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Thread: CA - Johnnie Joe Herrera, 20, Oxnard, 27 Aug 1971

  1. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobby88 View Post
    I got this reply back today from Erin Browne of the show "Disappeared".

    Hello Bobby,
    Thank you so much for submitting.
    I will look into Johnnie’s case as soon as I can. Thanks for the details you’ve provided.

    Please just know that at this point we are only in the research stages, and there are no guarantees that any stories will make it to air but I will share the case with the team to see if it fits. It is particularly difficult to get a case that is more than 10 years old on the show, but it is possible – so I will look into it.

    If you have any questions please feel free to send them my way.

    Thanks again,

    Erin Browne
    NBC NEWS - Peacock Productions
    Associate Producer
    30 Rockefeller Plaza
    New York, NY 10112
    212-664-3799
    That's unfortunate that they are hesitant to look into cases that are more than 10 years old because those are the ones (IMO) that I would really like to see have more exposure. Plus, a lot can change with time -- people that were once afraid to talk about what happened to a missing person might no longer be afraid, etc.

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  3. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ambercat View Post
    That's unfortunate that they are hesitant to look into cases that are more than 10 years old because those are the ones (IMO) that I would really like to see have more exposure. Plus, a lot can change with time -- people that were once afraid to talk about what happened to a missing person might no longer be afraid, etc.
    I agree. I think since many of the people in Johnnie's case who know what happened are much older (I'm guessing they were about Johnnie's age at the time and would be in their early sixties now) and wiser and realize that Johnnie's family knowing what happened to him after forty years is more important than any trouble they themselves might get into.

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  5. #128
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    I know this UID was found in New Jersey several years after Johnnie went missing, but does anyone else see a lot of similarities between Johnnie and the reconstruction?

    http://doenetwork.org/cases/5umnj.html

  6. #129
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    Sent an e-mail to Donna Fontana, the NJ detective in charge of the John Doe last night and already got a response. She thanked me and said she'd look into it.

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  8. #130
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    Johnnie is our featured cold case from 6/10/2012 to 6/17/2012
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  10. #131
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    I think I may have found Jose Aceves, the man I believe had the bachelor party that night. According to peoplefinder.com, there are six men named Jose Aceves in Oxnard. I looked up Maria Aceves, his wife (her maiden name was Herrera, but I've never been able to find out whether she was any relation to Johnnie) and there are apparently four women by that that name in Oxnard. Two of those four women have the exact same addresses and phone numbers as two of the men named Jose Aceves in Oxnard.

    I'm not sure what to do with this info. Should I write to him or call him? Obviously, the Oxnard PD aren't going to help me as they said in their e-mail to me a few months ago.

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  12. #132
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    Mexico?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bobby88 View Post
    Good point. If he was at a bachelor party, there was more than likely alcohol, and he could have simply had too much before getting behind the wheel.
    Here's my first impression. Bachelor party....crazy things happen at bachelor parties. Did something bad happen and someone got hurt? Did he skip across the border? Does he have relatives in Mexico? Why hasn't his family been more active in finding him? Afraid to cause trouble and draw attention to themselves? Is he living in Mexico?
    And yes, how handsome.
    My posts are opinion and speculation only.

  13. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobby88 View Post
    I think I may have found Jose Aceves, the man I believe had the bachelor party that night. According to peoplefinder.com, there are six men named Jose Aceves in Oxnard. I looked up Maria Aceves, his wife (her maiden name was Herrera, but I've never been able to find out whether she was any relation to Johnnie) and there are apparently four women by that that name in Oxnard. Two of those four women have the exact same addresses and phone numbers as two of the men named Jose Aceves in Oxnard.

    I'm not sure what to do with this info. Should I write to him or call him? Obviously, the Oxnard PD aren't going to help me as they said in their e-mail to me a few months ago.
    I think the chances of them telling you anything are pretty slim, but it's certainly worth a try. I sure the guy that had the bachelor party knows exactly what happened...
    My posts are opinion and speculation only.

  14. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobby88 View Post
    Just in case anyone is interested, here is what little I have started of the article for the magazine:

    Whatever Happened to Johnnie Herrera?

