17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #31

[Donjeta]

Did the gf say TM was running, are there witnesses to the fact that he was running or are we just assuming that he was because GZ said so?

 

[m00c0w]

Not far from where he started running? According to the SPD and SFD his body was 100 feet from where he started running, and equally important 233 feet from GZ's vehicle.

As to any evidence of GZ leaving the area of his car, I don't know what evidence they may or may not have other than the very simple response given by the Investigator at the Bond Hearing:



When his statement, with the 911 call's running times in red, is now locked into the record as follows:



He has clearly told LE AND his attorney that he followed TM for 18 seconds, then went on an "address hunt" requiring that he continue walking for 80 feet to the front of the building he was behind, and then started walking back towards his car but was attacked by TM.

It doesn't get any more simple than that. He walked for 18 seconds, then walked 80 feet more, then was walking back to his truck. Any way you look at it, it would take LESS than 1 minute.

That's his story, and that's why "other than his statement, no" is all the State will need to prove he's lying about that night. IMO, what TM could or couldn't have done won't have a big bearing on anything once the jury gets a handle on GZ's timeline.

To be blunt, you really don't know what he did for that amount of time. You can speculate all you want to, but nothing implies there was constant movement for that entire amount of time. At the very least, he could have been pacing or walking in circles as he was talking to the dispatcher. The timelines not fitting whatever direction you perceive a person to continuously move to (or away from) doesn't mean much without all of the facts. You're assuming he never stopped walking or continuously walked in one path or route. That's a very big assumption.

 

[ScubaTwinn]

see you all later before I get timed out or banned...

this is really very frustrating to suggest the victim didn't try hard enough to get to his door...


shame on those who think this teen is the problem and not GZ, who isn't even close to fulfilling his dreams at 29 y/o....that tells alot about a guy who doens't have his career set, yet...:banghead:

I totally agree. WHY let someone know where you live? And apparently his younger brother was there.

I have been jogging and had someone stop their car blocking the sidewalk across the street to take the hard top off their car. And they kept watching me approach, watching, watching, paying more attention to me than their car. And I stared back, memorizing the car, what he looked like, anything that I might need to know. When I got to the street he was parked on blocking the sidewalk, I took an immediate left into the yard and ran through the yard clear up to the front doors. I kept running through yards, right up next to their front doors. I PASSED my house up because no one was home at the time and I wasn't about to let this person know where I lived. I was ready to bolt if he so much as moved and start banging on one of these doors and yelling. I kept turning around giving him the stink eye. He realized what I was doing and left.

 

[lauriej]

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2...ients-apology-to-trayvon-martins-parents?lite

Zimmerman's attorney apologizes for client's apology to Trayvon Martin's parents

During his bond hearing last week, Zimmerman addressed Martin’s family directly, saying he was sorry for the loss of their son. Speaking on “CBS This Morning” Monday, attorney Mark O’Mara said he didn’t realize the family would feel the apology came at the wrong time.

“Had I known or been told that that wasn't the time, it wouldn't have happened. So, I apologize for that,” O’Mara said.

O’Mara said his client wouldn’t have apologized at the hearing had he seen the press conference.

“My concern is, I didn’t realize that the way that they had responded to me was through a press conference, where they said it was too late or not an appropriate time,” he said.

 

[Phoenixfla]

It doesn't matter IMO, because in this case there was an actual phone call...:moo::twocents:

Probably your right, but what evidence supports that? I believe her statement was taken 3 weeks after the event?

 

[badme102]

I'm seeing some saying that MOM said TM's GF's name at the bond hearing and I just listened to the feed (video) again:

http://www.wral.com/news/video/11004815/#/vid11004815

MOM--during this time, Martin was on the phone with a friend and described to her what was happening. And how'd you get that information?(1:16:07)

Gilbreath--From Detective Osteen

MOM--And how did he get it?

Gilbreath--He interviewed the witness

MOM--And (inaudible) her name? I think he says "remember her name"

Gilbreath--No, I don't

MOM--You don't know it?

Gilbreath--I do....I have access to it

Prosecutor-- (cross talk.) Your honor...I apologize..I'm gonna object to that witness' name being disclosed for safety...(cross talk)

MOM--and I apologize, It came out and I realized....

Prosecutor--thank you

MOM--I agree and I apologize...

