View Poll Results: who molested/abused JB?

Voters
425. You may not vote on this poll
  • JR

    119 28.00%
  • BR

    109 25.65%
  • JAR

    22 5.18%
  • a close family friend

    25 5.88%
  • a stranger/stalker a la JMK

    16 3.76%
  • PR-it wasn't sexual abuse,it was corporal punishment

    73 17.18%
  • she wasn't previously abused/molested

    61 14.35%
Page 35 of 89 FirstFirst ... 25 33 34 35 36 37 45 85 ... LastLast
Results 511 to 525 of 1329
  1. #511
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    In the Federal Witness Protection Program
    Posts
    7,990
    Quote Originally Posted by SunnieRN View Post
    There are as many theories about this case, as there are people who read about it. I don't believe JB was molested by only one person. I think when she was young, DP may have been a perpetrator.

    As JB got older, I think there were others. Possibly JR, JAR, BR. I think the level of abuse would have been different with each incident or who was involved.

    I think BR was possibly molested also. I always thought the comment PR said he made about his comparing himself to JB was strange. Made me wonder what really was going on within the family.
    Interesting that BR was also a bed-wetter (and he may have had soiling problems too) until Patsy turned her attention to JB's pageant persona. Could it be that at that point, a more sexualized JB became the focus for the molester?
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.


  2. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to DeeDee249 For This Useful Post:


  3. #512
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    725
    Quote Originally Posted by SunnieRN View Post
    I think BR was possibly molested also. I always thought the comment PR said he made about his comparing himself to JB was strange. Made me wonder what really was going on within the family.
    BBM Totally agree. Which comment are you referring to?
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    Interesting that BR was also a bed-wetter (and he may have had soiling problems too) until Patsy turned her attention to JB's pageant persona. Could it be that at that point, a more sexualized JB became the focus for the molester?
    Do you connect BR's "issues" with abuse? Abuse by PR? By JR?

    Can't find the emoticon for "pick DD's brain"!


  4. #513
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    In the Federal Witness Protection Program
    Posts
    7,990
    Quote Originally Posted by Nom de plume View Post
    BBM Totally agree. Which comment are you referring to?


    Do you connect BR's "issues" with abuse? Abuse by PR? By JR?

    Can't find the emoticon for "pick DD's brain"!
    At the very least he was overwhelmed by his overbearing mother. As to abuse, I don't necessarily feel there was sexual/physical abuse, but emotional abuse was very likely. The reaction if soiling is said to me more indicative of sexual abuse (especially when it happened in a child that had previously been potty trained) than bedwetting.
    Remember, JB didn't just wet the bed. She pooped in it too, and wet and pooped her clothes too. THAT is a huge red flag. Not so much if it was just bedwetting- after all, that is not all that rare in kids and is not usually a sign if sexual abuse.
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.


  5. The Following User Says Thank You to DeeDee249 For This Useful Post:


  6. #514
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    725
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    At the very least he was overwhelmed by his overbearing mother. As to abuse, I don't necessarily feel there was sexual/physical abuse, but emotional abuse was very likely. The reaction if soiling is said to me more indicative of sexual abuse (especially when it happened in a child that had previously been potty trained) than bedwetting.
    Remember, JB didn't just wet the bed. She pooped in it too, and wet and pooped her clothes too. THAT is a huge red flag. Not so much if it was just bedwetting- after all, that is not all that rare in kids and is not usually a sign if sexual abuse.
    It IS a huge red flag about BOTH kids. BR had a soiling issue too! Remember he smeared the bathroom walls, his PJ pants dirty on JB's floor, etc.?


  7. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Nom de plume For This Useful Post:


  8. #515
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    6,998
    Quote Originally Posted by Nom de plume View Post
    It IS a huge red flag about BOTH kids. BR had a soiling issue too! Remember he smeared the bathroom walls, his PJ pants dirty on JB's floor, etc.?
    Nom de plume,
    ITA. But just what is BR's soiled pajama bottoms doing in JonBenet's bedroom?

    The more information that is revealed the more it seems to link BR with JonBenet


    .


  9. The Following User Says Thank You to UKGuy For This Useful Post:


  10. #516
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    In the Federal Witness Protection Program
    Posts
    7,990
    Quote Originally Posted by UKGuy View Post
    Nom de plume,
    ITA. But just what is BR's soiled pajama bottoms doing in JonBenet's bedroom?

    The more information that is revealed the more it seems to link BR with JonBenet


    .
    Those pajama bottoms MAY be BR's, but they have never been proven to be. Just because they seemed too big for JB doesn't mean they weren't hers. I don't recall wether those soiled pajama bottoms made into an evidence locker, but it would be a simple matter to test that fecal material. They have JB's DNA , not sure whether they ever were allowed to get BR's.
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.


  11. #517
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    3,576
    I was reviewing autopsy photos today and I had forgotten about the pink 'triangle' under the ligature marks on JonBenet's neck. These are commonly seen in victims of strangulation with a soft object, such as a scarf. Remember JR's 'keepsake', put into the coffin when JonBenet was buried?