    The year was 1971. Richard Nixon was in the White House. The controversial sitcom All in the Family debuted on CBS. Rod Stewart’s Maggie May topped the pop music charts, and a new car at the time cost on average a whopping $3,500 and could be powered by gasoline purchased at forty cents a gallon. On August 27 of that year, twenty-year-old Johnnie Herrera, a handsome, dark-haired young man dressed sharply in a purple shirt and white pants, attended a friend’s bachelor party on the 700 block of West Cedar Street in Oxnard. He was reportedly seen at the party, but what happened after that is unknown. What is known is that neither Johnnie nor the blue 1969 Volkswagen Beetle he was driving that night have ever been seen or heard from again. He left behind a young wife (now deceased) and ten-month-old son, as well as a host of unanswered questions. His is the oldest unsolved missing persons case on file in Oxnard, and undoubtedly one of the most baffling.

    Johnnie Joe Herrera and his identical twin brother Joe were born in Oxnard on February 17, 1951 to Mexican immigrant parents named Laureano and María Herrera (née Rodriguez). They were the fifth-born in a family that included a total of seven children, all seemingly normal kids. Johnnie and his brother graduated from Hueneme High School in 1969.

    I haven't gotten any more info from Elidet yet to write any more than this. What do y'all think?
    Exceptional.
    My posts are opinion and speculation only.

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  16. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobby88 View Post
    I think I may have found Jose Aceves, the man I believe had the bachelor party that night. According to peoplefinder.com, there are six men named Jose Aceves in Oxnard. I looked up Maria Aceves, his wife (her maiden name was Herrera, but I've never been able to find out whether she was any relation to Johnnie) and there are apparently four women by that that name in Oxnard. Two of those four women have the exact same addresses and phone numbers as two of the men named Jose Aceves in Oxnard.

    I'm not sure what to do with this info. Should I write to him or call him? Obviously, the Oxnard PD aren't going to help me as they said in their e-mail to me a few months ago.
    BBM

    1. My first inclination would be to telephone. If you don't get anywhere on the phone, then I'd suggest writing. The most important things to get across are that you're a reputable person (although I don't know exactly how you'd do that) and that you don't want any money.

    2. They are not interested and they don't care--most unfortunately.

    Best of luck to you and please keep us updated!!

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  18. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiln Wood View Post
    BBM

    1. My first inclination would be to telephone. If you don't get anywhere on the phone, then I'd suggest writing. The most important things to get across are that you're a reputable person (although I don't know exactly how you'd do that) and that you don't want any money.

    2. They are not interested and they don't care--most unfortunately.

    Best of luck to you and please keep us updated!!
    I'm not sure how to get across that I'm not after money or anything either. After all, they don't know me and I have no credentials, so there really isn't any reason they should take me at my word. Besides it's quite possible that they really don't know much more than what the Doe Network and Charley Project have listed, although I kind of have a feeling that there's at least a little bit more to the story than meets the eye.

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  20. #137
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    One possible scenario that comes to mind.

    I wonder if there was a dancer hired for entertainment at the bachelor party. If so, these dancers normally bring bodyguards to make sure that nobody gets out of line.

    Perhaps he crossed the line and was dealt with accordingly by the bodyguard.

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  22. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobby88 View Post
    WARNING: This post may seem inflammatory and offensive to those involved in the case. These are questions I've had regarding Johnnie's disappearance based on my nearly two year's worth of research into the case. These questions, as uncomfortable as they may be, are in no way meant to attack, disrespect, or defame Johnnie, his character, or those who love and care about him. I almost didn't want to post these questions, but when I thought about it, I considered the fact that others who have looked at this thread may have the same questions, but were too afraid to ask them outright for fear of sounding insensitive. However, I believe it is by discussing such questions and looking at this case from all possible angles that we may be able to find out what happened to Johnnie all those years ago and thereby bring peace to his family after 40 years of worry.

    The questions I have about this case are:

    1. Why wasn't it Annette who made the missing persons report? It was the husband and father of her child who was missing and legally, she would be Johnnie's next of kin.

    2. Why did Joe wait all those days to report his brother missing? I can forgive the first 48 hours since most police depts. won't/can't declare an adult officially missing during those two days, but why wait three more days? Especially since he swears up and down that Johnnie would never just disappear. Joe has probably kicked himself every day since then about not doing something sooner. But the question still remains - if he was so convinced that his brother wouldn't just vanish and that something was dreadfully amiss, why did he and the family think they would simply "happen" upon him somewhere around town during those three days? Also, was she a US citizen? If a report was filed were there family members who could get deported? Family and lots of it are values very important to this culture.

    3. The VC Star article states that Joe and his family searched the San Fernando valley and Skid Row over the years "in the hopes of finding clues". What "clues" did they expect to find? I'm sure they were just trying to be thorough, but what made them think Johnnie was in either place, particularly Skid Row? Skid Row can be a very dangerous place; was Johnnie invovled in drugs or something that they even entertained the notion that he was there? I think there's a specific reason they looked where they did. This is one of those things where I think there's more to the victim than meets the eye.

