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  1. #286
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    First time poster here, and trying to sift through threads, so sorry if these questions have been addressed.

    Does anyone know/have theories as to why JW's friends were on the 5th floor of SW, and how they entered the building? Were they visiting LS's roommates, or someone else? Were they looking for LS and CR? Did they know CR? Did JW know or know of CR? ZO sounds like trouble, in general.

    Also, if CR has memory loss from the punch, how does he remember that LS was helping HIM home? Maybe he was assuming, IDK.

    In regards to the psychic, has it been confirmed that she was using "cadaver" dogs? I have only seen them referred to as "her dogs," and IMO, most psychics seem a little whack-a-doo, so maybe they are her psychic dogs or something, and not trained cadaver dogs. Besides, why would a psychic think she needs cadaver dogs?? Kinda funny.

    Again, sorry if these questions have been addressed, and my heart goes out to the Spierer family.


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  3. #287
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabby66 View Post
    Oh sorry, I thought you were referring to one of the apartments. I wonder how deeply a cadaver dog can "hit". If she was buried under a mound of thickly packed garbage, I wonder if they could still detect her....
    I don't think the transfer station gets packed like that... but that's just a guess...


  4. #288
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulR View Post
    Criminal? Innocent people have been charged - and convicted - with crimes they haven't committed before.

    Any attorney with criminal justice experience from the DA's office has litigated before, anyway.
    Even civil charges - perhaps some sort of negligence... he knew something and failed to act, etc. The possibilities are endless, really.
    "It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into." - Jonathan Swift


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  6. #289
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    Quote Originally Posted by bonechaos View Post
    He just got punched. I don't understand why you think he wouldn't leave the building immediately.
    Because they had other, better options imo. Her apt if possible for first aid for CR or to escape their agressor, or hell because that's where they were headed to begin with....other friends apts was another option..etc.

    But since you brought it up..with other options at hand why scoot?
    Maybe it was LS that said "let's just go". Maybe SW was just a pit stop per her request and after the altercation she said "skip it...lets move on".


  7. #290
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    Quote Originally Posted by bonechaos View Post
    Yep. What I'm saying is, he's going to be treated as a defendant if push comes to shove and he's arrested. You don't wait until there are charges filed against you to get an attorney, at least not if you can help it.
    EXACTLY. If my son's gf went missing I would retain an attorney .
    I would expect my son to fully cooperate with the LE investigation, but he would need to have some one protecting him from wrongful accusations. Innocent people need representation too.
    “Every day that they don’t find something is good for me.“ Billie Dunn


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  9. #291
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tr. View Post
    Because they had other, better options imo. Her apt if possible for first aid for CR or to escape their agressor, or hell because that's where they were headed to begin with....other friends apts was another option..etc.

    But since you brought it up..with other options at hand why scoot?
    Maybe it was LS that said "let's just go". Maybe SW was just a pit stop per her request and after the altercation she said "skip it...lets move on".
    I don't think first aid was a high priority for him then, and some accounts even say he wasn't hit very hard. Even if he was, he was drunk and may not have felt the pain, felt like he needed to be a man and take a punch, etc.

    But I explained why leaving makes more sense than staying in posts #254, 258, and 262, and also be reminded that CR was not supposed to be at SW due to the "list."

    Also, keep in mind that regardless of what you believe a reasonable person would do in this situation, they were highly intoxicated (by all accounts).
    "It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into." - Jonathan Swift


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    Tr.

  11. #292
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    Quote Originally Posted by bloom54 View Post
    I don't think the transfer station gets packed like that... but that's just a guess...
    DUH! I need to just GIVE UP and go to bed! I am totally not even with it and am reading posts incorrectly. Sorry, I read your post to say "landfill" Of course, I READ "transfer station" but my brain THOUGHT "landfill". I'm calling it a night. Obviously I'm no help here


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  13. #293
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tr. View Post
    Because they had other, better options imo. Her apt if possible for first aid for CR or to escape their agressor, or hell because that's where they were headed to begin with....other friends apts was another option..etc.

    But since you brought it up..with other options at hand why scoot?
    Maybe it was LS that said "let's just go". Maybe SW was just a pit stop per her request and after the altercation she said "skip it...lets move on".
    An altercation, most likely noisy, in a nice apt complex with a "No Trespass" order? I'd have high-tailed it out of there if it were me. But, if he had the bearings to make that decision, then the punch didn't affect him TOO much, certainly not enough to cause amnesia, IMO.

    Also, if she felt "busted" by her bf's friends for being w/another guy, she might have wanted to get the H out of there as well. Similar thing happened to me. On elevator in apt complex w/guy friend, door opens, guy I was dating just prior (and still a little, lol) standing there looking RIGHT at us (snuck in past security), and we let door close and got OUT of there.


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  15. #294
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    Quote Originally Posted by jjenny View Post
    What litigation could possibly take place with JW if he didn't see her that night at all?
    Possible litigation isn't necessarily the only reason you might want an attorney.
    Just dealing with LE can get tough if they set their sites on you. An attorney can act as your liaison in a situation like this.

    I know from being at the search center that JW was on the radar from the beginning. Where LE stands with that now, I don't know.


  16. #295
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabby66 View Post
    DUH! I need to just GIVE UP and go to bed! I am totally not even with it and am reading posts incorrectly. Sorry, I read your post to say "landfill" Of course, I READ "transfer station" but my brain THOUGHT "landfill". I'm calling it a night. Obviously I'm no help here
    me, too!! Good night all... if someone could have this solved by morning, we'd be ever so grateful!!


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  18. #296
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    Quote Originally Posted by GobBluth View Post
    An altercation, most likely noisy, in a nice apt complex with a "No Trespass" order? I'd have high-tailed it out of there if it were me. But, if he had the bearings to make that decision, then the punch didn't affect him TOO much, certainly not enough to cause amnesia, IMO.

    Also, if she felt "busted" by her bf's friends for being w/another guy, she might have wanted to get the H out of there as well. Similar thing happened to me. On elevator in apt complex w/guy friend, door opens, guy I was dating just prior (and still a little, lol) standing there looking RIGHT at us (snuck in past security), and we let door close and got OUT of there.
    There is also a possibility that IF the altercation was about her involvement with CR (which we still have not confirmed), it just made her even more adamant about staying with him. I know that if I was hanging out with a new guy and my old guy's friends started hassling him about it, I wouldn't turn around and leave my new guy high and dry. I'd be defensive about it and likely make it a point to leave with him.
    "It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into." - Jonathan Swift


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  20. #297
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    Quote Originally Posted by GobBluth View Post
    <snipped> In regards to the psychic, has it been confirmed that she was using "cadaver" dogs?
    They were referred to as cadaver dogs, but I had the exact same question about if/how they were trained...

    Does anyone know who Don Cranfill is? On the facebook page where this discussion took place, he stepped in to vouch for GSJ's cadaver dog story (at least the hit at the dumpster part) and weighed in about BPD's involvement. Bloomington peeps, is he connected to the investigation or search in some way, or just to GSJ?
    Last edited by AbbeyR; 07-27-2011 at 12:36 AM. Reason: added link


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  22. #298
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    Quote Originally Posted by bonechaos View Post
    I doubt the group of boys just walked away. I can picture people being held back, or someone saying, "CR, dude, just leave," and CR/LS getting out of there before it escalated or the cops were called.
    Right..we've discussed this on another thread.
    Body Language as you describe plus choice words (possibly threats) equates to intimidation.

    At least one of them (CR, LS) was not too drunk to know where the "house" was.
    LS and CR were within steps of her Apt...a safe haven if-you-will, yet they didn't go there.
    The most obvious reason (always imo) to leave at this point is because you feel compelled to do so out of one thing...fear.


  23. #299
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    Quote Originally Posted by bloom54 View Post
    me, too!! Good night all... if someone could have this solved by morning, we'd be ever so grateful!!
    Done. It was Mr Smythe, in the ballroom, with a candlestick

    Have a good night


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  25. #300
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tr. View Post
    Right..we've discussed this on another thread.
    Body Language as you describe plus choice words (possibly threats) equates to intimidation.

    At least one of them (CR, LS) was not too drunk to know where the "house" was.
    LS and CR were within steps of her Apt...a safe haven if-you-will, yet they didn't go there.
    The most obvious reason (always imo) to leave at this point is because you feel compelled to do so out of one thing...fear.
    What "house" are you referring to? You can be blackout drunk and still remember where you live... I've never forgotten where I lived while out on the town, and I'm not proud to say I've been in Lauren's state a few times.

    Her apartment was not a "safe haven" by any means though. CR was NOT supposed to be there. You have a group of boys who don't want you there, you're on a "list," and you're going to stay there? No. The fact that CR was not allowed at SW is key, and makes perfect sense as to why they left.

    Where are you getting at with the reason being fear, though? Because I tend to agree. Fear that the boys would call security, fear that the cops would be called, fear that things would escalate... those are all plausible factors that don't really say anything more. If you're saying fear that the boys would retaliate against Lauren, I think it is a possibility, but I hardly think that it is an "obvious reason."
    "It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into." - Jonathan Swift


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