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Thread: NE - Omaha Double Murder #3 - *Arrest Made*

  1. #76
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    I still wish we knew more about what was going on in Calgary. The good news
    is that if they decided not to call one of our suspicious characters to testify in the
    botched autopsy cases, they must know where he is. I haven't heard a really good
    argument about why he should be taken off our list of possible perpetrators other than
    "gut feelings."

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  3. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by brudsaunt View Post
    I still wish we knew more about what was going on in Calgary. The good news
    is that if they decided not to call one of our suspicious characters to testify in the
    botched autopsy cases, they must know where he is. I haven't heard a really good
    argument about why he should be taken off our list of possible perpetrators other than
    "gut feelings."
    Agreed. I have been trying to check Calgary media, on line newspapers and also keep tuning in to their news stations via the internet. The story there has faded out, just like it has here. Since it was getting good play there previously I now wonder if this isn't the calm before the storm.
    Speaking just for myself this man is very high on my list of suspects. He would have had the skill to carry out knife murders without leaving a lot behind and so far as we know may have had some motivation.
    I do think the authorities know where he is, I'd bet he is being watched in case he decides to run. I'd also bet a lot is going on out of sight of the public.

    For what it is worth here is a link to a short discussion of the crime I found on a previously unknown website:


    http://www.johndouglasmindhunter.com...f1bffd3be70a19
    Last edited by Snick1946; 03-04-2011 at 11:18 AM.
    'Never stop fighting..never give up'

    Kevin Kostner as Eliott Ness in 'The Untouchables'

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  5. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snick1946 View Post
    Agreed. I have been trying to check Calgary media, on line newspapers and also keep tuning in to their news stations via the internet. The story there has faded out, just like it has here. Since it was getting good play there previously I now wonder if this isn't the calm before the storm.
    Speaking just for myself this man is very high on my list of suspects. He would have had the skill to carry out knife murders without leaving a lot behind and so far as we know may have had some motivation.
    I do think the authorities know where he is, I'd bet he is being watched in case he decides to run. I'd also bet a lot is going on out of sight of the public.


    ~above respectfully BBM~

    I agree Snick. He is on the top of my list of suspects. I think LE has known about him for awhile. One of our very own WS posters eluded to a Russian way back on the previous thread. I think this investigation is taking awhile due to MB living across the border in Canada.

    I don't know that OPD would expend the money and resources to travel across the border without reasonable suspicion. JMO.

    wm
    ...and be sure your sin will find you out.

    Numbers,32:23

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  7. #79
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    * I'm copying part of an article I found:

    A neighbor of the Hunters', who spoke on the condition of not being named,reported seeing a shorts-clad Thomas Hunter coming home as usual Thursday, getting off his school bus in front of the family's home just before 3 p.m.

    About 3:20 p.m., the same neighbor saw a car moving conspicuously down the street, starting and stopping as if the driver were looking for an address. The driver was a dark-haired man with olive skin, and his car had pink- or peach-colored license plates.

    The same neighbor spoke with two other neighbors who saw the same man. One of them saw him wearing a black coat and carrying a briefcase and walking up to the house. He was let in the door by the housecleaner.

    The man later was seen by another neighbor walking back to his car, which was parked nearby. He did not seem to be uncomfortable or in a hurry.

    * I have always wondered how many neighbors were witnesses and according to his article, there were at least four. I wonder if any think MB is the person they saw that day?

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  9. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by mac6831 View Post
    * I'm copying part of an article I found:

    A neighbor of the Hunters', who spoke on the condition of not being named,reported seeing a shorts-clad Thomas Hunter coming home as usual Thursday, getting off his school bus in front of the family's home just before 3 p.m.

    About 3:20 p.m., the same neighbor saw a car moving conspicuously down the street, starting and stopping as if the driver were looking for an address. The driver was a dark-haired man with olive skin, and his car had pink- or peach-colored license plates.

    The same neighbor spoke with two other neighbors who saw the same man. One of them saw him wearing a black coat and carrying a briefcase and walking up to the house. He was let in the door by the housecleaner.The man later was seen by another neighbor walking back to his car, which was parked nearby. He did not seem to be uncomfortable or in a hurry.

