2010-04-23 JVM: Tommy Croslin's Attorney Speaks

[Whisperer]

fftopic:

Do you have the link where Ron says that he will kill himself and take RJ with him? I don't believe I've ever seen that one or heard it.

Upon following the case, rc has made several references to death by his own hands and taking out others around. Once, jr was in the room when rc displayed and postured with an assault gun. The second was in the audio with Cobra.

There are links but not specifying jr. just anyone in shooting range but jr was either present or mentioned in passing along with the rants.

""During one of those conversations, he threatens to kill anyone and everyone who had anything to do with the disappearance of his daughter, and “would kill anyone in shooting range.” (That included me.) “I’ll take everyone out, I’m so pissed.” Although the threat seemed idle at the time, I was unaware that 50 feet away was an assault rifle.""

jr. was in the room also, according to Miller. He later showed miller what he would do and put the gun in his mouth.

http://stephww.wordpress.com/2009/10/16/haleigh-cummings-will-ronald-cummings-loose-another-child/

 

[twall]

Tommy called GMA Flo on the Sunday before the search because she is the only person who had money on her account to accept his call. It is my understanding he called her for the sole reason of asking her to call Lindsy and tell her to call his lawyer and arrange for a meeting with him and Steve Brown. It all vibes with the info. Tommy's lawyer put out in his press release. I do not believe Steve Brown solved the case.

Press release below:
On Thursday, April 8, 2010, Tommy did take a polygraph given by technician, Ron Grenier. On Saturday, April10, 2010, this attorney met with his client to discuss the results of the polygraph.
On Sunday night, April 11, 2010, this attorney received a telephone call from Lindsey Croslin (Wife) that Tommy requested that we meet with Steven K. Brown, the private investigator involved for the past 10-11 months.
On Monday morning, 9:30 AM, April 12, 2010, Steven K. Brown, this attorney and Tommy met at the St. Johns County Jail to discuss the polygraph and February 9, 2009.
Based on discussions that morning, this attorney made contact with FDLE, the State Attorney’s Office and Scott Bolin, Special Agent, FBI, and arranged an interview with Tommy at the State Attorney’s Office, Homicide Investigations Unit, St. Augustine, Florida, at approximately 5:00 PM.
As a result of the 2 plus hours interview with Jason Jolicoeiur, Special Agent, FDLE, Detective Peggy Cone, Putnam Co. Sheriff’s Office, under the guidance of this attorney and Steven K. Brown, Tommy took the group to the Shell Harbour Road boat ramp, St Johns River, Putnam County, Florida.
The commencement of the river search for Haleigh was at 10:00 AM, Tuesday, April 13, 2010.

 

[Whisperer]

It appears that Tommy has fessed to knowledge or participation in disposal within days of taking the poly. It you consider the words and timing of Brown and Werter, it may be the case and tommy is the one who is talking.

Brown felt there was enough for probable cause but LE wants more. Brown said he thought the evidence would be gone at Shell Harbor. It appears that Hardy believed this is how it went down and was hoping to find some evidence (my opinion).

After hearing news and having reason to believe it is true, he informed the families that he has good reason to believe this was a homicide. That rules out accidental death

Brown was asked if rc was involved and he said "To the best of his knowledge, no".

 

[yosande]

Attorney won't talk about drug abuse in Ron's trailer cuz he will jeopardize his
great relationship with LE.

Attorney now asked by Levi several great questions, but JVM tells us that attorney can't answer. Thanks a lot, Jane (not).

bbm, huh?



:floorlaugh:

My own question suddenly reminded me of that 911 call.
But I still don't understand the atty's response. Can anyone clarify?
tia

 

[Whisperer]

Post #282 sums up the case for us.
Thank you Twall. That is the best and most informative information of the past fifteen months. It also tells us that somebody in the famiily told FLO what tommy said.

Tommy has talked. What did he say? I'm guessing it all comes back to the original Ocam's Razor.

 

[Emma Peel]

Do you have the link where Ron says that he will kill himself and take RJ with him? I don't believe I've ever seen that one or heard it.

http://74.125.45.132/search?q=cache...th+him+until+he+dies&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

Clip 2.

hard to listen to.

 

[Whisperer]

My own question suddenly reminded me of that 911 call.
But I still don't understand the atty's response. Can anyone clarify?
tia

Attorneys sue each other more than anyone else. If Werter talks about rc and accuses him of having drugs in the house, Shoemaker will file against him for destroying his clients chances of a fair trial. MO

 

[Emma Peel]

It appears that Tommy has fessed to knowledge or participation in disposal within days of taking the poly. It you consider the words and timing of Brown and Werter, it may be the case and tommy is the one who is talking.

Brown felt there was enough for probable cause but LE wants more. Brown said he thought the evidence would be gone at Shell Harbor. It appears that Hardy believed this is how it went down and was hoping to find some evidence (my opinion).

After hearing news and having reason to believe it is true, he informed the families that he has good reason to believe this was a homicide. That rules out accidental death.

Brown was asked if rc was involved and he said "To the best of his knowledge, no".

Whisperer, homicide doesn't rule out accidental death, does it? Like involuntary manslaughter is technically still classified as homicide. At least I thought it was...

Also, is this an article you're quoting? about Brown saying RC was not involved?

 

[Whisperer]

Whisperer, homicide doesn't rule out accidental death, does it? Like involuntary manslaughter is technically still classified as homicide. At least I thought it was...

Also, is this an article you're quoting? about Brown saying RC was not involved?

It was on video, Brown stated that the perp will not be a surprise to anyone.He was asked if he thought RC was involved and that is how he responded.

It is on video and it is in print.

 

[Emma Peel]

It was on video, Brown stated that the perp will not be a surprise to anyone.He was asked if he thought RC was involved and that is how he responded.

It is on video and it is in print.

Okay, I remember that now.

So ... I've had my beer. I can't remember. Why don't we believe Brown? Brown thinks RC is not involved.

And...didn't someone else say we WOULD be surprised who was involved?

 

[Whisperer]

Whisperer, homicide doesn't rule out accidental death, does it? Like involuntary manslaughter is technically still classified as homicide. At least I thought it was...

Also, is this an article you're quoting? about Brown saying RC was not involved?

Technically they are in the same ballpark but the intent is what separates the two. All I recall is that manslaughter, depending on the degree was a much shorter sentence (many got five years). California could be very different from Florida. But you right, they both come under the same unbrella, it will be broken up according to what the perp says happened and what they find as evidence. I don't know how anyone can say manslaughter involving a child. It is usually homicide when a child is involved, my opinion.

 

[Whisperer]

I only heard one person speak (Brown) about NOT being surprised and rc not being involved "According to his best knowledge"..remember those words..

 

[Emma Peel]

Technically they are in the same ballpark but the intent is what separates the two. All I recall is that manslaughter, depending on the degree was a much shorter sentence (many got five years). California could be very different from Florida. But you right, they both come under the same unbrella, it will be broken up according to what the perp says happened and what they find as evidence. I don't know how anyone can say manslaughter involving a child. It is usually homicide when a child is involved, my opinion.

For example, if it were "accidental overdose" - that would be homicide. But still, could argue involuntary.

By the way if the drugs were Ron's and the drugs were illegal and the house is Ron's and the child is Ron's, I think he'd be charged as well.

Steve Brown's comments IMO, pushes the crime to murder by Misty or Joe with Tommy involved as clean-up or confidant or witness somehow. Only other possible person left is Timmy...if Steve Brown's comment about Ron not being involved is true.

Of course, Steve Brown is only going to tell us what LE is letting him tell us.

Sorry, I'm just noodling before bedtime here...

 

[Whisperer]

Can't see any arguing about involuntary in this case. Too late. Hiding the body and involuntary doesn't add up in my mind. Can't use drugs in this case w/o the body. They can scream that till the cows come home but w/o the proof, it won't fly because the body was hidden. That assumes guilt by homicide because of concealment. MO>

 

[Emma Peel]

Can't see any arguing about involuntary in this case. Too late. Hiding the body and involuntary doesn't add up in my mind.

yeah. voluntary. even if accidental overdose.

And.. if it's Ron's drugs, in Ron's house, re- Ron's child, he could get the same charge even though he was at werk. IMO.

ETA: quit editing Whisperer. lol! I have to edit now to say I'm trying to follow your train of thought regarding they can't prove drugs, and the fact that they hid the body means assumption of guilt - not accidental.

Hmmmm...That might get Ron a pass, then on the drugs thing?

 

[Whisperer]

fftopic:

Simplest conclusion would be Haleigh threw a temper tantrum and misty lost it...

 

[Emma Peel]

OH man. we are wandering off-topic but only because of Tommy's lawyer's connection to Steve Brown and Steve Brown's statement and the word homicide.

Sorry mods!

:bedtime: for me!

 

[Donjeta]

I think I like this lawyer the best of the ones we've seen so far. He's doing a good job it seems.

He did a neat sidestep right there in the beginning of the show. He got asked what he thinks about Flora's allegations that Tommy and Joe were in another room molesting Haleigh while Misty listened to it and if Tommy and Joe tied her to a brick and threw her in the river. And he avoids replying to any of that neatly by going off on a tangent about dates and times and who contacted who about the search.

I don't give a blue hoot about what date it was when Tommy had his polygraph or if it was Monday or Tuesday he was on the dock. I want to know if he and Joe molested Haleigh and tied her to a brick and threw her in the river.

Jim, thank you so much for joining us. We have just heard some extreme allegations against your client from his own grandmother. We want to clear the air. We want to get your side of the story. What is your reaction about what Grandma Flo is saying?

JAMES WERTER, ATTORNEY FOR TOMMY CROSLIN: Well, that`s why I put my release out last week. It just -- all the rumors and speculation that are going around just totally annoyed me. And I put a press release out last week outlining how law enforcement came to the river on Monday night. That would have been April 12.

If you remember on HLN on the 26th of March, I informed you, well, maybe not you, but HLN that he would take a polygraph, and he did take a polygraph on April 8. I spoke with him on April 10 -- that was a Saturday morning. And on April 11, Lindsay called me, his wife, Tommy`s wife. So Monday morning, April 12, Steve Brown, the investigator, and myself sat down with Tommy. We discussed the results of the polygraph. And that evening...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: What were the results? Did he fail or did he pass and what was he asked about?

WERTER: Well, I can`t really get into what he was asked about. I have a good working relationship with law enforcement, so that`s part of the investigation. So I have to refrain from that.

But because of the polygraph that night, Monday night, April 12, we were on the dock with Tommy and law enforcement. That would have been FDLE, Putnam County Sheriff`s Office, and those two agencies. We were there discussing the scene with Tommy.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: The investigators searched a dock along the St. John`s River, drudging up two cinder blocks and reportedly some yellow rope. Now, does this dovetail with Grandma Flo`s story that Misty told her Tommy and Joe tied Haleigh with a rope with cinder blocks and threw her in the river?

Cops brought Misty to the dock. They reportedly also brought Tommy Croslin to the dock.

Jim, again, we want to get your side of the story. Your client had originally said, according to published reports, that he went to the trailer the night Haleigh disappeared at 10 p.m., knocked on the door, nobody was there, Misty wasn`t there and he left. Now we`re hearing possibly many other different stories. My question to you is why did police bring Tommy to the dock?

WERTER: Again, we`re getting into the facts, and I talked to your producers about this. Getting into the facts of that evening, which are in the hands of law enforcement. And it`s really hard for me to discuss that because I don`t want to jeopardize the investigation.

I will tell you that I feel comfortable with Tommy and representing Tommy. But the fact of the matter is I don`t know if they pulled anything out of the river because I can`t get a straight story from anybody on that. So all the things about bones or cinder blocks, things of that nature, I think it`s pure speculation at this time until an arrest is made.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, let me just say this. I guess what we`re all wondering, and I understand you`re limited in what you can say, but I guess what we`re all wondering is, if he had nothing to do with it, how would he know what to point out down at the river? That`s what nobody seems to understand.

WERTER: It is a good point, and I`ll leave that to your speculation. You`re a brilliant woman.

 

[Pensfan]

I sure hope Tommy is not involved. He has kids that need him to get out of jail and be a dad and a man. I cannot take him out of the disposal part of the crime. If I were to take anyone of them out of my scenario it would be Joe.
I do think the cops have had to devise a new method for reading result of LDT though. I think they have found that they all lie about the same thing and then theorize the next scenario and test again.

I sure hope that Children's Services GET involved with Tommy's kids.

 

[Donjeta]

I sure hope that Children's Services GET involved with Tommy's kids.

Just speculating but I think they already are... It might be one reason why Lindsay moved away from the rest of the clan.