Identified! VA - Annandale, WhtFem 245UFVA, ~60, 'NO CODE, DNR, No Penicillin', Dec'96

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I always think of this case when it is xmas time, yesterday was the anniversary of her death. May she rest in peace.
 
I was looking through doenet trying to find a match for a different doe, and was reminded of the Annandale Jane Doe when I saw a photo of Magdelena Chindris. She went missing from Italy about a year and a half prior to Ms Doe being found. She too had attempted suicide, but her attempt is thought to have been unsuccessful.

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/1770dfita.html
 
The victim's Namus page
https://identifyus.org/cases/6279

The only one in the rule out list is Iva Foss. Namus says DNA samples exist but the tests are not complete so apparently there are no Codis ruleouts by default.
 
I too wonder if she were possibly murdered. :( I hope Dateline or some news show, shows some interest!
 
There is no indication that she was murdered. She committed suicide. She mixed alcohol and Valium and had a do not resuscitate necklace or bracelet on. A murderer isn't going to go through all of the steps she did before she laid down to die. IMO This case has bothered me for a long time.
 
this is my take on this UID. first of all she knew exactly what she was doing. the DNR bracelet would prevent any medical person from interfering with her in the event she was found still alive.

I assume she was well educated and had a professional or semi-professional career. for whatever reason suicide was her final decision. she made it not only as painless as possible but with the tapes she made her exit as comfortable as possible.

it is more curious why she wanted to be unidentified. even so, that is what she opted for so part of me says leave well enough alone and maybe people should just respect that.

you'd think that somewhere there was an apartment left vacant, but if she went through this much planning, she probably vacated her last address prior to her suicide to minimize any possibility of someone putting 2 and 2 together. there is an outside chance she was a patient somewhere and that facilities might be unwilling to release that kind of information for patient privacy purposes. for that matter, she might have been in a care facility and voluntarily checked herself out and proceeded to do this. thus she might not have had a last home address in the classic sense.
 
Bump, thinking of this doe....someone out there must know who she is!!!!
 
dogperson said:
According to the Find A Grave website, this cemetery is ethnic & African American. There is a record on the website of the grave markers for the babies and they are mostly what I'd call, "foreign-sounding names" for lack of a better word. I think it's unlikely that any of the babies were blood related to the UID unless there was a mixed marriage in her family because this lady couldn't look any more Caucasian. Has anyone followed up on whether this could be Evelyn Piper? Someone mentioned her and I see a resemblance if the UID's hair was fluffed up.
Click to expand...

https://identifyus.org/cases/6279
Evelyn Piper is on the Namus ruleouts list, along with Iva Foss.
 
http://www.weespernieuws.nl/getpdf/2008/wn09jan08.pdf

This article, written in Dutch tells about Johanna Atalia Gersina De Haas, and how her daughter (who she gave up for adoption) is in search of her. The article mentions this UID Case.

2622443110045078242S600x600Q851.jpg
245UFVA.jpg

Johanna Atalia Gersina De Haas https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/12580/0
DoeNetwork Case 245UFWA http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/245ufva.html


Jane Doe
In 1985 she appealed to TROS Missing. Thanks to this TV program many children have already been reunited with their parents.

The investigators, after wanderings via Germany and Canada went to the United States to look into the case of an unknown woman who died in 1996. The approximately sixty year old woman had committed suicide on a children's graveyard. This 'Jane Doe' (as they call unidentified deceased in America) wore at the time of her death Dutch-made glasses and shows a resemblance to Johanna de Haas. Currently there is genetic research to compare her Black Jopie.

Rose: "When I look at the pictures, the likeness is so apt that I think that this woman is indeed my mother. I hope of course that it is not. I have yet so many questions which remain unanswered. I still would prefer to find a living mother. But if it is my mother, the least I can do for this unknown woman in that tomb is to give her a name. "
Click to expand...
 
I don't think this was a cancer patient at all - I think she was a NURSE. We always joke about having NO CPR or DNR tatooed on our chests. And if you've ever witnessed an autopsy (which many, many nurses have during their training) would make you not want one. A nurse would have this put on their medic alert bracelet, along with their drug allergy.

The detailed planning, the careful hiding of her identity. It screams NURSE to me.