    * I have always wondered how many neighbors were witnesses and according to his article, there were at least four. I wonder if any think MB is the person they saw that day?

    I've always questioned how a neighbor could see who let the stranger in unless they were standing on the Hunter's sidewalk. The Hunter house in photos looks as if it sits a good distance from the street. I would like to know exactly where the SUV was parked in reference to the Hunter home.
    YellowDog

    These are my opinions only and should not be misconstrued as factual.


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  11. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by YellowDog View Post
    I've always questioned how a neighbor could see who let the stranger in unless they were standing on the Hunter's sidewalk. The Hunter house in photos looks as if it sits a good distance from the street. I would like to know exactly where the SUV was parked in reference to the Hunter home.
    I'd sure like to know just who this helpful neighbor was. I have visited the neighborhood more than once. I suppose if someone was staring out the front window across the street it's possible they could have seen all this, including the POI being let in. Unless someone knew something was going down, why were they looking so much at all?
    I think there is an established pattern in these events- if a neighbor comes forward with a lot of detailed information then you need to be suspicious of that neighbor.
    On the other hand I wonder if LE used something like hypnosis to extract these statements?
    I first visited that area a few months after the killings; at that time the house just north of the Hunters' was up for sale. Not too many homes go on the market in that area....
    'Never stop fighting..never give up'

    Kevin Kostner as Eliott Ness in 'The Untouchables'

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  13. #82
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    I agree. If some neighbor did see who let the stranger in, I think they would have had to be directly across the street from the Hunter house. I also find it unusual that they didn't know what time the stranger left if they were watching that closely.

    Could a neighbor have been using these events as a cover for themselves? Makes you wonder.....

    I have never, in my own mind, completely ruled out someone from right there in the neighborhood.

    Quote Originally Posted by Snick1946 View Post
    I'd sure like to know just who this helpful neighbor was. I have visited the neighborhood more than once. I suppose if someone was staring out the front window across the street it's possible they could have seen all this, including the POI being let in. Unless someone knew something was going down, why were they looking so much at all?
    I think there is an established pattern in these events- if a neighbor comes forward with a lot of detailed information then you need to be suspicious of that neighbor.
    On the other hand I wonder if LE used something like hypnosis to extract these statements?
    I first visited that area a few months after the killings; at that time the house just north of the Hunters' was up for sale. Not too many homes go on the market in that area....
    YellowDog

    These are my opinions only and should not be misconstrued as factual.


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  15. #83
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    Here's a link to a new article about Dr. Belenky. I wish the news would report his current whereabouts in one of their articles.


    http://www.calgaryherald.com/story_p...39835&sponsor=
    YellowDog

    These are my opinions only and should not be misconstrued as factual.


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  17. #84
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    I'm beginning to think they don't have anything on Dr. Belenky and we are back to square one on this case. I hope I'm wrong and that it is close to being solved.
    YellowDog

    These are my opinions only and should not be misconstrued as factual.


  18. #85
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    anniversary article

    I live in the area so am expecting to read an "update" (wishful thinking?) in the Omaha World Herald this weekend since the third anniversary of this horrible crime is Sunday. Will post any new information. Or will LE continue to leave the public in the dark?

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  20. #86
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    Third Anniversary. March 13, 2011

    This Sunday marks the third anniversary of a brutal, senseless crime that took the lives of two very nice human beings. I would not be surprised to see some article but again I wouldn't be if one did not appear.

    I want to take this moment to thank all of you who have participated in this thread. This has been a long sometimes frustrating journey with many ups and downs. I have in the past years been almost certain from time to time that LE was close to an arrest only to have the hope fade away.

    In all this time, hope can fade. We have seen posters come and go, some who were regulars have not been heard from for months. I do not blame them. After awhile there seems little left to say. However I do know one thing; somewhere out there, a killer is walking among us. I believe that killer has followed this case, perhaps even this discussion.

    Some of us may drop out of the discussion or post less often, but no one should mistake this for a letting go. Justice still needs to be done. I know some of you well enough by now to feel this will not be forgotten.

