OK OK - Jamison Family; Truck, IDs, money, & dog found abandoned, Oct 2009 - #4

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Where are these three?? I don't think it was a planned disappearance because of the dog..but stranger things have happened. I like the rogue cop or cop impersonation story. But...they could be anywhere.
 
mtrooper said:
Sorry for the delayed response.... I am not sure if they were baptised or not. I will call Gary Brandon and see if he knows. I know in one of her journal entries Sherilyn mentions being born today.. That could be in reference to her baptism. (the date on the paper was not on her actual bday). I am all for a October search. Just tell me what you need, I will do my best. I think the fall will actually be the best time to search. Needs to be after the leaves have fallen, and before the snow. I am thinking if we walk the main areas of concern (at least in my mind) it would take a week or so depending on what we can get for equipment, personell, and weather/ terrain conditions. I am working on getting some maps so the area can be properly gridded, and excluded. Just let me know what you need....I am all in.
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I agree. Might be less if we can get a helicopter out and the weather cooperates. Coordinating out the grids would be great if you have the time- I'll know more once I take a look at the land what we're talking about in terms of grid space. We usually do minimums of 3's in that kind of territory, one dog/handler, two flanks- hopefully we could get 3 teams out at a time and expect a 3 day search with brief and debrief? We probably can't do more than that in one shot.
We can start by ruling out parts of the mountain and area that we think holds no interest (I know the two roads are of primary interest- and any blind spots in particular. Bearing in mind that one of my most recent thoughts is that whoever picked up the Jamisons may have accidentally disposed of them all...? Hey, it wouldn't be the first time someone drove over an edge and disappeared into thin air for a couple of years...) Maybe all this worry about murder and whatnot is actually...just an accident?
Anyway! we'll keep on working on it on our end.
Thanks!
 
Oh yeah- and about the church- could you ask if they have a retreat area (residential) in NC? TIA....
 
Hey ya'll we were not able to get over to the mountain to look at terrain this weekend- it'll have to wait till next visit. Just wanted to keep everyone updated.
 
little726 said:
RP SEARCH SERVICE used in the search to find the missing Jamison family 10/09.

http://rpsearchservices.org/blog/?p=32
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In my experience, these RC aircraft are sensitive to several different variables during searches. Anyone else have any experience? I can absolutely see 'surface' area being cleared. But with the terrain as is (especially drop-offs) I'm thinking maybe not so much under heavier growth such as trees. Such as if something with considerable weight fell a far distance and came to rest in trees or overgrowth on the ground underneath trees. We've had this experience with explosions and plane crashes, that sort of thing. It's amazing how far and how fast a body or objects can be propelled with momentum.

It's just a theory, but I can easily see a vehicle plunging off a dropoff in this terrain with enough momentum to hit forest/undergrowth, and appear to leave no trace behind. Thoughts?
 
Oriah said:
In my experience, these RC aircraft are sensitive to several different variables during searches. Anyone else have any experience? I can absolutely see 'surface' area being cleared. But with the terrain as is (especially drop-offs) I'm thinking maybe not so much under heavier growth such as trees. Such as if something with considerable weight fell a far distance and came to rest in trees or overgrowth on the ground underneath trees. We've had this experience with explosions and plane crashes, that sort of thing. It's amazing how far and how fast a body or objects can be propelled with momentum.

It's just a theory, but I can easily see a vehicle plunging off a dropoff in this terrain with enough momentum to hit forest/undergrowth, and appear to leave no trace behind. Thoughts?
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Oriah, I know nothing about search and rescue. I know mtrooper said there were alot of cliffs on that mountain.

If a car or truck went over one of them, wouldn't the tops of the trees be broken from the car falling through them?

Also, if someone buried bodies with a large piece of machinary, would the cadaver dogs be able to find the buried bodies? I guess what I'm asking is, how deep do buried bodies have to be before the dogs can no longer locate them?
 
If anyone can help me out here, I need to know when the gas well was capped and the last piece of machinary left the area where the truck was found?
 
little726 said:
Oriah, I know nothing about search and rescue. I know mtrooper said there were alot of cliffs on that mountain.

If a car or truck went over one of them, wouldn't the tops of the trees be broken from the car falling through them?

Also, if someone buried bodies with a large piece of machinary, would the cadaver dogs be able to find the buried bodies? I guess what I'm asking is, how deep do buried bodies have to be before the dogs can no longer locate them?
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If a car or truck went over a cliff-type scenario (probably in this situation, its more of a drop-off or curve in the road I would think) with bunches of foliage and trees on the way down) the specific drop off itself- where the vehicle or weight hits- there are broken limbs and whatnot that are evidence of that. But vehicles are heavy, and they tend to go nose-first if they encounter bumpiness on the way down, not necessarily end over end. Sometimes that makes for a kind of 'weave' pattern through foliage, whereby they almost drive down an embankment and leave behind little evidence of the fall. Does that make any sense? Then it appears as if the foliage is undamaged (even though it is.)

As for how deep do bodies have to be buried...gosh. It kind of depends on the situation. In my experience, a good HRD dog can do about 4-5 feet if there is a heavy scent. But others might have a different experience with that.
 
The well had been inactive for a long time (years) before they went missing. The equipment wasn't reclaimed until earlier this spring. There was a large water tank that was there (and was emptied as part of the original search efforts) as far as the well goes it's not like a water well with a pit it was just 3 or 4 small pipes sticking up from the ground). Nothing big enough to stuff a body in. I think the biggest pipe was only 5 or so inches across.
 
As far as would the dogs smell them, there are a lot of variables. If they are sealed in an airtight drum and burried it would obviously be more difficult to smell. As far as just being burried, still varies.... Amount of decomp, weather, type of soil. I agree with Oriah, 5 foot is definitely doable. I am having a hard time connecting with Gary Brandon. Not sure why. I am talking with other members of the church, they didn't mention anything about the spirits, more that they were abnormally clingy.
 
Thank you, mtrooper. I have another question about the wells.

Which site was their truck found on? The upper or lower?

I think the upper well is still active. It has the piping (christmas tree) coming out of the ground. If I found the correct well (Gibson), the lower one, it was finished in 2003.

I have been looking at a lot of maps. One shows just where the pipeline has been laid. My question is, is there a road that runs along the line?
 
mtrooper said:
As far as would the dogs smell them, there are a lot of variables. If they are sealed in an airtight drum and burried it would obviously be more difficult to smell. As far as just being burried, still varies.... Amount of decomp, weather, type of soil. I agree with Oriah, 5 foot is definitely doable. I am having a hard time connecting with Gary Brandon. Not sure why. I am talking with other members of the church, they didn't mention anything about the spirits, more that they were abnormally clingy.
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The Jamisons were clingy, or was the church people clingy?
 
Going back to the cliff discussion, I found two.

1.) Bee Bluff +35.0556,-95.1699

2.) Red Bluff +35.0408,-95.0116

Red Bluff is closer to where the truck was found.
 
I wonder if Madyson's dog could hit on the Jamisons scent, if she was taken back up on the mountain?

I know, it's a crazy thought.
 
little726 said:
I wonder if Madyson's dog could hit on the Jamisons scent, if she was taken back up on the mountain?

I know, it's a crazy thought.
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Any SAR dog could, if they had a good scent article and if there was scent dispersal that was still 'live.'

I don't think their dog would be any more likely to hit on their scent, though, at this point.
 
Oriah said:
Any SAR dog could, if they had a good scent article and if there was scent dispersal that was still 'live.'

I don't think their dog would be any more likely to hit on their scent, though, at this point.
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I guess I was just wishful thinking about Madyson's dog. I think it was just a puppy at the time it was found.
 
little726 said:
I guess I was just wishful thinking about Madyson's dog. I think it was just a puppy at the time it was found.
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I understand. Dogs do frequently 'find' people they know and love quicker than blinds... but I don't think that would be the case here.

We need to get some well trained HRD dogs out in the likely spots where they might be located, even if it means using a little special equipment to reach those spots. Then, I think, we might have some luck.
 
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