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Thread: IL - Tanya Shannon, 40, missing after fatal car accident in Seneca, 5 Dec 2010 - #2

  1. #476
    Joe Friday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hatchersch View Post
    Joe Friday, I recall something being mentioned about metal detectors, can't remember the context. It might have been here or another forum.
    Do you really think 4 biz days would be enough time to get the phone records? I think back to other cases & often, it took months. A subpoena or search warrant is needed, cooperation on behalf of the carrier, etc. Gosh, I had to ask Verizon for an itemized bill once & it took forever, for my own info'. So, in any case, LE would have had 12-6 thru 12-9 to get the info prior to the search conducted on 12-10.
    They had the ping information in a matter of days. Trust me they had the phone records too.

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  3. #477
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    I found an article that said they used metal detectors.

    More than 35 searchers carefully scanned the area near the crash site on Tuesday, using poles to probe snow banks, metal detectors in ditches and even a helicopter to blow away snow and fly over the area.

    http://www.deseretnews.com/article/7...ml?s_cid=rss-5

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  5. #478
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    The phone records are pretty easy to come by in cases like this or am I wrong? usually within a few days at the most they can be accessed by LE

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    Quote Originally Posted by KathyJ View Post
    The phone records are pretty easy to come by in cases like this or am I wrong? usually within a few days at the most they can be accessed by LE
    I worked in the technology end of LE for years....they can get phone records in minutes depending on the situation.

    They can also get longitude/latitude of the last known location and owner of the phones address...however....there are many variables...the service providers all follow different protocols (ie who they will release info to and under what circumstances and with or without a warrant). And long/lat is usually not a pinpoint location....say...more like a city block...or area...

    And it still only works if there is some battery power left in the phone...AND they type of phone gets thrown into the variables as well.

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  9. #480
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Friday View Post
    I found an article that said they used metal detectors.

    Ok...here comes a possibly very dumb question! Lol

    Is there enough actual metal in cell phones these days to set off a metal detector? I'm sitting here looking at my phone and it looks all plastic and glass and maybe aluminum?

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    Thanks Jipsee, I figured there were all sorts of circumstances and I am sure depending on the severity of the situation comes into play as well.

    Tanya's phone was left in the car correct? She had Dale's phone....?

  12. #482
    Quote Originally Posted by Jipsee View Post
    Ok...here comes a possibly very dumb question! Lol

    Is there enough actual metal in cell phones these days to set off a metal detector? I'm sitting here looking at my phone and it looks all plastic and glass and maybe aluminum?
    Mine too! I wonder how well a metal detector functions in the snow??? Anyone know?

    As far as phone records, a lot of times there is a lot of red tape involved. Perhaps if a person is deceased, things are expedited as there is no breach of privacy, correct? Jipsee, have you heard any info regarding Dale's phone other than it did ping but the pings were not conducive to the search? TIA

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  14. #483
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    Quote Originally Posted by KathyJ View Post
    Thanks Jipsee, I figured there were all sorts of circumstances and I am sure depending on the severity of the situation comes into play as well.

    Tanya's phone was left in the car correct? She had Dale's phone....?
    Here phone was found in the car....and by pinging Dale's they think it's in the area of the crash site...

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  16. #484
    Ooh, they do believe Dale's is in the immediate vicinity? The last I had heard was that there was no benefit to the "pinging", thanks for this update!

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    I don't know about hand held metal detectors, but for my job I have to pass a dector every day and my phone will set it off. Some of them are very sensitive.
    Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.
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  19. #486
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    I would think a metal detector designed to detect metal buried in soil would be even more effective in finding metal buried in the snow.

    I was thinking more on the lines of Tanya's jewelry setting off the detector such as a wedding ring not the phone. I think if a metal detector was set off by Dale's cell phone in the snow I think Tanya would be found close by.

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  21. #487
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    I absolutely agree JF. The only thing that I worry about with the metal dectors is that if there are any burried pipelines or wires they could give false positives in the search.
    Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.
    Friedrich Nietzsche

  22. #488
    The last I heard about Dale's phone was the lack of a tower in the area made it impossible to triangulate the pings. Has anyone heard a more current update? Like the last time the phone was actually used?

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    I am a bit surprised it was so easy in this case. I know in other cases they couldn't get the records because the person was not there to consent to them being released. You know, because they were missing. Even if the person who paid the bill did consent, sometimes that didn't help. I believe it took a long time to get Julie Ann's phone records if I'm remembering correctly.

    Quote Originally Posted by KathyJ View Post
    The phone records are pretty easy to come by in cases like this or am I wrong? usually within a few days at the most they can be accessed by LE

    The only crime that I can see being applicable here is leaving the scene of an (injury) accident. Unless they were to determine there was more to the accident itself, I don't see any other charges here. Even if they thought there was more to the accident, anything else would be near impossible to prove in court.

    Quote Originally Posted by Willow57 View Post
    I understand what you are saying. But the difference between the run-a-way bride and Tanya is that the runaway bride called LE and made a false claim that she had been kidnapped, etc.

    If Tanya is alive and even if she knows about the search for her she hasn't done that. There is no law that you can't leave and disappear if you want to. Now-I am not saying that that wouldn't be morally wrong-I just don't think it would be criminal. For some reason I don't think she is out there alive-but I hope so. The alternative is such a tragedy!

  24. #490
    Quote Originally Posted by MsFacetious View Post
    I am a bit surprised it was so easy in this case. I know in other cases they couldn't get the records because the person was not there to consent to them being released. You know, because they were missing. Even if the person who paid the bill did consent, sometimes that didn't help. I believe it took a long time to get Julie Ann's phone records if I'm remembering correctly.




    The only crime that I can see being applicable here is leaving the scene of an (injury) accident. Unless they were to determine there was more to the accident itself, I don't see any other charges here. Even if they thought there was more to the accident, anything else would be near impossible to prove in court.
    Remember when they tried to get Casey A's? For the day Caylee was last seen? Have you heard info' as to the last call made or rec'd on Dale's phone? TIA

  25. #491
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    It may depend on the state laws, as to how quickly and under what circumstances LE can obtain the phone records. They had a deceased person, and it was his phone they were searching for, so for his phone, they should have been able to get what they needed easily and since it was his that was missing, it likely would be his that she used, if she used any, once she left the car.

    How deep is this snow now where the accident was?
    Just my opinion, of course.

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  27. #492
    Joe Friday's Avatar
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    I think leaving the scene of an injury accident would only apply to the driver.

    http://www.criminallawyerillinois.co...t-in-illinois/

    http://law.onecle.com/illinois/625ilcs5/11-401.html
    Last edited by Joe Friday; 12-22-2010 at 05:00 PM.

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  29. #493
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    When they believe some one's life to be endangered, they can get cell records or last known location ASAP. For example, female calls 911 and just screams into the phone without giving an address...the can trace it via long/lat or her personal info and hopefully get an address.

    This case MAY be different because it's Dale's phone...but I would hope not since Tanya could have just grabbed his since it might have been easier to reach. And how cell records are released may vary from state to state...I only know how Illinois works. In fact, when I personally would call for traces the service providers always ask which state your in as their first question.

    Thanks JoeF for the metal detector info....it makes better sense now!

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  31. #494
    Jipsee, thanks! How long would it take you in IL to get the cell records as far as incoming/outgoing calls?

  32. #495
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Friday View Post
    I think leaving the scene of an injury accident would only apply to the driver.

    http://www.criminallawyerillinois.co...t-in-illinois/

    http://law.onecle.com/illinois/625ilcs5/11-401.html
    Thanks, Joe. The research I did stated: If you are a passenger in a vehicular accident in state of IL & the driver is unable to rpeort the accident, you must. I know MI used to be the same. Leaving the scene might be okay but a report must be made, at some point.

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  34. #496
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    Quote Originally Posted by hatchersch View Post
    Jipsee, thanks! How long would it take you in IL to get the cell records as far as incoming/outgoing calls?

    It just depends on the situation and the service provider. I wot name the company, but there is one provider who makes LE jump through ridiculous hoops to get any info....and there are others who would do anything to help as quickly as possible.

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  36. #497
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    Sorry everyone I guess icant spell today

  37. #498
    Joe Friday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jipsee View Post
    Sorry everyone I guess icant spell today
    Try using Mozilla Firefox. It automatically underlines all your incorrectly spelled words. Then you right click on them to correct them.

    http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/products/download.html

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  39. #499
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    Thanks JoeF!

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    mywebtimes.com has new article pertaining to the guardianship hearings. sorry, for no link, each time I've tried to link it, I lose power.

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