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  1. #1
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    Reasons why you think it could be suicide

    I'm still on the fence, but leaning towards suicide the more I read here. I'd like to hear other people's views on why you think it's suicide.

    I have multiple reasons for leaning towards the suicide theory. I'll begin by copying my post about why Rebecca possibly left the message she was alleged to have left, from the thread about the painted message . I believe that "She save him, can you save her?" could be a valid suicide message, and this is why:

    I think it could mean that Rebecca was angry and hurt at the time of her death. I imagine the scenario this way, and again, these are just my thoughts and nothing more:

    I think that JS MIGHT have told RZ that Max wasn't going to make it, and asked her to move out of the mansion before he got back to it. I think RZ MIGHT have been angry because she credited herself with "saving" MS, even though he was going to die eventually. So she possibly could have planned her message (angry black block letters) as a dig at JS - She (RZ) saved him (MS), can you (JS ) save her?

    I also believe she hanged herself in the nude because I read an article that Ocean linked here on thread 1, 2, or 3 that stated that nude suicides are usally committed by people who are angry and want to get back at someone.

    I also think that was why she possibly could have killed herself outside, where AS or someone coming to the guest house (perhaps JS to see his brother?) could find her.

    My humble two cents.

  2. #2
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    I also believe that self-bondage isn't an impossibility. In fact, it happens all the time. Of course, simply because it isn't as uncommon as some may think, does not mean that it happened in Rebecca's case.

    This link has pictures:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-bondage

  3. #3
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    This link contains a list of "Famous Cases" of people who have died while bound in a manner similar to the way Rebecca was found. Does this mean that Rebecca died in the same manner? Of course not, but it does show it's in the realm of possibility.

    Erotic asphyxiation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia@@AMEPARAM@@/wiki/File:Sada_Abe.jpg" class="image"><img alt="" src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b5/Sada_Abe.jpg/220px-Sada_Abe.jpg"@@AMEPARAM@@commons/thumb/b/b5/Sada_Abe.jpg/220px-Sada_Abe.jpg
    Last edited by OkieGranny; 02-23-2016 at 02:10 AM. Reason: broken link

  4. #4
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    The blood on Rebecca's legs can be explained by blood engorgement of the genitals, not uncommon with hanging deaths.

    Death by hanging, whether an execution or a suicide, has been observed to affect the genitals of both men and women. In women, the labia and clitoris will become engorged and there may be a discharge of blood from the vagina
    .

    Death erection - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Last edited by OkieGranny; 02-23-2016 at 02:10 AM. Reason: broken link

  5. #5
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    Reasons for a naked suicide:

    Naked suicide suggests a variety of psychological themes. The shedding of clothes may symbolize a new beginning, a rebirth and cleansing, or a sloughing off of the world. In the biblical description of Christ's resurrection, his clothes, a symbol of an unregenerate world, were left behind as he ascended into heaven.11

    Anger and vengeance can be expressed by completing suicide while naked, especially when it is intended to traumatize a survivor. The shock of discovering a naked suicide inflicts an indelible, traumatic memory that can haunt a survivor for a lifetime.12 The person who completes suicide while naked may intend to add insult to a suicide survivor's already devastating injury.

    In severely depressed individuals, a naked suicide may be an expression of vulnerability, utter despair, desolation, and worthlessness. Psychotic patients may be responding to delusions or auditory hallucinations commanding them to commit suicide while naked as a self-abasement.

    In an illustrative case example, a suicidal psychiatric inpatient with a psychotic depression (case disguised) believed that he was the cause of the world's calamities. During suicide risk assessment, it was discovered that the patient planned a naked suicide to atone for his "sins" by becoming a "sacrificial lamb, shorn of my clothes."
    http://www.jaapl.org/cgi/content/full/36/2/240

  6. #6
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    And then there is the guilt factor. Rebecca's sisters have stated that they don't think Rebecca felt particularly guilty about little Max's injuries and impending death. They mention her continuing with activities such as shopping, dinner, and normal conversations with loved ones. However, they have also said that Rebecca loved Max as much as a mother, and that, in fact, people assumed Rebecca was Max's mother.

    So if Rebecca really did love Max as much as they claim, would she not have felt any sort of guit or pain over his impending death? Most mothers, if not all, will tell you how much guilt is a component of true motherhood. We all feel guilty if our kids fall or get scrapes. It's commonplace for parents to blame themselves for things that happened when they were clearly not to blame, so why wouldn't Rebecca feel such guilt if Max was under her care while he received his injuries? She'd have to be a robot to not feel some iota of guilt or pain.

    So while she may NOT have committed suicide, it's hardly out of the realm of possibility that she did due to overwhelming guilt and sorrow over an innocent child's tragic death.

  7. #7
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    I fully believe Rebecca killed herself.

    Her life changed for the worse the day Max fell..........it bottomed out when she received the call that all hope was gone of saving Max.

    I truly believe her love for Max and Jonah was deep and genuine.

