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Thread: TX - Missing Fort Worth Three, 1974 - #1

  1. #401
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    by the way, in response to everyone question about the phrase used in the letter " I know I'm going to catch it" was a phrase we used as children. Our parents were raised in east Texas, Marshall to be exact. Their dialect was a little different than in North Texas. But that does not mean she wrote the letter only that I remember using the phrase and also telling my sons they were going to catch it if they didn't straighten up. I hope this is helpful to you. Have a blessed day.

  2. #402
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    Luminol can work even in a situation that is more than 100 years past the time blood was present. For example, it has been used in the Lizzie Borden house not too many years ago to examine the basement area for blood. It can work in a situation where the room has been repainted or refloored. The main issue would be if someone cleaned the crimescene with bleach. In that case, the whole room would glow as though it was covered with blood - however, it is easy for an investigator to distinguish between blood and bleach due to the characteristics of the two.

    [ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luminol[/ame]

    http://science.howstuffworks.com/luminol.htm
    Last edited by Balthazar; 06-28-2009 at 10:54 AM. Reason: add links

  3. #403
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    Deige, I would like to know about Rachel's relationship to Tommy's ex-wife and her family. Were these nice people? Was Tommy's ex nice to Rachel? Had she remarried? Did the police investigate them?

  4. #404
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    Princess Rose that would be a good question to ask kaiser sousa about Tommys ex and her family. I never met them. I'm pretty sure Rachel had little contact with Shawna other than to maybe pick up Shawn.

  5. #405
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    Debra, do you know whether Rachel updated her driver's license after she got married and moved into the house with Tommy? She was married only a few months before disappearing.

    If she was still carrying a license with her maiden name and address, that would indicate the abductor either knew her personally or talked to her long enough to get the new information if he knew to send a letter to Tommy and not to the Arnolds. Unless of course she had other documents like a school I.D. in her purse that might have had the new address and name...

  6. #406
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    Quote Originally Posted by deige View Post
    Princess Rose that would be a good question to ask kaiser sousa about Tommys ex and her family. I never met them. I'm pretty sure Rachel had little contact with Shawna other than to maybe pick up Shawn.
    That's a very interesting piece of information, Diege. I was thinking about a different scenario - one in which the ex felt betrayed by Tommy and wanted to get even. She knew about you dating him and she knew what Rachel looked like from when she dropped off or picked up her son for Tommy's visitation. It looks to me like you were dating Tommy as he finalized his divorce and then he took up with Rachel. What if Tommy's ex orchestrated this because she wanted to hurt Tommy? What if they mistook Renee for you, having never met you, and took all 3 girls to get even with Tommy?

    I'm wondering if your sister was approached by Tommy's ex and she asked her to come see her son, if the three girls would willingly go with her?

    Which leads to the question of the gift in your sister's car for Tommy's son - did Renee's mother know Renee had bought that gift for him for certain? If not, that could indicate that gift was put in the car to cast suspicion away from the guilty party.

  7. #407
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    Ive finally been able to catch up on this thread-WOW!Great work guys-has anyone heard from the Detective currently handling the case?I know it was said he had a heart attack then a bypass but was back at work?
    The saints are the sinners who keep trying...

  8. #408
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    This Place breaks my heart


  9. #409
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    I was thinking about a different scenario - one in which the ex felt betrayed by Tommy and wanted to get even.




    I really dont think so , dont really want to say why on site

  10. #410
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    Well its starting to sound like Rachel might have written the letter if "catch it" was a commonly used phrase as Diege says. Diege I know this is heartbreaking for you to revisit all this here but we want to help. If your anything like me, you aint getting any younger. Somebody has to no something , we have to get closure for all. How certain is everyone that Rachel didnt write the letter? would you say 50/50 chance or what?

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  12. #411
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaiser Sousa View Post
    I was thinking about a different scenario - one in which the ex felt betrayed by Tommy and wanted to get even.




    I really dont think so , dont really want to say why on site
    You can PM me, if you want with this info. I will not publicly reveal anything on the website that you want to keep private.

    The astrologist who is working with us also does not see anything on the charts indicating that Tommy's ex was involved. I just want to rule out every "known" person.

  13. #412
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    is there spell check on this site? I know "know" is not spelled "no"

  14. #413
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    It is not unusual to invite the detective involved in a Cold Case to Websleuths and they will often come on here and post. Websleuths has a pretty good reputation with law enforcement for solving cold cases. I think it might be helpful to get the public case file first, however, so that we can ask educated questions. Right now I think we are still dealing with a lot of supposition.

  15. #414
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaiser Sousa View Post
    is there spell check on this site? I know "know" is not spelled "no"
    Sadly, no. One way to get around it is to type in Word, spellcheck there then copy paste here. It's klugy, but effective. At any rate, no one here cares about spelling mistakes!

  16. #415
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    There is another member who is an astrologist (and a really good one) who has been helping us. In general her charts show this was a stranger abductions, that the girls could have been taken from a restroom and also show that Rachel's wedding rings are with the unsub and this evidence may someday be his undoing.

    This makes me wonder where the restrooms were at Seminary South - does anyone remember? With the Christmas rush, I would imagine the ones in the department stores would have a long line for the ladies room. So is it possible that the girls went down to the basement to use a restroom that was less known - perhaps one near the former bowling alley?

    Diege, do you remember anything about the restrooms at the mall? Was there one in the basement you all knew about?

  17. #416
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    Restrooms

    there were some large ones upstairs at sears that the stalls were pay toilets in 1973, there were restrooms in the Restaurants, El Chicos, Wyatts, and Bobs(if it was still there) and the largest and free was in the basement on the south side where Razors Edge and the Radio Station were. There were not many public restrooms in most of the stores. And of course the bowling alley had restrooms, but now that i think of it they wouldnt have gone to the bowling alley then to use them, because if it was open they wouldnt like it down there and I think it was closed by then. I wish there were some public records on what was open and when.

  18. #417
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    Is there something distinct about the ring that would make it easy to identify?

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  20. #418
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    Quote Originally Posted by Princess Rose View Post
    There is another member who is an astrologist (and a really good one) who has been helping us. In general her charts show this was a stranger abductions, that the girls could have been taken from a restroom and also show that Rachel's wedding rings are with the unsub and this evidence may someday be his undoing.

    This makes me wonder where the restrooms were at Seminary South - does anyone remember? With the Christmas rush, I would imagine the ones in the department stores would have a long line for the ladies room. So is it possible that the girls went down to the basement to use a restroom that was less known - perhaps one near the former bowling alley?

    Diege, do you remember anything about the restrooms at the mall? Was there one in the basement you all knew about?
    Maybe they were held in the restroom in the bowling alley by a security person if, and that's if the bowling alley had been shut down. Otherwise, I can't see three girls being taken from any restroom during heavy Christmas shopping. Some other time of the year possibily, but not during the last days before Christmas. It would've been too great a risk for the perp/s.

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  22. #419
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    I still say they were tricked or trusted their abductor, i dont believe it could have been a forced abduction inside the mall or in the parking lot in broad daylight

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  24. #420
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    I found this:

    DAVID WAYNE McCALL, suspect
    Dallas, Texas
    Irving man suspect in Indiana killing -- (Dallas News)
    An Irving man suspected but not charged in the slayings of a half-dozen Dallas-area women has been a murder suspect in his native Indiana for two decades, police there say. Woman's 1978 murder unsolved; he denies part in any slayings.


    I can't find any more information about this guy online. Maybe whoever is in Dallas can check the archives there.

    Deige, it would be worth checking with Ft. Worth LE to see if they think this guy was a possibility or if they ever considered him.

  25. #421
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaiser Sousa View Post
    I still say they were tricked or trusted their abductor, i dont believe it could have been a forced abduction inside the mall or in the parking lot in broad daylight

    I would think they may have been tricked even if for an istant. A phony floor walker accusing them of shoplifting in the parking lot or a van parked near to theirs. The only thing about a vehicle purposely parking near is it was the Christmas holidays and parking spots might have been hard to find near a particular spot. I saw the tv show the other night about Ted Bundy and how he used ruses with the arm casts back during that time and wonder if it could have been something similar. How anyone could get 3 scared girls under control is beyond me though. Does anyone think the car could have left the mall with the girls then been taken back there? The thing with the gas station owner still bothers me since someone did report the sighting.

  26. #422
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    Respectfully snipped

    txsvicki :
    Does anyone think the car could have left the mall with the girls then been taken back there? The thing with the gas station owner still bothers me since someone did report the sighting.
    txsvicki, that's certainly a possibility, but I don't see how it would tie in with the sighting the next day.

  27. #423
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    Here is the story of David Wayne McCall. He's obviously a serial killer, but it appears that he was most likely too young to be involved in the trio case. He was 35 in 1995, which would make him 14 in 1974 and living in Indiana. He apparently committed his first murder at age 15 there. Most of his crimes in the DFW area were in the 1990's.

    http://www.crimezzz.net/serialkiller...avid_wayne.php

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  29. #424
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    McCall files an false arrest claim in 2004 from Texas prison - finding for the defendants (arresting detectives) - they did have probable cause for the arrest.

    http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:...&ct=clnk&gl=us

  30. #425
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaiser Sousa View Post
    there were some large ones upstairs at sears that the stalls were pay toilets in 1973, there were restrooms in the Restaurants, El Chicos, Wyatts, and Bobs(if it was still there) and the largest and free was in the basement on the south side where Razors Edge and the Radio Station were. There were not many public restrooms in most of the stores. And of course the bowling alley had restrooms, but now that i think of it they wouldnt have gone to the bowling alley then to use them, because if it was open they wouldnt like it down there and I think it was closed by then. I wish there were some public records on what was open and when.
    What do you mean they wouldn't like it down in the bowling alley if it was open? Was this an area known for criminal activity or was it taken over by teen boys or what?

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