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Thread: TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #4

  1. #326
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pearl* View Post
    No, I disagree there. Somebody IS inside and would come out to investigate. Who knows where 911 would send an officer. Dispatchers don't know the roads.
    Just listen to how that sounds about our LE. 911: where is your location and can you give us directions?



    This is now posted several places. Enlightening!

    http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?...1620n#comments
    Last edited by happy409; 05-31-2011 at 12:58 AM. Reason: Add link

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  3. #327
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    Quote Originally Posted by happy409 View Post
    Just listen to how that sounds about our LE. 911: where is your location and can you give us directions?



    This is now posted several places. Enlightening!

    http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?...1620n#comments

    Hi happy!! I'm really confused and it totally could be that I am just completely worn to a frazzle from the last 5 days I've had my in-laws in town..and therefor I am missing the point..the subject..etc..that you're posting about above..

    I went to the cbs link and it took me to a story about a girl who wants to see her father get sentenced to death.. Thought maybe you were speaking of something talked aBout in the comment section so I read all 13 of those as well and I honestly haven't a clue what I am even looking for..loL

    If you could please just clarify for me I would be forever appreciative

    TIA!

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  5. #328
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    Quote Originally Posted by happy409 View Post
    Just listen to how that sounds about our LE. 911: where is your location and can you give us directions?


    In all fairness, it's not so different from what happens all over the county. In most communities, there won't be a dispatcher right around the corner. I think the biggest problem is that so many people are not aware the "system" has changed. When people believe they are speaking with someone who is a VERY local local, they give information differently than if they know the real deal. This wastes precious time and causes confusion in my opinion.

    The "in the parking lot" situation is unique though. I'd still blow the horn and maybe get on the phone at the same time.

    Let's not forget the fire department is right there too. Maybe a fireman could run out and hit somebody over the head with a fire extinguisher?

    Ok. Time for me to go to bed before I get in trouble.

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  7. #329
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    Re: "Reel Nauti" I just had to comment that I absolutely love your username..lol..It's great..

    I have seen your name pop in on Gail's threads from time to time and had been meaning to post a comment about your uniquely cute play-on-words username..

    Ok..ok.. No more O/T..back on the topic of all things Gail..

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  9. #330
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    Quote Originally Posted by SmoothOperator View Post
    Hi happy!! I'm really confused and it totally could be that I am just completely worn to a frazzle from the last 5 days I've had my in-laws in town..and therefor I am missing the point..the subject..etc..that you're posting about above..

    I went to the cbs link and it took me to a story about a girl who wants to see her father get sentenced to death.. Thought maybe you were speaking of something talked aBout in the comment section so I read all 13 of those as well and I honestly haven't a clue what I am even looking for..loL

    If you could please just clarify for me I would be forever appreciative

    TIA!
    To clarify this link is posted over many Signal Mountain FB pages and BGHN. That was all. I guess awareness, sorry if inappropriate, it is late here too!

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  11. #331
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pearl* View Post
    In all fairness, it's not so different from what happens all over the county. In most communities, there won't be a dispatcher right around the corner. I think the biggest problem is that so many people are not aware the "system" has changed. When people believe they are speaking with someone who is a VERY local local, they give information differently than if they know the real deal. This wastes precious time and causes confusion in my opinion.

    The "in the parking lot" situation is unique though. I'd still blow the horn and maybe get on the phone at the same time.

    Let's not forget the fire department is right there too. Maybe a fireman could run out and hit somebody over the head with a fire extinguisher?

    Ok. Time for me to go to bed before I get in trouble.
    Pearl* it sounds bad I think when you read it, but we know different. I believe this is the best place to live in Hamilton County.

    Not wanting to

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  13. #332
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    I think the whole 911 thing is being blown out of proportion a little. Just because we can't directly call the police doesn't mean that they don't have ways to communicate with other law enforcement agencies.

    I don't live in Signal Mountain, but I do live in the unincorporated County. And if someone calls 911 it never takes more than five minutes to get a patrol car to come and check something out. Last week, we had a transformer blow up one night in the neighborhood behind us (more fallen trees on the lines) and our neighbors called 911. It was no more than a few minutes before LE showed up with several cars.

