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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
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    5,005

    TX - Phyllis Berry, 21, Terlingua, 1 Nov 1975

    Phyllis Eleanor Berry Missing since November 1, 1975 from Terlingua, TX


    -------------------------------------
    Name: Phyllis Eleanor Berry
    Missing: 2 November 1975
    Last Known Location: Terlingua, Texas
    Sex: Female
    Race: White
    Age: 21
    DOB: 1954
    Height: 5ft 5in
    Weight: 110 lbs
    Hair: Brown
    Eyes: Hazel
    Ms Berry has pierced ears, a flat brown mole on her lower right abdomen, a slight space between her two front center teeth and a freckle between her thumb and right wrist.

    Circumstances:

    Phyllis Eleanor Berry was last seen at the "World Championship Chili Cookoff" in Terlingua in November of 1975. She may have left the area on the back of a motorcycle with an unknown male subject. An extensive search of the area was performed, but Ms. Berry was not located.

    LINK:

    http://www.odessacrimestoppers.org/missing.aspx



    -------------------------------------------------


    Phyllis Eleanor Berry
    Missing since November 1, 1975 from Terlingua, Brewster County, Texas.
    Classification: Endangered Missing

    Vital Statistics

    Date Of Birth: September 16, 1954
    Age at Time of Disappearance: 21 years old
    Height and Weight at Time of Disappearance: 5'5"; 110 lbs.
    Distinguishing Characteristics: White female. Hazel eyes; brown hair. She is of slender build.
    Marks, Scars: Berry has pierced ears, a flat brown mole on her lower right abdomen and a freckle between her thumb and right wrist.
    Dentals: Available. She has a slight space between her two front center teeth.
    Fingerprints/DNA: Available

    Circumstances of Disappearance

    Berry was last seen at the 'World Championship Chili Cookoff' near the Texas-Mexico border. Sometime between midnight and 08.00, November 2 she disappeared. She may have left the area on the back of a motorcycle with an unknown male subject. An extensive search of the area was performed, but Berry was not located. She has not been seen since.

    Investigators
    If you have any information concerning this case, please contact:

    Texas Department Of Public Safety
    432-447-3533

    NCIC Number: M-400921199
    Please refer to this number when contacting any agency with information regarding this case.

    Source Information:
    Texas Department of Public Safety
    Odessa Crime Stoppers
    Doenetwork Case 544DFTX

    LINK:

    http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/544dftx.html

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
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    Missing for 35 years...

    There is also an information file on Phyllis at the website for Texas Department of Public Safety.


    LINK:

    http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/mpch/mp...5:05:47PM'

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    156

    A Possible Match

    This UID is a possible match. Most circumstances match including the gap between her two front teeth.

    http://doenetwork.org/cases/295uffl.html

    https://identifyus.org/en/cases/9302

    This was already submitted to the Doe Network. Seems like people are looking into this.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    El Segundo, California
    Posts
    7,483
    I called this possible in to TX DPS a couple of years ago. They contacted Broward County and were told that it was a CODIS rule-out by default.

    I have a feeling though that they were just blowing it off. Florida has a reputation for botched rule-outs (e.g., Colleen Orsborn and Peggy Sue Houser)

    Looking at the NamUs MP and UP casefiles for PEB and the Jane Doe, it is not clear whether both cases are in CODIS. There is a mtDNA profile for the Jane Doe at the Univ. of North Texas, but they were unable to develop a nucDNA profile for her. For Phyllis, it says "Sample available - Not yet submitted." However, it is unclear whether "Not yet submitted" applies to NamUs, or CODIS (or both).

    But I noticed that they finally entered the dentals into the Jane Doe's NamUs UP casefile. So we can compare the description of the Jane Doe's dentals to the visual of PEB's teeth.

    Here's a close-up of Phyllis' teeth (with the #8 and #9 teeth labled for reference).



    Regarding the 295UFFL Jane Doe's teeth the NamUs casefile indicates the following:

    Decedent has teeth #6 and 7 congenitally missing with primary teeth C and D retained.
    In the photo of PEB's teeth, note the large gap next to (i.e., on her right of) her #8 tooth where her #7 tooth would normally be. I don't think that's her #7 on the other side of the gap. The #7 appears to be missing, I can't tell if that tooth is her #6, or if it is a primary tooth as is described of the UID.

    But nevertheless, it could be consistent to the description of the Jane Doe's teeth.