    It was a scarf. I couldn't ever understand that. It's not as if a scarf was a favorite clothing item that was a 'trademark' for Jon Benet. I really question his reasoning for a scarf. Blanket, maybe. Scarf, not so much.

    http://crimeshots.com/CrimeScene1.html

    Fifth row down on the left.
    ___________________

    "This Time We Get It Right!"
    If you can read this, thank a teacher, if it's in English, thank a soldier!
    If I forget to mention it. Everything I post is my opinion, right or wrong, good or bad.
    If you have questions about Rebecca Zahaus death, please watch this:http://websleuths.com/forums/showpos...00&postcount=1


  12. The Following User Says Thank You to SunnieRN For This Useful Post:


  13. #518
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Mid-North Coast, NSW, Australia
    Posts
    100
    Quote Originally Posted by SunnieRN View Post
    There are as many theories about this case, as there are people who read about it. I don't believe JB was molested by only one person. I think when she was young, DP may have been a perpetrator.

    As JB got older, I think there were others. Possibly JR, JAR, BR. I think the level of abuse would have been different with each incident or who was involved.

    I think BR was possibly molested also. I always thought the comment PR said he made about his comparing himself to JB was strange. Made me wonder what really was going on within the family.
    I hadn't considered this idea SunnieRN, but now that I think about it, it makes sense. Maybe BR & JB did some "exploring", "playiing doctor", you know. It happens. But the more I get to understand the whole Ramsey family dynamic, it seems to me that sexual misconduct or inappropriate conduct might have been the "norm" in that family, from JAR, PR, JR, or a myriad of others. It's a horrid thought, but makes sense. And if we add the transgenerational aspect to the picture (i.e. a sexually abused child might be inclined to do it to others later), perhaps it stems back from PR's side of the tree and/or JR's. Or, sadly, both.

    And as vile as sexual abuse is, it does happen, but doesn't usually lead to murder. Something else was so broken in that family that there was a snap on the behalf of one or more of the three surviving R's in the house the JB was killed. It sad for all concerned-- even sad for the one or more who killed her. (Not excusing the crimes in any way, shape, or form, merely expressing a bit of sympathy here for what must have been a painful life for all of them.)

    I dearly wish we lived in a world where we didn't have to think about such things.


  14. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to SunVenus For This Useful Post:


  15. #519
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    In the Federal Witness Protection Program
    Posts
    7,990
    Quote Originally Posted by SunVenus View Post
    I hadn't considered this idea SunnieRN, but now that I think about it, it makes sense. Maybe BR & JB did some "exploring", "playiing doctor", you know. It happens. But the more I get to understand the whole Ramsey family dynamic, it seems to me that sexual misconduct or inappropriate conduct might have been the "norm" in that family, from JAR, PR, JR, or a myriad of others. It's a horrid thought, but makes sense. And if we add the transgenerational aspect to the picture (i.e. a sexually abused child might be inclined to do it to others later), perhaps it stems back from PR's side of the tree and/or JR's. Or, sadly, both.

    And as vile as sexual abuse is, it does happen, but doesn't usually lead to murder. Something else was so broken in that family that there was a snap on the behalf of one or more of the three surviving R's in the house the JB was killed. It sad for all concerned-- even sad for the one or more who killed her. (Not excusing the crimes in any way, shape, or form, merely expressing a bit of sympathy here for what must have been a painful life for all of them.)

    I dearly wish we lived in a world where we didn't have to think about such things.
    The housekeeper reported that she had come into BR's bedroom and found JB and BR under the covers "playing". When she did, the kids screamed at her to get out. I assume she would have told Patsy, but I have not seen that in print.
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.


  16. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to DeeDee249 For This Useful Post:


  17. #520
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Mid-North Coast, NSW, Australia
    Posts
    100
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    The housekeeper reported that she had come into BR's bedroom and found JB and BR under the covers "playing". When she did, the kids screamed at her to get out. I assume she would have told Patsy, but I have not seen that in print.
    Yes, odd isn't it? You'd think she'd have said something... but for all we know, maybe she did. But maybe she was embarrassed too. Sexual matters make many people uncomfortable, and would the housekeeper have been willing to say to her employers: "umm, I think you need to have a frank birds & bees discussion with your kids". I'd like to think that had it been me, I'd have spoken up-- I am fairly "clinical" about sex and not shy about such matters... but to an employer? Especially ones that prided themselves on an appearance of moral rectitude & overt Christian values? And in an environement of such tension with focus on "go-go-go important family on the move" and PRs recovery from cancer and so on? I just don't know. Maybe she (the housekeeper) sensed-- intuitively-- it would cause a tempest in the household. And looking back, perhaps related sexual conduct did cause the ugly, ending tipping point.

    But yes, as you point out, we have that confirmation of a known sexual aspect between JBR & BR. With that & other innuendos, statements, the deliberate sexualisation/objectification by PR of JBR in pagentry and so on, it paints a dysfunctional picture of the family in matters of sex, sexual boundaries & sexual conduct.


  18. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to SunVenus For This Useful Post:


  19. #521
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    where the big sharks come to play
    Posts
    3,504
    ....and the unusual marks on the side of the neck that appear like blackish burn marks look like the prongs that a stun gun makes.......so sad.
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    "Look, if any of us wanted to mind our own business, we wouldn't be here" (carbuff 8/11/13)

    This post reflects my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy it anywhere else outside of the WebSleuth forum


  20. #522
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    2,230
    About this "playing". Were any more details given about this? For example: they had a flashlight and some books under there or they were lying down vs. sitting up under the covers- anything?

    I can see a bunch of abuse scenarios but I am leaning towards JR was abusing her and BR began abusing her. That is why the protectiveness towards BR, the weird stuff that happened on the 23rd, the general attitude of "circle the wagons", etc.


  21. The Following User Says Thank You to deca For This Useful Post:


  22. #523
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Mid-North Coast, NSW, Australia
    Posts
    100
    Quote Originally Posted by ATasteOfHoney View Post
    ....and the unusual marks on the side of the neck that appear like blackish burn marks look like the prongs that a stun gun makes.......so sad.
    I think Lou Smit's theory of a stun gun being used has been pretty well ruled out by Kolar's resaerch.

    Still, the household & it's inhabitants was abusive: physically, emotionally, sexually, mentally & spiritually. It disgusts me.


  23. #524
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    In the Federal Witness Protection Program
    Posts
    7,990
    Quote Originally Posted by SunVenus View Post
    Yes, odd isn't it? You'd think she'd have said something... but for all we know, maybe she did. But maybe she was embarrassed too. Sexual matters make many people uncomfortable, and would the housekeeper have been willing to say to her employers: "umm, I think you need to have a frank birds & bees discussion with your kids". I'd like to think that had it been me, I'd have spoken up-- I am fairly "clinical" about sex and not shy about such matters... but to an employer? Especially ones that prided themselves on an appearance of moral rectitude & overt Christian values? And in an environement of such tension with focus on "go-go-go important family on the move" and PRs recovery from cancer and so on? I just don't know. Maybe she (the housekeeper) sensed-- intuitively-- it would cause a tempest in the household. And looking back, perhaps related sexual conduct did cause the ugly, ending tipping point.

    But yes, as you point out, we have that confirmation of a known sexual aspect between JBR & BR. With that & other innuendos, statements, the deliberate sexualisation/objectification by PR of JBR in pagentry and so on, it paints a dysfunctional picture of the family in matters of sex, sexual boundaries & sexual conduct.

    LHP did not say more about it. We don't know whether she told Patsy. LHP planned to write a book, but never did. I am sure she was intimidated into not writing it. She had asked a judge to be allowed to discuss her testimony before the Grand Jury, but was denied. I don't think she could have been legally prevented from writing a book, but she could have been barred from discussing that GJ testimony. She had plenty of material for a book anyway, so I can only imagine how she was intimidated into not proceeding with it. Libel laws protect only the living- anyone may write whatever they wish about a dead person, but there are still two living Rs left.
    A curious point- a dictionary in the R master bedroom was open to the page that had the word "INCEST" on it, and the corner of that page was folded down to point to that word. Coincidence? Well..you know what they say about coincidences- there are none.
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.


  24. The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to DeeDee249 For This Useful Post:


  25. #525
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    6,998
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
    Those pajama bottoms MAY be BR's, but they have never been proven to be. Just because they seemed too big for JB doesn't mean they weren't hers. I don't recall wether those soiled pajama bottoms made into an evidence locker, but it would be a simple matter to test that fecal material. They have JB's DNA , not sure whether they ever were allowed to get BR's.
    DeeDee249,
    I agree, this might just be a factoid, which I think originates from Kolar's book. If Kolar is referencing them, then I reckon they made it to the evidence cage. Also they may have been determined as belonging to BR, but this has never been disclosed publicly.

    My understanding is that these pajama bottoms are distinct from the soiled pants on the bathroom floor?

    Apart from the fecal stains on the pajamas alleged to belong to BR, the inside of them will contain his touch-dna, and next to none of JonBenet's. So determining ownership should not be difficult?

    All the above, if true, along with LHP's claims about Burke and JonBenet playing beneath the sheets, seem to add up to some form of dysfunctional relationship between Burke Ramsey and his sister?


    .


  26. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to UKGuy For This Useful Post:


Page 35 of 89 FirstFirst ... 25 33 34 35 36 37 45 85 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Molested with the handle?
    By Paradox in forum JonBenet Ramsey
    Replies: 396
    Last Post: 06-26-2014, 09:42 AM
  2. OK- girls molested at slumber party
    By peeples in forum Crimes-Spotlight on Children
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 04-08-2011, 09:49 AM
  3. 20+ Teens Molested by PA Cop
    By MrsBuckWeaver in forum Crimes in the News
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 10-28-2007, 11:11 PM
  4. Replies: 65
    Last Post: 09-06-2006, 01:55 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •