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Thread: David Hartley - Pirates shoot US man in Mexican waters #3

  1. #376
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    I doubted Mexico would do any real testing.

    There are so many dead bodies found in Mexico I couldn't imagine them trying to forensically ID them all.

    I hope David is found one day.
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  3. #377
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    I was almost certain they would not identify this poor person's dead body as David Hartley. There are so many people killed in Mexico, related to the drug cartels in the past several years, it's unreal. No DNA testing? I am NOT surprised at all. This is just another day in THEIR WORLD.

    I've been following this since '04(?), '05(?), when articles started popping up about over 40 people from Loredo, Texas who'd disappeared after crossing into Mexcio. LE in Mexico told the families it was because their loved ones were involved with the drug cartels, when MANY said, "There is no way!' After reading several of the families' accounts, I realized, these people were being slaughtered for no reason. I even attempted to begin a dialogue here on Websleuths and started a thread, but received almost no response, or very little.

    Living on the Mexican border and having family from Mexico, I KNOW what's happening. I personally love Mexico and am sad that it's now too dangerous to travel there.

    But guess what? I still have people in my family who still find a reason, 'oh, they just have to go there. Don't worry, nothing will happen.' ....................oh? really?

    I realize there are many people who I, or anyone else, can convince that this was a day-trip that went horribly bad. This is after all, a crime sleuthing community and many of us suspect everything and everyone. But sometimes, bad things happen to nice people. Nice people sometimes make bad, or incorrect decisions that have deadly consequences. And the younger you are, the more invincible you feel, leading to the type of thing that happened to David and Tiffany Hartley. To be honest, when I was their age, I may have felt the same. IF ONLY I knew THEN, what I KNOW NOW, well,................you get the point.

    Unfortunately, I believe the Hartley family will never find the answers they seek. There is no happy ending here. There will most likely never be an arrest, ............. no confession, no body.......... Just another day in the world,........... life of the Mexican drug cartels.

    So sad. So many lost lives, unnecessary loss of life. My heart goes out to all of the victims of this violence. Most especially to Tiffany and the Hartley family.

    JMHO
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  5. #378
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kimberlyd125 View Post
    http://www.9news.com/news/article/24...le-jet-skiing-

    Test results from the Mexican government show clothing on a human skeleton found on Falcon Lake does not match what David Hartley was wearing the day he reportedly died. Additionally, the skeleton's skull does not have a bullet wound.

    * earlier reports said the skull did have a bullet hole.
    That's why we don't have fishermen doing autopsies.


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  7. #379
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    Was checking my subscriptions and I noticed this thread had revived activity...
    I did not hear/read that skeletal remains had been found in Falcon Lake..
    Looks like I need to go back a few pages and start reading ....
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    Mexico makes arrest in killing of U.S. tourist on Falcon Lake

    Mexico makes arrest in killing of U.S. tourist on Falcon Lake

    "Mexican marines over the weekend arrested a man they say masterminded some of the most horrific crimes in northern Mexico, including the killing of U.S. tourist David Michael Hartley two years ago and mass slaughters in a border state."

    Read more: http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/loc...#ixzz28jMfJ9vX
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  10. #381
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    I'm hoping this family can get some answers.
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  12. #382
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoeticSoul View Post
    Mexico makes arrest in killing of U.S. tourist on Falcon Lake

    "Mexican marines over the weekend arrested a man they say masterminded some of the most horrific crimes in northern Mexico, including the killing of U.S. tourist David Michael Hartley two years ago and mass slaughters in a border state."

    Read more: http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/loc...#ixzz28jMfJ9vX
    From your link:

    Mexican officials said Martínez is a high-ranking Zeta who oversaw the gang's criminal activity in the states of Tamaulipas, Nuevo Leon and Coahuila, all of which border Texas. Mexico had a 15 million peso (more than $1 million) bounty on his head.

    Read more: http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/loc...#ixzz28lB98j2h
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  14. #383
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    Mexican authorities have arrested an alleged drug cartel leader known as Commander Squirrel who they say is linked to the 2010 murder of American jet skier David Hartley on a border lake, as well as to more than 200 other deaths in Mexico. http://news.yahoo.com/narcoboss-comm...opstories.html
    Well, I'm glad there's a chance there might be some justice.

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    I'm hoping this has some actual ties to Hartley, and not some 'round up the usual suspects and close the books' due to diplomatic pressure. Everything about this case has been so odd and vague, cynical thought I know, this just crosses my mind.

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  18. #385
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    Quote Originally Posted by corq View Post
    I'm hoping this has some actual ties to Hartley, and not some 'round up the usual suspects and close the books' due to diplomatic pressure. Everything about this case has been so odd and vague, cynical thought I know, this just crosses my mind.
    Gnaws at mine.