What say you?
 
marycarney said:
I don't think this was a cancer patient at all - I think she was a NURSE. We always joke about having NO CPR or DNR tatooed on our chests. And if you've ever witnessed an autopsy (which many, many nurses have during their training) would make you not want one. A nurse would have this put on their medic alert bracelet, along with their drug allergy.

The detailed planning, the careful hiding of her identity. It screams NURSE to me.

What say you?
Click to expand...

Sounds plausible.

Perhaps she was a nurse who felt guilt over the death of a child who she might have been able to save. (or who died as a result of her self-percieved negligence).
 
marycarney said:
I don't think this was a cancer patient at all - I think she was a NURSE. We always joke about having NO CPR or DNR tatooed on our chests. And if you've ever witnessed an autopsy (which many, many nurses have during their training) would make you not want one. A nurse would have this put on their medic alert bracelet, along with their drug allergy.

The detailed planning, the careful hiding of her identity. It screams NURSE to me.

What say you?
Click to expand...

I agree totally. A normal every day person wouldn't realize to have that bracelet on. She wanted to make sure that if she was found they wouldn't try to resuscitate her. Sadly she definitely wanted to die. I have always wondered if the LED took a picture of her around to the hospitals in the area. There are a few of them near by. Somebody has to be missing her. She had to of lived some place. I have studied a lot of these cases over the years on here but this one has stuck in my mind for a long time. Another thing I thought of too was you have to take the correct amount of Valium and alcohol to kill yourself. If you take too much your body would reject it and you'd vomit. She knew how much to take....something a nurse would know too!
 
webrocket said:
this is my take on this UID. first of all she knew exactly what she was doing. the DNR bracelet would prevent any medical person from interfering with her in the event she was found still alive.

I assume she was well educated and had a professional or semi-professional career. for whatever reason suicide was her final decision. she made it not only as painless as possible but with the tapes she made her exit as comfortable as possible.

it is more curious why she wanted to be unidentified. even so, that is what she opted for so part of me says leave well enough alone and maybe people should just respect that.

you'd think that somewhere there was an apartment left vacant, but if she went through this much planning, she probably vacated her last address prior to her suicide to minimize any possibility of someone putting 2 and 2 together. there is an outside chance she was a patient somewhere and that facilities might be unwilling to release that kind of information for patient privacy purposes. for that matter, she might have been in a care facility and voluntarily checked herself out and proceeded to do this. thus she might not have had a last home address in the classic sense.
Click to expand...


Most people that try to commit suicide and fail will tell you that they were glad they got a second chance at life. She might have felt the same way However she was drugged up and had alcohol in her system so it would have been almost impossible for her to change her mind or to think logically. I am sure somebody has been missing her from some where. Because she made sure that she couldn't be identified wouldn't stop me from trying to find her family. Maybe she didn't want to hurt them because she killed herself She might have thought that it would be easier on them if they thought she just disappeared. It's hard to know what goes through a persons mind
 
Could this possibly be Margaret M. Kilkoyne?

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/k/kilcoyne_margaret.html

Age: Margaret went missing in 1980; she was 50. The UID was found in 1996, 16 years later. If Margaret had been alive in 1996, she would have been 66 in 1996, which does fit with the estimated age of the unidentified per NAMUS - 50-70 years old.

Height: The UID is reported to be 5'0". Margaret is reported to be 5'0".

Weight: The UID is reported to be 157 pounds. Margaret is reported to have weighed 140 back in 1980 when she first went missing. She could have gained 17 pounds in 16 years.

Hair: The UID is reported to have Red/Auburn hair. Margaret is reported to have red hair and blue eyes.

Eyes: The UID shows a photo of eyeglasses in NAMUS; Margaret is reported to have worn Horn rimmed eyeglasses back in 1980.

I also think that Margaret does resemble the UID.

NOTE: Margaret was a nurse who then went onto become a cardiologist. She is reported to have been experiencing severe mental stress and depression and/or mania at the time of her disappearance. She felt that people at work were spying on her.

She apparently was very educated and wealthy, as it is reported on Charley Project that she left behind an estate of $200,000. Her financial status and her education could account for her having the means to travel for 16 years or having the means to find other employment during those 16 years until perhaps her mental state overcame her and she committed suicide.

She was declared legally dead in 1989.

Anyone think this is worth a shot? I'd like to see the UID be identified. Anyone want to submit, please feel free to.

https://identifyus.org/en/cases/6279
 
TxJan1971 said:
Could this possibly be Margaret M. Kilkoyne?

