Match! MI - Monroe Co, WhtFem remains, 45-56, Dec'86 *Ruth Hoffman*

masnitram said:

I was looking at for Carroll Lou Viau from Ontario for an entirely different case previously. Some things fit rather well in comparison to this UID, though the circumstances of her disappearance give me the impression that the answers for her may be closer to Thunder Bay then Michigan.

What do you think?

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/744dfon.html

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I came across this lady too Masnitram and thought she looked like a good possible and it is not too huge a distance. In my humble opinion she should be considered at least.

belfastgirl73 said:

I came across this lady too Masnitram and thought she looked like a good possible and it is not too huge a distance. In my humble opinion she should be considered at least.

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I doubt that possible match. I can't figure out where the psychiatric patient from Thunder Bay, ON would wind up with a t-shirt from a Michigan bar that just happened to be 13 miles from where the body was found.

Stranger things have happened!:twocents:

webrocket said:

I doubt that possible match. I can't figure out where the psychiatric patient from Thunder Bay, ON would wind up with a t-shirt from a Michigan bar that just happened to be 13 miles from where the body was found.

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I wouldn't see it as a problem, her psychiatric patient status is pretty much irrelevant when it comes to the t-shirt IMO. If Jane Doe was Ms. Viau she might have traveled to Michigan and got the t-shirt in any of the ways non-psychiatric patients usually get theirs. Bought a souvenir, worked at a bar and got it as part of uniform (although I hope that would have been checked), got it from somewhere that sells used clothing locally etc. Salvation Army maybe? She was spotted in one before she disappeared. There is more than a year after her last date of contact in Sept 1985 and the body being found in December 1986 and the estimated postmortem interval is months which gives her time to get a t-shirt in a number of ways IMO. If she happened to have some contact to the area prior to disappearing she might even have had the t-shirt before disappearing.

According to DN she was a voluntary patient who checked herself in the psychiatric hospital for a nervous breakdown and mental confusion. They don't say how severe her situation was but the way her diagnosis is phrased it does not sound like a stable state. A nervous breakdown could be triggered by some kind of a life crisis and one can get better or be cured altogether, at least be functional enough to be able to obtain a t-shirt one way or another. Nothing too implausible required imo.

Sorry,

NO real update. I was told the investigator at the ME's office was working on it..I am going to try a different route. Any inside help would be appreciated.

Thanks

sls314 said:

I would assume that she was either local or had spent a lot of time in the area, due to the tank top with the local bar on it. This wouldn't appear to be a randomly dumped body from another area.

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My thought on the tank top is the later, that she wouldn't be local. Perhaps it was more like a "souvenir" of her time in the area. IMO, even though this was for a bar, it would make more sense for a non-local to purchase it than a local. This also would make more sense as to why she hasn't been identified more quickly since this took place in 1986.

More info on Ruth here: http://www.michigandoes.com/MP/RuthHoffman.html

mtrooper said:

Sorry,

NO real update. I was told the investigator at the ME's office was working on it..I am going to try a different route. Any inside help would be appreciated.

Thanks

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I have noticed with many of the Michigan cases, it lists ME as the reporting agency. Is that correct, that is abbreviation for Maine? Just curious, just thought if it is listed wrong, it somehow could be causing problems for multiple cases.

ginestra said:

I have noticed with many of the Michigan cases, it lists ME as the reporting agency. Is that correct, that is abbreviation for Maine? Just curious, just thought if it is listed wrong, it somehow could be causing problems for multiple cases.

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ME = Medical Examiner or the Coroner

How embarassing!! Ok, now I know..........

mtrooper said:

I am thinking this is Ruth Hoffman. Still waiting to hear back from LE.

https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/821/4/

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And it's official... This Doe was Ruth Hoffman.

Snip:

"Ruth Hoffman, who went missing out of River Rouge in June 1986, was identified last month using DNA. Acting Sgt. Jeff Pauli of the Monroe County Sheriff’s Office said Hoffman’s remains were found in that county in December 1986."

http://www.freep.com/article/20130906/NEWS06/309060023/Missing-Michigan-DNA

had anyone from here submitted Ruth?

webrocket said:

had anyone from here submitted Ruth?

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mtrooper did in 2011

webrocket said:

had anyone from here submitted Ruth?

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I submitted it back in 2011, just couldn't get an answer until DNA was complete and family was notified.

then do we have a match? well done mtrooper!

webrocket said:

then do we have a match? well done mtrooper!

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Yes it was match. I feel so bad for Ruth and her family, I wish the outcome would have been more positive. Now all we can do is hope that the person or persons responsible for this tragedy will be brought to justice. RIP Ruth

Prayers for Ruths family. Well done mtrooper

mtrooper, many, many thanks for helping to return Ms. Hoffman to her family.

The Doe Network case files for the unidentified (792UFMI) and the missing person, Ms. Hoffman (1690DFMI), are still up and the NamUs entries (UP # 8380, MP # 821) are still in Google cache. List of some differences, which are exceedingly common, especially in older cases:

UID (792UFMI): Estimated age: 45-56 years old
MP (Ruth Sharon Hoffman, 1690DFMI): Age: 44 years old

UID: Approximate height: 5' 3" (63 inches)
MP: Height: 5' 6" (66 inches) [Doe Network], 5' 7" (67 inches) [NamUs]

UID: Hair: brown
MP: Hair: blonde [Doe Network], blond/strawberry (sometimes worn red) [NamUs]

UID: Clothing: "Clothing associated with the body included a black silk tank top with 'GOLDEN EAGLE BAR' Sumpter, MI printed on it. She also had black with grey pinstriped jogging shorts on and a pair of flat black strappy sandles with ankle straps."
MP: Clothing: "Red, small sized half top, cropped with bare midriff, Gloria Vanderbilt blue jeans (size 9), White Nike tennis shoes, Brown leather coat; mid-length. She was also carrying a brown leather purse, with a saddle bag style flap over center zipper."

UID: Other: "Staining on the palate of the denture is consistent with excessive smoking."
MP: Other: "Ruth is a nonsmoker; she very rarely drank alcohol." [Doe Network; but note in the missing person Websleuths thread for Ms. Hoffman, her daughter states that Ms. Hoffman did smoke daily and drank occasionally.]

The things that matched — timing of disappearance vs. remains recovery, the upper dentures, possible orofacial injury, approximate age, etc. — were more significant than the discrepancies, as mtrooper obviously knew.

Ms. Hoffman's missing person thread, started by her daughter, is long but worth a look. It's unfortunately a pretty clear reminder of the roadblocks that family and friends of missing persons face. Ms. Hoffman's daughter had to refile long after her mother's disappearance and states that she was told at one point that her mother had closed her own missing persons report in 2004.

Found Deceased MI - Ruth Hoffman: My Mom!, 44, River Rouge, 7 July 1986 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Congrats Mtrooper! I hope Ruth's family has some closure now..

Great job, mtrooper! :highfive:

:rose: May Ruth's family have peace as they deal with this final chapter :rose: