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Thread: NV - Steven T. Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - #18

  1. #326
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    Quote Originally Posted by webrocket View Post
    I commented on Erick's thread that I saw similarities between him and Steven.

    Maybe one of these years Steven will make contact and say he's okay.
    There's actually quite a few similarities in the cases:

    1--Each abandoned their cars a distance from where they lived.
    2--Each was a musician (Erick professionally, Steven informally)
    3--Each had worked for an online news organizations
    4--Neither was married (EW had a female roomie)
    5--Neither lived at home.
    6--Each was described as religious (Erick as "straight-laced", Steven likely so).

    Wales left for a work-related appointment
    Many believe Steven had a work-related appointment

    Erick lived in Mission Valley
    Steven went on a mission

    OK....time to quit
    Last edited by laytonian; 11-15-2010 at 09:59 PM.

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  3. #327
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    Quote Originally Posted by laytonian View Post
    There's actually quite a few similarities in the cases:

    1--Each abandoned their cars a distance from where they lived.
    2--Each was a musician (Erick professionally, Steven informally)
    3--Each had worked for an online news organizations
    4--Neither was married (EW had a female roomie)
    5--Neither lived at home.
    6--Each was described as religious (Erick as "straight-laced", Steven likely so).

    Wales left for a work-related appointment
    Many believe Steven had a work-related appointment

    Erick lived in Mission Valley
    Steven went on a mission

    OK....time to quit
    I realize we probably will never know, but I wish we could know why Erick chose to walk away and where he went. It might shed some light, not just on Steven's case, but many others.
    ~~~Cynical Optimist~~~

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  5. #328
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fairy1 View Post
    I realize we probably will never know, but I wish we could know why Erick chose to walk away and where he went. It might shed some light, not just on Steven's case, but many others.
    Erick was described as "religious and straight-laced".

    That doesn't sound like a guy who'd walk away from his family, and would "religious, straight-laced" guy have a live-in girlfriend?

    Maybe it's just me, but when I watched the video of his family, I saw tight faces. I know it would be painful knowing (and they did know, because of the note) that he left them on purpose....but there was a reason.

    It's always seemed like an alternative lifestyle issue, to me.
    Something's not approved of.
    And I can guess.

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  7. #329
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    Quote Originally Posted by laytonian View Post
    Erick was described as "religious and straight-laced".

    That doesn't sound like a guy who'd walk away from his family, and would "religious, straight-laced" guy have a live-in girlfriend?

    Maybe it's just me, but when I watched the video of his family, I saw tight faces. I know it would be painful knowing (and they did know, because of the note) that he left them on purpose....but there was a reason.

    It's always seemed like an alternative lifestyle issue, to me.
    Something's not approved of.
    And I can guess.
    I believe Steven would be described similarly - and he doesn't sound like the kind of guy who would walk away either. But who's to say he didn't? He moved away from them months before. Maybe that was the first step.

    Surely, there is always a reason for the person who walks away. At least in their own minds.

    Who really knows what drives any person to do what they do?
    ~~~Cynical Optimist~~~

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  9. #330
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    Just received a "breaking news" flash from 8NEWSNOW.com saying:

    The Clark County Coroner says the remains found at Red Rock Canyon last week were not human. The bones were found by hikers. 8 News NOW will have more details later today.
    ~~~Cynical Optimist~~~

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  11. #331
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    Please keep in mind that we only see the parts of a person's psyche that they willfully allow us to see. Many people present themselves to all those around them one way when they are actually deeply internally conflicted as to who they really are.
    Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.
    Friedrich Nietzsche

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  13. #332
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    Hey everyone...I just wanted to leave the link on the remains found in Red Rock and also to say a few words to those who continue to have a strong dedication on helping find Steven no matter what people may think. It takes special people to take the time out of your busy schedules for almost a year now and if no one has told you that they appreciate your efforts...I appreciate each and every effort you have put forth. And each and every one of you know who you are. Let's hope all these efforts bring this young man home to his family some day soon. Again, thank you.

    http://dlvr.it/8f7rg


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  15. #333
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fairy1 View Post
    Just received a "breaking news" flash from 8NEWSNOW.com saying:

    The Clark County Coroner says the remains found at Red Rock Canyon last week were not human. The bones were found by hikers. 8 News NOW will have more details later today.
    [Font Size changed by me ]

    So....since the remains were "wrapped in a t-shirt", where did the t-shirt come from?
    Is this a serial-killer dog or deer, or what?

