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Thread: Forensic Astrology - CAYLEE ANTHONY Reported missing 7/15/2008 #16

  1. #226
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leomoon80 View Post
    People in the astro communities are discussing G.A. Nessus in his natal chart as well as the Midpoints between his Synastry with C.A. as for mitigation of the defense and it's charges against him., as well as the defense's contention that GA helped hide the death of Cayley Anthony.

    I've not used NESSUS myself in the charts although it's easily added on as an important asteroid at astro.com along with the Black Moon, Lilith and other options one might add. , but I must say, there is a lot to be gained and at least thought about now that these charges have been brought to light, for being unbiased when it comes to Astrology delineations and the charts of all parties who had access to Cayley (the victim) as you all know.

    Here is a little I've found about Nessus today online:

    Asteroids: Nessus, (sex abuse)


    From: http://www.astroknowlogy.com/questio...steroid-nessus

    As for the natal chart (and I wish we had times of birth ) of all being accused,(i.e. State blames CA and Defense blames G.A. ) but we do not as of today, have the times of birth yet.

    Composite Chart of C.A. and her father, G.A. reveals:



    Venus square Pluto, Sun/Nessus - midpoint conjunct to Venus

    Moon/Saturn Midpoint is also square to Nessus
    Thanks, Leomoon. I read this last night and wanted to think about it a little. I am not an astrologer and need kindergarten interpretation, as you all know, but I also know that the stars do not lie. However, our interpretations can be different. I am having a hard time because I don't want to believe GA abused ICA just because of my feeling toward ICA and because I now see him as a broken man. However, I have treated many survivors of childhood sexual abuse and my tendancy is to be for them and believe them. Not all who accuse are sexually abused, but many who accuse are not believed.

    Taking a deep breath here --- I think we all may be a little biased and - if I may say it - are we seeking an interpretation we want to believe and discarding the one we do not like????

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  3. #227
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    Wow! Everyone here has completely valid, yet differing, points.

    If I were George (being ex law enforcement) the first thing I would say would be "hook me up for a polygraph test". Just sayin'.

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  5. #228
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frigga View Post
    Wow! Everyone here has completely valid, yet differing, points.

    If I were George (being ex law enforcement) the first thing I would say would be "hook me up for a polygraph test". Just sayin'.
    I agree Frigga, it's very hard not to become biased with one's own emotions invested into the case as well as astrologically, as suggested, it's a subjective interpretation upon an objective natal position. Can go two ways depending upon many factors, and that is why it takes setting aside the emotions to approach a case from the most objective vantage point possible.

    Quite honestly, and all of us can see this, just by a "thanks" we can see subjective rendering, on what meets our subjective approval and what theories we discard, and we see this all the time on the forum. Those for instance who do not believe for one second that CA is mentally ill, or discard this theory will not "thank" me, lol. That is very easy to see here.

    I've said over and over, imo, Casey A. is mentally ill. I'm sure I can find something in her natal to verify my opinion in this regard.

    Not having the times of birth is a real drawback for any Astrologer too, as the Angles are "super" important.

    Midpoints as well may be read from varying perspectives, again, Astrology is an Art using as it's foundation and basis, astronomical points which then convert to symbology for the Astrologer and not everyone agrees with the symbols per se, most of course do, but not everyone in the same way.

    As for GA and his daughter's accusations?

    Well my father was seen by everyone as a "swell guy" both at his work and publically in the neighborhood and elsewhere....and I can't tell you how many times I was told this, even when my first daughter was born and he and my mom came to see me in the hospital, the girl in the next bed was very impressed with his personnae. He'd joke with my friends as a teenager, and that too would endear him to them.
    Who would have believed back then?

    I'd say without the anger, more a joking person, he came across as a G.A. would.

    Very caring, very nice very personable, (not an angry person) by any means publically anyway.

    It takes all kinds, they say; to make up a universe or a world.

    As for "Free Will", I agree, we all have free will as a soul, but we also are born into vibrations that carry over, imo.

    The Astrological saying is "The Stars impel they do not COMPEL", but try to give up cigarettes or chocolate when one is "impelled" to carry on with them, and you can see how difficult it is to overcome a vibration (by analogy) too.
    "The Greek word moira (μοῖρα) literally means a part or portion, and by extension one's portion in life or destiny.
    They controlled the metaphorical thread of life of every mortal from birth to death."

    Wikipedia


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    Leomoon, I really appreciate all that you post - you, too, Frigga! I think ICA is mentally ill, but that does not excuse what I believe she has done. I go back and forth on the sexual abuse - but if it happened, it does not excuse what she did. If it did not happen, her accusations are not excusable, either. As I said, I am inclined to believe those who say it happened to them, although I have worked with false accusations, too, but those are rare. I am interested in hearing more from our astrologers. I really appreciate their interpretations.


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    One of the reasons I reject the theory that SA caused Casey to lie is found in her natal chart. She has Mercury retrograde in Pisces in a very tight square to Mars/Uranus in Sag. That is a textbook trait of an impulsive pathological liar. Add to that the Sun / Neptune square which is layered on top of that, and there is even more evidence of an inability to tell the truth to others.
    Given that, I do not believe that SA 'caused' her lying behavior. Also, she has a very strong trine between her Venus and her Saturn. I have never seen particular beneficial aspect in the chart of a girl abused by her father. So I have to go with my gut reaction which is that Casey made it all up to cover her own self. imoo

    eta:Mercury=Mars/Uranus:
    A test of power carried through CALCULATINGLY.
    “Every day that they don’t find something is good for me.“ Billie Dunn


  8. #231
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    Quote Originally Posted by momshrink View Post
    Leomoon, I really appreciate all that you post - you, too, Frigga! I think ICA is mentally ill, but that does not excuse what I believe she has done. I go back and forth on the sexual abuse - but if it happened, it does not excuse what she did. If it did not happen, her accusations are not excusable, either. As I said, I am inclined to believe those who say it happened to them, although I have worked with false accusations, too, but those are rare. I am interested in hearing more from our astrologers. I really appreciate their interpretations.
    My mind is wide open to either/or at this point. I can't go much farther towards absolutes without the times of birth being given as evidence for the natal charts. However, I have found some interesting observations such as the following to add here:


    CA & GA composite DYNAMICS:
    the composite of Casey & GA NATALS more clearly:

    Venus is square to Pluto. With the Sun/Nessus midpoint see below conjunct to Venus . abuse is “possible” as shown by Jupiter square to Venus/Sun and opposed to Pluto in a traditional or objective look of the combined energies.

    Casey’s natal Moon (instincts or emotions) is Quincunx (harmed) by it’s harsh aspect to Saturn
    (emotions harmed in her natal chart). Similar to a square or harsh aspect , it’s indicative of one’s own childhood and inability to express emotions properly leading one to think of a person as having a “cold heart” (Alan Oken, Complete Astrology)
    From what I’d surmise…..probably adding to mental and emotional illness as the Quincunx more often then not, points to medical issues.


    Composite : GA & CMA i.e. Casey :
    Sun/Nessus Midpoint = is 27°24’ Gem/Sag - or conj. Venus in composite chart @ 26°5’Gemini which is also Quincunx to Neptune at 26°49Scorpio!

    Midpoint of Composite Venus and Mars
    = 22°AQ21’ /Leo
    Which is a degree of self-undoing and Opposes Casey’s (natal) NESSUS 22°47’Leo ( supportive of a sexual abuse indictment) of some kind or at least supportive of her “belief” it occurred.

    Enjoy your posts, as they seem well informed as to the dilemma of a sexual abuse victim and how they may function in the outer world as you apparently have been around quite a few of them.
    "The Greek word moira (μοῖρα) literally means a part or portion, and by extension one's portion in life or destiny.
    They controlled the metaphorical thread of life of every mortal from birth to death."

    Wikipedia


  9. #232
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leomoon80 View Post
    My mind is wide open to either/or at this point. I can't go much farther towards absolutes without the times of birth being given as evidence for the natal charts. However, I have found some interesting observations such as the following to add here:


    CA & GA composite DYNAMICS:
    the composite of Casey & GA NATALS more clearly:

    Venus is square to Pluto. With the Sun/Nessus midpoint see below conjunct to Venus . abuse is “possible” as shown by Jupiter square to Venus/Sun and opposed to Pluto in a traditional or objective look of the combined energies.

    Casey’s natal Moon (instincts or emotions) is Quincunx (harmed) by it’s harsh aspect to Saturn
    (emotions harmed in her natal chart). Similar to a square or harsh aspect , it’s indicative of one’s own childhood and inability to express emotions properly leading one to think of a person as having a “cold heart” (Alan Oken, Complete Astrology)
    From what I’d surmise…..probably adding to mental and emotional illness as the Quincunx more often then not, points to medical issues.


