GUILTY GA - Jorelys Rivera, 7, Canton, 2 Dec 2011 - #5

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milagoddess said:
vlpate:


Is that facetious? Grooming her? Does that mean you think it was premeditated that he was going to assault or molest her? No intent to kill, just molest or rape? Or he was just being nice?

I hope that doesn't come across snarky...I am asking respectfully.
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Hi, and welcome to WS!

No, I am not being facetious, "grooming" is a very common stage in child molestation....he molested her. Did he intend to kill her? I don't know - she could have started telling him she would tell, and he killed her. He could have had it planned all along. No way for me to know that with the evidence.
 
"grooming" is a very common stage in child molestation
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Wow, I did not know that. Well, I guess I assumed something like that happened, but I didn't know there was a name and a technique to it. Thank you!
 
FYI It is written in the Chemical Enhancement Techniques of Bloodstain Patterns and DNA Recovery
After Fire Exposure indicates "for the most part, the recovered
DNA seemed to be unaffected by the heat, until the temperature was 800C or greater. At this temperature, no DNA profiles were obtained."
~So my theory of heat effecting DNA is difficult to destroy in the manner of heater being left on on turned up to effect crime scene blood is nearly impossible. DNA can even survive fires.
 
mrsu said:
I'm still trying to imagine how blood would look like feces? They must have assumed it was very loose stool?? Ick! If there was that much blood, how was it all over the bathroom, but not found in the rest of the apartment?
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I've been cleaning the house for my 8 month PG sister the last month. I went over the other day and it looked like feces were all over the bottom of the toilet bowl - like loose stools. When I asked her about it she told me she had a terrible nose bleed and cleaned up not realizing that she didn't get under the bowl when cleaning it up. So yes, dried blood could look like feces.

I'm just shocked the perp didn't clean up the blood.
 
vlpate said:
:waitasec: That was a very short bus he rode to school....
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?!

As a teacher working with children with special needs, I have a lot of experience with students with learning disabilities and mild intellectual disabilities. Students with LD are very intelligent just have an issue with either reading, writing, math or organization. Many of my students with LD and MID write like RB and his brothers. Improper grammar, no sentence structure etc. They require a lot of remediation and I can see if that were the case for RB and if he was home schooled why he only finished grade 10. MID is also hereditary.

Anyway - just my thoughts. I suspect RB is MID or has an LD.
 
Mara232 said:
I've been cleaning the house for my 8 month PG sister the last month. I went over the other day and it looked like feces were all over the bottom of the toilet bowl - like loose stools. When I asked her about it she told me she had a terrible nose bleed and cleaned up not realizing that she didn't get under the bowl when cleaning it up. So yes, dried blood could look like feces.

I'm just shocked the perp didn't clean up the blood.
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I was questioning why he would turn up the heat to dry the blood, as someone suggested, rather than just washing the blood off the surfaces.

How in the world does a nose bleed get under a toilet bowl?
 
vlpate said:
I was questioning why he would turn up the heat to dry the blood, as someone suggested, rather than just washing the blood off the surfaces.

How in the world does a nose bleed get under a toilet bowl?
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That's what surprise me too - why not clean it? Maybe eh was trying to get out of there to dispose of body with plan to come back and clean and neve got to get back??


As for nose bleed, she said it was pouring out of her nose she ran into the bathroom and it must have splashed up onto the toilet from the floor? I'm not sure, she did call me when she had it freaking out that her nose was bleeding like crazy. I guess it's a common thing in late pregnancy.
 
Mara232 said:
I've been cleaning the house for my 8 month PG sister the last month. I went over the other day and it looked like feces were all over the bottom of the toilet bowl - like loose stools. When I asked her about it she told me she had a terrible nose bleed and cleaned up not realizing that she didn't get under the bowl when cleaning it up. So yes, dried blood could look like feces.

I'm just shocked the perp didn't clean up the blood.
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Of all the people who inspected the vacant apartment, only Sgt. Dixon looked in the bathroom and told Kendra "there was **** all over the bathroom floor." (page 4, 3rd paragraph).

D/S McMullen who saw "a little blood" said he looked in the toilet and saw no water (page 10, lst paragraph) so if it was feces on the floor, it's possible the toilet was plugged and the contents overflowed onto the floor.

The mattress with sticks on it and leather couch were in the living room and LE claim the victim was sexually assaulted so why would only a minuscule amount of the victim's blood be in the bathroom and not in the livingroom? Maybe some of the victim's blood dripped off the perp's body while they were in the bathroom cleaning up but the amount of blood the detectives and SAR personnel saw doesn't equal the amount of blood one would expect to find if a victim had been stabbed multiple times in the vacant apartment. :twocents:

Personally I don't believe Jorelys was abducted on her way to the playground after leaving her apartment with drinks for her friends since there are no reliable witnesses afaik who saw her there and we don't know who notified the family that Jorelys hadn't showed up at the playground after she left to get drinks for herself and friends. The babysitter who should have been watching Jorelys wasn't there and her mother and coworker were "sleeping" - Joseline Rivera claimed she hadn't seen or spoken with her daughter since Thursday. Jorelys arrived at school around 7:15 am and she likely got home around 3. She wasn't reported missing until 7:15 pm Friday.

Timothy Carr from SAR said he saw blood in the bathroom and it looked to him like someone had a nosebleed.

