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Thread: CA - Bob Harrod, 81, Orange County, 27 July 2009 - #2

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    CA - Bob Harrod, 81, Orange County, 27 July 2009 - #2

    Please continue here.

    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=87453"]Thread 1[/ame]
    Last edited by Cubby; 08-01-2010 at 03:17 PM.
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    <snipped respectfully from Cloudajo>

    Thanks. So if the housekeeper came every other Monday, I wonder if she was not originally scheduled to come Monday, July 27th, but Bob called her and told her to come since Fontelle was arriving back that Wednesday. If the SIL didn't know she was coming, he could have thought nobody would be around when he went back to do a final check (I'm just speculating here). As it is, if he left at 2:40 and got back at 3:30, and the housekeeper had been waiting there for a time (rumor it was for 30 minutes), that doesn't leave very much time for someone to go to Bob's and lure him away or do something to him at the house and remove him.


    This is something that has been nagging at me. We all know about the "window of opportunity". If the SIL left Bob at 2:40 pm, the housekeeper arrived at 3:00pm(exact time not verified) and waited until 3:30pm when the SIL returned and let them in, then (sorry for the run-on sentence) that leaves a 20 minute window for an unknown assailant to do the deed. This is VERSUS the 10:00am phonecall lto Bob and the SIL is there, until 2:40pm when SIL leaves and checks out with a receipt at Home Depot at 3:04pm and then returns to let the housekeeper in.Opportunity of 20 minutes versus 4 hours and 40 minutes.

    A strange vehicle pulling up to a house in that closeknit neighborhood, or a well-recognized vehicle pulled back into the second parking spot by the garage. Just thinking aloud, here...
    Last edited by suzyq211; 07-25-2010 at 02:03 PM.
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    "Close knit neighborhood"? Sheesh. At 3:00 on a Monday afternoon, no one saw anything. The living areas of most of the houses are in the back, not the front. Most of those neighbors would not know if a vehicle was strange or not. Almost all of them did not even know Bob had gotten married until the news vans showed up to do the story. Some of them told me Georgia had died about a week after she died. I knew the minute she died and when they were taking her body away. Close knit - crap!

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    I am about to write about Bob's children. I will write what I know as well as what I have been told. I do not like this part because I know them. But, for the sake of this board and this case, I will. This is especially true since the police have no interest in what I have to say.

    Robbie: I don't know anything. I have met her a few times. I have never really talked to her. I have seen her truck parked in front of Bob's house a few times at various occasions (Christmas, Father's Day, Mother's Day, etc.). I can not confirm or deny anything you may have heard or read about her.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CA Exile View Post
    "Close knit neighborhood"? Sheesh. At 3:00 on a Monday afternoon, no one saw anything. The living areas of most of the houses are in the back, not the front. Most of those neighbors would not know if a vehicle was strange or not. Almost all of them did not even know Bob had gotten married until the news vans showed up to do the story. Some of them told me Georgia had died about a week after she died. I knew the minute she died and when they were taking her body away. Close knit - crap!
    I guess that was a poor choice of words...I meant the houses are fairly close together.
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    Cloudajo - would you mind bringing over your latest timeline?
    ~~~Cynical Optimist~~~

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    P: I know a little about P. Several years ago, Bob asked me to clean up P's car and sell it for her. She had a sedan and needed a minivan for her scooter. She was not able to get around as well. She needed a minivan to load the scooter in and out of. I was happy to do it. While cleaning out the car, I found several past due notices under the seat. I did not open them. I just gave them to Bob and asked if he knew about them. He said he did and we just went on.
    After that, Bob decided to get himself a minivan. He had a Camry. He felt he needed something that would be easier to get Georgia in and out of for doctor's appointments. He bought a new minivan. He hated it. He only had it for a couple of weeks. So, it left. A little bit later, P came over driving it. I am guessing he gave or sold it to her because the one she had was old and unreliable. Since he had purchased it, he could not take it back to the dealer. Either way, she had the new van from him.

    I did hear that a long time ago, P's ex-husband borrowed around $50,000, and never paid it back. I am guessing that was why he is her ex-husband. I would have dumped him after that as well. Apparently, Bob was willing to give money to his children and their spouses when in need.

    P seemed to be a little closer to Bob than R, but not as much as J.
    Last edited by Cubby; 07-25-2010 at 02:34 PM. Reason: Please use initials

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    Sorry I didnt know how to bring something from Part 1 so I copied:

    At the point of his disappearance, Fontelle had little to gain. Bob had already said he was going to put everything in both their names and add her to his stuff when she returned from MO to CA. Yes, he told me that. Why in the world would she have anything to do with his disappearance before he did all that. If she was going to do anything, would it not be after all the papers were signed and she would legally be entitled to it. That would just be dumb. Fontelle is NOT a dumb lady. You see what she is going through now.