    4. Although the same article didn't state what Johnnie actually did for a living, it did say that he was employed at the time of his disappearance. Didn't his boss and/or co-workers notify anyone when he abruptly stopped coming in for his shift? Unless he was on some leave of absence or was using up some sick days or something, five days is a long time to simply not come into work.

    5. Did Johnnie have a best friend (apart from his twin brother) in whom he may have confided if something was wrong? His relatives stated that he didn't seem unhappy, but sometimes people, particularly younger people, confide thing in their close friends rather than relatives.

    6. Detective Fenton states that people thought that it was only because he got Annette pregnant that Johnnie married her at all. Who specifically said this? And was it simply their perception, or did Johnnie confide this to them?

    7. What were the "indications" (as Det. Fenton put it) of marital and financial problems between Johnnie and Annette?

    8. How did Johnnie's friends and relatives feel about Annette, and how did hers feel about him? Was there any tension?

    9. What was Johnnie's personality like? Was he naive and trusting of others to the point of accidentally putting himself in danger to help someone (i.e., picking up any hitch hiker/vagrant he came across while driving without fear of the person possibly being dangerous)?

    10. Was there anyone who Johnnie didn't get along with who may have wanted to harm him? In other words, could someone have been bullying or harassing Johnnie and he simply never told anyone?

    Any other questions, feel free to add them. This is one of those cases where it seems as though very little adds up.
    Bobby...I numbered the questions in the quote so I could give my input.

    1. It may have been common for him to not come home for periods of time. Especially, if they married because of a pregnancy. It is also not uncommon for Hispanic women to defer interactions with figures of authority or the law to male members of the family. It is not uncommon, especially during that time, for certain traditional hispanic females to not have any say in anything male family members do. Different gender roles, especially in those days. Cultural differences. Also, the last thing a wife would want to do is deal with the anger of a husband who is not coming home by choice by involving the law. Remember, there was a lot of racial tension in those days in the US and most groups prefered to handle things on their own.

    2. The brother may have assumed he was off doing his own thing. This was the time before cell phones, internet, etc. It was not uncommon to not speak with people for days. But, if he had a history of spending time in other places, and then coming home...5 days is not an issue. Also, again, due to racial tensions, police brutality and many things that were occurring during that time, I know I would not want to draw attention to a family member. Especially, if he was doing recreational drugs (not uncommon) or what not. You don't narc family out. The question is...what was the pivotal point where the brother decided the when it was out of character or angering the brother was less of a concern then his where abouts?

    3. Johnny may have been doing some recreational drugs. I am not saying that to judge...just looking at the times. Looking in areas frequented by those who do drugs, would be a good starting point. The other question that came to my mind is this: He was an identical twin. Any chance he was misidentified by someone as his brother and met foul play? What was the twin's life style? Did the twin hear a rumor about his own "demise" that prompted him to call police and fear for his brother's safety?

    4. Being missing from work for 5 days may or may not be a red flag. Did he do temporary or per diem work? Did some of those 5 days fall outside of normal business days? Did he have a phone or contact on file with his employer. Many people during that time would work enough to get by and skip jobs. Many people did not leave personal information with employers. Or if they tried to call, having a answering machine was for the very elite...not your average person.

    5. Culturally, hispanic men are very stoic and there is a pressure for machismo. Most hispanic men do not confide in anyone about certain types of stressors. It is important to not show weakness or what not. I don't mean to stereotype, more just trying to get a cultural understanding. He may confide in his twin, but, I don't see him talking to the guys at a bar gripping about feeling used by the boss...He would have taken action, got another job or what not.

    6. Hispanic men have pride and take their responsibilities very seriously. They also are very family oriented. It is not uncommon for a young man to marry a woman who is carrying his child. It is a source of honor, pride and family values. This can be seen as positive or negative according to different people. While he may have done what was right by marrying her, if he was unhappy, it would not be unreasonable to see other people, or visit other women for days on end. As long as he was taking care of his child.

    7. I think any young couple with a child have financial issues. During this time, many women were entering the workforce, creating what is now the dual-income family. Culturally, she would have stayed at home to be the mother, wife, etc. But, as the Jones took off, not having that dual income really created poverty for many who were traditionalists. If he also was seeing other women on the side it could be draining of income. Or even dealing a bit of weed here and there to make ends meet...it would not be abnormal.

