Deaths of Male College Students-General Discussion #6

As of today, it is still an open investigation. Although right now it seems to be just an accident, there are still lots of unanswered questions but hopefully in time we will all know the root cause of this.


Thank you pittsburghgirl. You know I felt bad about posting a while after I did, because I realized that all of the local news didn't have him id'd. I thought, just maybe, her friends had jumped the gun, and it would turn out not to be him. But I see this evening, they did make a positive id. :(

I'm going to wait a few days to see what comes up. It's an open investigation and they still have to do the autopsy. My daughter is scheduled to go out of town tomorrow, so she most likely won't know anything further until after she returns.

I'll watch and see if anything comes in the news. The problem in California, is there are so many people, something like this doesn't get much press. I didn't even know he was missing until my daughter called me today when they'd already found him.

She actually called me because she knew about these cases. I told her I'd search around and see if I can find out anything.

So far, it just looks like he went out with a group of friends to celebrate his g/f's bday. My daughter said she's not sure what happened because, from what she's been told, the stories don't match or are confusing.

Do these kids really go out in groups and get so wasted they don't remember what happened? I seriously never thought that could REALLY happen. I hope none of them did something stupid.

I know his family is devastated. I can't even imagine being confronted with such a loss. So young and so much promise.

What a shame.
fran

PS....I'm grateful they at least found him. To be faced with the 'not knowing' would be much worse.....fran :(
 
I read this book years ago. The original printing I think was 1987; [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Ultimate-Evil-Truth-Murders-Beyond/dp/0760713936/ref=sr_1_3?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1302657286&sr=1-3"]Amazon.com: The Ultimate Evil : The Truth about the Cult Murders: Son of Sam and Beyond (9780760713938): Maury Terry, Illustrated with Photographs: Books[/ame]

The book is about the Son of Sam murders but the author believes that David Berkowitz was the fall guy for a satanic cult he belonged to. The author makes a good argument in linking a killing in SF in the 60's to this group to. I was thinking about this book the other day and wondered if this group could be responsible for the college kids.

[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Berkowitz[/ame]

Son of Sam case reopened based on cult claims

Journalist Maury Terry began investigating the Son of Sam shootings before Berkowitz was arrested. He noted a number of unresolved questions and inconsistencies which called into question the lone-shooter theory favored by police. Further investigation, including several interviews with Berkowitz himself, uncovered evidence supporting the involvement of a violent offshoot of the Process Church in the Son of Sam murders, and other crimes. In one televised interview in 1977, Berkowitz specifically named John and Michael Carr, the sons of his neighbor Sam Carr (and therefore, quite literally, sons of Sam) as two of the other "Son of Sam" shooters.[44][45]

After consulting with police and agreeing to withhold some names and other details, Terry published his conclusions in a series of newspaper articles distributed by the Gannett syndicate in 1979, and later in his book, The Ultimate Evil, which has been expanded several times since its initial 1987 publication.[37] Queens District Attorney John Santucci reportedly reopened the Son of Sam case in 1996, but no new charges were filed.[46]
...
 
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/fr/740408/posts


...David Berkowitz, a then 24 year-old Yonkers postal worker, readily confessed to a year-long rampage of eight shooting attacks in Queens, the Bronx and Brooklyn. The attacks left a toll of six young people dead and seven others wounded. Berkowitz pleaded guilty, never going to trial, and was sentenced to life.

But in a stunning reversal in 1997, Berkowitz told Eyewitness News producer Maury Terry that he had other partners in crime, saying it was a murder conspiracy. Berkowitz said the conspiracy began with satanic meetings at Untermeyer Park in Yonkers.

David Berkowitz, Convicted Killer (1997): "I mean, this was not just something they were doing for any type of, necessarily, pleasure, but that it was just part of an agenda. A very deep, covert and hidden agenda. You know, they were about making war, and they were about bringing some chaos into the world."

And what better way to create chaos, Berkowitz told us, then to slay the symbol of America's future: Bright young people in middle-class neighborhoods throughout the city. Berkowitz readily admits he pulled the trigger in two of the attacks, including the murder of Donna Lauria. ...
 
I have question. Have the detectives stopped working on this case? I haven't heard any new news about it in a while. In fact the last news I heard was that they were going to release some more info, but they never did. Did they ever explain that?
 