    Tooth #10 is also congenitally missing and tooth # 11 has erupted in #10 position.
    Again, not conclusive, but the tooth next to (i.e., on her left of) her #9 tooth appears to have come in crooked, as if it is the #11 filling the gap left by a missing #10.

    primary tooth H is retained in positon of tooth #11.
    No way to judge that one way or the other from this photo.

    Large diastema (space) between teeth #8 and #9
    The photo is a little too blurred to be sure, but there appears to be a significant gap between #8 and #9.
    Last edited by CarlK90245; 01-04-2013 at 02:50 AM.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    156
    Quote Originally Posted by CarlK90245 View Post
    I called this possible in to TX DPS a couple of years ago. They contacted Broward County and were told that it was a CODIS rule-out by default.

    I have a feeling though that they were just blowing it off. Florida has a reputation for botched rule-outs (e.g., Colleen Orsborn and Peggy Sue Houser)

    Looking at the NamUs MP and UP casefiles for PEB and the Jane Doe, it is not clear whether both cases are in CODIS. There is a mtDNA profile for the Jane Doe at the Univ. of North Texas, but they were unable to develop a nucDNA profile for her. For Phyllis, it says "Sample available - Not yet submitted." However, it is unclear whether "Not yet submitted" applies to NamUs, or CODIS (or both).

    But I noticed that they finally entered the dentals into the Jane Doe's NamUs UP casefile. So we can compare the description of the Jane Doe's dentals to the visual of PEB's teeth.

    Here's a close-up of Phyllis' teeth (with the #8 and #9 teeth labled for reference).



    Regarding the 295UFFL Jane Doe's teeth the NamUs casefile indicates the following:

    Decedent has teeth #6 and 7 congenitally missing with primary teeth C and D retained.
    In the photo of PEB's teeth, note the large gap next to (i.e., on her right of) her #8 tooth where her #7 tooth would normally be. I don't think that's her #7 on the other side of the gap. The #7 appears to be missing, I can't tell if that tooth is her #6, or if it is a primary tooth as is described of the UID.

    But nevertheless, it could be consistent to the description of the Jane Doe's teeth.

    Tooth #10 is also congenitally missing and tooth # 11 has erupted in #10 position.
    Again, not conclusive, but the tooth next to (i.e., on her left of) her #9 tooth appears to have come in crooked, as if it is the #11 filling the gap left by a missing #10.

    primary tooth H is retained in positon of tooth #11.
    No way to judge that one way or the other from this photo.

    Large diastema (space) between teeth #8 and #9
    The photo is a little too blurred to be sure, but there appears to be a significant gap between #8 and #9.
    Phyllis Berry DNA status in NAMUS is listed as Sample available - Not yet submitted. It means it is not in CODIS yet. Once it is in CODIS in can be matched against the DNA of this UID which is already in CODIS:

    https://identifyus.org/en/cases/9302

    As soon as Phyllis Berry's DNA status is updated as Sample Submitted test complete, it can be checked by the Regional Administrator

    Right now, Michael Nance is the Regional Administrator for this UID and he is very helpful and responsive. I will keep an eye on this case, once the DNA status is updated for Phyllis Berry I will email Michael Nance (or whoever happens to be the Regional Administrator for this case) for a possible DNA match.

    It's just going to have to wait until then.
    Last edited by CarlK90245; 01-19-2013 at 12:35 AM. Reason: Added level-2 quotes.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    El Segundo, California
    Posts
    7,483
    The dentals are entered for Phyllis Berry. But as was the case with Peggy Sue Houser, (who, like this Jane Doe, had retained multiple baby teeth into adulthood), you can't rely on the accuracy of the dental chart.

    You would be able to see though whether PEB had fillings in any of her teeth, in which case she would be a likely rule-out. It appears that this Jane Doe had none.

    BTW, a contemporaneous news article I found online indicated that she was from Odessa TX. But I haven't been able to find her in any of the yearbooks for the high schools in Odessa (either under the surname Berry or the alternate surname Ecklison). There are a few people from that era with the surname Berry, but I couldn't find her.
    Last edited by CarlK90245; 01-19-2013 at 01:09 PM.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    1,054
    This UID has 124 rule outs, https://identifyus.org/cases/3153. One not on the list is Phyllis Berry. Have we heard anything about the above DNA matches?

    https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/2927/10


    img_4430.jpeg 592UFIL.jpg

    img_4429.jpeg 101_4075-1.jpg

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    El Segundo, California
    Posts
    7,483
    The NamUs UP casefile for the 1975 Davie Jane Doe now indicates that mtDNA is available at UNT (although they weren't able to get a nucDNA profile).

