Ok Im very P'D off now

My turn I guess. I would like to say that I was not talking about anyone on here in particular when I stated that I was tired of hearing about the other countries who thought their people should have been evac first. I agree with lostfaith that if the buses were taken from the tourists to rescue someone who was elderly,young or sick then they should go before the tourists. If the tourists fit in that catagory then they should also be taken out first. It is very sad that the Aussies were being tormented and people were seeking them out to hurt them but they are not the minority here. There were other people who were also tormented. My post was to state that we were not to go and find only tourists so that we could keep the peace with other countries. For you to say that we believe that American lives are more important than people from other countries shows that you know nothing about us. Who is the first to come to the aid of other countries? We are. I also agree about the bold YOUR. Doesn't look good in our eyes. I am sorry your people were left to fend for themselves but so were ours. The Mandatory Evacuation was for people who could find their own means to get out of the city. That would include all of our people. They had no bus plans to remove people before the *advertiser censored* hit the fan. People had to pay for them themselves.

lostfaith said:

You know, I don't think the way you keep bolding YOUR people and YOUR government is healthy. It is just pitching a YOU against US mentality, and it is a very accusing tone.

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I agree, 100%.

Here are just a few comments of an accusatory tone from just ONE of aussie's posts:

YOUR monday....
YOUR people.... (x4)
YOUR own sick....
YOUR gov.... (x3)
YOUR tourists....

First of all, I stopped reading aussie's long-winded, repetitive posts, which do nothing to bolster the lot of us regular, salt-of-the-earth Americans.

While I agree with aussie's bitterness over poor planning on behalf of our government, I would appreciate her not adding insult to injury, over and over and over again.

I think all Americans feel a certain amount of shame with regard to the way this tragedy has unfolded. I would venture to say that the pain runs deep, even among those who are indirectly affected.

WE Americans have pride, WE Americans have strength in facing adversity, and most of us Americans wouldn't want to be anywhere else. I know the final outcome of this tragedy will further unify our citizens, as it always does in any horrific event.

God Bless America!

:blowkiss:

I've been silent all weekend, and I finally OD'd on the news yesterday afternoon. I do remember the explanation as to why the mayor escorted the tourists to the busses ahead of the lines. Just like Aussie said, these tourists had paid for buses to take them out. Someone commandeered their transportation. I will applaud the mayor for stepping in to help the tourists. There was no reason their buses should have been taken BEFORE the storm arrived, leaving them stranded. That is plain wrong. Those who arranged for their safe evacuation were stranded unnecessarily.

quote: lostfaith

I do not care one iota when those buses were arranged, I still hold my ground that if there were sick, elderly, and children that were in worse shape than tourist, they get evacuated first. I believe most people would feel that way. Anyone with a heart would look at a baby dying of dehydration, elderly in a wheelchair and say, take them first.

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I disagree with your statement. These tourists, wherever they were from, (UK, USA, AUS, China, etc.) arranged for their own evacuation. If their buses were re-routed by city officials, then that was just plain wrong. It was also wrong for any official to commandeer the hotels without arranging for these tourists to be totally evacuated and cared for either.

Just my two cents on this issue.

I think the biggest problem with this situation that people from other countries see is, Media was allowed in but our own embassy staff to locate citizens were not. Offered aid was rejected initially. There is a lot of anger that Aussie's for example were not able to get assistance from Embassy staff because the Authorities refused to allow them in, but allowed the media.

Other countries are gobsmacked that this has been allowed to happen to anyone in a country we believed to be the richest, free country. There is a lot of anger at the moment, that this was allowed to happen to anyone, resident or tourist.

I can totally understand why the tourists would be angry, scared, pissed, etc. They did pay for their own buses to take them out. However, I would be more angry at the touring company that DID NOT EVACUATE THEM BEFORE THE HURRICANE HIT. This is totally unacceptable - the tourists should have left New Orleans or not even stopped in NO due to the impending hurricane.

I don't know if the people driving the tourist buses (scheduled to leave AFTER the hurricane hit) would even be able to get out of the area without someone leading them, especially after the levy broke.

We are experiencing something that is so large no one seems organized. I wonder now how people handled the earthquake in CA that was so devistating. The tsnaumi (sp) was horrible in and of itself and it was a third world country, we are supposed to be ready, but are we as a people really prepared for "the big one?" The area of ground that was affected by this hurricane/levy break/flooding is the size of GREAT BRITAIN. It would be as if the whole of the UK were under water. I don't know if the best laid plans could actually be much better.

