ARUBA - Robyn Gardner, 35, Maryland woman missing in Aruba, 2 Aug 2011 - # 3

[R.U.Kidding!]

I agree. I think the two police incidents in 2011 where Robyn had been drinking is more the point.

OK, with reference to the alcohol use:

A) Robyn was easily "angered " due to excessive alcohol consumption on 2 occasions with RF. That does not make her an alcoholic. Lots of people get anger easier when drunk. The broad assumption that this makes her relationship volatile is unfair.

B)Then Dr. Drew takes that incident and makes the leap to explain how she has a"volatile" relationship, and that helps him understand why she makes "bad decisions" WHAT?

Does anyone think it's about time the Gardner's get a "restraining order " on Rf"s MOUTH!......and what's up with DR. Drew, He is ONLY trying to understand how she might have made a bad decision. Pleeeease--that was entirely up to Robyn.
How is RF allowed to go on TV and make Robyn out to be the "bad guy" and he is the victim. This is so wrong in so many ways. Robyn can not even defend herself.:maddening:

Sorry for the rant, but Robyn is the Victim here. Anyone of us including Mr. Wonderful can make a "bad decision" .:twocents::twocents:

 

[HatesSociopaths]

I don't make any conclusion yet that Robyn was an alcoholic. However, if the police were involved twice this year with someone who has been drinking, society is expressing that their conduct is a problem. You don't get drunk and each time the police are called. This drunkenness happened more than twice. There is a drinking problem here, and RF confirms it.

Does not make it less of a crime against her. I think a lot of us want to understand what happened here though. Society can learn from her mistakes. Alcohol was a factor in her poor judgment, IMO.

 

[cluciano63]

I don't see how she was forced to go, unless he already had something on her and blackmailed her?

 

[HatesSociopaths]

Blackmail is part of his past he did that with a woman in 2010 with sex videos posted online and nude photos put in neighbours mailboxes.

 

[HatesSociopaths]

I wonder how she lost her job.

 

[OneLostGrl]

OK, with reference to the alcohol use:

A) Robyn was easily "angered " due to excessive alcohol consumption on 2 occasions with RF. That does not make her an alcoholic. Lots of people get anger easier when drunk. The broad assumption that this makes her relationship volatile is unfair.

B)Then Dr. Drew takes that incident and makes the leap to explain how she has a"volatile" relationship, and that helps him understand why she makes "bad decisions" WHAT?

Does anyone think it's about time the Gardner's get a "restraining order " on Rf"s MOUTH!......and what's up with DR. Drew, He is ONLY trying to understand how she might have made a bad decision. Pleeeease--that was entirely up to Robyn.
How is RF allowed to go on TV and make Robyn out to be the "bad guy" and he is the victim. This is so wrong in so many ways. Robyn can not even defend herself.:maddening:

Sorry for the rant, but Robyn is the Victim here. Anyone of us including Mr. Wonderful can make a "bad decision" .:twocents::twocents:

Ya know, I don't think "Mr. Wonderful" is trying to bad mouth her.. I think he's being as honest as he can because he thinks it's what will help the most and I personally think he's right. When reality smashes us in the face denial really is of no help.. to me it's clear this man loves her, even though they had issues, even though she may have had an issue with alcohol, even though she snuck on vacation with a man and said she was going with her family. She isn't an angel, so what? That doesn't make her any less of a victim, it doesn't mean the people admitting her truth are bad mouthing her. I admire the guy for putting his pain of finding out she was cheating on him all this time with this other guy, seeing him twice a month and going on vacation with him.. not a lot of men would be doing what he's doing, they'd have walked away when they found out. This guy loves her regardless and is keeping her name in the news, he wants her home.. he's never bad mouthed her, he's admitted she drinks, so what?!

 

[Columbo]

It's clear to me she is an alcoholic. Alcohol has caused too many upsets and difficulties in her life and probably has assisted in her demise. A person doesn't have to be a down and out wino lying drunk in an alley to be an alcoholic. (I say that with sympathy for that person).

Look at the AA website, note questions # 6 and 7.
http://www.aa.org/lang/en/subpage.cfm?page=71

I'm not calling her names...alcoholism is a problem that needs treatment. Hope I am saying this right--I mean it with all due respect.

 

[webrocket]

I have not followed all the twists and turns here and if I have mischaracterized something, pleasee someone correct me.

whether or not Robyn was actually an alcoholic does not diminish the fact that she certainly exhibited alcoholic behavior. most people don't have a single incident with the police involving alcohol. non-alcoholics can and do have such incidents but usually only once. get a DWI, pay the price, learn your lesson and it is never repeated. here she had to prior run ins with the police where alcohol was involved. hmmm

as for her behavior leading up to this trip, she told people she was going to Florida or on a cruise or something while she was planning a trip to Aruba with a man who was not her boyfriend. she agrees to have a $1.5 million travel insurance policy taken out on her. she is the subject of nude pics or videos while on vacation?

who knows if these people devised an insurance scam? a couple of drunks might think it a brilliant idea. no sane or sober person would be a party to it especially on the part of the person on whose life the policy is taken.

none of this diminishes the fact that she is missing and presumed dead. I can't script a set of actions more reckless than what she did leading up to this trip.

