2010.05.10 - Casey Anthony Motions Hearing

[littlemisslegal]

Wow, watching that clip was a surprise! A very changed and subdued Baez talking here. Not even one smirk - and he looked exhausted. It looks like two things have happened - he read the post interview press from last week, and he's had some pretty intensive lessons from a media coach somewhere. Maybe both Mason and Ms Lyon(s) gave him a "now hear this" lecture.

at one hearing i was at i told jose i liked his smirk-lol. he blushed !!

 

[Pensfan]

Mr. Baez.....maybe you could intern with the SA office. They could teach you a few things.

I was thinking that he should repeat his internship with Lionel Hutz (the Simpsons).

This has been a very funny thread. Thanks to all for sitting through this hearing and for posting the good laughs.

 

[littlemisslegal]

LOL! Sure looks like the logo. But we already knew that GA is supporting 'his team' !

my old boss would say use the kiss principal theory - then he would say keep it simple stupid-yeah he was verbal abusive---lol

 

[LambChop]

LOL! Sure looks like the logo. But we already knew that GA is supporting 'his team' !

GA's shirt looks like a "security" shirt.. Could GA be.....gasp! "WORKING"?????

 

[JSR]

I'm guessing she was instructed to by her lawyers, against her will.

Agreed. Remember the last few motions regarding the mitigation expert? Perhaps they tipped their hand too much and realize they need to keep snowing GA and CA. They need to keep them in their good graces if they want them to keep all of Casey's secrets from coming out. And keep them close enough so it will be easy to roll over them with their huge bus.

I have a gut feeling that between CA and GA if they were to actually testify truthfully they could be the lynch-pin to convict Casey. I really think they hold some vital clues as to what happened before, during and after Caylee was murdered. Unfortunately though their testimony isn't all that useful. They have lied so many many many times and changed their stories so many times as well that this is now a benefit to the defense. No matter what they say either to a benefit to the state or the defense a jury is going to have to digest their testimony with a grain of salt.

 

[joypath]

OMGoodnesss! :twocents: I just finished watching the videos and the post interview (how charming JB "tried" to be...musta received a lecture from the "ole man" after the other performance Friday!) and am in A W E of His Honor! Now that is a man who can deliver a slap in the face, an upper cut and a "get'er done" 'tude with a smile and a nod! LOVED his mini seminar in the law to JB regarding his laundry list from LKB, too bad JB has no knowledge of what the heck he's requesting, it might make him a better gopher if he UNDERSTOOD (okay being charitable today, remembered) some of the principles within his (oops, LKB's ) motion!:banghead: Really :loser:JB.....you have no idea that there's a difference between an expert witness and a CSI?...oh MY!

BUT for me the most unbelievable piece of "lawyering" (and my sincere apologies to all reputable, worthwhile, intelligent Esquires out there!) was the abysmal :loser:Jose Baez production of "observe my client's worst moments, how hated she is/was/should be (in case you weren't sure!),her disgusting family, observe my (JB's) hatred toward those who tried to help Caylee, and my (JB's) irrational animosity toward TES, MN, OCSO,FBI, even LennyP!".......

:waitasec:WHAT IDIOT EMPHASIZES HIS CLIENT IN SUCH A NEGATIVE MANNER????? and in emotive video, no less, not just within the "flat" transcript! :waitasec:

Again.....O M G !:truce:

 

[Lanie]

If I recall from when this was first talked about when Strickland was the judge in this case I believe he also instructed JB to use the proper channels in acquiring the information he was needing by following the proper procedure for doing so in that state. I think it has been well established from these newer hearings that JB and Co. have not done much of anything in this case. Being this far into it (approx 2 years) they should be much much farther along then they are. Strickland also said that information such as that held by Oakridge and the FBI was out of the courts jurisdiction. What JA was saying is not an argument based on his personal opinion, but based on procedural guidelines. The SA's office may also be more willing to work with and help JB in this endeavor if JB would be willing to work with the SA's office. Just a question... Has the defense released anything in terms of discovery? Keep in mind they are under the same obligation to release their evidence to the SA.

JB has pretty much established he wants others to do his leg work for him. There are numerous examples such as the TES records. The court has repeatedly told JB what needs to be done to get the records and evidence he needs. It is going to require him to actually do some work for the 90k he has received on this case.... hmm imagine having to do actually work for your pay.... what a novel concept. JB was ordered to clarify his needs for the court.

A blanket "I want everything" isn't going to work because as has been stated some things are not open for discovery and others are out of the courts jurisdiction. It's been stated numerous times and it's not exactly a hard concept to understand. Not sure why JB doesn't get it by now. This judge wants specifics so he can make the best, most informed ruling he can.

