Weekend Discussion thread 04/21-24/2012

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JMO
my last post on this issue...I understand that many a thief has forgotten about a camera but what I am saying is IF they were so particular after the crime to cover their steps..ie: toss the clothing...wash the car...lose a car seat...etc. etc. why not be concerned at the start to cover their tracks... doesn't make sense to me at all...JMO and now I have stated all I want and from this debate I will move on....respectfully....

no doubt there was a point that either one of them might have wished after the crime they had wiggled their butts up a few poles and pulled down some of those cameras while disposing of some evidence over the initial weeks after; but I could be wrong JMO

also since the cameras DID catch them in the act; was anyone else seen taking her? It does seem strange I agree; yet, there TLM is leading her away, there the two are at the HD, there is MTR pings at the scene. And there it is, TS DNA in his car and blood. AND yet there it is MTR lying to LE. And yet there it is, all the funky stuff he did after to deceive. Yes it is hard to believe he would do this crime or TLM would do this crime in front of cameras but yet the video is there.

I wonder what the stats are on people incarcerated for crime who had video evidence presented against them at trial. I wonder how many of them groan when they think of those cameras as they serve those sentences. JMO

JMO
 
Yes but the driver was driving fine with what looks like the window down in the Esso which someone posted yesterday it was to believed that VS was in the car at the Esso. Also TLM and MR (if they didn't know VS) would have to assume a child that was just kidnapped into an unknown car would kick and scream to get out. TLM in the the front seat just makes me think all the more VS knew one of them. JMO Unless a 3rd person???

It could be Tori wasn't kicking and screaming. Didn't TLM say Tori asked to go home, and she promised to not tell anyone. It sounds to me that she was scared quiet. Had Tori started kicking and screaming, I believe it would have been a whole different scenario. I think they knew at this point that they could get away with making the stops along the way.
 
It could be Tori wasn't kicking and screaming. Didn't TLM say Tori asked to go home, and she promised to not tell anyone. It sounds to me that she was scared quiet. Had Tori started kicking and screaming, I believe it would have been a whole different scenario. I think they knew at this point that they could get away with making the stops along the way.

My point was that TLM and MR had to assume that a kidnapped child would kick and scream but TLM seem to have no problem going around to the driver seat for the kidnapping ride. Even if VS was (froze to try and run) How was TLM and MR to be reasured that at some point in the ride to guelph etc that VS wouldn't try to open the door and run? Which is why I believe VS knew one of them.
 
It's going to be a long drawn out boring half of the trial. It's all going to be about how great mtr is and how crazy TLM was. The music from Necro will be brought up AGAIN as well as all the damning things she said during her testimony. I am curious however to hear from witnesses on his side however it won't change my mind because he is just as guilty. I don't even really want to listen to all the bs that Derstine is going to throw out there. Mr is a coward and in the end if justice doesn't prevail karma will. Jmo

God I hope they don't bring this Necro crap back up again. I as well think the defense's side will be all about blaming TLM. I think that would be a big mistake tho. He should use his time to explain all the circumstatial evidence the crown has against his client.

BTW, I found a really good site on law issues in canada that may interest some of you:

http://www.duhaime.org/LegalResources/CriminalLaw/LawArticle-205/Murder.aspx
 
My point was that TLM and MR had to assume that a kidnapped child would kick and scream but TLM seem to have no problem going around to the driver seat for the kidnapping ride. Even id VS was (froze to try and run) How was TLM and MR to be reasured that at some point in the ride to guelph etc that VS wouldn't try to open the door and run? Which is why I believe VS knew one of them.

I understand what you're saying. I just don't get that feeling. I think they just happened to "luck" out that they came upon a child they were able to scare into submissiveness. It would only take seconds for a child to look in a car door for a dog, be pushed in, held by another person while the first ran around to the other side of the car, and then take off.

I think that had Tori been kicking and screaming, they would have taken off out of town immediately to a more remote location and would have had the same outcome. The whole act may have taken much less time in that case, but I believe they took their time because they could.
 
Jezebel......If I could be so bold as to ask......

