FL FL - Michelle Parker, 33, Orlando, 17 Nov 2011 - #15

Lark2 said:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7405041&postcount=301

From Einyroo's comment on the 7th thread:

"I also forgot to mention that the investigator was also interested in where Dale used to live. When I knew him it was in an apartment complex of some sort. I told her I thought it was right around where the car was found...I was only there several times at night and never drove myself...but I do remember the millenia mall being really close by and I thought it was off of Conroy.

I thought it was really interesting because my back and forth with the investigator made it pretty apparent they were looking at Dale very closely (kind of stating the obvious, I know). But she said that the LE knew he lived somewhere around where the car was found previously, but they were trying to pinpoint if it was around Kirkman or Conroy. I found this interesting because clearly they didn't want him to think they were looking at him, or else wouldn't they have just asked him straight up? "

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I got some flack for posting that...people not believing that a detective would give that kind of info, etc etc...But, I really think it was to confirm if I knew what they already knew.

Everything does seem to be in Dale's territory...from the last ping being near Jesse Black's to everything else.

Someone said it best on here...if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, sometimes it's actually A DUCK!!!:whipper:

Analyze This said:

The Walden Circle location bothers me because DS II told Michelle's family that she was "going shopping" when she left his condo. Why abandon the Hummer in that condo complex? Why not leave it at the mall or in another parking lot? There is a Kohl's and a Walmart in walking distance to his condo, so if the "going shopping" thing was some sort of deflection, then it makes no sense to dump the Hummer in a condo complex instead of a large parking lot in a shopping area. It certainly wasn't a convenience to leave the Hummer there.

If he came up with that after he dumped the Hummer, then why not say, "Well, she said she was going to stop at a friends house"? He had her iphone at that point, so he would know what was on her calendar and all of the contacts that she had in the phone, so why not use that information to establish a better story?

I also find it weird that Michelle's disappearance seems to straddle the line of a rage killing and a well planned abduction/murder. If it was strictly a rage killing, then I feel that there would be a lot of forensic and circumstantial evidence available. DS II has a bad temper. He throws and breaks things when he is angry. Did the police find anything of that nature in his condo?

If it was well planned, then I can't see DS II as the perpetrator because I just don't believe that he is dumb enough to plan it the way it happened. Maybe he had thoughts about how to cover up a crime of this nature and so he had a working plan established for what he would do if he lost it and went too far, but a guy like DS II likes to brag and talk. So, did he ever say something to his friends about where he would hide a body?

And, if he was on FB that night talking about the PC episode, what time was that and where was he? If he was on a mobile device, then records would show that. The police have his computers, so what evidence has been compiled from the seizure of his computers. If they took his computers, how is he going online? Borrowing a friends? Did he purchase another one? Or, is he using his smartphone?

Not that any of the above changes the fact that he is the most likely suspect, but I believe that trying to understand his thought process is the key to finding Michelle. Every morning I wake up hoping that Michelle is found and that her family gets the answers that they need.

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:goodpost:

BBM

You couldn't have said it better. I think that's EXACTLY what happened.

artzypantz said:

Thanks sparky!

Im sure it hasn't been said what time she was reported missing to LE, correct?

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m's sister called LE to report m missing at 7:20pm 11/17- according to the timeline.

Analyze This said:

The Walden Circle location bothers me because DS II told Michelle's family that she was "going shopping" when she left his condo. Why abandon the Hummer in that condo complex? Why not leave it at the mall or in another parking lot? There is a Kohl's and a Walmart in walking distance to his condo, so if the "going shopping" thing was some sort of deflection, then it makes no sense to dump the Hummer in a condo complex instead of a large parking lot in a shopping area. It certainly wasn't a convenience to leave the Hummer there.

If he came up with that after he dumped the Hummer, then why not say, "Well, she said she was going to stop at a friends house"? He had her iphone at that point, so he would know what was on her calendar and all of the contacts that she had in the phone, so why not use that information to establish a better story?

I also find it weird that Michelle's disappearance seems to straddle the line of a rage killing and a well planned abduction/murder. If it was strictly a rage killing, then I feel that there would be a lot of forensic and circumstantial evidence available. DS II has a bad temper. He throws and breaks things when he is angry. Did the police find anything of that nature in his condo?

If it was well planned, then I can't see DS II as the perpetrator because I just don't believe that he is dumb enough to plan it the way it happened. Maybe he had thoughts about how to cover up a crime of this nature and so he had a working plan established for what he would do if he lost it and went too far, but a guy like DS II likes to brag and talk. So, did he ever say something to his friends about where he would hide a body?

And, if he was on FB that night talking about the PC episode, what time was that and where was he? If he was on a mobile device, then records would show that. The police have his computers, so what evidence has been compiled from the seizure of his computers. If they took his computers, how is he going online? Borrowing a friends? Did he purchase another one? Or, is he using his smartphone?

Not that any of the above changes the fact that he is the most likely suspect, but I believe that trying to understand his thought process is the key to finding Michelle. Every morning I wake up hoping that Michelle is found and that her family gets the answers that they need.

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Those are some good questions you pose.

The notion that Dale actually planned this has never seemed quite right to me. Even if he is not an exceptionally bright person--although we have no indication of his actual intelligence--he could hardly choose a worse time to carry out a murder. And then so many of the details that we actually know seem to point back to him as the culprit. He could hardly have made himself a more obvious suspect!

I realize that there are examples of other planned murders where the murderer was positively bumbling. But the idea of planning to carry out the murder of your ex-girlfriend on the very afternoon that a TV program airs nationally and demonstrates the contentious nature of your relationship, plus offers clear indications that you have a violent, vindictive temperament seems beyond bone-headed!

I'm not at all suggesting that he didn't do the thing, I'm just questioning the planning aspect.

I can, however, see him considering in the past what he might do to get rid of a body, hypothetically, and talking about it with friends. I remember that someone in one of these threads said she had herself considered the best way of disposing of remains, not that she would ever want to carry out a murder. (Was it you, LittleBitty?) A person need not be a criminal or violent to consider such a thing.

It would indeed be interesting if someone had heard him talk about it, and would offer the information to LE. There's certainly a chance that this could happen. Unless his friends are extremely loyal.

Analyze This said:

The Walden Circle location bothers me because DS II told Michelle's family that she was "going shopping" when she left his condo. Why abandon the Hummer in that condo complex? Why not leave it at the mall or in another parking lot? There is a Kohl's and a Walmart in walking distance to his condo, so if the "going shopping" thing was some sort of deflection, then it makes no sense to dump the Hummer in a condo complex instead of a large parking lot in a shopping area. It certainly wasn't a convenience to leave the Hummer there.

If he came up with that after he dumped the Hummer, then why not say, "Well, she said she was going to stop at a friends house"? He had her iphone at that point, so he would know what was on her calendar and all of the contacts that she had in the phone, so why not use that information to establish a better story?

I also find it weird that Michelle's disappearance seems to straddle the line of a rage killing and a well planned abduction/murder. If it was strictly a rage killing, then I feel that there would be a lot of forensic and circumstantial evidence available. DS II has a bad temper. He throws and breaks things when he is angry. Did the police find anything of that nature in his condo?

If it was well planned, then I can't see DS II as the perpetrator because I just don't believe that he is dumb enough to plan it the way it happened. Maybe he had thoughts about how to cover up a crime of this nature and so he had a working plan established for what he would do if he lost it and went too far, but a guy like DS II likes to brag and talk. So, did he ever say something to his friends about where he would hide a body?

And, if he was on FB that night talking about the PC episode, what time was that and where was he? If he was on a mobile device, then records would show that. The police have his computers, so what evidence has been compiled from the seizure of his computers. If they took his computers, how is he going online? Borrowing a friends? Did he purchase another one? Or, is he using his smartphone?

