View Poll Results: who molested/abused JB?

Voters
366. You may not vote on this poll
  • JR

    102 27.87%
  • BR

    89 24.32%
  • JAR

    19 5.19%
  • a close family friend

    19 5.19%
  • a stranger/stalker a la JMK

    14 3.83%
  • PR-it wasn't sexual abuse,it was corporal punishment

    68 18.58%
  • she wasn't previously abused/molested

    55 15.03%
Page 14 of 45 FirstFirst ... 456789101112131415161718192021222324 ... LastLast
Results 326 to 350 of 1124

Thread: Who molested/abused Jonbenet?

  1. #326
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    In the Federal Witness Protection Program
    Posts
    7,576
    I really don't feel they would have left without BR. Just because he was at the White's doesn't mean they wouldn't have gotten him before they went to the airport.
    While I feel they wouldn't have wanted to leave JB in the basement to be found by cadaver dogs in a state of decomposition, they might have risked it in order to be out if the jurisdiction of the BPD. Having made a getaway, they couldn't have been forced to return or even speak to LE unless they a warrant for their arrest was issued, and even then they still didn't have to talk to police. The lawyers the Rs already had in place would have prevented it.
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

  2. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to DeeDee249 For This Useful Post:


  3. #327
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    6,419
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    I really don't feel they would have left without BR. Just because he was at the White's doesn't mean they wouldn't have gotten him before they went to the airport.
    While I feel they wouldn't have wanted to leave JB in the basement to be found by cadaver dogs in a state of decomposition, they might have risked it in order to be out if the jurisdiction of the BPD. Having made a getaway, they couldn't have been forced to return or even speak to LE unless they a warrant for their arrest was issued, and even then they still didn't have to talk to police. The lawyers the Rs already had in place would have prevented it.
    DeeDee249,
    You could be right here. But if the plan was to fly with Burke why send him to the White's?

    There would have been nothing to stop Burke flying onto Atlanta at a later date. I reckon John was playing safe here since, he was not certain about the outcome so he removed Burke from the equation.

    JonBenet was intended to be left to decompose, John's flight instructions mandate this. I think at that point in time, John simply wanted to flee Boulder ASAP!

    Plan A was fool the police into accepting that JonBenet had been abducted, when they had left, presumably to search for her, John and Patsy would fly interstate to Atlanta on urgent business matters!

    Plan B was to use Pam to do a supermarket sweep through the house and remove the incriminating evidence, that would have been abandoned, if Plan A had been executed. All this was followed up with regular visits to church, a meeting with Lou Smit, who was close to retirement, and might need an additional stipend? So in the spirit of shared Christian values, John and Lou had a vision regarding a psychotic pedophile, who must have broken in and defiled JonBenet. Lou Smit reasoned so because John Ramsey was a Christian, went to church, and like him knew the power of prayer, so after praying together, Lou Smit went on to enthusiastically promote the Intruder Theory, even though there was no evidence to support his case!


    So Plan B worked because of police collusion, how else can you explain the removal of forensic evidence from a homicide crime-scene? After filling the police car up with Ramsey artifacts Aunty Pam even treated herself at McDonalds. So appropriate for someone overweight.

  4. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to UKGuy For This Useful Post:


  5. #328
    belimom's Avatar
    belimom is offline Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter ~MLK Jr
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    10,533
    (OT: I don't want to get in the middle of the whole "estate" debate, but an estate can refer to someone's assets/worth at any time)

    An estate is the net worth of a person at any point in time. It is the sum of a person's assets - legal rights, interests and entitlements to property of any kind - less all liabilities at that time.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estate_(law)
    Fly high and free, Jhessye ~

    My posts are meant to help think through possibilities and are strictly an additional opinion under circumstances when many points of view need to be considered. I apologize in advance to anyone whose potential involvement is contemplated in error. Please understand that much of what is happening is merely brainstorming during unfortunate events.

