What Is the Defense Strategy?

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Long ago before we spent hours posting and reading every detail we could find- us websleuthers are known... for checking out other sites for info too- we posted our first thoughts. I posted long ago what if someone gave casey a dead caylee? What if she just told someone take the lil snothead, I need a break . Maybe someone told her they could get some one to adopt her , human traffic her, in the end casy gets money and has her good beautiful life she craved. She gets her tattoo, parties with no worrys, only problem she has it what the heck can she tell cindy , george when they ask for caylee? So she avoids them, lies, she already had a nanny story so maybe she thinks- yeah - that nanny has her and will not give her back to me cause she fell in love with her. Then she thinks - no- the nanny stole her. that sounds good. Maybe at that time caylee was alive. MAYBE SHE WAS DEAD BY ACCIDENT. IN THE BEGINING I THINK I REMEMBER CASEY SAYING SHE WAS AFRAID OF WHAT CINDY WOULD SAY OR DO. If casey gave someone caylee and she had given her something to make her sleepy and got a call - hey the kid will not wake up- shes dead - the lies must begin. If she herself found caylee dead, forgot her in car, heat, drugs, medicine, add other ways pool , anger she must act as if caylee is alive. party. so far everyone believes caylee is ok. If someone or herself found caylee dead- she had to get rid of her. the lies are a whole other story as we know she does that well. I just wonder if in the end jose will finally say when the truth comes out you will understand. I really think casey did not actually murder her but did contribute to the death by being able to do something that made caylee die by accident. yes, it was her fault or someone elses but then she or someone else had to dump her. the story begins- who what when where why. some we know- some we only guess. If we try to seperate how caylee died from caseys reactions., non reactions. lies and behavior we may have a better way to keep it all in seperate issues. maybe some of it will come into place of the truth. no one can outdo caseys lies- do not even t ry to figure out why. Somewere in the lies is a reason. she thinks no one will think she lies AND THAT IS SCAREY IN ITSELF.
 
logicalgirl said:
You and I are disagreeing at cross purposes here. My statements are about Baez making opening statements or presenting evidence that has a possibility of being effective.

Baez can say anything he wants, I agree. But my expectations are he will try to say something that is cohesive, believable or even has the possibility of being believable and has some kind of basis to have his statements believable since he insists on being lead attorney on the Defense team.
The implication of sexual abuse by George is laughable - there is no basis of fact for ICA's slight remembering that maybe something happened.

Here are some statements. My father sexually abused me. My daughter was murdered or died accidently. All evidence points to me. I partied like a rockstar from the last day my daughter was seen. Four statements we accept as "true". The question is what does Baez say, do or present that will have the jury conclude ICA is innocent of this murder?

I was discussing what Baez could say that would have some impact on the jury. Something logical, something effective. SODDI here, a hint of sexual abuse there isn't going to cut it. As I said before, the guilt phase is about How, Who, and Where, the Penalty phase is about Why. Any hint of sexual abuse fits into the Why phase.

From all the evidence that will be presented at trial, it is laughable to suggest George was sexually abusing ICA therefore he killed Caylee.
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No one said George is the killer, not yet. I don't think they will go with that. I am saying, once again, that Baez is gong to offer the excuse of sexual abuse for the 31 day delay in telling anyone. Schaeffer, wftv's spokesman for this case, thinks George is the perfect fall guy re sexual abuse as it goes right along with KCs stealing, lying and promiscuity. It does not have to go to the penalty phase and Baez does not have to admit guilt - it is simply an explanation for the 31 day delay.

I would bet money that he opens with this. He has made reference in the hearing to stress syndrome due to happenings years ago. He is going to do it, imo. And frankly, all he needs is one person on the jury who believes the sexual abuse theory and with this dysfunctional family, it is not hard to believe.

They could still go with the kidnapping and it does not have to be Zanny.
 
littlemisslegal said:
Long ago before we spent hours posting and reading every detail we could find- us websleuthers are known... for checking out other sites for info too- we posted our first thoughts. I posted long ago what if someone gave casey a dead caylee? What if she just told someone take the lil snothead, I need a break . Maybe someone told her they could get some one to adopt her , human traffic her, in the end casy gets money and has her good beautiful life she craved. She gets her tattoo, parties with no worrys, only problem she has it what the heck can she tell cindy , george when they ask for caylee? So she avoids them, lies, she already had a nanny story so maybe she thinks- yeah - that nanny has her and will not give her back to me cause she fell in love with her. Then she thinks - no- the nanny stole her. that sounds good. Maybe at that time caylee was alive. MAYBE SHE WAS DEAD BY ACCIDENT. IN THE BEGINING I THINK I REMEMBER CASEY SAYING SHE WAS AFRAID OF WHAT CINDY WOULD SAY OR DO. If casey gave someone caylee and she had given her something to make her sleepy and got a call - hey the kid will not wake up- shes dead - the lies must begin. If she herself found caylee dead, forgot her in car, heat, drugs, medicine, add other ways pool , anger she must act as if caylee is alive. party. so far everyone believes caylee is ok. If someone or herself found caylee dead- she had to get rid of her. the lies are a whole other story as we know she does that well. I just wonder if in the end jose will finally say when the truth comes out you will understand. I really think casey did not actually murder her but did contribute to the death by being able to do something that made caylee die by accident. yes, it was her fault or someone elses but then she or someone else had to dump her. the story begins- who what when where why. some we know- some we only guess. If we try to seperate how caylee died from caseys reactions., non reactions. lies and behavior we may have a better way to keep it all in seperate issues. maybe some of it will come into place of the truth. no one can outdo caseys lies- do not even t ry to figure out why. Somewere in the lies is a reason. she thinks no one will think she lies AND THAT IS SCAREY IN ITSELF.
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Wouldn't that make KC guilty of child neglect that lead to the death of her child. Would she be any less guilty? No matter what the spin will be for defense it will not go well for KC in the end. We all know that. Caylee did not cause her own death, her mother did. Trying to blame someone else, most people feel sympathy for the one accused. This was a child, not an adult, so feeling will run deep within the jury panel and they'll be thinking if I knew her, she could be accusing me. In the end it all comes back to KC. jmo
 
Snaz said:
Respectfully BBM

I can see them trying this defense, however, since Lee can testify to the the statements made by Cindy to ICA that Caylee was HER mistake, the best mistake, but a mistake nonetheless, I can't see this working.

Being raped would not have been HER mistake.

JMHO
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Snaz, With all due respect . . . . Rape Victims typically blame themselves for the violent act. (If only I didn't: wear that outfit, drink too much, trust this guy, say no, listen to my inner voice, listen to my Mom/Friend/etc, go to that location, lead him on, answer that ad, look so cute, etc . . . . . on and on).

This is one of the biggest reasons victims do not come forward and pursue charges against the perp. They feel responsible in some way for allowing themselves to be taken advantage of.

I absolutely agree with you that it is never a rape victims mistake/fault - however that is not typically the victims view, and sadly - for most of the general public as we often blame female victims for somehow bringing on the act of rape. Tragically, rape is an act of violence/rage/power and control over someone else.
 
LambChop said:
Wouldn't that make KC guilty of child neglect that lead to the death of her child. Would she be any less guilty? No matter what the spin will be for defense it will not go well for KC in the end. We all know that. Caylee did not cause her own death, her mother did. Trying to blame someone else, most people feel sympathy for the one accused. This was a child, not an adult, so feeling will run deep within the jury panel and they'll be thinking if I knew her, she could be accusing me. In the end it all comes back to KC. jmo
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I just hope in the end they do not try and blame george .It could get very ugly if Jose tries to explain what he has been claiming- once everyone knows they will understand her. Ok- so if defense says casey is the martyr who has had to deal with being so honorable to not tell anyone who daddy is, who she is protecting, willing to spend two years in jail to cover up what? In the wildest story it will be shocking to hear explanations we wait to hear on opening . Everyone will want to know how defense can compete with state atty. Why did you wait jose- does casey like being in jail two years?
 
Solace said:
What is the Statement of Facts document? Is that something both sides have to submit before trial?
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Statement of facts is what each side will present to the potential jurors to familiarize them with the case.
(During jury selection)
 
Solace said:
\

they are going to have a hard time with the Zanny theory since Linda Kenny Baden (sp) came out and said it was a lie and she use to be on their team.
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I think they want to get rid of the zanny theory and LKB helped them at their request to go on live TV and announce she lied.
 
pip said:
I think they want to get rid of the zanny theory and LKB helped them at their request to go on live TV and announce she lied.
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I agree. Have to admit I was surprised that she came out with that. I just can't wait to hear Baez' opening statement.
 
wenwe4 said:
Snaz, With all due respect . . . . Rape Victims typically blame themselves for the violent act. (If only I didn't: wear that outfit, drink too much, trust this guy, say no, listen to my inner voice, listen to my Mom/Friend/etc, go to that location, lead him on, answer that ad, look so cute, etc . . . . . on and on).

This is one of the biggest reasons victims do not come forward and pursue charges against the perp. They feel responsible in some way for allowing themselves to be taken advantage of.

I absolutely agree with you that it is never a rape victims mistake/fault - however that is not typically the victims view, and sadly - for most of the general public as we often blame female victims for somehow bringing on the act of rape. Tragically, rape is an act of violence/rage/power and control over someone else.
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Wenwe,

Baez has so little to work with that I think he is going to come out with the most outrageous because he has so little. He has to paint her as a victim and the first way to do that is through sexual abuse, imo.
 
ZsaZsa said:
There's still that thing about going to JG's house for a shower when she didn't need one. I don't think we have heard the last of that. ICA may be stupid but she's cunning too...
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...a few hairs from his brush maybe?
But why then would she leave the door open?:waitasec:
 
nort said:
I'm with the idea that they will make it look like GA, CA, ICA & LA all could have done it. With no DNA at the scene that could be plausable. So instead of finding anyone who did it they will say reasonable doubt for ICA because a few people could have done it.
Click to expand...

ITA - the DT is going for reasonable doubt. That is all they have.
 
Whome? said:
IMHO when JB steps up to the podium with his opening statement,have a big drink handy because the majority of people who have been following this trial are going to go crazy,this board is gonna go crazy,just get ready for it,cause you know it's coming :twocents:
Click to expand...

I just hope it's not the
"The server is too busy right now try again later" :cry:
 
Solace said:
No one said George is the killer, not yet. I don't think they will go with that. I am saying, once again, that Baez is gong to offer the excuse of sexual abuse for the 31 day delay in telling anyone. Schaeffer, wftv's spokesman for this case, thinks George is the perfect fall guy re sexual abuse as it goes right along with KCs stealing, lying and promiscuity. It does not have to go to the penalty phase and Baez does not have to admit guilt - it is simply an explanation for the 31 day delay.

I would bet money that he opens with this. He has made reference in the hearing to stress syndrome due to happenings years ago. He is going to do it, imo. And frankly, all he needs is one person on the jury who believes the sexual abuse theory and with this dysfunctional family, it is not hard to believe.

They could still go with the kidnapping and it does not have to be Zanny.
Click to expand...

Okay so you are saying they are throwing in the sexual abuse just for colour then, to explain why she lied stole and partied before and after the "incident", but the actual "incident" is SODDI. Uh huh.

Okay - I'll be content if Baez floats that. sure he can implicate George, which in turn implicates Lee and Cindy and then yes, he would achieve his statement that these three are agents of the state. I'm confident JA can counter that information rather smoothly, in quite a dramatic fashion. But it will make for interesting trial press.