Not that any of the above changes the fact that he is the most likely suspect, but I believe that trying to understand his thought process is the key to finding Michelle. Every morning I wake up hoping that Michelle is found and that her family gets the answers that they need.

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I agree, I don't think this was well-planned at all--if it was even planned. DS Jr. is a guy who acts on spur-of-the-moment, out-of-control emotions, as he did in other crimes he has committed (at least the ones we KNOW about): the chair-over-the-head assault at a party; dragging his wife Shannon to a metal balcony and hitting her head against it, causing head injuries and hospitalization; kicking the head of a victim in the aggravated battery case on the night of the murder of BT.

Interesting, now that I look at it, all of the injuries his victims endured were head injuries ... wonder if that's what happened here in MP's case.

May Michelle be found today ...

truthsleuth said:

I agree, I don't think this was well-planned at all--if it was even planned. DS Jr. is a guy who acts on spur-of-the-moment, out-of-control emotions, as he did in other crimes he has committed (at least the ones we KNOW about): the chair-over-the-head assault at a party; dragging his wife Shannon to a metal balcony and hitting her head against it, causing head injuries and hospitalization; kicking the head of a victim in the aggravated battery case on the night of the murder of BT.

Interesting, now that I look at it, all of the injuries his victims endured were head injuries ... wonder if that's what happened here in MP's case.

May Michelle be found today ...

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It's exactly that "spur-of-the-moment" behaviour that makes me believe that if something happened and he reacted quickly, out of panic, that he would not have been driving around with a body in a vehicle for any length of time. When I look at the satellite maps of that wooded area behind his condo complex, off Lee Vista Blvd, I have to wonder how extensively it has been searched. He can access it through his own subdivision...his own street. No need to even drive out of the street with a body. And it's a pretty large, dense area. If they haven't already, TES would be the perfect organization to search it. But they are in with MN and DS2 and you can bet that they aren't going to ask anyone to search the wooded area right near DS2's home.

Or, as was said in the post above, he's thought about a perfect place to hide a body in the past. He might have followed the CA case and thought how stupid KC was to hide the body so close to home. Started thinking of better alternatives she could have utilized while following the trial and applied them to his own situation when he found himself in need of such a place.

MOO

truthsleuth said:

I agree, I don't think this was well-planned at all--if it was even planned. DS Jr. is a guy who acts on spur-of-the-moment, out-of-control emotions, as he did in other crimes he has committed (at least the ones we KNOW about): the chair-over-the-head assault at a party; dragging his wife Shannon to a metal balcony and hitting her head against it, causing head injuries and hospitalization; kicking the head of a victim in the aggravated battery case on the night of the murder of BT.

Interesting, now that I look at it, all of the injuries his victims endured were head injuries ... wonder if that's what happened here in MP's case.

May Michelle be found today ...

Click to expand...

While Dale unquestionably has range/anger issues...I think there is also an extent to which he is a sociopath. To be involved in all of these horrible scenarios that you described takes more than just an inability to control your emotions. Clearly, there is an element to him that is not normal. Someone on here mentioned that Dale was the leader of the gang that targeted a specific young man. This takes some kind of pre-meditative action. I think in his head, unspoken, he likely had thoughts of hurting/killing Michelle for some time. I truly believe he had probably considered how he would do it and what he would do thereafter, but not when or even if he would actually do it...The PC show through him over the edge and he harmed her. And then, carried out what he had already pre-meditated. JMO. But, I think it's really plausible.

Kamille said:

]It's exactly that "spur-of-the-moment" behaviour that makes me believe that if something happened and he reacted quickly, out of panic, that he would not have been driving around with a body in a vehicle for any length of time. [/B] When I look at the satellite maps of that wooded area behind his condo complex, off Lee Vista Blvd, I have to wonder how extensively it has been searched. He can access it through his own subdivision...his own street. No need to even drive out of the street with a body. And it's a pretty large, dense area. If they haven't already, TES would be the perfect organization to search it. But they are in with MN and DS2 and you can bet that they aren't going to ask anyone to search the wooded area right near DS2's home.