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  20. #386
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    Tiffany Hartley hopeful that Mexico will try cartel leader in her husband’s slaying

    http://www.greeleytribune.com/news/c...ey-2010-mexico
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  22. #387
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    http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/art...on-3933490.php

    Hartley widow says Zeta arrest brings vindication

    Hartley, who now lives in Colorado, said the announcement should satisfy her critics: “The people who thought I had something to do with it can finally go, ‘But Mexico's admitting that they had something to do with it.'”

    Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano said early that “speculation is unwarranted” toward Tiffany Hartley.

    Zapata County Sheriff Sigifredo Gonzalez said he was frustrated by the way the Mexican government treated her.

    “She wasn't interviewed but rather interrogated,” he said.

    Some months earlier, officials received reports of armed “pirates” on the lake, robbing U.S. fishermen at gunpoint.

    Sheriff Gonzalez said Tuesday that Tiffany's story was, from the beginning, consistent with those reports.

    “I'm sure that the Mexican military is not going to lie about this thing,” Gonzalez said. “I'm sure he was involved somehow, though not the actual killing of Hartley himself.”

    Mexican officials naming Hartley as a murder victim is “very important,” he said.
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  24. #388
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    David Hartley - Pirates shoot US man in Mexican waters #3

    Quote Originally Posted by Linda7NJ View Post
    Except for the FACT there was ZERO reason to hide THIS body.

    Sorry there was every reason to take and hide the American body that they killed to protect their drug dealings.

    Last night I watched a cnn special on it. They have witnesses that have come forth to support wife's story and photos of the pirates from surveillance that are dressed exactly as she described.

    It happened just as she says it did.

    It's so sad that we are so suspicious of victims anymore.
    http://www.cnn.com/2012/10/08/world/...cartel-arrest/

    http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../23/cp.01.html


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    Last edited by ScarlettScarpetta; 01-05-2014 at 12:02 PM.
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  26. #389
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScarlettScarpetta View Post
    Sorry there was every reason to take and hide the American body that they killed to protect their drug dealings.

    Last night I watched a cnn special on it. They have witnesses that have come forth to support wife's story and photos of the pirates from surveillance that are dressed exactly as she described.

    It happened just as she says it did.

    It's so sad that we are so suspicious of victims anymore.
    http://www.cnn.com/2012/10/08/world/...cartel-arrest/

    http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../23/cp.01.html


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    Wow! I guess that's what the sheriff meant in October 2010 when he said there was extensive evidence to back up the wife's account of the events.

    I wish I would have seen that special. I've followed this case since the beginning and never doubted her story.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kimberlyd125 View Post
    Wow! I guess that's what the sheriff meant in October 2010 when he said there was extensive evidence to back up the wife's account of the events.

    I wish I would have seen that special. I've followed this case since the beginning and never doubted her story.
    Mexico is such a mess.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kimberlyd125 View Post
    Wow! I guess that's what the sheriff meant in October 2010 when he said there was extensive evidence to back up the wife's account of the events.

    I wish I would have seen that special. I've followed this case since the beginning and never doubted her story.
    BBM:

    I never doubted her story either, Kimberlyd125. It was a shame so many people (in the public) had immediately started accusing her of murdering her husband.


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  32. #392
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kimberlyd125 View Post
    The body was not David.



    I'll be back with a link if I can get this phone to cooperate.
    I wonder how many other bodies are in that lake?
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  34. #393
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    Quote Originally Posted by LambChop View Post
    I wonder how many other bodies are in that lake?
    A lot.
    I think everybody knew it was a long shot. But I was really hoping for answers for his family when I posted that 2 years ago.

    I don't think he will ever be found.
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  36. #394
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kimberlyd125 View Post
    A lot.
    I think everybody knew it was a long shot. But I was really hoping for answers for his family when I posted that 2 years ago.

    I don't think he will ever be found.

    His body is gone. The sheriff has it in good authority that he was put in a barrel and burned.

    It's so sad. I had to just shake my head as the fisherman who kept insisting it was safe on the lake. Snuck quietly to the Mexican side and then took off like a bat out of heck when he showed them the chapel.




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    Juror #8: "It's always difficult to keep personal prejudice out of a thing like this. And wherever you run into it, prejudice always obscures the truth. I don't really know what the truth is. I don't suppose anybody will ever really know. Nine of us now seem to feel that the defendant is innocent, but we're just gambling on probabilities - we may be wrong. We may be trying to let a guilty man go free, I don't know. Nobody really can. But we have a reasonable doubt, and that's something that's very valuable in our system. No jury can declare a man guilty unless it's sure." -12 Angry Men 1957

    All my posts are my opinion only.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ScarlettScarpetta View Post
    His body is gone. The sheriff has it in good authority that he was put in a barrel and burned.

    It's so sad. I had to just shake my head as the fisherman who kept insisting it was safe on the lake. Snuck quietly to the Mexican side and then took off like a bat out of heck when he showed them the chapel.