Can anyone help, I am trying to find the website of lists of missing men that later turn up dead in a river? its a huge list, sorry if its vague, I had it on my 'favorites' but laptop played up and lost all my favorites. I think its the same river for all deaths.
 
I have question. Have the detectives stopped working on this case? I haven't heard any new news about it in a while. In fact the last news I heard was that they were going to release some more info, but they never did. Did they ever explain that?



I don't think they ever explained that. I'm sure Kristi Piehl would have written an article about it if they had(sfkillers.com). I would love to hear more from them...maybe a follow up of some sort.
I know Kristi was working with Josh Szostak's father,whom I believe is a retired cop. Josh Szostak was caught on surveilance tape leaving a bar while staggering around ripping his clothes off before stumbling out of view of the camera...months later he is found dead in Hudson River. possibly drugged?
Link to video of Josh:
http://sfkillers.com/?p=603

copied & pasted from above link:

Josh Szostak spent the evening of December 22nd, 2007 celebrating a friend’s birthday. He was laughing and talking inside the Bayou Cafe . None of Josh’s friends can explain what happened shortly after midnight or why Josh and a friend went outside. After a few seconds outside, the friend returns to the bar and Josh stays outside.

Was Josh drugged? You decide. Click here to watch the video recorded by a surveillance camera mounted across the street.

** watch the timer in the upper right hand corner of the screen

00:08:35 – Josh walks out.

00:10:06 – Josh is standing on the sidewalk in the lower left hand portion of the screen. He doubles over.

00:10:22 – Josh takes off his sweatshirt and shirt.

00:11:34 – Josh walks away from the bar.

Josh’s car was parked near the apartment where he planned to spend the night. A camera (300 feet south) at 67 N. Pearl Street records Josh alone – standing, looking around. He staggers and walks out of view. Josh is not seen on any other surveillance cameras (a police report verifies this). The Hudson River is 2 miles in the opposite direction. His body was recovered from the Hudson in April 2008.
 
As Kelly Catalano's niece I would like to thank you for pointing out the "drownings" of woman in VA. Kelly is not the only one. Jill Edmonds and at least 4 other woman went missing all within a month of each other all around water. Kelly and Jills deaths were ruled "Suicide by drowning" as I have a copy of Kellys autopsy There is no evidence of suicide or drowning. When speaking to the coroner they ruled it "dry drowning" LE ruled it suicide. After speaking to Jill Emonds family her death was ruled "Suicide by Drowning" but there were no lungs in Jills body and lower 1/2 of her body wasnt present with no internal organs. lower part of body was found in different area from upper part. I just cant think either one of these deaths could be suicide.


So many interesting things people are pointing out, kudos to everyone. cherish is there more info on that possible survivor?

Does any one have a list of drownings/suspicious bodies found in Virginia?

I know there is a current VCU student missing, belongings found by the James River (Jonathan Dorey) I can think of a guy who was found in a water way connected to the James River a couple years ago but I can't find a link.

I've always been suspicious of the tons of "accidental drowning" incidents that are written off as such. I've always thought something was fishy and people use it as a way to cover up a crime. Can forensics see if the person died from actual drowning as opposed to asphyxiation prior to being submerged in water or does water seep in anyway even if not inhaled from actual drowning? Do stun gun tasers usually not leave marks? I imagine if needles or drugs/poison are involved it isn't tested for in all these "drowning" cases. If being drunk is blamed are these peoples blood alcohol level tested?

I came across this site and the smiley face murders theory by accident but it confirmed feelings I had about the numerous "drownings".

I wanted to throw this stuff out here, I see this is focused around young white college men, could the reason for it being a lot of college males leaving parties and bars be this smiley face group consists of current college students/frat members/alumni (connected nationwide by some group allegiance and or internet)? Could they possibly be doing this to more than just college aged white men leaving parties and bars and look for opportunities elsewhere when possible?

I say this because I don't want people to over look the other shady drownings like recently here in Virginia within days of each other two older men (Ferdinand Nathaniel Jr., Ernest Gay Brooker Jr.) were found in rivers with their cars on bridges. Also a missing woman (Kelly Catalano) was found in the river recently. Also in search I found tons of "accidental drownings" nationwide and in Canada and not every one was fitting this college aged drunken white male description but they still seem suspicious in a lot cases but are still written off as nothing.

For instance the case of Oil Executive Douglas Schantz found in the Mississippi River after leaving a bar, fits part of the scenario but he is much older although some what younger looking. Another instance is this case of 29 year old William Henry Blankenship "last seen at the southern West Virginia Community and Technical College Campus in Williamson." found in the Tug Fork of the Big Sandy River.