    BBM

    From what I've gathered from Georgia's trust for her daughters..Bob did not have the right to put everything in both his and Fontelle's names. I really don't think Fontelle had anything to do with the disappearance of Bob. I feel sorry for her. But, in the interest of everyone involved, wouldn't it be best for her to go back to her family where they can take care of her and let the courts figure out what would be best?
    "I am confident that, in the end, common sense and justice will prevail. I'm an optimist, brought up on the belief that if you wait to the end of the story, you get to see the good people live happily ever after."

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    Fontelle may not have a right to Georgia's stuff if there is a trust involved. But, she does have a right to Bob's since she was his widow. If it is not in Georgia's trust, Bob can do whatever he likes. I do not know about the trusts and estates and stuff, so I can not say what he was or was not entitled to do.

    You may be willing to give up and go home, but I certainly would not. Fontelle apparently does not either. Running away does not seem to be her style. I would wait until it was all settled before I did anything. I was taught not to give up what you do not have to.

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    Here is the Timeline Fairy was asking for:

    Quote Originally Posted by cloudajo View Post
    I updated the timeline with the new info from the LA Times article. For focus, I'm just including a few days before he went missing and after.

    Sat, July 25, 2009

    • Bob Harrod last seen by a neighbor or neighbors.

    Sun, July 26, 2009

    • Afternoon – Bob’s 3 daughters went to his house. They argued over finances.
    • According to Fontelle, Bob said his daughters became upset when he told them he planned to include his new wife in the estate. (Note that Bob must have told Fontelle this when they spoke later that evening.)
    • Per daughter PB, “There was a family meeting on Sunday, it was heated at times, there were NO threats and we all left on good terms.” (ref IS and since removed)
    • His daughter RB said her father lost his temper. She said he had failed to provide copies of their mother's will, which he was obligated to do because of the financial mechanisms set up by the estate. "It wasn't a heated meeting," she said in a phone interview. "Dad got heated. He's very selfish, very conditional. The day before he went missing in the afternoon, he was going to provide us copies of the will, and we went over to get the copies. He didn't have them."
    • Evening - Fontelle last spoke to Bob by phone while she was in MO. (Note: MO time zone is 2 hours ahead of California.)
    • ~8:00PM – Sunset in CA

    Mon, July 27, 2009

    • Weather: Low temp: 68.5 F, high temp: 91.4 F, avg: 78.2 F; precipitation: 0.0
    • ~6:00AM – Sunrise in CA
    • 9:30AM – Bob’s son-in-law JM arrives at Bob’s house.
    • 10:00AM – Per officials, there was a phone call to Bob, which is the last time anyone other than SIL JM verified he was at the house. (Note: was this the housekeeper?)
    • Morning/Time? - Bob talked to the housekeeper on the phone and told her to come.
    • Morning/Time? – Hearsay: SIL JM went to CVS Pharmacy in Placentia. He purchased soda and paper plates. We don’t know whether he stopped at CVS on the way to Bob’s before 9:30AM, or whether he left Bob’s house in the AM, went to CVS, then returned to Bob’s house. (Note: There is a CVS Pharmacy on East Yorba Linda Boulevard, which is a 5 min drive from Bob’s house.)
    • ~11:00AM-12:00? – Daughter PB says she called her father and heard her BIL say he was going to the hardware store, and her father “responded in a favorable way.” (ref IS and since removed)
    • ~2:40PM – SIL JM left Bob’s house and went to Home Depot.
    • ~2:55PM? – SIL JM arrived at Home Depot. (Note: Unknown which Home Depot JM went to. There is a Home Depot at 601 S Placentia Ave, Fullerton, CA 92831-5199. Distance is only 2.7 miles from Bob’s address in Placentia, about a 6-minute drive. There is another Home Depot located at 2455 E Imperial Hwy, Brea, CA 92821-6114. Distance from Bob’s address in Placentia is 2.8 miles, about a 7-minute drive.)
    • ~3:00PM? – The housekeeper arrived at Bob’s house. The door was locked and nobody answered.
    • 3:04PM – SIL JM paid for purchases at Home Depot (per time stamp of purchase receipt).
    • 3:30PM – SIL JM arrived back at Bob’s house from Home Depot, and the housekeeper was sitting on the porch, waiting to be let in. She told JM the door was locked and nobody was answering, and that Harrod might be taking a nap. JM then went into the house to check, and Harrod was not there. JM told the housekeeper his father-in-law might have gone to visit a neighbor, police say
    • Time? – Housekeeper cleaned and left the house.
    • 6:00PM – SIL JM left the house and headed home to Running Springs.
    • 8:00PM? – Fontelle called Bob’s house but he didn’t answer. She called him every 20 minutes until after midnight, when daughter JM called to say her father was missing.
    • Evening/Night - Harrod's daughter JM, SIL’s wife, called the house, and there was no answer. She called her sisters RB and PB.
    • Evening/Night – Daughter RB called Placentia Police to do a welfare check at the residence. Officers found the house empty.

