ARREST!!! Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #21

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CaseClosed said:
GENERAL COMMENT - Nobody can stop the general public from discussing a case or whatever it is. The internet has been available to many people for over 20 years and this is not the only case (nor will it be the last) that will generate forum discussions all over the place. The authorities, whether it be police or government, know this and are expecting people's speculation. I agree that QPS should keep many details secret, but what has been released to the public through media is very much what they want us to know. If the authorities thought that any information released would be detrimental to someone or to a prospective trial, they would not have released any details about anything and would have put a total ban on the media reporting on this case (or any other case).



This forum has moderators and if they believe that a particular post or comment is inappropriate (according to their TOS), they will promptly delete them, as we have experienced. But we still have the right to express our opinions, with respect for the victim and all involved, including respect for members of this forum. I believe expressing certain grieve for the death of woman (with whom many here identify with and for various reasons) is perfectly acceptable.

If authorities are so concerned about what is being discussed in forums like this, WHY haven't they come out and confirm they have eliminated certain player(s) from their investigation? Because they HAVEN'T eliminated them. All they above is my personal opinion only.

I still stand by my own theory: Allison died as a result of a DV incident. IMO.
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But I wonder to what extent the desire to discuss every minutia of the case, including numerous speculations not mentioned in MSM, is risking the long-term outcome of the investigation? I know everyone is free to make their own decisions regarding what they want to discuss, but it would be a terrible shame if the (hopefully) eventual court case is somehow impacted upon by this - even in a small way. Everyone's motivation is justice for Allison but the worst outcome for her family would be to find that this compulsion, while not actually solving the crime, could in fact create a problem down the track. It is reasonable for the media to report on the facts that come to light via the QPS, but I'm not sure how reasonable it is for people to publicly sleuth every family member, friend, business associate, company, etc. This is not intended as a criticism of any individual here, but more as food for thought about taking a long-term approach to the investigation to ensure it has optimal success. (IMO of course)
 
mum73 said:
Internet forums/rumour/innuendo have been around for a long time, but there have also been several cases where they've been raised as having a negative effect on investigative processes. I feel it is only a matter of time before forums such as this one are brought in to grant a mistrial in a major case.

Please also remember that this is an American website, and I think you will find that the owners/moderators will not/cannot guarantee that your input here will have no legal repercussions under Australian law.

Please understand that I am not defending anyone, nor am I saying any of you don't have the "right" to do as you please. I am just suggesting that some of the matters I have raised should be considered; both for the health and well being of posters here, and to protect the case against Allisons' killer/s.
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Yes, I am aware that we have to be careful with accusations because libel laws take into account the locality where the comment was made, and not where the internet forum is based.

I think we must also consider that many people live isolated lives (whether due to location, age, circumstance, etc.) and internet forums are basically their only arena to establish certain relationships (virtual) with the outside world, i.e it becomes their way of holding a "conversation" with other people. Some are more emotional than others and some are more restrained. It's just how these forums work.
 
factfinda said:
But I wonder to what extent the desire to discuss every minutia of the case, including numerous speculations not mentioned in MSM, is risking the long-term outcome of the investigation? I know everyone is free to make their own decisions regarding what they want to discuss, but it would be a terrible shame if the (hopefully) eventual court case is somehow impacted upon by this - even in a small way. Everyone's motivation is justice for Allison but the worst outcome for her family would be to find that this compulsion, while not actually solving the crime, could in fact create a problem down the track. It is reasonable for the media to report on the facts that come to light via the QPS, but I'm not sure how reasonable it is for people to publicly sleuth every family member, friend, business associate, company, etc. This is not intended as a criticism of any individual here, but more as food for thought about taking a long-term approach to the investigation to ensure it has optimal success. (IMO of course)
Click to expand...

I understand the discussion on this site could possibly be a problem regarding jury selection for a trial, but im sure that people, especially locals, would be discussing this case at length and many of them would know those involved personally. Aren't we really doing the same thing, just not in person? Afterall, everything we talk about is only our opinions and thoughts.

Also, correct me if I am wrong, if you are selected for a jury doesn't the judge advise you not to access the media during that time.
 
factfinda said:
But I wonder to what extent the desire to discuss every minutia of the case, including numerous speculations not mentioned in MSM, is risking the long-term outcome of the investigation? I know everyone is free to make their own decisions regarding what they want to discuss, but it would be a terrible shame if the (hopefully) eventual court case is somehow impacted upon by this - even in a small way. Everyone's motivation is justice for Allison but the worst outcome for her family would be to find that this compulsion, while not actually solving the crime, could in fact create a problem down the track. It is reasonable for the media to report on the facts that come to light via the QPS, but I'm not sure how reasonable it is for people to publicly sleuth every family member, friend, business associate, company, etc. This is not intended as a criticism of any individual here, but more as food for thought about taking a long-term approach to the investigation to ensure it has optimal success. (IMO of course)
Click to expand...