I would hope people would not trash Aruba or its LE. Aruba does not choose those who vacation there.

 

[R.U.Kidding!]

It's clear to me she is an alcoholic. Alcohol has caused too many upsets and difficulties in her life and probably has assisted in her demise. A person doesn't have to be a down and out wino lying drunk in an alley to be an alcoholic. (I say that with sympathy for that person).

Look at the AA website, note questions # 6 and 7.
http://www.aa.org/lang/en/subpage.cfm?page=71

I'm not calling her names...alcoholism is a problem that needs treatment. Hope I am saying this right--I mean it with all due respect.

You are saying it right , Columbo==alcoholism is a problem that needs treatment. Perhaps I have made this too personal an issue. I am a recovering alcoholic, with 30 years of sobriety and know firsthand the kind of heartache this brings to ones life.
I am only trying to say (and I guess not very well), Alcoholism is so much more than a yes to #6 and #7 on a questionnaire, and a few fights with your boyfriend because you have had to much to drink.
How can you say "it is clear to me she is an alcoholic". With all due respect, those are the kind of "judgements" we have no right to make .
I also cannot see how anything RF has said in his many interviews has helped find what happened to Robyn Gardner, and that is the ONLY reason he should have for wanting to be on TV as much as he has. IMOO!:twocents:

 

[otto]

I don't make any conclusion yet that Robyn was an alcoholic. However, if the police were involved twice this year with someone who has been drinking, society is expressing that their conduct is a problem. You don't get drunk and each time the police are called. This drunkenness happened more than twice. There is a drinking problem here, and RF confirms it.

Does not make it less of a crime against her. I think a lot of us want to understand what happened here though. Society can learn from her mistakes. Alcohol was a factor in her poor judgment, IMO.

When the first US woman disappeared in Aruba, there was alcohol involved and it was played down as it cast some doubt on the victim. This is not to say that the victim is in any way responsible, but what I mean is that society views a drunk victim differently than a sober victim. We are seeing the same thing here. It was first believed that Robyn had her wits about her and may have gone snorkeling, then it was revealed that police attended two drunken disputes, and now we learn that alcohol was a big part of the Aruba trip.

If Robyn was drunk, we can expect something different from her than if she was sober. For example, if she was sober and GVG was pissed, she would have been reluctant to get into a car with him or anything else. If she was pissed and he was sober, we could assume that he manipulated her. If they were both pissed, then anything is possible ... they would have driven together, had more to drink, wandered into dangerous places, made bad decisions and perhaps had quite a big disagreement.

 

[Columbo]

You are saying it right , Columbo==alcoholism is a problem that needs treatment. Perhaps I have made this too personal an issue. I am a recovering alcoholic, with 30 years of sobriety and know firsthand the kind of heartache this brings to ones life.
I am only trying to say (and I guess not very well), Alcoholism is so much more than a yes to #6 and #7 on a questionnaire, and a few fights with your boyfriend because you have had to much to drink.
How can you say "it is clear to me she is an alcoholic". With all due respect, those are the kind of "judgements" we have no right to make .
I also cannot see how anything RF has said in his many interviews has helped find what happened to Robyn Gardner, and that is the ONLY reason he should have for wanting to be on TV as much as he has. IMOO!:twocents:

bolded by me.

Thanks R.U.Kidding! A great post--and you are right, that was a judgmental thing for me to say, or it came across as being judgmental. I guess I just thought I was stating a fact. Of course, I could not encompass the depth and breadth of alcoholism and its damage in one statement. I suppose saying she is an alcoholic--even if she is-- won't help solve this case, either.

I think RF does want to find Robyn Gardner---maybe nothing he has said will help, either.

That is wonderful about your sobriety!

 

[otto]

I don't see how she was forced to go, unless he already had something on her and blackmailed her?

I don't think a trip to a Aruba is something people have to agree to when they're being blackmailed. If she was being blackmailed because of something on film, the last thing she would do, drunk or sober, is pose for more pictures.

 

[otto]

I wonder how she lost her job.

What do we know about her that may have something to do with losing her job. In the last couple of years, perhaps recently, she:

added tattoos
added botox
had surgical enhancements
altered her hair
had alimony troubles
was dating at least two men
associated with a man that was known for violence against women
accepted a cruise with a much older man and then abruptly cancelled
2x in the last 6 months consumed alcohol accessively and loudly; involving police
may not have always told the truth

And then, maybe it was simple downsizing. She did scheduling for a dentist. Maybe someone added that to their job description and the position was eliminated.