    Composite : GA & CMA i.e. Casey :
    Sun/Nessus Midpoint = is 27°24’ Gem/Sag - or conj. Venus in composite chart @ 26°5’Gemini which is also Quincunx to Neptune at 26°49Scorpio!

    Midpoint of Composite Venus and Mars
    = 22°AQ21’ /Leo
    Which is a degree of self-undoing and Opposes Casey’s (natal) NESSUS 22°47’Leo ( supportive of a sexual abuse indictment) of some kind or at least supportive of her “belief” it occurred.

    Enjoy your posts, as they seem well informed as to the dilemma of a sexual abuse victim and how they may function in the outer world as you apparently have been around quite a few of them.
    As you have already said, we can not see too much more without accurate birth times. The Venus/Pluto Square is in effect for every child born that day whose father is the same age as George. I don't think they were all abused. We need more accurate times to make that assumption, imoo.

    And the Moon / Saturn inconjunct is not certain because we have no birth time. But even if it were it is not usually indicative of physical or sexual abuse, more like emotional disconnect or feelings of distance between father and mother or child. imoo

    Composites are based upon the midpoint of two events, the birthcharts of two individuals. Without birthtimes the composite is useless imo. I would not want to accuse a man of being a pedophile based upon composite chart with no accurate birthtimes.

    I am a SA survivor and I do like to give benefit of the doubt to SA victims. But I also see how horrible it is to assume someone is guilty of abuse on flimsy evidence. And I think the evidence of Casey being a born liar is more substantial than the evidence of her being a victim of abuse by her father. imoo
    Last edited by katydid23; 06-02-2011 at 02:56 PM.
    “Every day that they don’t find something is good for me.“ Billie Dunn


  10. #233
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    Did anyone else notice that ICA is trying to seduce at least one guy on that jury if not all? Can someone please tell me if they see any of the men on the jury buying into her damsel in distress defense, or becoming infatuated with her based on the jury charts?
    Last edited by FifthEssence; 06-03-2011 at 05:37 PM. Reason: removed opinions


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    CA Natal: (checking various random times for the Moon in Cancer on her birthday)


    Moon in Cancer at Noon on her birthday CST = 10°38'
    Moon in Cancer at 1AM that same day = 05°
    Moon in Cancer at 8PM that same day =14°

    Moon more then likely (probability quotient) within orb of a Quincunx to Saturn

    Note:

    (keeping my personal feelings out of it, just giving the Astrology here of the Moon's position this day)
    "The Greek word moira (μοῖρα) literally means a part or portion, and by extension one's portion in life or destiny.
    They controlled the metaphorical thread of life of every mortal from birth to death."

    Wikipedia

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  13. #235
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    Quote Originally Posted by katydid23 View Post
    AFAIK inconjuncts are given very small orbs. Usually from 0 to 3 degrees, otherwise they are actually another minor aspect. So if she was born at mid day it would be an inconjunct. But even then, Moon inconjunct Saturn is not usually an indicator of physical sexual abuse AFAIK.

    Do you see the Inconjunct or Quincunx aspect, as usually a medical ailment in the natal charts or pointing to same?

    I'd be interested in knowing whether or not others see the same as I do, when it comes to the Quincunx often pointing to medical themes .
    Last edited by FifthEssence; 06-02-2011 at 08:24 PM.
    "The Greek word moira (μοῖρα) literally means a part or portion, and by extension one's portion in life or destiny.
    They controlled the metaphorical thread of life of every mortal from birth to death."

    Wikipedia

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  15. #236
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    I do see the inconjunct as quite often being a medical theme. I do not see it as usually being a physical assault. It may be, but I am not judging the relationship between casey and her dad on only that aspect. To me, the main reason people say that they believe Casey was abused is because of her behavior. [ lying and stealing and ignoring childs death]
    I see those things, that type of behavior, in Casey's natal chart. So it does not seem to be caused by the relationship between father and daughter, imoo.