    And they have GPS and maps and I see patrols all the time, even late at night. So I really don't know where the idea comes from that we aren't covered in Hamilton County. There might be some confusing situations where jurisdictions overlap. Out here in the East county there are places where it's hard to know if a person should call the Sherriff, the Collegedale Police, or the City of Chattanooga, but the 911 dispatcher usually will tell you what is up with that.

    The Mountain is a little different because it's separate, but I always thought the problem was too much patrolling, not too little patrolling.

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    I just finished watching that 48 Hour Mistery Home. That was an eye opener for sure. It really makes you wonder. Prayers for Gail.

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  17. #334
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pearl* View Post
    In all fairness, it's not so different from what happens all over the county. In most communities, there won't be a dispatcher right around the corner. I think the biggest problem is that so many people are not aware the "system" has changed. When people believe they are speaking with someone who is a VERY local local, they give information differently than if they know the real deal. This wastes precious time and causes confusion in my opinion.

    The "in the parking lot" situation is unique though. I'd still blow the horn and maybe get on the phone at the same time.

    Let's not forget the fire department is right there too. Maybe a fireman could run out and hit somebody over the head with a fire extinguisher?

    Ok. Time for me to go to bed before I get in trouble.
    A good squirt of water wouldn't hurt.... Night Pearl.

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  19. #335
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtFox View Post
    I think the whole 911 thing is being blown out of proportion a little. Just because we can't directly call the police doesn't mean that they don't have ways to communicate with other law enforcement agencies.

    I don't live in Signal Mountain, but I do live in the unincorporated County. And if someone calls 911 it never takes more than five minutes to get a patrol car to come and check something out. Last week, we had a transformer blow up one night in the neighborhood behind us (more fallen trees on the lines) and our neighbors called 911. It was no more than a few minutes before LE showed up with several cars.

    And they have GPS and maps and I see patrols all the time, even late at night. So I really don't know where the idea comes from that we aren't covered in Hamilton County. There might be some confusing situations where jurisdictions overlap. Out here in the East county there are places where it's hard to know if a person should call the Sherriff, the Collegedale Police, or the City of Chattanooga, but the 911 dispatcher usually will tell you what is up with that.

    The Mountain is a little different because it's separate, but I always thought the problem was too much patrolling, not too little patrolling.
    As long as they weren't the ones following GP.......

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  21. #336
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    Quote Originally Posted by happy409 View Post
    Pearl* it sounds bad I think when you read it, but we know different. I believe this is the best place to live in Hamilton County.
    Absolutely. I've lived here a long time because there is no place I'd rather be.

    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtFox View Post
    I think the whole 911 thing is being blown out of proportion a little. Just because we can't directly call the police doesn't mean that they don't have ways to communicate with other law enforcement agencies.

    I don't live in Signal Mountain, but I do live in the unincorporated County. And if someone calls 911 it never takes more than five minutes to get a patrol car to come and check something out. Last week, we had a transformer blow up one night in the neighborhood behind us (more fallen trees on the lines) and our neighbors called 911. It was no more than a few minutes before LE showed up with several cars.

    And they have GPS and maps and I see patrols all the time, even late at night. So I really don't know where the idea comes from that we aren't covered in Hamilton County. There might be some confusing situations where jurisdictions overlap. Out here in the East county there are places where it's hard to know if a person should call the Sherriff, the Collegedale Police, or the City of Chattanooga, but the 911 dispatcher usually will tell you what is up with that.

    The Mountain is a little different because it's separate, but I always thought the problem was too much patrolling, not too little patrolling.
    Yes all the way. They communicate, they use their GPS technology--even with cell phones now, they are constantly on patrol, and the response time can't be beaten anywhere. I don't doubt that Gail got results each and every time she called 911.

