The Springfield Three--missing since June 1992 - #1

[Ken]

I'm not a dentist but I believe that the use of mercury dental fillings stopped long before Suzie & Stacy would have ever been to a dentist in their lifetime. Perhaps Sherrill had some old fillings which had never been replaced. But those would have to have been some pretty old fillings. Most old mercury based fillings have been replaced by now because they break. See how many people you can find today in their 50's or older, who still have these mercury based fillings that have not been replaced.

My vote says that what you are seeing is just some old decaying tree limbs. Nothing more.

Hurricane, please read this article from the American Dental Association. Dental Amalgrams containing mercury are still being used today. They are currently in use because they are safe, durable, easy to use, and relatively inexpensive.
http://www.ada.org/public/topics/fillings.asp


The family of the Oklahoma Three is convinced there is more to it than "decaying tree limbs".

 

[Ken]

Getting back to the basics of my post, let me condense this down to just a couple of questions for you to answer:

*How can Stacy McCall not be one of the bodies there when she gave you explicit detail as to her whereabouts?

*How can the remains now be just a "bag of bones"?

Hurricane, I believe I answered these two questions in my long post on page 22.

 

[Hurricane]

Hurricane, please read this article from the American Dental Association. Dental Amalgrams containing mercury are still being used today. They are currently in use because they are safe, durable, easy to use, and relatively inexpensive.
http://www.ada.org/public/topics/fillings.asp


The family of the Oklahoma Three is convinced there is more to it than "decaying tree limbs".

Mercury is also used to preserve wood by inhibiting the growth of wood rotting fungi. As a result mercury is one of the heavy metals present in rotting wood. Tim Gray's scanner may very well be picking up the mercury from decaying tree limbs or rotting construction trash. He acknowledges in the video that it could be decaying tree limbs, does he not?

The fact that the family of the Oklahoma 3 is convinced is nothing more than their wish to bring closure to their case. Do they have any evidence that puts their missing family members there?

 

[Hurricane]

Hurricane, I believe I answered these two questions in my long post on page 22.

What you have proposed is that the bodies were previously buried in eastern Greene County and then moved just prior to the pouring of the concrete as a "bag of bones" and reburied. Did I understand your point correctly?

My question then is how could this be, when the reports from the scans that were conducted indicate that the bodies are laying side by side, shoulder to shoulder? The reports from the scans that those of you who were involved have given us do not confirm that what was seen was a bunch of scattered bones.

 

[Ken]

The Springfield Police Department's slogan on their website is "Partnering with the Community..."

IF the SPD were to core out the anomaly at the parking garage, it would be good Public Relations for them regardless of the outcome. Whether or not there are remains or tree roots, they can publically say that they are willing to "Partner with the Community..."

They have a tremendous opportunity in front of them.

 

[Ken]

Mercury is also used to preserve wood by inhibiting the growth of wood rotting fungi. As a result mercury is one of the heavy metals present in rotting wood. Tim Gray's scanner may very well be picking up the mercury from decaying tree limbs or rotting construction trash. He acknowledges in the video that it could be decaying tree limbs, does he not?

The fact that the family of the Oklahoma 3 is convinced is nothing more than their wish to bring closure to their case. Do they have any evidence that puts their missing family members there?

Hurricane, before I respond to this post, can you please explain in detail the reasoning behind your faulty post about dental fillings. Nothing that you had written concerning dental fillings was correct.

 

[Hurricane]

Hurricane, before I respond to this post, can you please explain in detail the reasoning behind your faulty post about dental fillings. Nothing that you had written concerning dental fillings was correct.

I did read the link you provided concerning the fillings; I stand corrected. I assumed that any mercury based fillings went the way with mercury batteries, etc.

However I still believe that the amount of mercury in decaying tree limbs and in the soil could give a false reading.

 

[Missouri Mule]

The Springfield Police Department's slogan on their website is "Partnering with the Community..."

IF the SPD were to core out the anomaly at the parking garage, it would be good Public Relations for them regardless of the outcome. Whether or not there are remains or tree roots, they can publically say that they are willing to "Partner with the Community..."

They have a tremendous opportunity in front of them.

Except they would then have to address the facts. This parking lot controversy plays to their advantage to stonewall the issue as that takes everyone's eyes off the other proven facts they refuse to talk about.

They will not core unless the family members insist on it. There is no sign that is in the offing. The cops won't and don't want to discuss the case. So they get to have their cake and eat it too. They just keep on saying it is the conspiracy addicts feeding the story and claim there is nothing there. And they are getting by with it. This is why I have said that interested people should look at known and published facts. That they can't ignore.