    https://identifyus.org/en/cases/9302

    And PEB's casefile indicates "Sample submitted - Tests complete"

    https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/2927/0

    They should be able to do a mtDNA comparison.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    156
    Quote Originally Posted by joeytes View Post
    Phyllis Berry DNA status in NAMUS is listed as Sample available - Not yet submitted. It means it is not in CODIS yet. Once it is in CODIS in can be matched against the DNA of this UID which is already in CODIS:

    https://identifyus.org/en/cases/9302

    As soon as Phyllis Berry's DNA status is updated as Sample Submitted test complete, it can be checked by the Regional Administrator

    Right now, Michael Nance is the Regional Administrator for this UID and he is very helpful and responsive. I will keep an eye on this case, once the DNA status is updated for Phyllis Berry I will email Michael Nance (or whoever happens to be the Regional Administrator for this case) for a possible DNA match.

    It's just going to have to wait until then.

    Now that DNA is available, I emailed Michael Nance of the possible match.

    I have noticed in the last 2 months that Michael Nance does not return emails or answer his calls. I suspect he is not at NAMUS anymore. Hopefully someone will pick up on this possible match. I will keep an eye on it until it is excluded or matched.

    I also submitted a confidential web tip to Odessa Police. She was listed as a missing person on their web site. I always wondered if police followed up on web tips. We should find out soon.
    Last edited by joeytes; 03-13-2013 at 12:56 PM.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    El Segundo, California
    Posts
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    I've seen the teeth on the 75 Davie Jane Doe, and I can now say I am sure she is not Phyllis. The 75 Davie Doe's teeth are very severely gapped. The gap is about 1/4 inch wide, and her #9 tooth skews outward and to the left. Phyllis' teeth are nowhere near that badly gapped and skewed.


  11. #11
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    9,734
    http://sanangelolive.com/news/intern...tion-terlingua
    The annual World Champion Chili Cookoff in Terlingua was held again last week. The 48th annual this year.
    Every year around the first of November the population of Terlingua, in the Big Bend of Texas, swells considerably as “chili-heads” flock to the famous spot to attend one, or both, of the competing chili cook-offs: The Francis X. Tolbert-Wick Fowler International Original Terlingua Championship Chili Cook-Off and the Chili Appreciation Society International’s Terlingua Chili Championship
    Phyllis has been missing for 39 years.

    In additional to Carl's ruleout, Phyllis is a listed ruleout on these Unidentified Women:
    https://identifyus.org/cases/8493
    ME/C Case Number: N1993-37273
    Fairfax County, Virginia
    26 to 34 year old White Female
    Found 12.06.1993

    https://identifyus.org/cases/6259
    ME/C Case Number: HCCO-OC-45-81
    Lawrence County, Ohio
    30 to 60 year old White Female
    Found 04.22.1981

    https://identifyus.org/cases/6150
    ME/C Case Number: C1998-29162
    Stafford County, Virginia
    28 to 45 year old White Female
    Found 11.07.1998

    https://identifyus.org/cases/8427
    ME/C Case Number: 0620-82
    Washoe County, Nevada
    25 to 35 year old White Female
    Found 1.20.2011

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Posts
    1,372
    Did anyone happen to see/possibly save/take any screen shots of the x rays of Phyllis's teeth by chance? I'm not sure if they were still available for viewing in NamUs when they were updated but if someone has them, I would love to see them.
    All you need is love and. . . .(fill in the blank)

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Posts
    1,372
    Found a picture of Phyllis that someone posted on another site that they got from an old newspaper article. She looks very different than some of her other photos, this one is fully face forward so you can get a sense of her nose and the spacing of her eyes. The original poster didn't state what paper it came from or when:
    Attached Images Attached Images
    All you need is love and. . . .(fill in the blank)

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Posts
    1,372
    Just curious, does anyone know if a someone has rhinoplasty if the ME can tell? Let's say I just had the tip of my nose bobbed, but didn't have anything done that required changing the bridge of my nose, could they tell? I'm referring to someone with a recognizable face, not so much skeletal remains. Anyone know?
    All you need is love and. . . .(fill in the blank)

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    TX
    Posts
    127
    I was friends with Phyllis. I do not believe that is her in the last pics. She lived with a couple she called aunt and uncle, but I am fairly sure not blood relation. She went by their last name, Matheny, for awhile. She did not complete high school so no pics would be available. I wish her disappearance could solved, I think about her often.

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