  6. #329
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    In the Federal Witness Protection Program
    Posts
    7,576
    BR was sent to the White's very early that morning- hours before JB was "found" and JR was caught trying to make his plane getaway. The reason for sending BR to the White's was to get him out of the house. There are a few reasons for wanting him out of the house: one was to keep LE away from him. Another was to keep him from doing or saying anything that might be incriminating. Another was to prevent any LE from observing his demeanor or wanting to question him, and then there was also the very understandable desire to not have him around when his sister's body was brought upstairs.
    So sending him to the White's is a totally separate issue from planning the getaway. I still maintain they never intended to leave BR in Boulder when they fled Colorado. They would have picked him up at the Whites or had the Whites drive him to the airport.
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

  7. #330
    It is my firm hope that as BR grows into adulthood and can put some distance between his parents influence and memory - he might reveal to someone memories he has, which may even be repressed at present. Perhaps if that happens, we may finally understand what really happened that night. BR might be our last hope of solving this perplexing case.

  8. The Following User Says Thank You to ShadyLadySleuth For This Useful Post:


  9. #331
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    6,419
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    BR was sent to the White's very early that morning- hours before JB was "found" and JR was caught trying to make his plane getaway. The reason for sending BR to the White's was to get him out of the house. There are a few reasons for wanting him out of the house: one was to keep LE away from him. Another was to keep him from doing or saying anything that might be incriminating. Another was to prevent any LE from observing his demeanor or wanting to question him, and then there was also the very understandable desire to not have him around when his sister's body was brought upstairs.
    So sending him to the White's is a totally separate issue from planning the getaway. I still maintain they never intended to leave BR in Boulder when they fled Colorado. They would have picked him up at the Whites or had the Whites drive him to the airport.
    DeeDee249,
    So sending him to the White's is a totally separate issue from planning the getaway.
    Apparently so. But he was absent from the house when John phoned for his plane.

    John likely removed Burke for all the above reasons. Now whether John or someone else found JonBenet, John would have factored this event into Plan A, so he had some intended course of action to undertake, on the discovery of JonBenet. Patently part of Plan A was to flee the state of Colorado, hence his instructions to his pilot.

    So in executing Plan A John deliberately removed Burke, at this point John cannot predict if he will ever see Burke again. John might have been arrested never to leave the penal system again!

    Since Plan A was not working out quite as intended, John at the first opportunity, and matching a staged homicide profile, went and found JonBenet.

    His next move was to phone instructions to his pilot, so assuming Burke is innocent, John has nothing to gain by going over to the White's. I reckon given the seriousness and gravity of the situation John and Patsy would have left Colorado ASAP, without Burke, leaving JonBenet to decompose.

    Now if they were willing to abandon JonBenet's body, they would probably have left Burke with the White's reasoning we can arrange for him to travel to Atlanta or Peru, at a later date.


    John by removing Burke has already signaled he has a Plan A. And three parts of it have been executed e.g. 1. JonBenet hidden in the wine-cellar, 2. Patsy dialling 911 about the ransom note, and 3. Burke removed from any fallout.

    Part four was nobody finds JonBenet, part five was the police leaving to search locally for JonBenet, part six John and Patsy flee Colorado.

    So it is only parts four and five that vary if it had turned out as John had estimated, he would have left along with Patsy for Atlanta.

    Given Fleet Whites suspicion regarding John and the discovery of JonBenet. Would he have simply handed Burke over, maybe, would John have told Fleet Hey we are bailing out of Colorado, and we would like Burke to come too or would he just tell Fleet We have some very important business matters to attend to in Atlanta, these are so important, we are just leaving JonBenet behind?

    Of course not, going anywhere near Fleet White whilst attempting to flee is to risk Plan A failing at the final step.

    In all probability John and Patsy fully intended to leave Burke behind just like we know they intended to abandon JonBenet to the process of decomposition.


    .

  10. #332
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    6,419
    Quote Originally Posted by ShadyLadySleuth View Post
    It is my firm hope that as BR grows into adulthood and can put some distance between his parents influence and memory - he might reveal to someone memories he has, which may even be repressed at present. Perhaps if that happens, we may finally understand what really happened that night. BR might be our last hope of solving this perplexing case.
    ShadyLadySleuth,
    If Burke played no part in JonBenet's death, then I reckon at some point, say after John has passed on, he will unburden himself?

    Maybe not, he might be wary of the media spotlight, but there will come a time when he knows that he alone can offer closure to the death of JonBenet.