    Also she has a very nice trine from her Venus to her saturn, and no difficult aspects from her Pluto to any of her personal planets. In fact she has Pluto trine Moon [potentially.] And that Moon opposed Neptune tells a story of her being deceitful much more than her being physically assaulted. Again, imoo. Because both her Saturn and her pluto make nice strong beneficial aspects to Venus and the Moon, the feminine duo, I do not believe she was raped throughout her childhood. In my experience there are much more difficult aspects seen in charts of lifelong SA victims.

    [ I have a fixed Grand Square involving Pluto and personal planets for example.] Her squares to Venus are from the Moon and Neptune, which to me, tells a story of her own deceitfulness. IMOO.

    ETA: my posts were in response to the statements that astrologers on other boards were saying that there is reason to believe she was being abused by her father. THAT is what I am disputing, using my own opinion on the charts only.
    “Every day that they don’t find something is good for me.“ Billie Dunn


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    Thumbs up Trine aspect Casey Anthony

    Casey has a Trine of Venus to Saturn.


    I just noticed that I too, have a Trine aspect between Saturn and Venus.

    My Saturn is located 6°Leo and my Venus is located 3°Sag.
    within 3 degrees of an exact trine.
    My Venus however, is semi-square to Mars
    He pretty much abused my younger sister and I all of our childhood, but she had more vivid memories then I from the much younger years.

    Of course I came to terms with my abuser, (my father) and forgave him before he even asked.
    Actually, he never asked forgiveness , but I dreamt he did after he died. I saw him with his stove on fire in a small apartment and said, "You almost burned the house down" (consciousness i see as houses)
    He was telling me, he tried to call me over and over I suppose for forgiveness.

    I forgave him......but also told him off, in the dream state.

    It's a shame we do not yet have Casey's time of birth, for the 2nd/8th house I learned from Magi-Astrologers is called the Axis of Desire.
    My Pluto and the Moon are both in the 2nd house.
    "The Greek word moira (μοῖρα) literally means a part or portion, and by extension one's portion in life or destiny.
    They controlled the metaphorical thread of life of every mortal from birth to death."

    Wikipedia


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    I wish we had the birth times as well. They would be fascinating charts to interpret and to compare. I am hoping some one close to the family eventually discovers the times.

    Interesting, you have a trine from Venus and Saturn and were abused by father, and I have a semi-square between the two, and had a very supportive father. Hmmmmm. I guess that goes to show us that it takes a lot of aspects, the entire big picture, to determine the outcomes.

    I love the Magi-Astrologers. I work a lot with the houses because that is what makes a chart personal, as opposed to the same chart everyone else born that day has. So not having the birth times is very frustrating, imo.
    “Every day that they don’t find something is good for me.“ Billie Dunn

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  19. #239
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    My question is: if the DT had not brought these allegations against GA and LA, would anyone see the indicators of of possible sexual abuse in the charts? Was there anything seen before the allegations were brought?
    As you can tell, I am so undecided on this. I want so much to say that everything that comes out of ICA's mouth is a lie, but I also want to believe or at least be open to believing anyone who reports that they were are victim of sexual abuse.
    I am also not sure this has any bearing on this trial. While sexual abuse may explain her behavior, it does not excuse her behavior.

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  21. #240
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    I looked for child abuse and or incest a couple of years ago because of the name Cay-Lee. I thought it was kind of creepy that the child's name was a combo of the brother and sisters name. If my 19 yr old was going to have a baby [ please, hypothetical ONLY] the last thing she would do is combine her name with her older brothers. So I thought it was very odd, especially given the ' birthfather is dead' explanation.

    However, imo and imo only, I did not see abuse from the father in the chart, which is usually indicated by Saturn, Jupiter or Pluto. But there is a Mercury/Mars tight square with no harmonious outlets. So, imo, she may have had some kind of sexual interactions with her brother, but I do not know if it was forced or consensual. Again, imoo.

    If I had the birth times, and the 10th/4th axis were afflicted, then I would give more credence to the father being involved.

    I may be entirely wrong.
    “Every day that they don’t find something is good for me.“ Billie Dunn


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    Thanks, Katy - this is what I have thought, that there may have been some sexual interaction with LA, but nothing involving penetration - can I say that here????

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  24. #242
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    Quote Originally Posted by katydid23 View Post
    I looked for child abuse and or incest a couple of years ago because of the name Cay-Lee. I thought it was kind of creepy that the child's name was a combo of the brother and sisters name. If my 19 yr old was going to have a baby [ please, hypothetical ONLY] the last thing she would do is combine her name with her older brothers. So I thought it was very odd, especially given the ' birthfather is dead' explanation.