Or, as was said in the post above, he's thought about a perfect place to hide a body in the past. He might have followed the CA case and thought how stupid KC was to hide the body so close to home. Started thinking of better alternatives she could have utilized while following the trial and applied them to his own situation when he found himself in need of such a place.

MOO

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That area behind his condo runs very wide and deep. I know that LE took a rather cursory look at it early on, and I'm hoping they went back to check it out in depth. I feel very strongly that that is the most likely place he would put her body. Close to home, convenient, yet difficult to search. Dust off hands, dust off shoes, done.

I want MP located sooo much. I hope it will happen today.

EINYROO said:

While Dale unquestionably has range/anger issues...I think there is also an extent to which he is a sociopath. To be involved in all of these horrible scenarios that you described takes more than just an inability to control your emotions.

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Here are some of those horrible scenarios from the actual court docs (originally posted on Huffington Post).

Wife #2's statement says that DS told her he wanted to kill himself that night because people were making fun of him at the bar about upcoming divorce. But instead of doing that, he apparently took it out on her.

MOO, this guy has a very fragile self-image and any hint of someone mocking him, challenging him or rejecting him can shatter it.

Analyze This said:

The Walden Circle location bothers me because DS II told Michelle's family that she was "going shopping" when she left his condo. Why abandon the Hummer in that condo complex? Why not leave it at the mall or in another parking lot? There is a Kohl's and a Walmart in walking distance to his condo, so if the "going shopping" thing was some sort of deflection, then it makes no sense to dump the Hummer in a condo complex instead of a large parking lot in a shopping area. It certainly wasn't a convenience to leave the Hummer there.

If he came up with that after he dumped the Hummer, then why not say, "Well, she said she was going to stop at a friends house"? He had her iphone at that point, so he would know what was on her calendar and all of the contacts that she had in the phone, so why not use that information to establish a better story?

I also find it weird that Michelle's disappearance seems to straddle the line of a rage killing and a well planned abduction/murder. If it was strictly a rage killing, then I feel that there would be a lot of forensic and circumstantial evidence available. DS II has a bad temper. He throws and breaks things when he is angry. Did the police find anything of that nature in his condo?

If it was well planned, then I can't see DS II as the perpetrator because I just don't believe that he is dumb enough to plan it the way it happened. Maybe he had thoughts about how to cover up a crime of this nature and so he had a working plan established for what he would do if he lost it and went too far, but a guy like DS II likes to brag and talk. So, did he ever say something to his friends about where he would hide a body?

And, if he was on FB that night talking about the PC episode, what time was that and where was he? If he was on a mobile device, then records would show that. The police have his computers, so what evidence has been compiled from the seizure of his computers. If they took his computers, how is he going online? Borrowing a friends? Did he purchase another one? Or, is he using his smartphone?

Not that any of the above changes the fact that he is the most likely suspect, but I believe that trying to understand his thought process is the key to finding Michelle. Every morning I wake up hoping that Michelle is found and that her family gets the answers that they need.

Click to expand...

Dumping the car at WalMart or Kohl ... my fear is that you might get caught on camera...but then again the condo he parked at....does it have security cameras?
Wasnt the parking of the hummer in an area that make the witness think he wasnt visiting a condo there?
It is strange no one saw anything at his condo(his leaving etc)...or this condo?

Kamille said:

It's exactly that "spur-of-the-moment" behaviour that makes me believe that if something happened and he reacted quickly, out of panic, that he would not have been driving around with a body in a vehicle for any length of time. When I look at the satellite maps of that wooded area behind his condo complex, off Lee Vista Blvd, I have to wonder how extensively it has been searched. He can access it through his own subdivision...his own street. No need to even drive out of the street with a body. And it's a pretty large, dense area. If they haven't already, TES would be the perfect organization to search it. But they are in with MN and DS2 and you can bet that they aren't going to ask anyone to search the wooded area right near DS2's home.

Or, as was said in the post above, he's thought about a perfect place to hide a body in the past. He might have followed the CA case and thought how stupid KC was to hide the body so close to home. Started thinking of better alternatives she could have utilized while following the trial and applied them to his own situation when he found himself in need of such a place.

MOO

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BBM
I agree that driving around for any significant amount of time with a body would not be likely. It surprises me that the searches have not been more concentrated in the area around DS II's condo. Law enforcement knows what they are doing, but if they are working off of bad information than perhaps the searches were not as effective as they could've been. I worry that neighbors who provided tips about DS Sr and his boat were acting on their own agenda and gut feeling, which makes their information less objective, but not necessarily less accurate. Even if their information was completely accurate, it doesn't necessarily mean that it had anything to do with where Michelle is. Unfortunately, OPD has to react to the information that they have and they can't start second guessing every tip that comes in. Then again, I have no idea how OPD determined that they needed to search the areas that they did.

Lark2 said:

Here are some of those horrible scenarios from the actual court docs (originally posted on Huffington Post).

Wife #2's statement says that DS told her he wanted to kill himself that night because people were making fun of him at the bar about upcoming divorce. But instead of doing that, he apparently took it out on her.

MOO, this guy has a very fragile self-image and any hint of someone mocking him, challenging him or rejecting him can shatter it.

Click to expand...

BBM

That would be my take on what happened....

If Michelle felt embarrassed by the PC show...and DS2 told all his friends to watch maybe his take on it was totally different than hers....

I can see Michelle not agreeing with him winning at all and saying how stupid they or "he" looked standing there. yada yada. maybe mocking him....

And he snapped and strangled her or something like that...

JMO

Analyze This said:

BBM
I agree that driving around for any significant amount of time with a body would not be likely. It surprises me that the searches have not been more concentrated in the area around DS II's condo. Law enforcement knows what they are doing, but if they are working off of bad information than perhaps the searches were not as effective as they could've been. I worry that neighbors who provided tips about DS Sr and his boat were acting on their own agenda and gut feeling, which makes their information less objective, but not necessarily less accurate. Even if their information was completely accurate, it doesn't necessarily mean that it had anything to do with where Michelle is. Unfortunately, OPD has to react to the information that they have and they can't start second guessing every tip that comes in. Then again, I have no idea how OPD determined that they needed to search the areas that they did.

Click to expand...

Mark Nejames said at least BY 4:30 a witness said he was at his parents home but what if his truck and the kids were there....parents picking up both the truck and the kids from his condo and DS2 was disposing of Michelle and her hummer...

captdj said:

Mark Nejames said at least BY 4:30 a witness said he was at his parents home but what if his truck and the kids were there....parents picking up both the truck and the kids from his condo and DS2 was disposing of Michelle and her hummer...

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It is entirely possible that something like the above happened. The only thing that has stopped me from jumping on that theory is that MN was very confident when discussing the timeline. If he didn't think that it was solid, then I don't think that he would say anything at all. But, I admit that I assumed that the witness actually saw DS II with the twins and his truck at 4:30pm and that may not be true. Thanks for prompting me to take another look at the 4:30 info from the timeline!

Analyze This said:

The Walden Circle location bothers me because DS II told Michelle's family that she was "going shopping" when she left his condo. Why abandon the Hummer in that condo complex? Why not leave it at the mall or in another parking lot? There is a Kohl's and a Walmart in walking distance to his condo, so if the "going shopping" thing was some sort of deflection, then it makes no sense to dump the Hummer in a condo complex instead of a large parking lot in a shopping area. It certainly wasn't a convenience to leave the Hummer there.

If he came up with that after he dumped the Hummer, then why not say, "Well, she said she was going to stop at a friends house"? He had her iphone at that point, so he would know what was on her calendar and all of the contacts that she had in the phone, so why not use that information to establish a better story?