    .

  11. #333
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    In the Federal Witness Protection Program
    Posts
    7,576
    There was no way JR would have never seen his son again. This is America- every killer gets out of prison someday. In this case, no one would have gone to prison for life anyway- that is reserved for First Degree Murder (premeditated) which this case was NOT. This would have ended up a plea bargain, even with a sexual assault charge added in (IMO, that charge would have been dropped anyway in the plea bargain).

    They'd have never left BR behind and run the risk that LE would get to him or that he might do or say something that incriminates one of them.
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

  12. #334
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    7,245
    If the case wasn't in Boulder, I think Patsy would've been charged with 2nd degree murder or manslaughter. Sometimes they go for the highest charge possible in these high profile cases. But since this is Boulder, land of the plea bargains, I agree that it would've gone that route.

  13. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to eileenhawkeye For This Useful Post:


  14. #335
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    6,419
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    There was no way JR would have never seen his son again. This is America- every killer gets out of prison someday. In this case, no one would have gone to prison for life anyway- that is reserved for First Degree Murder (premeditated) which this case was NOT. This would have ended up a plea bargain, even with a sexual assault charge added in (IMO, that charge would have been dropped anyway in the plea bargain).

    They'd have never left BR behind and run the risk that LE would get to him or that he might do or say something that incriminates one of them.
    DeeDee249,
    Your assumptions are based on Plan B. John Ramsey was not interested in plea bargains and certainly wished to avoid incarceration in a federal prison.

    To that end I reckon he wanted to leave interstate for Atlanta ASAP. He intended to leave JonBenet to decompose, he was not interested any further in Burke or what he might or might not say. By fleeing Colorado John was telling the world I'm Guilty. Once out of Colorado and eventually the USofA John could not care less whatever Burke or Fleet had to say.

    He was never coming back that was the intended conclusion to Plan A!


    .

  15. #336
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    In the Federal Witness Protection Program
    Posts
    7,576
    Quote Originally Posted by UKGuy View Post
    DeeDee249,
    Your assumptions are based on Plan B. John Ramsey was not interested in plea bargains and certainly wished to avoid incarceration in a federal prison.

    To that end I reckon he wanted to leave interstate for Atlanta ASAP. He intended to leave JonBenet to decompose, he was not interested any further in Burke or what he might or might not say. By fleeing Colorado John was telling the world I'm Guilty. Once out of Colorado and eventually the USofA John could not care less whatever Burke or Fleet had to say.

    He was never coming back that was the intended conclusion to Plan A!


    .
    I guess we will just have to disagree on this one. Remember there is a MOM to add to the equation as well. With her daughter dead, there was no way Patsy would walk away forever from her 10 year old son. Neither would JR. It is one thing to want to get away from the jurisdiction of the BPD. It is quite another to abandon your surviving child forever to what? Live with a "friend"? No way. I don't know whether you are a parent, but a parent, even a guilty one, would not do this. Having gone through this trauma, then have his parents run away and dump him with friends, never to return, would have destroyed BR. I simply cannot accept JR would do this.
    He was allegedly overheard making plans to fly "my remaining family" to Atlanta. I'd say that included his son.

    How about the rest of you? What are your thoughts on this? Was JR planning to leave his son behind, possibly forever? Or was he planning to pick him up on his way out of town?
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

  16. The Following User Says Thank You to DeeDee249 For This Useful Post:


  17. #337
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    In the Federal Witness Protection Program
    Posts
    7,576
    Quote Originally Posted by UKGuy View Post
    ShadyLadySleuth,
    If Burke played no part in JonBenet's death, then I reckon at some point, say after John has passed on, he will unburden himself?

    Maybe not, he might be wary of the media spotlight, but there will come a time when he knows that he alone can offer closure to the death of JonBenet.


