fear of any consequences. A guy like that could kill a girl, on purpose or on accident, in a blink. And then what are you gonna do? All there is to do is clean up. There's really something wrong with him. It just begs for rolling around the possibilities in your head.

 

[Woodland]

Now I see why there was no preliminary hearing and understand the decision to go straight to trial.

I can also see why DM decided not to spend $300k or whatever on a lawyer.

 

[Stratocaster]

There's no doubt in my mind that MS knew about the overall 'grand’ plan from the first time DM instructed SS to build a home made incinerator in the spring of 2012. Maybe MS didn't know who, or when, until the details were hashed out at the titty bar, but I'm of strong opinion that he knew the master plan all along.

On a different note, the case(s) are local to me, and after driving by the hangar this afternoon, like I have many many times since Millardair built it, I noticed a beehive of activitiy of about 8 vehicles parked there and 4-5 planes near the service doors. Looks to a fully functioning operation. And I always say a micro-prayer in my mind when I'm passing the hangar for the horrible events that transpired there.

 

[Oreck]

Hi I am thinking MM was there but either doesn't remember being there that specific date as nothing stands out or she saw absolutely nothing. It is best for DA not to bring up as it would look good for MS and DM won't bring up as he is trying to pin on MS. I think DA is hoping MS will be raged by this and recant against DM and in process throw himself under bus. If I were MS attorney I would nothing as it all looks bad on DM and the jury were instructed the letters are against DM not MS by judge
I am also thinking MS didn't participate in actual act but fence sitting on the beforehand knowledge but he most certainly assisted in aftermath
Also Sea En looks worse after the letters it's as if she is aware beforehand he is involved - and okay with it ?maybe due to what we didn't see but I don't understand why she hasn't been charged with anything
Here's hoping she is on stand and gets charged with perjury !
All MOO


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don't think MS will say anything.
As I said in a post in the TB trial, MS does not want to go into prison with a name like Smitsh the Snitch.

 

[Inspector_North]

Was there a part of the letter where he reminds CN of a trip they took together on the water?

Yes, the North Channel. She was most likely one of the women reported to sail with him from Manitoulin.

 

[ABro]

It’s hearsay when the accused writes them?

He admitted to writing them in an agreed statement of facts. It's only hearsay in the most technical possible interpretation, ie that the letters are an "out-of-court statement."

 

[NoodlesMcgee]

I think part of the struggle for me is the question of just what DM is capable of? He's just so off. He drives a 100,000 dollars into a swamp. He spends a zillion dollars racing a car for 6 miles in Mexico. As Shane testified, he's just a guy that breaks stuff. No anticipation of the results of his actions and no apparent fear of any consequences. A guy like that could kill a girl, on purpose or on accident, in a blink. And then what are you gonna do? All there is to do is clean up. There's really something wrong with him. It just begs for rolling around the possibilities in your head.

I think this theory is from Abro's book but I think he's a thrill seeking killer. Off road racing, sky diving, stealing, etc. Even his killings progress - high risk victim in LB, older reclusive guy in his dad and then a stranger. In the TB murder - there was hunting and following people around (although we don't know if he did that with TB). https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/wicked-deeds/201509/the-zodiac-and-other-thrill-killers

 

[RezButt]

It doesn’t matter that DM is representing himself, this is exactly like the TB trial. The only defense is the cutthroat defense, pointing the finger at ‘the other guy.’ If either of them takes the stand or presents evidence, get ready for a few days worth of legal arguments to decide what is ‘in’ and what is ‘out.’ It’s well established that LE arrested the right people in terms of culpability. DM and Dungey will have to walk a fine line in terms of what is incriminating and what is not.

Either way, if one or both of them take the stand, I am steadfast in my feeling that users of this site and the public will ‘believe’ whatever is said in terms of ‘narrative’ and I think that only comes from the desire to know the unknown. Just like TB there’s only 3 people who know what actually happened. One of them is dead and the other two are charged with planning that death.

 

[matou]

I can also see why DM decided not to spend $300k or whatever on a lawyer.

Haha so true.

 

[JuneBug67]

There's no doubt in my mind that MS knew about the overall 'grand’ plan from the first time DM instructed SS to build a home made incinerator in the spring of 2012. Maybe MS didn't know who, or when, until the details were hashed out at the titty bar, but I'm of strong opinion that he knew the master plan all along.

On a different note, the case(s) are local to me, and after driving by the hangar this afternoon, like I have many many times since Millardair built it, I noticed a beehive of activitiy of about 8 vehicles parked there and 4-5 planes near the service doors. Looks to a fully functioning operation. And I always say a micro-prayer in my mind when I'm passing the hangar for the horrible events that transpired there.

I think that's the part that is missing to me - I agree Smich was in on the 'grand plan', at least the vision DM was pitching at the time. But what was that grand plan? What was it? I never accepted that it was for a truck and I don't yet accept that it was for Laura. And, btw, who or what was in the incinerator in August? Someone or something new? I feel like there is a piece we are missing with the incinerator that would finally make things make sense.

 

[Ms.elle]

I suspect it's just a mild preview of the case he'll present. That'll be a full opportunity for him to unleash his obnoxiousness. I wouldn't be surprised if CN does testify if he dares ask her about what an amazing lover he thinks he is.

 

[deugirtni]

[FONT=&amp]Lisa Hepfner‏ @HefCHCHNews [video=twitter;933821822952525824]https://twitter.com/HefCHCHNews/status/933821822952525824[/video]More


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[FONT=&amp]Dellen Millard letter found in Christina Noudga’s bedroom. Full story 6pm @CHCHNews
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Really too funny. MM should've asked DM to spell 'disappeared' (among other words).. his arrogance astounds me.

 

[don_quixote]

The letters definitely are incriminating.... Without of the letters DM was likely to be convicted. With the letters it's a sealed deal.

For MS, the letters are probably not such a bad thing. Can't be admitted against MS. How could it be bad? Removes any doubts that LB's life ended there and then. But if MS really was at fault, DM wouldn't have to make up all these stories. Truth is almost invariably very simple.

What he made up is worthy of a cheap fiction novel. He went to CN (!) early in the morning (!) to tap on her window (!) and then somehow they see MS and LB enjoying cocaine in the basement (!). Why not say "MS got enraged with LB's comment about his rapping ability, grabbed a knife and stabbed her in the chest"? That's how some 75% of homicides happen, I imagine.

I wonder if Dungey participated in the arguments at all. And if he did, then on which side?

At this point DM has absoposilutely nothing to lose and all bets are off.