 

[annalia]

When the first US woman disappeared in Aruba, there was alcohol involved and it was played down as it cast some doubt on the victim. This is not to say that the victim is in any way responsible, but what I mean is that society views a drunk victim differently than a sober victim. We are seeing the same thing here. It was first believed that Robyn had her wits about her and may have gone snorkeling, then it was revealed that police attended two drunken disputes, and now we learn that alcohol was a big part of the Aruba trip.

If Robyn was drunk, we can expect something different from her than if she was sober. For example, if she was sober and GVG was pissed, she would have been reluctant to get into a car with him or anything else. If she was pissed and he was sober, we could assume that he manipulated her. If they were both pissed, then anything is possible ... they would have driven together, had more to drink, wandered into dangerous places, made bad decisions and perhaps had quite a big disagreement.

My bolding

That is absolutely not true, total nonsense. It didn't cast any doubts on that victim for anyone except the Beth H and Natalee bashers. It was no secret in the media or anywhere that NH and the others kids drank. No one except for the victim bashers thought any less of her, quite the opposite as most parents know that kids drink and predators like Van der Sloot take advantage of girls in that situation.

 

[annalia]

OK, with reference to the alcohol use:

A) Robyn was easily "angered " due to excessive alcohol consumption on 2 occasions with RF. That does not make her an alcoholic. Lots of people get anger easier when drunk. The broad assumption that this makes her relationship volatile is unfair.

B)Then Dr. Drew takes that incident and makes the leap to explain how she has a"volatile" relationship, and that helps him understand why she makes "bad decisions" WHAT?

Does anyone think it's about time the Gardner's get a "restraining order " on Rf"s MOUTH!......and what's up with DR. Drew, He is ONLY trying to understand how she might have made a bad decision. Pleeeease--that was entirely up to Robyn.
How is RF allowed to go on TV and make Robyn out to be the "bad guy" and he is the victim. This is so wrong in so many ways. Robyn can not even defend herself.:maddening:

Sorry for the rant, but Robyn is the Victim here. Anyone of us including Mr. Wonderful can make a "bad decision" .:twocents::twocents:

ITA

We don't know anything about RG, or everything that went on between them and for all we know RF could be the one that was no good. He's out portraying himself one way in the media, but RG isn't here to defend herself.

I wouldn't think he would air any dirty laundry that might make him look bad. What would it matter anyway, it doesn't change or answer what happened to her.

 

[Justdesserts]

There is no way of knowing what she is referring to
Its a rather mild statement

But a negative one. She wasn't happy about something. And why write her bo to tell him.?

 

[Justdesserts]

She could have been talking about dinner

She could have been referring to the trip and the company she was keeping

She could have been saying it because her BF caught her on Vacation with another man

Its two words, can't determine what she was talking about

The fact that she didnt' say what and the fact that she was impelled to tell her boyfriend in the states, tells me she was speaking of the present situation AND THEN She told her bo, she missed him and would work it out when she got home. Sounds like it's inferring a mistake by going on that trip for whatever reason, but since she's telling her american bo, she wanted him to know she was miserable with that guy in Aruba

 

[OneLove]

What do we know about her that may have something to do with losing her job. In the last couple of years, perhaps recently, she:

added tattoos
added botox
had surgical enhancements
altered her hair
had alimony troubles
was dating at least two men
associated with a man that was known for violence against women
accepted a cruise with a much older man and then abruptly cancelled
2x in the last 6 months consumed alcohol accessively and loudly; involving police
may not have always told the truth

And then, maybe it was simple downsizing. She did scheduling for a dentist. Maybe someone added that to their job description and the position was eliminated.

As a former Human Resource Specialist, I can comfortably say that none of the above should have cost her a job.

ETA: Except for the very last one.

 

[OneLove]

My bolding

That is absolutely not true, total nonsense. It didn't cast any doubts on that victim for anyone except the Beth H and Natalee bashers. It was no secret in the media or anywhere that NH and the others kids drank. No one except for the victim bashers thought any less of her, quite the opposite as most parents know that kids drink and predators like Van der Sloot take advantage of girls in that situation.

I don't think it is that anyone necessarily thought LESS of her as much as they knew she was more VULNERABLE to foul play or making poor decisions under the influence.

As it turns out, getting (drunk) into that car with those three was, indeed, a poor decision. It SHOULD be noted by her peers how very sad and unfortunate that one inebriated mistake cost her dearly. She would probably have NOT climbed into that car sober, and even if she had, would have been in a better position to defend herself better and earlier.

The same is probably, sadly, true of Robyn also.

 

[otto]

My bolding

That is absolutely not true, total nonsense. It didn't cast any doubts on that victim for anyone except the Beth H and Natalee bashers. It was no secret in the media or anywhere that NH and the others kids drank. No one except for the victim bashers thought any less of her, quite the opposite as most parents know that kids drink and predators like Van der Sloot take advantage of girls in that situation.

A woman being drunk or sober, when disappearing, is a bit like a working woman (prostitute), or a career woman (suit person), being found murdered down the street - investigators and sleuthers read it differently.