Your explanation is very informative, and so nicely done. :blowkiss:

I just wanted to add, as this is something that bugs me, part of this motion today was asking for things JA says LKB told him were already received. ??? JA then went on to say he would double-check with LKB on these items. Why is Baez not consulting with his defense team member himself? Is this how things are normally done? IM (non-attorney)O, this seems a little ridiculous to me if the defense team is not communicating with each other.

OOPS, I am referring to the SA guy as JA, and I don't think that is right, and I am drawing a complete blank on his name!!!! Ashton??

 

[zoey]

my old boss would say use the kiss principal theory - then he would say keep it simple stupid-yeah he was verbal abusive---lol

actually, my kids have been told that line by teachers.....:innocent:

 

[notthatsmart]

If I recall from when this was first talked about when Strickland was the judge in this case I believe he also instructed JB to use the proper channels in acquiring the information he was needing by following the proper procedure for doing so in that state. I think it has been well established from these newer hearings that JB and Co. have not done much of anything in this case. Being this far into it (approx 2 years) they should be much much farther along then they are. Strickland also said that information such as that held by Oakridge and the FBI was out of the courts jurisdiction. What JA was saying is not an argument based on his personal opinion, but based on procedural guidelines. The SA's office may also be more willing to work with and help JB in this endeavor if JB would be willing to work with the SA's office. Just a question... Has the defense released anything in terms of discovery? Keep in mind they are under the same obligation to release their evidence to the SA.
JB has pretty much established he wants others to do his leg work for him. There are numerous examples such as the TES records. The court has repeatedly told JB what needs to be done to get the records and evidence he needs. It is going to require him to actually do some work for the 90k he has received on this case.... hmm imagine having to do actually work for your pay.... what a novel concept. JB was ordered to clarify his needs for the court.

A blanket "I want everything" isn't going to work because as has been stated some things are not open for discovery and others are out of the courts jurisdiction. It's been stated numerous times and it's not exactly a hard concept to understand. Not sure why JB doesn't get it by now. This judge wants specifics so he can make the best, most informed ruling he can.

bold 1
Your right, Strickland said that. It looks like this Judge sees it differently. Is now going to make the defense provide a line by line motion so he can look at it. So, the subject is back on the table and Stricklands ruling is out. This is good for the defense, they now have to do their homework. Nothing wrong with that. The state can't just pick an expert from kookamonga so it will be difficult for the defense. If the defense is not allowed to see how an expert came to his opinion, then I doubt the Judge will let it in.

bold 2
Well I am not sure how that works. First not sure there is any discovery, but if there was, would not be sure if the state would release exculpatory evidence to sunshine. I think the Judge would say, exactly what discovery are you talking about? The defense has no obligation here to prove Soddi, yes they are under the same rules, but not sure what it is that posters are asking for. The state has brought these charges, it is their obligation to prove beyond a reasonable doubt. The defense does not have to give up their strategy. I think it is just wishful thinking. Have not heard any complaints from the SA. The Judge did ask them.

The Tes thing is back on the table again. There is a new motion on that. Apparently they had difficulty from Nm's office, so that will be decided at a later date. I can't wait. I think this Judge will take control of that situation and order the documents to be brought down to the Court house. IMO

Your right, the I want everything is not going to work with this Judge or any other Judge for that matter. I think the I won't give anything will not work either for the SA. I disagree with the idea that Jb does not work hard. I believe the defense is doing the best they can do, and I am seeing a change in the atmosphere. I actually hear Ja calling him JUDGE and Jb calling him Your Honor today.

The defense now has a Judge that is willing to listen and consider the rules of discovery and Kc right to a fair trial while making decisions. IMO

 

[Horace Finklestein]

This is so frustrating.

I think the states argument for the 'party pictures' being relevant should be because: they show Casey's demeanor during the time frame that she claims her child was 'missing'.

Yes Jose missed the point - Casey said she was in the club searching for zani/Caylee. Not something you would do dressed in a mini dress and hooker boots, imo. Sorry if that was nothing short of outrageous

 

[Pensfan]

I'd bet thats the only time since KC was in 2rd grade that she said "Happy Mothers Day. I love you." to CA.

 

[JSR]

I think Ja tried the argument he made to Strickland that it was out of his jurisdiction and out of the courts jurisdiction and that the defense would have to go to those states and start their own legal approach to get the bench notes. IIRC the Judge did not fall for this, he said something like if it falls under 3.20 the discovery laws, then there are options. So, I believe JA has finally lost that argument. The court may have more power to get records than the State would like us to know. IMO

You don't follow much litigation do you? A judge in one state NEVER has jurisdiction over any entity in another state unless they allow themselves to have jurisdiction over them.

