GUILTY NC - Laura Ackerson, 27, Kinston, 13 July 2011 #2

[borndem]

Question for anyone who might know...

If a person is given immunity in exchange for evidence, is there any public record or formal record of it? So, for example (and just hypothetically), if Karen Berry had been threatened with prosecution but she gave them info in exchange for immunity, would the defense be able to refer to a formal document referring to the agreement?

Or is such a thing all done under the table, not on record?

In the Ryan Hare case (the four teenagers who were in on the murder of a "friend," Matthew Silliman), two of the accomplices who were also charged initially with 1st Degree Murder, took pleas for 2nd degree -- and were sentenced after Hare's trial -- agreed to testify at Hare's trial.

One did not testify because he became "iffy" just before he was to take the stand. One, who was not there at the time of the murder, did testify, but he had not yet taken a plea. Anyway, Allegra Dahlquist testified that she had taken a 2nd Degree plea. All four of them were charged with a prior 1st Degree Murder attempt on Silliman which failed, and all four were charged with 2 conspiracy to commit murder charges. Dahlquist's deal was definitely part of that trial record. She got ~37 years max, the other non-testifier got ~40 years max. The 3rd, who had a very small part of the crime, took an Alford plea and got accessory after the fact, ~5 years.

ETA: None of the 3 who were given deals obviously were not given immunity. But this is the closest case I know of where pleas were exchanged for testimony in Wake County that I have seen live.

 

[aa9511]

Possibly dumb answer from a casual watcher: is it the same sister they went to in TX? Is she testifying to protect herself?

Edit: I guess I HAVE been paying attention after all.

yes, same sister....I'm a casual watcher too. Been over there at Richard Chrisman trial so haven't kept up with this case.

 

[NCEast]

yes, same sister....I'm a casual watcher too. Been over there at Richard Chrisman trial so haven't kept up with this case.

I started with the Chrisman trial but, even at my age, I got too antsy with no live stream, tweets only at the time. I check the WS thread there almost every night and miss my friends on that thread. Chrisman needs life without parole so he can endure prison life for many years. This Hayes trial began and I've been waiting for 2 years for this one so I just had to be here.

 

[AnonymousNC]

Grant Hayes regularly dabbled in cocaine on the weekends.. this was well known within his social circles (which I was privy to).. a group of bar performers/musicians and "nightlife socialites". It was about as natural/normal as second hand smoking (to casually take a trip to the bathroom and do some blow). This much is as true as his name is Grant Hayes.... However.. his drug use was recreational.. in that.. it had nothing to do with this case.


I'm not sure if you guys remember, but before Grant Hayes facebook page was removed/deleted. one of his last comments were in regards to a "Dexter" episode he was watching.. clearly his actions were highly based on what he learned form watching Dexter.. (which was at the height of its popularity at the time of the murder)

it explains why there was no blood, and all precautions were taken in making sure they covered their tracks during the murder.. unfortunately for them, and fortunately for us.. they sort of lost track of "not leaving a paper-trail" post murder.

 

[aa9511]

Grant Hayes regularly dabbled in cocaine on the weekends.. this was well known within his social circles (which I was privy to).. a group of bar performers/musicians and "nightlife socialites". It was about as natural/normal as second hand smoking (to casually take a trip to the bathroom and do some blow). This much is as true as his name is Grant Hayes.... However.. his drug use was recreational.. in that.. it had nothing to do with this case.


I'm not sure if you guys remember, but before Grant Hayes facebook page was removed/deleted. one of his last comments were in regards to a "Dexter" episode he was watching.. clearly his actions were highly based on what he learned form watching Dexter.. (which was at the height of its popularity at the time of the murder)

it explains why there was no blood, and all precautions were taken in making sure they covered their tracks during the murder.. unfortunately for them, and fortunately for us.. they sort of lost track of "not leaving a paper-trail" post murder.

Do u think their plan was all along to take the body to Texas and dump it there where they thought no one would find it and no one would look for it? Because I"m wondering why they waited so long to make the trip to Texas?