I just wanted to have an open mind about it and not be stuck on only white college students who are drunk and found drowned being that is what mainly ties the "isolated" incidents together. Like I said maybe the bulk of them are white college students because that is who is most accessible to them in their areas since the smiley faced gang are possibly college students/alumni themselves. The smiley faced gang if real can't make victims they would have to hunt out and wait for people to be alone, drunk or in a weakened state of some sort so I would think any one is game for them it's just the opportunity arises more so with drunken college guys.

One thing is for sure I wish LE would not be so willing to easily write off a lot of these nationwide "suicides/drownings" no matter the case, people are possibly getting away with "the perfect murder".

Sorry for my first post being an essay. Also are there more photos than just the one red smiley face? I am into Graffiti and would like to look at these so called names written and such. I seen the photos in the picture thread and the one red smiley face looks weird but the other photo of the graffiti tags look more like random kids graffiti with poor style and a smiley face added.
 
Discussions
River drownings in France similar to Austin Bice case (karma: 2) en>fr fr>en
By JeanValette Comments: 47549, member since Sat Mar 15, 2003
On Tue Mar 15, 2011 12:29 AM
River drownings in France similar to Austin Bice case

Posted: Mar 14, 2011 8:06 PM EDT

Austin Bice death raises troubling questions

Disappearances in Lille - La Voix Du Nord

French deaths eerily similar to Bice case

By David Gotfredson

SAN DIEGO, Calif. (CBS 8) -- A series of river drownings in northern France is raising questions in the death of San Diego State University student Austin Bice in Madrid, Spain.

Bice's death is strangely similar to three recent, mysterious disappearances and deaths in Lille, France.

In the French cases, the victims were young men, whose bodies were found days later in the Deule River.

Like Bice, the three young victims had been drinking and were last known to be walking home alone through the city.

Bice, 22, disappeared last month after being refused entry to the La Riviera nightclub in Madrid. He told a friend he would walk home alone. His body was found ten days later in the nearby Manzanares River.

In Lille, France, 33-year-old John Ani disappeared Oct. 7, 2010 after a night of drinking. His body was found Oct. 11, 2010 in the Deule River. Toxicology testing confirmed alcohol and drugs in his system, according to French media reports.

On Feb. 5, Thomas Ducroo, age 26, disappeared while walking home and turned up dead in the same river Feb. 23. Toxicology tests also confirmed drugs and alcohol in body tissues, media reports said.

And, on Feb. 21, Jean-Meriadec Le Tarnec, 22, also went missing. Scuba divers located his body in the Deule River on Feb. 25. Toxicology results are not yet in.

Last week, an estimated 800 protesters marched along the river banks in Lille demanding answers in the mysterious deaths.

Autopsies concluded the deaths were accidental drownings but family members do not believe it.

Posters in the town of Lille now warn students to watch out for a killer nicknamed "Jack the Pusher."

San Diego journalist Joel Siegfried wrote a series of reports for the online Examiner web site, in which he compared the drownings in France to the death of Austin Bice.

"It is highly unusual to have so many accidental drownings turn up that are not related to people who have been out on the water boating or swimming," Siegfried said.

Siegfried said the cold weather in Lille, France in the fall and winter makes it unlikely the young men who died there went into the water voluntarily.

A fourth body pulled out of a different stretch of the Deule River last week was a female who has not been identified.

Another young man, Charles Quemin, 19, went missing Sep. 2, 2009 after arguing with friends at a bar in Lille. He left by himself and was found dead in the Deule River on Feb. 21, 2010, according to the La Voix Du Nord news web site.

Madrid is more than 900 miles south of Lille by road; about a 14-hour drive.

Austin Bice went missing on Feb. 26, during a week-long "ski holiday" in Lille, when many residents travel out of the city, said Siegfried.

"It just adds to the suspicion because during this time there might have been movement of people from Lille to Spain or elsewhere in Europe," Siegfried said.

Over the past two years, the bodies of several other young males have been found in various waterways throughout France, according to Siegfried.

So far, police have made no connection between any of the cases, as they continue to wait for toxicology tests to come back on the body of Austin Bice.

www.cbs8.com . . .
 