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    I went to Mexico once a couple of years ago on a cruise. The whole time I was ashore I felt like the hair was raised on the back of my neck. Very uncomfortable feeling. I will never go back. jmo
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  40. #396
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScarlettScarpetta View Post
    Sorry there was every reason to take and hide the American body that they killed to protect their drug dealings.

    Last night I watched a cnn special on it. They have witnesses that have come forth to support wife's story and photos of the pirates from surveillance that are dressed exactly as she described.

    It happened just as she says it did.

    It's so sad that we are so suspicious of victims anymore.
    http://www.cnn.com/2012/10/08/world/...cartel-arrest/

    http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../23/cp.01.html


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    BBM. Huh? None of this has been proven. This is her version of events. Nothing has changed, there has been no resolution to this case. Of course the sheriff has incentive to say "nothing to see here, move along, they did it, it's over…" Her story was fishy then, and is fishy now…..I know the Zetas are vicious and notorious. Likely, Mrs. Hartley was well aware of that too before their excursion. I see nothing that proves she is a victim, nothing that proves WHO perpetrated a crime.

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  42. #397
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    Quote Originally Posted by animlzrule View Post
    BBM. Huh? None of this has been proven. This is her version of events. Nothing has changed, there has been no resolution to this case. Of course the sheriff has incentive to say "nothing to see here, move along, they did it, it's over…" Her story was fishy then, and is fishy now…..I know the Zetas are vicious and notorious. Likely, Mrs. Hartley was well aware of that too before their excursion. I see nothing that proves she is a victim, nothing that proves WHO perpetrated a crime.

    Well then you are just not looking. Someone was arrested. The sheriff I charge of investigating has substantiated her story with witnesses and video and photographic proof.

    She Is a victim and this is over. Other than getting his body back.


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    Juror #8: "It's always difficult to keep personal prejudice out of a thing like this. And wherever you run into it, prejudice always obscures the truth. I don't really know what the truth is. I don't suppose anybody will ever really know. Nine of us now seem to feel that the defendant is innocent, but we're just gambling on probabilities - we may be wrong. We may be trying to let a guilty man go free, I don't know. Nobody really can. But we have a reasonable doubt, and that's something that's very valuable in our system. No jury can declare a man guilty unless it's sure." -12 Angry Men 1957

    All my posts are my opinion only.

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  44. #398
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    this is the case that brought me to WS, after researching it for other reasons.

    I will go on record as saying I think Tiffany Hartley had a hand in her husband's death, sadly. The reasons that led me to take this position are too many to quickly list and I doubt his body will ever be found or identified. Regardless, this is sad for everyone. I am glad we can agree to disagree around here.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScarlettScarpetta View Post
    Well then you are just not looking. Someone was arrested. The sheriff I charge of investigating has substantiated her story with witnesses and video and photographic proof.

    She Is a victim and this is over. Other than getting his body back.


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    Oh yes, "someone" was arrested. There have been "witnesses" reported. I haven't seen that there is definitive video and photographic proof although I'm sure that that has been alleged along the way as well. None of which overcomes the glaring inconsistencies in her story, as well as the completely ridiculous scenario posited for the actions of the drug cartel, who supposedly disposed of this man's body, when their whole usual MO is to display their killings like trophies, as well as somehow let her live as she raced away like a female James Bond. But you are right in that it seems to be over. No one involved with the exception of Mr. Hartley's family really has any incentive to ferret out the truth.

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  48. #400
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    David Hartley - Pirates shoot US man in Mexican waters #3

    Quote Originally Posted by animlzrule View Post
    Oh yes, "someone" was arrested. There have been "witnesses" reported. I haven't seen that there is definitive video and photographic proof although I'm sure that that has been alleged along the way as well. None of which overcomes the glaring inconsistencies in her story, as well as the completely ridiculous scenario posited for the actions of the drug cartel, who supposedly disposed of this man's body, when their whole usual MO is to display their killings like trophies, as well as somehow let her live as she raced away like a female James Bond. But you are right in that it seems to be over. No one involved with the exception of Mr. Hartley's family really has any incentive to ferret out the truth.

    It's out there. I saw it pictures of the suspects she described that day.

    There IS Proof it was someone else. There is no proof it was her. there is more than one witness that verifies her story.
    I follow proof and evidence.



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    Juror #8: "It's always difficult to keep personal prejudice out of a thing like this. And wherever you run into it, prejudice always obscures the truth. I don't really know what the truth is. I don't suppose anybody will ever really know. Nine of us now seem to feel that the defendant is innocent, but we're just gambling on probabilities - we may be wrong. We may be trying to let a guilty man go free, I don't know. Nobody really can. But we have a reasonable doubt, and that's something that's very valuable in our system. No jury can declare a man guilty unless it's sure." -12 Angry Men 1957

    All my posts are my opinion only.

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