    I know that the loss of a loved one can trigger suicidal thoughts.

    I also know that close relationships can trigger suicides when something tragic happens and turns their lives upside down forever changing what could have been.

    But most of all I trust the evidence found during the 7 long week investigation.

    It is a simple deduction of the facts, imo.

    The main one is there is absolutely no evidence found that anyone else was there at the time but Rebecca. I don't buy into the idea that some phantom killer was in the house who left no footprints anywhere or DNA.

    Imo, this wasnt an undoable act. It really doesn't take much planning. Go get the rope..the knives...go to the guest bedroom with the balcony...cut the ropes in three pieces...print the message on the door. Apply the ropes and walk out on the balcony and jump off. The rope tying is not complicated. It is more like weaving a figure eight back and forth on each wrist and putting the rope through in order to tighten.

    Both Dina and Jonah's whereabouts during the time that Rebecca killed herself are ironclad.

    Adam, per the Zahau family, took a polygraph and passed. They don't even suspect Adam of any wrongdoing.

    So who does that leave? A hit man? Well hit men have to be contacted and I have no doubt cell phone records by all parties involved are in the possession of LE and were thoroughly gone through just like they viewed the surveillance tapes of the hospital and Ronald McDonald house who prides itself on its safety even having to use key cards to leave and enter.

    A hit man would not go to all this trouble, imo. They are in and out quickly and if hired they would not do it in the home Rebecca was in but would lure her to another place less suspicious, imo. If any note was written the hit man would make Rebecca write it on paper and it would be clear and concise. Not some cryptic message on a door that no one can understand.

    But we do know that when a person commits suicide they are not in a rational state of mind and what they decide to do and how... is known only to them. They can be very creative but each person is unique.

    Just google 'odd or weird suicides". Suicides are just as individualistic as anything else a human being does.

    IMO
    "Pardon Our Noise, It's the Sound of Freedom" USMC New River Air Station, Jacksonville, North Carolina

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhyme & Reason View Post
    Above 2 items BBM

    1. My problem is with the investigation. I don't feel they even checked the house for any other footprints or DNA. IMO they felt it was a suicide from the get-go and didn't bother to investigate it as anything other than a suicide. I know they claimed they did, but I just don't believe them.

    2. I disagree with the word "ironclad" here.

    IMO MOO JMO!!!
    They had to if they came to the determination that no other fingerprints were found but hers.

    I do think their alibis are ironclad.

    LE have the tapes from the hospital.

    And at McDonald house they use key card entries which logs when the room is opened and closed. I have no doubt LE has those logs during the time Rebecca killed herself.

    LE said 'beyond a shadow of a doubt we know where Dina and Jonah Shacknai were" Paraphrasing from memory.

    IMO
    "Pardon Our Noise, It's the Sound of Freedom" USMC New River Air Station, Jacksonville, North Carolina

  9. #9
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    I'm probably posting my beliefs in the wrong thread LOL sorry. I will move to the other thread!

  10. #10
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    I'm not 100% convinced it was suicide but after reading the AR, on page 9, the examiner describes the black paint on RN's right hand. It sounds consistant to me she held the tube of paint in that hand between her thumb & index finger. Now was she right handed or left handed? Also the descriptions throughout the AR where paint is located on her body and rope leads me to believe even more she was the writer of the note on the door if she was left handed.

    https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&p...ZTYzYmY5&hl=en


  11. #11
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    Interesting article and footage of others who have hanged themselves in similar fashion to Rebecca Zahau:

    http://www.cbs8.com/story/15294873/c...icide-scenario

  12. #12
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    Another interesting article, this time from Psychology Today, in support of the suicide theory:

    http://my.psychologytoday.com/blog/t...de-or-murder-0

  13. #13
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    I don't have enough knowledge about the case yet to make my own determination.


    But,the most compelling reason for suicide to me is that no one would stage a murder to look like a suicide that didn't look like a suicide.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by CDS22 View Post
    Another interesting article, this time from Psychology Today, in support of the suicide theory:

    http://my.psychologytoday.com/blog/t...de-or-murder-0
    Thanks for the article, CDS22. Did you note the author?

    Steve Albrecht, DBA has authored or co-authored 15 books, including Ticking Bombs: Defusing Violence in the Workplace, Fear and Violence on the Job, and Tactical Perfection for Street Cops. He holds degrees in English and Psychology, and a doctorate in Business Administration. Albrecht is a former police officer and domestic violence investigator with the San Diego Police Department.


    I'm sure Dr.Albrecht is completely impartial in this matter, but I believe I'll take his conclusions with a grain of salt anyway. KWIM?
    If you're lucky enough to be at the beach, you're lucky enough.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by JBean View Post
    I don't have enough knowledge about the case yet to make my own determination.


    But,the most compelling reason for suicide to me is that no one would stage a murder to look like a suicide that didn't look like a suicide.
    Whatever it was, clearly it looked enough like a suicide for a police declare their case "iron clad."
    Just my opinion

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