    There is, however, a communication gap between the caller and the dispatcher, unless the caller realizes the dispatcher is not just around the corner. And for many years they were. I'm not sure when the change happened, but I think I could round it off to 2005. Most people don't have occasion to call 911 very often--I certainly hope--and therefore many people still don't know.

    This will probably help non-locals understand more about Signal Mountain as well as the "911" issue itself. We are a small town where everybody knows most everybody. It's impossible to go to the grocery store without seeing somebody you know. I can't for the life of me figure out how we managed to misplace a RED JEEP!

    Here's the problem: I made a 911 call myself within the last year, and the conversation went something like this (actual locations changed for privacy purposes):

    911: 911, what is your emergency?
    Me: There's been a car accident on the main highway right in front of Pruett's.
    911: What highway is that?
    Me: You know, the MAIN HIGHWAY.
    911: What is the name of the road?
    Me: What?? It's RIGHT HERE in front of PRUETT'S!
    911: Do you know the address of Pruett's?

    ...and at that point, the local person who thinks the conversation is with another local person...is ready to jump through the phone.

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  23. #337
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    What I learned from the Nooga.com article:

    Either the dispute regarding the boat was not listed, or it took place at the couple's home...so why was there media discussing Matt jumping out of a moving car to go home?

    I am intrigued by the language "settling a dispute"...this could mean a disagreement over the rules of Sorry to doors being kicked in and blood being drawn....

    Then there is the statement by criminal defense attorney Bryan Hoss-that many people consult and hire attorneys to act as a go between for the client and LE. Really? Now granted MP is no Marc Klaas, but the first thing HE did when Polly went missing was to march himself down to LE and take a polygraph so that they didnt waste any time focusing on him. Just sayin.
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  25. #338
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    Quote Originally Posted by believe09 View Post
    ...Then there is the statement by criminal defense attorney Bryan Hoss-that many people consult and hire attorneys to act as a go between for the client and LE. Really? Now granted MP is no Marc Klaas, but the first thing HE did when Polly went missing was to march himself down to LE and take a polygraph so that they didnt waste any time focusing on him. Just sayin.
    Yeah, that's hinky to me. Some people do hire an attorney for a go-between, but it's not necessary if you are the husband of a missing person and just want to find her for the sake of your children.

    Even if he has things he wanted covered up at first (the possible girlfriend, divorce plans, etc) so much time has gone by that the longer he continues to stonewall police, the more suspicious they become. But that's his boat to float (no pun intended). People often make choices to not talk or to talk too much (as in the Hailey Dunn case) and it can come back to bite you either way.

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  27. #339
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    Quote Originally Posted by hollyblue View Post
    Remember the time difference....

    I can't get over thinking there was someone in wait for her when she got home. If not in the garage or woods, maybe inside somewhere, since the house is so large. I wonder if they have a basement?

    Maybe Gail's siblings and friends are busy gathering info for court on Friday? Is that possible?
    Bingo.

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  29. #340
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    Regarding the hearing on Friday-I wonder in what circumstances a GAL would be appointed in a probate situation like this one? I mean it couldnt hurt at all to have a guardian take legal custody (not physical) of these little ones and determine who is the better parent, even though Gail maybe absent.

    The kids are at an age where any judge worth his/her salt would ask them what they think and feel about custody...at least that is what would happen here as in the NorthEast.

    Can any locals weigh in?
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    Quote Originally Posted by believe09 View Post
    Regarding the hearing on Friday-I wonder in what circumstances a GAL would be appointed in a probate situation like this one? I mean it couldnt hurt at all to have a guardian take legal custody (not physical) of these little ones and determine who is the better parent, even though Gail maybe absent.

    The kids are at an age where any judge worth his/her salt would ask them what they think and feel about custody...at least that is what would happen here as in the NorthEast.

    Can any locals weigh in?
    I think a GAL can advocate for counseling for the children. I'm almost sure but would hope a legal expert could weigh in on this.

    This is the main issue I am afraid will fall through the cracks.

    I am confused by the mention of probate. I thought probate dealt only with situations where a person was deceased. Surely that has not been legally assumed at this time....

