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  1. #1
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    OR - Kyron Horman, 7 yo Second grader, Portland, 4 June 2010 - Part #4

    Please continue here.

    Part #3 is at [ame="http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=106178"]OR OR - Kyron Horman, 7 yo Second grader, Portland, 4 June 2010 - Part #3 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]


    If you haven't read the rules or TOS lately, now might be a good time to do so. The Rules - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

    Once again, Websleuths is a victim friendly forum. We do not sleuth family until we are given a reason to do so. No one in this case has been named a POI. Further sleuthing, disparaging comments, and speculation about family involvement will not be tolerated. Anyone continuing to do so will be given a time out. THIS IS THE FINAL WARNING.

    It is easy to blame the family. And yes, it is important to look there. But at this point, LE has given us no reason to do so. So for now, get out of your "sleuthing comfort zone". There are dozens of other avenues to explore.

    Also, we NEVER sleuth minors. You may link to Facebook pages, but do not post direct quotes. And only link to those directly involved in the case.

    As always, if you have any questions, please ask. You can PM a moderator, or check the Threadiquette thread that is a sticky at the top of the forum. ( Threadiquette- Questions about rules welcome here - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community )

    Please do not go off-topic. For example, we had an issue in the last thread with posters picking apart Kyron's science project. That is off-topic unless you can directly tie it to his disappearance. Hope that's clear.
    "Don't forget the kangaroo!"

  2. #2
    Sheriff in Kyron Horman Search Vows, 'We're Going to Bring You Home Buddy'
    Portland Second-Grader Disappeared From School Last Week
    June 7, 2010

    See video. Be prepared - it's very moving.

    Gates said a source at the school saw him around 9 a.m. Friday, but declined to provide details.

    http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/Media/kyro...ry?id=10847733

  3. #3
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    I agree with CharlestonGal's theory - it makes perfect sense. It also reminds me of the case in Florida where a little girl was abducted and killed by a 14-year-old neighbor girl - does anyone know which case I'm talking about? We all thought that was handled strangely, too....

  4. #4
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    Reposting CharlestonGal's theory - hope that's ok:

    CharlestonGal
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    FINALLY. I figured it out. I was wracking my brains all weekend long, lost in the details of the science fair, school procedures, blah blah. Then at work today it came to me like a bolt out of the blue.

    All the clues are in the behavior of the police and the family. All of us figured out this was being handled strangely. I think I know why. The suspect is the older sibling of a student at the school. That explains everything.

    The first clue came from SM who got the word out not to listen to the media - in other words, this is not what it seems to be.

    The police refuse to call this an abduction. They also are not interested in sex offenders. They know it was not a stranger who did this. So why not say so? Because he suspect is a minor and is known to the school and the family.

    The family does not speak (even though the bio-mom wants to) for the same reason - the suspect is a minor Kyron and the family know and trust. It is not another student at the school because no other student went missing with Kyron that day.

    This minor I believe is a former student and older sibling of a current student for two reasons. (1) He knows the easiest way to help Kyron get out of the school, and (2) he does not look at all out of place in the venue of the science fair even if he is spotted there.

    I think the sheriff was in tears today because he knows they are looking for Kyron's body and he knows (as does the family) who did it and why.

    I think Kyron planned to go with this older minor; that's why he was waiting by the door after his SM left the school. I also think he believed he was going to be back in time for the talent show. I believe this older minor tricked him into thinking they were leaving and performing some "surprise", maybe for his parents.

  5. #5
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    Asked if there were any persons of interest, Sheriff Dan Staton replied: "In this type of situation, I think everyone is of interest to us."


    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/...n6557954.shtml

  6. #6
    Emma Peel's Avatar
    Emma Peel is offline Keep your bowler hat on in times of trouble, & beware of diabolical masterminds.
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    Popping in rather late with a few random observations.

    At this stage, observing what LE does (rather than listening to LE statements alone) may be of interest. Attuned locals can observe the investigation and note what they see and what they notice they don’t see.

    It certainly appears that someone with some school-schedule knowledge awaited opportunity and took this child from school on a special/irregular-hectic schedule community visiting day at school. Because school days this year are almost over, this makes me think someone was planning this and was motivated by the school calendar, and the attractive time of this morning Fair activity. On the calendar, it’s not long until the kids are home and no longer attending school. With school is ending, time was short to act. For the abductor, perhaps abducting from this school, during the school year, during early part of the school day (when attendance is not yet reconciled) was the plan that was easiest.

    School Superintendent has spoken to media, making decisions & even speaking completely under direction of LE at this point. School remains open business as usual Monday. Is there an investigative need to see who does/doesn't return to a normal school-related schedule Monday? There will likely be a high level of LE presence at the school all week.

    I want to be hopeful for Kyron at this point, but I really find the time of school year/opportunistic timing of this child’s disappearance foreboding.

    First circle of interest moves outward from immediate family to extended family to neighbors and friends, enemies, and acquaintances of family. But in this case, another major circle of interest moves outward from the child's school relationships. We are seeing this with the school-related interviews… LE statements have indicated they are speaking to/interviewing teachers, school staff, parents, children. Probably not surprising for the school community or the community in general to hear that. But the fact that interviews are highly school focused and continuing today means there is likely a reason to focus there. Also might mean some who needed to be spoken with were reached over the weekend.

    Family/neighbor/friends circle - These LE interviews are less obvious. We possibly know of one, perhaps - JK the dead-end road woman-in-white-truck observer … This gentleman would not have had so much access to media if he was told not to by LE. Either LE did not mind if he talked (have the white truck owner come forward and eliminate themselves) or they already eliminated this tip.

    Specific outdoor areas were chosen to be searched using dogs, using helicpoters. What areas & why these areas? Were the areas searched based on tips? At this point in the investigation locals can sometimes simply observe what LE is doing where. Are there more ground searches today or are they focused on/watching the school? Are the press briefings descriptive of what locals observe seeing on the ground?

    Those who are going to keep following this case might like to record screen shots of digital information (FB, random comments to news articles) that you feel might be of interest later. Things of interest now may disappear. You may be following this case for quite some time and be grateful later for early digital info on the case that you stored away.

    The biggest hints I got from LE statements were: 1) the acknowledgement that time zero of the Kyron’s gone-missing event (whatever it’s cause) had an 8 hour plus head start on LE. And 2) The emotion (and likely unintended) of the LE spokesperson was also telling. I think LE fears they have been in the red zone on child-abduction-recovery timeframes since the original missing call came in. IMO, Missing/endangered means just that.

    All JMO, with prayers for Kyron & his family. It is so sad for the whole community, and very sad that this happens at the happiest-celebratory time of the school year - the last weeks of school.

  7. #7
    pufnstuf's Avatar
    pufnstuf is offline "Yes, she's emotionally disturbed. She's unbalanced!"
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    I checked Carol Moulton's statements against the facts.

    First of all, she's off by two years on the date that Terri and Kaine got married. They've only been married since 2007...can't get a month on that. Anyone who has friended Terri on FB will be able to get that, though. She has a folder of photos entitled "Our Hawaii Wedding 2007."

    So she's not been married to Kaine but 2 1/2, maybe 3 years.

    As for whether or not she's raised Kaine from infancy, we have no one's word on that but her own mother's word. And her mother was wrong on the length of Kaine and Terri's marriage.

    I'm just posting this to show that when we rely on family members' comments for facts, we may not be getting facts.

    Other info...

    Kaine and Desiree divorced in February 2003. We don't know why, and we don't know when Kaine got primary custody. We also don't know whether there was a 50/50 arrangement on custody, but Desiree let Kyron stay with Kaine during the school year because Skyline is actually a great school academically. If that is the case, the irony is painful.

    So much that we don't know about the family arrangements. I really hate seeing comments that seem to smear Kyron's mother, just because she did not have physical custody of Kyron when he went missing.

  8. #8
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    Charlestongal, although I pray you are wrong, I think you are right on the money.

  9. #9
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    I am not really on board with the fellow student/slightly older minor theory. I have given up on trying to read between the lines of cryptic LE comments; they appear in every case and sometimes I think people tend to analyze them too much, seeking any information that might be buried in what they are saying. What I am getting so far is that no one has been ruled out as POI's. When no one is ruled out, that to me means they do not have a focus at all or maybe even more than a theory. JMO. I think the emotion at the press conference comes from total frustration, not having any real idea where Kyron ir or what happened to him and just wishing they had been called far sooner. Again, JMO.
    Just my opinion, of course.