Judge--So you know who the witness is...and you know what the name is...but you just don't want to reveal it at this time pursuant to court order?

Gilbreath--Yes, sir and I do have access to it, however, I do not--no.

MOM--that's fine, I apologize for the slip and the enquiry

This is all just by my ears, but I don't see where MOM mentions TM's GF's name?
Did they take it out?

Of course, this is all CNN has on their transcript:
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1204/20/cnr.02.html

O'MARA: During this time, Martin was on the phone with a friend and described what was happening. How did you get that information?

GILBREATH: From Detective Osteen.

O'MARA: How did he get it?

GILBREATH: He interviewed the witness.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'll object to that witness' name being disclosed.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I apologize.

(END LIVE FEED)

 

[Adrienne37]

Is there actual evidence the "brother" was home that night? So far, I've seen the story change a few times on that one. The final version of events implying he was not home.

How about the links to those changes please?


~jmo~

 

[Adrienne37]

The gunshot wound was not what started the confrontation. Please look back at the previous posts and you will see that we were discussing evidence of how the physical confrontation started. I have not seen any evidence that indicated that GZ threw the first punch.

Nor is there any evidence that indicates that Trayvon threw the first punch either.


~jmo~

 

[m00c0w]

How about the links to those changes please?


~jmo~

They're scattered here and there and everywhere. I've discussed it many times here. I have a rationale for my beliefs. If you don't share the same, that's your prerogative.

 

[Adrienne37]

I'm seeing some saying that MOM said TM's GF's name at the bond hearing and I just listened to the feed (video) again:

http://www.wral.com/news/video/11004815/#/vid11004815




This is all just by my ears, but I don't see where MOM mentions TM's GF's name?
Did they take it out?

Of course, this is all CNN has on their transcript:
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1204/20/cnr.02.html

Why would O'Mara apologize if he didn't speak her name during the hearing? He knows full well that this child is a minor and he didn't need to do that. I guess he has the same selective hearing about not needing to do something that Zimmerman does.



~jmo~

 

[m00c0w]

Why would O'Mara apologize if he didn't speak her name during the hearing? He knows full well that this child is a minor and he didn't need to do that. I guess he has the same selective hearing about not needing to do something that Zimmerman does.



~jmo~

Maybe because he was pushing for the name? How do you even know O'Mara has the name if discovery hasn't taken place?

 

[annalia]

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2...ients-apology-to-trayvon-martins-parents?lite

Zimmerman's attorney apologizes for client's apology to Trayvon Martin's parents

Nice little dig at the family while giving his apology, but hang on a second. Didn't MOM acknowledge right after the bond hearing that he was aware that the family had indeed rejected their attempt at a meeting? I can't find the link to it.

I'm sure that MOM is every bit the great defense attorney as some say, but his style is becoming clearer, kind of passive/aggressive, using honey while sticking in the dagger.

JMHO

 

[LolaMoon08]

Did the gf say TM was running, are there witnesses to the fact that he was running or are we just assuming that he was because GZ said so?

George says Trayvon is "running" but the girlfriend says she told Trayvon to run, but he said he was just going to walk fast.

George also said Trayvon was "checking him out" and walking "towards him" too? And he was "on drugs" and had "something in his pocket" I think George has a problem with embellishing because I know no one who would get out of their car and follow someone like that... which George admits he was doing.

MOO

 

[grandmaj]

I've never seen an MSM link which changed the story of Mr. Martin that the brother was home and Trayvon went to the store. I'd also appreciate a link.

 

[Adrienne37]

They're scattered here and there and everywhere. I've discussed it many times here. I have a rationale for my beliefs. If you don't share the same, that's your prerogative.

You plainly state the following in your post...

Is there actual evidence the "brother" was home that night? So far, I've seen the story change a few times on that one. The final version of events implying he was not home.

You are implying that the story has changed many times. It's not unreasonable to ask another for a link when they appear to be stating something as fact. I certainly don't see anywhere on your post that it is your opinion. Therefore, it is my right to ask for a link to a MSM article that indicates that the story has changed regarding the 13-year-old being home or not being home that night.



~jmo~

 

[PaintingAnemone]

see you all later before I get timed out or banned...

this is really very frustrating to suggest the victim didn't try hard enough to get to his door...

