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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by starrynightastro View Post
    "I know the moderator use to be rather strict about presuming or presumptions (types of charts) and usually wants us to present our evidence with Links from only the Reported Events (especially when including names for folks with links for the names )"

    Thank you for telling me. I will keep that in mind for future posts.
    Using your chart, or the one posted earlier, where do you think Lauren's body is now residing? 4:15AM puts Cancer at the cusp of the I/C i.e. a water sign.

    I wonder how or what type of delineations you might use to find the body?

    I'm not at all famililar with where this Apt. is in relation to water or even IF they should be looking into water sites., and wonder if you have any insight into the location using the charts of just where we might direct the search?

    Geographical ones?

    Using the Part of Find, we have as the calculation for the 4:15AM chart the following:
    Leo: 29:53min.

    Note: Using this formula PO Find:

    The formula is Moon + House 4 Cusp - chart ruler. Chart ruler means ruler of the ASC
    Last edited by Leomoon80; 06-18-2011 at 04:54 PM. Reason: Added: Part of Find for 4:15AM chart
    "The Greek word moira (μοῖρα) literally means a part or portion, and by extension one's portion in life or destiny.
    They controlled the metaphorical thread of life of every mortal from birth to death."

    Wikipedia

  2. #17
    Thank you for telling me about the Part of Find. That will be something to play with.

    Always, finding the location of the body is the toughest part of forensic astrology, but I thank you for asking me that question. I spent much of last night and early this morning on this, so all that work has to end up as blog post, which I posted on True Crime and Astrology.

    Here is the blog post in its entirety which I hope adequately shows the techniques and theories I used.

    The Astrology of Disappearances: Where is Lauren Spierer?

    Where is Lauren Spierer? Well, that’s the $64,000 dollar question, isn’t it? The answer is in the chart, it always is, but where in the chart is the question.

    I have found that in many cases, but not all, the position of Saturn indicates the body, and the degrees on the planets connected with Saturn can indicate the number of miles the body is transported to the last location. The zodiac sign the Saturn is in may be an indicator the type of place in which body would be found.

    Holly Wimunc’s body was found approximately 95 miles from her home in Fayetteville, NC, taken from her apartment off base to Fort Lejeune where her Marine husband was stationed. The event Saturn indicated direction of the location: adding the degrees of the planets from Pluto (excluding the Ascendant) to the Saturn/Mars combination of that day adds up to 95 the number of miles. She was found buried in a wetland a short way from the house where her husband lived. The Saturn was in Virgo.

    On the other hand, the body of Somer Thompson, a young girl that was abducted in Florida on her way walking home from school, it was the girl’s own Natal Saturn that pointed the way to where her body would be found, 57 miles from home, dumped in a landfill. The perpetrator had put her body in a dumpster, and if wasn’t for the intuitive insights of the detective working the case, her body might not have been found. Adding the degrees of Saturn, Venus and Uranus gives us the number 57, the rough amount of miles where Somer was found.

    And then again, Yale grad student Annie Le was found hidden in the basement of the building where she was murdered. In the last seen chart of Annie Le, transiting Pluto was a 0 degrees conjunct her Neptune at the Midheaven. When placed inside the houses of the event chart, Annie Le’s Pluto sat in the eighth house. Her Pluto was 01 degrees Scorpio, while her Saturn sits in eighth house event chart at 21 degrees Scorpio. The Last Seen Chart with Pluto in Capricorn was especially indicative because the 0 degrees essentially displayed her body was not moved and the zodiac sign Capricorn is indicative, according to Deb Houlding, Skyscript, “of places low to the ground”.

    When we place Lauren’s natal planets in the event chart of June 03, 2011, 4:14 AM, Bloomington, Indiana, Lauren’s Saturn in the sign of Capricorn sits in the 10th house. Her Pluto sits within 7 degrees of the 7th house cusp. Should we give weight then the planet sitting closes to the midheaven, or the planet at the seventh house cusp? Traditional astrology tells us the midheaven is the brightest place in our charts.

    Here Lauren Saturn is in Capricorn, the zodiac sign of places low to the ground. But there is the North Node, the Sun and Neptune all in close proximity to that Saturn and if you add up those degrees you get 95, a whole lot of miles to be traveled if she was taken by the perpetrators somewhere. This seems unlikely in the timeline of events. None of the people she was with seem to have disappeared for up to four hours and suddenly reappeared, unless there is something the police haven’t told us which is possible.

    With transiting Pluto in Capricorn and with Lauren’s Saturn in Capricorn then Capricorn places are where to look. Deb Houlding of her Skyscript website shares with us a summary of William Lilly’s description of places assigned to Capricorn:

    “Capricorn--As an earth sign Capricorn signifies farms, farming equipment, wood stores and places where farm animals roam. It is also said to specifically rule over fallow or bare land, barren fields, land that is bushy and thorny, or where there are dunghills, compost heaps or soil prepared with manure. Like all earth signs it indicates locations that are low down, either near or on the ground. It particularly signifies low dark places. Traditionally, it is said to signify a place where sails for ships and such materials are stored.

    Capricorn shares Saturn's dominion over boundaries, thresholds and all structures that divide and contain rooms and territory; from walls, garden fences, gateposts and international borders. As the sign that signifies mid-winter it also shares Saturn's signification over mausoleums, churchyards and ruins. Inside the house it is a low dark corner, on or near the floor, doors, closed in or confined spaces, earthy objects and those associated with waste disposal.”

    So these leads us in the directions the police and other searchers have been looking, farmland, open fields, dumpsters and dump sites.

    My thinking is that Lauren was placed in a dumpster. I know, Law Enforcement said they did a thorough search of the dumpsters, but perhaps the dumpster was emptied before they thought that “foul play” was involved. If the dumpster theory is correct then the landfill that services her area, according the best information I could get from Google, is about 9.5 miles south of Rossman’s apartment, taking the route mapped by Mapquest. Lauren’s Saturn position does seem to indicate a direction pointing due South and if you add the number of degrees in her Saturn position 2+7 you get 9. The seconds of that Saturn position are 55, seemingly to emphasize that number.

    But then again, you can’t discount all those other planets that added together totals 95. Either 9.5 miles to 95 miles south. This is where the planets point us to look for Lauren Spierer.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by starrynightastro View Post
    Thank you for telling me about the Part of Find. That will be something to play with.

    Here Lauren Saturn is in Capricorn, the zodiac sign of places low to the ground. But there is the North Node, the Sun and Neptune all in close proximity to that Saturn and if you add up those degrees you get 95, a whole lot of miles to be traveled if she was taken by the perpetrators somewhere. This seems unlikely in the timeline of events. None of the people she was with seem to have disappeared for up to four hours and suddenly reappeared, unless there is something the police havenít told us which is possible.
    But then again, you canít discount all those other planets that added together totals 95. Either 9.5 miles to 95 miles south. This is where the planets point us to look for Lauren Spierer.
    Snipped and bolded by me.

    I am not ready to discount the possibility of 95 miles. JR, the person who said he watched Lauren walk away at 4:15-4:30 am AND boyfriend, JW, both left campus to go home within days after Lauren went missing.

    I haven't ever read that their cars were searched. The only article I can find about cars searched is CR.
    Say what you mean, mean what you say, but don't say it mean.
    We are all just trying to make sense of an unimaginable crime.

  4. #19
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    Also, I found an article that gives the time that the bag of clothes and shoe box was found behind the trash bin at Lauren's apt on Friday, June 17


    However, items of clothing have been found this morning at approximately 5:05 a.m. in the vicinity of the girls' apartment at Smallwood Plaza, according to Fox59
    Say what you mean, mean what you say, but don't say it mean.
    We are all just trying to make sense of an unimaginable crime.

  5. #20
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    WELCOME StarynightAstro.

    Interesting take on 'location' using maps. I believe Soulscape & Tuba have used a similar map method in the past. Over the last 2.5 years since the inception of this Forum, we've tried several methods, sometimes they have worked out very well, other times, not so well. But of course, consideration of various known methods of location are welcome. We always want to find the missing person ASAP. Thank you.
    Last edited by FifthEssence; 06-20-2011 at 11:17 AM.

  6. #21
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    I have a question pertaining to time.. there are some mixed feelings on the 4AM time of last seen as there really is no proof of her being last seen at 4AM. Basically, it's word of mouth until otherwise. Would the chart change if based on the last time she was seen on surveillance video? That time was 2:51 a.m

    http://www.idsnews.com/news/story.aspx?id=81946

    Also, is there anything in the charts that say at around 1:30AM there was a fight in the apartment complex?
    "Minds are like parachutes. They only function when they are open." - James Dewar

  7. #22
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    http://www.allthingshealing.com/Astr...ng-Person/4902
    using example of Chandra Levy’s abduction,rape & murder…in his article.


    Lilly says that the 8th house ruler or a planet in the 8th house indicates the nature of the death

    In the case of Lauren Spierer, the 8th house is ruled by Jupiter found on the cusp of the ASC. using the 4:15AM chart
    Pluto the closest planet is found in the 9th house

    Lily says we can use the Moon to locate missing objects and persons:

    Jupiter (ruler of the 8th) found near the ASC in the 12th is also in perfect square aspect to the Moon at 29degrees Gemini in the 3rd house perhaps not far then > ? * musing here out loud!

    The Moon 29Gemini opposes 9th house Pluto in early Capricorn – According to the Rex Bills Rulership Book, we’d look to Saturn or Scorpio for Dumps (when emptying dumpsters the locale) , and Garbage Collections (Mars, Saturn or Pluto)
    "The Greek word moira (μοῖρα) literally means a part or portion, and by extension one's portion in life or destiny.
    They controlled the metaphorical thread of life of every mortal from birth to death."

    Wikipedia

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by sherbetjello View Post
    I have a question pertaining to time.. there are some mixed feelings on the 4AM time of last seen as there really is no proof of her being last seen at 4AM. Basically, it's word of mouth until otherwise. Would the chart change if based on the last time she was seen on surveillance video? That time was 2:51 a.m

    http://www.idsnews.com/news/story.aspx?id=81946

    Also, is there anything in the charts that say at around 1:30AM there was a fight in the apartment complex?
    I think the 1:30 you are speaking about, would be either heresay or a rumor?? I didn't notice that time in the link you posted., however:

    Since this is a recorded, "timed event" on video, I'll post the chart for it and we'll see what it says in relation to the vehicle mentioned and already commented upon in the link posted above:

    snipped:

    The truck of interest, Qualters said, is particularly important because it was seen on camera circling Morton and 10th streets around the same time Lauren disappeared.

    It first appeared on video at 4:14 a.m., then drove north on Morton and appeared again on video heading west on 10th at 4:24 a.m.
    "The Greek word moira (μοῖρα) literally means a part or portion, and by extension one's portion in life or destiny.
    They controlled the metaphorical thread of life of every mortal from birth to death."

    Wikipedia

  9. #24
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    Thanks Leomoon ... Did you also run a last seen chart for 2:51AM?
    You are the anchor to my soul, you won't let go ...

  10. #25
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    Lauren Speirer Missing IND.

    Quote Originally Posted by Knox View Post
    Thanks Leomoon ... Did you also run a last seen chart for 2:51AM?
    Thanks for the reminder,it slipped my mind. Here it is now:




    Now this chart isn’t looking good is it?

    Moon, is the co-ruler of this chart and Pisces Rising puts Jupiter as it’s lord. Jupiter found in Aries, but the last
    or 29th degree, a sign of violence (Mars rules Aries) found in the 1st house of this Surveilance Video capture chart.

    She was heading down an alley, shoeless after a night and early morning of partying with friends going somewhere, and never seen again by any who are admitting to having seen her publically (or at least that is my understanding of this case)

    Jupiter cannot be underestimated here, because of it’s Anaretic or last degree – the end of the rope, end of the line.
    I inserted Bacchus, the asteroid for drinking, partying and recalling that Bacchus was the Greek “god of wine and alcohol, who went mad with rage and tore his victims from limb to limb”. Seeing Bacchus here in the 1st, close to the Ascendant and Uranus (the disappearance) and within 43minutes of an exact conjunction to each other.
    Bacchus and Uranus oppose Saturn in the 7th, and as mentioned earlier by Starrynightastro , Saturn often tells us something of the body or deceased.
    Here, in the 7th Saturn is in the house of the “others” and no doubt Lauren was not alone wherever she ended up (whether in an apartment or a vehicle)….she wasn’t alone.

    The 3rd house cusp is 5 degrees Gemini, truly a malefic place,for this house that rules minds, lower thoughts and communications, is conjunct “Hyades” in the Pleiades, and as such is telling us there was an argument more then likely that took place close to this time period.

    The Sun placed in the 3rd house of lower mind, at 12Gemini, may indeed be representing the person or persons that she argued with, in Gemini, perhaps more then one person, (look to the 7th house cusp of the others and see that Mercury also rules this cusp)_ and found at the 0 degree54min. Gemini, entering into the Weeping Sisters, so I do think that this is pointing us to more then one person involved in her disappearance.

    Part of Fortune found in 12th, called Misfortune here, is in a degree of murder or suicide at 9 Pisces.
    This place conjuncts fixed star "SKAT" sometimes it augers suicides, sometimes murder., but always misfortune.
    The Part of Fortune here is quincunx to Saturn intercepted in the 7th of others, (cannot act on it's own ) in Libra, and POF is also
    square the Sun in Gemini, (in the 3rd house). The only harmony here, is that the POF is Sextile to Pluto (the death)




    Uploaded with ImageShack.us
    Last edited by Leomoon80; 06-19-2011 at 09:19 PM. Reason: add text
    "The Greek word moira (μοῖρα) literally means a part or portion, and by extension one's portion in life or destiny.
    They controlled the metaphorical thread of life of every mortal from birth to death."

    Wikipedia


  11. #26
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    Thank you Leomoon very much!!

    So now using this last seen chart for 2:51 AM, do you see any clues as to her location?

    My hubby's grilling seafood, I'm in charge of the artichokes and asparagus
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  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leomoon80 View Post
    I think the 1:30 you are speaking about, would be either heresay or a rumor?? I didn't notice that time in the link you posted., however:
    It is, at this point, hearsay about the fight in the apartment complex. Knowing if the stars know it, or not, could be very, very insightful.

    Thank you, Leomoon!
    "Minds are like parachutes. They only function when they are open." - James Dewar

  13. #28
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    Lauren Spierer Missing IND.

    Quote Originally Posted by starrynightastro View Post
    Thank you for telling me about the Part of Find. That will be something to play with.

    Always, finding the location of the body is the toughest part of forensic astrology, but I thank you for asking me that question. I spent much of last night and early this morning on this, so all that work has to end up as blog post, which I posted on True Crime and Astrology.

    Here is the blog post in its entirety which I hope adequately shows the techniques and theories I used.

    The Astrology of Disappearances: Where is Lauren Spierer?

    Where is Lauren Spierer? Well, that’s the $64,000 dollar question, isn’t it? The answer is in the chart, it always is, but where in the chart is the question.

    I have found that in many cases, but not all, the position of Saturn indicates the body, and the degrees on the planets connected with Saturn can indicate the number of miles the body is transported to the last location. The zodiac sign the Saturn is in may be an indicator the type of place in which body would be found.

    Holly Wimunc’s body was found approximately 95 miles from her home in Fayetteville, NC, taken from her apartment off base to Fort Lejeune where her Marine husband was stationed. The event Saturn indicated direction of the location: adding the degrees of the planets from Pluto (excluding the Ascendant) to the Saturn/Mars combination of that day adds up to 95 the number of miles. She was found buried in a wetland a short way from the house where her husband lived. The Saturn was in Virgo.

    On the other hand, the body of Somer Thompson, a young girl that was abducted in Florida on her way walking home from school, it was the girl’s own Natal Saturn that pointed the way to where her body would be found, 57 miles from home, dumped in a landfill. The perpetrator had put her body in a dumpster, and if wasn’t for the intuitive insights of the detective working the case, her body might not have been found. Adding the degrees of Saturn, Venus and Uranus gives us the number 57, the rough amount of miles where Somer was found.

    And then again, Yale grad student Annie Le was found hidden in the basement of the building where she was murdered. In the last seen chart of Annie Le, transiting Pluto was a 0 degrees conjunct her Neptune at the Midheaven. When placed inside the houses of the event chart, Annie Le’s Pluto sat in the eighth house. Her Pluto was 01 degrees Scorpio, while her Saturn sits in eighth house event chart at 21 degrees Scorpio. The Last Seen Chart with Pluto in Capricorn was especially indicative because the 0 degrees essentially displayed her body was not moved and the zodiac sign Capricorn is indicative, according to Deb Houlding, Skyscript, “of places low to the ground”.

    When we place Lauren’s natal planets in the event chart of June 03, 2011, 4:14 AM, Bloomington, Indiana, Lauren’s Saturn in the sign of Capricorn sits in the 10th house. Her Pluto sits within 7 degrees of the 7th house cusp. Should we give weight then the planet sitting close to the midheaven, or the planet at the seventh house cusp? Traditional astrology tells us the midheaven is the brightest place in our charts.

    Here Lauren Saturn is in Capricorn, the zodiac sign of places low to the ground. But there is the North Node, the Sun and Neptune all in close proximity to that Saturn and if you add up those degrees you get 95, a whole lot of miles to be traveled if she was taken by the perpetrators somewhere. This seems unlikely in the timeline of events. None of the people she was with seem to have disappeared for up to four hours and suddenly reappeared, unless there is something the police haven’t told us which is possible.

    With transiting Pluto in Capricorn and with Lauren’s Saturn in Capricorn then Capricorn places are where to look. Deb Houlding of her Skyscript website shares with us a summary of William Lilly’s description of places assigned to Capricorn:

    “Capricorn--As an earth sign Capricorn signifies farms, farming equipment, wood stores and places where farm animals roam. It is also said to specifically rule over fallow or bare land, barren fields, land that is bushy and thorny, or where there are dunghills, compost heaps or soil prepared with manure. Like all earth signs it indicates locations that are low down, either near or on the ground. It particularly signifies low dark places. Traditionally, it is said to signify a place where sails for ships and such materials are stored.

    Capricorn shares Saturn's dominion over boundaries, thresholds and all structures that divide and contain rooms and territory; from walls, garden fences, gateposts and international borders. As the sign that signifies mid-winter it also shares Saturn's signification over mausoleums, churchyards and ruins. Inside the house it is a low dark corner, on or near the floor, doors, closed in or confined spaces, earthy objects and those associated with waste disposal.”

    So these leads us in the directions the police and other searchers have been looking, farmland, open fields, dumpsters and dump sites.

    My thinking is that Lauren was placed in a dumpster. I know, Law Enforcement said they did a thorough search of the dumpsters, but perhaps the dumpster was emptied before they thought that “foul play” was involved. If the dumpster theory is correct then the landfill that services her area, according the best information I could get from Google, is about 9.5 miles south of Rossman’s apartment, taking the route mapped by Mapquest. Lauren’s Saturn position does seem to indicate a direction pointing due South and if you add the number of degrees in her Saturn position 2+7 you get 9. The seconds of that Saturn position are 55, seemingly to emphasize that number.

    But then again, you can’t discount all those other planets that added together totals 95. Either 9.5 miles to 95 miles south. This is where the planets point us to look for Lauren Spierer.
    Bringing forward this informative post on finding bodies, by Astrostarrynight:


    Astrostarrynight points to SATURN in Lauren's own natal chart which is located 27 degrees 37min. Capricorn (ruled by Saturn so in it's own ruler sign)
    and is conjunct to her (fated) North Node 28Capricorn01min.
    This is good information to know and recall into the Event chart!

    We now need to examine further and extrapolate.




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    "The Greek word moira (μοῖρα) literally means a part or portion, and by extension one's portion in life or destiny.
    They controlled the metaphorical thread of life of every mortal from birth to death."

    Wikipedia

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by sherbetjello View Post
    It is, at this point, hearsay about the fight in the apartment complex. Knowing if the stars know it, or not, could be very, very insightful.

    Thank you, Leomoon!
    I'd surmise the 2:51AM chart looks like there could have been an argument that occurred near this time.
    Again, the asteroid BAM (being hit? symbolically ) is near the D/C cusp, and conjunct the Vertex (fated person or event)...then there is the fact that in this chart the
    lord of the 6th House of decisions, is Leo, putting the Sun (as ruler of Leo) in the sign of Gemini (the twins so more then 1 person) and in the 3rd house of communications and short distances)

    This is the same ruler (Mercury that rules the 7th house of the other.

    Saturn is here also in the 7th and intercepted, so "without power and restricted" in this house of others.

    Why is she being restricted?.......The 8th house of death and other's assets is ruled by Mars and mars is found in the 2nd house conjunct to Venus (a man and a woman) perhaps Lauren?

    They are both found in late Taurus, near critical stars and then Mercury also here is found at the 0 degree of Gemini. So yes, I think there was a fight/arguing or something that went on, and that was the end of Lauren , not soon thereafter (caveat see below reference drugs overdosing)

    We ALSO need to be cognizant of the fact that planets and stars are simply symbolic tools we use for subjective rendering in the chart readings.
    We try as we may to be objective as much as possible of course, and some are better then others doing this.

    But what i'm trying to point out, is that it's "possible" that this is also pointing to a drug overdose, for the WeepingSisters is just that, (Mercury 0Gem) pointing to a great deal to cry about.

    Can the cry be over Lauren's overdose whether by her own hand or that of another? There was the case of John Belushi in Hollywood who had a friend (we should say acquaintance) give him the fatal shot of heroin and he died from that overdose.

    Is this (overdosing from drugs or alcohol) however , symbolically a violent act?
    It may be seen as such I would surmise because it's violent to the body itself.

    There are worse stars then what are here to symbolize a violent death from another because this 2:51AM chart seems to be a "mixed bag" of vibrations, none really good, none pointing to a good outcome however, when we know someone is missing, that's 1/2 way there. We know it's not going to be a "good outcome" unless there is a positive sign somewhere in the charts, like Spica, Sirius, or Rigel or even a positive Jupiter to help the person along.

    In this case, we don't see that positiveness of the vibrations with these aspects, placements, etc.

    But, Part of Fortune as mentioned earlier (or misfortune) in the 12th of one's own undoing,or imprisonment?

    SKAT conj. the POF may be either a death by overdosing, hence, a suicide OR a murder. It can be either/or.

    We need to go into another tool bag to decide these charts.


    Even when we see "suicide" it may be a mental exercise we are seeing that results via a catalyst from another. It's suicidal to walk across the crowded street in New York City (or any busy intersection) drunk, BUT we may not at all intend to die from doing so.


    That Mercury rulership may indeed be a "crowd" of young males and drugs.
    "The Greek word moira (μοῖρα) literally means a part or portion, and by extension one's portion in life or destiny.
    They controlled the metaphorical thread of life of every mortal from birth to death."

    Wikipedia

  15. #30
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    Thank you, Leomoon I appreciate all of the hard work you put into reading these charts.

    I have always been suspicious of JR, the last person to see Lauren alive, and never truly believed his account of watching her 'walk down the street and turn the corner'.

    I pray for Lauren's parents, that the others with knowledge of what transpired will listen to their conscience and give this grieving family the answers they need.
    Say what you mean, mean what you say, but don't say it mean.
    We are all just trying to make sense of an unimaginable crime.

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