  10. #10
    Kimberlyd125's Avatar
    Kimberlyd125 is offline Softball is for everyone. Fast pitch is for athletes.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cluciano63 View Post
    I am not really on board with the fellow student/slightly older minor theory. I have given up on trying to read between the lines of cryptic LE comments; they appear in every case and sometimes I think people tend to analyze them too much, seeking any information that might be buried in what they are saying. What I am getting so far is that no one has been ruled out as POI's. When no one is ruled out, that to me means they do not have a focus at all or maybe even more than a theory. JMO. I think the emotion at the press conference comes from total frustration, not having any real idea where Kyron ir or what happened to him and just wishing they had been called far sooner. Again, JMO.
    I disagree with this, respectfully. No one was ever ruled out in Somer's case. That brought forth much spectulation from many. The thought was "her Mom has not been ruled out, there must be a reason" kinda thing.
    But, LE had their eyes on the perp for a while. They still did not rule anybody else out.

    So, what I'm trying to say here is just because nobody has been cleared or ruled out, IMO it does not mean they do not have a focus at all or a theory.

    JMO
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  11. #11
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    KNOCK OFF THE SNARKY AND JUDGMENTAL COMMENTS ABOUT KYRON'S MOM!

    Hoppy
    mod
    "Don't forget the kangaroo!"

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by pufnstuf View Post
    I checked Carol Moulton's statements against the facts.

    First of all, she's off by two years on the date that Terri and Kaine got married. They've only been married since 2007...can't get a month on that. Anyone who has friended Terri on FB will be able to get that, though. She has a folder of photos entitled "Our Hawaii Wedding 2007."

    So she's not been married to Kaine but 2 1/2, maybe 3 years.

    As for whether or not she's raised Kaine from infancy, we have no one's word on that but her own mother's word. And her mother was wrong on the length of Kaine and Terri's marriage.

    I'm just posting this to show that when we rely on family members' comments for facts, we may not be getting facts.

    Other info...

    Kaine and Desiree divorced in February 2003. We don't know why, and we don't know when Kaine got primary custody. We also don't know whether there was a 50/50 arrangement on custody, but Desiree let Kyron stay with Kaine during the school year because Skyline is actually a great school academically. If that is the case, the irony is painful.

    So much that we don't know about the family arrangements. I really hate seeing comments that seem to smear Kyron's mother, just because she did not have physical custody of Kyron when he went missing.
    I agree, we don't know how long Kyron has been in his father's primary custody. It may just be a school year thing. They may have joint legal custody. We just don't know. The step grandmother may be kind of making it look like the step mother raised him for whatever reason.

  13. #13
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    PS- One thing we have all heard Mark Klaas say many, many time is that it is up to the parents and immediate family members to do whatever possible to clear themselves fin an investigation so that LE can move in other directions. Since no one has been ruled out, I am taking from LE that no one has been cleared. I can't imagine why, on the 4th day, the family cannot be cleared by LE, which would cease all kinds of speculation in that direction. Again JMO and just sticking to what is being said, which is very little.
    Just my opinion, of course.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by amandab View Post
    Reposting CharlestonGal's theory - hope that's ok:

    CharlestonGal
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    Join Date: Jan 2009
    Posts: 398
    FINALLY. I figured it out. I was wracking my brains all weekend long, lost in the details of the science fair, school procedures, blah blah. Then at work today it came to me like a bolt out of the blue.

    All the clues are in the behavior of the police and the family. All of us figured out this was being handled strangely. I think I know why. The suspect is the older sibling of a student at the school. That explains everything.

    The first clue came from SM who got the word out not to listen to the media - in other words, this is not what it seems to be.

    The police refuse to call this an abduction. They also are not interested in sex offenders. They know it was not a stranger who did this. So why not say so? Because he suspect is a minor and is known to the school and the family.

    The family does not speak (even though the bio-mom wants to) for the same reason - the suspect is a minor Kyron and the family know and trust. It is not another student at the school because no other student went missing with Kyron that day.

    This minor I believe is a former student and older sibling of a current student for two reasons. (1) He knows the easiest way to help Kyron get out of the school, and (2) he does not look at all out of place in the venue of the science fair even if he is spotted there.

    I think the sheriff was in tears today because he knows they are looking for Kyron's body and he knows (as does the family) who did it and why.

    I think Kyron planned to go with this older minor; that's why he was waiting by the door after his SM left the school. I also think he believed he was going to be back in time for the talent show. I believe this older minor tricked him into thinking they were leaving and performing some "surprise", maybe for his parents.
    I think CharlestonGal hit it on the head. Oh God, I hope not. The theory fits. It's the only thing that makes sense to me outside of his own family. I never believe it was a stranger abduction.

    I posted earlier my son (same grade) would not ditch school and wait by an exit door for a ride - but he may just do it for an older child. That scares me to death! Makes me think of Elizabeth Olten's case. Heartbreaking!

  15. #15
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    HLN will be talking about Kyron next.

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