What have you guys...

read about the Ramsey case? I know the majority of u have read Perfect Murder Perfect Town, and Thomas' Book, and Lee's book. Though have any of you read A Mother Gone Mad: The Hidden COnfessions of JonBenet's killer. OR Who Killed JonBEnet Ramsey by Cyril Wecht, or JonBenet Knows Evil Love, or Presumed Guilty, or Who Will SPeak for JonBenet. The reason I am asking apart from being curious is that I want to know what books are worth reading out of the ones I've listed. Obviously Schiller's book and Thomas' book I have already read and Lee's I am in the process of reading. Though how are the others?

I've read each and every one of these books, and I say run like hell from JonBenet Knows Evil Love. It is about reverse speech which, IMO, is a crock of smit.

I still like PMPT, Thomas' book, and Cyril Wecht's the best. Death of Innocence by the Ramseys themselves is also a wealth of information. It is a CYA book, basically a fairy tale. But it is interesting in researching their dynamics.

PMPT
JonBenet ITRMI
Who Killed JonBenet
DOI
JonBenet's Mother
The Prime Of Miss Jean Brodie
The Psalms

Thorkim said:

Death of Innocence by the Ramseys themselves is also a wealth of information. It is a CYA book, basically a fairy tale. But it is interesting in researching their dynamics.

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It's Patsy's confession.

Although I do not agree with Singular that John Ramsey had any involvement, I do think his characterizations of the players, and his insight into the actions and reactions of those involved with the investigation makes his book one of the must reads. He certainly left one thinking , "don't they want this solved?".


remember the letter?
http://www.the7thfire.com/Politics and History/JonBenet_pedophiles_in_boulder.htm

I would put Wecht and Singlulair on your must reads.

They are not books, but I would put Google and ACandyRose on your reading list.

JMO]

We, including myself , are just too darn gullible , we have allowed ourselves to be influenced by people who are likely not as smart as we are. We are influenced by the media to the degree we can likely not think on our own, we have become "Mary Hartman", the icon of consumer stupidity. We fear , if we happen to have an original thought, that it won't be welcomed ,that we will be ridiculed, we will lose our position in some level of society, whether it be on a forum, in a sorority/fraternity , at our job, in our neighborhood..the possibilities are endless, we have such a strong need to belong and be accepted.
It has been known for some time that there is no one in Boulder or on these forums that has a real clue to offer up that would solve this case, yet when anyone creative "comes aboard" such as BAD, we throw her out. IMO the worst she did was give CW some free publicity, and that certainly isn't nearly as outrageous as slandering a nine year old child.
I bet if we could understand Lee's english we would find him dull, a few lucky "hits" along with great PR and advertising is all it took to give him expert status. We need to stop this, we are becoming darn sheep. Cm'on I could have found edta in the blood as could anyone of us, what he didn't do, is go a step farther, did he research whether the edta was in the tubes or testing equipment from prior use or cleaning. These guys aren't gods. RIght now in this case concerning the call, have they tested the 911 tapes, to see if they were reused? These guys stop when they "THINK" they have the answer. The whole damn case is one AH HAH after another with little or no substantial follow up, nothing but a series of conclusions based on guesses coming in from every direction. I wouldn't suggest PMPT is the bible of the case, because much of the information gathered by Schiller is based on falsehoods and inaccuracies, I would like to say there is some real trash between the covers of many of the others, but that wouldn't be fair, it won't hurt to read them all. Some may make you laugh at the absurdities but no harm done. It's difficult to separate the flotsam from the jetsam, I can't do it, and I doubt any of us can, just keep in mind "you" are smarter than they are and don't buy into any one theory. IMO....really

BrotherMoon said:

You need to speak for yourself. You seem to be rudderless.

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Hey now, I was, that is why the IMO.
I find everyone's reasoning connected to garbage leaks, such as "the Bible was opened to psalm 118". ...."Mindhunter" was on the shelf...a single beaver hair was found on the tape...Patsy was heard after the hang up....
What about the animal hairs found on her hands, where is the crime scene, why was there NOTHING in her stomach...about these things no one has any curiosity.IMO

yep we are all rudderless..imo

an F-15 just flew over heading toward DC, yep I wonder "why" about a lot of suff..

sissi said:

It has been known for some time that there is no one in Boulder or on these forums that has a real clue to offer up that would solve this case, yet when anyone creative "comes aboard" such as BAD, we throw her out. IMO the worst she did was give CW some free publicity, and that certainly isn't nearly as outrageous as slandering a nine year old child.

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Did BAD get banned from Websleuths?

The books listed above are garbage except PMPT and Presumed Guilty, An Investigation into the JonBenet Ramsey Case, The Media and the Culture of *advertiser censored* by Stephen Singular *my hero*

My belief is that a lucifarian church called the Ordo Templi Orientis is behind these child sex rings. The headquarters is located in Berkely, California. Most of the OTO members include lawyers, doctors, teachers, celebrities and politicians. I was reading on the internet an oil tycoon from Canada is also an OTO member along with USA senator Larry Byrd.

It would not surprise me if a secret OTO mole was a member of the BPD. Maybe that's why Linda Arndt appears paranoid about her fellow coworkers. Who exactly is the mole? Koby? Steve Thomas?

If Jeff Johnson and Horace Mills want answers they should look here.
http://www.adastra-oto.org/
http://www.gaiaguys.net/vic.introduction.htm

Yep Abigail it seems as though she did, and BTW, where is BrotherMoon?

BrotherMoon said:

It's Patsy's confession.

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Bull , Come on Moonster you can do better than that huh? :twocents:

I just wrote an extremely long post for this thread but then accidently deleted it.

