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  1. #16
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    as Richard pointed out in his original posts about this case (the following is from Court TV's CrimeLibrary.com)-
    SC law enforcement recovered a weapon with the serial number partially filed off from a drunk driver, approximately four months after the murders. Bullets taken from the weapon matched those recovered from the bodies. The driver was released when his alibi apparently checked out.
    If the calibers matched, it would seem easy enough to check the slugs recovered from "Cali" to this weapon. I would also hope the weapon would be checked with today's technology for further evidence.

  2. #17
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    May 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by shadowangel
    as Richard pointed out in his original posts about this case (the following is from Court TV's CrimeLibrary.com)-
    SC law enforcement recovered a weapon with the serial number partially filed off from a drunk driver, approximately four months after the murders. Bullets taken from the weapon matched those recovered from the bodies. The driver was released when his alibi apparently checked out.
    If the calibers matched, it would seem easy enough to check the slugs recovered from "Cali" to this weapon. I would also hope the weapon would be checked with today's technology for further evidence.
    I have tried to gather info regarding databases for ballistics in the past too. I'm far from an expert on any of this. What I have found is that there is not a national requirement to enter ballistics into a database. (Unless like you mentioned the FBI becomes involved, or Vidocq, etc.) When I looked, I found that there are several ballistics databases (mostly by state and a couple by regions) and they are growing in amounts of information and popularity. I don't know how/who determines when or if cold case ballistics are entered into any sort of database. If you find this out please let me know. I would find it very helpful to have that info. I'm glad that someone else is interested in this too. Some of the ballistics database info links are here:
    Note: Please don't be offended by the political nature of some of these links. I'm not trying to stir up any debate on gun control at all by providing these links. This is just info I came across when I was comparing cases like you are with Cali and the SC couple.
    http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory...imelab/1830415
    http://www.bradycampaign.org/facts/i...page=ballistic
    http://www.mitretek.org/publications...ngerprints.pdf
    http://caag.state.ca.us/newsalerts/2002/02-122.htm
    http://www.pbs.org/newshour/extra/fe...allistics.html
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...-2005Apr1.html
    Last edited by Mullins; 08-04-2005 at 12:06 PM. Reason: spelling

  3. #18
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    Quick Correction...

    Please disregard part of my previous post, for some reason I had it in mind that "Cali's" murder came first. If the LE in SC had the recovered weapon in 1976, it is vey unlikely that it was used in a murder 3 years later! (Sometimes I scare myself...)

  4. #19
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    May 2005
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    175

    Smile

    No biggie, sounds like something I'd do or probably have done in the past. Sometimes the dates all run together at least for me.

  5. #20
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    Jul 2005
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    Exclamation French

    ...oh, were these kids European do you think?

    FRENCH, they were french tourists possibly. This needs to be checked but 99.5% sure of this

  6. #21
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    It is entirely possible...an unshaven female definitely points to a European connection, France most especially (also the lack of undergarments). It has been reported that the male used the name "Jock", or more likely, "Jacques" (sp?). He supposedly made the statement that his father was a doctor in Canda and that he had been disowned. It is certainly possible, in this scenario, that the family was from France. I considered it most likely a French-Canadian connection, but France is certainly a possibility.
    Also, keep in mind this was the summer of the Bicentennial...The country basically stopped that summer to celebrate. I'm sure the number of visitors from other countries during that summer increased greatly, as there was something going on in every town and city throughout the country.

  7. #22
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    Sep 2004
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    Trucker Connection?

    Does anyone see similarity between this case and others?

  8. #23
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    I too think they were foreign tourists visiting the States for the celebrations. Although they may have said they were Canadian, I don't think they were (but that's just a guess on my part).

    If the Jacques lead was really a true lead, why didn't LE go to the KOA office and ask to see their registration slips for that time period? KOAs required you to fill out a form saying your name, where you were from, etc.. Anyone could have written anything... but it makes you wonder why they would not have put their real information on the form.