Hi all-I am new to this case and I can not stop thinking about it.I have read a lot about it and think there is a connection to most of them.I have not read through all the post here,so if this has been discuss please forgive me..i think the most important clue we have
in this case-is the Josh Szostak video outside the bar he went missing from.you can tell he is being watched by at least 4 different people 2 girls and 2 guys.
I am trying to find the video of the young man who went missing from the Ugly Tuna Bar who was last seen on the escalators talking to 2 girls,his name escapes now,but I think he was a pre-med student.If anyone knows where I can watch it-I would appreciate it.
I find it hard to believe LE and the FBI do not see a connection with this cases,its really clear to me.. at least.
 
I don't mean to be pushy-but we need to get this thread going again!! I have read all the links for the past week and it seems,no one is talking about this case anymore since 2010 that I can see....There is a connection to these murders and I do not understand why the LE and FBI do not see it..If we can get this thread going and put pressure on them,just maybe one of you great sleuthers will bring the clue to crack this case wide open...lets start with the JS video and Brian S video when he is at the Ugly Tuna talkin with the 2 girls on the esculators- can anyone make a connection with the 2 girls in both videos?They are hard to see,that is why I ask if anyone can see anything that might bring them together.I can not get this case off my mind,my DH thinks I am crazy..There has to be something that ties all of these cases together that we are missing...WHAT IS It???
 
We have 2 more missing young men..James Slack is missing from Pitts,Pa Dec 6 from a concert and Matt Huszar went missing from Canada on Dec 16 from a Christmas party at a pub..both areas have water located around them..I am worried about both of these young men..
I am also worried with New Years coming up,seems like several young men went missing on that day in the past!!
 
We have 2 more missing young men..James Slack is missing from Pitts,Pa Dec 6 from a concert and Matt Huszar went missing from Canada on Dec 16 from a Christmas party at a pub..both areas have water located around them..I am worried about both of these young men..
I am also worried with New Years coming up,seems like several young men went missing on that day in the past!!



IMO,I think James Slack could be a potential victim. I mean,all these "disappearances" of these young men and then eventual recoveries of their bodies in water....to me it seems like someone(or group of people) is targeting a specific group.

Why isn't this getting more attention? I guess people are unwilling to accept anything other than alcohol as the culprit.

And,yes,it seems like there are certain times of the year where these young men will vanish.

I wish more people would actually research this.

@SyraKelly

Here is a link to a transcript of a town hall meeting(it was actually televised on their local channel too) that was held to address all the unusual "drownings" in LaCrosse,WI...included in them was the case of Jared Dion.

Please read this. I was shocked at everything I read. The people know there is a problem. This link is more than a transcript,it was written by a professor
Well worth the read. I think the quotes from the townhall meeting start around page 10 or so...

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&...ZTg4My00ODk2LTgyMTktYzg2NmYyOGI3MTBk&hl=en_US

I hopes this link works.
 
IMO,I think James Slack could be a potential victim. I mean,all these "disappearances" of these young men and then eventual recoveries of their bodies in water....to me it seems like someone(or group of people) is targeting a specific group.

Why isn't this getting more attention? I guess people are unwilling to accept anything other than alcohol as the culprit.

And,yes,it seems like there are certain times of the year where these young men will vanish.

I wish more people would actually research this.

@SyraKelly

Here is a link to a transcript of a town hall meeting(it was actually televised on their local channel too) that was held to address all the unusual "drownings" in LaCrosse,WI...included in them was the case of Jared Dion.

Please read this. I was shocked at everything I read. The people know there is a problem. This link is more than a transcript,it was written by a professor
Well worth the read. I think the quotes from the townhall meeting start around page 10 or so...

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&...ZTg4My00ODk2LTgyMTktYzg2NmYyOGI3MTBk&hl=en_US

I hopes this link works.

It works for me.

I'd like to see a graph of alcohol related drowning deaths going back til around 1940 to see if there is a sustained dramatic spike beginning within the last several years. JMO
 
3 known wrestlers from Wisconsin: Jared Dion & Craig Meyers from La Crosse,Ricardo Gonzalez from Eau Claire

3 from Iowa: Abel Bolanos & Jacob Hobson from Ames,Matt Kruzinski(sp?) from East Dubuque

Scott Radel from St. Cloud,MN

Christopher Olberding from Cincinatti,OH

Keith O'Donnell from Ithaca,NY

Jordan Andrulonis from Dubois,PA

Greg Hart from Providence,RI



////////////////////////////


This was a list I found online about potential victims. It seems many of these young men were wrestlers.