 

[Trooogrit]

OK Ken you got your point across, no need to push it, as it runs people off. I realize you feel quite confident about that location and what you saw, but its not the only information that has come in about the case. Its a shame that the police dont just dig it to eliminate it from the mix. I would focus on shoring up more information on that spot. Documenting every possible tip that led to that spot outside of psychic visions. I have only found 1 other person that ever mentioned that site. So the more facts gathered the better, and potentially finding people that worked that site. They said they would dig if they had more evidence. Find that then proceed?

 

[Ken]

OK Ken you got your point across, no need to push it, as it runs people off.

If your methodology is correct, then why do we see the same advertisements over and over and over again in the media? If what you are saying is true; pharmaceutical sales should have tanked a long time ago.

If you want something that runs people off, choose Apathy.

 

[Trooogrit]

Force feeding your opinion has run people off here before. Not everyone agrees with your opinion. I have looked at it very closely. To the extent of writing letters to the other man who posted the rumors about Cox Hospital, unfortunately he did not respond. I can only go by what I am told is there. I can only go by what is at best controversial in nature. I would just like to hear the kind of stories about the Cox site that you hear about PFI sight? Where are the rumors?. I am not interested in visions, I have no proof that is possible. The technology used to scan the concrete is reliable, now find some more evidence pointing to the spot. Its pretty simple. I dont think you are gonna get the dig done until there is more evidence pointing there.

 

[Ken]

Force feeding your opinion has run people off here before. Not everyone agrees with your opinion. I have looked at it very closely. To the extent of writing letters to the other man who posted the rumors about Cox Hospital, unfortunately he did not respond. I can only go by what I am told is there. I can only go by what is at best controversial in nature. I would just like to hear the kind of stories about the Cox site that you hear about PFI sight? Where are the rumors?. I am not interested in visions, I have no proof that is possible. The technology used to scan the concrete is reliable, now find some more evidence pointing to the spot. Its pretty simple. I dont think you are gonna get the dig done until there is more evidence pointing there.

When the thread died out last October 1st, I got blamed for running people off even though I hadn't posted anything since July 6th. I hadn't written anything for three months. I guess I can write something today and run people off three months later LOL.

With that being said, Tim Gray is what leads us to the parking garage, not my vision. Tim is the one who discovered the anomaly at the parking garage. My vision had nothing to do with it. When I met with him back in 2006, he told me that he was 150 yards away from the parking garage when his instrument picked up the signal for mercury. He was able to narrow the signal down to the spot in question.

Cox Hospital is an area that he would have checked anyways, regardless of my vision. Cox Hospital would have been a reasonable area to check with his technology simply because of the amount of construction that took place in early 90's.

Again, at the risk of running people off, Tim Gray is what leads us to the parking garage, not my vision.

 

[Trooogrit]

I am not talking about that. I am talking about why you were looking there in the first place. Find more information that points to that location as a burial, whether it is tips, rumors or whatever. That would solidify your scans as real evidence and the police will have to dig. I have not seen much in the way of rumors or tips that point there, and I believe that the police dont think it is possible. Therefore they wont dig.

 

[Hurricane]

With that being said, Tim Gray is what leads us to the parking garage, not my vision. Tim is the one who discovered the anomaly at the parking garage. My vision had nothing to do with it. When I met with him back in 2006, he told me that he was 150 yards away from the parking garage when his instrument picked up the signal for mercury. He was able to narrow the signal down to the spot in question.

How did he know that he wasn't just picking up a signal for mercury from someone with dental fillings in the car next to him? There had to be people all around him within 150 yards with fillings in their mouth.

 

[Ken]

I am not talking about that. I am talking about why you were looking there in the first place. Find more information that points to that location as a burial, whether it is tips, rumors or whatever. That would solidify your scans as real evidence and the police will have to dig. I have not seen much in the way of rumors or tips that point there, and I believe that the police dont think it is possible. Therefore they wont dig.

There is another possibility. The SPD may still be in the process of investigating this lead. Several months after announcing on television that they had no intentions of digging; they were in the process of doing a background check on Tim Gray.

Tim works as a subcontractor for the EPA in Homeland Security and he has a very high security clearance. It set off red flags when the SPD tried to do a backgound check. Tim mentioned that his boss alerted him to what was happening.

Maybe that is why the SPD has been tight lipped lately.

 

[Ken]

How did he know that he wasn't just picking up a signal for mercury from someone with dental fillings in the car next to him? There had to be people all around him within 150 yards with fillings in their mouth.

That is another $64,000 question and it's a good one. It's a question that only Tim Gray can answer. Tim has told me on many occasions: "Ken, I can't tell you how it works. I can just tell you that it does."

