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View Poll Results: Do you agree with the way LE and the DA cleared people in this case?

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44. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    1 2.27%
  • No

    43 97.73%

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  1. #1
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    Question for both IDI and RDI

    Thanks in advance for voting

    Edit: DA's not DA,I mean both Hunter and Lacy.
    Last edited by madeleine; 05-12-2010 at 06:42 AM.
    The rice is already cooked...

  2. #2
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    No one knows whether this crime was committed by one person or more (IDI,RDI,doesn't even matter).So how on earth can we discuss clearing people.Especially clearing them because DNA doesn't match.I am talking now of EVERYBODY who was cleared because of DNA.
    Since no one knows,not even LE or the DA,how many people were involved in this how can we talk about people being cleared?
    Same re clearing them because handwriting didn't match.
    Let's take the following scenario,there were 3 people involved,one's the DNA owner,one's the RN writer and there's another one.Maybe LE/DA cleared one and lost access to the other two by it.And this is just one example outta SO many which ARE possible in this case.
    The rice is already cooked...

  3. #3
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    The only people who should have been 100% cleared are those with solid alibi's of being out of town.
    you make a good point about what if there were multiple people involved it would make several things take on different meanings.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by slug View Post
    The only people who should have been 100% cleared are those with solid alibi's of being out of town.
    ITA!And I mean SOLID.
    The rice is already cooked...

  5. #5
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    I believe the DA's have all been right where they should be, in that they haven't falsely arrested anyone. Commendable, really, what with all the lynch-mob mentality people in the tabloids and writing books.

    Its simple: All family, friends, neighbors should've been cleared because neither their DNA nor handwriting match and they have alibis.

    Was there someone whose DNA matched, or handwriting matched, or had no alibi and thus they shouldn't have been cleared? How can you NOT clear someone who matches neither DNA nor handwriting? What would you have to hold them on?

    If a suspect's DNA doesn't match then probably they didn't sexually assault or murder JBR. Likewise if a suspect's handwriting doesn't match they probably didn't write the note. The DA's office hasn't been using the DNA exclusively, but has also used the handwriting.

    The lack of any local suspects is consistent with FFDI. I'm surprised nobody has figured that out yet.
    Last edited by Holdontoyourhat; 05-29-2010 at 11:25 AM.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Holdontoyourhat View Post
    I believe the DA's have all been right where they should be, in that they haven't falsely arrested anyone. Commendable, really, what with all the lynch-mob mentality people in the tabloids and writing books.

    Its simple: All family, friends, neighbors should've been cleared because their DNA and handwriting don't match.

    Was there someone whose DNA or handwriting matched and thus they shouldn't have been cleared? How can you NOT clear someone who doesn't match DNA OR handwriting (JMK)? What would you have to hold them on?

    If a suspect's DNA doesn't match then probably they didn't sexually assault or murder JBR.
    Likewise if a suspect's handwriting doesn't match they probably didn't write the note. The DA's office hasn't been using the DNA exclusively, but has also used the handwriting.

    The lack of any local suspects is consistent with FFDI. I'm surprised nobody has figured that out yet.
    What evidence do you have that the DNA is connected to the crime and to the offender? Also, Patsy Ramsey could not be excluded as the ransom note writer. In fact, several well respected QDEs have stated they believed she did write the note. Citations for these QDE opinions can be found easily here on Websleuths using the "Search" routine.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by BOESP View Post
    What evidence do you have that the DNA is connected to the crime and to the offender? Also, Patsy Ramsey could not be excluded as the ransom note writer. In fact, several well respected QDEs have stated they believed she did write the note. Citations for these QDE opinions can be found easily here on Websleuths using the "Search" routine.
    The evidence we have that the DNA is connected to the crime is the locations where the DNA was discovered: three (3) locations on two (2) separate articles of clothing JBR was known to be wearing at the time. These locations are consistent with the sexual assault part of the crime: the inside crotch of her underwear and each side of the longjohn waistband.

    Maybe you should consider reading that again because its really signficant. They found MORE DNA on JBR that MATCHED the underwear DNA! Huge breakthru courtesy of ML as evidenced in the news media who has completely dropped reference to JR or PR as suspects.