I wish the detectives could have gotten a search warrant for their house before they left NC...

 

[Cherry]

I do, I thnk he thought they were so smart. But alas, they were wrong and thus made the usual 32 mistakes most criminals make when attempting to cover their own *advertiser censored* as well as a horrific (judges own words) murder. He is so smug in that courtroom, a wannabe.

 

[carynative]

Very good points, as usual, Boods! Stabbing -- ahhh, maybe so. And if she were stabbed in the stomach, nothing there to nick -- and yes, I thought earlier about just letting her bleed to death in the bathtub (How cruel. They must do something about access by the boys to the bathroom -- lock it, or put her in theirs instead? -- running a long shower to wash all the blood out of the tub and out of the pipes in their plumbing system. If so, somebody did clean all blood traces out of the bathroom, and that takes care of the missing shower curtain, too. Wrap her up and throw her in the trash can and slice & dice later, or on the road (Wasn't there a shower curtain there a few days prior, according to AH's daughter?)

Yep, I like those ideas, Boodles. And certainly a heroin OD would work, and quickly, quietly and neatly, too...

<smh> How cruel people can be.

I think they ambushed her right when she came in the entryway to the apartment. Remember the Raleigh detective said the first thing he noticed was a large bleach stain on carpet right by entryway/front door? They had those boys locked away and they never even knew their mommy was there. Something produced blood right there or there wouldn't have needed to be. A clean-up bleach stain right there.
Although the heroin idea is interesting. Amanda looks like a heroin addict for sure.

 

[Marilou]

I'm wondering if there is a discrepancy with the ME's testimony today & the testimony expected from NC's ME. There was so much focus by both sides today on the thyroid/voice box and whether the TX ME cracked it open or not to check for possible signs of strangulation. Boz asked today if he was sure he had cracked it open in THIS case & kept seeming to try to get him to rethink what he was saying. Then defense brought it up again & got him to confirm that he had cracked it open. Would be interesting to see the NC ME's report where this is concerned. Guess it will be addressed eventually.

 

[Boodles]

I think they ambushed her right when she came in the entryway to the apartment. Remember the Raleigh detective said the first thing he noticed was a large bleach stain on carpet right by entryway/front door? They had those boys locked away and they never even knew their mommy was there. Something produced blood right there or there wouldn't have needed to be. A clean-up bleach stain right there.
Although the heroin idea is interesting. Amanda looks like a heroin addict for sure.

I agree they ambushed her, and there was blood by the front entry. But IMO GH first got her to sign that agreement. I feel like there was some urgency to this agreement thing, not sure what/why. Whether it was a real agreement or something Laura signed because she was in fear and forced to go along with it, I can't figure out.

I hope the State makes their hypothesis clear next week. Something about those text messages ("the business day ends in two hours...you're putting me in a *advertiser censored***'d situation...") and agreement are important, IMO.

Maybe he wanted her to call her attorney and say "we figured it out so call off all legal proceedings" to have that on record so GH could claim "no motive b/c we had worked it all out." But that's stupid because they killed her the same day...

Were they maybe trying to make it appear that she didn't care about the kids (see? She gave them away for $25K!) and took off after closing this agreement and (they would have alleged) receiving $25K? That would "explain" her sudden disappearance.

Anyway, back to the blood. I think something may have been placed by the entryway which leaked or smeared blood there.

I think they killed her (with the kids in the other room like was said earlier), then put her in the bathtub, where she remained overnight. GH then went to Walmart in the middle of the nite to get supplies: tarp, goggles, saw.

After Sha got the kids the next morning, G & A went to work in the kids' bathroom sawing. That was Thursday. GH didn't buy the coolers and ice until Sat, IIRC. So I won't speculate about where the body parts were kept Thursday, Friday and Saturday before they got the coolers. But they had duffel bags (which would allow liquid to leak/soak through).

Then they cleaned the bathroom with bleach (maybe used one of those pressurized sprayers), completely covering the bathroom floor, thus the bleach leaching into the hallway carpet. And they had the tarps and shower curtain to help contain the mess.

