Syringe in bottle contained traces of chloroform

[QuietStorm]

hahaha I asked that earlier.

carrie gave us some answers though. that is it for me, i am going to start all over on this tomorrow.

The Orlando Sentinel reported that the chloroform findings were reported in the summary report. I haven't looked at the docs yet. Is there such a summary report?

 

[magic-cat]

I remember an interview, but I cant remember which one. go figure.

Anyway, the reason this person couldn't meet Cindy was that she was Spanish and Cindy did not like Spanish people. Casey kept her away from Cindy for that reason. It may be the same for Zanny

She was not Spanish...she was supposed to have been Puerto Rican but since she does not even exist, I would say it is a moot point wouldn't you agree?

The Orlando Sentinel reported that the chloroform findings were reported in the summary report. I haven't looked at the docs yet. Is there such a summary report?

The one I am going through is 1765 pages so that will take a day or three...If YOU find it feel free to share! lol:dance:

 

[QuietStorm]

She was not Spanish...she was supposed to have been Puerto Rican but since she does not even exist, I would say it is a moot point wouldn't you agree?

The one I am going through is 1765 pages so that will take a day or three...If YOU find it feel free to share! lol:dance:

OK, am trying to find the doc dump online.

 

[Valhall]

Courtesy of Harmony2

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=6119&d=1257605229

I see this as like a foot from eachother. How do you get 4 - 16 feet?

Thanks! I had not seen this. The best I could find was the narratives in the incident reports filed by the various LE who worked the crime scene. Would you happen to have a link to the doc it came from so that I can read everything that was with this table?

Thank you again!

 

[Valhall]

-----Original Message-----
From: Vass, Arpad Alexander
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 8:31 AM
To: Vincent, Michael (OCSO)
Subject: RE: **Exempt**

Mike, I try very hard not to second-guess people since I am well aware that I know very little of what is really going on in an investigation, but I think the early release of the chloroform data was a mistake. Since I am saying nothing to anyone outside my group, I am now getting criticized for other reasons and feel that it might be time to back away from this work. I will of course get the next report out to you and Yuri as promised as soon as I can. On a final note, some of the products we have seen include Pinene and Limonene. This could point to a (possibly) shallow marshy area with decaying vegetation. Is there such an area anywhere near where the car was found? Is it possible to get a topo map of the area? Would it be possible to speak to the individual leading the search from Necrosearch? Arpad

Arpad A. Vass, Ph.D

BBM
I saw earlier posts that mentioned Citronella as the oil in the bag, citing these two substances. (sorry, looked but can't find the posts).. This says possible decaying vegetation. I do remember something about kissing a working mans arse..

Uhhh...not yet lizzy. This statement by Dr. Vass could link the contents of the Gatorade bottle to Casey - but not because of vegetation. Because of the cleaning solution used in the trunk!

http://citrusdepot.net/images/MSDS for all Products.pdf

The "orange cleaners" will have "Terpenes" - that's your Limonene, Pinene and Terpineol.

 

[Valhall]

Ok the report, the very one you provided the link for, plainly states that the syringe was not analyzed AT ALL. So if there is no error and the bag was inside the bottle and the liquid was in fact from the bag as stated, and NOT inside the syringe, then what we have here is a syringe that was never even analyzed per the report from this link:
http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFiles/11911-11987.pdf

So how on earth did we arrive at traces of anything inside the syringe when now I am seeing it was not even analyzed according to this report.
page 75 of 77.:waitasec::waitasec::waitasec:

Hang on - lol.

It says that Q238 (the bottle), Q238.2 (the piece of plastic in the bottle), Q239 (the two rolls of cardboard in the bottle), Q240 (the world of disney bag) and Q240.1 the syringe from Q240, were not analyzed. It does not state that Q238.1 (liquid contents of the bottle), or Q240.1.1 (contents of the syringe) weren't analyzed. They were.