    However, imo and imo only, I did not see abuse from the father in the chart, which is usually indicated by Saturn, Jupiter or Pluto. But there is a Mercury/Mars tight square with no harmonious outlets. So, imo, she may have had some kind of sexual interactions with her brother, but I do not know if it was forced or consensual. Again, imoo.

    If I had the birth times, and the 10th/4th axis were afflicted, then I would give more credence to the father being involved.

    I may be entirely wrong.

    Katydid,

    If you are "entirely wrong," so are Tuba, Neptunian, Housemouse, Kaitland and myself. As most of our readers know, we have been involved in the astrological analysis of this case since the beginning. None of us saw credible evidence of natal promise of sexual abuse in Casey Anthony's (untimed) birth chart, nor did we see the tell-tale markers in GA's (untimed) birth chart that typically suggest sexual obsession/ perversion.

    What we did see in Casey Anthony's chart was testimony after testimony associated with manipulation, deceit and pathological lying.


    Thanks,
    Soulscape
    Last edited by Soulscape; 06-02-2011 at 09:33 PM. Reason: additional comment


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    Quote Originally Posted by Soulscape View Post
    Katydid,

    If you are "entirely wrong," so are Tuba, Neptunian, Housemouse, Kaitland and myself. As most of our readers know, we have been involved in the astrological analysis of this case since the beginning. None of us saw credible evidence of natal promise of sexual abuse in Casey Anthony's (untimed) birth chart, nor did we see the tell-tale markers in GA's (untimed) birth chart that typically suggest sexual obsession/ perversion.

    What we did see in Casey Anthony's chart was testimony after testimony associated with manipulation, deceit and pathological lying.


    Thanks,
    Soulscape
    Thank you, Soulscape. You and Katydid have confirmed what I have felt all along, that GA was falsely accused.
    Casey Anthony: She lies; we listen; it’s exhausting

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  27. #244
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    Quote Originally Posted by momshrink View Post
    Thank you, Soulscape. You and Katydid have confirmed what I have felt all along, that GA was falsely accused.
    I love your "off to bed" emoticon! Puts a chuckle in an otherwise, hard subject to write about.

    I've been back to the charts, looking again as in the very beginning of this case, at CERES, which I find fasincating, in this family arena of charts, not only because of it's location in Cayley's natal chart, but also the interplay of the family charts and of course, the mythology behind the nurture of Ceres:


    Ceres description at this link: astrologycom.com


    http://www.cafeastrology.com/article...tpatterns.html

    Re:Casey's KITE formation with Neptune at the Apex of the kite.

    quote:

    M.March and J.McEvers reckon that the biggest problem of the Kite is that the configuration comprises three different aspects, and can lead to excessive concentration on part of a horoscope and, correspondingly, to adverse utilization of other opportunities which are contained within the horoscope.



    I'm not here to try to convince anyone of anything, especially when minds are made up but I do think Ceres is one part of everyone's chart which should be seriously considered, especially in regards to this case in particular.

    Everyone who is human needs nurturing and needs to learn to nurture in return. Not everyone learns apparently one or the other.


    There happens to be a “running theme” I noticed and am willing to share here, from the very beginning, of checking the natal charts d for CA, her child Cayley (timed birth helped a great deal here, for we easily find her Ceres at the I/C in Scorpio)….Ceres for the grandmother, GA and LA.


    Here are the locations in case anyone is interested in studying Ceres in the natal charts:

    LA (uncle) Ceres at 22nd degree of SAG conj. Neptune at 25deg.Sag.
    Venus 2Sag conj. Uranus 4Sag.

    CA (grandmother of child) 9Leo conj. Uranus 8Leo (obvious as loss of the child to nurture and be nurtured by in such a “quick” (Uranus) fashion, overnight.

    On December 11, 2008 when the bones were discovered , the grandmother’s natal chart has TR Ceres conj. TR Mercury stationed over her natal PLUTO (DEATH) (both conj. Regulus)

    TR Mars stationed over her natal Venus and formed a square to her Ceres & Uranus.

    G.A. - (grandfather of Caylee , dad of Casey):
    His Ceres is 9PISCES (fatal and a degree of suffering) and of course, ruled by Neptune(theme)
    When Caylee’s body was found, his PROG Ceres was conj. “Fomalhaut” at 3PIS.
    (in the news, and as the ancients suggested, an immortal name)
    His Natal North Node is conj. Ceres at 9PIS within one hour
    and Sun is conj. the South Node and at 9Virgo – is considered, “body in the ditch” at this degree.

    CA (Caylee) is the only timed chart, so we know the angles involved. In this case, even more poignant of course because the I/C where her Ceres is located, is in the 3rd (using Placidius an uneven houses chart) and located conjunct the cusp of the 4th which is the home life.
    Caylee’s I/C was 17.36 degrees Scorpio and her Ceres was 16.51 degrees Scorpio so we can see how remarkably close in orb they were. The Angle to Ceres.
    As well, Caylee’s Ceres is square to the Sun (the light or ego expression) which was 16Leo57minutes Leo , (see how close to Ceres, this square was)
    And square to her natal Neptune which was 16degrees 11minutes Aquarius
    Remarkable, and certainly shows us how Astrology can reflect in the natal chart the probability to come.

    CMA (Casey A.) : Has her natal Ceres at 4degrees34min. (rx) Virgo which puts it opposed to natal Jupiter at 6°Pisces.
    Her natal Ceres makes one other major aspect (caveat being the time of birth), which is a Trine to Neptune, the Apex of a Kite in her natal chart linking the Moon (emotions) with Pluto and Jupiter (both at the 6th degree) and Neptune (illusions, and fantasies) at almost the same 5 degrees 43minutes in Capricorn, and of course the Apex of the Kite, the expiation point i.e. “fantasy world woven by the other planets” control is often a hallmark of Pluto when unbridled and unleashed, Jupiter (can be overwhelming and overdone) Neptune, is usually undermining and in this case we know now it is to her (the made up life and people in the life) a life of fantasy weaving.

    To my belief however, the fantasies are a creation (purposeful perhaps) in order to cope with the life she was leading and had led as a child.

    Anyone see the classic movie, "12 Angry Men?"......one of my husband's favorites, he probably knows every line.
    CA only needs one holdout to escape the DP. who MAY wonder if it's possible this is the only time she didn't lie after all.
    But like the old Aesop Fable? "The little boy who cried wolf" ?
    Who will believe now......when so many lies were told just like that fable teaches.
    Last edited by FifthEssence; 06-04-2011 at 01:12 PM. Reason: Mod:fixed link-copy came from astrologycom.com, not astrology.com/ also Caylee found on 12/11/08 NOT 12/13
    "The Greek word moira (μοῖρα) literally means a part or portion, and by extension one's portion in life or destiny.
    They controlled the metaphorical thread of life of every mortal from birth to death."

    Wikipedia

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  29. #245
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    I wonder if casey herself, is a sexual abuser....something just haunts me about that video of baby Caylee in her highchair, and casey is so weird filming her aiming the camera at her crotch and saying kill....and then the baby starts repeating it, I Kill You
    Could the charts be picking up that casey is the sexual abuser?

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=807kMNkVl0k&feature=related"]YouTube - ‪Who is Momtective? Breakfast with Caylee‬‏[/ame]
    Last edited by Hunnie; 06-02-2011 at 11:31 PM. Reason: sorry if i am not supposed to post this here!...please remove if so..

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  31. #246
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    In my experience, Ceres in a natal chart is said to represent one's sense of 'mother' and one's own mothering skills and ability to nurture. Having an afflicted Ceres would be indicative of being 'abused' or neglected or overpowered by one's mother figures before it would indicate being molested by the father. imoo

    Casey has Ceres retro in Virgo, opposed by Jupiter in Pisces. I would [imo] interpret that as Casey having a critical mother figure who was passive aggressive in nature, and who was in opposition to an expansive and nurturing male figure, who was too forgiving and too generous to a fault. But I see nothing in that aspect which denotes sexual assault. imoo

    That Ceres also describes HER as a mother. She would feel that inner critical passive/aggressive
    tension herself when it comes to being in the role of the nurturer.
    Being at the midpoint of Saturn/Chiron in Gemini/ Sag may bring about the urge to break free from the bonds of daily routine activities. Those things make her feel deeply insecure and unprepared. Her own mother probably added to that feeling of inferiority because Cindy was a super MOM. everything was just so and just
    perfect. How could Casey ever live up to that expectation with such an afflicted sense of Ceres.