    Tues, July 28, 2009

    • After Midnight – Bob’s daughter JM called Fontelle Harrod in Missouri and told her Bob was missing
    • ~12:22AM PDST - Fontelle filed a missing persons report from Missouri with PPD.
    • Daughter JM gave interview to reporter. Said her husband was with her dad at his home the day before, he went to the hardware store alone, and when he came back, her dad was gone. Asked what time, she replied, “We’re thinking maybe 1, noon?”
    • After Bob disappeared, someone -- police won't say who -- told officers he might have regretted the decision to marry. For three days police thought they were dealing with a case of cold feet.

    Wed, July 29, 2009

    • Fontelle returned to Placentia from MO (as previously scheduled).
    • In response to being contacted by family before Bob went missing, an investigator from OC Social Services showed up at Bob’s house to conduct the second investigation into suspected elder financial abuse. (ref IS and since removed)

    http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la...,3066456.story
    http://www.ocregister.com/news/-214111--.html
    http://www.ktla.com/videobeta/watch/...9354&src=front
    Cloudajo posted a good timeline.

    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4768783&postcount=312"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - CA CA - Bob Harrod, 81, Orange County, 27 July 2009[/ame]

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    Can we please get back on topic?

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    J; J was always nice to us. She knew about the hairdresser and that Bob had been giving her money. She had asked me to watch the house and let her know whenever the hairdresser came over. I did. Also, I told Bob about it and I still did it. If I were in her situation, I would have done the same thing. She was worried he was being taken advantage of, as we all were. Otherwise, she was always a good neighbor and a good friend.
    She came over about once a week or so. Probably checking on Bob, making sure he was okay. This was after Georgia had passed away, so he was alone. I never went over when she was there. I figured it was father/daughter time. I did not want to intrude. I also never asked Bob about her. It was none of my business. If he wanted to talk about it, he would.

    Her son who lived around the corner also would come over now and then. His wife would make stuff for him for dinner. They seemed really close. Bob was proud of him. I liked him as well. I did not know him well, but he seemed all right to me.

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    There you have it. That is what I know about Bob's daughters. There is nothing amazing or scary about them. They had their ups and downs as any parent-child relationship does. I can no speak to what they said on the IS posts or in the paper. They would have to do that for themselves.

    I am sad that J stopped talking to me or returning my calls after last August. I thought she would keep me informed as to what is going on. I have been told they are not talking to any of the police or press about the case. I guess they just got burned out on it and don't want to discuss it any more. I don't know. He was my friend and I still will not let go. I will talk to anyone and everyone who will listen.

    Thanks for your patience.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CA Exile View Post
    There you have it. That is what I know about Bob's daughters. There is nothing amazing or scary about them. They had their ups and downs as any parent-child relationship does. I can no speak to what they said on the IS posts or in the paper. They would have to do that for themselves.

    I am sad that J stopped talking to me or returning my calls after last August. I thought she would keep me informed as to what is going on. I have been told they are not talking to any of the police or press about the case. I guess they just got burned out on it and don't want to discuss it any more. I don't know. He was my friend and I still will not let go. I will talk to anyone and everyone who will listen.

    Thanks for your patience.
    Thank you...Bob needs a voice.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CA Exile View Post
    There you have it. That is what I know about Bob's daughters. There is nothing amazing or scary about them. They had their ups and downs as any parent-child relationship does. I can no speak to what they said on the IS posts or in the paper. They would have to do that for themselves.

    I am sad that J stopped talking to me or returning my calls after last August. I thought she would keep me informed as to what is going on. I have been told they are not talking to any of the police or press about the case. I guess they just got burned out on it and don't want to discuss it any more. I don't know. He was my friend and I still will not let go. I will talk to anyone and everyone who will listen.

    Thanks for your patience.
    Thank you for sharing.
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    SNIPPED from Cloudajo's timeline:

    Mon, July 27, 2009

    Weather: Low temp: 68.5 F, high temp: 91.4 F, avg: 78.2 F; precipitation: 0.0
    ~6:00AM – Sunrise in CA
    9:30AM – Bob’s son-in-law JM arrives at Bob’s house.
    10:00AM – Per officials, there was a phone call to Bob, which is the last time anyone other than SIL JM verified he was at the house. (Note: was this the housekeeper?)
    Morning/Time? - Bob talked to the housekeeper on the phone and told her to come.
    Morning/Time? – Hearsay: SIL JM went to CVS Pharmacy in Placentia. He purchased soda and paper plates. We don’t know whether he stopped at CVS on the way to Bob’s before 9:30AM, or whether he left Bob’s house in the AM, went to CVS, then returned to Bob’s house. (Note: There is a CVS Pharmacy on East Yorba Linda Boulevard, which is a 5 min drive from Bob’s house.)

    ~11:00AM-12:00? – Daughter PB says she called her father and heard her BIL say he was going to the hardware store, and her father “responded in a favorable way.” (ref IS and since removed)
    ~2:40PM – SIL JM left Bob’s house and went to Home Depot.


    ~2:55PM? – SIL JM arrived at Home Depot. (Note: Unknown which Home Depot JM went to. There is a Home Depot at 601 S Placentia Ave, Fullerton, CA 92831-5199. Distance is only 2.7 miles from Bob’s address in Placentia, about a 6-minute drive. There is another Home Depot located at 2455 E Imperial Hwy, Brea, CA 92821-6114. Distance from Bob’s address in Placentia is 2.8 miles, about a 7-minute drive.)

    __________________________________________________ ______


    The phonecall PB says she placed to her dad has always bothered me.

    PB posted that between 11am - 12 noon on July 27, 2009 she was on the phone with her father and heard the SIL state he was going to the hardware store. Yet we now know the SIL did not go to the hardware store until 3-4 hours later.

    JM also gave an earlier time for her father's disappearance right after Mr. Harrod went missing.

    JM states her father disappears around noon or 1 pm.

    Reporter: “Julie says her husband was with her dad, at his home yesterday. He went to the hardware store alone. When he came back…”
    JM: “My dad was gone.”
    Reporter: “What time?”
    JM: “We’re thinking maybe 1, noon?”


    http://www.ktla.com/videobeta/watch/...9354&src=front
    Last edited by Angelo; 07-25-2010 at 05:28 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by suzyq211 View Post
    I guess that was a poor choice of words...I meant the houses are fairly close together.
    I think the key point as you mentioned is the window of opportunity - a ~20 minute window vs a 4 hour and 40 minute window for someone to do something to Bob and remove him from the house without being noticed.

    As we know, Bob had scheduled the housekeeper and would have been expecting her, so I don't think he would have left willingly in that ~20 minutes.

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    The youngest daughter (who was married to SIL) posted back in Aug 09 on IS that Bob pushed them away around Christmas in 08, that it hurt them, and that the distance he created was selfish. She mentioned the purchase of lavish gifts for the barber, and said they tried to warn him of her taking advantage of him, but he brushed it off. She posted “he did not even acknowledge his own grandson and great grandchildren.” She posted that is what happened until they went down to meet Fontelle and Bob “wanted us to be an instant family again.” That the difficult situation of losing their mother and then Bob pushing them away was “insane.” She posted “as if our emotions can be shut down and then turned back on in a snap.”

    Emotions were clearly running high when Bob went missing, not only about how Bob was spending his money but perhaps a perceived slight of their son (Bob‘s grandson), who was apparently very close to Bob. A person who typically keeps feelings inside, is helpful, and non-confrontational may have exploded after a buildup of events over many months, say if a perceived harsh comment was made the morning after an argument with the daughters about finances the previous evening.

    Just something to consider…

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    Where is Bob?

    That's why I keep coming back to this thread like I do all the other thread on W/S where there is a missing person involved! BUT, on the other threads we discuss LE, Tips, eyewitness accounts....I have fallen right into the discussion that has nothing to do with Where is Bob! I can understand the daughters concern about what is rightfully theirs. I can understand a new bride wondering where her new husband is, even if it's only been 6 days of wedded bliss but what I can't understand now is an accusation about a grandson that was close to his grandfather that may have exploded???

    I think LE needs to follow up on the hairdresser..I think LE needs to follow up on this Cold Case because I don't think enough was done in the first place to find Bob Harrod!
    Bob, I still drive by your house every Saturday asking..Where are you?
    "I am confident that, in the end, common sense and justice will prevail. I'm an optimist, brought up on the belief that if you wait to the end of the story, you get to see the good people live happily ever after."

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  42. #22

    Where is bob?

    Quote Originally Posted by DollyPardonMe View Post
    Where is Bob?

    That's why I keep coming back to this thread like I do all the other thread on W/S where there is a missing person involved! BUT, on the other threads we discuss LE, Tips, eyewitness accounts....I have fallen right into the discussion that has nothing to do with Where is Bob! I can understand the daughters concern about what is rightfully theirs. I can understand a new bride wondering where her new husband is, even if it's only been 6 days of wedded bliss but what I can't understand now is an accusation about a grandson that was close to his grandfather that may have exploded???

    I think LE needs to follow up on the hairdresser..I think LE needs to follow up on this Cold Case because I don't think enough was done in the first place to find Bob Harrod!
    Bob, I still drive by your house every Saturday asking..Where are you?

    Finally a post that I agree with wholeheartedly!

    The question is where is Bob and what have the police really done to find out. If they have thoroughly investigated all that they can and still come up with nothing, then they've been looking in the wrong places or are waiting for suspect(s) to trip up.
    IMHO, Newspaper reports of "he said or she said" do not necessarily reflect what the police cannot tell the public until they are absolutely certain. They must not jeopardize the REAL investigation, so media reports are not entirely reliable and can be very misleading. IMHO
    Bob's neighbor gave his insite, for whatever it is worth, about the family and alot more insite about what Fontelle's thoughts are but, the questions (and Bob) still remain unanswered and out there, somewhere.

    The neighbor's description of the hairdresser is very creepy and eventhough rumor has it she and her husband were cleared, is this actually true?

    IMHO: The investigation process in a case like this must be kept tightly confidential. That makes sense. I hope they're still working it dilligently.

    Real life mysteries are truly complicated, unlike television crime stories that many watch.

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    LE does not care. They have been trying to write this off since it happened. First it was a demented old man wandered away. Then it was a nervous groom with cold feet. I have always said if Bob had been some 20-something coed with bleached blonde hair partying in some exotic tropical island, It would be national news. But since it is an 80 year old man, no one cares any more. That just seems to be what our society has degraded to. A missing old man is just not "sexy" news.

    It sucks, but tell me I am wrong. The police are in over their heads and are too arrogant to admit it.

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  46. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by CA Exile View Post
    LE does not care. They have been trying to write this off since it happened. First it was a demented old man wandered away. Then it was a nervous groom with cold feet. I have always said if Bob had been some 20-something coed with bleached blonde hair partying in some exotic tropical island, It would be national news. But since it is an 80 year old man, no one cares any more. That just seems to be what our society has degraded to. A missing old man is just not "sexy" news.

    It sucks, but tell me I am wrong. The police are in over their heads and are too arrogant to admit it.

    Looking at the old links, even statements made by their public information person now seem very staged and out of touch to me since you've described Bob as you knew him.

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  48. #25
    Cubby is offline 50K reward, Bob Harrod-Missing: Call Det. Radomski 714-993-8176
    Join Date
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    Chicago burbs
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    Where is Bob?

    Quote Originally Posted by DollyPardonMe View Post
    Where is Bob?

    That's why I keep coming back to this thread like I do all the other thread on W/S where there is a missing person involved! BUT, on the other threads we discuss LE, Tips, eyewitness accounts....I have fallen right into the discussion that has nothing to do with Where is Bob! I can understand the daughters concern about what is rightfully theirs. I can understand a new bride wondering where her new husband is, even if it's only been 6 days of wedded bliss but what I can't understand now is an accusation about a grandson that was close to his grandfather that may have exploded???

    I think LE needs to follow up on the hairdresser..I think LE needs to follow up on this Cold Case because I don't think enough was done in the first place to find Bob Harrod!
    Bob, I still drive by your house every Saturday asking..Where are you?

    I agree... I do appreciate very much the insight CA_Exhile has given us. To summarize there were some 'battles of wills' not only with finances but with some hurt feelings over the dynamics of the family relationships. I think that in general gives us some insight... It helps clarify some things... but we still dont' know where Bob is.

    Was there any WS'rs early on in the case who have been in contact with LE regarding this case? I'd love to see about someone making a call to LE and asking what is happening with the investigation into his disappearance rather than hashing out who is entitled to this mans estate. That is a different 'court' issue entirely.

    IMO some calls to LE need to happen to find out what the heck is going on with this case.

    Where is Bob?
    ~JMO~

    A grandfather is someone with silver in his hair and gold in his heart. ~Author Unknown


    Long Lost Love - Discovery ID - Disappeared - Bob Harrod Case

    You can now purchase Mr. Harrod's Disappeared episode through Amazon, iTunes or YouTube.


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