    Since the DNA is evidenced to be related to the crime and doesn't belong to PR/JR, and since BPD failed (yes FAILED) to match PR/JR to the ransom note YEARS AGO, its really, really safe to clear PR/JR except by over-the-edge BORG.

    There's a lot of mistaken people in here. I suggest using the search feature if you would like to reread some of their posts (LOL).
    Last edited by Holdontoyourhat; 05-29-2010 at 12:01 PM.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Holdontoyourhat View Post
    The evidence we have that the DNA is connected to the crime is the locations where the DNA was discovered: three (3) locations on two (2) separate articles of clothing JBR was known to be wearing at the time. These locations are consistent with the sexual assault part of the crime: the inside crotch of her underwear and each side of the longjohn waistband.

    Maybe you should consider reading that again because its really signficant. They found MORE DNA on JBR that MATCHED the underwear DNA! Huge breakthru courtesy of ML as evidenced in the news media who has completely dropped reference to JR or PR as suspects.

    Since the DNA is evidenced to be related to the crime and doesn't belong to PR, and since BPD failed (yes FAILED) to match PR to the ransom note YEARS AGO, its really, really safe to clear PR except by over-the-edge RDI.

    There's a lot of mistaken people in here. I suggest using the search feature if you would like to reread some of their posts (LOL).
    We've already discussed the ways the DNA could have innocently arrived on the panties and long johns. We've also discussed how the DNA does not exclude Ramsey involvement.

    Sorry, but your statement that the "BPD failed" to match PR to the ransom note is false. Just use the SEARCH function here or on Google to find QDEs who disagree with your statement.

    The evidence, circumstantial and direct, suggests familial involvement of some degree. I am also sure there is evidence that has not been made public.

    It is pretty amazing to me how low a profile John Ramsey keeps now that Patsy is dead. I find that interesting.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by BOESP View Post
    We've already discussed the ways the DNA could have innocently arrived on the panties and long johns. We've also discussed how the DNA does not exclude Ramsey involvement.
    DNA showing up on more than one article of clothing JBR was wearing at the time is evidence that could be there innocently. That the DNA is located where it is located, instead of on her feet bottom, is evidence that the DNA is instead linked to the crime. Your previous statement that there is no evidence the DNA is linked to the crime is false. Evidence that the DNA is linked to the crime has been provided. Whereas evidence that the DNA is not linked to the crime has not been provided.


    Quote Originally Posted by BOESP View Post
    Sorry, but your statement that the "BPD failed" to match PR to the ransom note is false. Just use the SEARCH function here or on Google to find QDEs who disagree with your statement.
    What?? Better slow down and read this:


    No BPD-Hired Experts Identified Patsy as RN Author. "During the investigation, the Boulder Police Department and Boulder County District Attorney's Office consulted at least six handwriting experts. (SMF P 191; PSMF P 191.) All of these experts consulted the original Ransom Note and original handwriting exemplars from Mrs. Ramsey. (SMF P 205; PSMF P 205.) Four of these experts were hired by the police and two were hired by defendants. (SMF P 191; PSMF P 191.) None of the six consulted experts identified Mrs. Ramsey as the author of the Ransom Note. (SMF P 195; PSMF P 195.) [Emphasis added.]

    OK I don't know what you call it but I call it BPD failure to match PR to the ransom note. Its over, no tap backs. The jello is jigglin and all that. PR didn't write the note.

    Quote Originally Posted by BOESP View Post
    The evidence, circumstantial and direct, suggests familial involvement of some degree. I am also sure there is evidence that has not been made public.
    This is wrong also.

    There is no evidence that suggests familial involvement to any greater extent than someone who just lived there.


    Quote Originally Posted by BOESP View Post
    It is pretty amazing to me how low a profile John Ramsey keeps now that Patsy is dead. I find that interesting.
    I find that irrelevant. Besides, I'm not sure running for office is low profile.
    Last edited by Holdontoyourhat; 05-29-2010 at 12:38 PM.