    .
    I don't think BR will be the hero some may wish he will be. He may be implicated in some way as well, and whether his father is gone will not make a difference to whether he will "tell all". And if he doesn't really KNOW exactly what happened, he won't want to open that can of worms again. And his lawyers will strongly advise against it.
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

  18. The Following User Says Thank You to DeeDee249 For This Useful Post:


  19. #338
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    6,419
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    I guess we will just have to disagree on this one. Remember there is a MOM to add to the equation as well. With her daughter dead, there was no way Patsy would walk away forever from her 10 year old son. Neither would JR. It is one thing to want to get away from the jurisdiction of the BPD. It is quite another to abandon your surviving child forever to what? Live with a "friend"? No way. I don't know whether you are a parent, but a parent, even a guilty one, would not do this. Having gone through this trauma, then have his parents run away and dump him with friends, never to return, would have destroyed BR. I simply cannot accept JR would do this.
    He was allegedly overheard making plans to fly "my remaining family" to Atlanta. I'd say that included his son.

    How about the rest of you? What are your thoughts on this? Was JR planning to leave his son behind, possibly forever? Or was he planning to pick him up on his way out of town?
    DeeDee249,
    Its not really about disagreeing with you, personally. Its simply about the evidence. You have the luxury of hindsight, a perfect science. Also I did not say he was abandoning Burke. My interpretation of the evidence is that John and Patsy intended to flee Colorado ASAP. This is what the crime-scene staging was all about, they were buying time, they thought they might be arrested and not bailed, so they both intended to leave Boulder. If John and Patsy thought they could take Burke with them then why bother handing him over to Fleet White?

    I reckon you are overstating your case. We all know what Patsy was capable off, and walking away from JonBenet's body was likely easier than asphyxiating her with the garrote. So knowing Burke was in safe hands, Patsy would have no problem flying off to Atlanta. She could always phone him from there.

    If Patsy had stayed behind while John alone flew to Atlanta what would that look like?

    The seriousness of the situation mandated that John and Patsy flee Colorado, thats what all the staging is for. They did not know that there would be a Plan B invoked. They were executing Plan A, simply to avoid arrest, one or both of them thought they might face a homicide charge.

    The evidence tells you John intended to flee Colorado, I doubt whether he would risk telegraphing his intentions by detouring to pick up Burke, when he could simply tell Fleet White to put Burke on later flight.

    .

  20. #339
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    6,419
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    I don't think BR will be the hero some may wish he will be. He may be implicated in some way as well, and whether his father is gone will not make a difference to whether he will "tell all". And if he doesn't really KNOW exactly what happened, he won't want to open that can of worms again. And his lawyers will strongly advise against it.
    DeeDee249,
    I doubt he would ever tell all. But he might do some pre-arranged documentary interview where he reveals some crucial evidence that clears himself, with his parents gone, he knows he is the only person left that can shed light on the case.

    And if he doesn't really KNOW exactly what happened, he won't want to open that can of worms again. And his lawyers will strongly advise against it.
    If he does not know, then I reckon its even more probable we will be hearing from him.



    .

  21. #340
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    4,541
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post

    How about the rest of you? What are your thoughts on this? Was JR planning to leave his son behind, possibly forever?
    No way,not JR,maybe PR yes.


    Or was he planning to pick him up on his way out of town?
    maybe he didn't even think so far.him and FW were still close buddies otherwise they wouldn't have called him over that morning,they trusted FW,so maybe they thought BR is safe for NOW,we'll see how we deal with this later, now we got more important issues to deal with (cops arriving,JB has to be found).
    There are only two mistakes one can make along the road to truth; not going all the way, and not starting.
    Buddha


  22. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to madeleine For This Useful Post:


  23. #341
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    In the Federal Witness Protection Program
    Posts
    7,576
    That wasn't my original quote- sometimes the "quote" button doesn't capture the actual poster who made the original post.

