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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by otto View Post
    Thanks for clarifying ... so his employer or his girlfriend or her father could have stood bail for him ... so that's not a factor if everything is on the up and up ... or ... he would never let them (too proud) do that for him
    He can still apply for bail. The stronger the case against him the less likely he is to get it so it could be that they wait till they get the depositions (evidence) bundle, or till May 4th to apply, though he can apply sooner than that too.

    It can take time to sort some things out before a bail hearing ie have a suitable address (most probably outside the Bristol area) to go to, then to find people willing to stand surety and then for those people to gather proof to take to court that they do actually have the funds to pay it should they need to.

    This article in the link below is a good reference re bail in the UK
    http://www.yourrights.org.uk/yourrig...ants/bail.html

    Unless he has some very close and generous friends in the UK he may be struggling (or have struggled) to find anyone to help him where living accomodation is concerned. God knows what the status of his job is right now- if they haven't sacked him is he classed as on unpaid leave or what? Without any salary how does he pay rent for anywhere if he's bailed? I have a feeling TM's father, a lawyer himself, may not want VT as a lodger in the circumstances, or to be any more involved than giving statements that VT was "a lovely boy".

    Is he "lovely boy" enough to risk losing 20k-30k on by standing surety? I'd have to be absolutely certain of someone's innocence and have absolute trust in them too to even think about doing it. I'd do it for my parents; that's about it. No one else. I wouldn't be doing it for a daughter's boyfriend that's for sure. I wouldn't do it for my own lol.

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Missjones View Post
    I get the scenario, but in VTs case we have no motive, he is not a rapist has a good clean record in Holland as well as in the UK, worked hard to get the PHd and good job, got a new life with lovely GF spending Christmas with her parents from 24 till 26 Dec then goes home to his family in Holland till 2 Jan, goes back to work, why kill JY, why throw it all away, his family are so shocked and love him too . I cant think of another murdered who didnt have something in their background to make them a killer if not at the least some motive


    I am not saying VT is guilty that is for the Court's to decide, there has to be some substantial evidence against VT for the CPS to go with Case.
    Just because someone has a Degree, loving Relatives, a nice girl friend and a good life, is not to say that they are not capable of doing this, Killer's come from all different part's of Society,

    You said VT had a lot to lose, look how many murder's are committed in an act of rage, a Husband kill's his Wife or vise versa, they too have a lot to lose their Family(Children) freedom etc, but in a moment in a total loss of control and all normal reality goes out of the window, I know they were not Married, I was sighting an example of loss of control, at the time the Person committing a killing is not thinking about what they have to lose, rage consumes them and nothing else.

    If VT is guilty, there is the possibility that VT never meant to kill JY, then after the act of what happened, self preservation and self survival took over.
    We won't know anything until the Trail, as for the motive we may never know.
    I do understand what you are saying though.
    Last edited by Trio; 02-01-2011 at 02:44 PM. Reason: re phrased.

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by goldielox View Post
    Agree (to all of it). When you read his Twitters you realise his use of the word wasn't odd, not for him anyway. I just think he's odd full stop.
    Indeed. And an important distinction. His remark tells us much more about him than about whom he speaks. It just results in speculation based upon the comments of someone who had the option but not the wisdom to say "no comment".

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Black Frost View Post
    His remark tells us much more about him than about whom he speaks.
    It just tells me he's got a large vocabulary and likes to make use of it. Nothing wrong with that.

    The vast majority of people would have said they assumed X had "run off" with somebody (polite version) or that X had " _____ed off" with someone (insert popular vernacular expression of your choice).

  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by otto View Post
    I watched a bit of it again. At 4:01 minutes (approx) the brother discusses VT being away for work. He says that the flat that Joanna and GR were in was empty for a few months, and then Joanna and GR were there for only a couple of months, and in the same time VT was in the US working ... so there wasn't much opportunity for them to have contact.

    I suppose this suggests that if VT did murder Joanna, then it would be a random, stranger attack.
    Thank you for that otto
    Not to help justice in her need would be an impiety ~Plato~

  6. #81
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    It's interesting to me that many people think that someone can't possibly be a murderer if their family/friends say that they're a lovely, gentle person, etc. My opinion is that everybody has a dark side. Therefore, I would be more convinced if somebody's family said something like: 'Yes, he's a great guy, intelligent, caring, but can get angry or moody occasionally.' As somebody pointed out on a previous thread, we somehow feel that if a close relative does something bad, it somehow reflects badly on us, as if some genetic defect has been revealed. Rather than contemplate that possibility, people are more likely to go into denial and only talk about the good aspects of the person's character. Especially if they have been accused of murder.