 

[Ken]

I am not talking about that. I am talking about why you were looking there in the first place. Find more information that points to that location as a burial, whether it is tips, rumors or whatever. That would solidify your scans as real evidence and the police will have to dig. I have not seen much in the way of rumors or tips that point there, and I believe that the police dont think it is possible. Therefore they wont dig.

Trooogrit, there is something else. After Tim Gray made the discovery in April 2006; Cpl. Higdon from the SPD wanted to see a demonstration of Tim's instrument. Tim refused to show the SPD how his technology works. Tim told me that he was concerned that his instrument would be confiscated. Tim did have phone conversations with Cpl. Higdon a few times and Major Ijames on at least one occasion. Needless to say, they didn't go well.

Because of this, we asked Rick Norland to do an independent scan. We didn't videotape Tim's scan, so we wanted to make sure that we videotaped Rick Norland's scan. Part of us was hoping that Rick's GPR scan would come up negative. Because if it did, we could write Tim off as a quack and move on to something else. However, when Rick's GPR scan supported what Tim was saying; it created a conundrum.

I personally believe that for Tim to have randomly picked the spot in question is astronomical; whether or not there are three tree roots or three sets of bones buried there.

 

[Hurricane]

That is another $64,000 question and it's a good one. It's a question that only Tim Gray can answer. Tim has told me on many occasions: "Ken, I can't tell you how it works. I can just tell you that it does."

Ken,

One hundred fifty yards would be the equivalent of standing in the middle of three football fields, end to end. Everything within that 150 yard radius containing mercury would set off a signal on Gray's scanner. How did Gray null out all other signals and hone in on what may only be five or six, maybe even a dozen dental fillings that belonged to the missing three?

The hospital would certainly be within this radius. Think about all of the sources of mercury producing signals from there; a hundred or more patients, nurses, and doctors all with dental fillings in their mouths; mercury switches, thermostats, thermometers, wood, and who knows what else containing mercury and producing such signals would all be in that hospital.

How can Gray's scanner ignore all of these sources of mercury signals and hone in on a location that he supposedly has no prior knowledge of?

For him to get away with just saying "Ken, I can't tell you how it works. I can just tell you that it does." only adds to the lack of credibility of him, and of those involved in the scan who did not ask such questions and demand appropriate answers before taking the results as being worthy.

You wanted him to find the results you wanted, and where you wanted them.

 

[Hurricane]

After Tim Gray made the discovery in April 2006; Cpl. Higdon from the SPD wanted to see a demonstration of Tim's instrument. Tim refused to show the SPD how his technology works. Tim told me that he was concerned that his instrument would be confiscated.

Why didn't SPD just get a court order to compel Gray to comply with the demonstration? After all Gray entered the case when he conducted his scan. I'm not sure if SPD would have any legal right to confiscate his equipment. We would need a lawyer to answer that.

If I had this piece of technology that was cutting edge, I would welcome the chance to receive an endorsement of it's legitimacy by a police department. It certainly would go a long way in marketing your services.

 

[Trooogrit]

Trooogrit, there is something else. After Tim Gray made the discovery in April 2006; Cpl. Higdon from the SPD wanted to see a demonstration of Tim's instrument. Tim refused to show the SPD how his technology works. Tim told me that he was concerned that his instrument would be confiscated. Tim did have phone conversations with Cpl. Higdon a few times and Major Ijames on at least one occasion. Needless to say, they didn't go well.

Because of this, we asked Rick Norland to do an independent scan. We didn't videotape Tim's scan, so we wanted to make sure that we videotaped Rick Norland's scan. Part of us was hoping that Rick's GPR scan would come up negative. Because if it did, we could write Tim off as a quack and move on to something else. However, when Rick's GPR scan supported what Tim was saying; it created a conundrum.

I personally believe that for Tim to have randomly picked the spot in question is astronomical; whether or not there are three tree roots or three sets of bones buried there.

Ok now the whole story is coming out. When I first heard about this I focused on this "new technology" of Tim Gray. GPR is not as reliable. The GPR scan has been used in other cases and will show disturbances consistent with burial, but not always will there be a body in that spot. What you need is to promote this new technology of Tim Gray. Give it an acid test of sorts. Convince them that it works as you say it does. I also would document more rumors about that site. If you want the dig done you need to do some more work in my opinion. They have made a stand on what you have so far, and it probably isnt gonna happen without more evidence pointing to that sight, and more demonstrations of the technology Tim Gray uses. To tell someone "I dont know how it works, I just know it does" is.........very unreliable.