I will not cast stones at this time, now is the time we must come together to help the people in crisis - there will be "tomorrow" to make those who should be accountable for these mistakes actually accountable.

I want to add something for lostfaith. Put this in prospective also, lostfaith. I know your concern for the infants and elderly and even the very poor. I know that you thought it was ok that the buses hired to take the stranded tourists out were used to evacuate others first.

I put it to you to wonder if it would be ok to commandeer private persons who were leaving in their own vehicles, to evacuate those poor and infirm first? There's a limit to this blame game and excusing poor judgment on the part of local officials.

BarnGoddess said:

I put it to you to wonder if it would be ok to commandeer private persons who were leaving in their own vehicles, to evacuate those poor and infirm first? There's a limit to this blame game and excusing poor judgment on the part of local officials.

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Actually, many state emergency plans give the Governor, or anyone under his or her order, the right to commandeer any and all private property, food, clothing, transportation, property, buildings, etc. Although it sounds unfair - I think people would be surprised to know how much the government can take from you at a time of crisis. Now, they have to pay you for it or pay you for its use and/or return it to you when they no longer need it, once you file the appropriate forms, filed in triplicate (LOL). Not meaning to argue, Barn. That's not my intention at all!!! Just wanting everyone to realize they may want to look up their individual state's emergency response plans and just see what it is their own state can or cannot do.

There was no reason their buses should have been taken BEFORE the storm arrived, leaving them stranded. That is plain wrong. Those who arranged for their safe evacuation were stranded unnecessarily. ....BarnGoddes......

I might have mis-understood, but I was under the impression that these buses were arranged on Monday,(day of the storm) and arrived on Wed. This is per Aussie's post #6 and #15. So if that info is correct the buses were taken AFTER the storm, not before. I would be really mad at the tourist agent who screwed them over and did not get them out before the storm came. I believe if those buses would have arrived before the storm, they had plenty of notice, they would not have been taken away from them.

That is plain wrong. Those who arranged for their safe evacuation were stranded unnecessarily......BarnGoddes......

In my opinion if the buses were arranged on the day of the storm and came 2 days after (Wed.) then the buses were not arranged for safe evacuation, they were arranged for rescue. Why did they not arrange for them before Katrina? Did they possible think the storm would pass over them and they could continue thier vacation, or were they waiting for the tourist company to come thru for them and they did not?

I do agree with you however on the hotel issue, If they were made to leave they absolutely should have been given and bused to another safe place.

BarnGoddess said:

I put it to you to wonder if it would be ok to commandeer private persons who were leaving in their own vehicles, to evacuate those poor and infirm first? There's a limit to this blame game and excusing poor judgment on the part of local officials.

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Yes, I do think it is o.k. In the aftermath of the storm, not the evacuation of the storm. In the evacuation of the storm, the government of NO should have provided more help to its citizens in getting out of there before Katrina hit. To commandeer private vehicles at that time would have been wrong, they could have used their school buses or chartered buses for their citizens. In the chaos after the storm, I think it is o.k. to commandeer private vehicles in order to save persons in dire straights. I think it is the moral thing to do.

Now, I do believe these tourist need to be compensated for those buses, they should get back every penny of it, and a apology from NO for not being better prepared. I also think the tourist true anger should be directed at the tourist agency that ditched them. Big lawsuit time in my opinion!

Oh, and before this is brought up, someone said there were also elderly and wheelchair bound tourist, well they should have been taken out with those buses too. They are exactly the kind of people who should have been among the top priority.

less0305 said:

Actually, many state emergency plans give the Governor, or anyone under his or her order, the right to commandeer any and all private property, food, clothing, transportation, property, buildings, etc. Although it sounds unfair - I think people would be surprised to know how much the government can take from you at a time of crisis. Now, they have to pay you for it or pay you for its use and/or return it to you when they no longer need it, once you file the appropriate forms, filed in triplicate (LOL). Not meaning to argue, Barn. That's not my intention at all!!! Just wanting everyone to realize they may want to look up their individual state's emergency response plans and just see what it is their own state can or cannot do.

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Thanx, I knew I had seen this done in movies, but was not sure about the legal part of it in real life.