I also find it weird that Michelle's disappearance seems to straddle the line of a rage killing and a well planned abduction/murder. If it was strictly a rage killing, then I feel that there would be a lot of forensic and circumstantial evidence available. DS II has a bad temper. He throws and breaks things when he is angry. Did the police find anything of that nature in his condo?

If it was well planned, then I can't see DS II as the perpetrator because I just don't believe that he is dumb enough to plan it the way it happened. Maybe he had thoughts about how to cover up a crime of this nature and so he had a working plan established for what he would do if he lost it and went too far, but a guy like DS II likes to brag and talk. So, did he ever say something to his friends about where he would hide a body?

And, if he was on FB that night talking about the PC episode, what time was that and where was he? If he was on a mobile device, then records would show that. The police have his computers, so what evidence has been compiled from the seizure of his computers. If they took his computers, how is he going online? Borrowing a friends? Did he purchase another one? Or, is he using his smartphone?

Not that any of the above changes the fact that he is the most likely suspect, but I believe that trying to understand his thought process is the key to finding Michelle. Every morning I wake up hoping that Michelle is found and that her family gets the answers that they need.

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Analyze This, you are performing a wonderful service for me. Your questions force me to go back to the sources, verify info and pick out the "facts" that would either prove or disprove your theories. Thank you. Below are some of my thoughts on your thoughts.

"...Walden Circle location bothers me because DS II told Michelle's family that she was "going shopping"..." DS2 also told LE and/or family that MP arrived at 4pm and he left his condo at 4:30 pm and there is a surveillance tape that shows differently. Michelle's sister & mother said she intended to go home immediately after dropping off the twins.

"..why not say, 'Well, she said she was going to stop at a friends house'?..." Too easily verifiable. MOO

"..Did the police find anything of that nature in his condo?.." Only LE has this info now, and probably don't want it leaked.

"..[Maybe DS2]..had a working plan established for what he would do if he lost it and went too far.." I agree; not much of a stretch for his "eliminating MP" fantasies to morph into where to "hide the evidence" fantasies.

"..[A]..guy like DS II likes to brag and talk. So, did he ever say something to his friends about where he would hide a body?" I agree and LE is probably asking the same question, of themselves and DS2's friends. It is surely info they wouldn't want released.

"...f he was on FB that night..." He made an entry at sometime after 11pm, for which I don't have the link. Perhaps some one else can provide it.

"...The police have his computers..." LE is being very tight-lipped about what evidence they have or don't have. Do we know they have his computer?

Thank you for all the great questions. I, too, wake up every morning worrying about Michelle & her family. How they must be suffering.

Analyze This said:

The Walden Circle location bothers me because DS II told Michelle's family that she was "going shopping" when she left his condo. Why abandon the Hummer in that condo complex? Why not leave it at the mall or in another parking lot? There is a Kohl's and a Walmart in walking distance to his condo, so if the "going shopping" thing was some sort of deflection, then it makes no sense to dump the Hummer in a condo complex instead of a large parking lot in a shopping area. It certainly wasn't a convenience to leave the Hummer there.

If he came up with that after he dumped the Hummer, then why not say, "Well, she said she was going to stop at a friends house"? He had her iphone at that point, so he would know what was on her calendar and all of the contacts that she had in the phone, so why not use that information to establish a better story?

I also find it weird that Michelle's disappearance seems to straddle the line of a rage killing and a well planned abduction/murder. If it was strictly a rage killing, then I feel that there would be a lot of forensic and circumstantial evidence available. DS II has a bad temper. He throws and breaks things when he is angry. Did the police find anything of that nature in his condo?

If it was well planned, then I can't see DS II as the perpetrator because I just don't believe that he is dumb enough to plan it the way it happened. Maybe he had thoughts about how to cover up a crime of this nature and so he had a working plan established for what he would do if he lost it and went too far, but a guy like DS II likes to brag and talk. So, did he ever say something to his friends about where he would hide a body?

And, if he was on FB that night talking about the PC episode, what time was that and where was he? If he was on a mobile device, then records would show that. The police have his computers, so what evidence has been compiled from the seizure of his computers. If they took his computers, how is he going online? Borrowing a friends? Did he purchase another one? Or, is he using his smartphone?

Not that any of the above changes the fact that he is the most likely suspect, but I believe that trying to understand his thought process is the key to finding Michelle. Every morning I wake up hoping that Michelle is found and that her family gets the answers that they need.

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BBM - IMO, telling everyone MP said she was going shopping falls in line with her other earlier text about shopping with mom (which he could have easily read on her phone), so he would hope that's where LE and friends and family would look for her 1st. I think he felt he had diverted attention to shopping centers, so he had to dump the hummer some place they wouldn't be readily looking at.

Analyze This said:

BBM
I agree that driving around for any significant amount of time with a body would not be likely. It surprises me that the searches have not been more concentrated in the area around DS II's condo. Law enforcement knows what they are doing, but if they are working off of bad information than perhaps the searches were not as effective as they could've been. I worry that neighbors who provided tips about DS Sr and his boat were acting on their own agenda and gut feeling, which makes their information less objective, but not necessarily less accurate. Even if their information was completely accurate, it doesn't necessarily mean that it had anything to do with where Michelle is. Unfortunately, OPD has to react to the information that they have and they can't start second guessing every tip that comes in. Then again, I have no idea how OPD determined that they needed to search the areas that they did.

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That's just it. They seem to have been working off of phone pings and tips of what DS SR and DS JR may have been doing the following day. I still think the whole boat thing could have been a ruse by DS SR...kind of a "look over here" type diversion. I'm not sure but I thought that he was actually seen in the vicinity of the lake that was searched and may have even spoken to someone who knew him in that area. And it was apparently during broad daylight. If this is true it doesn't sound like he was trying in any way to conceal this odd behaviour.

Would a father/grandfather really be out for a pleasurely boat ride the day after his grandchildren's mother was reported missing and police had questioned his son and searched his son's home? I don't think there was much fishing in that lake. Did he really need to go out by himself in a boat and catch some dinner that day? :waitasec:

And then DS JR not only goes to work on a job in Titusville after his harrowing "search" ordeal (I'm assuming he can actually place himself there at a jobsight) but he feels the need to post this detail on his FB? He also seemed to want people to be aware of what he was doing that day. But for someone with an obvious love of attention, the one thing he didn't do was put himself up front and center in the search for Michelle. A huge opportunity for him to get lots of TV face time, attention and sympathy. I wonder why not?

Both scenarios seem like a concentrated effort to throw off search efforts to me. Plus the addition of the phone going on an excursion through the Belle Isle/Oakridge area the night before, before ending up being tossed off a bridge into a local lake.

Perhaps the two of them are smarter than we're giving them credit for.

MOO

Analyze This said:

BBM
I agree that driving around for any significant amount of time with a body would not be likely. It surprises me that the searches have not been more concentrated in the area around DS II's condo. Law enforcement knows what they are doing, but if they are working off of bad information than perhaps the searches were not as effective as they could've been. I worry that neighbors who provided tips about DS Sr and his boat were acting on their own agenda and gut feeling, which makes their information less objective, but not necessarily less accurate. Even if their information was completely accurate, it doesn't necessarily mean that it had anything to do with where Michelle is. Unfortunately, OPD has to react to the information that they have and they can't start second guessing every tip that comes in. Then again, I have no idea how OPD determined that they needed to search the areas that they did.

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BBM (thanks for giving me the abbr for that Smooth!). I worry about that too. For instance, the neighbor who called into The Bucket Show saying that it was her tip that lead to the search at Lake Eleanor: She stated that she had seen DS Sr. the next day towing a boat. But she ALSO said that he has a Hummer and I haven't seen that in the driveway anytime LE has been there, or reporters, or through neighbor videos,or on the Google map.

nobodynoz said:

Those are some good questions you pose.

