Identified! CA - Ludlow, WhtFem UP2517, 17-22, buried, Nov'80 - Pamela Duffey & William Lane *arrest*

CarlK90245

UID Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Nov 11, 2009
Messages
8,242
Reaction score
6,659
The Doe Network:
Hot Case 1278
http://www.doenetwork.org/hot/hotcase1278.html
NamUs UP Case 2517 https://identifyus.org/cases/2517

No Image Available

Unidentified White Female

* The victim was discovered on November 17, 1980 near Ludlow, San Bernardino County, California
* Estimated date of Death: 1-6 months prior
* Partial Skeleton

Vital Statistics

* Estimated age: 17 - 22 years old
* Approximate Height and Weight: 5' 5"; 115 lbs.
* Distinguishing Characteristics: Light red/brown/blonde hair. Pierced left ear.
* Jewelry: Yellow metal, 10-K, size 7 ring, with 7 glass stones, center glass stone missing.
* Dentals: Available. Prim cuspid between 5, 6. Teeth 7, 10, 14 congenitally missing.
* DNA: Complete - Profile available at state lab

Case History
The victim was located in the desert, about 5 miles east of Ludlow, California on November 17, 1980. She may possibly have been a nurse.
 
Adrianne Gilliam
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/g/gilliam_adrianne.html

2231012710045078242S600x600Q85.jpg


Negatives:

The height (5'8") is off by three inches. But the remains were skeletal, and height measurements are not precise.

Positives:
  • She does have reddish blonde hair to match the UID
  • Her age (19) is within range (17-22)
  • Her weight (110 lbs) is close enough to the estimate (115 lbs)
  • Her DLC (22-Jun-1979) is 18 months prior to the Discovery Date (Postmortem interval of 1-6 months)
  • She was traveling on the road to correspond to the desolate desert location in which the UID was found.
  • DoeNet indicates that the UID may have been a nurse. Adrianne worked as a nurse's aide prior to her disappearance.

Questions:
  • On what are they basing the statement that the UID may have been a nurse?
  • There is no indication of her dental description. It would be an easy comparison if they were available, as the UID was missing the two upper lateral incisors (7 and 10) congenitally, as was her upper-left-second-molar (#15). Too bad the photo of her teeth is not more clear, as the missing incisors would be easy to see.
  • The UID description indicates a pierced left ear. It's uncertain if her right ear was not pierced, or if the remains were too decomposed to tell.
 
Adrianne Gilliam
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/g/gilliam_adrianne.html

2231012710045078242S600x600Q85.jpg


Negatives:

The height (5'8") is off by three inches. But the remains were skeletal, and height measurements are not precise.

Positives:
  • She does have reddish blonde hair to match the UID
  • Her age (19) is within range (17-22)
  • Her weight (110 lbs) is close enough to the estimate (115 lbs)
  • Her DLC (22-Jun-1979) is 18 months prior to the Discovery Date (Postmortem interval of 1-6 months)
  • She was traveling on the road to correspond to the desolate desert location in which the UID was found.
  • DoeNet indicates that the UID may have been a nurse. Adrianne worked as a nurse's aide prior to her disappearance.

Questions:
  • On what are they basing the statement that the UID may have been a nurse?
  • There is no indication of her dental description. It would be an easy comparison if they were available, as the UID was missing the two upper lateral incisors (7 and 10) congenitally, as was her upper-left-second-molar (#15). Too bad the photo of her teeth is not more clear, as the missing incisors would be easy to see.
  • The UID description indicates a pierced left ear. It's uncertain if her right ear was not pierced, or if the remains were too decomposed to tell.

Her hair reminds me so very much of the girl in this Alcala photo at some sort of outdoor concert or similar event.
http://cnnnancygrace.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/01021.jpg

Of course if she was an Alcala victim, latest possible date of death would have to put her significantly outside the earliest estimated date of death for that Doe. And the clothing in the Alcala photo seems a bit earlier than the late seventies, so she'd have to be someone he'd met once and got the details of then gone back for.
 
I dropped a quick e-mail to David Van Norman. He replied very promptly with the following message:

These two cases have never been matched against each other, that I can see. However, both have DNA profiles in CODIS and the state DNA lab, and theoretically that means they are not a match.

None of the publicly available info on AG indicated a CODIS entry, so I guess the only way to have found that out was to e-mail him as I did.
 
NamUs UP#2517
Probable year of death 1980 to 1980
Estimated postmortem interval 1 Months

Circumstances
Location Found
GPS coordinates
Address 1 5 miles east of Ludlow, south of SR 66
Address 2
City Ludlow
State California
Zip code 92357
County San Bernardino
Circumstances of death
Remains of a young male and a young female were found in a shallow grave in remote desert area off of "Route 66." Identity can only be established by comparison of dental X-rays and DNA.​
Bold by me.
I'm wondering if this is a NamUs mix up as this information is not listed in doe network. :waitasec: This young woman is the one who is possibly a nurse.
 
there is only one rule-out listed at Namus:

REBECCA DUNN 1958 Nevada

per namus this UID "had multiple gaps in her smile, both top and bottom, with congenitally missing lateral incisors and a retained primary right canine. Her smile was incredibly distinctive and should be recognizable on a photo."

Carl, since you've had positive dealings with David Van Norman before, is there any way you might be able to get some image of the mouth? the teeth/smile were so distinctive, they think they could make a match by photos.

"Possible identiifcation by comparison of "smiling photos" (showing teeth). "
 
Carl, since you've had positive dealings with David Van Norman before, is there any way you might be able to get some image of the mouth? the teeth/smile were so distinctive, they think they could make a match by photos.

"Possible identiifcation by comparison of "smiling photos" (showing teeth). "

Done.

I sent an e-mail to David VanNorman.
 
Carl, since you've had positive dealings with David Van Norman before, is there any way you might be able to get some image of the mouth? the teeth/smile were so distinctive, they think they could make a match by photos.

"Possible identiifcation by comparison of "smiling photos" (showing teeth). "

Done.

I sent an e-mail to David VanNorman.

VanNorman replied that there are six images uploaded to NamUs, but they are only visible to Law Enforcement users.
 
I noticed that Kimberly Ann Kahler's page on the Doe Network and Charley Project
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/k/kahler_kimberly.html
www.doenetwork.org/cases/942dfca.html
both state that
Kahler was last seen in Venice, California on January 1, 1980. She was accompanied by an unidentified male at the time of her disappearance.
She has reddish-brown hair like the unknown woman, yet her height is a little taller and she is two years younger than the age estimate. The way that she is smiling in the photo looks like someone who is trying to hide her teeth (IMO), that, her hair color, and that she was with a male is what got my attention.
kahler_kimberly.jpg


I wonder why LE believes that the woman in Ludlow was a nurse?
 
Deborah Susan Balken was an Australian nurse with quite a distinctive smile, missing in Australia 1st July 1980. Her female friend/flatmate also went missing, they'd phoned their fellow flatmate during a night out and said they would be away until the 18th, then they failed to return at all. Sounds about the right timeframe for if they'd organised to do a run as drug couriers, or even were being used as unwitting drug mules. Or maybe to help body pack, because they were both nurses. Since a smiling photo comparison is quick, cheap and easy, it might be worth running her smiling photo past the person in charge of the Doe's case.

http://www.missingpersons.gov.au/missing-persons/profiles/profiles/b/a/balken-deborah-susan.aspx
http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/223dfnsw.html
 
https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/11582/2

Barbara Bruno is a possibility.

Case Information

Date LKA August 01, 1980
Age LKA 18 to 19 years old
Race White
Sex Female
Height (inches) 61.0 to 63.0
Weight (pounds) 120.0 to 145.0
Circumstances
City Rochester
State New York
Circumstances
Barbara was last seen in 1980 by her family in Rochester. Rumors had her moving to New York City and also California and has not been heard from since.
DNA
Status: Samples submitted - Tests not complete
 
What about Brenda Crowley?

Her sister set up a myspace page. In various blog writings she says:
We wonder if you ever made it to California as you dreamed of when you were young.
and in a poem
not even the teeth knocked out ya mouth
.
I see that it says they were congenitally absent, but maybe she lost them when she was younger?

Date LKA
March 01, 1979
Age LKA-16 to 16 years old (would have been 17 in 1980.)
Race-White
Sex-Female
Height (inches)-65.0 (1 inch off from UID)
Weight (pounds)- 120.0 (5 lbs off from UID)
 
The following quote is from a personal narrative by author Paul Bailey about his time with Marine Corps Military Police at Twenty Nine Palms Marine Base. He refers to the unsolved disappearance of a 19 year old woman - probably some time in the early 1970's (the article does not state the date).

(quote) My informant told me that this Marine carried a small weapon, and wasn't going to get caught, he wasn't going to do time, and he'd shoot it out, either escape or die.

He also told me about this 19yrs old girl who had been this drug dealer's "*****." She hadn't been seen in a long time. I advised the task force and they interviewed him. They asked him if he'd wear a wire and see if he could get this dealer to talk about it so they'd have it on tape.

He agreed to wear a wire. It worked, the dealer told him about her. So now they were going to set up a buy/bust, to get this dude. (unquote)

Source:
Leatherneck Magazine
Where the Hell is 29 Palms?
By Paul Bailey

LINK:

http://www.leatherneck.com/ezine/ar...l-is-29-Palms/Where-the-Hell-is-29-Palms.html
 

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
74
Guests online
2,474
Total visitors
2,548

Forum statistics

Threads
590,011
Messages
17,928,944
Members
228,038
Latest member
shmoozie
Back
Top