Since you were actually there, and all we are reading is tweets etc........did you get the feeling during her testimony.............

Did TLM look at the Crown and defense when they were asking her questions?

Did she appear "stuck for an answer" at times and start sobbing, wiping away tears or ask for a recess?

Or was her testimony as smooth as would be expected under the circumstances?

Just wondering.......because the tweets tell us nothing about that.

I also wonder.......and odd question I know..........

What do you think would have been her reaction, had you got up from your seat, walked right up to her and stuck your face in her face, and told her you didn't believe her and she was a liar?

Any thoughts?

JMO.................

Ardy, I am going to come back to this question in a bit, well actually on my lunch where I will have time to sit and write a proper answer for you :)
 
I bet MR mother will take the stand saying back seat was out of car on April 8th and before that date. JMO

wouldn't surprise me if she does or doesn't testify, what a dilemma for a parent. JMO
 
Yes but the driver was driving fine with what looks like the window down in the Esso which someone posted yesterday it was to believed that VS was in the car at the Esso. Also TLM and MR (if they didn't know VS) would have to assume a child that was just kidnapped into an unknown car would kick and scream to get out. TLM in the the front seat just makes me think all the more VS knew one of them. JMO Unless a 3rd person???

The video of him at Esso was approx 3.20pm I believe, so Tori would not have been in the car at that point.
 
does anyone have the ws list of christie blanchford reports? saw it once posted with all the links to her reports
 
wouldn't surprise me if she does or doesn't testify, what a dilemma for a parent. JMO

It would be tough on a parent, but to lie would be perjury.......and not respectful of VS.

MR was 28 and responsible for his own actions..........at some point you have to let go.

JMO..............
 
If there was a ban, the Crown would still be able to ask, the media would just not be allowed to report.

So it's possible that we're not hearing everything? There seems to be many holes and unasked questions that I am really curious if there is something the jury is hearing but we are not.
 
It would be tough on a parent, but to lie would be perjury.......and not respectful of VS.

MR was 28 and responsible for his own actions..........at some point you have to let go.

JMO..............

Well MR mother was not a witness for the crown that the seat was intact so i am assuming she would be the defence witness that the seat was out of the car. JMO Opps was responding to what i thought was a post i posted about this earlier sorry.
 
..IMO a terrible deed was commited MURDER of an innocent 9 year old who was left for 3 mths in an undigified manner ...naked from the waist down and wrapped in GARBAGE BAGs and under pile of heavy rocks in a secluded farm area ...chances of being found slim!........ I do believe she was also RAPED ..as tough as this is to TYPE...IMO again! ....I feel strongly IMO that the evidense is CLEAR that MR was INVOLVED! ... it is clearly shown him driving his car after tori was ABUCTED ... so I MUST say I am PUZZLED as to why there are so many opinions that HE MAY not be guilty ...Imo I am having a very hard time reading this now....Yes I know the defense has not presented their case ...BUt ...IMO only>>> How can they possibly get him off ....???...He is ON VIDEO in numerous locations on that horrid day ...April 8 , 2009....again this in my opinion and yes I do understand MANY MAY have conflicting views and so be it .....But when someone is CLearly on Video ...kind of a no brainer IMO ...Plus he had 3 mths to get rid of the evidence( which he tried very hard to do..)if so much time did not lapse after the MURDER ... I am confident that we would have Little LEFT DOUBT in all of our minds more percisely what had occured ! ...thanks robynhood...I do respect others opposing views we all have the freedom in Canada to do have different views .BUT it all seems very concrete IMO again...I guess soon we will hear the defense's side ...and sure they are INTITLED to do this ...just hope it is NOT the same OLD BS about how bad a person TLM is and her music taste as IMO ...this holds very little crediablity ...especially her music ..OMG...hold on to your hats as I am Not looking forward to their side ....I think Tori's family has been thru the worst nightmare any Parent could face ....IMO I feel the TORI LAW needs to be looked at as crimes against children in our nation seems to growing terribly! ......especially by young offenders i ....Please listen closely was commented made ...and yes I do want to hear it explained as the defense indicated before the TRIAL that>>> something like...do not make judgements till you hear our side ....well all ears ...Mr. Defense!...robynhood...I stress again this is just IMO again!..robynhood
 
I think he threw TM's name around in the LE interview because he observed just how vilified TM was in the press and online. People really thought TM had something to do with Tori's disappearance, and, imo, he exploited that. He used that to try and get LE off his trail.

imo

Actually, I thought MR started thowing TM's name around BEFORE it hit the press? I could be wrong about that. I just thought it was very interesting that he knew about her from the bar and knew she was into the drug scene but he "was one of the good guys."