    But for the record, i already posted that I do not believe EITHER parent would have EVER left BR behind for any reason, for any length of time.
    For one, they would have bee too concerned he would say something incriminating the family. He already admitted he was really awake that morning and pretended to be asleep. He was heard on the enhanced 911 tape. He knows SOMETHING.
    I believe that even though this may have been a dysfunctional family, even though many do not agree with their choices (the pageants), even though they may have been obnoxious show-offs and even though someone in the family (not necessarily the parents) had been abusing JB- even taking all this into account- the death of JB, brutal as it was, was not intentional. They did love their children and would never have abandoned their son forever.
    That alone would point to their guilt. There is nowhere in the world they could hide- they'd become world-wide fugitives- and they don't have THAT kind of resources. They were going to Atlanta, not a hidden private island or secret underground bunker. There is no waiver of extradition for murder. They could have (and would have) been brought to Colorado for charges to be filed if it came to that.
    There is simply no rational reason for them to have left town without him. None.
    If JR's original plan had worked and they were able to fly to Atlanta, they'd have picked BR up on the way to the airport or had FW drive him to the airport.
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

  24. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to DeeDee249 For This Useful Post:


  25. #342
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    6,419
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    That wasn't my original quote- sometimes the "quote" button doesn't capture the actual poster who made the original post.

    But for the record, i already posted that I do not believe EITHER parent would have EVER left BR behind for any reason, for any length of time.
    For one, they would have bee too concerned he would say something incriminating the family. He already admitted he was really awake that morning and pretended to be asleep. He was heard on the enhanced 911 tape. He knows SOMETHING.
    I believe that even though this may have been a dysfunctional family, even though many do not agree with their choices (the pageants), even though they may have been obnoxious show-offs and even though someone in the family (not necessarily the parents) had been abusing JB- even taking all this into account- the death of JB, brutal as it was, was not intentional. They did love their children and would never have abandoned their son forever.
    That alone would point to their guilt. There is nowhere in the world they could hide- they'd become world-wide fugitives- and they don't have THAT kind of resources. They were going to Atlanta, not a hidden private island or secret underground bunker. There is no waiver of extradition for murder. They could have (and would have) been brought to Colorado for charges to be filed if it came to that.
    There is simply no rational reason for them to have left town without him. None.
    If JR's original plan had worked and they were able to fly to Atlanta, they'd have picked BR up on the way to the airport or had FW drive him to the airport.
    DeeDee249,
    If JR's original plan had worked and they were able to fly to Atlanta, they'd have picked BR up on the way to the airport or had FW drive him to the airport.
    Well, well, so what was John's original plan?

    I'm a believer in KISS, Occam etc. So we have a homicide and sexual assault, then we have the alleged killer bailing out of the state in his own private plane. So accepting this, I reckon he will fly out of the USA to some other jurisdiction, simply because the intent is to evade capture and arrest.

    Why should he stop enroute to pickup Burke, who is safe, and endanger his masterplan? John is smart enough to know, even if he picks up Burke, whats to stop Fleet from phoning the police right away, just as he gets back in his car, putting his plan at risk?

    Burke like JonBenet was to be left behind!


    .

  26. #343
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    In the Federal Witness Protection Program
    Posts
    7,576
    Quote Originally Posted by UKGuy View Post
    DeeDee249,

    Well, well, so what was John's original plan?

    I'm a believer in KISS, Occam etc. So we have a homicide and sexual assault, then we have the alleged killer bailing out of the state in his own private plane. So accepting this, I reckon he will fly out of the USA to some other jurisdiction, simply because the intent is to evade capture and arrest.

    Why should he stop enroute to pickup Burke, who is safe, and endanger his masterplan? John is smart enough to know, even if he picks up Burke, whats to stop Fleet from phoning the police right away, just as he gets back in his car, putting his plan at risk?

    Burke like JonBenet was to be left behind!


    .
    BR was "safe" because there was never any danger. BR heard and/or saw something. There was a GREAT risk he might say something. Also LE could have gotten to him, and tried to question him without his parents present.

    JR's plan was to fly himself, Patsy and BR to his in-laws home in Atlanta and let the lawyers keep LE away.
    But I don't think he really would have done it anyway. I can't see them leaving JB to rot in the basement.
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

  27. The Following User Says Thank You to DeeDee249 For This Useful Post:


  28. #344
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    in the coldest city around
    Posts
    209
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    BR was "safe" because there was never any danger. BR heard and/or saw something. There was a GREAT risk he might say something. Also LE could have gotten to him, and tried to question him without his parents present.

    JR's plan was to fly himself, Patsy and BR to his in-laws home in Atlanta and let the lawyers keep LE away.
    But I don't think he really would have done it anyway. I can't see them leaving JB to rot in the basement.
    But they DID leave her to rot by the christmas tree!? I fully think John would have loaded them all up if he could and flown away to Atlanta.