    Her Ceres is the midpoint of Saturn/Chiron, and the apex of a t-square. I see that as mental stress, nervous exhaustion, perhaps double messages in the home life about honesty/dishonesty. But the mutable mode and the Saturn /Jupiter do not imply sexual
    abuse in my opinion. I see it more as a battle between the sexes in the home, as the women emasculating the men, by witholding respect or love, and by being hypercritical.

    The Kite is a difficult planetary formation, I agree. An under estimated formation imo.
    However, imo, and imo only, it represents' leaving' the body, soaring above reality, escapism, the urge to disconnect from the physical senses. I have not seen it being a representation of physical abuse.

    Casey's lies--that she has a good steady job, is in college, has a wealthy boyfriend who gave her a tiffany ring, has lots of successful friends---are the only way she can live up to her family's expectations. The kite is like something that gets out of control, goes airborne, and there is no turning back, onward and upward.

    The major planetary formations in Casey's chart seems to be connected to her inability to realistically assess physical reality. I think she may be delusional at times and be at risk of losing touch with reality. But that does not seem to be tied to a father /sexuality issue imo. It seems to be her own personal demons, and inner rage. Sure, she grew up in a dysfunctional family. But I do not see it as the way she is describing it at all. imo

    ETA: I can agree that she wanted to rise above her difficult home life. But I do not agree that it was because of sexual abuse by the father. I think it was more likely to do with issues surrounding the tension between the mother and father, their own lack of connection, love and respect for each other. I think she felt a real burden to be a 'perfect' child and felt wholly incapable of doing so. [ Sun in critical degree of Pisces with major afflictions from Moon and from Mars, Uranus and Neptune. I think she felt insecure and inferior in many ways and could not focus well enough to follow through on basic ordinary tasks. [ Sun = Moon/Mars, Uranus in Mutable signs.]
    Last edited by katydid23; 06-03-2011 at 01:36 AM.
    “Every day that they don’t find something is good for me.“ Billie Dunn


  32. #247
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    Jun 2010
    Location
    East Coast
    Posts
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    Dear wonderful members,
    This may be a primitive attempt at astrological, and forensic websluething however I have compared ICA’s chart with my own because I know for a fact that I had a childhood of abuse. I am convinced that ICA was a child who was doted over by a well meaning, loving, but imperfect family. \

    Rather, I see a power base in her chart that makes her energy like a bull dozer. People are hit and run by her before they realize it. They do not expect the actions they eventually get from her based on what they initially believe about her. She is also somewhat intelligent which makes her a skilled manipulator.
    Not to say she has the same influential power of great world leaders who also have the “free will” to use their influence for good or bad; but it is similar. ICA is not sophisticated enough. Instead she will steam roll someone and leave them in the dust wondering why the heck they didn’t see it coming. ICA is blusterous right out of the gate of her creation, and wanting right away to do her own bidding. She lives for ICA ( herself) and no one else. Some are too bad, too soon to be stealthy. Her GREAT Midpoint conflicts with GA or anyone else are of her own doing……or un- doing. IMO
    Last edited by FifthEssence; 06-03-2011 at 05:48 PM.


  33. #248
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
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    near Chicago
    Posts
    600
    Quote Originally Posted by momshrink View Post
    Leomoon, I really appreciate all that you post - you, too, Frigga! I think ICA is mentally ill, but that does not excuse what I believe she has done. I go back and forth on the sexual abuse - but if it happened, it does not excuse what she did. If it did not happen, her accusations are not excusable, either. As I said, I am inclined to believe those who say it happened to them, although I have worked with false accusations, too, but those are rare. I am interested in hearing more from our astrologers. I really appreciate their interpretations.
    It's taken me time to separate emotion but now I also think that ICA is mentally ill. Just throwing my in.