 

[kaRN]

Wouldnt a subcutaneous injection of chloroform be just as deadly in the long run as a IV injection? I dont think KC would have been able to give Caylee an IV injection... and it really doesnt make any sense to have a needle in the syringe.. if she was just using it as a "dropper"...
Its funny.. I automatically keep immediately thinking of scenarios that dont include premediated murder.. I guess its just nearly impossible for me to wrap my mind around that concept.. especially of a child by her own parent... I had wondered if KC was using the syringe as a measuring device.. in an attempt to just put Caylee to sleep... but Im giving her too much credit ... I know.. Besides, again, Im back to the fact that on the long shot that was the case.... there would be NO need for the needle to be in the syringe..

Yes it would be. It just takes longer to absorb the drug.

 

[QB.]

The Orlando Sentinel reported that the chloroform findings were reported in the summary report. I haven't looked at the docs yet. Is there such a summary report?

Yes, there is a summary report.

http://www.clickorlando.com/download/2009/1106/21540506.pdf
Page 53 is the summary of results

Page 45, 46 is a list of items with their Q numbers

 

[QB.]

I don't doubt there was a presence of chloroform. My concern is at what concentration was it measured - enough to raise questions?
Obviously we don't have all the findings yet,but the fact that chloroform keeps coming up is suspicious.
There was also chloroform residue on the doll from what I understand, but this is all very confusing so someone correct me if I am wrong.

 

[QB.]

Uhhh...not yet lizzy. This statement by Dr. Vass could link the contents of the Gatorade bottle to Casey - but not because of vegetation. Because of the cleaning solution used in the trunk!

http://citrusdepot.net/images/MSDS for all Products.pdf

The "orange cleaners" will have "Terpenes" - that's your Limonene, Pinene and Terpineol.

So the substance we should really be discussing is the cleaner? Do we know what was used in the trunk or is LE speculating it was cleaning fluid related?

 

[QB.]

Thanks! I had not seen this. The best I could find was the narratives in the incident reports filed by the various LE who worked the crime scene. Would you happen to have a link to the doc it came from so that I can read everything that was with this table?

Thank you again!

BBM

http://www.wftv.com/_blank/18740668/detail.html

page 17

 

[Valhall]

BBM

http://www.wftv.com/_blank/18740668/detail.html

page 17

Thank you thank you! Typical...same document I was reading the narratives in, just didn't see this table. 12000 pages of discovery will suck your brains out.

 

[QB.]

I know, I have been trying to keep notes but its crazy. I like having a bunch of people working on it together, we all remember different small things. I just finished reading your article at your blog.
I tend to agree but am also keeping an open mind.

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

Why testosterone? Any nurses or scientists here who can shed some light?

I was wondering the same.

Who in KC's circle of friends may be body building?

Who in KC's circle of friends might be taking HGH (human growth hormone)?

I'm also hoping there are fingerprints on the gatorade bottle/syringe.

The pregnancy test found with the remains, also hoping that can be linked straight to KC. If urine didn't evaporate, could have traces of her DNA???

 

[Harmony 2]

Uhhh...not yet lizzy. This statement by Dr. Vass could link the contents of the Gatorade bottle to Casey - but not because of vegetation. Because of the cleaning solution used in the trunk!

http://citrusdepot.net/images/MSDS for all Products.pdf

The "orange cleaners" will have "Terpenes" - that's your Limonene, Pinene and Terpineol.

This could point to a (possibly) shallow marshy area with decaying vegetation.

Good morning!!

The quote is suggesting a shallow marshy location as a possible dumpsite for the body. This is before the remains were found. He does not ask if a cleaner was used in the trunk to explain the limonene and pinene. My interpretation and :twocents:

 

[Crabcake23]

Wasn't her first tattoo. She also hung out there/visited several times when not there for a tattoo.

Not disagreeing, just putting other possible scenarios out there.

I'm not married to any one specific theory, but I am casually dating several.

lol Well said.

 

[carrie]

yes. I am looking at pdf page 74 and 75.
what is the number for the liquid in the syringe? i see liquid in the plastic bag, liquid in the vehicle and liquid in the bottle.
I am assuming that there is another report that says that the liquid in the plastic bag is also the liquid in the syringe?

this report also says that the plastic bag was in the bottle.

Typed verbatim from docs PP 11517 - 11518 at , http://www.clickorlando.com/download/2009/1106/21540506.pdf
Page is a form labeled “GENERAL DESCRIPTION OF EVIDENCE AND CONTAINERS



The paper bag is labeled in part “Tag H – 6058 . . . inside Disney bag . . . unknown liquid . . . “ and contains a sealed K pack bag (stapled and taped w/blue evidence tape. The Kpack bag contains a closed Gatorade bottle ^Q238 (Cool Blue) further containing an unknown liquid (Q 238.1),two cardboard rolls (Q239) and an unknown plastic item (Q240.Which later turns out to be a pre packaged bag containing a syringe with liquid in it.

Upon opening the Gatorade bottle, the plastic item revealed itself to be a disposable syringe w/in plastic pouch labeled “Disposable Syringe Kit ‘. After removing the cardboard rolls, plastic bag and syringe, the 20 oz. bottle is approx ¾ full of unknown liquid. Within the plastic bag and in the liquid w/in the bottle a cotton like or paper like material is present.

When pouring the liquid contents out of Q238 a small piece of clear plastic was discovered.
Q238 > Gatorade bottle
Q238.1 > unknown liquid from Gatorade bottle
Q238.2 > plastic piece (clear) from Gatorade bottle
Q239 > cardboard rolls – two
Q240 > plastic bag labeled “Disposable Syringe Kit”
Q240.1 > syringe from w/in Q240 which was found w/in the Q239 cardboard rolls
Q240.1.1 > liquid from syringe

The small padded manilla envelope is sealed (w/ yellow tape and labelled in part “ . . .Tag# H – 51976 . . . from #13 Crystal Light bottle . . .vial with liquid. This envelope contains a sealed (w/ red evidence tape) ZPB containing an amber bottle approx 1/5 full. The ZPB is labeled “90115014 TO. Q241”. There is clear tape around the lid of the bottle. The bottle contains a brown liquid.



[words in red font and bolding added by me]

So, it’s easy to see why this is confusing.

--There are three different liquids being discussed: liquid from Gatorade bottle, liquid from syringe that was in a small plastic bag in cardboard rolls in the Gatorade bottle, and liquid from the Crystal Light bottle.

--There are, obviously two bottles. Blue Gatorade bottle is from the remains site. Crystal Light is NOT from the remains site. IIRC, CL bottle is from the trash bag collected from the car. (If I’m wrong on that point, someone please correct me. I’m too tired to find a link for it right now – lol.)

There are two plastic bags (related to the syringe from the remains site): The World of Disney bag and the small plastic bag the syringe came packaged in.

Hope this helps us a little. Thought I’d type it up for reference.

 

[VALee]

The Crystal Light bottle is from the trash bag found in the trunk and tossed at the tow yard. I read it just this morning as I was scanning the trash bag contents for another Gatorade bottle, but there was not a Gatorade bottle in the trash bag.

 

[VALee]

As far as the cardboard rolls found in the Gatorade bottle, possibly toilet paper rolls? Anyone have a read on that?

 

[QuietStorm]

After reading every post in this thread, my goal was to read the latest documents. I hadn't wanted to read anything more after sweet Caylee's body was found - I was so sad and it really took a toll on me. I did not lose interest in the case. I just needed a break. So here I am.

My post this morning is meant to be analytical, so please bear with me and DO NOT rush to judgment on its contents because I AM NOT a genetic specialist. I've taken classes and understand it at is basic core. It's my hope that this post will inspire us to take a look into my posits and hopefully there will be a genetic specialist among us who can take it from there.

And with that, I am deleting my post. Never mind. Sorry.