  10. #10
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    unfortunatly with this case i think a simple they don't match the DNA so there cleared wont work, especially if a FFDI as there is nothing to stop said faction from recruting someone who lived next door 3 streets away ect.
    anyway thats IMO


  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Holdontoyourhat View Post
    I believe the DA's have all been right where they should be, in that they haven't falsely arrested anyone. Commendable, really, what with all the lynch-mob mentality people in the tabloids and writing books.
    ITA

    Its simple: All family, friends, neighbors should've been cleared because neither their DNA nor handwriting match and they have alibis.

    Was there someone whose DNA matched, or handwriting matched, or had no alibi and thus they shouldn't have been cleared? How can you NOT clear someone who matches neither DNA nor handwriting? What would you have to hold them on?
    I am not saying treat them and publicly name them as suspects but at least don't take them of the POI list since we have no idea how many people were involved in this.

    If a suspect's DNA doesn't match then probably they didn't sexually assault or murder JBR. Likewise if a suspect's handwriting doesn't match they probably didn't write the note. The DA's office hasn't been using the DNA exclusively, but has also used the handwriting.
    We don't know if the same person who wrote the note is also the DNA owner.The DA and LE were both wrong here IMO, they assumed it was ONE killer,LE cleared people because in their minds the RN is the killer and ML cleared people based on the idea that the DNA owner is the killer.But nothing shows whether there is indeed only ONE killer.

    The lack of any local suspects is consistent with FFDI. I'm surprised nobody has figured that out yet.
    I agree with slug here.If SFF how do we know they didn't have help from an insider?(who was cleared because his DNA and handwriting didn't match>lead's a dead end then)
    The rice is already cooked...

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by madeleine View Post



    I agree with slug here.If SFF how do we know they didn't have help from an insider?(who was cleared because his DNA and handwriting didn't match>lead's a dead end then)
    I happen to agree these days with the RN because after almost fourteen (14) long years NOT ONE of the claims of the so-called 'bogus' ransom note has EVER been ruled out by fact. That is, claims that there were three people belonging to a group that represented a small foreign faction who dont like fat cats, respects the business but not the country, etc., etc. has not been ruled out.

    Even the original motive of kidnapping for ransom has never been ruled out. Maybe Igor got carried away with himself.

    There SHOULD be a scenario with three people in it.

  13. #13
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    For a SFF they happened to know a lot about JR's family/house and business.I still find the broken window/point of entry scenario to be bs.Even if SFF (maybe the group just called themselves like this,doesn't mean they WERE foreign),who knows where they could have gotten a key from.
    The rice is already cooked...

  14. #14
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    This is the reason why LE should have questioned everyone till they dropped dead,maybe someone gave up info about the R's without even knowing.A housekeeper,a gardener,etc
    The rice is already cooked...

  15. #15
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    as the sun plays on the infantry

    Bill Ritter: This is an investigation that you could still pick up tomorrow and work and the less the public knows about intimate details more likely you are to apprehend the killer or killers.
    The killer could have entered through an unlocked door or with a key. Could have left through a door.

    Laying low?

    Under assault by a national and international media feeding frenzy, some of whom were offered incentives to find (even stimulate) headline attention grabbing material, the Ramsey's did their best to handle this predatory onslaught, a Pearl Harbor like attack on their dignity and privacy, on their essence as human beings. No one is trained how to cope with that kind of pressure. They were stripped naked before a world-wide audience, in a vacuum of, in the absence of and total disregard for America's honored tradition of common decency. "Innocent until proven guilty," a long held sacred tenet of our coveted way of life in the land of the free, left on a train for the coast (along with the Holy Ghost). There was no way to prepare for it.

    As if that wasn't more than enough humiliation, at the very same time they were left grieving from the shocking, brutal murder of their youngest child. Under siege, this marauding gang of character assassins and hooligans, on orders from powerful media conglomerates' executives, (businessmen relaxing and imbibing spirits in penthouse luxury thousands of miles away) aimed their lust for dark gossip and whatever else would produce profit, directly at this deeply wounded mom and dad. And the citizens of the Home of the Brave feasted on every "breaking" news flash screeching across amber waves of grain, Lincoln and Washington turning over in their graves. It was a media bonanza.
    Last edited by WHITEFANG; 05-30-2010 at 09:17 AM.

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