Salem
 
JMO
my last post on this issue...I understand that many a thief has forgotten about a camera but what I am saying is IF they were so particular after the crime to cover their steps..ie: toss the clothing...wash the car...lose a car seat...etc. etc. why not be concerned at the start to cover their tracks... doesn't make sense to me at all...JMO and now I have stated all I want and from this debate I will move on....respectfully....

I would say that there are no perfect crimes and that is why MR is in the situation he is in right now. His past is catching up with him--he doesn't seem capable of doing anything perfectly--he has left a trail like a catipillar--that why he is in jail.

I firmly believe that TLM and MR acted TOGETHER in this crime against Torie from beginning to end.
 
Actually, I thought MR started thowing TM's name around BEFORE it hit the press? I could be wrong about that. I just thought it was very interesting that he knew about her from the bar and knew she was into the drug scene but he "was one of the good guys."

Salem

Did MR state he knew her from this bar in his interview? I thought that was just internet gossip that she "hung around" there?
 
..IMO a terrible deed was commited MURDER of an innocent 9 year old who was left for 3 mths in an undigified manner ...naked from the waist down and wrapped in GARBAGE BAGs and under pile of heavy rocks in a secluded farm area ...chances of being found slim!........ I do believe she was also RAPED ..as tough as this is to TYPE...IMO again! ....I feel strongly IMO that the evidense is CLEAR that MR was INVOLVED! ... it is clearly shown him driving his car after tori was ABUCTED ... so I MUST say I am PUZZLED as to why there are so many opinions that HE MAY not be guilty ...Imo I am having a very hard time reading this now....Yes I know the defense has not presented their case ...BUt ...IMO only>>> How can they possibly get him off ....???...He is ON VIDEO in numerous locations on that horrid day ...April 8 , 2009....again this in my opinion and yes I do understand MANY MAY have conflicting views and so be it .....But when someone is CLearly on Video ...kind of a no brainer IMO ...Plus he had 3 mths to get rid of the evidence( which he tried very hard to do..)if so much time did not lapse after the MURDER ... I am confident that we would have Little LEFT DOUBT in all of our minds more percisely what had occured ! ...thanks robynhood...I do respect others opposing views we all have the freedom in Canada to do have different views .BUT it all seems very concrete IMO again...I guess soon we will hear the defense's side ...and sure they are INTITLED to do this ...just hope it is NOT the same OLD BS about how bad a person TLM is and her music taste as IMO ...this holds very little crediablity ...especially her music ..OMG...hold on to your hats as I am Not looking forward to their side ....I think Tori's family has been thru the worst nightmare any Parent could face ....IMO I feel the TORI LAW needs to be looked at as crimes against children in our nation seems to growing terribly! ......especially by young offenders i ....Please listen closely was commented made ...and yes I do want to hear it explained as the defense indicated before the TRIAL that>>> something like...do not make judgements till you hear our side ....well all ears ...Mr. Defense!...robynhood...I stress again this is just IMO again!..robynhood

I'd be very surprised if MR was found not guilty even if he didn't know VS was kidnapped he sure did when he was cleaning up the crime scene and the way he was able to carry on like nothing happened. It will be the rape that may or may not stick. But i am sure murder and kidnapping charges will stick. IMO
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nobodyzgirl View Post
If there was a ban, the Crown would still be able to ask, the media would just not be allowed to report.
So it's possible that we're not hearing everything? There seems to be many holes and unasked questions that I am really curious if there is something the jury is hearing but we are not.
My feeling is that if there were any testimony under a media ban, the reporters would say so, just not report it.
 
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