The notion that Dale actually planned this has never seemed quite right to me. Even if he is not an exceptionally bright person--although we have no indication of his actual intelligence--he could hardly choose a worse time to carry out a murder. And then so many of the details that we actually know seem to point back to him as the culprit. He could hardly have made himself a more obvious suspect!

I realize that there are examples of other planned murders where the murderer was positively bumbling. But the idea of planning to carry out the murder of your ex-girlfriend on the very afternoon that a TV program airs nationally and demonstrates the contentious nature of your relationship, plus offers clear indications that you have a violent, vindictive temperament seems beyond bone-headed!

I'm not at all suggesting that he didn't do the thing, I'm just questioning the planning aspect.

I can, however, see him considering in the past what he might do to get rid of a body, hypothetically, and talking about it with friends. I remember that someone in one of these threads said she had herself considered the best way of disposing of remains, not that she would ever want to carry out a murder. (Was it you, LittleBitty?) A person need not be a criminal or violent to consider such a thing.

It would indeed be interesting if someone had heard him talk about it, and would offer the information to LE. There's certainly a chance that this could happen. Unless his friends are extremely loyal.

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I agree that it couldn't have been a worse time for Dale to kill Michelle...but I am not sure that he is a person who is in control of
his emotions...I doubt he thought anything through before he got angry..and while angry at Michellle, I think he went into a rage ..not even
able to think of the obviously poor timing. I see him as a sociopath. I also think he is very dangerous. If he did kill Michelle, what else would trigger him...I worry about the twins. ^i^

If Dale Smith Jr. is indeed responsible for Michelle's disappearance, then I list my rambling thoughts:
1. While logic would dictate that this was not planned (assuming DS killed her and had help in disposing of either/both her remains and her Hummer) I have seen and read about many "dumb" killers. Scott Peterson (I was fishing...for sturgeon...without bait...), Susan Smith (I was car jacked at a non-stop sign/light), Chris Rezos (I met my about to be estranged wife in a hotel room--a meeting most people in her family knew about...tried to beat her to death and claimed an assailant did it, got bonded out and attemped to kill her again, by hiding in the back seat of her mini-van while I was on bond for her attempted murder, and shooting her twice in the head and claimed she fought me for the gun and it "missfired" while also shooting myself in the forearm to make it appear as though my story made some actual sense, and then attempted to hire a hitman from jail to off her and her whole family...<TG Amy survived>)...I could go on and on and on and on about people who "planned" out killing someone only to have it backfire...most criminals simply are not that smart, nor well-read on anything. Even if this was "planned" it simply doesn't rule out DS. It is not like he has gotten away with the stuff he actually has done.

2. If this was not planned, it was done in a moment of rage/ domestic violence perpetrators (of which we know he is one) don't think two minutes beyond their bruised "ego" and some "imagined" wounding of said ego/ manliness.

3. Nothing has been coming out of LE virtually since they found the phone. Is the phone yielding any clues? Did LE send it somewhere to get the information off of it? Why all of the silence? I know that the are very good cops. I know that they want to find MIchelle. I know that we are not entitled to the work on this investigation...and yet...they are not exactly pleading with the Orlando public to help them...are they simply only waiting for her body to turn up before charges are pressed?

4. While this may not bother some posters it bothers me: Dale wouldn't take a lie detector test. It is almost as if he is Scott Peterson, who also refused one after several interviews...once the test was offered, Scott, stopped cooperating with police. While I get police make mistakes...were I innocent, I doubt I would clam up and stop cooperating with authorities...jmo. I know some posters have been burned by police, but police want to find this missing mother. They need to rule out as quickly as possible, the closest people to her, including the last person, "known" (to us and from what has been let out by LE) to have been seen with her. When that person clams up and refuses a test, which cannot even be shown to a jury and has no legal significance, it bothers me. JMO.