I understand what you are saying. Do you know of any criminal case in the world (since the availability of the internet) where a forum discussion has resulted in a failed outcome? I personally don't know of any.
 
louisepiglet said:
I understand the discussion on this site could possibly be a problem regarding jury selection for a trial, but im sure that people, especially locals, would be discussing this case at length and many of them would know those involved personally. Aren't we really doing the same thing, just not in person? Afterall, everything we talk about is only our opinions and thoughts.
Click to expand...

Agree. I personally don't think it will be that difficult to find 12 jurors in a city of 2 million people, where probably only a very insignificant number of residents are discussing this case in forums.
 
People are judged by their peers in a court of law, no one should be judged in a public forum unless all the facts are known especially when the info on that forum will be available forever and a day wether the person is guilty is not. But people are people, we all want our opinions heard and we all feel the need to let the rest of the world know how clever we are. Sadly the world is a dog eat dog world and people will say what they want when they want all we can do is ignore what we disagree with and accepts peoples opinion. I have alwys been of the opinion that if you like who you are and what you stand for no one elses opinions matter.
 
CaseClosed said:
GENERAL COMMENT - Nobody can stop the general public from discussing a case or whatever it is. The internet has been available to many people for over 20 years and this is not the only case (nor will it be the last) that will generate forum discussions all over the place. The authorities, whether it be police or government, know this and are expecting people's speculation. I agree that QPS should keep many details secret, but what has been released to the public through media is very much what they want us to know. If the authorities thought that any information released would be detrimental to someone or to a prospective trial, they would not have released any details about anything and would have put a total ban on the media reporting on this case (or any other case).



This forum has moderators and if they believe that a particular post or comment is inappropriate (according to their TOS), they will promptly delete them, as we have experienced. But we still have the right to express our opinions, with respect for the victim and all involved, including respect for members of this forum. I believe expressing certain grieve for the death of woman (with whom many here identify with and for various reasons) is perfectly acceptable.

If authorities are so concerned about what is being discussed in forums like this, WHY haven't they come out and confirm they have eliminated certain player(s) from their investigation? Because they HAVEN'T eliminated them. All they above is my personal opinion only.

I still stand by my own theory: Allison died as a result of a DV incident. IMO.
Click to expand...

I agree. I have always felt that this is a case of DV that spun out of control.
IMO
 
louisepiglet said:
I understand the discussion on this site could possibly be a problem regarding jury selection for a trial, but im sure that people, especially locals, would be discussing this case at length and many of them would know those involved personally. Aren't we really doing the same thing, just not in person? Afterall, everything we talk about is only our opinions and thoughts.

Also, correct me if I am wrong, if you are selected for a jury doesn't the judge advise you not to access the media during that time.
Click to expand...

I think the problem with having such a myriad of information online, available to everyone to see at any time, is that there is understandably a hybrid of facts, rumour and speculation that could potentially influence a jury. While jurors are supposed to base their decisions solely on what they have seen and heard in court, it would be a huge temptation to have a good dig around online when you get home. I know I probably would! So my personal opinion is that it's the easy availability of all the opinions and information that could be troublesome, as opposed to perhaps overhearing the odd conversation around town. But I do agree that this is the nature of the online world these days and perhaps the laws need to change to accommodate this. I'm not saying that people shouldn't discuss the case; it's more about the extent and depth of the speculation that could have an impact.
 
factfinda said:
I think the problem with having such a myriad of information online, available to everyone to see at any time, is that there is understandably a hybrid of facts, rumour and speculation that could potentially influence a jury. While jurors are supposed to base their decisions solely on what they have seen and heard in court, it would be a huge temptation to have a good dig around online when you get home. I know I probably would! So my personal opinion is that it's the easy availability of all the opinions and information that could be troublesome, as opposed to perhaps overhearing the odd conversation around town. But I do agree that this is the nature of the online world these days and perhaps the laws need to change to accommodate this. I'm not saying that people shouldn't discuss the case; it's more about the extent and depth of the speculation that could have an impact.
Click to expand...

If worst come to worst, the jury could be ordered to be sequestered in a hotel without access to media or others.
 
louisepiglet said:
I understand the discussion on this site could possibly be a problem regarding jury selection for a trial, but im sure that people, especially locals, would be discussing this case at length and many of them would know those involved personally. Aren't we really doing the same thing, just not in person? Afterall, everything we talk about is only our opinions and thoughts.
Click to expand...