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/k/kilcoyne_margaret.html

Age: Margaret went missing in 1980; she was 50. The UID was found in 1996, 16 years later. If Margaret had been alive in 1996, she would have been 66 in 1996, which does fit with the estimated age of the unidentified per NAMUS - 50-70 years old.

Height: The UID is reported to be 5'0". Margaret is reported to be 5'0".

Weight: The UID is reported to be 157 pounds. Margaret is reported to have weighed 140 back in 1980 when she first went missing. She could have gained 17 pounds in 16 years.

Hair: The UID is reported to have Red/Auburn hair. Margaret is reported to have red hair and blue eyes.

Eyes: The UID shows a photo of eyeglasses in NAMUS; Margaret is reported to have worn Horn rimmed eyeglasses back in 1980.

I also think that Margaret does resemble the UID.

NOTE: Margaret was a nurse who then went onto become a cardiologist. She is reported to have been experiencing severe mental stress and depression and/or mania at the time of her disappearance. She felt that people at work were spying on her.

She apparently was very educated and wealthy, as it is reported on Charley Project that she left behind an estate of $200,000. Her financial status and her education could account for her having the means to travel for 16 years or having the means to find other employment during those 16 years until perhaps her mental state overcame her and she committed suicide.

She was declared legally dead in 1989.

Anyone think this is worth a shot? I'd like to see the UID be identified. Anyone want to submit, please feel free to.

https://identifyus.org/en/cases/6279
Click to expand...


I don't believe this is her, and here's why:
*UID had a c-section scar. Margaret's info lists nothing about children, and doesn't mention a husband or being previously married.
*I don't believe that Margaret was mentally stable enough to have enough money for 15 years to buy those types of clothing that the UID was found wearing.
* I don't see a resemblance, specifically in the eye spacing.

This lady was probably not homeless for very long...just my opinion. I would bet that Margaret is either deceased or homeless.
 
The biggest problem with Margaret Kilkoyne is the 16 year interval from 1980 and 1996. I do not think her a hidden/underground lifestyle for 16 years would have satisfied her personality.

I also think the UID did not have much money. $50 is a joke towards cremation costs. She did not want to die at home, or address estate issues.

Although it is possible this is a nurse, I dismiss this theory about lying down among the graves of infants due to being bothered by previous patient circumstances or mistakes. The likelihood of that scenario could be applied to any female who dealt with a loss in their lifetime and not necessarily applicable to a nurse not coping well in her profession. What I do see is a person very intent on suicide, who has meticulously planned its execution,and who wanted to insure that she was not revived. This was someone who was mentally ill/depressed who was focused on ending her life.
 
CherBearSTL said:
I don't believe this is her, and here's why:
*UID had a c-section scar. Margaret's info lists nothing about children, and doesn't mention a husband or being previously married.
*I don't believe that Margaret was mentally stable enough to have enough money for 15 years to buy those types of clothing that the UID was found wearing.
* I don't see a resemblance, specifically in the eye spacing.

This lady was probably not homeless for very long...just my opinion. I would bet that Margaret is either deceased or homeless.
Click to expand...

Here's a side-by side:

245UFVA.jpg
kilcoyne_margaret.jpg
 
A nurse would know that suicide is against the law in every state (or was in 1996) and that the DNR would not be honored in the case of an attempted suicide. I don't believe her wearing the bracelet is necessarily linked to her suicide. If it was, why would it list a drug allergy? The drug allergy listing shows forward thinking, indicating it was not acquired while she was suicidal. A suicide attempt invalidates a DNR because a) it is a crime (or was at the time, I know some states are in the process of implementing doctor assisted suicide) and b) the patient is deemed to be not of sound mind so unable to make those decisions herself.

That being said, I think her being a nurse is entirely possible. A nurse friend of mine talked about all the suicides gone wrong she had treated and described this particular manner as the best way to go. Benzos, alcohol and a plastic bag... you just go to sleep.
 
Teresa Larson said:
Another thing I thought of too was you have to take the correct amount of Valium and alcohol to kill yourself. If you take too much your body would reject it and you'd vomit. She knew how much to take....something a nurse would know too!
Click to expand...

I think she took the Valium and alcohol to relax and make her passing go smoother. The case information indicates that she died from suffocation due to having the plastic bag over her head, not from a Valium and alcohol overdose.
 
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