  9. #24
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    May 2005
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    I do. Either way is a possibility. Keeping in mind that during that time frame many females were "burning bras" and not adhering to prior social norms of feminine behaviors. Otherwise they may have just not been keeping up their normal hygiene due to camping etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard
    Does anyone see similarity between this case and others?
    Last edited by Mullins; 01-01-2006 at 01:09 PM. Reason: spelling

  10. #25
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    That is a good point about the KOA registration. It would have had at least the names of the camper that registered, and if they were in a vehicle they usually wanted the license number.
    I wonder if there were any abandoned cars found in the area. If it was someone like a trucker- they would have had their truck and the campers vehicle to contend with.
    I think the trucker should have been checked out, but I would have also checked out the KOA manager. Reportedly, he was the last to see them alive and he evidently didn't provide LE with a camper registration. He could have committed the murders, thinking that no one would remember the couple. Then later have become afraid that someone would remember, and thus given his version of the story in case someone mentioned them being at the camping area.
    Just when I think that I have seen the most depraved things a human can do to another human, somebody posts a new story...........

    Why is it that when a custodial parent fails to provide for a child it is called neglect and is a criminal matter. But when a non custodial parent fails to provide it is called failure to support and is a civil matter?


    "Just when the caterpillar thought its world was over, it became a butterfly" ~ Michelle Knight


  11. #26
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    May 2005
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    That is an interesting theory MW. It's true that most campgrounds take the name and address of driver, vehicle license #, number of people in party, and such. I wonder if they did check the registration (seems such a logical thing to do) and it didn't lead to anything? If not, makes you wonder who was managing that campground at the time.



    Quote Originally Posted by mysteriew
    That is a good point about the KOA registration. It would have had at least the names of the camper that registered, and if they were in a vehicle they usually wanted the license number.
    I wonder if there were any abandoned cars found in the area. If it was someone like a trucker- they would have had their truck and the campers vehicle to contend with.
    I think the trucker should have been checked out, but I would have also checked out the KOA manager. Reportedly, he was the last to see them alive and he evidently didn't provide LE with a camper registration. He could have committed the murders, thinking that no one would remember the couple. Then later have become afraid that someone would remember, and thus given his version of the story in case someone mentioned them being at the camping area.

  12. #27
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    Another possibility is that the campers were put in an "overflow" area, where registration wasn't required. This is usually an ajoining property which is close enough for the campers to use the bathrooms, etc., on the "official" grounds.

    In other words, "off the books", discounted, cash. Many campgrounds do this kind of thing when availability is in short supply - like it was in 1976.

  13. #28
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    Oct 2005
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    the pics

    Has anyone looked at blown up versions of the pics from the crimeibrary.com site? It looks as if either the guy's shirt said something other than the coors name as listed or that someone actually wrote Sumpter on the shirt before snapping the pic.

    http://www.crimelibrary.com/graphics...oe-crime-s.jpg

  14. #29
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    Doc I don't see what you are referring to, but the shirt does say Sebring on it - perhaps that's what you are seeing? There is a full color photo of the shirt out there - I've seen it recently, but I went searching and can not locate it again


    To everyone, the Doe Network has recently added new sketches for the John and Jane Doe. If you haven't visited in a while perhaps you'd like to take a peek of the new representations of what they look like? ...just letting you know.

  15. #30
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    pic and word

    Quote Originally Posted by PonderingThings
    Doc I don't see what you are referring to, but the shirt does say Sebring on it - perhaps that's what you are seeing? . . .
    I placed a bigger copy of the pic in my sumpter album at
    http://photos.yahoo.com/docwho3
    You should download it and view it in its actual size. I added the red circle.
    As to the Sebring word note that the victem is layin with his front showing and his back is not seen and then read the description of the T-Shirt which says the back of the shirt had the Sebring word on it and not the front. Also the word in the pic does not appear to me to be the word Sebring.
    ''Coor's America's light beer'' scrawled across the front and ''Camel Challenger G T Sebring 75'' across the back.
    http://www.crimelibrary.com/notoriou..._couple/2.html

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