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by notsure View Post
    It's interesting to me that many people think that someone can't possibly be a murderer if their family/friends say that they're a lovely, gentle person, etc. My opinion is that everybody has a dark side. Therefore, I would be more convinced if somebody's family said something like: 'Yes, he's a great guy, intelligent, caring, but can get angry or moody occasionally.' As somebody pointed out on a previous thread, we somehow feel that if a close relative does something bad, it somehow reflects badly on us, as if some genetic defect has been revealed. Rather than contemplate that possibility, people are more likely to go into denial and only talk about the good aspects of the person's character. Especially if they have been accused of murder.

    well I think it's the fact that so far no one's come forward to mention any warning signs at all. have you read de becker's "the gift of fear"? there are pretty much always warning signs. no one randomly walks down the street and takes up murdering, raping, pillaging, plundering et al etc with absolutely no warning whatsoever.

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by aneurin View Post
    Try reading the following story from yesterday's Daily Mail. In brief, a 45 year old executive at Deutsche Telekom had a bad day at the office, and so relieved his frustrations by abducting, raping, and killing a 10 year old boy before dumping his body in the woods.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ce-stress.html

    You cannot infer guilt or innocence from past conduct.
    But German privacy laws mean that we don't know anything about his past conduct - previous cautions, convictions and so on.

    Remember that nothing was known by Suffolk Police about Ian Huntley's past, until members of the public recognised his photo and made the connection with past events.

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherwell View Post

    The vast majority of people would have said they assumed X had "run off" with somebody (polite version) or that X had " _____ed off" with someone (insert popular vernacular expression of your choice).
    I was thinking the same. I expect someone who would say "absconded" would perhaps put it as X had _____ orf though instead.

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by veggiefan View Post
    But German privacy laws mean that we don't know anything about his past conduct - previous cautions, convictions and so on.
    The folk at Deutsche Telecom have a mega impressive "jungle drums" system. If he'd had any convictions he wouldn't have got the job. If he gained any during employment he wouldn't have kept the job. Culture and the right behaviours are everything at that place. They're obsessed with it.

    I haven't a clue about German privacy laws but if it's anything like in the UK upon a conviction all the past convictons (of significance) come out in court and so make it into the press.


  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by naturally suspicious View Post
    agree, even though a resident implied that all this couldn't possibly be happening in clifton...after all the lord mayor lives up the road....!!!

    i suppose you have a certain number of professionals having the salary to live there...rent or buy...but remember that includes at least 300 on the sex register
    There are 301 people on the sex register in the whole of Bristol. Nationwide nearly half a million people are on the register, including many who have never been convicted of any offence but who may have been accused by angry or jealous neighbours, disaffected pupils and so on.

  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by veggiefan View Post
    There are 301 people on the sex register in the whole of Bristol. Nationwide nearly half a million people are on the register, including many who have never been convicted of any offence but who may have been accused by angry or jealous neighbours, disaffected pupils and so on.
    Even this man's on it.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7095134.stm



    It says it all that, about that register

  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by goldielox View Post
    Even this man's on it.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7095134.stm



    It says it all that, about that register
    agreed...but many would be for offences concerning other people/children/animals

    also, have just read a daily mail article sighting 500 in whole of bristol.
    i know my sister, social worker, told me there are many,many such on register within a small distance.
    people are NEVER as they seem/seek to portray themselves...

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by goldielox View Post
    I know. At the time CJ was under arrest and didn't get released until 1st January. It would be interesting to know what day he actually called this summit. I'm wondering if it was only after CJ was released. TM's brother was proclaiming on Twitter on 31st December he was 100% sure CJ would be charged which leads me to think perhaps VT didn't call this summit until after CJ was released. I'm guessing of course but why would you announce you were under suspicion while someone else has been arrested? You'd at least wait to see what happened with the one under arrest first wouldn't you...or I would anyway.
    We don't know that he knew CJ had been arrested - He would've needed to actively searched online for developments maybe not a priority while on holiday at his family's house

    I would say that if the police were searching my house i would be 'under suspicion'. Perhaps not in those words but the dutch are fairly straight to the point like Germans and would perhaps phrase it that way.

  15. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherwell View Post
    I think it's a reasonable assumption, given that he knew next to nothing about her and her relationships. It's very common for someone to leave their partner for another. Murder is rare though.
    My thoughts exactly! Grrr damn job - I need to play catch up on here all the time!!

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