They cleaned (using Sha's vacuum), sold furniture, etc. to remove physical evidence and get $ for the trip. Probably dumped stuff in random dumpsters around North Raleigh or even en route to TX.

They got to TX and couldn't figure a way to go shark fishing or gator searching. (What if Shelton had said "yes" to GH's request?? Were they going to implicate him, too??). They thought acid would destroy the remains. Then they took the boat into the creek and the rest is history.

That's my theory at the moment.

 

[AnonymousD]

I'm spending my Friday night catching up watching the trial.

Chavon is tugging at my heartstrings. It's amazing how we can meet complete strangers & just hit it off like Laura & Chavon did. That warms my heart so much.

I'm at the point where Chavon is looking at the notebooks she recovered from Laura's home. As she is looking over them quietly, I've caught myself waiting to see her smile. Reading something that her friend wrote that would bring her comfort. I finally saw it & I swear, something flew into my eye. Watching Chavon smile & giggle at what Laura wrote was what I needed to see tonight.

Laura, you made a true friend in Chavon. That's something we all wish for in this life.

 

[al66pine]

... this prosecution is in a NC court under NC law (imo, that's why).

Amanda's sister lived in Texas and (AFAIK) did not set foot in NC during the time period in which AH's and GH's premeditation, Laura's death, and the cover up occured.

Perhaps someone here could tell us whether she might be subject to prosecution under NC law, if NC LE and prosecutor had solid evidence of her participation in a conspiracy before the death (ex: email: "Amanda & Grant, you're going to kill Laura and would like to bring the remains here? Count me in. I'll help to put the remains in our creek w. the alligators in it. Your loving Sister in TX" w. digital, electronical, technical corroboration).

With that evidence, could TX prosecute her (for ?)?
Seems like logistics would be complicated, expensive, etc.

Federal law? Ditto.

JMO :twocents:

 

[Nymeria]

There is no way in Disney-hell he would ever get on that stand. I mean, he cannot possibly think it would help his case to be cross-examined and be all smug, right? Right? Right? :scared:

2 words- Jodi Arias

If he is anything like her (and I suspect he is), Grant is going to think only HE can get the story out and save himself.
Only HE is smart enough to handle all this silly mess....doncha know? :facepalm:

Here is to Grants lawyers not being able to talk him out of it...and getting up there are just burying himself just like lil miss Jodi did...:cheers: :toast:




BTW- :welcome5: AnonymousNC
I am sorry something so tragic brought you here, but I hope you get to see justice served and stay around for other cases. It is an interesting place with lots of smart, savvy, trialwatchers.

 

[aa9511]

I agree they ambushed her, and there was blood by the front entry. But IMO GH first got her to sign that agreement. I feel like there was some urgency to this agreement thing, not sure what/why. Whether it was a real agreement or something Laura signed because she was in fear and forced to go along with it, I can't figure out.

I hope the State makes their hypothesis clear next week. Something about those text messages ("the business day ends in two hours...you're putting me in a *advertiser censored***'d situation...") and agreement are important, IMO.

Maybe he wanted her to call her attorney and say "we figured it out so call off all legal proceedings" to have that on record so GH could claim "no motive b/c we had worked it all out." But that's stupid because they killed her the same day...

Were they maybe trying to make it appear that she didn't care about the kids (see? She gave them away for $25K!) and took off after closing this agreement and (they would have alleged) receiving $25K? That would "explain" her sudden disappearance.

Anyway, back to the blood. I think something may have been placed by the entryway which leaked or smeared blood there.

I think they killed her (with the kids in the other room like was said earlier), then put her in the bathtub, where she remained overnight. GH then went to Walmart in the middle of the nite to get supplies: tarp, goggles, saw.

After Sha got the kids the next morning, G & A went to work in the kids' bathroom sawing. That was Thursday. GH didn't buy the coolers and ice until Sat, IIRC. So I won't speculate about where the body parts were kept Thursday, Friday and Saturday before they got the coolers. But they had duffel bags (which would allow liquid to leak/soak through).