    Justice for Tom and Shirlee!
    'Never stop fighting..never give up'

    Kevin Kostner as Eliott Ness in 'The Untouchables'

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  22. #87
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    I am resurrecting what I think are some of the more thoughtful posts on this crime as I think some new to this board may not have seen them. This one is respectfully copied from a July 2009 post from Greykid. It is one of the most thought provoking I have seen and I admit i failed to appreciate its worth at the time:



    Ok, finally done with the mulling over and re-wording. Gonna post in two chunks so I don't fry the board, heh! As ever with me, it's all just lateral thinking stuff - that's my background, as opposed to hard research, which I'm fairly lame at. Hope that's cool!

    Been through and read this thread from the beginning, good work guys.

    So...initial thoughts on a couple of notions previously outlined. All IMO, of course!

    1. ‘Suspicious visitor’ POI as the lone perp?
    I’m going with yes for now, reasons being:
    i. Timing fits. If POI left Shirlee/Tom alive when he left, then actual perp would have had to sneak in and out again, completely unobserved, within next half hour or so. Multiple witnesses to arrival/exit of POI make this seem unlikely.
    ii. For same reason as (i), additional perp(s) involved at scene is unlikely. Unseen conspirator(s) would have had to arrive at Hunter property earlier, and stayed remarkably well hidden from what sound like very observant neighbors. A one-perp operation at the scene more plausible.
    iii. Clothing worn and bag carried by POI seem to match/allow for perp’s MO.


    2. Weapons used
    Would be very useful (though impossible at present?) to establish whether the two (precisely two?) knives ‘recovered’ were either:
    a) brought to the house
    b) already belonged there, used more opportunistically
    c) a combination - one brought, additional grabbed?

    - Generally, weapons left at scene more common in case of b), as we know.
    - However, bag carried by POI makes a) distinctly possible.
    - If a), did the perp bring a ‘spare’, or use two together? A slick, organized perp might well carry a spare to a well-planned hit, but POI’s apparent difficulty in locating the right house - whether or not they actually succeeded - doesn’t seem well-planned. If he didn’t know exactly where the address was, how could he accurately predict what time he’d get there? And yet the perp here seemed to be operating in a fairly narrow time window - doesn't suggest good planning to me. However, two might have been carried to act as a single weapon, which seems to fit a rage scenario.
    - Weapons being left as a ‘message’ seems far-fetched, IMHO. Would Dr Hunter, a medial teacher, really be expected to note and understand any ambiguous or convoluted criminal ‘shorthand’ amid the shock and horror of the scene?

    NB: Clearly the Hunters, and therefore LE, will definitely know whether the weapons were brought in or not. And yet we, the public, do not. Can we thus infer that the answer is particularly significant? I think so. Why? Two reasons:

    i. If no weapon was brought, suggests perp was already known to either Shirlee or at least one of the Hunter family. Also suggests the visit might at one point have had an alternate outcome, but that things somehow went badly awry. (NB: To me, ‘potential different outcome’ theory also seems to match POI’s witnessed behaviour in approaching the house - stop-starting down an affluent suburban road in a silver SUV is hardly discrete for someone who knew they were definitely about to commit a major crime.)

    ii. Answer to whether or not weapons were brought might tell us which victim was killed first, especially if the earlier mention of a weapon left in Tom’s body is accurate, and therefore help clarify a motive.

    So:

    3. Order of events at the scene
    If ‘weapon in Tom’s body’ rumour is accurate, then the order of attacks seems to hinge on whether one or two knives were used simultaneously.

    i. If perp used one at a time, seems more likely Tom was attacked first. Either the weapon stuck awkwardly, or perp let go of it as Tom fell, giving cause to use a second weapon to attack Shirlee. Had perp attacked Shirlee first with one weapon, which remained in his possession (ie. was not left in the body), why then ‘swap’ weapons to attack Tom?

    ii. If perp used two weapons simultaneously, seems more likely Shirlee was attacked first. Would seem odd for a perp to attack a child using two weapons, leave one behind in the process, then go after an adult using just one?

    There's more to follow..
    'Never stop fighting..never give up'

    Kevin Kostner as Eliott Ness in 'The Untouchables'

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  24. #88
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    I received some information from a source who does not want to be named tonight. I was told that OPD no longer is giving credence to much of the eyewittness accounts that have been part and parcel of this case since day one. They especially are now discounting the alleged account of someone seeing Shirlee admit him to the house. He was apparently seen standing on the porch but was never seen getting in. The accounts of the POI's appearence are also questioned, the composite has not been circulated by OPD for some time. {mod edit}

    I don't want to seem mysterous, but this comes from a source that has always given me stuff that checks out and who in the past has given me advance notice of new information.
    I am placing this comment with their permission. This may change a lot of the direction of this discussion if accepted.
    Last edited by fran; 03-13-2011 at 04:48 PM. Reason: per poster's request
    'Never stop fighting..never give up'

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  26. #89
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    Thinking of Tom and Shirlee and their families today! I pray that justice is served for these senseless murders.

    wm

    (snick thanks for the update)
    ...and be sure your sin will find you out.

    Numbers,32:23

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  28. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by waltzingmatilda View Post
    Thinking of Tom and Shirlee and their families today! I pray that justice is served for these senseless murders.

    wm

    (snick thanks for the update)
    You should know, WM, and Snick and YellowDog - all of you who keep this thread interesting and and so compelling - that I read everything you write here, and I'll be praying right beside you, for justice for Tom and Shirlee's murders, and for peace to find those who love them -including you fine folks. Your dedication is a fine thing.

    Best,

    coastal
    If you're lucky enough to be at the beach, you're lucky enough.

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  30. #91
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    I have to second coastal's motion....I read here consistently but rarely post as I really have nothing of value to add - don't want to clutter up the thread with innocuous posts. I too appreciate all of the info and all of the work everyone has put forth on Tom and Shirlee's behalf.

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  32. #92
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    I third the motion.. I always read this thread

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  34. #93
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    Awww! Ya'll are very kind and your words touch me. I am glad to know you all read here and keep up. This case has been difficult to sleuth due to lack of info from OPD but I can understand since this investigation is ongoing. We try really hard to keep the thread bumped up to keep awareness to the forefront.

    Personally, I will never give up on this case being solved. I identify with both victims as a former 5th grade teacher who cleaned houses during summer break to make ends meet.

    It breaks my heart to think of what Tom and Shirlee went through. I want this killer to pay for his crime and for Tom's and Shirlee's families to have justice for their deceased loved ones. I hope you all continue to hang in here with us!

    wm
    ...and be sure your sin will find you out.

    Numbers,32:23

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  36. #94
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    Omaha World Herald Article 3-13-11

    On a gorgeous March weekday, shortly after school let out, someone entered the 2½-story brick home of two doctors and killed their child and their housecleaner.

    Both were stabbed in the neck: Thomas Hunter, 11, a curious sixth-grade boy who loved nature, science and animals. And Shirlee Sherman, 57, who enjoyed gardening, crocheting and spending time with her grandchildren.

    Sunday marks the third anniversary of one of the most baffling, unsolved homicide cases to jolt Omaha in years. “It's still a sore spot,” said Dr. Vernon Ward, a longtime neighbor.

    Ward, a retired physician, and others still ask the same questions that were first raised three years ago:

    Who was the olive-skinned stranger spotted by other neighbors?

    The man who slowed his vehicle near the Hunters' home, apparently searching for a specific address? Who finally parked on a side street about a block away from the Hunters' home near 54th and Davenport Streets?


    <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<full article at link>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    http://www.omaha.com/article/20110313/NEWS97/703139919


    I plan to comment later today.
    Last edited by fran; 03-13-2011 at 05:06 PM. Reason: to comply with copyright laws and provide link
    'Never stop fighting..never give up'

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  38. #95
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    Thank you for sharing, Snick! I am so very pleased that OWH ran this piece, there is alot of new information included that I have not previously heard. I am eager to dissect this news article and make notes of new information/clues.

    It will probably be tomorrow before I can commit time and concentration as it is family day for watching the basketball tourneys

    The information in this link is very compelling and there is alot to glean from it, IMO.

    Thanks much, wm
    ...and be sure your sin will find you out.

    Numbers,32:23

  39. #96
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    Article about reward

    This article is about the reward, apparently setting a record for a Nebraska homicide...

    http://www.omaha.com/article/2011031...or-single-case

    AMW exposure would sound to be the best thing for this case if it continues unsolved.
    'Never stop fighting..never give up'

    Kevin Kostner as Eliott Ness in 'The Untouchables'

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  41. #97
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    A few random thoughts on reading today's article:

    I would love to know what the list of names Dr Hunter was shown was all about. This is intriguing. None were apparently CU students or staf members. Could they possibly be possible on-line friends of Tom?

    Then a day or so later the lead detective drops by. He wants to look the house over again. My take: they have a theory and are testing it; can it be related to the list of names?

    The FBI profile indicated a possible transient serial killer. OPD sounds to now want to resubmit some new evidence to their experts. Can they now have evidence that they think may lead the FBI to a different conclusion?

    The Hunters apparently have had a PI investigating this for awhile. I was glad to hear this. It tends to disprove any possible connection to their family and also a PI can go places and do things LE cannot. It sounds that OPD is not opposing this. The man they retained is the best they could have, he has a good reputation as a tough investigator.
    'Never stop fighting..never give up'

    Kevin Kostner as Eliott Ness in 'The Untouchables'

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  43. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snick1946 View Post
    On a gorgeous March weekday, shortly after school let out, someone entered the 2½-story brick home of two doctors and killed their child and their housecleaner.

    Both were stabbed in the neck: Thomas Hunter, 11, a curious sixth-grade boy who loved nature, science and animals. And Shirlee Sherman, 57, who enjoyed gardening, crocheting and spending time with her grandchildren.

    Sunday marks the third anniversary of one of the most baffling, unsolved homicide cases to jolt Omaha in years. “It's still a sore spot,” said Dr. Vernon Ward, a longtime neighbor.

    Ward, a retired physician, and others still ask the same questions that were first raised three years ago:

    Who was the olive-skinned stranger spotted by other neighbors?

    The man who slowed his vehicle near the Hunters' home, apparently searching for a specific address? Who finally parked on a side street about a block away from the Hunters' home near 54th and Davenport Streets?


    <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<full article at link>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    http://www.omaha.com/article/20110313/NEWS97/703139919


    I plan to comment later today.
    BBM. This just jumps off the page, doesn't it? So...discordant, and so very cold. Who in the round blue world could do that?
    If you're lucky enough to be at the beach, you're lucky enough.

  44. #99
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    I still can't rule out in my own mind that it's not someone from right there in the neighborhood. I could visualize some perverted male from the neighborhood watching Tom get off the bus day after day becoming very familiar with his routine and where he lived.

    Could this fictitious male have gone to the Hunter home with the intentions of forcing himself on Tom not knowing Shirlee would be there (Shirlee probably always entered from the back door and parked her car in the back) but thinking he would be there alone until his parents got home? Perhaps Tom even knew the neighbor and let him enter the house under some ruse and when the neighbor discovered Shirlee was there, he went berserk.


    Quote Originally Posted by Snick1946 View Post
    I received some information from a source who does not want to be named tonight. I was told that OPD no longer is giving credence to much of the eyewittness accounts that have been part and parcel of this case since day one. They especially are now discounting the alleged account of someone seeing Shirlee admit him to the house. He was apparently seen standing on the porch but was never seen getting in. The accounts of the POI's appearence are also questioned, the composite has not been circulated by OPD for some time. {mod edit}

    I don't want to seem mysterous, but this comes from a source that has always given me stuff that checks out and who in the past has given me advance notice of new information.
    I am placing this comment with their permission. This may change a lot of the direction of this discussion if accepted.
    YellowDog

    These are my opinions only and should not be misconstrued as factual.


  45. #100
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    Quote
    "Police have told the Hunters the killer left behind little physical evidence, except for bloody knives."
    Unquote

    This paragraph from the newspaper article sounds like the killer brought his own knives into the house. I wonder exactly what kind of knives they were? Kitchen knives, hunting knives, straight blades, serrated blades?
    YellowDog

    These are my opinions only and should not be misconstrued as factual.


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