Help! I can't find any links anywhere that state that B and L were removed from K&R's custody prior to this happening.
Help! I can't find any links anywhere that state that B and L were removed from K&R's custody prior to this happening.
I was surprised to see Kiesha was buried in an open area in the woods.
I too doubt R&K buried Kiesha together but they may have. K&R had a newborn and a toddler to take care of and Rob said he couldn't assist in the search for Kiesha because their children needed them but I wouldn't be shocked to learn Kristi did leave her children who were completely dependent on her alone occasionally. CPS was called many many times to investigate allegations Kiesha was being grossly abused at home and they were powerless to stop it so Kristi didn’t live in fear of loosing her children. Remember when Kristi went upstairs to visit her neighbor shortly after her son was born without Kiesha? IIRC Kiesha's sister wasn’t there either and Kristi didn't explain where her daughters were so perhaps she left them alone at home. She didn't say the girls were in her husband's care and AFAIK, the neighbor didn't ask her where they were.
This sick couple have emotionally wounded and deeply scarred a lot of people. I suspect the reason Kristi is distraught in jail is because they got caught. She was sure cocky before they were arrested; flashing her finger with **** U written on it at the camera and chanting "don't judge me". She didn't attend her daughter's vigil either IIRC.
If she murdered her firstborn, she got away with murder once already and she was free to visit his grave whenever she pleased, so perhaps this is why she figured she could visit her daughter's gravesite and she wasn't able to differentiate and take the cost involved seriously.
One of these two should have put their foot down when their partner suggested they visit Kiesha's gravesite on her Birthday and made them see what they stood to loose if they followed through with such an absurd idea. One of them should have refused to discuss the matter any further and refused to accompany them. But this couple is very unstable and they aren't able to offer each other the love and emotional support they need to "make it" so they blindly walked into a situation most couples would have chosen to avoid. On the other hand, I am glad they did make this choice because they lost their right to raise their remaining children and now they have to face and live with the consequences of their actions. Fortunately Justice is being served in this case.
Last edited by Crosby87; 04-25-2011 at 11:56 PM. Reason: move a line
On that note, I'm wondering if all news articles referring to Kiesha as 'Kiesha Abrahams' may provide an advantage for detectives and the prosecution. Technically, that's not her name - I'm assuming it's 'Keisha Weippart' (spelling?). Maybe it was a strategic (and smart) move on behalf of the investigative detectives to let that name be touted about.
Oh for sure. It amazes me that when people are arrested they weep, they cry, they collapse ... the only thing they're upset about is getting caught, not the actual crime (I'm certain of that). Do we know if K is no stranger to jail? I'm sure she would know the welcoming she'll receive in prison for a crime such as hers.I suspect the reason Kristi is distraught in jail is because they got caught.
Last edited by Nosee_Parker; 04-26-2011 at 12:22 AM. Reason: Added a quote
She could have told R that if he didn't go with her for the b'day visit, she would tell the police everything.
It just stinks of a trap to me....Just my gut feeling
IMO, She's gotten cocky and thinks she can get away with anything,
I know the phones were bugged- but that just doesn't add up for me. If they were drug users, even in the past, they would know to never talk specifics on a phone....especially one that had been in the hands of police!
Would certainly be interesting to see the surveillance of the night to see the demeanor/body language of both.
Would be even better to find out that K thought she was working with the cops to pin this on Rob, when they were actually using her to get both of them.
RE: upstairs neighbour:
^ From the 3rd Aug, which puts the visit around 1 week after the murder and a few days after the body disposal....and Kristi.seemed.fine.'I nursed it right here,'' the neighbour said yesterday as police dusted for fingerprints downstairs. ''But I haven't seen the little girl for a while,'' he said. ''Can't remember when … The mum seemed fine.''
That's gonna really hurt her come trial time.
-13 days between L's birth and Kiesha alleged DOD
-16 days between L's birth and kieshas alleged body disposal
-11 days between alleged DOD and date Kiesha was reported missing.....11 days to cover everything up.
I am starting to doubt the taxi story (its possible to me that the brothers car was used)....also I thought they were followed there by police because of a tip off...do we think they actually TOLD someone else? Can't imagine anyone in Sydney not knowing their faces with the coverage, especially someone picking up a couple with a stinky suitcase to take into the bush!! All shall be revealed at trial no doubt.
Put down the pitchfork and back away from the monitor ..
From the day of the arrests:
Det Insp Oxford confirmed the couple’s other children were removed by officers from the Department of Community Services earlier this week.
Love For Kiesha Abrahams Beats Flames
Just hours after a teddy bear tumbled on to a candle, sending Kiesha's memorial wall up in flames, mourners had begun to rebuild the display.