And it will certainly speed things along more quickly to a guilty verdict and Justice For Caylee. IMO
 
Solace said:
Wenwe,

Baez has so little to work with that I think he is going to come out with the most outrageous because he has so little. He has to paint her as a victim and the first way to do that is through sexual abuse, imo.
Click to expand...

Just so I am clear on what you believe he is going to say - he is going to say she was a victim, but really just an innocent bystander despite the strongest circumstantial evidence Bill Scheaffer has ever seen in a murder trial. That ICA is an innocent victimized bystander and it was SODDI.

Okay.:innocent:
 
Solace said:
Wenwe,

Baez has so little to work with that I think he is going to come out with the most outrageous because he has so little. He has to paint her as a victim and the first way to do that is through sexual abuse, imo.
Click to expand...

But that is not a reason for killing your child. If, in fact, KC will claim abuse CA would have to be apart of that also. She lived in the same home and for the most part controlled the household. GA pretty much worked at night and KC did not come forward with anything horrific that we have heard through her writings, almost it could have happened but I'm not sure.

If this were true wouldn't she want to stand before the jury and tell them what happened. She does not have to do it but in order for anyone to believe her, because she really does spin some whoppers, she would have to testify during the guilt phase for anyone to take it seriously. This is not a case of self defense.

I think her statements to her friends at times shows KC did not want this responsibility. In her letter from the jailhouse KC writes that Caylee was in a better place. Who says that with the death of a child? "She will never have to worry about being hurt.." now there is a profound statement, true now that Caylee has suffered the ultimate hurt of all times, her death in which she appears to have suffered by the very hand that was suppose to protect her.

Defense starts to open these doors there's a lot more behind them then just taking KC's word for it. There's a ton SA can use to discredit her accounting. They are in a corner, for sure. jmo
 
LambChop said:
But that is not a reason for killing your child. If, in fact, KC will claim abuse CA would have to be apart of that also. She lived in the same home and for the most part controlled the household. GA pretty much worked at night and KC did not come forward with anything horrific that we have heard through her writings, almost it could have happened but I'm not sure.

If this were true wouldn't she want to stand before the jury and tell them what happened. She does not have to do it but in order for anyone to believe her, because she really does spin some whoppers, she would have to testify during the guilt phase for anyone to take it seriously. This is not a case of self defense.

I think her statements to her friends at times shows KC did not want this responsibility. In her letter from the jailhouse KC writes that Caylee was in a better place. Who says that with the death of a child? "She will never have to worry about being hurt.." now there is a profound statement, true now that Caylee has suffered the ultimate hurt of all times, her death in which she appears to have suffered by the very hand that was suppose to protect her.

Defense starts to open these doors there's a lot more behind them then just taking KC's word for it. There's a ton SA can use to discredit her accounting. They are in a corner, for sure. jmo
Click to expand...

Lambchop, Baez is never going to admit that KC killed her child. Never. He is going to use sexual abuse, imo, for the delay in contacting anyone for 31 days. He is going to say she is promiscuous, steals and lies all of this goes to sexual trauma and Cindy stood by and let it happen or just denied it..

KC said before she told Cindy and Cindy called her a liar.

No one said Baez is going to admit that KC did this.

Baez needs to get some sympathy for KC and imo this is how he will do it.
 
logicalgirl said:
Just so I am clear on what you believe he is going to say - he is going to say she was a victim, but really just an innocent bystander despite the strongest circumstantial evidence Bill Scheaffer has ever seen in a murder trial. That ICA is an innocent victimized bystander and it was SODDI.

Okay.:innocent:
Click to expand...

yup, according to Schaeffer, George is the perfect fall guy.
 
logicalgirl said:
Just so I am clear on what you believe he is going to say - he is going to say she was a victim, but really just an innocent bystander despite the strongest circumstantial evidence Bill Scheaffer has ever seen in a murder trial. That ICA is an innocent victimized bystander and it was SODDI.

Okay.:innocent:
Click to expand...

I realize you take this case very seriously. But the sarcasm is unnecessary. unless you would like me to just agree with everything you say; I guess that could go on endlessly.
 
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