    I also agree being metnally ill does not excuse what was done to Caylee.
    "This is not about Casey Anthony, but about what happened to Caylee Anthony between the photograph taken on June 15 and the one taken on December 11." LDB, my hero

    "I just have to ask you, how does one human being do this to another, let alone do it to their Mother?" Bill Shaeffer

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  35. #249
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    677
    All I can say is thanks for these interpretations! Leomoon, Katydid, and VidaRose. I am (and always have been) fascinated by family dynamics and the ways that individual and family dynamics interact. These interpretations make so much sense to me. And I think we have to consider all of the family dynamics in order to understand ICA.
    Leomoon - I created that new signature last night when I was so tired after yesterdays court session. That was how I felt!
    Casey Anthony: She lies; we listen; it’s exhausting

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  37. #250
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
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    4,729
    Quote Originally Posted by katydid23 View Post
    In my experience, Ceres in a natal chart is said to represent one's sense of 'mother' and one's own mothering skills and ability to nurture. Having an afflicted Ceres would be indicative of being 'abused' or neglected or overpowered by one's mother figures before it would indicate being molested by the father. imoo

    Casey has Ceres retro in Virgo, opposed by Jupiter in Pisces. I would [imo] interpret that as Casey having a critical mother figure who was passive aggressive in nature, and who was in opposition to an expansive and nurturing male figure, who was too forgiving and too generous to a fault. But I see nothing in that aspect which denotes sexual assault. imoo

    That Ceres also describes HER as a mother. She would feel that inner critical passive/aggressive
    tension herself when it comes to being in the role of the nurturer.
    Being at the midpoint of Saturn/Chiron in Gemini/ Sag may bring about the urge to break free from the bonds of daily routine activities. Those things make her feel deeply insecure and unprepared. Her own mother probably added to that feeling of inferiority because Cindy was a super MOM. everything was just so and just
    perfect. How could Casey ever live up to that expectation with such an afflicted sense of Ceres.

    Her Ceres is the midpoint of Saturn/Chiron, and the apex of a t-square. I see that as mental stress, nervous exhaustion, perhaps double messages in the home life about honesty/dishonesty. But the mutable mode and the Saturn /Jupiter do not imply sexual
    abuse in my opinion. I see it more as a battle between the sexes in the home, as the women emasculating the men, by witholding respect or love, and by being hypercritical.

    The Kite is a difficult planetary formation, I agree. An under estimated formation imo.
    However, imo, and imo only, it represents' leaving' the body, soaring above reality, escapism, the urge to disconnect from the physical senses. I have not seen it being a representation of physical abuse.

    Casey's lies--that she has a good steady job, is in college, has a wealthy boyfriend who gave her a tiffany ring, has lots of successful friends---are the only way she can live up to her family's expectations. The kite is like something that gets out of control, goes airborne, and there is no turning back, onward and upward.

    The major planetary formations in Casey's chart seems to be connected to her inability to realistically assess physical reality. I think she may be delusional at times and be at risk of losing touch with reality. But that does not seem to be tied to a father /sexuality issue imo. It seems to be her own personal demons, and inner rage. Sure, she grew up in a dysfunctional family. But I do not see it as the way she is describing it at all. imo

    ETA: I can agree that she wanted to rise above her difficult home life. But I do not agree that it was because of sexual abuse by the father. I think it was more likely to do with issues surrounding the tension between the mother and father, their own lack of connection, love and respect for each other. I think she felt a real burden to be a 'perfect' child and felt wholly incapable of doing so. [ Sun in critical degree of Pisces with major afflictions from Moon and from Mars, Uranus and Neptune. I think she felt insecure and inferior in many ways and could not focus well enough to follow through on basic ordinary tasks. [ Sun = Moon/Mars, Uranus in Mutable signs.]
    Thank you for your interpetations, Katydid..as well as the other astrologers. Your gift is so very unique....Thank you all...

    I see there is emotional/mental/verbal abuse with the two women of that home. I think a domineering, controlling mother who's daughter can never do anything right, led to the animosity between them. I believe they butted heads over how to raise Caylee and of course, it's CA's way or the highway. I also believe since CA was paying the way, gave Caylee lots of attention (as she should, she was her first grandchild), ICA felt she could not measure up to her mothers love.

    I also believe ICA was made to feel like only the babysitter to her own child. I believe this was the contention between them and ICA felt 'sibling' rivalry towards her own child.

    I do not believe ICA was molested by her father as a child or young teen. I don't buy that theory at all. This is just more of ICA's vengenace and it appears as if she is getting great pleasure in doing so. She is taking delight in embarrasing her family.

    As for the lying. Nothing ICA told CA was checked into to, nor was she held responsible for bad behaviors. CA's self proclaimed 'avoidance' tendencies is where this family went wrong with ICA. I also believe CA has that same ability to spin a tale, we've all seen her do this as well. There is no rhyme or reason, they do it just because. JMHO

    Justice for Caylee


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