D/S McMullen said he walked to a bedroom with a bathroom and saw “a little blood.” He speculated that it was a “nose bleed” or someone cut themselves when they were moving out of the apartment.

http://m.ajc.com/multimedia/archive/01222/Cherokee_internal__1222434a.pdf
 
Mara232 said:
That's what surprise me too - why not clean it? Maybe eh was trying to get out of there to dispose of body with plan to come back and clean and neve got to get back??


As for nose bleed, she said it was pouring out of her nose she ran into the bathroom and it must have splashed up onto the toilet from the floor? I'm not sure, she did call me when she had it freaking out that her nose was bleeding like crazy. I guess it's a common thing in late pregnancy.
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BEM: Great point.
 
There is no question at this point that it was indeed blood in the bathroom and the officer's original assumption was mistaken. There was not feces on the floor. There is no question that this apartment is the place where the murder occurred. An officer has been disciplined for not reporting what he saw. The scene has been processed. Samples have been taken of the substance in the bathroom. LE has not said that the bathroom was the only place that blood was found in the apartment. There were blankets reportedly left in one of the rooms. The blankets could have been used to cover bloodstains or the other rooms could have been cleaned before they were searched. I think there was very much more in that apartment than has been reported. We don't have access to all the evidence - we just know that they are confident they have the right guy. IMO it is cruel to try to implicate this child's grieving family. I cannot imagine what this mother is going through but it is possible that she or others close to her could be reading here.
 
stillwatersc said:
There is no question at this point that it was indeed blood in the bathroom and the officer's original assumption was mistaken. There was not feces on the floor. There is no question that this apartment is the place where the murder occurred. An officer has been disciplined for not reporting what he saw. The scene has been processed. Samples have been taken of the substance in the bathroom. LE has not said that the bathroom was the only place that blood was found in the apartment. There were blankets reportedly left in one of the rooms. The blankets could have been used to cover bloodstains or the other rooms could have been cleaned before they were searched. I think there was very much more in that apartment than has been reported. We don't have access to all the evidence - we just know that they are confident they have the right guy. IMO it is cruel to try to implicate this child's grieving family. I cannot imagine what this mother is going through but it is possible that she or others close to her could be reading here.
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Especially when there is absolutely no evidence to implicate anyone in the grieving family. If there was any evidence against anyone in Jorelys family LE would be all over it.
 
Sorry if this has already been posted!

Canton hires third-party reviewer

LaGrange Police Chief Louis Dekmar has been selected to begin a third-party review into the response and investigation of the Jorelys Rivera murder case.
Canton City Manager Scott Wood said Dekmar’s review is under way.
“Chief Dekmar began his work Dec. 28, interviewing various members of our police department,” he said. “The results of his report will be presented to me, which I will share with mayor and council, the police department and the media.”













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http://www.ledgernews.com/news/1127-january-4-2012/4396-canton-hires-third-party-reviewer
 
I am also new to this board. Has anyone been able to find out of the Jorelys' and RB's families are under gag orders? It seems RB's sister is saying stuff on Facebook, and specific stuff like whether or not a pair of shoes in question belong to RB, polygraph tests, etc:

http://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=333389253356763&id=322014381160917

I can only imagine what stress the family is under, but...
 
log1c_cat said:
I am also new to this board. Has anyone been able to find out of the Jorelys' and RB's families are under gag orders? It seems RB's sister is saying stuff on Facebook, and specific stuff like whether or not a pair of shoes in question belong to RB, polygraph tests, etc:

http://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=333389253356763&id=322014381160917

I can only imagine what stress the family is under, but...
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Hi and Welcome! I thought I had heard about a gag order for both families but I cannot be sure if that is true.

I saw the posts you are referring to and I cannot even bear to respond to her, my heart goes out to her...... I just cannot imagine.
 
log1c_cat said:
I am also new to this board. Has anyone been able to find out of the Jorelys' and RB's families are under gag orders? It seems RB's sister is saying stuff on Facebook, and specific stuff like whether or not a pair of shoes in question belong to RB, polygraph tests, etc:

http://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=333389253356763&id=322014381160917

I can only imagine what stress the family is under, but...
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His sister makes some interesting points, as does the woman who discussed the Internal Report.

How do we KNOW that this kid wasn't set up by the real perp. As she said, if another maintenance worker asks you to go clean up a vacant apt and gives you the key, then you might have the key still in your possession and leave your own DNA behind. And do they KNOW those bloody shoes were really his shoes? Even if they were his, someone could easily frame him by putting them in the dumpster themselves , or wearing them during the crime.

I only wonder because there was no other record in this kids past of anything at all like this. I really hope they are checking out everyone else as well.
 
katydid23 said:
His sister makes some interesting points, as does the woman who discussed the Internal Report.

How do we KNOW that this kid wasn't set up by the real perp. As she said, if another maintenance worker asks you to go clean up a vacant apt and gives you the key, then you might have the key still in your possession and leave your own DNA behind. And do they KNOW those bloody shoes were really his shoes? Even if they were his, someone could easily frame him by putting them in the dumpster themselves , or wearing them during the crime.

I only wonder because there was no other record in this kids past of anything at all like this. I really hope they are checking out everyone else as well.
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Here's an interesting fact for you to consider in this case, 39% of offenders of victims ages 6 through 11 were also juveniles.
 
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