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Thread: ~*~ Caylee's Law ~*~

  1. #301
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    I think this is an excellent tool. Quicker recovery would have told the story of what happened to Caylee through forensics.

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  3. #302
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    Why Caylee's Law is a Bad Idea
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_893953.html

    Anger is understandable. But anger is a bad reason to make public policy. New laws, especially laws with serious criminal sanctions, demand careful consideration: Will the law actually address the problem it is intended to address? Is it enforceable? What are some possible unintended consequences of this law? Could it be abused by police and prosecutors?
    I thought this article brought good perspective to this law. While I know it is meant with the best of intentions, I have some of the same concerns reflected in this article.
    Last edited by AnaTeresa; 07-11-2011 at 12:31 PM. Reason: Typo
    “Justice cannot be for one side alone, but must be for both.” - Eleanor Roosevelt


    In no way should any of my statements be construed as legal opinion or advice. I am a newly practicing lawyer (yay!) but not a verified poster here at WS. The above statement(s) are an expression of my personal opinion, for entertainment purposes only, and copyright.

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  5. #303
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnaTeresa View Post
    Why Caylee's Law is a Bad Idea
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_893953.html



    I thought this article brought good perspective to this law. While I know it is meant with the best of intentions, I have some of the same concerns reflected in this article.
    I think the law has good intentions. My issue though is if the verdict was 'guilty', would this even be brought up? Meaning, was it brought up because of what happened to Caylee or was it brought up because people are pissed about the NG verdict and this is their way to vent about it. If it's about Caylee, how come this wasn't proposed 3, 2 or even 1 year ago?

    Again, good intentions (although I think the fine print of it needs to be clarified), but what's the real motivation behind it?

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  7. #304
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    For posters who think this doesn't happen elsewhere!

    I've read a few posters say this whole thing with Casey is a one time thing, like she is the only one who has or will EVER do it.... Well, in 1994 we had our own version of the Casey Anthony debacle...this was not the mother/parent/guardian...this was the babysitter....so imo, the law needs to extend to "anyone" who is caring for the child.

    http://livingstonparishnews.com/opin...html?success=1

    Instead of going for Capital Murder, they went for Obstruction of Justice...and got it.
    "This ain't my first rodeo, Mr. Baez"

    Where will Casey be when lightening strikes the third time....hmmm?


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  9. #305
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    Quote Originally Posted by JusticeSeeker1960 View Post
    Here's one for ya, happened right down the street in 1994, before I moved here but I remember hearing about it.

    http://livingstonparishnews.com/opin...html?success=1
    Thank you!
    My favorite new quote "Prosecutors in Fl went for the whole enchilada against Casey Anthony and were stunned to discover that most of the individuals enpaneled on her jury ,it turned out, were born yesterday."

    It goes on to say
    McKnight prevented authorities from recovering the body of the toddler in her care in time to determine how he died. That's because she threw the kid off a bridge into the Tickfaw River and then lied for six days. She told the world the infant had wandered off, maybe kidnapped, been molested by a house guest - it depends on what day she was asked the question.

    Unlike Casey Anthony, the mother who tried to finger a fictitious babysitter, McKnight was not the mother, but a baby sitter. Matthew's mother, Robin Garon, who is now deceased, chose to leave her child with McKnight to go bar hopping. That's not exactly mother of the year behavior, but sadly it isn't all that rare.********

    Much more at the link provided by JusticeSeeker1960

    http://livingstonparishnews.com/opin...html?success=1
    Always ,just my opinion

    SPECIAL NEEDS MISSING MAN
    JOHNNY LAMAR BROWN missing since Aug 3rd from MYRTLE BEACH,SC while on a family vacation .Hometown CARTERSVILLE,GA

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=181822




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  11. #306
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnaTeresa View Post
    Why Caylee's Law is a Bad Idea
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_893953.html



    I thought this article brought good perspective to this law. While I know it is meant with the best of intentions, I have some of the same concerns reflected in this article.
    I believe that your concerns are valid. I don't believe that a "Caylee's law" will have the effect of stopping the future murders of children (sorry, folks, I just don't see that as being its intended purpose. If a parent/caregiver is going to kill a child- this law isn't going to stop them.) Rather, this law will serve as another way to seek justice when a child turns up missing or dead. Especially when there isn't enough evidence to file charges any other way.

    But, speaking to the concerns you have, this is why I would personally only support a law that speaks only to young children (not teenagers) and that gives a longer window (one or two hours after disappearance is too short). I believe there is "An Offenses By Caregivers" bill being sponsored by State Reps. Scott Plakon, R-Longwood; Jose Felix Diaz, R-Miami; and Jeanette Nunez, R-Miami that seems really good. It would also apply to caregivers who fail to report a child's death or location of the body within two hours of learning of the death. And anyone who lies to police or misleads them about a child they know to be in danger would be guilty of a felony.

    Casey Anthony isn't the first case that I have gotten angry about. I am sick and tired of this. I am tired of parents throwing their kids away. How many cases have you heard of children... unidentified children... found along roadsides or in landfills or in parks? It happens. And if we find the parents/caregivers we should be able to charge them with something! You can't just say, oh yeah, she got sick and died and uh.... we didn't know what to do so...uh... we buried her in the woods.

    We need to pass a law so that if another parent/caregiver tries this again they go to jail. End of story.

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  13. #307
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    Quote Originally Posted by cityslick View Post
    I think the law has good intentions. My issue though is if the verdict was 'guilty', would this even be brought up? Meaning, was it brought up because of what happened to Caylee or was it brought up because people are pissed about the NG verdict and this is their way to vent about it. If it's about Caylee, how come this wasn't proposed 3, 2 or even 1 year ago?

    Again, good intentions (although I think the fine print of it needs to be clarified), but what's the real motivation behind it?
    I wish something this specific was already on the books. It falls under neglect but the jury obviously didn't consider it,so it needs to be spelled out .If lying to police was not so specific ,she would have gotten away with that too.IMO

    Bills are being written by legislators in each state that decides to move forward on this issue. I don't believe they will use what is in the petition ver batim and there's always a tweaking process after bills are introduced.

    There are other cases that are similar and people are fed up.It might not save a child's life but it will help convict caregivers who try to cover up a murder by not reporting a death or a missing child.
    Always ,just my opinion

    SPECIAL NEEDS MISSING MAN
    JOHNNY LAMAR BROWN missing since Aug 3rd from MYRTLE BEACH,SC while on a family vacation .Hometown CARTERSVILLE,GA

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=181822




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  15. #308
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    I agree, the proposals need tweeking. These are preliminary. Follow the proposal in your state. If you are of the opinion of a potential problem, write to the lawmakers proposing them with your feelings.

    Parents need to be held to some higher standard. Is it in your belief that it's ok her child "drowned in a pool" and not call 911. But just cover it up?

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  17. #309
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rail_Tracer View Post
    I believe that your concerns are valid. I don't believe that a "Caylee's law" will have the effect of stopping the future murders of children (sorry, folks, I just don't see that as being its intended purpose. If a parent/caregiver is going to kill a child- this law isn't going to stop them.) Rather, this law will serve as another way to seek justice when a child turns up missing or dead. Especially when there isn't enough evidence to file charges any other way.

    But, speaking to the concerns you have, this is why I would personally only support a law that speaks only to young children (not teenagers) and that gives a longer window (one or two hours after disappearance is too short). I believe there is "An Offenses By Caregivers" bill being sponsored by State Reps. Scott Plakon, R-Longwood; Jose Felix Diaz, R-Miami; and Jeanette Nunez, R-Miami that seems really good. It would also apply to caregivers who fail to report a child's death or location of the body within two hours of learning of the death. And anyone who lies to police or misleads them about a child they know to be in danger would be guilty of a felony.

    Casey Anthony isn't the first case that I have gotten angry about. I am sick and tired of this. I am tired of parents throwing their kids away. How many cases have you heard of children... unidentified children... found along roadsides or in landfills or in parks? It happens. And if we find the parents/caregivers we should be able to charge them with something! You can't just say, oh yeah, she got sick and died and uh.... we didn't know what to do so...uh... we buried her in the woods.

    We need to pass a law so that if another parent/caregiver tries this again they go to jail. End of story.


    I agree. Where are the consequences here? She died in the swimming pool, so my Dad wrapped her in a bag like our pets?

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  19. #310
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rail_Tracer View Post
    I believe that your concerns are valid. I don't believe that a "Caylee's law" will have the effect of stopping the future murders of children (sorry, folks, I just don't see that as being its intended purpose. If a parent/caregiver is going to kill a child- this law isn't going to stop them.) Rather, this law will serve as another way to seek justice when a child turns up missing or dead. Especially when there isn't enough evidence to file charges any other way.

    But, speaking to the concerns you have, this is why I would personally only support a law that speaks only to young children (not teenagers) and that gives a longer window (one or two hours after disappearance is too short). I believe there is "An Offenses By Caregivers" bill being sponsored by State Reps. Scott Plakon, R-Longwood; Jose Felix Diaz, R-Miami; and Jeanette Nunez, R-Miami that seems really good. It would also apply to caregivers who fail to report a child's death or location of the body within two hours of learning of the death. And anyone who lies to police or misleads them about a child they know to be in danger would be guilty of a felony.

    Casey Anthony isn't the first case that I have gotten angry about. I am sick and tired of this. I am tired of parents throwing their kids away. How many cases have you heard of children... unidentified children... found along roadsides or in landfills or in parks? It happens. And if we find the parents/caregivers we should be able to charge them with something! You can't just say, oh yeah, she got sick and died and uh.... we didn't know what to do so...uh... we buried her in the woods.

    We need to pass a law so that if another parent/caregiver tries this again they go to jail. End of story.
    I don't think anyone believes this will stop future murders,necessarily,but it spells it out for future jurors .It's a tool for LE and Prosecutors to use since neglect appears to be too vague for some.

    I make no apologies for letting my anger about the verdict drive my need to see bills, based on this petition, passed.
    Anger and frustration about current conditions are often the catalyst for positive change. Civil Rights, Bosnia, Dharfur etc.................
    This is not just about one child ,it's about justice for all children who suffer a fate such as Caylee's. JMO
    Last edited by MissJames; 07-11-2011 at 04:12 PM.
    Always ,just my opinion

    SPECIAL NEEDS MISSING MAN
    JOHNNY LAMAR BROWN missing since Aug 3rd from MYRTLE BEACH,SC while on a family vacation .Hometown CARTERSVILLE,GA

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=181822




    *****************************************
    We never saw it coming .Please talk to your teen even if you don't think you need to !
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  21. #311
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluebirdii View Post
    I really want to sign this petition - I reside in the Republic of South Africa though - is there any way how I can get involved?
    If you are in contact with any US citizen's you can make them aware of the petition and you can look into the laws from SA.

    My Father in Law is from South Africa and sadly is in his last days of life.
    My husband remembers trips to visit his grandparents in SA ,fondly
    Always ,just my opinion

    SPECIAL NEEDS MISSING MAN
    JOHNNY LAMAR BROWN missing since Aug 3rd from MYRTLE BEACH,SC while on a family vacation .Hometown CARTERSVILLE,GA

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=181822




    *****************************************
    We never saw it coming .Please talk to your teen even if you don't think you need to !
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  23. #312
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    I wonder how the Anthonys feel about one million, one hundred and seventeen thousand people looking for a law to prevent inaction taken by future families and naming it in honor of their granddaughter! That in itself gives me some comfort.

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  25. #313
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    Quote Originally Posted by MissJames View Post
    I don't think anyone believes this will stop future murders,necessarily,but it spells it out for future jurors .It's a tool for LE and Prosecutors to use since neglect appears to be too vague for some.

    I make no apologies for letting my anger about the verdict drive my need to see bills, based on this petition, passed.
    Anger and frustration about current conditions are often the catalyst for positive change. Civil Rights, Bosnia, Dhardur etc.................
    This is not just about one child ,it's about justice for all children who suffer a fate such as Caylee's. JMO
    Good post MissJames. ITA. All of our laws are tools for LE to use to be sure that justice is done. Will it stop murderous parents... probably not. This jury from this case would have had something to work with though. They ALL state (the ones who have spoken anyway) that they don't believe Casey was innocent but only believed the State proved lying to police. Well, that law needs more teeth. Some of the examples brought up by articles against this law site hypotheticals about no cell signals and camping in the woods. That isn't what this is aimed at. This is aimed at parents who dispose of their children as easy as they do disposable diapers. If our present laws aren't enough to punish those parents, then the laws need to be changed. I will never believe laws such as Amber Alerts are a knee jerk reaction that won't help. This law has saved numerous children. Caylee's law won't save children (there are already lots of laws against murder), but it will help these poor children get justice. We are a country of laws and most of them have been written because of specific cases. I think this one deserves to be considered by our legislature so I have contacted my representatives and my governor. If you disagree, then you should contact your representatives and make your voice heard. That's how our country works.

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  27. #314
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    May I interject for a moment to say thanks to everyone who has voiced their opinion on this matter (on both sides).

    It's as Omachka says, "That's how our country works."

    We get better/stronger laws when everyone participates. When we care enough to state our opinions.

    So thank you, everyone, whether you agree with me or not. Thank you for caring enough to participate rationally in the discussion. I really appreciate it.

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  29. #315
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowdaze View Post
    I agree, the proposals need tweeking. These are preliminary. Follow the proposal in your state. If you are of the opinion of a potential problem, write to the lawmakers proposing them with your feelings.

    Parents need to be held to some higher standard. Is it in your belief that it's ok her child "drowned in a pool" and not call 911. But just cover it up?
    I don't think it's fair to say that if we have concerns about this law, or if we'd rather not see it on the books because of potential complications = we're okay with what happened to Caylee.
    “Justice cannot be for one side alone, but must be for both.” - Eleanor Roosevelt


    In no way should any of my statements be construed as legal opinion or advice. I am a newly practicing lawyer (yay!) but not a verified poster here at WS. The above statement(s) are an expression of my personal opinion, for entertainment purposes only, and copyright.

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  31. #316
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    Quote Originally Posted by cityslick View Post
    I think the law has good intentions. My issue though is if the verdict was 'guilty', would this even be brought up? Meaning, was it brought up because of what happened to Caylee or was it brought up because people are pissed about the NG verdict and this is their way to vent about it. If it's about Caylee, how come this wasn't proposed 3, 2 or even 1 year ago?

    Again, good intentions (although I think the fine print of it needs to be clarified), but what's the real motivation behind it?
    I know that this (a law) has been discussed here for a very long time...long before a verdict was reached.

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  33. #317
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    Quote Originally Posted by MissJames View Post
    I wish something this specific was already on the books. It falls under neglect but the jury obviously didn't consider it,so it needs to be spelled out .If lying to police was not so specific ,she would have gotten away with that too.IMO

    Bills are being written by legislators in each state that decides to move forward on this issue. I don't believe they will use what is in the petition ver batim and there's always a tweaking process after bills are introduced.

    There are other cases that are similar and people are fed up.It might not save a child's life but it will help convict caregivers who try to cover up a murder by not reporting a death or a missing child.
    Zahra Baker comes to mind

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  35. #318
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    Quote Originally Posted by MissJames View Post
    I don't think anyone believes this will stop future murders,necessarily,but it spells it out for future jurors .It's a tool for LE and Prosecutors to use since neglect appears to be too vague for some.

    I make no apologies for letting my anger about the verdict drive my need to see bills, based on this petition, passed.
    Anger and frustration about current conditions are often the catalyst for positive change. Civil Rights, Bosnia, Dhardur etc.................
    This is not just about one child ,it's about justice for all children who suffer a fate such as Caylee's. JMO
    Thank you!

    If nothing else this sends a strong message that what happened in FL is wrong. I can't see that as bad. MO, of course.

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  37. #319
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnaTeresa View Post
    I don't think it's fair to say that if we have concerns about this law, or if we'd rather not see it on the books because of potential complications = we're okay with what happened to Caylee.

    Sorry, emotions got the best of me. Just trying to wrap my head around what sounds like an agreement to the way the laws stand now. Which ends up being nothing. KC walking out with no consequences to her actions, which I believe is how she was raised in the first place. So the story continues...

    Just trying to understand where the objections are coming from. Maybe we can agree that the system has a flaw?

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  39. #320
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    Quote Originally Posted by cityslick View Post
    I think the law has good intentions. My issue though is if the verdict was 'guilty', would this even be brought up? Meaning, was it brought up because of what happened to Caylee or was it brought up because people are pissed about the NG verdict and this is their way to vent about it. If it's about Caylee, how come this wasn't proposed 3, 2 or even 1 year ago?

    Again, good intentions (although I think the fine print of it needs to be clarified), but what's the real motivation behind it?
    I can't answer for everyone else but my own motivation is that this verdict brought to my attention that our laws have a huge loophole that needs to be closed. If it had been brought to my attention 3, 2 or even 1 year ago, I would still feel that it needs to be done. I, on my own, didn't have that kind of foresight so only realized it was needed after this verdict went down. Even under another name besides Caylee's I think the law is sound although I feel that giving her name gives her at least some of the justice that was denied to her. You just can't throw your child away and lie about it until evidence is no longer there. Parents who have a real accident or death or a lost child will report already without the law. This is aimed at those who don't.

    I'd like to add a personal story. When my son was 8 years old, he decided to go visit a friend after school without telling anyone. I was a single Mom and working... he was supposed to ride the bus and go to his grandparent's home until I got off work... our daily routine. He figured he'd ride to his friend's house on a different school bus from his own and just call me later (that way I couldn't say no was his thinking). Well, turned out that his friend didn't have a phone and his Mom didn't have the car so he had to wait until the boy's dad got home from work. They had no idea that my son was there without permission. Meanwhile, I have a child missing as of the time his bus came home without him. I didn't panic right away but figured he just missed his bus. I took off work, went to the school and he wasn't there. My very first reaction when I realized he was missing was to call the police. I had detectives at my home and officers in patrol cars combing the area... helicopters were flying above. When the boy's dad brought him home he was questioned closely. I was lucky that I only had a child who goofed up. He could have been hurt, kidnapped or killed I honestly didn't know what happened. I was a basket case the whole time but when it got dark and I didn't know where he was I really freaked out. I like to think I'm a normal parent... my first reaction as soon as I realized he was missing was to call the police. It wasn't even an hour. This law isn't going to hurt anyone who is trying to do the right thing and I do think it will help LE and prosecutors to do their job when someone is trying to cover up a crime.

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  41. #321
    [quote=noseyone;6886823]
    Quote Originally Posted by MargotKidder View Post
    [

    I was born in America, and have spent 52yrs here. I have yet to see a proposed bill for a new law, that was perfect, and was not revised over, over and over.... It is how our system works! This petition is not the final Law, no matter how many revivisions we see made, and there are still many more to come.
    MOO
    Thanks you for this perspective. Obviously all laws should be responsibly designed to promote the best possible good for a civil society. We would all like the legal process to be less complicated, but life isn't always simple, and there has to be a starting point for even the best of laws.

    In forming new laws, reason and emotion should be balanced, and they are not mutually exclusive. Offended emotion is a natural response to this outrageous case of Caylee's mistreatment, and I expect that, for the most part, proponents of Caylee's law will channel their emotions into proper remedies.

    Faith has its reasons that reason knows not of.

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  43. #322
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    1,126,376 signatures 4:20pm EST Monday July 11




    Always ,just my opinion

    SPECIAL NEEDS MISSING MAN
    JOHNNY LAMAR BROWN missing since Aug 3rd from MYRTLE BEACH,SC while on a family vacation .Hometown CARTERSVILLE,GA

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=181822




    *****************************************
    We never saw it coming .Please talk to your teen even if you don't think you need to !
    Far more teens commit impulsive suicide without chronic depression
    Miss U James

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  45. #323
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    Some of the proposed bills require parents to report their child's death in an hour. What if the child dies during their sleep and they aren't discovered until the morning? What if a natural disaster strikes and the parent doesn't realize their child is dead (or can't get to a phone)? What if you get into a car accident into a rural area, and your child dies, and your cell phone isn't working, and you have to wait more than an hour for help? There better be some clear guidelines in this law, because if it just states "If you don't report your child dead in an hour, you're going to be arrested". You're going to have a lot of problems. Whatever the law says is what goes.

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  47. #324
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    Quote Originally Posted by eileenhawkeye View Post
    Some of the proposed bills require parents to report their child's death in an hour. What if the child dies during their sleep and they aren't discovered until the morning? What if a natural disaster strikes and the parent doesn't realize their child is dead (or can't get to a phone)? What if you get into a car accident into a rural area, and your child dies, and your cell phone isn't working, and you have to wait more than an hour for help? There better be some clear guidelines in this law, because if it just states "If you don't report your child dead in an hour, you're going to be arrested". You're going to have a lot of problems. Whatever the law says is what goes.
    If you read back through this thread you'll find other discussions on these very same issues.
    Always ,just my opinion

    SPECIAL NEEDS MISSING MAN
    JOHNNY LAMAR BROWN missing since Aug 3rd from MYRTLE BEACH,SC while on a family vacation .Hometown CARTERSVILLE,GA

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=181822




    *****************************************
    We never saw it coming .Please talk to your teen even if you don't think you need to !
    Far more teens commit impulsive suicide without chronic depression
    Miss U James

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    Caylee's Law in PA!
    Just got this in my email

    RE: Create Caylee's Law, Not Reporting Child's Disappearance Should Be a Felony
    Sent By:
    "Senator David Argall" <dargall@pasen.gov> On: Jul 07/11/11 4:08 PM
    To: xxxx@comcast.net>

    Thank you for contacting me regarding Caylee's Law. I appreciate you
    taking the time to share your thoughts with me on this important issue.


    Currently, there is not a law in Pennsylvania that makes it
    a felony for a parent, legal guardian, or caretaker to not notify law
    enforcement of the death of their child, accidental or otherwise, within
    1 hour of said death being discovered. While there are many laws
    established in Pennsylvania for the protection of children against abuse
    and neglect, this particular proposal has not been proven to be a
    concern in the past.

    I agree that our state should establish laws that protect
    the rights and well-being of children, especially in cases where
    innocent children are unable to properly defend themselves. I shared
    your email with Senator Stewart Greenleaf, Chairman of the Senate
    Judiciary Committee. I look forward to learning more about Caylee's
    Law and to see future legislation regarding this issue reach the Senate
    floor.

    Once again, I appreciate hearing from you on this important
    matter. Please do not hesitate to contact me should you have additional
    questions or concerns.

    Sincerely,

    DAVID G. ARGALL
    State Senator
    29th District

  49. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to BlOnDe_GuRrL For This Useful Post:


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