UT -Susan Powell, 28, West Valley City, 6 Dec 2009 - #4

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nervous_nellie said:
what do they think happened to susan? im not being snarky either, but really what are the options?
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I almost understand not wanting to say she is dead. If the family admit it is most likely she is dead publicly, then perhaps people won't be as aggressive in looking for her- and you really really need to find her! As long as she is not found, those boys will likely stay with their murderous father. It is a way to keep the urgency going. The searchers know they are looking for a body.

Alternately, if you (as a family member) say you think highly suspect she is dead and Josh did it, then you lose access to those boys you are trying to protect. They can't give Josh any excuse to keep them from his mother's family.

I'm sure the family is working behind the scenes with LE to try to ensure the safety of those kids and justice for their mother. They just aren't public with it.
 
kiki the parrot said:
Okay, from the outset of this case, some here--including myself--have considered whether Susan may have been poisoned. As I had little evidence on which to base this I more or less went in search of something more than the disturbing ease w which I can readily envision someone w what we know of JP's personality traits--a weak, cowardly, narcissistic, controlling temperament--resorting to this method. So strongly, in fact did I sense this tho that I read up on the psychological profile of a poisoner. Here is a short excerpt from Criminal Poisoning: Investigational Guide for Law Enforcement, Toxicologists (by John Harris Trestail III, bbm),

"However, one can make some hypotheses about this type of individual by examining the personalities involved in the published cases of poisonings in which there have been convictions. There are commonalities among these types of poisoning offenders. Poisoners are for the most part cunning, avaricious, cowardly (physically or mentally nonconfrontational), childlike in their fantasy...

If one looks at the characteristics in the standard reference Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, 4th Ed. (Am Psychological Assoc 2000) in the section on personality disorders, clusters A, B, and C, one will find characteristic that seem to fit very well with our poisoner hypotheses. The poisoner's personality especially correlates with the Cluster B disorder known as narcissistic personality disorder, whose characteristics include the following: a grandiose sense of self-importance (lies about achievements), a belief that the person is "special" and "unique," a sense of entitlement (expects favorable priority treatment), a need to take advantage of others without regard to feelings, a lack of empathy (no acknowledgment of the needs of others), a feeling of envy toward others, an arrogant/haughty behavior or attitude, a preoccupation with fantasies of self-importance (fame, wealth, achievement), a requirement for excessive admiration, and an inter-personal exploitativeness (uses other to achieve his or her own end).

Why does the poison murderer select this weapon as the means of achieving his or her goal? One of the major reasons is that it provides a very good chance of getting away with the crime. Another reason is the fact that a poison allows completion of the assault without physical confrontation with the victim. The poisoner is truly an intelligent coward or, one coud say, has the mindset of an enfant terrible (incorrigible child) in the body of an adult. This is a very dangerous combination. If one also looks at many, if not most, of the male poisoners who have been tried and convicted, one will see that they tend to deal with conflict in a manner that is not physically confrontational.

One sees in the childish personality of the poisoner an immature desire for one's own way... something seems to be hidden in the psyche of poisoners that keeps them permanently immature; they never seem to grow up... "

Lo and behold it's pretty spot on. Poisoner's motives aren't much different from those of other homicides, usually include money (insurance, expensive divorce, large debt etc); elimination of a goal blocker (eliminating the individual who stands between the poisoner and his or her goal); revenge; ego (arrogance, belief in mental superiority), etc.

JP may have believed he could escape detection by ensuring there were no witnesses, by sufficiently distancing himself from the crime scene (the spontaneous "camping trip") and because poison would leave no visible signs (woops didn't anticipate being reported so soon, forgot about fans). It explains a vomit eg stain on carpet. And after administering poison, he could have left w boys long enough for a death to occur (3 hours), then returned to dispose of her. Fits w passive-aggressive style, and we know he had both means and opportunity to poison.

My only question is, how self-controlled is JP? Is he too much of a coward to coldly plan and execute something of this sinister nature--ie was he perhaps equally prone to unleashing his rage in a vicious attack (as some narcissists can be?)

http://books.google.com/books?id=CR...&q=psychological profile of poisoners&f=false

:parrot:
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Your post is so helpful and just about confirms all my thoughts about Josh and what I feel he did to Susan. Thank you so much for this information.
 
fran said:
Interesting in that video that Josh has the vent/window on the top of the van open, when it's obviously VERY cold with snow on the ground.

Wonder if he was 'airing it out.'

Just fwiw,
fran
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Go back frame-by-frame on the vid. There is no vent on the van roof, what you see is the roof of the home in the background.

I thought so too (vent) but when you do stop frame, it isn't a vent.

eta:
3-7.jpg


5-4.jpg
 
okay.. finally caught up... wanted to clarify something about the quilt. I don't think there was one missing... Rather LE took the one on the master bed and Josh b!tched about having to replace it.

There was a link somewhere in here that said the quilt had been taken in the SW by LE.

The fact that he b!tched about it instead of pleading for his wife's safe return? Well, I am sure you all know what I think about that!

Really surprised there has been no arrest yet... And Mark Geragos on Geraldo! Every time that man opens his mouth my blood boils... He most obviously does not have a conscious... because he seems very smart... so that means he "gets it" but chooses to side with the devil. moo of course!
 
Kimster said:
Mark Geragos thinks Josh is being suspected prematurely.
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IIRC, Mark Geragos thought Scott Peterson was suspicious from the beginning and then went on to change his tune by defending him. Maybe Geragos just says the opposite of what he really feels ;)
 
mgardner said:
JMO - I think she's in the backyard, or across the street. Right under LE's nose. I think Joshy boy is too much of a weasel to put too much effort into trying to conceal the body. The snow will melt soon, and IMHO, Susan will be found.

It's what my heart and gut is telling me. No evidence, no link -- just MO.

Best,

Mel
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ITA, I feel she is close to her own home.
Josh seems lazy, germophobic, someone that would panic after Susan died and just take her somewhere quick, then go on with some plan to throw LE and everyone off.
All the miles was someone panicing and getting out of the house, no where to go.........just running, thinking, and can't even think of a good plan.
Now if she is found near home, he'll try to say she walked out and froze to death.
He is such a coward I would not be surprised if he took her out unconscience.
and left her to die where she laid..........creepy!
what's around the house? woods? the neighbors seem close but not that close???
 
mgardner said:
JMO - I think she's in the backyard, or across the street. Right under LE's nose. I think Joshy boy is too much of a weasel to put too much effort into trying to conceal the body. The snow will melt soon, and IMHO, Susan will be found.

It's what my heart and gut is telling me. No evidence, no link -- just MO.

Best,

Mel
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Mel~ your comment made me think about Josh not going/staying back at his house. These are my thoughts on why he won't go back to the house IMO
1) I think he is such a wuss that he won't stay in the house he murdered his wife in. Or
2) If he looks out certain windows, he may be looking at the "grave" of his wife. Or
3) He thinks LE would be on surveillance at/around the house 24/7. Or
4) He thinks the having the boys there may trigger some memories for the 4 year old that he doesn't want triggered. ie - an argument between he and Susan or daddy hurting mommy.

These are just my thoughts....I find it very weird that he won't or hasn't gone back to house.
 
Taminator said:
IIRC, Mark Geragos thought Scott Peterson was suspicious from the beginning and then went on to change his tune by defending him. Maybe Geragos just says the opposite of what he really feels ;)
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MG probably remembers spouting off about SP's guilt prior to taking the case and is hoping that Powell might need him to get out of this one so he's playing his cards differently. :loser:
 
If Simpson Springs is about 100 miles from WVC and the rental car had in excess of 200 miles on it, wouldn't that be a good place to start a ground search? Maybe it seems like common sense to me. He claimed he was there camping. Why not search there? Could be nothing, could be something. No offense to anyone, especially Susan's friends or family, but other than getting Susan's face in the public the social media blitz really does nothing.
 
I for one think it is time to hold a vigil for the boys and twitter about THEM...use that energy to get those boys away from Josh
 
Taminator said:
If Simpson Springs is about 100 miles from WVC and the rental car had in excess of 200 miles on it, wouldn't that be a good place to start a ground search? Maybe it seems like common sense to me. He claimed he was there camping. Why not search there? Could be nothing, could be something. No offense to anyone, especially Susan's friends or family, but other than getting Susan's face in the public the social media blitz really does nothing.
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LE searched extensively at Simpson Springs.
 
CCup said:
Mel~ your comment made me think about Josh not going/staying back at his house. These are my thoughts on why he won't go back to the house IMO
1) I think he is such a wuss that he won't stay in the house he murdered his wife in. Or
2) If he looks out certain windows, he may be looking at the "grave" of his wife. Or
3) He thinks LE would be on surveillance at/around the house 24/7. Or
4) He thinks the having the boys there may trigger some memories for the 4 year old that he doesn't want triggered. ie - an argument between he and Susan or daddy hurting mommy.

These are just my thoughts....I find it very weird that he won't or hasn't gone back to house.
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ITA! Yep, that is xactly what I am thinking! BBM
Ron C was the same..........never back at house.........may be 'bugged'......etc.
Ran to daddy right away! Daddy STEVE is the key for all of this because Josh talked to steve more than he talked to Susan!
 
passionflower said:
ITA! Yep, that is xactly what I am thinking! BBM
Ron C was the same..........never back at house.........may be 'bugged'......etc.
Ran to daddy right away! Daddy STEVE is the key for all of this because Josh talked to steve more than he talked to Susan!
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Daddy Steven also went through a long divorce, custody issues, child support payments, atty fees, etc. while Josh witnessed this. No doubt Josh did not want to go through all that with Susan and took the easy way out. jmo
 
passionflower said:
My Christmas was great! Thanks and I hope yours was also.
IIRC, Josh said that LE took quilt of bed, but I don't think he used it.
It would be wise to see if her coat, boots at still there.
If so, she was dead taking her from home........
if gone, she could have them on alive leaving house.I still wonder if this coward had someone help him in the clean up, disposal.

The Tom Capano murder is on TV and he convinced his brother to help him.
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You are so right about the part BBM. I know LE will most likely not reveal if the coat and boots were there, but I sure would like to know........
 
Warrants in missing Utah mom case sealed

Associated Press - December 28, 2009 4:25 PM ET

SALT LAKE CITY (AP) - Search warrants in the case of a 28-year-old Utah woman missing for three weeks have been sealed.

Susan Powell was last seen on Dec. 7, when husband Josh Powell says he left their suburban home in West Valley City about 12:30 a.m. to take their two boys camping in freezing conditions.

She was reported missing the same day when she failed to show up for her stockbroker job and her kids weren't dropped off at day care

http://www.localnews8.com/Global/story.asp?S=11738840
 
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