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  17. #334
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    Quote Originally Posted by laytonian View Post
    [Font Size changed by me ]

    So....since the remains were "wrapped in a t-shirt", where did the t-shirt come from?
    Is this a serial-killer dog or deer, or what?
    Sounds like possibly someone who hiked the area,with a pet that had a favorite t-shirt, that may have been laid there to rest.

  18. #335
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    Red Rock remains ARE human, after all

    Source: KLAS-TV.

    It turns out that two sets of remains were found the same day, in nearby locations in the Red Rock area.

    One set was human (Red Rock Canyon), one was not (Bonnie Springs).

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  20. #336
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    Quote Originally Posted by laytonian View Post
    Source: KLAS-TV.

    It turns out that two sets of remains were found the same day, in nearby locations in the Red Rock area.

    One set was human (Red Rock Canyon), one was not (Bonnie Springs).
    Ah, okay, that makes more sense.
    Opinions expressed are strictly my own (who else would they belong to???)

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  22. #337
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    Today they're saying the spine was human. Jeez.

    Steven, give us a hint! Or call your folks.
    ~~~Cynical Optimist~~~

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    Hi all, I made the mistake of getting a "real job" and I can no longer surf the net all day. I'm just checking in on Steven's case and I wanted to bring back this article I posted about a hundred threads back.

    In reference to Shefner's questions about how Steven would have planned his suicide...my contention, as this article points out, is that their are two types of suicides, the planned and the impulsive. I believe Steven acted on impulse after not landing the job, not getting the girl or "enter the latest disappointment in his life here."

    "As it turns out, one of the most remarkable discoveries about suicide and how to reduce it occurred utterly by chance. It came about not through some breakthrough in pharmacology or the treatment of mental illness but rather through an energy-conversion scheme carried out in Britain in the 1960s and ’70s. Among those familiar with the account, it is often referred to simply as “the British coal-gas story.”

    For generations, the people of Britain heated their homes and fueled their stoves with coal gas. While plentiful and cheap, coal-derived gas could also be deadly; in its unburned form, it released very high levels of carbon monoxide, and an open valve or a leak in a closed space could induce asphyxiation in a matter of minutes. This extreme toxicity also made it a preferred method of suicide. “Sticking one’s head in the oven” became so common in Britain that by the late 1950s it accounted for some 2,500 suicides a year, almost half the nation’s total.

    Those numbers began dropping over the next decade as the British government embarked on a program to phase out coal gas in favor of the much cleaner natural gas. By the early 1970s, the amount of carbon monoxide running through domestic gas lines had been reduced to nearly zero. During those same years, Britain’s national suicide rate dropped by nearly a third, and it has remained close to that reduced level ever since.

    How can this be? After all, if the impulse to suicide is primarily rooted in mental illness and that illness goes untreated, how does merely closing off one means of self-destruction have any lasting effect? At least a partial answer is that many of those Britons who asphyxiated themselves did so impulsively. In a moment of deep despair or rage or sadness, they turned to what was easy and quick and deadly — “the execution chamber in everyone’s kitchen,” as one psychologist described it — and that instrument allowed little time for second thoughts. Remove it, and the process slowed down; it allowed time for the dark passion to pass."

    See more in the story:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/06/ma...ewanted=2&_r=1

    Basically, Steven didn't have to plan his suicide. He just had to have the means to kill himself at the exact moment he felt like doing it.

    Sorry, this is a bit off topic at this point, but still interesting. I'm eager to find out about the bones found in Red Rock canyon. While I don't believe they belong to Steven, it would be nice to bring closure to another family none the less.

    I'll be checking in when I can; best to all who care enough about Steven to still be looking for him today.

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  25. #339
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    Nice post, seekingsusan....an interesting read.

    I think I would be more likely to consider suicide if it were not for that happenstance video footage of him walking (in what I like to call a "purposeful" way...although I don't how to define that exactly) with that portfolio. Wherever he went after those moments, he never returned.....and that thought drives me crazy.

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  27. #340
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    Quote Originally Posted by seekingsusan View Post
    Hi all, I made the mistake of getting a "real job" and I can no longer surf the net all day. I'm just checking in on Steven's case and I wanted to bring back this article I posted about a hundred threads back.

    In reference to Shefner's questions about how Steven would have planned his suicide...my contention, as this article points out, is that their are two types of suicides, the planned and the impulsive. I believe Steven acted on impulse after not landing the job, not getting the girl or "enter the latest disappointment in his life here." See more in the story:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/06/ma...ewanted=2&_r=1

    Basically, Steven didn't have to plan his suicide. He just had to have the means to kill himself at the exact moment he felt like doing it.

    Sorry, this is a bit off topic at this point, but still interesting. I'm eager to find out about the bones found in Red Rock canyon. While I don't believe they belong to Steven, it would be nice to bring closure to another family none the less.

    I'll be checking in when I can; best to all who care enough about Steven to still be looking for him today.
    Good to see you here, and congrats on the "mistake"

    I've snipped some of your excellent post.

    I know everyone else sees "purposeful", but I just see someone walking down a street. Maybe it's hard to explain, but who doesn't walk "purposely" when they're walking? What would have been the opposite style of walk? Lurking, holding back, maybe doubling back to the car?

    Steven's friends and relatives recognized his walk -- so did he always walk "purposefully?"

    Why am I focusing on that?
    Because the article you posted, fits into my beliefs about the case.

    While passing out flyers, you'd have to have them in something - like a folder or portfolio. It's too hard to carry a stack of individual papers. Yet, flyers were found in his car, and they were very visible. It'd be interesting to know if they were dumped out, or neatly stacked.

    Waiting until noon to get out of the car, sounds more like an appointment with himself, than with another person.

    Repurposing the portfolio, to contain a note, sounds reasonable to me.

    I've always said that the clue to his location, may have been litter (flyers) strewn by the wind.

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  29. #341
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fairy1 View Post
    Today they're saying the spine was human. Jeez.

    Steven, give us a hint! Or call your folks.
    They always said the spine was human; the confusion was in the report about the other set of bones at Bonnie Springs.

  30. #342
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    Quote Originally Posted by laytonian View Post
    Good to see you here, and congrats on the "mistake"

    I've snipped some of your excellent post.

    I know everyone else sees "purposeful", but I just see someone walking down a street. Maybe it's hard to explain, but who doesn't walk "purposely" when they're walking? What would have been the opposite style of walk? Lurking, holding back, maybe doubling back to the car?

    Steven's friends and relatives recognized his walk -- so did he always walk "purposefully?"

    Why am I focusing on that?
    Because the article you posted, fits into my beliefs about the case.

    While passing out flyers, you'd have to have them in something - like a folder or portfolio. It's too hard to carry a stack of individual papers. Yet, flyers were found in his car, and they were very visible. It'd be interesting to know if they were dumped out, or neatly stacked.

    Waiting until noon to get out of the car, sounds more like an appointment with himself, than with another person.

    Repurposing the portfolio, to contain a note, sounds reasonable to me.

    I've always said that the clue to his location, may have been litter (flyers) strewn by the wind.
    Repurposing it to contain a handgun as well?
    Opinions expressed are strictly my own (who else would they belong to???)

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    BREAKING NEWS: Bones Found at Red Rock Identified

    LAS VEGAS -- The remains found at Red Rock National Conservation Area have been identified as 54-year-old John Rosholt of Scottsdale, Arizona.

    The Clark County Coroners office was not able to determine the cause of death or when Rosholt died.
    Hikers found Rosholt's bones last week at Black Velvet Canyon.
    ~~~Cynical Optimist~~~

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  33. #344
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fairy1 View Post
    I believe Steven would be described similarly - and he doesn't sound like the kind of guy who would walk away either. But who's to say he didn't? He moved away from them months before. Maybe that was the first step.

    Surely, there is always a reason for the person who walks away. At least in their own minds.

    Who really knows what drives any person to do what they do?
    If that is why SK moved...why get involved with Singles Ward, as well as take a calling and attend the temple? For every "similarity", there is an explanation for why it might not really apply to SK. Maybe if he was living with someone, stopped going to church, didn't attend the temple...one or all of these things, it would be easier to accept as plausible.

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  35. #345
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    Quote Originally Posted by laytonian View Post
    Good to see you here, and congrats on the "mistake"

    I've snipped some of your excellent post.

    I know everyone else sees "purposeful", but I just see someone walking down a street. Maybe it's hard to explain, but who doesn't walk "purposely" when they're walking? What would have been the opposite style of walk? Lurking, holding back, maybe doubling back to the car?