  29. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to GingBreade For This Useful Post:


  30. #345
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Isenbuettel,GERMANY
    Posts
    373
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    You know, the more I think about it, I simply can't see EITHER parent covering up for the other. This was THEIR CHILD, and she was DEAD. Imagine these scenarios: Patsy kills JB accidentally with a bash/slam to the head. JR finds out but agrees to help with the cover up because he has sexually abused her? So after their daughter has been killed NOW he has to tell Patsy that he's been sexually molesting her, so he'll help her stage it to look like a kidnapping so no one will find out? Unlikely.
    Or JR kills JB with a bash on the head because she screamed as she was being sexually molested and Patsy agrees to cover it up so she can continue to enjoy her lifestyle?
    Unlikely.
    BUT envision their son(s) as the perps and you have a whole 'nother ball game.
    NOW I can see it.

    No way Patsy did all of this by herself, and JR just goes along with it when he finds out.
    or maybe JR has been abusing her daughter before, JBR told her mom about it that night, so PR did hit her on the head, so JR and PR had to cover it up because both were guilty?! what I do not get it is why if dad was the abuser, the autopsy says someone has abused her with a finger or kinda other instrument? was she abused by JR ,so why with a finger?

  31. The Following User Says Thank You to DIRK SCHILLER For This Useful Post:


  32. #346
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Ceti Alpha V
    Posts
    11,198
    Quote Originally Posted by DIRK SCHILLER View Post
    or maybe JR has been abusing her daughter before, JBR told her mom about it that night, so PR did hit her on the head, so JR and PR had to cover it up because both were guilty?!
    Dirk, that actually is my theory. I posted it somewhere around here.

    what I do not get it is why if dad was the abuser, the autopsy says someone has abused her with a finger or kinda other instrument? was she abused by JR ,so why with a finger?
    Well, Dirk, according to all the literature I've come across, it's actually fairly common among long-term male abusers not to go for direct penile penetration right away. There's a "grooming" period in which digital penetration is used to gently stretch the vagina over time so as to prepare it for penile penetration, ie, get it large enough so it won't be torn to shreds by the member.

    God, I hated writing that.
    All posts made by me are MY exclusive property, and are NOT to be used or reproduced without my permission. DAVE SMASH THIEVES!

  33. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to SuperDave For This Useful Post:


  34. #347
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    6,419
    Quote Originally Posted by DIRK SCHILLER View Post
    or maybe JR has been abusing her daughter before, JBR told her mom about it that night, so PR did hit her on the head, so JR and PR had to cover it up because both were guilty?! what I do not get it is why if dad was the abuser, the autopsy says someone has abused her with a finger or kinda other instrument? was she abused by JR ,so why with a finger?
    DIRK SCHILLER,
    Not quite. Coroner Meyer stated there was both digital penetration and sexual contact. These might be coincident or separate events. Take your pick. Evidently Coroner Meyer considered it important enought to make the distinction since you might be forgiven for assuming digital penetration alone is sufficient for sexual contact?

    I reckon Coroner Meyer could be suggesting there was sexual contact undertaken prior to JonBenet's death. But at some point digital penetration was enacted as part of a staged sexual assault along with the garrote, size-12's and longjohns etc?

    Also it would have been nice to hear Coroner Meyer's rationale for arriving at digital penetration , since he was not present. Yet we know the stager had access to a paintbrush handle!

    In other words it looks like some evidence has been redacted?



    .

  35. The Following User Says Thank You to UKGuy For This Useful Post:


  36. #348
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    6,419
    Quote Originally Posted by GingBreade View Post
    But they DID leave her to rot by the christmas tree!? I fully think John would have loaded them all up if he could and flown away to Atlanta.
    GingBreade,
    Of course! Its not as if this was a vacation trip. This was an attempt to evade justice. And if it means leaving your children behind, albeit knowing they will be safe in the hands of Fleet White et-al, so be it.

    Lets Fly, Fy Away :-)


    .