Unless that entity (lab, FBI, etc) released these documents to the state then the state is NOT bound to get them for the defense. It's called reciprocal discovery. Whatever the state has in possession must be turned over to the defense (in accordance with the discovery rules of that state/court/jurisdiction), and many times there are exceptions. As evidenced by the delay of documents pertaining to an ongoing investigation in this case (i.e. the jail letters).

I think you should be more concerned at this juncture the defense hasn't released not a single item of discovery to the State. In FL it's all or none. She has to follow the rules of discovery just as much as the State does, it's the way reciprocal discovery works. At some point the defense is going to have to put up or shut up.

There is nothing nefarious about what the State is doing here. It's how the legal system works. The state, the judge, or the judge's staff are NOT obligated to do JB and company's job.

Preparing for trial and the discovery phase sucks. It requires long hours and really really hard work. If JB and company can't stand the heat in the kitchen and don't like the hard work then they should get out.

 

[logicalgirl]

OMGoodnesss! :twocents: I just finished watching the videos and the post interview (how charming JB "tried" to be...musta received a lecture from the "ole man" after the other performance Friday!) and am in A W E of His Honor! Now that is a man who can deliver a slap in the face, an upper cut and a "get'er done" 'tude with a smile and a nod! LOVED his mini seminar in the law to JB regarding his laundry list from LKB, too bad JB has no knowledge of what the heck he's requesting, it might make him a better gopher if he UNDERSTOOD (okay being charitable today, remembered) some of the principles within his (oops, LKB's ) motion!:banghead: Really :loser:JB.....you have no idea that there's a difference between an expert witness and a CSI?...oh MY!

BUT for me the most unbelievable piece of "lawyering" (and my sincere apologies to all reputable, worthwhile, intelligent Esquires out there!) was the abysmal :loser:Jose Baez production of "observe my client's worst moments, how hated she is/was/should be (in case you weren't sure!),her disgusting family, observe my (JB's) hatred toward those who tried to help Caylee, and my (JB's) irrational animosity toward TES, MN, OCSO,FBI, even LennyP!".......

:waitasec:WHAT IDIOT EMPHASIZES HIS CLIENT IN SUCH A NEGATIVE MANNER????? and in emotive video, no less, not just within the "flat" transcript! :waitasec:

Again.....O M G !:truce:

LOL - C'mon Joypath, don't be shy - spit it out - tell us all what you really think!!!! That was hilarious and what's really funny is I understood what you were saying the first time I read it for once....

 

[darnudes]

Hi everyone,

I have a question for anyone who is willing to answer. Can someone give me the actual in session link that covered this case. I can get to in sessions but can't get to the live feeds or even any of the past videos on casey. I am on dial up and very slow and also very computer illiterite (sp) but I am really trying to get ready for tomorrow's hearing. Or maybe if there is just an audio live feed I could hear that.. TY all so much for reporting all the hearings so ones like me can read what is going on anyway..

But I would GREATLY appreciate anyones help and /or advice in this matter..
TYIA
sweets

Hi there, don't think there are any audio only clips for you to listen to which is a shame as you're on dial up and they would certainly play better for you.

Place to watch hearings is wftv

http://www.wftv.com/caseyanthony/index.html

Do you have access to trutv? They might replay parts of it.

Might be better for you to read the motions which are the Death Penalty ones that will be heard tomorrow, you can find them here or at wftv.

Hope that helps

 

[Turnadot]

bold 1
Your right, Strickland said that. It looks like this Judge sees it differently. Is now going to make the defense provide a line by line motion so he can look at it. So, the subject is back on the table and Stricklands ruling is out. This is good for the defense, they now have to do their homework. Nothing wrong with that. The state can't just pick an expert from kookamonga so it will be difficult for the defense. If the defense is not allowed to see how an expert came to his opinion, then I doubt the Judge will let it in.

bold 2
Well I am not sure how that works. First not sure there is any discovery, but if there was, would not be sure if the state would release exculpatory evidence to sunshine. I think the Judge would say, exactly what discovery are you talking about? The defense has no obligation here to prove Soddi, yes they are under the same rules, but not sure what it is that posters are asking for. The state has brought these charges, it is their obligation to prove beyond a reasonable doubt. The defense does not have to give up their strategy. I think it is just wishful thinking. Have not heard any complaints from the SA. The Judge did ask them.

The Tes thing is back on the table again. There is a new motion on that. Apparently they had difficulty from Nm's office, so that will be decided at a later date. I can't wait. I think this Judge will take control of that situation and order the documents to be brought down to the Court house. IMO

Your right, the I want everything is not going to work with this Judge or any other Judge for that matter. I think the I won't give anything will not work either for the SA. I disagree with the idea that Jb does not work hard. I believe the defense is doing the best they can do, and I am seeing a change in the atmosphere. I actually hear Ja calling him JUDGE and Jb calling him Your Honor today.

The defense now has a Judge that is willing to listen and consider the rules of discovery and Kc right to a fair trial while making decisions. IMO

All BBM.

When has the SA done this? Cite it, please. Also, are you implying Judge Strickand wasn't fair? The bold in red indicates you're implying Strickland wasn't fair, imo If that's what you mean, can you cite examples of that too? I'm interested, and thank you for your time.

 

[JSR]

bold 1
Your right, Strickland said that. It looks like this Judge sees it differently. Is now going to make the defense provide a line by line motion so he can look at it. So, the subject is back on the table and Stricklands ruling is out. This is good for the defense, they now have to do their homework. Nothing wrong with that. The state can't just pick an expert from kookamonga so it will be difficult for the defense. If the defense is not allowed to see how an expert came to his opinion, then I doubt the Judge will let it in.

bold 2
Well I am not sure how that works. First not sure there is any discovery, but if there was, would not be sure if the state would release exculpatory evidence to sunshine. I think the Judge would say, exactly what discovery are you talking about? The defense has no obligation here to prove Soddi, yes they are under the same rules, but not sure what it is that posters are asking for. The state has brought these charges, it is their obligation to prove beyond a reasonable doubt. The defense does not have to give up their strategy. I think it is just wishful thinking. Have not heard any complaints from the SA. The Judge did ask them.

The Tes thing is back on the table again. There is a new motion on that. Apparently they had difficulty from Nm's office, so that will be decided at a later date. I can't wait. I think this Judge will take control of that situation and order the documents to be brought down to the Court house. IMO

Your right, the I want everything is not going to work with this Judge or any other Judge for that matter. I think the I won't give anything will not work either for the SA. I disagree with the idea that Jb does not work hard. I believe the defense is doing the best they can do, and I am seeing a change in the atmosphere. I actually hear Ja calling him JUDGE and Jb calling him Your Honor today.

The defense now has a Judge that is willing to listen and consider the rules of discovery and Kc right to a fair trial while making decisions. IMO

Again, perhaps you don't work in the legal field or haven't followed litigation cases.

The defense does not have to give up their strategy but if they want the discovery they are requesting from the state they too MUST (not may, not maybe if JB feels like it) MUST engage in reciprocal discovery. They don't get to "surprise" the State during trial. That's what I find so funny that most people think trials work like some Perry Mason moment where the State or the Defense has an ah HA moment and springs some "secret" evidence to prove or disprove a case. It does not work like that. At all.

Most all of trial work is done before you ever enter a courtroom. And even if JB doesn't want to do it the State WILL have access to all the evidence the defense intends to present at trial. And if they don't then the Defense won't be allowed to use it. That however doesn't mean that the State will have access to their attorney work product. The State will know what evidence they intend to submit to the Court but not how he intends to USE it.

 

[The World According]

But seriously about the discovery, how is the defense supposed to know what in the experts' documents and notes is discovery/relevant without being able to see it? How can they be any more specific, isn't asking for all the states' experts' discovery and benchnotes fair enough? Just provide it, why not?

That is an easy one, the Florida rules of discovery are available to him, ( and the public ) , set out just the way he likes them ; LABELED, NUMBERED AND OUTLINED!!!!


I have posted them for him, many, many, many times! Google Florida Rules of Criminal Procedure



You just cannot make this stuff up!

 

[Solange82200]

The defense now has a Judge that is willing to listen and consider the rules of discovery and Kc right to a fair trial while making decisions. IMO

I know it's your opinion, but that is unfair to Judge Strickland. There is no proof that they didn't have those qualities in him as well. I think most people would say they have always had that in a judge. The Marinade Dave thing aside (which I don't agree with you that he did anything wrong, but that is a different story), how anyone can say that Strickland was biased against Casey having a fair trial is beyond me. I appreciate a different point of view from the norm, it helps us see things in a different light, but sometimes it is hard to follow your logic, at least for me....

 

[Turnadot]

Thanks for the awesome explanations, JSR.

 

[sleutherontheside]

Guys lets not let semantics distract from discussion...... Opinions will vary.