I think that Patsy wagging her finger at the camera and saying "at least two people know who did this - the perpetrator and someone who he or she might have told", was her actual confession.

According to the ransom note, it was a "small foreign faction", not ONE person. While she's saying this, John is sitting there looking away and looking both embarrassed and ashamed. He knows that she's telling the TRUTH, and she's also telling him, "I know that you know what I did, even though I've never come right out and told you"......and by his demeanor he's admitting that this is so.

Sorry about that: I don't want to edit my post, but I made a mistake: the ransom note was addressed to Mr. Ramsey only.

Why? To put all the attention of this case on HIM, not her - and also for Patsy to vent some of her semi-conscious hostility toward John.

wenchie said:

I just wrote an extremely long post for this thread but then accidently deleted it.

I think that Patsy wagging her finger at the camera and saying "at least two people know who did this - the perpetrator and someone who he or she might have told", was her actual confession.

According to the ransom note, it was a "small foreign faction", not ONE person. While she's saying this, John is sitting there looking away and looking both embarrassed and ashamed. He knows that she's telling the TRUTH, and she's also telling him, "I know that you know what I did, even though I've never come right out and told you"......and by his demeanor he's admitting that this is so.

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Her words were "confided in", not told. In TPOMJB, Jean Brodie seeks out one person to confide in. This is another example of how Patsy's fantasy life in literature leaks out into her public life. This leaking occurs many times in DOI. Her attempt to whitewash what she did in DOI turns out to expose her true colors: she thinks The Psalms are messages from a God and that super natural being had it's hand in JonBenet's death. DOI is an unwitting confession. For Patsy, the boundaries between the Gods, JonBenet and herself are blurred.

She might have cracked and incriminated herself if an investigator had been permitted to ask her some tough questions without her attorney present.

The heart on the palm of her hand? It wasn't there at the Christmas party. A kidnapper put it there? A murderer washed her body and put clean clothes on her and wrapped her in a warm blanket even though she was dead?

I'm outraged that Patsy wasn't arrested for this killing, and probably never will be. I see NO evidence of an intruder and tons of evidence that it was Patsy.

Just on the note alone, I can't imagine why she wasn't arrested. That note is the most ridiculous piece of prose I've ever seen.

And both of them showed clearly that there was no "kidnapping" when they didn't sit by the phone and jump every time it rang.

Then....20 minutes after her body was found they were going to jump on a plane and head out of town - leaving their daughter's body lying in a morgue?

They are two very, very strange people.

wenchie said:

Just on the note alone, I can't imagine why she wasn't arrested. That note is the most ridiculous piece of prose I've ever seen.

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I think the note was written by Patsy in a psychological state of dissociation and regression to a juvenile persona in the manner of MPD/DID. The note is the content of her psychosis. It seems ridiculous in the same way dreams seem incomprehensible. The note is irrational, but like dreams it has form and pattern while having a low degree of rationality.

Patsy is the author AND SUBJECT of the note. All the elements in the note, incuding the character John, have much more to do with Patsy's mind than anything in the real world.

Psychotics can't tell the difference between objects in their mind and objects in the temporal world. Patsy fused her identity with JonBenet over a period of time. That fusion accelerated near the deadline of Christmas '96. Patsy used JonBenet as an object in her psychotic fantasy.

The note can be understood.

wenchie said:

She might have cracked and incriminated herself if an investigator had been permitted to ask her some tough questions without her attorney present.

The heart on the palm of her hand? It wasn't there at the Christmas party. A kidnapper put it there? A murderer washed her body and put clean clothes on her and wrapped her in a warm blanket even though she was dead?

I'm outraged that Patsy wasn't arrested for this killing, and probably never will be. I see NO evidence of an intruder and tons of evidence that it was Patsy.

Just on the note alone, I can't imagine why she wasn't arrested. That note is the most ridiculous piece of prose I've ever seen.

And both of them showed clearly that there was no "kidnapping" when they didn't sit by the phone and jump every time it rang.

Then....20 minutes after her body was found they were going to jump on a plane and head out of town - leaving their daughter's body lying in a morgue?

They are two very, very strange people.

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AMEN!!! It's nice to know that some can see the forest for the trees!!!!

sissi said:

It has been known for some time that there is no one in Boulder or on these forums that has a real clue to offer up that would solve this case, yet when anyone creative "comes aboard" such as BAD, we throw her out.

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What are you saying? No one in Boulder has a real clue to offer up to solve this case? I beg to differ with you....It would seem that there are a few good detectives that originally worked the case that still work for the BPD. Just because you may not like the way that the BPD treated the only two people "under the umbrella of suspicion" doesn't mean that these fine detectives don't have a clue.

And the comment about the forums...You don't know who posts on these forums, nor do I. So, how can you say that no one on the forums has a real clue?

Yeah, BAD was "creative" all right. Real creative....Don't even get me started on BAD's "creativity." And unless you personally know BAD how do you know it is a woman??????

It seems like BAD got itself thrown out. I'm glad Tricia has the guts to do what is right!

What I REALLY don't understand is why some people get a "free pass" on things.

Those of us who follow crimes and trials know that people have been not only tried, but convicted - on much less evidence than there is against the Ramseys.

I accidently looked at an autopsy photo of Jonbenet's skull last night. The damage was shocking. I don't buy into the "Burke" theory. I have two grandsons who are now 10 and 12. They've gotten into some viscous fights and had to be pulled apart - but neither of them are capable of either the rage or the strength to split open a skull the way Jonbenet's was.

And I think that any kid who was capable of it would not be able to function in other ways without that type of violence showing up again and again. It just doesn't jibe.