  37. #349
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    In the Federal Witness Protection Program
    Posts
    7,576
    Quote Originally Posted by GingBreade View Post
    But they DID leave her to rot by the christmas tree!? I fully think John would have loaded them all up if he could and flown away to Atlanta.
    That was totally different. Leaving her in the basement would mean she was not "discovered". We already know that police would never have found her- they were so incompetent the first officer there never even looked in that room, despite having found the room- he never even looked up to see the simple wood latch that was all that stood between him and JB's corpse on he other side of the door- he couldn't figure out how to open the door! As far as I know, Detective Arndt never searched the house herself.

    Leaving her under the tree was another matter. She had already been "found", brought up from the basement and LE was aware of her. She wouldn't have been there too long- the morgue would be picking her up.

    JB wouldn't have left his son with FW indefinitely. The friends became enemies quickly- within a matter of days. I'd say that proved FW knew something that made JR very worried. So the way he dealt with him, and the way the Rs dealt with ANYONE who might think about voicing their suspicions, was to point a finger at any potential accuser and accuse them (or threaten to) of being the killer. There is no way the Rs would leave their son with someone who they feared might accuse them of knowing what happened or of being responsible for it.
    I feel, had JR's flight to Atlanta been allowed, he'd have picked up BR from FW's house that day- before FW had a chance to re-think the Rs guilt and/or knowledge about their daughter's murder.
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

  38. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to DeeDee249 For This Useful Post:


  39. #350
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    6,419
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    That was totally different. Leaving her in the basement would mean she was not "discovered". We already know that police would never have found her- they were so incompetent the first officer there never even looked in that room, despite having found the room- he never even looked up to see the simple wood latch that was all that stood between him and JB's corpse on he other side of the door- he couldn't figure out how to open the door! As far as I know, Detective Arndt never searched the house herself.

    Leaving her under the tree was another matter. She had already been "found", brought up from the basement and LE was aware of her. She wouldn't have been there too long- the morgue would be picking her up.

    JB wouldn't have left his son with FW indefinitely. The friends became enemies quickly- within a matter of days. I'd say that proved FW knew something that made JR very worried. So the way he dealt with him, and the way the Rs dealt with ANYONE who might think about voicing their suspicions, was to point a finger at any potential accuser and accuse them (or threaten to) of being the killer. There is no way the Rs would leave their son with someone who they feared might accuse them of knowing what happened or of being responsible for it.
    I feel, had JR's flight to Atlanta been allowed, he'd have picked up BR from FW's house that day- before FW had a chance to re-think the Rs guilt and/or knowledge about their daughter's murder.
    DeeDee249,
    I feel, had JR's flight to Atlanta been allowed, he'd have picked up BR from FW's house that day- before FW had a chance to re-think the Rs guilt and/or knowledge about their daughter's murder.
    The R's had a plan, we know that because of the staging, including the ransom note and Patsy's inconsistent statements.

    We also know that a flight had already been scheduled for that morning, so this would have to be factored into any plan e.g. cancellation.

    That John Ramsey was complicit in the execution of the staging was his decision to relocate Burke Ramsey out of the house, early that morning.

    Essentially there could only be two outcomes to this strategy:

    1. JonBenet is found, after a quick search.

    2. JonBenet is not found at all.

    Now outcome 2. cannot be the one the R's assumed might occur since they did remove Burke Ramsey.

    It follows Burke Ramsey was not included in the final steps of the plan, why, because he was not there.

    So enroute to their flight why should the R's endanger their plan, by stopping to pick up Burke who is in no danger, and I assume is innocent of any crime?

    Leaving Burke Ramsey behind was part of the plan!


    .

Page 14 of 45 FirstFirst ... 456789101112131415161718192021222324 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Molested with the handle?
    By Paradox in forum JonBenet Ramsey
    Replies: 396
    Last Post: 06-26-2014, 09:42 AM
  2. OK- girls molested at slumber party
    By peeples in forum Crimes-Spotlight on Children
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 04-08-2011, 09:49 AM
  3. 20+ Teens Molested by PA Cop
    By MrsBuckWeaver in forum Crimes in the News
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 10-28-2007, 11:11 PM
  4. Replies: 65
    Last Post: 09-06-2006, 01:55 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •