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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riverreefer View Post
    Has anyone tried to have contact with the families? I've read that Bartt reads this board regularly but doesn't post right? Has anyone had contact with the McCall family? has anyone tried to share information with them and see if they can shed any light on some of the dark spots surrounding the SPD investigation? Maybe the SPD shared info with them that the public wasn't privy to?
    Newspaper PDF files were shared sometime ago regarding Garrison's trial. That's a curious matter, possibly related to this case.
    "Never answer an anonymous letter"

    "I didn't really say everything I said"

    Yogi Berra



  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Resident View Post
    I have lived in Springfield all my life and followed this since the beginning. I am new to the forum and spent the last few weeks reading all the past threads. I have a question though, does anyone remember a dig or search that was done, I want to say around 2000-2003 that was at first covered by KY3 and the News-Leader and in fact I think something was found, but the evidence was sealed or a gag order was placed and it immediately dropped out of the public eye? It seemed like it was in both the paper and the news one day as something promising, and actually going on, then the next day it was gone. I thought perhaps it was the Cassville dig but from what I have read nothing was found. I might just be remembering all wrong and need to get to the library to look and see if I can find the original article.
    There was a gag order placed on the dig in 1993 Webster County. I know that information on the 2004 dig in Cassville had some potential blood evidence and it took a long time before it was found to be of no value.

  3. #18
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    Webster County

    Thanks, I was wanting a reference point to see if I could find the article. I've always felt there were only two ways this could be, everything was known or nothing, and always leaned toward the former. I'd hoped, for their sake, that at least the families had been given the information even if it was never made public but I got the impression from the ID channel show that they had no more information than anyone else. I think after losing two high profile cases (Feeney and Revell) shortly after this happened there might have been a more cautious approach to bringing this to a trial, maybe to cautious but it is hard to say since nothing has ever really been released on it.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Resident View Post
    Thanks, I was wanting a reference point to see if I could find the article. I've always felt there were only two ways this could be, everything was known or nothing, and always leaned toward the former. I'd hoped, for their sake, that at least the families had been given the information even if it was never made public but I got the impression from the ID channel show that they had no more information than anyone else. I think after losing two high profile cases (Feeney and Revell) shortly after this happened there might have been a more cautious approach to bringing this to a trial, maybe to cautious but it is hard to say since nothing has ever really been released on it.
    I have heard some say everything is known, but a confession would be needed to prove anything. If that is the case then I suspect that Garrison's story holds true to some degree. The people in that group would need to come forward with information. Much is made about Cox, but the first year after the crime was about Garrison. I believe he is the key to the case. There have been several rumors that sound similar. I believe that some truth rings in those stories. I also am 99% sure he and Cox have never met. Personal history and personality types are polar opposites. Garrison had a group of friends and family in Springfield and he was only out of prison for 3 weeks. IF the Florida caller is to be believed as credible we have more than one involved here. That points to Garrison's story. Cox worked alone, if he is anything at all it is by himself.

    One other very important part of this is Garrison is a convicted rapist falling into a specific category of rapist that is dangerous. He was very impulsive and he was a substance abuser. He used a weapon in his rape, and he controlled that crime scene by terrorizing. One thing that should be pointed out is Garrison looks similar to the transient in the area. The man was spotted in the area for up to 2 days.

    OR as you say, maybe they have nothing and never did. This is equally as possible.

  5. #20
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    I think at the beginning they really had nothing, the van on police station lawn seemed to be almost desperation, as in "we have one good (maybe) lead and this is it." Worse, if the person who did it had no connection to a van they then knew the police were on the wrong trail. Later it seemed there was more coming out but it was only vaguely reported on here and there. I think there was only one person. I don't see any more being involved as someone would have rolled over on the other by now. Both Cox and Garrison had issues with the law both before and after this. I can't imagine one not telling on the other for immunity, lighter sentence, etc. That is how the mafia came apart in the 70's and 80's and I can't see a conspiracy holding up in Springfield too well.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Missouri Mule View Post
    We know that the police were notified by the Zellers family within just a few days after the women went missing.

    Steve Zellers did NOT contact the SPD until AFTER the 48 Hours story about our girls aired a few months after their disappearance!!!

    I have contacted both prisons and asked to meet with both Cox and Garrison...both requests were denied.
    Don't confront me with my failures.....I had not forgotten them.

    Jackson Browne

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riverreefer View Post
    Has anyone tried to have contact with the families? I've read that Bartt reads this board regularly but doesn't post right? Has anyone had contact with the McCall family? has anyone tried to share information with them and see if they can shed any light on some of the dark spots surrounding the SPD investigation? Maybe the SPD shared info with them that the public wasn't privy to?

