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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by dodie20 View Post
    My sister had to put their precious black German Sheperd, down today. She was just over a year old, had been a little under the weather, but today, the vet found massive cancer in her bones, & there was nothing he could do. He even cried. They also have a traditional G shepherd, & watching those 2 dogs, is amazing. so smart & so protective. We babysat the black one, when he was little, & anytime this big, normally 'serious' dog would see my husband, she'd jump in his lap & lick his face. She remembered him playing with her.
    omg- how sad! Poor baby.

    They are amazing dogs - smart as all get out.
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  3. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by crocus View Post
    sarx- a dog's nose down on a trail that doesn't stray/venture outward much on a trail would indicate a newer trail to a handler?
    Oh how I wish it were that simple, my life would be so much easier, lol. No, sadly, some dogs always have their noses stuck to the ground, some go down and up, some stay up most of the time, some are down when it's fresh and up when it's old, and some are the exact opposite. No two are alike. A good handler can "work" any dog, but they're not going to be able to read someone else's dog. So, if the dog takes them straight to the person, it's all good. If he doesn't and the handler has to decipher what the dog did, there's where knowing the dog becomes key. By the same token, if a person hasn't trained on say an old trail (or a super fresh trail, or a car trail, or a trail in the rain, the list goes on and on), then they aren't going to know what to look for because they've never seen it.



  4. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarx View Post
    Oh how I wish it were that simple, my life would be so much easier, lol. No, sadly, some dogs always have their noses stuck to the ground, some go down and up, some stay up most of the time, some are down when it's fresh and up when it's old, and some are the exact opposite. No two are alike. A good handler can "work" any dog, but they're not going to be able to read someone else's dog. So, if the dog takes them straight to the person, it's all good. If he doesn't and the handler has to decipher what the dog did, there's where knowing the dog becomes key. By the same token, if a person hasn't trained on say an old trail (or a super fresh trail, or a car trail, or a trail in the rain, the list goes on and on), then they aren't going to know what to look for because they've never seen it.
    I just wanted to say thank you for explaining all of this. I find it totally fascinating...
    Fly high and free, Jhessye ~

    My posts are meant to help think through possibilities and are strictly an additional opinion under circumstances when many points of view need to be considered. I apologize in advance to anyone whose potential involvement is contemplated in error. Please understand that much of what is happening is merely brainstorming during unfortunate events.



  5. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarx View Post
    Oh how I wish it were that simple, my life would be so much easier, lol. No, sadly, some dogs always have their noses stuck to the ground, some go down and up, some stay up most of the time, some are down when it's fresh and up when it's old, and some are the exact opposite. No two are alike. A good handler can "work" any dog, but they're not going to be able to read someone else's dog. So, if the dog takes them straight to the person, it's all good. If he doesn't and the handler has to decipher what the dog did, there's where knowing the dog becomes key. By the same token, if a person hasn't trained on say an old trail (or a super fresh trail, or a car trail, or a trail in the rain, the list goes on and on), then they aren't going to know what to look for because they've never seen it.
    So - a handler who has worked with one specific dog over a period of time gets to "know" that dog and can get a good read on the dog's reactions on a trail?
    Missing Persons Case Archive Albums ~ http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/m...nkycrankerson/



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  7. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by crocus View Post
    So - a handler who has worked with one specific dog over a period of time gets to "know" that dog and can get a good read on the dog's reactions on a trail?
    Sure, provided that they have trained and experienced the situation before. When handlers work/train together often you get to the point where you can read other dogs in the group as well. Sometimes if you're resting say your dog you will run back up for another handler in your group, kinda like a second set of eyes on the dog, but that only works if you work/train together often.


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  9. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by belimom View Post
    I just wanted to say thank you for explaining all of this. I find it totally fascinating...
    Ditto.


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  11. #22
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    It would be FANTASTIC if we could get a clear answer on the poly issue. That would just be lovely....


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  13. #23
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    sarx - if you are still here. I have another question. I was told (by someone who is SAR) that German Shepherds notoriously cannot smell human remains under water, as in a lake or river. From what I understand - they can - that the gasses produced will rise to the surface of the water and disperse above it - and a dog - German Shepherd or not - can smell it and will react.
    Missing Persons Case Archive Albums ~ http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/m...nkycrankerson/



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  15. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by dodie20 View Post
    My sister had to put their precious black German Sheperd, down today. She was just over a year old, had been a little under the weather, but today, the vet found massive cancer in her bones, & there was nothing he could do. He even cried. They also have a traditional G shepherd, & watching those 2 dogs, is amazing. so smart & so protective. We babysat the black one, when she was little, & anytime this big, normally 'serious' dog would see my husband, she'd jump in his lap & lick his face. She remembered him playing with her.
    I am so sorry for your sister's loss. Losing a loved one is hard enough, losing them that young is really rough. Been there, hope I never am there again. My heart goes out to them.


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  17. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarx View Post
    It was reported that the video at the Western Suites Motel was checked (because dogs showed "interest" here, but nothing was found on the tapes). Anyone have quick access to that link?
    I found a link - an article about Hailey's mom being on NG's show, but after reading it, it doesn't even match the transcript

    Billie Dunn told Grace that bloodhounds were used over the weekend and that the dogs may have tracked Hailey’s scent to a local motel.

    Authorities then searched the rooms at the motel and the motel security camera footage, but no other evidence was obtained.


    http://www.ktxs.com/news/26377186/detail.html

    transcript:

    I want to go back to Billie Dunn, this is Hailey`s mother.

    How far did they tell you the dogs tracked your little girl to that Western Motel? Did they track her into the lobby? Did they track to a certain room, to the parking lot? How far did the trail go?

    B. DUNN: They didn`t tell me that. They just let me know that to the friends, to the motel, and they`re reviewing the video at the motel, and calling everybody who had been checked in to the motel that day.


    http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../04/ng.01.html
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  19. #26
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    Quick question: who is BO? I thought mom's initials were BD. TIA


  20. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by sarx View Post
    Oh how I wish it were that simple, my life would be so much easier, lol. No, sadly, some dogs always have their noses stuck to the ground, some go down and up, some stay up most of the time, some are down when it's fresh and up when it's old, and some are the exact opposite. No two are alike. A good handler can "work" any dog, but they're not going to be able to read someone else's dog. So, if the dog takes them straight to the person, it's all good. If he doesn't and the handler has to decipher what the dog did, there's where knowing the dog becomes key. By the same token, if a person hasn't trained on say an old trail (or a super fresh trail, or a car trail, or a trail in the rain, the list goes on and on), then they aren't going to know what to look for because they've never seen it.
    Thank you, you have provided a wealth of knowledge this evening.

    Recently, there was a case where they were bringing dogs in to search under water... does the body fluid disperse in the water like in the air?

    And thank you again!


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  22. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by crocus View Post
    sarx - if you are still here. I have another question. I was told (by someone who is SAR) that German Shepherds notoriously cannot smell human remains under water, as in a lake or river. From what I understand - they can - that the gasses produced will rise to the surface of the water and disperse above it - and a dog - German Shepherd or not - can smell it and will react.
    Well, my shepherd thoroughly enjoys bringing up dead fish from the bottom of the river....

    LOL, ok, sorry for that, but say what? It is a different discipline of training all together and you may not have any success taking a trailing dog out on a boat and hovering over a dead body, but being a GSD has nothing to do with it. (Course any dog out on the water may act "funny" in the presence of those gases rising up, and just not know how to "alert" on it.) After all dogs generally love dead things, it's a natural behavior, just like all search disciplines.

    There is no cookie cutter answer to what breed makes the best SAR dog, there are certainly breeds that are more apt to it, but even there, it is only a tiny handful who have what it takes. You can't take every bloodhound, lab, shepherd, etc and turn them into a SAR dog. There are a few breeds who because of their pinched/pugged noses they actually don't have great sniffers, but that's such a tiny group it's hardly worth mentioning. I've seen so many breeds and mutts that have been awesome that I would never judge a dog by it's coat.



  23. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by tdaj View Post
    Quick question: who is BO? I thought mom's initials were BD. TIA
    BO is Mom. Billie Ostrander. IIRC
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  25. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by StrayKat View Post
    Thank you, you have provided a wealth of knowledge this evening.

    Recently, there was a case where they were bringing dogs in to search under water... does the body fluid disperse in the water like in the air?

    And thank you again!
    Water dogs work off of the gases that are released when scent molecules diffuse into the water and then are evaporated when they reach the surface (turning into the gas the dog smells). This reaction can go on for months depending on conditions, possibly even longer.


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