I've found that it can incredibly frustrating discussing this case sometimes - everyone has their own ideas and opinions on what happened, and their own perspective of who is "innocent" or "guilty." We have far too little in the way of facts, so we're left to speculate about every little thing and pick at it for any hint of meaning, be it real or imagined. Evidence that's obvious to some people, may not be so obvious to others. Heck, I've seen posts from people insisting they didn't see certain things that were clearly visible, even after it had been highlighted and circled for them.

Let me share a short story with you guys:

I was at the laundromat with my boyfriend the other day, and we were folding our clothes. There was a pair of socks that he didn't recognize, so he insisted they must be mine. "No," I said, "They're yours, because I've seen you wear them." Besides, they were men's socks; I don't buy men's socks, so they certainly didn't belong to me. I suggested that maybe he had simply forgotten he had them.
Now, this wasn't a spare sock that might have come from another person's laundry. It was a complete pair of socks. But then we get into a brief back and forth about whose socks they are. Finally, I pick up one of my own socks, hold it up against one of the socks in dispute, and show him that just the size difference alone should indicate that they are clearly not my socks. He sees the difference, acknowledges that they're not mine - and then repeats AGAIN that they're not his, and says he's going to just throw them away! :floorlaugh:

Moral of the story: don't get so invested in whatever side you've chosen that you ignore what's right in front of you and are willing to throw away your own socks rather than admit to being wrong.

 

[LolaMoon08]

Also, when you listen to GZ call to LE, the dispatch asks George immediately after George got out of the call if he was following Trayvon and he said "Yep" and the dispatch says "We don't need you to be doing that" and George says "Okay."

At that very moment is when GZ should have done a 180 and went back to his car... but we know he didn't.

MOO

 

[LolaMoon08]

And anyone who believes that George was really going to check an address, when he could have jumped in his car and drove around to check it -- I've got a 2012 New England Patriots Super Bowl Ring to sell.

MOO

 

[m00c0w]

You plainly state the following in your post...

Is there actual evidence the "brother" was home that night? So far, I've seen the story change a few times on that one. The final version of events implying he was not home.

You are implying that the story has changed many times. It's not unreasonable to ask another for a link when they appear to be stating something as fact. I certainly don't see anywhere on your post that it is your opinion. Therefore, it is my right to ask for a link to a MSM article that indicates that the story has changed regarding the 13-year-old being home or not being home that night.



~jmo~

I'm referring to the "brother" being home and Martin was allegedly out getting him skittles, to Martin having begged the father to be let out of the house with the trip to the store as an excuse. And the "brother" not having been mentioned since the initial reporting of the event.

His fateful walk to the convenience store for a bag of Skittles and an iced tea on the evening of February 26 happened only because the teenager pleaded to leave the apartment, said Horton.
"The only reason he got a chance to go to the store is because he begged his dad to go," he said. At the time, his father and his fiancée had gone out to dinner and to watch a basketball game, leaving Martin at the townhouse, according to Martin family spokesman Ryan Julison.

http://edition.cnn.com/2012/03/30/us/trayvon-martin-profile/index.html

I have not seen anything since the initial reports of Martin going to the store to get him candy that implicitly or explicitly states the "brother" was home at the time. This is why I asked for evidence. Is that too much?

 

[annalia]

George says Trayvon is "running" but the girlfriend says she told Trayvon to run, but he said he was just going to walk fast.

George also said Trayvon was "checking him out" and walking "towards him" too? And he was "on drugs" and had "something in his pocket" I think George has a problem with embellishing because I know no one who would get out of their car and follow someone like that... which George admits he was doing.

MOO

I get so confused about this running talk and how it's supposed to make Trayvon more suspicious. GZ said very early in the 911 call that he's running, that's when GZ got out of the car, that doesn't mean that Trayvon never stopped running or that he was running all the way home.

Didn't the GF say at one point that Trayvon had thought he lost GZ? If he thought he had lost him it's easy to see that he may have stopped running, he may have stopped completely so he could talk longer to his girlfriend. Was it when GZ appears behind him for the second time that Trayvon says no I'll walk fast?

Trayvon says to his gf that he thought he had lost GZ, GZ says he doesn't know where this kid is. Those two statements make it very plausible that Trayvon had indeed stopped running because he thought at that point GZ was no longer after him.

How would Trayon have even known that GZ had gotten out of his car if he, according to GZ's own words, ran and was down by the other entrance?

JMHO