Then they cleaned the bathroom with bleach (maybe used one of those pressurized sprayers), completely covering the bathroom floor, thus the bleach leaching into the hallway carpet. And they had the tarps and shower curtain to help contain the mess.

They cleaned (using Sha's vacuum), sold furniture, etc. to remove physical evidence and get $ for the trip. Probably dumped stuff in random dumpsters around North Raleigh or even en route to TX.

They got to TX and couldn't figure a way to go shark fishing or gator searching. (What if Shelton had said "yes" to GH's request?? Were they going to implicate him, too??). They thought acid would destroy the remains. Then they took the boat into the creek and the rest is history.

That's my theory at the moment.

bbm

I agree that they must have gotten all that acid thinking it would just evicerate (sp?) the entire body. I don't know if they were just dumb enough to believe their trail wouldn't eventually lead to the creek? They seem to have planned everything out, kinda, so I wouldn't think they would risk the chance of the body being found. I dunno.

 

[al66pine]

Thank you to people gave me guidance to the youtubes of the trial to catch up. Just about finished w. day 2.

Now confused about the marital status.

1. Per Laura's friend Heidi, Laura told her that Grant & Laura went to the J of P or courthouse and got married on short notice. Then turned out that Grant had not signed the certificate, so they were not actually married?

2. Heidi saw wedding pix of G & A from Las Vegas ceremony (on FaceBook or email from G to Laura? or ?), but I thought I heard on WRAL or read here that G & A were not actually married. Or maybe I misheard or misread?

Anyone have a clear understanding of this?
Thx in adv.

 

[AnonymousD]

Thank you to people gave me guidance to the youtubes of the trial to catch up. Just about finished w. day 2.

Now confused about the marital status.

1. Per Laura's friend Heidi, Laura told her that Grant & Laura went to the J of P or courthouse and got married on short notice. Then turned out that Grant had not signed the certificate, so they were not actually married?

2. Heidi saw wedding pix of G & A from Las Vegas ceremony (on FaceBook or email from G to Laura? or ?), but I thought I heard on WRAL or read here that G & A were not actually married. Or maybe I misheard or misread?

Anyone have a clear understanding of this?
Thx in adv.

I still don't know the marital status of G&A.

However, just now watching Heidi's testimony she stated that Grant sent Laura a pic of he & Amanda just after they got married in NY. Sent via text, iirc.

Heidi stated that Laura told her she wasn't really ever married to Grant, because Grant did not sign their marriage license.

 

[AnonymousD]

Just wanted to make sure I put these here.

From the end of trial day 1. GH blows someone in the galley a kiss.

 

[borndem]

I am praying that Grant will testify. I am praying that Grant will testify. I can't stress that enough. He is doing everything possible to cast all the guilt on AH so he very well may testify, with his big EGO and his attorneys' blessing. Maybe then we'll find out exactly what supposedly happened. I don't think we'll get the truth out of AH.

I don't think we'll get much truth from GH, either, 'East, not a whit of it. If he testifies to something he saw, then he was there & that's not good for him. A witness id'd him as the one who bought the items from the HD in Tx; his car was used; he rented the Uhaul, etc., etc. Boz would burn him up with questions just about that hour in the HD alone; and about the time he was at Sheetz waiting to meet her; and Boz's questions about GH's questions to the Berry brothers about alligators and so on.

If the jury were to buy something like, "I came home from the grocery store and AH said they had had a fight and she killed LA who was lying in the bathtub dead. She would not let me call 911. AH had a plan for us to go Tx with the body..." etc., etc., then that would buy him accessory after the fact and possible conspiracy, which would be about 15--20 years.

I just don't see him taking the stand to testify -- but I would love to see it.

------------------

And one more thang -- Is there any way AH could be watching this trial? Is there anyone who has been watching it and it visiting her to give her details of it? Grrrrrr.

 

[NCEast]

Do u think their plan was all along to take the body to Texas and dump it there where they thought no one would find it and no one would look for it? Because I"m wondering why they waited so long to make the trip to Texas?

I wish the detectives could have gotten a search warrant for their house before they left NC...

I don't think they had a 'plan' until after the murder and then everything they planned was off the cuff. I think that's why it took them so long to make the trip to TX. IIRC, in addition to the furniture they sold on Craig's list on the spur of the moment, GH also sold some sort of Apple computer on Craig's list at the same time for pretty decent $$. I think that's how they financed their trip once they made the decision to take the remains to TX.
I don't understand why they brought another child into the world if finances were so tight they had to sell furniture and a computer to get to TX. I just don't understand a lot of things about these people.

 

[NCEast]

I agree they ambushed her, and there was blood by the front entry. But IMO GH first got her to sign that agreement. I feel like there was some urgency to this agreement thing, not sure what/why. Whether it was a real agreement or something Laura signed because she was in fear and forced to go along with it, I can't figure out.

I hope the State makes their hypothesis clear next week. Something about those text messages ("the business day ends in two hours...you're putting me in a *advertiser censored***'d situation...") and agreement are important, IMO.

Maybe he wanted her to call her attorney and say "we figured it out so call off all legal proceedings" to have that on record so GH could claim "no motive b/c we had worked it all out." But that's stupid because they killed her the same day...

Were they maybe trying to make it appear that she didn't care about the kids (see? She gave them away for $25K!) and took off after closing this agreement and (they would have alleged) receiving $25K? That would "explain" her sudden disappearance.

Anyway, back to the blood. I think something may have been placed by the entryway which leaked or smeared blood there.

I think they killed her (with the kids in the other room like was said earlier), then put her in the bathtub, where she remained overnight. GH then went to Walmart in the middle of the nite to get supplies: tarp, goggles, saw.

After Sha got the kids the next morning, G & A went to work in the kids' bathroom sawing. That was Thursday. GH didn't buy the coolers and ice until Sat, IIRC. So I won't speculate about where the body parts were kept Thursday, Friday and Saturday before they got the coolers. But they had duffel bags (which would allow liquid to leak/soak through).

Then they cleaned the bathroom with bleach (maybe used one of those pressurized sprayers), completely covering the bathroom floor, thus the bleach leaching into the hallway carpet. And they had the tarps and shower curtain to help contain the mess.

They cleaned (using Sha's vacuum), sold furniture, etc. to remove physical evidence and get $ for the trip. Probably dumped stuff in random dumpsters around North Raleigh or even en route to TX.

They got to TX and couldn't figure a way to go shark fishing or gator searching. (What if Shelton had said "yes" to GH's request?? Were they going to implicate him, too??). They thought acid would destroy the remains. Then they took the boat into the creek and the rest is history.

That's my theory at the moment.

Good thoughts here Boodles. These are pretty much my own as well. I think the bleach stain at the door may have been made during an 'escape' attempt by LA once she realized they had tricked her into coming. She signed the document regarding the $25,000 and according to supposed upcoming testimony from the State, the handwriting in the second half was analyzed and found to be hers. So she was there long enough to do that with probably some discussion, etc.

 

[NCEast]

Thank you to people gave me guidance to the youtubes of the trial to catch up. Just about finished w. day 2.

Now confused about the marital status.

1. Per Laura's friend Heidi, Laura told her that Grant & Laura went to the J of P or courthouse and got married on short notice. Then turned out that Grant had not signed the certificate, so they were not actually married?

2. Heidi saw wedding pix of G & A from Las Vegas ceremony (on FaceBook or email from G to Laura? or ?), but I thought I heard on WRAL or read here that G & A were not actually married. Or maybe I misheard or misread?

Anyone have a clear understanding of this?
Thx in adv.

There has been talk on various news clips and other places--not just mere gossip, etc.--that Grant and Amanda never married. It's been testified to by Sha that they were married in Las Vegas but maybe it was a pretend marriage on one of those fake chapels. I don't know where the unmarried aspect of their relationshipe initially came from but it's been floating around since this case first hit the media.