    8. She was the mother of his child. There is a respect there. The only issue I can see where this would come up is if she was white or other and the family was not happy out breaking away from the traditional type of marriage. Also, if this was a "mixed-race" couple...they could have a whole boat-load of pressures and stigma from outside society. That is hard enough to deal with for people in this day and age...let alone at that time. If that is the case, say if she was white...did some good ol' boy "take care of him" for taking a white woman? (Sorry, that sounds bad...but...we may as well eplore this) Or if she was hispanic, how long had her family been in the US and was his family viewed as a threat as they were first generation? Or if he was a ladies man...someone could have gotten upset?

    9. I can say he had traditional cultural values by marrying her. Other then that we do not know. I would say he was street wise and such...given the times and what was happening in our country. I would also say if family looked on skid row for him, he may have experimented with drugs...like everyone else at the time.

    10. Again, I do not see bullying or harassing in the sense like today. He may have been targeted because he is hispanic due to tensions at the time. Or if his wife was white/black/asian/etc. Most hispanic men hold their own, are very stoic and will protect their honor. The biggest question I have is if he or his identical twin was a target for some reason, who would they turn to? Certainly not the law?

    I apologize if my post above offends anyone. I am not stereotyping or passing any value judgments...I am just trying to figure things out as well.

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  24. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by LucyOso View Post
    Bobby...I numbered the questions in the quote so I could give my input.

    1. It may have been common for him to not come home for periods of time. Especially, if they married because of a pregnancy. It is also not uncommon for Hispanic women to defer interactions with figures of authority or the law to male members of the family. It is not uncommon, especially during that time, for certain traditional hispanic females to not have any say in anything male family members do. Different gender roles, especially in those days. Cultural differences. Also, the last thing a wife would want to do is deal with the anger of a husband who is not coming home by choice by involving the law. Remember, there was a lot of racial tension in those days in the US and most groups prefered to handle things on their own.

    2. The brother may have assumed he was off doing his own thing. This was the time before cell phones, internet, etc. It was not uncommon to not speak with people for days. But, if he had a history of spending time in other places, and then coming home...5 days is not an issue. Also, again, due to racial tensions, police brutality and many things that were occurring during that time, I know I would not want to draw attention to a family member. Especially, if he was doing recreational drugs (not uncommon) or what not. You don't narc family out. The question is...what was the pivotal point where the brother decided the when it was out of character or angering the brother was less of a concern then his where abouts?

    3. Johnny may have been doing some recreational drugs. I am not saying that to judge...just looking at the times. Looking in areas frequented by those who do drugs, would be a good starting point. The other question that came to my mind is this: He was an identical twin. Any chance he was misidentified by someone as his brother and met foul play? What was the twin's life style? Did the twin hear a rumor about his own "demise" that prompted him to call police and fear for his brother's safety?

    4. Being missing from work for 5 days may or may not be a red flag. Did he do temporary or per diem work? Did some of those 5 days fall outside of normal business days? Did he have a phone or contact on file with his employer. Many people during that time would work enough to get by and skip jobs. Many people did not leave personal information with employers. Or if they tried to call, having a answering machine was for the very elite...not your average person.

    5. Culturally, hispanic men are very stoic and there is a pressure for machismo. Most hispanic men do not confide in anyone about certain types of stressors. It is important to not show weakness or what not. I don't mean to stereotype, more just trying to get a cultural understanding. He may confide in his twin, but, I don't see him talking to the guys at a bar gripping about feeling used by the boss...He would have taken action, got another job or what not.

    6. Hispanic men have pride and take their responsibilities very seriously. They also are very family oriented. It is not uncommon for a young man to marry a woman who is carrying his child. It is a source of honor, pride and family values. This can be seen as positive or negative according to different people. While he may have done what was right by marrying her, if he was unhappy, it would not be unreasonable to see other people, or visit other women for days on end. As long as he was taking care of his child.

    7. I think any young couple with a child have financial issues. During this time, many women were entering the workforce, creating what is now the dual-income family. Culturally, she would have stayed at home to be the mother, wife, etc. But, as the Jones took off, not having that dual income really created poverty for many who were traditionalists. If he also was seeing other women on the side it could be draining of income. Or even dealing a bit of weed here and there to make ends meet...it would not be abnormal.

    8. She was the mother of his child. There is a respect there. The only issue I can see where this would come up is if she was white or other and the family was not happy out breaking away from the traditional type of marriage. Also, if this was a "mixed-race" couple...they could have a whole boat-load of pressures and stigma from outside society. That is hard enough to deal with for people in this day and age...let alone at that time. If that is the case, say if she was white...did some good ol' boy "take care of him" for taking a white woman? (Sorry, that sounds bad...but...we may as well eplore this) Or if she was hispanic, how long had her family been in the US and was his family viewed as a threat as they were first generation? Or if he was a ladies man...someone could have gotten upset?

    9. I can say he had traditional cultural values by marrying her. Other then that we do not know. I would say he was street wise and such...given the times and what was happening in our country. I would also say if family looked on skid row for him, he may have experimented with drugs...like everyone else at the time.

    10. Again, I do not see bullying or harassing in the sense like today. He may have been targeted because he is hispanic due to tensions at the time. Or if his wife was white/black/asian/etc. Most hispanic men hold their own, are very stoic and will protect their honor. The biggest question I have is if he or his identical twin was a target for some reason, who would they turn to? Certainly not the law?

    I apologize if my post above offends anyone. I am not stereotyping or passing any value judgments...I am just trying to figure things out as well.
    Thanks for this. Let me clarify a few things.

    1. Johnnie's wife Annette was white. She was born in Washington D.C. in 1953 (I don't know when her family moved west to California) and died in Texas in 1995. There's very little info on her that I've been able to find. I do know that she remarried a man named Henry Morgan in 1978 in Texas (Morgan is likewise deceased) and had two daughters with him named Melissa and Misty, born 1979 and 1981 respectively. Annette and Henry divorced in 1989.

    2. From what I'm able to gather, Johnnie's twin brother Joe began looking for Johnnie immediately after they realized he hadn't come home. Johnnie, Annette and Johnnie Jr. were all living with Johnnie's family at the time, so it would have been immediately obvious to them that Johnnie wasn't there.
    Joe simply said that it was totally out of character of Johnnie not to come home, so I can only assume that Johnnie had never done such a thing before. That's why I wonder why they didn't go to the police sooner than they did.

    3. I've thought about whether Johnnie's disappearance could have been a case of mistaken identity since he was an identical twin. But I think if Joe had someone who was after him and thought the Johnnie was targeted by mistake, I think such information would have come out over the years, either intentionally or accidentally.

    4. Unfortunately, I have never been able to find out what Johnnie did for a living.

    5. Not much to say to that.

    6. Not much to add there either.

    7. Annette was only 16 when she got pregnant and 17 when she gave birth to Johnnie Jr. In fact, her 18th birthday was 8/22/71, five days before Johnnie's disappearance. So it's quite possible that she was still in high school at the time Johnnie disappeared.

    8. Several people who lived in Southern California have told me the interracial dating/marriage between whites and Hispanics was never really that big of a deal, even back then. Southern California has always had a very large Hispanic population. Johnnie's older brother Ralph has a white wife also, so Johnnie wouldn't have been the first male in his family to bring home a white girl. I think the main sticking point was the pregnancy. However, that doesn't necessarily mean that Annette's family (being from Virginia) approved of the relationship. Virginia, even to this day, is a very conservative state in many ways.

    9. Again, not much to add.

    10. Again, Oxnard is a majority-minority type of area, largely Hispanic and has been for several decades. So I don't know if the racial tension in that area would have been the same as it would have been in other parts of the country at the time. I have thought about whether some bigot may have targeted Johnnie, but how would they have known where he'd be that night?

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  26. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobby88 View Post
    Thanks for this. Let me clarify a few things.

    1. Johnnie's wife Annette was white. She was born in Washington D.C. in 1953 (I don't know when her family moved west to California) and died in Texas in 1995. There's very little info on her that I've been able to find. I do know that she remarried a man named Henry Morgan in 1978 in Texas (Morgan is likewise deceased) and had two daughters with him named Melissa and Misty, born 1979 and 1981 respectively. Annette and Henry divorced in 1989.

    2. From what I'm able to gather, Johnnie's twin brother Joe began looking for Johnnie immediately after they realized he hadn't come home. Johnnie, Annette and Johnnie Jr. were all living with Johnnie's family at the time, so it would have been immediately obvious to them that Johnnie wasn't there.
    Joe simply said that it was totally out of character of Johnnie not to come home, so I can only assume that Johnnie had never done such a thing before. That's why I wonder why they didn't go to the police sooner than they did.

    3. I've thought about whether Johnnie's disappearance could have been a case of mistaken identity since he was an identical twin. But I think if Joe had someone who was after him and thought the Johnnie was targeted by mistake, I think such information would have come out over the years, either intentionally or accidentally.

    4. Unfortunately, I have never been able to find out what Johnnie did for a living.

    5. Not much to say to that.

    6. Not much to add there either.

    7. Annette was only 16 when she got pregnant and 17 when she gave birth to Johnnie Jr. In fact, her 18th birthday was 8/22/71, five days before Johnnie's disappearance. So it's quite possible that she was still in high school at the time Johnnie disappeared.

    8. Several people who lived in Southern California have told me the interracial dating/marriage between whites and Hispanics was never really that big of a deal, even back then. Southern California has always had a very large Hispanic population. Johnnie's older brother Ralph has a white wife also, so Johnnie wouldn't have been the first male in his family to bring home a white girl. I think the main sticking point was the pregnancy. However, that doesn't necessarily mean that Annette's family (being from Virginia) approved of the relationship. Virginia, even to this day, is a very conservative state in many ways.

    9. Again, not much to add.

    10. Again, Oxnard is a majority-minority type of area, largely Hispanic and has been for several decades. So I don't know if the racial tension in that area would have been the same as it would ha been in other parts of the country at the time. I have thought about whether some bigot may have targeted Johnnie, but how would they have known where he'd be that night?
    I have to disagree on the point of interracial marriage during that time frame. It absolutely *was* a *very* big deal; even in Southern California. It is very possible this was a hate crime, based on the fact he was married to a white woman...and got her pregnant. This was still very controversial in that time period.
    My posts are opinion and speculation only.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CarlK90245 View Post
    One possible scenario that comes to mind.

    I wonder if there was a dancer hired for entertainment at the bachelor party. If so, these dancers normally bring bodyguards to make sure that nobody gets out of line.

    Perhaps he crossed the line and was dealt with accordingly by the bodyguard.
    I agree that something happened at that bachelor party, and everyone there knows what it was. Maybe it was even an accident of sorts; they were drunk out of their minds and they started arguing and fighting...and it got out of hand. They panicked and disposed of the body. I think that it might have been this straight forward. One thing I believe for sure....those men who were there *know*.
    My posts are opinion and speculation only.

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  30. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by rosesfromangels View Post
    I have to disagree on the point of interracial marriage during that time frame. It absolutely *was* a *very* big deal; even in Southern California. It is very possible this was a hate crime, based on the fact he was married to a white woman...and got her pregnant. This was still very controversial in that time period.
    Actually, it would have been even more controversial, because she was already three months pregnant when they married. The detective told me that people suggested that Johnnie only married her because he got her pregnant.

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  32. #143
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobby88 View Post
    Actually, it would have been even more controversial, because she was already three months pregnant when they married. The detective told me that people suggested that Johnnie only married her because he got her pregnant.
    Thank you for all your input in the posts above! I do have a question about Annette. Did she raise their daughter or did she stay with his family? How did her fasmily handle the situation?

    Any possibility that during the party he maybe drank too much or had a drug(not sure if they did drugs) overdosed? And the friends or other party goers hid his body out of fear?
    Last edited by LucyOso; 06-13-2012 at 08:12 PM. Reason: spelling

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    Quote Originally Posted by LucyOso View Post
    Thank you for all your input in the posts above! I do have a question about Annette. Did she raise their daughter or did she stay with his family? How did her fasmily handle the situation?

    Any possibility that during the party he maybe drank too much or had a drug(not sure if they did drugs) overdosed? And the friends or other party goers hid his body out of fear?
    I think the hiding his body out of fear is quite likely. I think they were probably very drunk and fight broke out, and an accidental death. Speculation, of course. I think if Bobby88 keeps up this great work, someone will speak up finally!
    My posts are opinion and speculation only.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LucyOso View Post
    Thank you for all your input in the posts above! I do have a question about Annette. Did she raise their daughter or did she stay with his family? How did her fasmily handle the situation?

    Any possibility that during the party he maybe drank too much or had a drug(not sure if they did drugs) overdosed? And the friends or other party goers hid his body out of fear?
    They had a son, not a daughter. The son is Johnnie Herrera Jr. He was born 10/13/70 in Oxnard. Here's a picture of him as he looks today.

    http://a1.ec-images.myspacecdn.com/i...b0f18873/l.jpg

    I have no idea how long Annette stayed with the Herreras after Johnnie's disappearance. She was definitely in Texas by 1978 because she got married there to a man named Henry Morgan, a marriage that produced two daughters named Melissa and Misty (born 1979 and 1981 respectively). Annette and Henry divorced in 1989 and Henry, like Annette, is also deceased.

    I don't know anything about Annette's family, except that her mother's maiden name was Dellenbach. She also apparently had at least one sibling because the inscription on her headstone reads "Beloved Daughter, Sister, and Mother". Apparently, after she divorced Henry Morgan in 1989, she took back Johnnie's surname because her headstone is marker "Annette Lee Herrera". Either that or she decided not to change her name to Morgan at all when she married Henry in 1978.

    There are two death certificates on file for Johnnie, both of which were filed in 1978. One was filed by his twin brother Joe and the other by Annette. The one by Joe lists the date of death as 8/26/71 and Johnnie's age at the time as 20. The one filed by Annette has his date of death as 8/27/78 (seven years to the day after Johnnie was last seen; seven years is also the minimum number of years a person must be missing before they can be declared legally dead) and his age as 27, which is how old he would have been in 1978. It makes no sense to me why she did that, unless she just made a mistake without knowing or there was a mistake by the judge or whoever authorized the certificate.

    There also seems to be a bit of a discrepancy about the date Johnnie went missing. The date he is said to have been last seen, 8/27/71, was a Friday. However on his Namus page, the approximate time he was allegedly last seen is listed as 00:30, which is equivalent to midnight on a standard clock. So I'm wondering if the party was actually on the night of the 26th and carried over into the early morning hours of the 27th. Or the party was held on the 27th and spilled into the the early morning hours of the 28th.I have a feeling that the party was on the 26th because on the death certificate that Johnnie's brother Joe made out, Johnnie's date of death is listed as 8/26/71. This would make sense if the party was on the 26th because Joe did not go to the party with Johnnie and the last time he would have seen his brother would be as Johnnie was leaving their home to go there. It would have been the other people at the party who would have seen him at midnight.

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  36. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobby88 View Post
    They had a son, not a daughter. The son is Johnnie Herrera Jr. He was born 10/13/70 in Oxnard. Here's a picture of him as he looks today.

    http://a1.ec-images.myspacecdn.com/i...b0f18873/l.jpg

    I have no idea how long Annette stayed with the Herreras after Johnnie's disappearance. She was definitely in Texas by 1978 because she got married there to a man named Henry Morgan, a marriage that produced two daughters named Melissa and Misty (born 1979 and 1981 respectively). Annette and Henry divorced in 1989 and Henry, like Annette, is also deceased.

    I don't know anything about Annette's family, except that her mother's maiden name was Dellenbach. She also apparently had at least one sibling because the inscription on her headstone reads "Beloved Daughter, Sister, and Mother". Apparently, after she divorced Henry Morgan in 1989, she took back Johnnie's surname because her headstone is marker "Annette Lee Herrera". Either that or she decided not to change her name to Morgan at all when she married Henry in 1978.

    There are two death certificates on file for Johnnie, both of which were filed in 1978. One was filed by his twin brother Joe and the other by Annette. The one by Joe lists the date of death as 8/26/71 and Johnnie's age at the time as 20. The one filed by Annette has his date of death as 8/27/78 (seven years to the day after Johnnie was last seen; seven years is also the minimum number of years a person must be missing before they can be declared legally dead) and his age as 27, which is how old he would have been in 1978. It makes no sense to me why she did that, unless she just made a mistake without knowing or there was a mistake by the judge or whoever authorized the certificate.

    There also seems to be a bit of a discrepancy about the date Johnnie went missing. The date he is said to have been last seen, 8/27/71, was a Friday. However on his Namus page, the approximate time he was allegedly last seen is listed as 00:30, which is equivalent to midnight on a standard clock. So I'm wondering if the party was actually on the night of the 26th and carried over into the early morning hours of the 27th. Or the party was held on the 27th and spilled into the the early morning hours of the 28th.I have a feeling that the party was on the 26th because on the death certificate that Johnnie's brother Joe made out, Johnnie's date of death is listed as 8/26/71. This would make sense if the party was on the 26th because Joe did not go to the party with Johnnie and the last time he would have seen his brother would be as Johnnie was leaving their home to go there. It would have been the other people at the party who would have seen him at midnight.
    That is interesting with the dual death certificates. Perhaps, Annette needed one to legally marry Morgan and there was some rule about not declaring someone dead until exactly 7 years and one day after they are mssing? Maybe it was easier to obtain that, then go through the required loopholes and paperwork of trying to divorce? Or perhaps, at that time she decided to take SS benefits for her son and needed some sort of death certificate? Or it may have been a simple error of the date of filing for the death certificate being placed in the date of issue.

    Maybe when the brother filed the death certificate the last day he saw him was the 26th...even if the party was on the 27th. Is the brother still alive? Is Johnnie's information like DNA in Namus?

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  38. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by LucyOso View Post
    That is interesting with the dual death certificates. Perhaps, Annette needed one to legally marry Morgan and there was some rule about not declaring someone dead until exactly 7 years and one day after they are mssing? Maybe it was easier to obtain that, then go through the required loopholes and paperwork of trying to divorce? Or perhaps, at that time she decided to take SS benefits for her son and needed some sort of death certificate? Or it may have been a simple error of the date of filing for the death certificate being placed in the date of issue.

    Maybe when the brother filed the death certificate the last day he saw him was the 26th...even if the party was on the 27th. Is the brother still alive? Is Johnnie's information like DNA in Namus?
    The interesting thing is that Annette married Morgan before the exact seven-year mark. They were married on January 27, 1978. Perhaps she had already filed for divorce on grounds of abandonment and just decided to go the extra mile to declare him dead?

    Joe Herrera is still very much alive and living in Oxnard. Here's what he looks like today.

    http://www.vcstar.com/news/2011/sep/...se-still-open/

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  40. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by rosesfromangels View Post
    I think the hiding his body out of fear is quite likely. I think they were probably very drunk and fight broke out, and an accidental death. Speculation, of course. I think if Bobby88 keeps up this great work, someone will speak up finally!
    I also wondered if it could have been a joke or something gone horribly awry. Perhaps someone spiked Johnnie's drink without him knowing and he had a reaction to it and died. Or perhaps he had a "special" brownie (either knowingly or someone gave it to him without telling him that it had been laced with some drug) and died from some type of unforeseen complication.

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  42. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobby88 View Post
    I also wondered if it could have been a joke or something gone horribly awry. Perhaps someone spiked Johnnie's drink without him knowing and he had a reaction to it and died. Or perhaps he had a "special" brownie (either knowingly or someone gave it to him without telling him that it had been laced with some drug) and died from some type of unforeseen complication.
    Hi
    Saw your case on the spotlight. I'm on a Louisiana case, new to WS, but had only a few questions:
    The initial police investigator you contacted certainly gave out a great deal of personal info that I found strange;
    I know little of ethnic conflict in So CA from that time period, but it doesn't appear to have been strongly investigated by LE there;
    The 'fluff' anniversary piece is also odd-no one thought to ask twin about the 5 day wait to report, neither did the work issue come up;
    The yes, very curt message from LE. I know little of LE inner workings in large cities, but was that not an odd dept head for cold cases;
    And yes, why skid row?
    Bobby, have you reached out to his son?
    I agree with your posters, it's a really odd case.
    I happened to have been traveling through Oxnard that time, so many years ago, on my way to Big Sur to see old friends. Then back to Louisiana. Good luck, have faith, keep hope, buena suerte,
    Doña Mena

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    Quote Originally Posted by Donamena View Post
    Hi
    Saw your case on the spotlight. I'm on a Louisiana case, new to WS, but had only a few questions:
    The initial police investigator you contacted certainly gave out a great deal of personal info that I found strange;
    I know little of ethnic conflict in So CA from that time period, but it doesn't appear to have been strongly investigated by LE there;
    The 'fluff' anniversary piece is also odd-no one thought to ask twin about the 5 day wait to report, neither did the work issue come up;
    The yes, very curt message from LE. I know little of LE inner workings in large cities, but was that not an odd dept head for cold cases;
    And yes, why skid row?
    Bobby, have you reached out to his son?
    I agree with your posters, it's a really odd case.
    I happened to have been traveling through Oxnard that time, so many years ago, on my way to Big Sur to see old friends. Then back to Louisiana. Good luck, have faith, keep hope, buena suerte,
    Doña Mena
    Johnnie's son was only ten-months-old when his father vanished, so he wouldn't really remember him. Also, not to bash Johnnie's late wife Annette, but we really don't know what (if anything) she told Johnnie Jr. about his father that may have made him try or not try to find him.

    I find it so puzzling how there's very little info on Johnnie's wife Annette.
    I just think it's so odd how there's almost no info about her. Even in the article, it never mentions her name, but does mention Johnnie Jr.'s name, who was likely the reason (given the values of the day) that they married. It mentions that she's dead, but nothing more. I can't help but think that Johnnie's family didn't like her, even before he got her pregnant, although the pregnancy was probably icing on the cake as far everyone was concerned. Perhaps they only reluctantly welcomed her into their family because of the baby. When the article mentions that Johnnie's family searched for him in the days before they officially reported him missing, I wonder if that included Annette. The fact that her name has never been mentioned in any of the admittedly few reports about Johnnie gives the impression that Johnnie's family doesn't really want her name linked to theirs.

    I think there's a lot of things we're not being told.

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