The blackened fence outside Kiesha's former home on Woodstock Ave, Mt Druitt, was decorated with fresh flowers, toys and cards soon after firefighters left yesterday.
Fire Destroys Kiesha Abrahams Memorial
Investigators do not believe the blaze was deliberately lit and fire fighters have returned to the site this morning to try to restore as much of it as possible.
I think Kiesha was already dead the day Kristi went to talk with her neighbor who lived above her and the reason she went was because her and Robert wanted to know if she heard anything the night Kiesha was murdered.
From Rob's dad:
And...''It's hard to believe he had something to do with this. I'd like to think he had nothing to do with it.''
Mr Smith said his son's mother, Rebecca, had visited him in custody yesterday where he was ''fairly upset''. He planned to see him today.
But Mr Smith said he did not get along with his de facto daughter-in-law, Ms Abrahams. ''I myself didn't like her a lot, but that's just a personal opinion.''
^BBMDespite earlier indications from police that they would reopen an investigation into the death of Kiesha's brother, homicide Detective Inspector Russell Oxford said yesterday he had consulted colleagues and it would not go ahead.
More from Chris' mum at link...
Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/kieshas-st...#ixzz1Kg6sXy2r
Have some tissues on stand-by for this one....
A grieving dad's final tribute to Kiesha Abrahams
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/nat...-1226045307434The pair told The Daily Telegraph they would lay Kiesha to rest with the dignity and respect she was robbed of for the nine months she lay in a shallow bush grave.
The child's family said they hoped to bury her alongside her older brother Ayden, who died in 2003 when he was just a few weeks old.
"That's what I want, both my kids together, brother and sister there with one another to keep each other happy," Mr Weippeart said. The family also requested Kiesha's surname be returned to the name she was born with.
"On her birth certificate she is Kiesha Weippeart, and that's how we would like her remembered," Mrs Weippeart said.
Wow! The last 9 months have taken such a physical toll on Chris. He looks so fragile.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news...-1226045234400The post-mortem examination at Glebe Coroners Court in Sydney on the skeletal remains is expected to be finalised today.
http://mt-druitt-standard.whereilive...abrahams-case/This latest news comes comes when detectives hope to have skeletal remains found in a shallow bush grave identified this week.
A post mortem is also expected to determine the cause of death.
Not sure if that bit about COD is to explain to readers in general that a PM can usually provide a COD , or that they mean it is possible that it can be determined with Kiesha's remains. Fingers crossed
A good read.....
Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/societ...#ixzz1Kgx4tMxXVicious threats of an online mob rescue no children
Another group titled ''No death penalty for Kristi Abrahams, the bi*ch needs to suffer'' also attracted more than 1000 members before it was shut down. Members of that group referred to the pair as ''cannibals'', ''mutts'' and ''cowards'' and many described in detail the modes of torture they would like to inflict on the pair.
The Australian Institute of Health and Welfare estimates that about 33,000 Australian children suffered some form of abuse last year. Yet a survey of 22,000 people by the National Association for Prevention of Child Abuse and Neglect found more than half of Australians say they would turn a blind eye when confronted with signs of abuse.
They would do so for fear that they might be wrong (48 per cent), because it was not their business (42 per cent), because they would not know what to do (38 per cent) or because they did not want to admit that the abuse had happened (22 per cent). Only one person in three would contact the police if a child disclosed sexual abuse.
In other words, while certain individuals are all too eager to get up on their soapboxes after the fact, few of us would step up and take responsibility if we were presented with signs of abuse.
The autopsy has been inconclusive.
Yep, definitely something wrong with their timeline. I remember commenting at the time (as I had watched the Golden Compass that night too) that their timeline was hinky. IIRC they stated they put her to bed just before the movie finished which I thought was a load of bullcrap as you wouldn't let a child watch all that way into a movie to put them to bed 10 mins before it finishes.
This statement immediately made me suspect her parents had "interferred" and hurt Kiesha. However Kiesha was already deceased when Kristi and Rob claimed she went missing sometime between Saturday night and Sunday morning. There was a report stating Kiesha wasn't removed from the flat until 3 days after she died as a result of her injuries. Unless Kristi and Rob tell the truth, we may never know the date and time of her death.
I was hoping the autopsy would find trauma to the skull or broken bones since a significant amount of Kiesha's blood was found in her home. If Kiesha had been suffocated or died from a drug overdose, there wouldn't have been any traces of blood found.
I didn’t believe Kristi either. Kristi claimed she tucked Kiesha into her bed at 9:30pm and she reported her eldest daughter missing on Sunday morning after she went into her room and discovered her bed was empty and the front door ajar, although it showed no sign of forced entry. Ms Abrahams had told police she put her daughter to bed at 9.30 pm and noticed her missing at 10 am on Sunday, though she had told a friend she noticed her daughter gone about 9 am. Kristi makes it sound like she slept in Sunday morning and parents with young children usually are up at the crack of dawn taking care of their children.
Nine o'clock is when business hours begin so it makes you think these two were actually taking care of business.
Most youngsters get up at the crack of dawn and Ms. Abrahams was nursing a newborn. There was another toddler living in the home too, so IMO Kristi should have awoken to find her eldest daughter missing sooner by several hours. She also said she wasn’t sure if the front door was locked when they went to sleep.
When asked if he had any suspicions where Kiesha might be, Mr Smith said: ''I have no idea. If I had any idea we'd be there looking.''
Is this the area in which Kiesha was found?
A psychic has also described to police a vision of Kiesha in bushland behind Amelia Way at Bidwell. The bush is a dumping spot with couches and old clothes littered throughout the grass.
Last edited by Crosby87; 04-27-2011 at 04:48 PM. Reason: punctuation
Home to tragedy - inside Kiesha Abrahams' death flat
^ shows pictures of the refurbished Woodstock Ave unit.
Link to inconclusive PM results.....
Further tests will be needed to determine whether the remains, found scattered through bushland at Shalvey, in Sydney's west, belong to the six-year-old.
Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/kiesha-mor...#ixzz1KlVXqCzc
I am surprised they announced Kiesha was murdered on Tuesday, July 20th, 2010. I thought because she has been deceased for 9 months, an examination of her remains would not be able to determine the day she died.
Her mother, Kristi Anne Abrahams, 28, and step-father, Robert Smith, 31, were charged on Good Friday with murdering the little girl on July 20 last year.
This is a snippet from a report that was released shortly after Kiesha was reported missing by her mother:
"Police say they are now investigating reports provided by a female neighbour who claims she saw the young girl on their street on July 23 or 24."
The flat Kiesha's family occupied has 2 bedrooms and a media report said Kiesha had her own bedroom which was located near the front door. AFAIK, LE never confirmed she had her own bedroom but it seems more plausible Kiesha shared a bedroom with her younger sister.
Last edited by Crosby87; 04-27-2011 at 09:33 PM. Reason: spelling error
The date of 20th July as DOD is what makes me think they have an informant, since it appears they had that date set in place even before the remains were collected/examined.
Pretty sure it was confirmed that Kiesha had the room all to herself....by LE and K&R.
It’ll be interesting to see who the informant is. The thought crossed my mind it could very well be Rob. Anyway, yes, it certainly looks like someone’s been talking to the police about the specifics of Kiesha’s murder.
My heart goes out to poor Kiesha. R.I.P. little darling.
"A female neighbour saw Kiesha with a relative near her street, Woodstock Avenue in Mount Druitt on July 23 or 24 and another report said a female neighbor saw Kiesha playing outside on their street July 23 or 24."
Other neighbors told police they had not seen Kiesha since Mother’s Day, May 9th, which means they hadn't seen Kiesha for approximately 2 months!
The neighbor Kristi went to visit upstairs was a male. IMO Kristi paid him a visit to find out if he heard the fighting and screaming that occurred the night she was murdered and whether he would disclose this information to the police. His only comments were that he hadn’t seen the little girl for awhile and Kristi seemed fine. I wonder if he is withholding information from investigators.
Kiesha's grandmother, Robert's mother, said she last saw Kiesha on July 7 when the little girl visited her newborn brother in hospital so she didn't lie to protect her son and daughter-in-law.
Kiesha attended a family birthday party four weeks before she went missing which would have been near the end of June, just before Kristi gave birth.
Kiesha attended school for only a handful of days during this her first year of school. Kiesha was enrolled in a playgroup for indigenous children about two years ago, but attended only 12 days.
Detectives interviewed western Sydney man, Albert Lafaele, after he claimed he saw Mr. Smith punching Kiesha outside the Hebersham Friendly Grocer store two or three weeks ago. "I was shocked. I walked past a white car and I saw this man whacking his child in the face," said Mr Lafaele, who runs weekend markets next to the supermarket."The girl was kicking and screaming, so I stopped in front of the car and told the man to hit me instead, which gave Kiesha a chance to jump out of the car."
Because this witness said Robert was driving a white car, I assumed it belonged to R&K, but perhaps it belonged to Kristi's brother? If R&K did take a taxi to the location where they buried Kiesha's remains, I wonder if they placed the suitcase in the trunk of the car and whether LE located the driver and tested the vehicle for body fluids?
If Kiesha was murdered on Tuesday, July 20, 2010, R&K waited 11 days to report her missing.
The reason Kiesha had her own bedroom in MO was to prevent her stepsister from witnessing the ongoing abuse R&K inflicted upon her.
An analysis of the statements made by Rob and Kristi indicate they committed this crime IMO.
Will details of the trial be released to the public BWI?
Last edited by Crosby87; 04-28-2011 at 09:39 AM. Reason: add a word
Hopefully now that Kiesha has been found, he will find peace and his life will return to "normal".
THE father of missing six-year-old Kiesha Abrahams was taken to hospital yesterday after collapsing at home and vomiting blood, as tension over the child's whereabouts became unbearable for her family.
And police revealed last night they were investigating a female neighbour seeing Kiesha with a relative near her street, Woodstock Avenue in Mount Druitt, on July 23 or 24.
An ambulance was called yesterday to the Tregear home of Kiesha's father Chris Weippeart, a diabetic who recently had a toe amputated, after he collapsed into the arms of his brother Matthew.
''I walked in and he just collapsed in my arms,'' said Matthew, a nightclub bouncer from the Gold Coast who had come to offer his support.
''He hasn't been sleeping … he hasn't left the house because of the TV cameras out the front. People have been twisting his words.''
Mr Weippeart's mother, Elizabeth Weippeart, said her son was on a drip and hospital staff said his blood pressure was low.
Mr. Weippeart, who has had minimal contact with Kiesha since she was a toddler, was interviewed by police on Wednesday. His home in Colbeck Avenue was searched and DNA samples were taken last week.
Police said they had been told of allegations that Kiesha's father, Christopher Weippeart, pointed a gun at his daughter, her half-sister, Brianna, and Mr Smith, last month.
Kylie Marshall, a friend of Kiesha's mother, told the Herald the gun allegations had been reported to police only after the child's disappearance.
"Four weeks ago the father rode past on a bike when Robbie was out hanging the clothes on the line with the two girls, Brianna and Kiesha, and pointed a gun at them," she said.
But a spokesman for Mr Weippeart said he was at Nepean Hospital at the time, having his toe amputated. "We don't want a trial by media; we've heard these allegations," he said.
Last edited by Crosby87; 04-28-2011 at 10:40 AM. Reason: add information
FYI, ‘The Golden Compass' is a film about rescuing kidnapped children in a parallel universe so perhaps R&B got their ideas to stage a kidnapping from this film.
Claiming Kiesha slept in a room by herself by the front door makes it easier for the family to spin this theory. Kristi doesn't remember if they locked the front door before they went to bed on this particular night.
Kiesha’s stepfather, Robert Smith, said he last saw Kiesha when they watched a movie, The Golden Compass, on Saturday night.
Ms Abrahams says Kiesha went missing from the Mount Druitt district flat some time after 9.30 pm on Saturday, when, she says, the family finished watching The Golden Compass, a film about the rescuing of kidnapped children in a parallel universe, and she put her eldest child to bed.
Police are refusing to confirm reports they told Kiesha Abrahams's stepfather to take them to her body.
Robert Smith told News Ltd detectives "got tough" with him during an interview on Wednesday night, with police asking him to "take them to the body".
Mr. Smith told News Ltd that they asked him to ''lead us to her body'' and said they would help with counseling if he co-operated. He said there was ''no way in the world'' he would have hurt Kiesha. He also said that police had not asked Ms Abrahams about a body.
Kiesha has been listed as missing since Saturday night with an extensive search of nearby homes, bushland and dams finding no trace of the six-year-old.
Mr. Smith said he believes police have labeled him the key suspect in her disappearance.
"Absolutely, they think I did it," he told the Daily Telegraph.
"They said 'lead us to her body' and that sort of thing. It was pretty tough."
Mr. Smith denies having anything to do with Kiesha's disappearance.
“Det Insp Oxford confirmed the couple’s other children were removed by officers from the Department of Community Services earlier this week.”
I found the statement the upstairs neighbour gave to Police regarding screams he heard at 6 am the morning Kiesha was reported missing very interesting. This is likely the same neighbor Kristi went to visit with her son before she reported Kiesha "missing".
Since LE believe Kiesha was murdered in her home between July 20-27, that means the screams their neighbor heard at 6 am on July 31 WERE FAKED and this couple were indeed awake long before Kristi called the Police around 9-10 am.
[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6379069&postcount=427"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased Australia - Kiesha Abrahams, 6, Sydney, 31 July 2010 - #2[/ame]
Last edited by Crosby87; 04-28-2011 at 02:37 PM. Reason: add informaton
Robert came into Kristi's and Kiesha's life after they separated and AFAIK the 2 children who were living in the home when Kiesha disappeared are Kristi's and Robert's.