    Steven's friends and relatives recognized his walk -- so did he always walk "purposefully?"

    Why am I focusing on that?
    Because the article you posted, fits into my beliefs about the case.

    While passing out flyers, you'd have to have them in something - like a folder or portfolio. It's too hard to carry a stack of individual papers. Yet, flyers were found in his car, and they were very visible. It'd be interesting to know if they were dumped out, or neatly stacked.

    Waiting until noon to get out of the car, sounds more like an appointment with himself, than with another person.

    Repurposing the portfolio, to contain a note, sounds reasonable to me.

    I've always said that the clue to his location, may have been litter (flyers) strewn by the wind.
    There were fliers in the car...hence the police calling his boss. Wouldn't he take all? Or maybe he took one as an example of his work....

  36. #346
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    Quote Originally Posted by CONCRNED CTZN View Post
    There were fliers in the car...hence the police calling his boss. Wouldn't he take all? Or maybe he took one as an example of his work....
    Yes, that's what I'm wondering about: since the flyers were visible, but it doesn't make sense to carry them "loose", were they just dumped out in the car - so the folder could be used for something else?

    Since seekingsusan brought up the "spur of the moment" idea...I'm just wondering if that's where the portfolio/cardboard folder came from, and if the reverse side of one flyer, was used to pen a farewell note that was never found.

    No flyers were passed out, or found, in SCA. BUT...you bring up a good question: did Steven make the flyers himself, or just pass them out? I'll ask.

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  38. #347
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fairy1 View Post
    BREAKING NEWS: Bones Found at Red Rock Identified

    LAS VEGAS -- The remains found at Red Rock National Conservation Area have been identified as 54-year-old John Rosholt of Scottsdale, Arizona.

    The Clark County Coroners office was not able to determine the cause of death or when Rosholt died.
    Hikers found Rosholt's bones last week at Black Velvet Canyon.
    But they COULD have googled, and found that he was last heard of around Christmas, 2004 with his last credit card usage on Jan 19, 2005:

    John "The Gambler" Rosholt still missing.
    Scottsdale climber has been missing since Christmas.

    I'm just surprised that neither carbuff nor I came up with him as missing in the LV area, when we were doing those searches for similar cases.

    ETA:
    Rosholt's car was found, months later, almost 17 miles from where his remains were located.
    MAP.
    Last edited by laytonian; 11-18-2010 at 04:53 PM.

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  40. #348
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    Quote Originally Posted by CONCRNED CTZN View Post
    If that is why SK moved...why get involved with Singles Ward, as well as take a calling and attend the temple? For every "similarity", there is an explanation for why it might not really apply to SK. Maybe if he was living with someone, stopped going to church, didn't attend the temple...one or all of these things, it would be easier to accept as plausible.
    I don't think his move to St George wast "dropping out", since he maintained close ties with his family. Outside of not having a job or any known close friends there, it sounds like his life in St George was similar to what he had in Northern Utah.

    Then....he either dropped out and left it all behind, or drove 120 miles to become a crime victim.

    We need more info on GW. I wish he or people he knew, would talk to us OR to LE - don't you?
    I don't suspect GW of doing anything wrong (outside of some negligence), but he may have the key to the disappearance.

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  42. #349
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    Quote Originally Posted by laytonian View Post
    I don't think his move to St George wast "dropping out", since he maintained close ties with his family. Outside of not having a job or any known close friends there, it sounds like his life in St George was similar to what he had in Northern Utah.

    Then....he either dropped out and left it all behind, or drove 120 miles to become a crime victim.

    We need more info on GW. I wish he or people he knew, would talk to us OR to LE - don't you?
    I don't suspect GW of doing anything wrong (outside of some negligence), but he may have the key to the disappearance.
    I felt from the outset that the move to St. George was a transition phase to distance himself from family while testing the waters for moving on.

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  44. #350
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    Quote Originally Posted by webrocket View Post
    I felt from the outset that the move to St. George was a transition phase to distance himself from family while testing the waters for moving on.
    Transition, yes. Not a total move.
    Maybe a test, to see if he could make it on his own.
    Maybe he was making it, much better than anyone knew (ie, cash built up).

    I don't know how often he talked to his folks before he went to St George, but we've read about a "weekly" phone call between them, afterwards.

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