Before the internet people discussed cases such as this, in person to person conversations, as in small talk (excuse the phrase) over a cuppa then probably didn't discuss it again until the Newspapers came out with something new. Sleuthing is something that the internet has enabled. Good or bad the thoughts we have are expressed and put in print for ALL to see thus keeping the rumors ,speculation and theories alive and well (and growing) day to day.The capacity to create a very biased public is far greater now. You can rest assured there is a junior law clerk (at GBC's lawyers office) who's job it is , is to read every forum and blog online regarding this case. All there in black and white..........not here say.Please don't think I am being critical of anyone in particular. I have been more an observer than a contributor on this forum.IMO of course.
:lurk:
 
CaseClosed said:
I understand what you are saying. Do you know of any criminal case in the world (since the availability of the internet) where a forum discussion has resulted in a failed outcome? I personally don't know of any.
Click to expand...

I'm not a solicitor and I haven't Googled any other cases, but I know it's an issue that is widely discussed behind closed doors in the media. I don't think it's an overstatement to say the potential is there. If erring on the side of caution would prevent a future injustice then it's probably worth considering, IMO.
 
IMO forum speculation and comment is least likely to affect a court case than the long term reputation of the person it is aimed at should it be proved they are innocent.

Having said that IMO GBC is guilty as sin.
 
Just checking my Avatar, hope nobody else has it (let me know if you do and I'll change it) Cheers
 
LostSock said:
People are judged by their peers in a court of law, no one should be judged in a public forum unless all the facts are known especially when the info on that forum will be available forever and a day wether the person is guilty is not. But people are people, we all want our opinions heard and we all feel the need to let the rest of the world know how clever we are. Sadly the world is a dog eat dog world and people will say what they want when they want all we can do is ignore what we disagree with and accepts peoples opinion. I have alwys been of the opinion that if you like who you are and what you stand for no one elses opinions matter.
Click to expand...

That is the best looking sock ever.......

Sometime today there will be a yellow cross laden with sunflowers at Kholo Bridge.
 
Mothergoose said:
Before the internet people discussed cases such as this, in person to person conversations, as in small talk (excuse the phrase) over a cuppa then probably didn't discuss it again until the Newspapers came out with something new. Sleuthing is something that the internet has enabled. Good or bad the thoughts we have are expressed and put in print for ALL to see thus keeping the rumors ,speculation and theories alive and well (and growing) day to day.The capacity to create a very biased public is far greater now. You can rest assured there is a junior law clerk (at GBC's lawyers office) who's job it is , is to read every forum and blog online regarding this case. All there in black and white..........not here say.Please don't think I am being critical of anyone in particular. I have been more an observer than a contributor on this forum.IMO of course.
:lurk:
Click to expand...

Maybe the forum needs to be members only and not available for public view with some form of copyright terms and conditions???

But in saying that the ability of the WS forum to influence the general public opinion is zero with 300 odd lurkers ...Australia wide...... any influence will come from MSM or high profile blogs from politicians and the like.

MOO
 
mum73 said:
I'm sure if you search "Google Mistrials" you will find examples.

I'm going to take some of my own advice and vacate the forum until there is more information to discuss. For all posters, please take care in what you discuss here and be aware that some of you through kind deeds/sleuthing have already inadvertently revealed who you are, both to authorities and to those who may take offence to some of the comments published here.
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Again so eloquently put mum73. I think it's a bit too late for cautionary advice though. Like shutting the gate after the horse has galloped. I'm off too. It's all been an interesting observation in human behavior......in a good way of course MOOO.......
 
I think it is amazing how good the sunflowers look on the page. Its a pleasure clicking through the forum. :)blushing:Lostsock the sunflower touch is too cute!)
 
Greg said:
Maybe the forum needs to be members only and not available for public view with some form of copyright terms and conditions???

But in saying that the ability of the WS forum to influence the general public opinion is zero with 300 odd lurkers ...Australia wide...... any influence will come from MSM or high profile blogs from politicians and the like.

MOO
Click to expand...

Do you honestly think only 300 non members read this forum. How do you know that is the figure. Do you have to be registered to read? Moo:what:
 
Keentoknow said:
That is the best looking sock ever.......

Sometime today there will be a yellow cross laden with sunflowers at Kholo Bridge.
Click to expand...
Hello...I'm back on after a self imposed break (again!) and am amazed at the Sunflower explosion here. When I first put sunflowers at Kholo Bridge a couple of Saturdays ago and called it Sunflower Saturday to a few posters I had no idea that it would become such a lovely and appropriate symbol for Allison.
The yellow cross is a wonderful gesture! Thank you so much.
 
Indromum said:
Hello...I'm back on after a self imposed break (again!) and am amazed at the Sunflower explosion here. When I first put sunflowers at Kholo Bridge a couple of Saturdays ago and called it Sunflower Saturday to a few posters I had no idea that it would become such a lovely and appropriate symbol for Allison.
The yellow cross is a wonderful gesture! Thank you so much.
Click to expand...

It has really taken off, I mainly read but just finished uploading mine hope it worked ... GLAD TO SEE YOU BACK :woohoo::woohoo:
 
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