    I have been in touch with both families. Do you really think that those of us who have inside information would broadcast it on a public information board?
    Don't confront me with my failures.....I had not forgotten them.

    Jackson Browne

  8. #23
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    There is no proof the door was locked, only conjecture on MM's part because someone said Sherrill was security minded. That begs the question of were the girls careful to lock the door behind them after a night of partying? Odds are no and if mother was alseep or did not arise after they came home, odds are the door was unlocked. Anyone who has had teenage children would know that. Elementary my dear super investigator mule

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathee View Post
    Steve Zellers did NOT contact the SPD until AFTER the 48 Hours story about our girls aired a few months after their disappearance!!!

    I have contacted both prisons and asked to meet with both Cox and Garrison...both requests were denied.
    I stand corrected. It was my recollection that Steve Zellers contacted the police within about a week or 10 days after hearing about the case. Evidently that was not until the 48 hours piece aired. That would have been about three months later if my recollection is correct. September, 1992, I believe.

    Kathee, did Cox and Garrison deny your request or was it the prison officials or both?
    "Never answer an anonymous letter"

    "I didn't really say everything I said"

    Yogi Berra



  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by olddog View Post
    There is no proof the door was locked, only conjecture on MM's part because someone said Sherrill was security minded. That begs the question of were the girls careful to lock the door behind them after a night of partying? Odds are no and if mother was alseep or did not arise after they came home, odds are the door was unlocked. Anyone who has had teenage children would know that. Elementary my dear super investigator mule
    I don't believe I ever have said the side door was locked or unlocked because I have no idea. Now if your contention is that Sherrill was not awakened when the girls arrived in two cars; if in fact they did arrive, that I would find hard to believe. As I understand the layout of her bedroom was facing the street. She would have seen the headlights and the sound of the cars pulling into the driveway unless she were a heavy sleeper. If in fact she was not awakened, then it is plausible the side door was unlocked. If, as reported to me, Suzie was not provided a key to the side door, it seems probable but not provable that that Sherrill would have wanted to ensure the doors were locked after the girls arrived.

    To my knowledge the only information revealed about any door being unlocked pertained to the front door. I can't recall ever reading or hearing anything about the side door being locked or unlocked. That would have been a significant fact, which if withheld, doesn't seem to me to be particularly important as it doesn't advance the case. It would make more clear, however, to the public that they could have exited out of either door. Logically, it seems the front door was the probable exit. I don't think it really matters.
    "Never answer an anonymous letter"

    "I didn't really say everything I said"

    Yogi Berra




  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Resident View Post
    I think at the beginning they really had nothing, the van on police station lawn seemed to be almost desperation, as in "we have one good (maybe) lead and this is it." Worse, if the person who did it had no connection to a van they then knew the police were on the wrong trail. Later it seemed there was more coming out but it was only vaguely reported on here and there. I think there was only one person. I don't see any more being involved as someone would have rolled over on the other by now. Both Cox and Garrison had issues with the law both before and after this. I can't imagine one not telling on the other for immunity, lighter sentence, etc. That is how the mafia came apart in the 70's and 80's and I can't see a conspiracy holding up in Springfield too well.
    I essentially agree with you but there is a curious blending of stories among the two suspects. In Cox's letter he made reference to his belief that the police blew their chance to solve this case at the very beginning. A paraphrasing as reported in the News-Leader had Garrison making an almost identical conclusion. The inference I draw from this is that both were operating from the same basis of personal knowledge. Stated differently, if they were not connected, either directly or indirectly, how would they be able to make that conclusion? I'm also drawn to Cox's letter where he referred to "Steve" questioning whether he was given or offered a polygraph. I'm certain that Garrison was the one being referenced. Cox refused as reported. I don't recall reading or hearing if Garrison ever was given a polygraph.

    As to the van, it has always been open to question. Recently, however, it was noted that a similar van was seen by the newspaper carrier parked on Kentwood in the early morning. Years ago I happened to have a parcel delivery route where I drove the same route into Illinois about 4 AM in the morning. Due to the fact that there is relatively little traffic on the road and very little in the way of distraction at this hour of the morning I find this sighting very compelling. Additionally, I seem to recall that Kentwood is a relatively narrow street. Thinking as someone who wanted to get into that house and keep his vehicle out of sight, parking a short distance on Kentwood would have been an ideal place to have parked it before needing to move it to the Levitt driveway.
    "Never answer an anonymous letter"

    "I didn't really say everything I said"

    Yogi Berra



  12. #27
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    Entry gained is important, even a ruse at the front door, does not account for the women being subdued. You go in the front door, and the house splits as far as where the women were. I think you have to think about this, we are talking seconds here. If Sherrill goes to the door and is overwhelmed you have 2 girls in the back bedroom. If Suzie goes to the door, you have 2 women in seperate rooms on different ends of the house. The dog is still in the picture. How does a perp gain access without a dog hearing and barking, alerting the others, even if they are asleep? I think this points two ways, the women knew the person/s or that the perp gained access before the girls arrived, girls come home and he has Sherrill in her bedroom, waits for the others to go to bed, then makes a move to them. It may have happened right on the front steps with more than one? Pretty hard to think of it any other way.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trooogrit View Post
    Entry gained is important, even a ruse at the front door, does not account for the women being subdued. You go in the front door, and the house splits as far as where the women were. I think you have to think about this, we are talking seconds here. If Sherrill goes to the door and is overwhelmed you have 2 girls in the back bedroom. If Suzie goes to the door, you have 2 women in seperate rooms on different ends of the house. The dog is still in the picture. How does a perp gain access without a dog hearing and barking, alerting the others, even if they are asleep? I think this points two ways, the women knew the person/s or that the perp gained access before the girls arrived, girls come home and he has Sherrill in her bedroom, waits for the others to go to bed, then makes a move to them. It may have happened right on the front steps with more than one? Pretty hard to think of it any other way.
    Upon reflection, I think you have a good point. Is it a fact that the girls could have been more easily subdued if the attacker/abductor came in from the side entrance? And then Sherrill taken down? Where exactly does that side entry go into? Now that's a door, is it not? Didn't Suzie have a sliding glass type door arrangement into her bedroom? Just looking at the house I am inclined to think the entry would have been into a utility room or kitchen. If that were the case, then the perp would have had to stealthily move from that area presumably into the bedroom where the girls were located I would think. I would be inclined to believe it would be more logical to want to take them down before moving on to Sherrill.
    "Never answer an anonymous letter"

    "I didn't really say everything I said"

    Yogi Berra



  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Missouri Mule View Post
    I essentially agree with you but there is a curious blending of stories among the two suspects. In Cox's letter he made reference to his belief that the police blew their chance to solve this case at the very beginning. A paraphrasing as reported in the News-Leader had Garrison making an almost identical conclusion. The inference I draw from this is that both were operating from the same basis of personal knowledge. Stated differently, if they were not connected, either directly or indirectly, how would they be able to make that conclusion? I'm also drawn to Cox's letter where he referred to "Steve" questioning whether he was given or offered a polygraph. I'm certain that Garrison was the one being referenced. Cox refused as reported. I don't recall reading or hearing if Garrison ever was given a polygraph..
    What is forgotten here is that Cox had the luxury of being free and reading about Garrison in the papers. Cox did not come onto the radar as a strong suspect until late 1995 early 1996. This was after the four agencies met and said they essentially agreed with the SPD and conluded sexual assault was the likely motive, but would have the suspects listed differently. In early 1996 they went to Texas. Garrison was already in prison on the rape out of the focus of the investigation. If Cox was a part of the 94 grand jury he would have been privy to that information too. Cox could have used anything that happened from 1992 to 1996, in his story telling. Garrison and Cox had similar statements in 1997, long after both were incarcerated, and Garrison could have made statements based on what Cox had said in the papers as well. I do not find any link between these two. It would be about as unlikely a pair as you would find. One other thing, even if Cox were guilty, he is playing a game with the police, no doubt in my mind. He was always prepared when they came to see him. Its a game to him.

  15. #30
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    Is it not true that the grand jury of 1994 is when Cox's girlfriend recanted her alibi for Cox? Cox wouldn't have known anything else that occurred in the grand jury but he would have been apprised by his girlfriend (I would think) that she had to retract her alibi or she would have been indicted for perjury or obstruction of justice if she held fast to that story. So far as I know Cox was never called as a witness to the grand jury. So he had no personal knowledge of anything other than what his girlfriend may have told him. She had a constitutional right to reveal what she said during the grand jury proceedings to anyone she wanted to.

    I'm not entirely clear how Garrison's arrest and conviction for the rape impacted Cox. Can you flesh that out for me?
    "Never answer an anonymous letter"

    "I didn't really say everything I said"

    Yogi Berra



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