    As I think of it, though, the idea that the case would move in that direction would explain the choice of Chancery over Circuit, for the legal separation proceedings. If I'm not mistaken, probate is definitely Chancery and NEVER Circuit. Circuit, on the other hand, presides over many more divorce cases than Chancery.
    Last edited by Pearl*; 05-31-2011 at 03:44 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hollyblue View Post
    Remember the time difference....

    I can't get over thinking there was someone in wait for her when she got home. If not in the garage or woods, maybe inside somewhere, since the house is so large. I wonder if they have a basement?

    Maybe Gail's siblings and friends are busy gathering info for court on Friday? Is that possible?
    My only problem with this theory is that the person lying in wait would have to have done this without the kids knowing, or surely they'd be talking about it and completely traumatized by watching their mom get kidnapped. And we might know about it (at least we'd know a little something more about what happened to Gail)! How could he (or she) grab Gail without the kids seeing or hearing anything? Seems like it might take too much planning, and just be too chancy.
    Last edited by Columbo; 05-31-2011 at 04:17 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pearl* View Post
    I think a GAL can advocate for counseling for the children. I'm almost sure but would hope a legal expert could weigh in on this.

    This is the main issue I am afraid will fall through the cracks.

    I am confused by the mention of probate. I thought probate dealt only with situations where a person was deceased. Surely that has not been legally assumed at this time....

    As I think of it, though, the idea that the case would move in that direction would explain the choice of Chancery over Circuit, for the legal separation proceedings. If I'm not mistaken, probate is definitely Chancery and NEVER Circuit. Circuit, on the other hand, presides over many more divorce cases than Chancery.
    My apologies Pearl-here we have Probate and Family Court, so that is how I refer to it. Sorry on the confusion!

    I do think a GAL would be a good conservative move, so that there is no rush to judgement on anyone's part.
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  36. #344
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    I dont know how I feel about the lying in wait theory-I guess it depends on whether or not she got out of the car to let the kiddos into the house....
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  38. #345
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    Quote Originally Posted by believe09 View Post
    I dont know how I feel about the lying in wait theory-I guess it depends on whether or not she got out of the car to let the kiddos into the house....
    And where he or she was lying in wait. I know it probably would have to be a "he" but you never know.

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  40. #346
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    Oh agreed Columbo-Gail could have been on her way down the mountain and stopped....
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  42. #347
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    Besides the GAL idea, here's another possibility that would be "out of the box." I don't know enough about the program to have "information," but I sure do have questions! The website refers to use of CASA's by juvenile court judges in cases of child abuse/neglect, but I wonder if that is really the full extent of the program. Could judges in other courts make use of this program in other circumstances, such as this one? Not instead of a GAL. From the little bit of reading I've done in the past 30 minutes (not exactly extensive research), in some states GALs and CASAs are the same or close to the same. In Tennessee, however, CASAs are not attorneys. I think I read in one of the articles I skimmed, that a CASA's report is accessible to the judge but NOT EVEN THE ATTORNEYS!

    Ideally, I think these children should have the benefit of every program that might help them. I see value in both programs and wonder if the children could have both.

    What I really worry about is that the children are not going to have any outlet to talk about WHATEVER they need to talk about. If they have to worry about whether or not dad would approve of what they say, counseling will do no good. That's why I think the counseling decisions need to be taken completely out of dad's control in this case. A safe situation where they can know that what they say won't be piped straight through to dad. Even if dad is guilty of nothing, he is still under scrutiny to the nth degree and HAS to be concerned that the children say nothing that could hurt him, even by twisting what they say.

    Here's the Tennessee CASA link: http://www.tncasa.org/. Also: http://casa-nashville.org/faq.htm

    I hope SOMEBODY is doing something to intervene legally for the children--separate from what dad is doing to cover his own rear end.
    Last edited by Pearl*; 05-31-2011 at 04:39 PM. Reason: Add another link with more information

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  44. #348
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    I wonder if it will be continued again...I doubt another 30 days would hurt anyone. JMO.
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  46. #349
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    Re: Great concern regarding upcoming court hearings..petitions..motions..rulings..etc..*Espec ially with regard of the two minor children, their behalf, well-being, and custody arrangements..

    I really wish we had one of our great legal eagles here peeping in on Gail's thread.. We certainly could use their knowledge and experience to help us possibly understand more about what may be going on, what is to come, and what are the chances of certain rulings, etc, etc..Is anyone by chance pals with any of our great verified WS lawyers? If so, maybe one could ask if when he/she had time could they peep in and take a look at some of our concerns and questions about these upcoming court proceedings..

    And then those of use that had specific or particular questions to ask about that our verified lawyers could help us understand we could post those concerns or questions??..Just thinking aloud..

    I just really need to have clarification about exactly what would be the procedure for moving forward with this divorce/separation, R.O., and of course most importantly how would they handle the two children's custody?

    Do they proceed as if Gail is willingly choosing to be absent from her children's lives without even phone communications..as well as willingly be absent to any/all of these court procedures..again especially the ones concerning her children??

    With there being no evidence of foul play[that we know of] and with Matt proceeding as if she has willingly chosen to disappear herself..will the courts follow suit in proceeding in the same manner as if Gail has every opportunity to be present for the court proceedings and is continuing to choose to not be present for them???

    I just cannot imagine the courts actually proceeding in this way?? But what is the option? IMO the option would be to proceed as if Gail is not willingly choosing to be absent therefor that would indicate some form of foul play having taken place that is keeping her from being present..[and personally this is my belief]..but we are talking about court and judicial proceeding that alot of it is cut and dry..black and white.. so, therefor how could they proceed as if she was a victim of foul play but yet would not Matt's counsel argue that there is zero proof of any foul play where Gail is concerned and demand that they must proceed at this point with Gail willingly choosing to not participate and/or be present..until something as far as evidence points or indicates something different as in proof that some type of foul play is definitely involved [prohibiting Gail from being present and participating fully in her children's lives, best interests, and ultimate custody decision...

    Until I know for certain what exactly this procedure would be I cannot for certain[or really even for purposes of theorizing]even begin decide what I feel may or may not happen in these upcoming procedures..

    For example with the GAL.. This IMO completely depends on how the courts choose to proceed[i.e. Gail willingly Missing or Gail met with Foul play]whether or not a GAL even comes into play in this case.. Meaning if they proceed with the presumption of Gail choosing not to be present then a GAL most likely wouldn't be assigned..unless something such as Gail's family had a very valid and provable claim or reason that the children would somehow be in harms way and therefor not in their best interest to be with dad full time[this IMO highly unlikely here in TN whereas extended family members, even Grandparents have no rights when it comes to custody OR EVEN A VISITATION SCHEDULE!!..They have zero rights to those kids or their upbringing.. I know this personally, first hand experience]..

    But if the court chose to proceed as if Gail had nmet with foul play and is being prohibited from being present and participating...well...that is just a whole another ball game entirely and completely...

    Hope that all made sense

    But we do need clarification on a couple of these most important upcoming court proceedings, filings, motions, hearings, etc... KWIM?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Columbo View Post
    My only problem with this theory is that the person lying in wait would have to have done this without the kids knowing, or surely they'd be talking about it and completely traumatized by watching their mom get kidnapped. And we might know about it (at least we'd know a little something more about what happened to Gail)! How could he (or she) grab Gail without the kids seeing or hearing anything? Seems like it might take too much planning, and just be too chancy.
    My thought is the kids went into the house and got occupied doing what kids normally do after a long trip.....get on their electronics, etc. MP had called her previously and said he wanted to meet with her to talk w/o the kids...for a short time and then "someone" was waiting for her in hiding and when she came into the house to unload... someone got into the jeep, then surprised her. They could have been in the woods or had access to the garage before she got there. She prolly would've left the keys in the ignition since she would been leaving again. Curious if the dogs were inside or outside dogs. They could have threatened her and had a weapon. Told her if she didn't do as told there was someone watching the kids and they would be hurt. ??? I hope I'm wrong.

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