Coincidence?

IMO,I don't think so.

I think a certain type is being targeted...a certain physical type.
 
vanceholmes.com/court/trial_missing_2.html

There is a lot of info on Jared here and lots of other info as well.
 
I agree Auburn,a certain type is being stalked,I use that term b/c I firmly believe this men are what the killer/killers is looking for..Someone mention maybe a fight club,where they have to fight their way out,that was a theory in the Canada disappearances,but it can't be the deaths here in US b/c all the bodies show no trauma,but what if they have to wrestle their way out,but never make it out and they are just killed b/c they were kidnapped in the first place.KWIM..I am not a expert on wrestling,but does it leave any marks or bruises on a body?I have been trying to figure out how are the killer/killers picking their victims.Facebook/myspace, are they going to campus bars and hanging out looking for a certain type and stalking them when they leave,are they paying girls to talk with this guys and get info if they are wrestlers.I do think they are being drugged and followed when they leave the bars,some of the guys that have been killed are big guys,so it has to be more than one person to get a big guy in a car or Van.I really thing you are on to something with several of them being wrestlers..I think we are dealing with a nation wide fight club and maybe the internet is a way to keep score..I don't know..but I really feel James Slack is one of this gangs victims.What do you all think..I know its out there!!!!
Auburn-thanks for that link..very interesting read..good find!!
 
I think a certain type is being targeted...a certain physical type.
Yes, and I think it might have to do with pure practicality more than anything. That is, if these men are being drugged with some sort of substance (like GHB, which has been found in some victims) the ones doing the drugging have to make sure the dose is right and corresponds with the victim's body weight and such. So they just pick victims with virtually the same build every time - less work for them. Or maybe not. It's just that I don't see a clear M.O. here. It's been theorized by different people that this is the work of anti-Christians, or men-hating feminists, or some group of disenfranchised outsiders/"geeks" taking vengeance on their physically fit, socially successful male peers. But if any of those were the case, I would think the perps would want it to be known these were murders. We might get some clear messages, some letters sent. Politically motivated crimes usually have that kind of vocal, boastful quality by the perps. If the Unabomber never wrote a word to go along with his bombs no one would have a clue what was going on.

Anyway, more generally. I think what's difficult about these cases is that because it's so under-investigated, because we know so little, it's easy to classify some deaths as being related when they might not be at all.

A lot of the cases in WI, MN, IA, IL, etc. seem connected, especially when you've got guys disappearing from the same bar. But to connect ones from CA or NY or PA... we'd have to assume either a very prolific serial killer team, or some sort of inconceivably devious government/CIA involvement like that which was theorized on another thread here.

Let's start simple, though. Occam's razor. What these cases need is a thorough examination from the very beginning, focusing on the most suspect ones, like Chris Jenkins or all the ones from La Crosse. If the victim didn't disappear from a bar, after being suspiciously separated from friends or in other strange circumstances, tentatively rule it out. Rule out anything outside of the Midwest, at least for now. Look at the dates of disappearance. If any happen on the same night, in different states, rule out (for now) the less suspect one. While I'm interested by the idea that this is some sort of extraordinarily elaborate cross-country crime, it just isn't the most likely.

More likely is that a good number of these are accidents, but there is also a killer/team of killers operating within a fairly specific tri- or quad-state area clustered by the Mississippi who are conveniently disguising their murders as accidents.

The M.O. for all this is still very mysterious, of course - no indication of sexual sadism, usually no marks left on the victim's bodies, etc. But look at, of all criminals, the Zodiac killer. There's a person who showed little interest in doing anything to his victims other than killing them - collecting "slaves" for his afterlife, as he said. Perhaps we are looking at something somewhat similar here. The crucial difference is that the Zodiac craved attention, needing to write the papers to not only confirm himself as the murderer but to taunt, threaten and baffle LE and the general public for decades to come. By contrast, the whole name of the game with these river murders is, well, to make them not look like murders at all... let alone calling in to report them immediately after, or writing the Chronicle with a series of cryptic ciphers.

By the way, does anybody know what happened to http://smileyfacemurders.com/?
It's been down for a while, marked private, and I have no idea how one would get in now without some prior authorization by the site owner. I hope he/she is just doing some site renovations or something. That site is one of the very few frequently updated resources on the web about these cases, and I'd hate to see it gone.
 

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