Nancy Grace - Monday, November 17, 2008

[trac]

I'm still trying to figure out what new evidence was found. Lee said they found new evidence....
Didn't LE go over this car with a fine tooth comb?
And it was my understanding that Lee was allowed to look at this car but not touch it (I heard that on news clips). Yet he found new evidence just by looking?
I wish I knew what this "new" evidence was.

And yes, I also thought the car had been cleaned out by the A's. Sheesh, what twists and turns.

We have to remember to take everything that the defense says with a grain of salt - especially Dr. Lee - he has fumbled quite a few cases - I've stopped taking a lot of stock in what he says - unfortunately

 

[MaryAnn]

Morgan............Casey will have to give a deposition of drop the lawsuit against ZG

That's the only positive thing about this case. The fact that Casey picked the stupidest (I know that's now a word) Attorney in the U.S. Jose has to be the biggest jerk!! He didn't know he wasn't supposed to have his hands all over her? Come on?? He didn't know Casey would have to give a deposition if he counter-sued? I'd love to be a fly on the wall for that one. She'll just dig her grace deeper and deeper... Keep it up Jose!!

 

[DianeB]

Dr Lee said he examined the entire car. I wonder if maybe the food boxes weren't in the trunk, but on the backseat or the floor.

 

[TURBOTHINK]

If it was the cadaverine and putriscene post, those chemicals are not specific to human decomp, they are produced by ALL animals during decomp, they wouldn't need to be mentioned because they would not narrow the list of possible sources of by even one item. Putriscene can also be found in live animals, in areas of infection.

I don't think the air samples are anything but a "front screen"........I believe all the evidence was from the maggots and blow flies. What they feed on is in them. They can get DNA, they can even get the drugs in a person's body and have no body. That is what I believe their case is based on.

 

[TURBOTHINK]

Dr Lee said he examined the entire car. I wonder if maybe the food boxes weren't in the trunk, but on the backseat or the floor.

Or front floorboard or under the seat. Could have been anywhere in the car.

He was very non-specific about them, but he did say there were maggots in the trunk.

I think he was tying to imply they were in the trunk too for the purpose of explaining the maggots when they may have been anywhere in that car.

 

[LEFT-COASTER]

I wonder if Dr. Lee didn't just examine the evidence that had been in the car when law enforment examined it. Like, they put it in cold storage or something, it would seem counter productive to put anything like that back in the car.

Thats what i really think happened.. I dont think they put all the stuff back in the trunk.. i think there are boxes and or bags that contain the evidence that came from the car..

I really thought that dr lee said it was like the scrap or stuff left in the frozen food boxes after you had eatten..

Ill have to watch again in 45 mins...

 

[Lovejac]

LP talking about putting his poly on Don King on PPV so he can make money to come back to Orlando

Soooo very happy to know that LP has not let the A's and LE ruffle his feathers.

BTW, did LP pronounce it Or-lawn-do!! I Love it when he does that!:crazy:

 

[memajen]

I find it hard to believe that the food boxes, full or empty, would have been left in the car since Cindy admitted that she cleaned out the car.

 

[panthera]

Dr Lee said he examined the entire car. I wonder if maybe the food boxes weren't in the trunk, but on the backseat or the floor.

What still isn't making any sense is Cindy removed some things from the car, even washing Casey's pants and took a dinner knife out and washed it, yet she left all this other stuff in the car. It's almost like wanting to remove anything that could implicate Casey in something but not wanting to take away the "trash" which could be used to explain the stench in the car. MOO

 

[LI_Mom]

I can't imagine LE would've left potential evidence still in the car. I thought I had read earlier that LE practically tore the car apart testing everything. :waitasec:

Obviously, AFTER LE finished with the car.... the "dump a dead body in Casey's trunk" perp snuck into the evidence yard & dumped NEW garbage into the trunk.

Will this rotten guy NEVER stop trying to frame Casey????

I'm starting to feel a little sorry for her. :crazy:

 

[DollyPardonMe]

Thank you. I'm not sure what to think now. It seems like if rotted foods, or even boxes with traces of rotted food, were found in the trunk, LE would have frozen them to preserve the state of the evidence. If all that stuff was left inside the trunk to continue rotting, it's no wonder the trunk still smells.

I just went back to read the account of what happened between GA and SB the tow truck driver and according to them, they opened the trunk of the car and flies flew out and all that was in there was a plastic bag with rotting pizza in it and maggots. I remember SB being relieved the bag was so light because he was sure there could have been a dead body in the bag.

 

[100%Agave]

I don't think he found food boxes in the car. I know that is what he said but I think that he meant that food boxes were found in the car when LE took it. Which is strange because neither GA nor the tow guy said anything about any other food boxes. Now I think that he was saying that these items were WERE in the car but not that they were in there when he looked at the car.

 

[Lovejac]

I don't think the air samples are anything but a "front screen"........I believe all the evidence was from the maggots and blow flies. What they feed on is in them. They can get DNA, they can even get the drugs in a person's body and have no body. That is what I believe their case is based on.

Maybe that is why LE doesn't seem to be too concerned with further searches? Because they have all they need for trial?

I am just thinking out loud here, not trying to talk smack about LE.

 

[impatientredhead]

I'm wondering the same thing. Why would they have left trash in the car after they inspected it for evidence. :waitasec:

They wouldn't be able to destroy anything from the car or dispose of any of its contents yet, the defense would love that. But there are different ways to store evidence in the condition it was found. Leaving rotting food (if there is current insect activity there has to be a protein source) in the car does not make any sense at all. It would be damaging to the case, the evidence defense would now be able to test would not be the same evidence they are prosecuting her based on.

And the FBI documents would have mentioned this food? It specifically says no pizza was found in the vehicle, now does that mean it was in the bag but that wasn't in the car... I don't think that is what it means, but it can be read either way. But they specifically say no pizza, do a control test with pizza, and don't mention other organic materials that are rotting in the car, during a decomp test. That sounds like something Cindy would try to tell someone.

 

[Chilly Willy]

I find it hard to believe that the food boxes, full or empty, would have been left in the car since Cindy admitted that she cleaned out the car.

I don't recall Cindy saying she cleaned out the car. She took the pants and the knife from the car.

 

[Koozit]

Something really major would have to happen for the life cycle to just end while they are still in the maggot stage. They don't feed for a large portion of that transition. Something is not making sense, which of course is what the defense team wants, confusion, doubt.....

Pre-pupa

migrates away from the corpse seeking a suitable pupation site, (usually in soil)
does not feed
transforms into pupa
pre-pupa to pupa takes 4 days

Pupa

resides within puparium
undergoes transformation from larval body form adult fly
does not feed
pupa to emergence takes 10 days

Adult fly

mates on emergence from pupa
feeds on protein from body fluids
lays eggs on corpse
emergence to egg laying takes 2 days

Exactly... I know this from two pets that died from maggot's, one from the bugs eggs that were in the feed (hamster), my Poor Shiztu that ate dog poop... Gross as it seem's. It does go to life form, to dead form.

 

[impatientredhead]

Something had to leak into the car to provide a food source for the maggots. Odor is not enough. So if it was frozen food or some other form or grocery, it had to be in there long enough in a leaky bag in order for nutrients to seep into the carpet.

However, Simon Birch's interview indicated the bag was light and basically had empty packaging, including an empty pizza box.

When AL picked up KC, he said she had some bags of food. Does not sound like anything was left in the trunk, and whatever she had was edible.

So there has to be another explanation.

Maggots actually feed on the soft tissue, they can get their teeth into it. The mature fly feeds off the fluids. Just reread the life of a blowfly.

 

[Chilly Willy]

They wouldn't be able to destroy anything from the car or dispose of any of its contents yet, the defense would love that. But there are different ways to store evidence in the condition it was found. Leaving rotting food (if there is current insect activity there has to be a protein source) in the car does not make any sense at all. It would be damaging to the case, the evidence defense would now be able to test would not be the same evidence they are prosecuting her based on.

And the FBI documents would have mentioned this food? It specifically says no pizza was found in the vehicle, now does that mean it was in the bag but that wasn't in the car... I don't think that is what it means, but it can be read either way. But they specifically say no pizza, do a control test with pizza, and don't mention other organic materials that are rotting in the car, during a decomp test. That sounds like something Cindy would try to tell someone.

Thank you, that's what I've been trying to find a way to say. Why were no control tests done with the other rotted food like there was with the pizza?

It's very strange, they test for pizza that, according to statements, wasn't there, but not for food products that, according to Dr. Lee, are there? :waitasec:

 

[DollyPardonMe]

It was Spam, it was Spam -- the decomposing body was Spam since KC uses her trunk as a fridge for food!!!!

Ewwwwwwwww! Spam smells like decomposition anyway!

 

[Nosey Parker]

Hi all. About the car, weren't we told that the car was taken apart piece by piece and that the defense was whining that there wouldn't be any evidence left? LE left them frozen food boxes? Would LE be obligated to put those frozen food boxes back in the trunk after dismantling the car?

Curiouser and curiouser...

I think Henry Lee was speaking about the contents of the bag that LE recovered from the tow yard dumpster. Not sure whether he actually did read the list of what the bag contained, was told by Baez and couldn't remember accurately, or whether he was spinning, so viewers would think it was still in the trunk and causing the smell to linger. As for the "evidence" he found and handed to LE, that could be anything - like a fibre on the driver's seat - nothing relevant, but it sounds good, don't it?